you'll want to subscribe to. veep stakes continue tomorrow. more from cleveland and more on hillary clinton meeting with tim kaine. "hardball" with chris matthews is next. >> bill mahr plays "hardball." good evening. i'm chris matthews in new york. the republican convention is just days away now and the party's nominee is running the most unpredictable, some would say confounding campaign in modern times. the democratic campaign is facing a major trust deficit. only 37% of voters consider her trustworthy. on top of that the country seems polarized on issues of race and policing. saying america needs more love and kindness. whose vision will prevail this november? with me the whole hour, bill mahr. he is hosting a series of four episodes all live during the republican and democratic conventions. nothing like having here. i can ask you the toughest question. if you had to explain this to someone you knew living overseas, what would you explain is going on in this country on racial issues? >> it depends on which country who i was talking to is from. some countries don't have a racial problem like we do because they don't have a history of slavery like we do. we never really got race right in this country. it is the original sin of this country. a fault line that we've tried to cover up. every time something racial happens, people act surprised. i just watched a documentary on o.j. simpson. it is hard to believe that back then, every white person in america was like, of course he is guilty. and no jury could ever final him anything but guilty. and they were shocked. >> i was, too. i was on the air. >> we were all shocked. and black folks were all applauding. not because they thought he was that innocent but because for once, for one time, a black guy beat the system after the system had beaten black folks so many time. that's the beginning of it. when it comes to the police, there is never any excuse for what happened. for shooting a policeman? of course, we all condemn that. there is no ands, ifs or buts. i don't condone it but i do understand it. >> you understand that guy? >> well, i understand the motivation, yes. how many videos can you see? how many years can go by when this is going on when black people are brutally assault? the last guy, right on the ground. and he put a slug in him. i'm surprised somebody did not fire back sooner. >> what do you think of the motives? it is motives are different in every case. you're the guest tonight. i see the common nature, white police officer kills black person. apparently without justification. what else is going on? is it prejudice? >> i introduced a police officer once on my old show. he said when i worked in the black neighborhood, i hated all black people. when i hated in the latino neighborhood, i hated latino people. when i worked in the san fernando valley, i hated the white people. when you're a police officer, you come up against not the good people. that's who you're dealing with. you're a policeman. you deal with criminals. so this is some of that and there is something with police culture. we're not indicting all the police. and without the police, this country would look like that movie, the purge. >> i was a capitol police officer for a while. it is not really dangerous work. one thing they said, when you go to approach a stopped car for a traffic violation. you never stand directly next to the driver's seat. you don't stand right at the window. could you get plugged in the stomach. so you approach from the back door. so police are basically worried when they stop anybody about who is in that car. >> of course. >> that may explain some of this. >> but it is a dangerous job. there are statistics on this. how dangerous it is. i don't think it actually cracks the top ten as far as how many deaths. i think cab drivers are killed more than policemen. i think electricians, fishermen. that's tonight say it is not a dangerous job. but it is a job you signed up for. the answer when you feel nervous about your high of can't be right away to shoot which seems like it happens way too soon. is it most cops? probably not. but it is way too many and it gets on film a hot. >> when you see the guy running across a field and he plugs him from behind. that's not self-defense. >> that's cowardice. >> are we missing something in the tape sometimes? >> i don't think we're missing much in the tape. i don't think we're missing much in the rodney king tape. once you have him on the ground and you have six guys wailing on him with batons, that cannot be justified. >> the chokehold guy. >> this is a job you volunteered for. it says protect and serve. that's to protect and serve us. that's not to protect and serve you. you have to understand there is an element of danger in this job and you have to accept that. i think most policemen like their job. yes, there is danger and a lot of perks. you know? >> this week donald trump tweeted, look what's happening in our country tumd weak leadership of obama and people like crooked hillary clinton. we are a divided nation. >> do you have the president at any given time has an knew of these situations of black and white? do you think the leadership does annoying forestall it? >> i think this president is awfully good about talking about it, about racial issues. there are lots of folks on one side who say he doesn't do it enough. like cornell west. >> i hear it from both of them. and we know what the white side says, that perhaps he is an illegitimate president. >> i know why he is doing it. i'm not saying not black. that's stupid. but to be someone who is seen as an overall leader and he doesn't want to be sectarian. >> it is almost an impossible situation that he put himself -- that he is in. as much as a president can calm the nation, he is upon the. all these people who think that donald trump will be great for their pocket book because he is rich. he is going to be horrible because he is the opposite of calm. the stock market hates nothing more than volatility. they all pretend they don't like obama because as he democrat and a socialist. he was great for the stock market because he is calm and they love calm. and trump will be horrible. >> you know the old line, if you want to live like a republican, vote for a democrat. >> i don't. that's great. >> donald trump called himself the law and order candidate. >> too many americans are trapped in fear, violence and poverty. we must maintain law and order at the highest level or we will cease to have a country 100%. we will cease we will cease to have a country. i am the law and order candidate. >> so that's what nixon said. it is a very fact-free assessment of what's going. on actually crime has been down the last 10, 20 years. that's not what it looks like on the evening news. >> you can see it. >> that's not what the media likes. they like sensationalism so people think things are worse. things are actually better ask statistically they are shown to be better. but that's not how you win votes. >> if you have kids like do i in new york, you feel a lot better about this vicinity. >> of course. i lived here in the hate '70s ask the early '80s. >> he says black parents should teach their kids to respect the police. >> really? he really said that? republicans wonder why they don't get votes of minorities when they make comments like that. black lives matter is not inherently racist. it is what it is. black lives should matter. when we see them gunned down in the street. when they're not deserving of that, is it not obvious that some movement had to rise up to protest against that? >> to make your interto, newt gingrich on his best behavior said it is more dangerous to be black in america. not just because of the crime on the street but because of the police. he put it together. both threats to black youth. what do you think he is up to? >> he is up to wanting to be vice president but i don't think that will happen. these republicans are so alarmed. many are appalled even though they're sort of getting behind him. they have spent all these decades of race baiting, anti-intellectualism, and conspiracy theories. when a donald trump emerges, they're surprised. they shouldn't be surprised. the one different thing with donald trump is his temperament. certainly we've had people who followed that strategy before in the republican party. we've never had anybody with this kind of temperament. if he became president, it would be government by snit. every day it would be about tweeting and getting even with people who did not do exactly what he wanted. >> do you think this call that obama was somehow the product of a strange personal conspiracy by his mother, that she was a white american woman from kansas and she went over the kenya to have her baby and married an african guy who wasn't exactly the best stand-up guy. he was not going to be around very long. then she somehow got it posted in the honor who lou newspapers and she gave them name hussein obama. president in 35 years? >> this is why he sued me. >> it is encredible when you talk it through. >> of course. that is racism. i know they hate to hear it. it is the one thing they hate to hear it. i would never say all republicans are racists. but if you're a racist and you're looking for a political party. >> it is not just trump. if you watch the republican debates, they all follow this script of restore america. i want my country back. it is subtle but not that subtle. they talk about obama and his presidency as if it never existed. there's something there. we have to put america back to work. yeah. did that. that actually happen. we put america back. we want to rebuild our depleted -- we didn't deneat military. it went up under obama like every president. their my explanation of birtherism. you go this all the pictures of john adams all the way through, and they all look white. and then you get to this guy. they want to say, like -- >> they just don't like the idea of a black family eating off the white house china. they can couch it any way they want but it did not go down well with them. this is their answer to that. >> really wasn't president. and they were hoping that he would be a terrible failure. then would it never happen again. bush to his credit, george w. bush on obama's first day in office said we want to you succeed. that was not the attitude of most republicans and i'm sure that they hated that history had judge his presidency as having succeeded. >> i think he is in the top couple tiers. >> we'll talk with the wild presidential race and much more about the rise of donald trump. you're here to buy a car. what would help is simply being able to recognize a fair price. truecar has pricing data on every make and model, so all you have to do is search for the car you want, there it is. now you're an expert in less than a minute. this is truecar. friday in new york, donald trump's pick for vp. stay tuned for that on friday. back with bill after this. do not take viagra if you take nitrates for chest pain or adempas® for pulmonary hypertension. your blood pressure could drop to an unsafe level. to avoid long-term injury, seek immediate medical help for an erection lasting more than four hours. stop taking viagra and call your doctor right away if you experience a sudden decrease or loss in vision or hearing. ask your doctor about viagra single packs. i'm not a stomer, but i'm calling about that credit scorecard. 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(to dog)i'm so proud of you. well thank you. get your free credit scorecard at discover.com. all i know is what's on the internet. >> right. me too. i get my news from porno. >> i find her slogan -- i am a ready for hillary? yes. am i excited? no. i spent my entire year of freshman in high school. republicans are wrapping up for the big convention. they have a problem. no one wants to go and no one wants to speak. >> back with bill maher who has had a busy year covering this campaign. the race comes down to a choice between donald trump and hillary clinton. did you see the numbers? 39% says they're independent now. >> first of all that's a myth. there aren't independents anymore. they have dived into this. they're usually right leaning independents. i think they have a side and don't want to admit it. bill o'reilly says he is an independent. i'm an independent. >> so is george will as of last week. >> that took guts. he earned a lot of admiration. >> let me ask but the show business quality at the conventions. the last time i think wendell in 1940, he won it by a big crowd in the galleries he won it. >> really? you don't remember that. >> i've been told. >> do i remember as a kid in 1968. chicago. >> he wasn't there. i never missed a minute of it. >> that kind of drama is what we may be facing. >> that one night. i was watching with my grad school roommates. he said one night, get some sleep. let me ask but trump. he has cleveland. monday through thursday next week. what will he do? to make it razz ma taz? honky tonk. >> that's not his problem. >> how does he make a compelling bit of theater? >> i think they'll make it for him. i think there will be a movement town seat him from the nomination. >> really? >> yeah. according to some people, they're not happy with this nominee. they feel like this is a zombie candidate. i've been saying the best thing that fumbles can do is punt. the only way they're going to win in november is to lose. it is not the worst thing in the world. to have hillary clinton for four years. in defense, a great defense, you punt. they have a great defense. they block legislation. they're obstructionists. this is what they do best. >> let her have the ball. >> yeah. let her have the ball. she's not really that horrible when you think about it. she is not some sort of far left person. she is a centrist. >> do you worry that she may be far right on some issues? >> too much of a hawk on some issues, absolutely, i don't blame her for the iraq vote. i think that was a vote to give george bush a badge and a gun. wasn't to send them in shooting and blazing and we had just been attacked. it was wrong country. a little thing like that. but she is too hawkish. i worry about. that one reason it was great to have bernie sanders in the race, or rand paul if he had followed what his father used to say, was that you at least had a voice in the debate saying we should not be in all these countries. the president talks about if you stay wrong words, that will stir up trouble. probably, it's droning. it is probably droning that is causing more of the hatred around the world. i'm not even sure if that program is worth it. >> the president prefers droning to war. >> of course. >> do you? >> i've always thought we have to do something. we can't just do nothing. obviously, troops on the ground, fighting a war like we did in iraq was an extremely stupid thing to do. i think the administration admitted, we don't know how many people we're killing. whenever there is a terrorist attack, what does the person today? what did the guy in orlando today? what did the bombers say? get out of muslim lands. stop bombing muslim people. so i wonder if it is the bombs or the drones? >> you wonder since the first iraq war, we've been killing muslim people international television. i don't know if we do it to any other group. >> we've also been saving many. like in kosovo. >> that's the argument. we would just probably be better off not to be so involved. one thing i will miss about the obama administration is no new wars. i wish we could have gotten out of ones we were in a little faster and more completely. but at least we didn't ramp up. they were trying on egg him on to go into syria. >> hillary wanted us to go into iraq. she didn't say i'm so sorry he did it. i thought he would bluff. it doesn't work after the fact. she supported getting in with the other two people. rice and powers in libya. she has had a pattern of wanting to be regime. >> women have patterns in the modern era when they get to be presidents in countries of being hawkish. they have to burnish their macho credentials. >> are you profiling here? be careful. >> i'm just observing. >> is that always true? >> golda -- >> theresa may? >> i don't know anything about her yet. >> golda. >> the women are looked at. there is a suspicion from men, are you going to be tough enough? and what we really need from women is what women are. more cooperative. and i think hillary will be that, too. and as she says, more kindness. >> reagan showed his toughness with the, what was it called? the air traffic controllers. >> i heard from tim o'neill, i don't like that stuff. >> bill maher is sticking with us. this is "hardball." the place for politics. >> i feel i should say something about a growing movement called bernie or bust where bernie supporters pledged, if it is hillary, they'll stay home or vote for the green party. on the website they said they're voting against plutocracy. s kno where self-proclaimed financial superstars pitch you investment opportunities. i've got a fantastic deal for you- gold! with the right pool of investors, there's a lot of money to be made. but first, investors must ask the right questions and use the smartcheck cllenge to make the right decisions. you're not even registered; i'm done with you! i can...i can... savvinvestors check their financial pro's background by visiti smartcheck.gov i can...i can... you totanobody's hurt, new car. but there will still be pain. it comes when your insurance company says they'll only pay three-quarters of what it takes to replace it. what are you supposed to do? 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(screams) road trip! whahhhh hahaha... roadrip! president obama met earlier with members of law enforcement and civil rights leaders to discuss community policing issues and donald trump and members of his family visited indiana governor mike penalty at his home this morning. his campaign manager said trump will announce the running mate decision on friday in new york. back to "hardball." >> you famously said in one of the first debates with hillary clinton, i'm tired of hearing about the e-mails. for a long time i was tired of hearing about the e-mails. and i still don't think she committed some horrible crime. but that story has moved a little bit, has it not? >> it has. but this is what i also think. there is enormous frustration on the part of the american people with the way we do politics in this country. people want us to talk about their lives and their issues and not just spend whole lives attacking our opponents. >> we're back bill maher. he interviewed sanders in may before the california primary. what do you make of sanders? it is a one shot for him. he is too old to go back next time. he won't make as sweet a deal as hillary did. >> first of all, i object because that's ageism. i don't know why we think someone, is over the hill. there are blue zones where people live to be 100 or older. that's the norm. >> so you think he'll come back again? >> i'm just saying people now, you and i are both over 35. >> you're going to do it, aren't you? >> just on this issue. >> do you know who should be, have a hat in the ring? jerry brown. why doesn't he? because of ageism. >> he's term limited now. >> i'm talking about in national politics. he's done so much to turn around california. >> you're your point. you two-point argument. jerry brown. okay. >> we're all individuals. some people are very, very there and completely together at 80. and some people aren't. reagan was in office and he wasn't. i'm sorry. that's the truthful. >> donald trump is taking criticism for his nickname for elizabeth warren. let's watch that. >> hillary clinton has somebody, did you ever hear of pocahontas? pocahontas elizabeth warren. she is a total failure. she said she was an indian because her cheek bones were high, that she was an indian. that she was native-american. and we have these surrogates, people like her. total failures. >> wow. >> i'm so tired of that. >> the first time i heard it it was funny. then it lost a lot of value as he kept doing it. >> we did a theme. it was i'm so tired of the two standards in this election, that he can get away with all this stuff and hillary clinton cannot. there are two standards. we went and showed tapes from other presidential elections of what people did that was beyond the pale. george allen are called somebody a name. i had never heard the word. out. goodbye. trump, what he does racially? that's stuff would have anybody else out of the race. >> so you think pocahontas was nefarious? >> i'm just saying, everybody before trump had to play by one set of rules. calling mccain not a war hero. the thing with the mexican judge. trump university. >> he's not getting off on that. everybody thinks that's against him. trump university is not a plus or a neutral. >> what about exploiting the veterans? not giving the money that he promised for charity? if hillary clinton did that, she would be out of the race tomorrow. there is a completely different set of standards for this man. and i'm glad -- i said a long time ago. emglad this election is going on for a long time. >> let's talk about why the election is pretty close. we have a poll that shows in a four-way race. getting close to ten. in a four-way race, hillary clinton and trump were even. the reason i think is this. she talked about her trust deficit. let's watch secretary cleanse. >> a lot of people tell pollsters they don't like me. i don't like hearing it and i thought a lot about what is behind it. maybe we can persuade people to change their meenlds by the marshalling facts and making arguments to rebut negative attacks. that doesn't work for everyone. you can't just talk someone into trusting you. you have to earn it. so yes, i could say that the reason i sometimes sound careful with my words is not that i'm hiding something. it is just that i'm careful with my words. >> what do you think? >> look. >> it's a hard thing for her, anybody to explain the fact of why you're not credible with people when you're running for president. >> but it is also true that she has been demonized more than anyone else for the last quarter century. as far as the e-mails go, i think mostly what that is is an elderly person, again, we're not bashing the elderly here. they ever every of right to run for president. but as far as technology goes, they're not great at i. i'm not great at i. i think she probably just didn't understand. i think the important thing is what was the intent? was the intent something nefarious? of course wasn't. most of the people in the state department used a private server because the government server was not efficient. she needed a private server to get her work done. democrats do work. government work. they don't hate the government. they want to get it done. she is a wonk who needed something worked. >> i don't believe it. >> you don't believe it? do you think something nefarious -- >> what i think was, and this is legitimate. hillary clinton had just run for president. she had personal contacts with tens of thousands of people in the country who are her political army. she wanted to keep the army together. to keep in contact shelf wanted to get kids in certain schools. she had to maintain a network which was nationwide shelf didn't want it subject to foia. the legitimate world in which she could operate. the law is the law. by the way, why is everybody in hollywood so unnuanced? very liberal and occasionally conservative. isn't there anyone who says there are things you can say on both sides. >> you're not talking about me. >> if anybody is spelling liberals they have spinach on their teeth, it's me. so don't throw that at me. >> just for consideration. >> can i say one more thing about this? the e-mail thing. if you look at all the issues. >> you've always taken this position about the e-mail thing. you never thought there was a problem there. >> as time bernie sanders, i think it is more of a problem than i thought to begin with but i don't think it is a giant issue. if you look at all the issues that an night right wing, e-mails, benghazi, voter fraud, planned parenthood, building a wall, who can go to the bathroom where. what do they have in common? they're imaginary. they're not real. they're not actual issues. >> before we break, this is where, i won't say both sides are guilty. that's too easy. somewhere during all the benghazi stuff when people got killed there, wondering why, hillary clinton is a very smart person. what if in, chris stevens was my friend of you don't even know the guy. i went to the cia, to all the forces we had available at state and i followed that thing hour by hour, hour by hour until we heard he was gone. that he had been killed i made a point of doing everything i could. you can could the tick tock on this. when you watch the hearings, they never said, what did you do this minute? they never asked they are kind of questions to get kind of narrative. all the people wanted to hear was she did her best. the republicans never gave her a chance to show that she had done her best difl understand, wasn't very helpful. >> no one has the guts to say that chris stevens, brave, but that wasn't a smart thing to do. it was his call. there wasn't enough security there. >> i think they were hoping she would say that. blame on it him. >> you won't hug it out with the jihadis. >> we were counting on local militia to protect us. i wish congress was capable of a clear cut hearing. ♪ ♪ take on any road with intuitive all-wheel drive. the nissan rogue, murano and pathfinder. now get 0% apr for up to 72 months, plus $500 bonus cash. ♪ the president is coming to the last six months of his term of after seven and a half years in office must seem like the final few months in high school. as president that means doing things just for fun now that it is the end. like, i don't know. legalize pot. put beyonce on the nickel. invite are a leap in the rose garden. did i mention legalize pot? >> nothing i like more than new rules by the way. that's yours. you own it. you own that franchise, new rules. >> people have tried to rip it off but they can't. >> welcome back to "hardball." more than 320,000 people recently signed a petition on the white house website for president obama to appear on real-time. the white house said they would keep in ninld invitation. they said plenty of people are asking tough questions that money and politics and trying on burst the bubble where some of our politicians and too many of our nation's political debates exist. thank you. do you want -- i'm pretty much pro obama. so this isn't new to anybody watching. what would you like him to get done between now and next january? >> well, legalizing pot would be great. >> nationwide? >> he can't do it single handedly but he could come out strongly for it and he should. he was a pot head himself. >> he used. >> no. he was a pot head. and he'll tell you that. >> a regular user. >> you never heard of it? back in hawaii. >> so it didn't kill his ambition. >> no. but if he had been convicted when he was young, he would not president. and he must know there are people serving time or their future is foreclosed in many ways. if you were convicted of just smoking pot, you can find yourself not able to get into a college or get housing. lots of stuff, with your kids. >> that's it? >> that's not the only thing. that would be a great last thing for him to do. i'm sure as he goes down that list of stupid things in america, let's open up cuba, let's have a climate deal. a nuclear deal with iran. these are the kinds of things that he seems to be checking off. and that one is a no brainer. but he has an attorney general who is very, very very much against legalizing pot which is a shame. >> let me ask you what he would like to do. it has nothing to do with man kind's history. the danger of his very sting like a butter fly, float like a bee. he's been very good at that. he knows how to sting the guy and then pull back. does he at some point risk getting pulled into the mud by trump? >> i don't think so. he is too smart for that. he doesn't get down on trump's level. nobody gets down on trump's level. trump fights in a metly unique way. enough never lost that. >> low energy. this lyin' ted. >> just saying things that makes peel nervous about themselves. remember he talked about kasich? he's disgusting when he's eating. talking about menstrual cycles. this is the high school bully and he never, ever lost that and it is very effective. >> let's talk about something we grew up with. of all the things we made progress. on sexual identity, sexual orientation in our lives. i was watching a movie the other night. they could still tell jokes about people being gay. a funny punch line. that's gone. there's no joke there anymore. people don't even have that discomfort. what do you think about the pope saying, the roman catholic church owes an apology to gay people? >> i think it is great of this pope is a different kind of cat than anyone we've had before. on catholic doctrine, he is pretty much down the line as has been every pope we've ever known. i think american liberals think he is more liberal than he really is but at least he makes this much of an effort. i will always love this pope just for the fact that he went to washington last fall and lectured the republicans on climate change. i mean, climate change isn't even on his beat. he is the pope. he doesn't to have address this issue. he took it upon himself, he is a smart guy. and he said i will put this on my agenda. >> it is sort of pro-life if you think about it. it saves the life of the species on this planet. >> but for me, the pope, the grand master flash of ancient fairytales. sfwha does that mean? grand master flash of ancient fairytales. >> it is an insult to religion. >> that's your beat. >> i know. but to lecture republicans on reality, on what is real, on getting real. of course, it didn't work because republicans didn't move one inch on that issue but i thought it was amazing and it made me really, really love that n. >> why is climate in real terms, not just the kilimanjaro doesn't have snow on it anymore. that miami beach is about five feet above sea level now. it is going to be venice down there. there are islands disappearing. it is not a theory anymore. >> of course not. >> climate is affecting us. >> how about the fact the pentagon has been on this page for the better part of a decade. the pentagon has been saying this is a national security issue. the republicans in congress have told them, don't tell us that. >> why are they afraid of science? are they afraid of admitting it is evolution? >> i think the main reason is because they get contributions from people like the koch brothers. >> who don't want to believe in it because of fossil fuel. >> because they only have $80 billion. what if they don't make any more money? how will they eat? i don't understand rich people ask climate. you can't have private air. you just can't. you can't escape all this toxicity in the water and the food supply. and it will get you all. don't they connect the dots between toxicity that is pervading the at moss sneer the sickness that they must see all around them? in themselves? the rates of cancer? i mean, america in general cause this is sickness because we are so toxic. >> well, they don't have your conscience. much more ahead. this is "hardball." but i keep it growing by making every dollar count. that's why i have the spark cash card from capital one. with it, i earn unlimited 2% cash back on all of my purchasing. and that unlimited 2% cash back from spark means thousands of dollars each year going back into my business... which adds fuel to my bottom line. what's in your wallet? ...meta appetite control. you and temptation with... clinically proven to help reduce hunger between mes. new, from metamucil, the #1 doctor recommended brand. >> we have to be so strong. we have to fight so viciously and violently, because we're dealing with violent people. vicious people. folks, there's something going on that's really, really bad. all right? it's bad. and we better get smart, and we better get tough, or we're not going to have much of a country left, okay? >> muslims are the ones that see what's going on, the muslims are the ones that have to report them. and if they don't report them, then there have to be consequences to them. >> welcome back to "hardball." he's criticized president obama and other democrats for not using the phrase radical islamic terrorism. does he have a point? i'm back with bill maher. what is the issue of language here? they seem to think they have obama on the hook there, by not using the phrase radical islamic terrorism. >> well, here's the thing, i think the question we have to ask is, can you defeat radical islamic terrorism, or the war on terror, not a great name for it, but for lack of a better term, without reforming the religion itself? that's a question americans need to ask themselves. i would say, no, you have to reform the religion itself before you get to the war on terror. and you can't reform the religion if you can't talk about it. if you can't be honest about it. if you can't criticize it. every time somebody says islamo phobia, they give cover to the religious bullies who are giving cover to the muslims want to sl live in the 20th century, as well as the 7th century, but donald trump is a fascist. the mayor of london, he's a muslim that's a great thing. when they're in places like that, they have to speak out for the values that we all share, separation of church and state, equality for women, freedom of speech. these are not always rife in the muslim world. >> trump says democrats don't want to use the phrase for some murky reason, you know what he's saying. that they're somehow on their side. >> of course, i know what he's up to. the language is not the main thing, but it is part of it. and i've been saying this for a long time, if there's an attack in the month before the election, i think it will probably help donald trump, although he has an amazing ability to sabotage his own cause. >> what are the caused of him right now, do you think? here in july? >> i want to scare people into coming out to -- >> how many out of ten? what are the odds? two out of ten chances, five out of ten? >> people say this to me all the time, can he win? yes, he can win. i want people to be very scared until november 8th, don't get complacent. anything can happen in this country. people have dumb idea about what makes a president. they say, we need to run the country lake a business, he's a businessman. as long as they believe that, anything is possible. and a terrorist attack could help him. and they don't like hillary either. so be very scared. the zombies are in the mall, this is not in the bag. let's say it's 5 out of 10. >> wow, 50/50. >> i don't really believe that. but i want them to stay scared. >> what do you really think? 1 in 10? >> i think it's higher than that, but it's going to be tough. obviously because of the demographics, and the more people see him, the more they hate him, for obvious reasons. he's abhorrent. >> his one great strength is he's out and hillary's in. that's what i think is the one. >> and he's an insane racist in orange grease paint. and the people, the more they see it, it took them a long time, we're not a country that is really that quick. >> back with more of bill maher, you're watching "hardball," the place for politics. ♪ take on any road with intuitive all-wheel drive. the nissan rogue, murano and pathfinder. now get 0% apr for up to 72 months, plus $500 bonus cash. murano and pathfinder. now get 0♪ apr for up to 72 trust number one doctor recommended dulcolax constipated? 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>> i hope there's a challenge to donald trump. we need more than two political parties, we need at least two. maybe they could find their soul again, if they were to challenge this man, and hopefully -- i don't want him to get hurt, but