Transcripts For MSNBCW Hardball With Chris Matthews 20190403

Transcripts For MSNBCW Hardball With Chris Matthews 20190403

Agency requesting six years of the president s personal income tax filings from 2013 through 2018. And thats not all. Neal is also asking the irs for tax returns from companies and the trusts associated with the president. And here is how the president reacted to that news late tonight. The chairman of the Democratic Congress ways and Means Committee asked the irs for six years of your tax returns. Is that all . Thats all. Usually its ten so i guess theyre giving up. No, were under audit, despite what people said, were working that out. Im always under audit it seems. Ive been under audit many years because the numbers are big and i guess when you have a name, youre audited. But until such time as im not under audit, i would not be inclined to do that. Thank you. He pointed out two facts which are not related. That hes very rich and hes very famous. But the request did not go to him, mr. President , it went to the irs for your tax returns. Also today, all 24 democrats in the House Judiciary Committee authorized the subpoena for the entire 400page report of special counsel Robert Mueller. No redactions. Chairman nadler says he will negotiate with the attorney general, william barr, but he insists he sees the full report without any compromises. Are you willing to negotiate any middle ground in terms of redactions no. Of the mueller youre not . No. The committee must see everything. According to the washington post, some democrats are more aggressive still, even more than nadler, calling for a showdown immediately. Quote, many do not share nadlers patience and want the chairman to serve barr with a summons for the report right away. Well, todays vote by judiciary democrats comes a day after attorney general barr missed the committees deadline to deliver the full report. Instead, barr has promised to release a partially redacted version to the public while congress is in recess later this month. We think midterm mid april sometime hes saying. Barr is also set to deliver prescheduled testimony before the House Appropriations committee next tuesday. It is unclear whether hell answer questions about the special counsel report at all. Im joined now by Democratic Congressman Eric Swalwell who sits on committees. Mimi rocah, federal prosecutor, and congressman. I want to go to congressman swalwell. It seems to me this is black and white. The federal statutes require that the irs provide personal income tax returns for the chair of the ways and kmeenz committee, and the Senate Finance committee. How can the president say its up to him not to do it . It doesnt have to be so hard, chris. He actually said as a candidate he was going to release them. The excuse that hes under audit may sound like a good excuse, but functionally i dont understand what prevents him from releasing them. We now have the majority of the American People want to see any president s tax return, republican or democrat. So were going to get them. Why dont you just ask the commissioner of the irs if hes under audit to start with . We can do that. The irs commissioner has to decide whether to meet your demand, it seems to me. The irs is being asked for these tax returns. Under law they have to provide them. Whats trumps mouth have to do with this . How can he get in this conversation . I dont understand it. I dont want to play into his semantics. I just want the tax returns because we should know the financial history of a person who leads the largest, you know, economy in government in the world. And so lets just get that. And for a guy who always says he has nothing to hide, again, he sure sounds like he has something to hide. Now were in a position to get the taxes. Were going to get them. It just may not be as fast as we want, but were going to fight and the law is on our side and the courts will be on our side. Well find out. Some of these appointees are toadys or not. For three years the president claimed it is an irs audit preventing him from releasing his tax returns. As he promised at one point, lets watch. I will absolutely give my return, but im being audited now for two or three years, so i cant do it until the audit is finished obviously. Its under audit. Ill release them when the audi sitcom pleated. My tax returns are very simple. They are under a minor audit, routine audit as they have been for many years, every year i get audited. At the appropriate time i will release them, but right now im under routine audit. Nobody cares. The only ones that cares about my tax returns are the reporters. You dont think the American Public is concerned . I won. I became president. No, i dont think they care at all. If the audit is still on you will not turn over the tax returns, you will fight to block it . Nobody would, nobody hands over a return when its under audit. The scrutiny of his personal finances would cross a red line. Let me go to carlos ka bella. This is a pretty clearcut chair of the ways and Means Committee is taking his time. Hes issued a demand, sent a letter tonight at 6 00 eastern time to the irs, which is really se serving the public. I want to see the returns of this individual american citizen. Whats the hold up . Chris, i think a couple things. Number one, the president should voluntarily turnover his returns. Its the tradition in our country and he should just do it the way he said he would. Number two, we should change the law to compel every president ial candidate by a certain date to release their returns for x number of years, members of congress can decide what makes most sense. I will say that in terms of chairman neal making this request, there are some risks for democrats in my opinion. The spirit of the law is that the ways and Means Committee chairman and the Senate Finance Committee Chairman can request these records in an effort or as they are attempting to conduct oversight of the irs. I think this is a little outside that scope, so i do think we should change the law. I think regardless of the law, the president should release his returns. But i do think that this could be a dangerous precedent. And you think what would happen . What would be the boomerang here . This is Something Arbitrary in nature and we would be setting a precedent that the ways and Means Committee or the Senate Finance committee can request anyones tax returns for any reason at any time. I think thats a little dangerous. Obviously were talking about the president of the United States. The standard should be the highest. But the law right now does not require the president or any president ial candidate to release the returns. I think thats what needs to change. I agree with carlos. We should change the law in the future. That has bipartisan support. Congressman, whats wrong with the law right now . Whats your version, the 1924 law which says the irs is to turn it over to the chairman of the ways and Means Committee, the house and the Senate Finance committee, whats unclear in the law . Nothing is unclear. The president a candidate should just be required to turn it over. Now the president is not going to allow his commissioner to do that. Its going to get tied up in courts and its going to take much longer than would be a service to the public. Well, id be interested in doing the culling of the herd to find out which are working for the people and which are toadys of the president. Steve mnuchin said he would most likely block a request for the president s tax returns. Lets take a look. Have you received any instruction or guidance of any kind about how to handle congressional requests for President Trumps tax returns . Based upon the request, well examine it and we will follow the law. We will protect the president , as we would protect any individual taxpayer you know, maybe thats a doubletalk there. Thats speaking with a forked tongue as they used to say in the cowboy movies. He says were going to obey the law. He says, were going to protect my boss. Whats he saying, anything . I dont know what hes saying. The president isnt any other citizen. Thats a ridiculous argument. And specifically here where the president has made a claim, which is that because hes under audit he cant release them, first of all, we dont even know if thats true as you pointed out. Michael cohen, in fact, i believe testified he didnt think the president was under audit. But thats something thats verifiable or not. And i dont know if him being under audit is a bar to his taxes being released. When you have those kinds of statements going on, it sure looks like hes hiding behind it. I think congress has the absolute right to request them here. And, in fact, its probably already been done by mueller and much of the analysis of his tax returns are probably already in the Mueller Report. Let me go to congressman swalwell. Wh swalwell. What do we make of nadler . I think hes a classic chairman of any committee. Hes being careful, yet here he is basically getting authorization today by all the democrats all the democrats on the committee of judiciary, all of them saying he now has the authority to go for use of subpoena. Where does he stand now in terms of getting the full Mueller Report . Were going to get the full report, chris. We also want to follow the rule of law, which we are so offended that the president doesnt. So were going to expect them to do the right thing and when they dont we will subpoena it. The republicans voted just a couple weeks ago 4200 with democrats to get the full Mueller Report. Their vote today against it is contradicting the earlier vote that they had. Chris, again, going back to the president could just voluntarily do this himself, if he is 100 exonerated, then he should just order his attorney general to give us 100 of the report. To your point, it was just three weeks ago as you say, the republicans in the Congress Democrats in a bipartisan vote urging the president urging the Justice Department to release muellers full report to congress. That bill explicitly called for the full release of congress to any report, special report counsel mueller provides to the attorney general. Everything should go. However, during today apartments judiciary committee, president of the same republicans were adamant in opposition to the subpoena. In the face of laws and rules, he finds inconvenient, the chairman demands our top Law Enforcement officer to break the rules and the regulations and the law. This is reckless, its irresponsible and its disingenuous. Its obvious to me that this is just a continuation of an attempt to undermine the president of the United States. Enough is enough, for heavens sakes. Lets please move on. Thats one of the great birthers of our time. What a joke. But let me ask you let me go to carlos on this question. Again, i dont know whats going to happen here. It seems the democrats do want to get the full Mueller Report so they can get it and release all of it to the American People as much as they can and yet the white house and the attorney general appointed by the president , looks like theyre playing a game of, well, well let you know. Were going to show you. This one is a lot easier, chris. I agree with eric. Congress should definitely get an unredacted report. The chair nan nadler is being prudent. Hes being patient and measured. Hes giving the attorney general the opportunity to deliver that report to congress. If that doesnt work, now he has the support of his committee to move forward. So i think hes being prudent. I think hes taking the right approach, and i think politically its important or democrats not to seem too anxious in this process and allow the administration the opportunity. Congressman swalwell . Well, we also dont want to do what the president does, chris, which is not follow the rule of law or the honor code. Some things are not written in law, but theres customs and traditions that we follow, which is you ask for something voluntarily. If they dont give it to you, then you issue the subpoena. But just like donald trump said hes going to give us his taxes and he didnt, just like he said hes going to release the Mueller Report now he doesnt want to, were now in a position with the subpoena power and the courts on our side, were going to get all of this. Mimi, how is this going to work out in the courts . I just see a lot over the horizon coming over this year. You know, we thought it was more likely for impeachment. Maybe its more this year were going to see real Court Battles over information. Its early. Its only april. There are a lot much battles ahead. Were no longer powerless and i carry myself with the confidence that the American People gave us the ability to put a balance of power finally on all of these abuses. Mimi, the subpoena power is really what they fight over. Nixon didnt have it. Bill clinton didnt have it. The subpoena power often makes the difference. Its the one weapon that the people trying to get to its hard to stop them. Can the democrats win this fight on all this stuff, from the tax returns to the Mueller Report . Were going to go into questions later in the show about the inauguration, who paid for it, what they got for it, questions about who are the people hanging around maralago, like sort of like gangsters and gamblers hanging around the locker room at a basketball game. Theres a lot of sneaky stuff going on here and the question is are we going to get the answers . Yeah, look, chris, in many ways i think court is a bad place for donald trump, and it has been over the past two years. Whenever things have been litigate and had gone to court, usually when the facts come out, they dont look good for donald trump. If you remember, amy berman jackson, the judge who sentenced roger stone said, court is a place where facts still matter. And so i think that to the extent this is going to get litigated in the courts, at the end of the day, the right thing is going to happen here. And by the right thing, i mean the facts coming out, whatever they are. And, by the way, President Trump is totally wrong because anybody you talk to certainly anybody on the democratic side, i think a lot of independents do want to find out what this president s Economic Situation is. They want know what hes been up to. They certainly want to know what his tax returns tell us about his dealings with russia, trump tower, the whole works. Anyway, thank you, u. S. Congressman swalwell, mimi rocah and former congressman carlos ka bella. Coming up, new concerns at maralago. Investigating chinese intelligence operations targeting the president at his winter white house. Plus bidens explanation. I want to talk to you about a whole lot of issues and ill always be direct with you. Today i want to talk about just the support and encouragement that ive made to women and some men, have made them uncomfortable. Tonight well show you his promise to be more respectful in the future and the clearest indication so far that hes running for president. And in a free wheeling speech to House Republicans last night, the president made a number of outrageous claims. Tonight a republican senator is calling one of those claims idiotic. Much more ahead. Stay with us. Could there be another around the corner . Or could it turn out differently . I wanted to help protect myself. My doctor recommended eliquis. Eliquis is proven to treat and help prevent another dvt or pe blood clot. Almost 98 percent of patients on eliquis didnt experience another. And eliquis has significantly less major bleeding than the standard treatment. Eliquis is fda approved and has both. Dont stop eliquis unless your doctor tells you to. Eliquis can cause serious and in rare cases fatal bleeding. Dont take eliquis if you have an artificial heart valve or abnormal bleeding. 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