The data says we dont have equal protection under the law. So is it inexcusable if some police not all, not even most feel they are above being questioned. We must really have peace and come together to show the world who we are. Thanks for watching. Im al sharpton. Hardball starts right now. Calling in the guard. This is hardball. Good evening. Im Chris Matthews in washington. Tonight, all roads lead to ferguson. The Missouri National guard is there. So is the group black lawyers for justice, and the nation of islam. Attorney general eric holder is headed there wednesday. What will come of this National Collision of emotion and demand . Something better . A better chance at criminal justice regarding the death of Michael Brown . A better chance for a wider
social justice between the deprived communities of this land and the wider america . Will the Police Officer be dealt with in jut . Will the cries of the Ferguson Community for justice be heard and satisfied . Will there be peace as those who demand justice here await it . Thats the question on the streets of ferguson tonight as the National Guard defends the police against a repeat of last nights chaos. On sunday night shots were fired at authorities. Molotov cocktails were thrown at a Police Command center. Looters targeted shops and restaurants. Employees at one local mcdonalds hid in a storage room after the restaurant was overrun by a crowd. The Police Responded by firing teargas, smoke canisters and rubber bullets into the crowds. Hundreds of officers were deployed in heavy duty riot gear. Several journalists were threatened physically by police. Tonight, thats the question. Governor nixon declared a state of emergency and has ordered in
the National Guard. Community activists are organizing their own security forces. Late today president obama announced that attorney general eric holder will travel to ferguson wednesday to meet with investigators and other community leaders. The president has again called for an end to the violence. We have all seen images oh of protesters and Law Enforcement in the streets. Its clear that the vast majority of people are peacefully protesting. Whats also clear is that a small minority of individuals are not. I understand the passion and the anger that arises over the death of Michael Brown. Giving into anger by looting or carrying guns and even attacking the police only serves to raise tensions and stir chaos. It undermines rather than advancing justice. Nbcs craig melvin is on the ground in ferguson. Its 7 00 eastern. What do you see coming out there . What do you see now . I think weve got a live look thousand for you, chris. There is a march right now. This has become customary about this time every night. This is the main drag here in ferguson. We are literally a block or two away from where the shooting happened. We have seen this crowd grow considerably over the past hour, hour and a half, two hours or so. So far i can tell you that the protest itself, the march itself has been peaceful. There was an incident i would say maybe 30 or 45 minutes ago. We were about a block down in front of the mcdonalds. This has been the epicenter for a lot of the action here. That mcdonalds, we should note, by the way, is closed. It has been closed for several hours. Businesses on both sides boarded
up. They have been vandalized as have dozens of businesses on this street. We were in front of the mcdonalds because we were told around 5 00 there would be a meeting where they were going to essentially organize a peaceful protest. We expected the meeting after 5 00. There was a swarm of police cars that showed up in front of the mcdonalds. It became clear that the police were telling the protesters they could not stand there. They could not assemble there. They had to keep moving. At that point, i would say maybe a hundred or so folks gathered in front of the mcdonalds start to move across the street. We ended up in the parking lot of a bank. One of the principal organizers
at that point vowed to continue protesting throughout the night. Also said they were prepared to get arrested. Also said they were going to hold off because they didnt have the numbers at that point. There were more Police Officers than protesters. They wanted to wait until they got more numbers to continue to protest. It appears as if, Chris Matthews, we are in for another long night in ferguson. When do you see the trouble beginning . There was the peaceful proare test and then what the president called the bad crowd showed up. People looking for trouble. I know there is no curfew tonight. There is no law against coming out. What do you expect to happen later tonight . When the sun goes down is typically when its started to get bad, so to speak. As you can see here, probably the sun is starting to go down. Its been a hot day in ferguson. North of 90 degrees. The temperature has also started
to go down as well. We have also been told that a number of the protesters come out after work. They come out after their jobs. They get off at 5 00, 5 30, 6 00 and they come here. One of the questions i asked over and over to the protesters is what does it take for this to come . What do you want to see . Everyone i ask that question to, young and old alike, they all said the same thing. They will go home, stop. Once there is some sort of punishment for the officer involved. Whether its charges, the indictment, termination all together. But they all said the same thing. Based on those conversations, i tend to think we are going to continue to see this play out until Something Like that happens. Also asked whether they thought the lifting of the curfew would have any measurable effect. No one i talked to thought that it would. Thank you so much, craig
melvin in ferguson. Charles ramsey is the Philadelphia Police commissioner. Bernard parks is the former police chief of los angeles. Commissioner ramsey, thank you very much for taking time from your duties tonight. I have a lot of respect for you. Big city responsibilities. Is there a best practices for dealing with a situation we face tonight following a night of chaos in ferguson . Dwron if there is one best practice. You want to try to control things best you can, protect people. You want to protect property. Do the best you can and keep things as low a temperature as you can while using a minimal amount of Police Presence and or force. What would be the impact on the people, do you think, of seeing National Guardsmen in fatigues. Soldiers of america. Not Police Forces but soldiers. Will they be more respectful of them, do you think . Its difficult to say. I can understand why the
governor took the steps he took. My understanding is the forward will have a limited role in support of the county police and the state police. Thats probably needed. Its been a week now we have had proare tests going on that have turned violent, unfortunately. Youve got to bring peace and calm to the streets of ferguson. Nothing much can be accomplished if you dont do that. So depending on the role of the National Guard, i think it could be of help. The toughest thing about being a Police Officer, especially in a tough neighborhood is discernment and not profiling people, treating them as an identity based upon numbers or statistics but treating people as individuals. How do they discern the difference between are protes r protesters out there for let jit mat rights of citizenship and somebody out there to do harm to property or others . The most important thing are what are their actions . Its clear as it relates to the
crowd thats there to be positive and deal with the issue of demonstration. They are not the ones throwing fire bombs, creating havoc. The mere fact that you have protesters that carry signs or speak loud is not an indication that they are violating the law. You go by their actions and if you can surgically remove those who are creating the havoc and creating the criminal activity, you can allow that peaceful demonstration to continue. If its so intertwined you cant distinguish the law breakers from the demonstrators then you have to call it unlawful assembly. No longer do you have a peaceful demonstration when the law breakers have taken it over. Commissioner ramsey, what about the culture of police . Philadelphia has had a long police culture, tough guys. Is there a sense you have to change the lingo, practice on the crowd and say, please move
along, use please, use words that suggest we are not the enemy . Are officers or officials in these cases taught to tell the troops to get out there and do it different tonight . Or just do it the way you have always done it . I can only speak for philadelphia, washington and chicago. Those are the three agencies i have served in. Things have changed a long time ago. You respect peoples right to protest. Thats not an issuement we need to treat people respectfully at all times. Even those that may not be respectful toward us. If we can establish communication. If we start off by treating people in a respectful manner then sometimes things dont escalate. Often times things begin to escala escalate. Deescalate to bring things back to a reasonable level so people can talk. People can demonstrate. We dont have people getting injured, businesses looted. Those kind of things. Police spent a lot of time in training in the agencies i have been in and the ones i am aware of. Working on deescalation and how to better handle crowds while respecting peoples right to protest. Commissioner, the old thing i grew up in philly was frank rizzo who was no friend to the Africanamerican Community at times. He believed you had to confront a situation with overwhelming force. Does that today incite a crowd . The sign of militarization, as its called . You get a sense of that from what the tenner of the crowd is. A show of force could be inciteful. Depends when you bring it forward. You could have resources allocated out of the sight of the public only to be brought in if shg gets out of control. The key is not that you have the force, but how you choose to use it and what the timing of it, as it relates to then quelling a
problem. You dont let the problem get so far out of hand that you then have to use excessive amount of resources to bring it back. You certainly want to deal with issues as they confront you. One of the issues in los angeles is they had far greater success when we had situations that helped those who wanted to demonstrate. Many times you will see in l. A. The police are escorting demonstrators through the street to allow them to demonstrate and not be in a traffic hazard. These are the things you learn as you go forward. Force is necessary at times. Just a matter of display of force unnecessarily could work against you. Its great having you on. Thank you so much. Youre a great group to have on, fellows. Thank you very much. The big goal tonight and we all agree. Nobody gets killed tonight. Thats a good goal. Coming up, the autopsy commissioned by the brown family conclude that is Michael Brown was shot six times including twice in the head. One was at the top of his head. Famed forensic pathologist will be here to talk about what the autopsy tells us and how prosecutor prosecutors could investigate the death. And the first africanamerican president is confronted with a racially charged incident. Whats happening in ferguson reminds us we are not yet in a post racial america. This is hardball, the place for politics. If hiring plumbers, carpenters and even piano tuners were just as simple . Thanks to angies list, now it is. Weve made hiring anyone from a handyman to a dog walker as simple as a few clicks. Buy their services directly at angieslist. Com no more calling around. No more hassles. Start shopping from a list of toprated providers today. Angies list is revolutionizing local service again. Visit angieslist. Com today. Well be right back with more from ferguson, missouri. Protesters have begun to march after a chaotic night. Police in ferguson are insisting that the protesters keep moving. Hardball, back after this. Kings hawaiian had faced, since robert taira opened his first bakery in a small hawaiian town. Making bread so good, that people bought two loaves one to take home, and one to eat on the way. So good, they grew from here. To here. To here. But to grow again, to the east coast they needed a new factory, but where . Fortunately, they get financing from ge capital. We not only have teams dedicated to the food industry, were also part of ge, a company thats built hundreds of factories. So we could bring in experts to help kings hawaiian make sense of transportation routes, supply chains, labor pools, and zoning to help them make the right decision. And, id like to think, to make their founder proud. If you just need a loan, just call a bank. At ge capital, were builders. And what we know, can help you grow. Thats why i always choose the fastest intern. R slow. The fastest printer. The fastest lunch. Turkey club. The fastest pencil sharpener. The fastest elevator. The fastest speed dial. The Fastest Office plant. So why wouldnt i choose the fastest wifi . I would. Switch to comcast Business Internet and get the fastest wifi included. Comcast business. Built for business. I met with the mother. She had the question any mother would have. Was my child in pain . Dr. Baden shared in his opinion he did not suffer. Welcome back to hardball. That was attorney Benjamin Krump who represents the family of Michael Brown describing the question Michael Browns mother had following an independent autopsy. This autopsy commissioned by the family revealed the unarmed 18yearold was shot at least six times including twice in the head. A separate examination is being performed as a result of what the Justice Department calls extraordinary circumstances. The county of st. Louis has conducted an earlier autopsy. The results havent been released. Nbc news confirmed with the st. Louis medical Examiners Office that Michael Brown was shot multiple times. That was the phrase from them. Joining me now forensic pathologist dr. Cyril wecht. How much can we expect . All three together or the second one for the family . I dont believe anything more will be learned from the third autopsy. Its too bad the feds could not have moved a little bit faster and gotten together with the family and arranged for an observer participant to be there with dr. Baden. Each time a body is dissected, things are changed. The obfuscation after two is great. Each time you dissect and examine bullet wounds, internal organ and tissue damage you are altering the picture and the ultimate diagnosis. What we have learned about the six wounds and, chris,
something that must be kept in mind with regard to the arm wounds, the arm moves in all kinds of positions. So supine, palm up or prone, palm down we call sup nation and pronation. You cant be sure whats front and back and how the shots were fired. With regard to the two shots to the head. Two things come to my mind. Number one, this young man is 6 63. It wasnt sniper fire from a tall tree. The young man was falling when the shots were fired. Those are the shots that killed him. Particularly the one that entered the top of the head and went into the brain. The shot entered around the eye and moved downward through the jaw and reentered in the superclavicular region above the clavicle. There is no way it could have been inflicted other than
Michael Brown falling, toppling down so that the trunk of his body is almost parallel to the ground and the shot comes in. It really has a parallel course by when the body is erect or lying on the autopsy table it appears to be perpendicular. There is a lot to be done. How many shots were fired . Were the casings obtained to show where the shooter was, were there other shots fired . The clothing. I do believe thats important. But i think they were probably going to find shots fired beyond 18, 24 inches which is the distance of a handgun beyond which you dont get gunpowder residue or stippling patterns. Well see how it plays out when the clothing analysis is released. Can Forensic Science and autopsies tell us whether a person was brought down after the shots not to his head . If the shooter were acting in
selfdefense, to shoot a person the fifth and six times after they already shot them three or four times to stop them if they were the aggressor. We know a shot to the brain in this case would not have allowed michaelle brown to engage in any kind of activity. It is almost certain that shot and most likely then the other shot because it struck him in the face, too, that those shots were fired at the end after the four shots to the arm. Thats deeply regrettable. The four shots to the arm, while nobody would like to be shot in the arm, it would not result in death or even the loss of the limb. Would it stop the assailant . Would it stop a person in their tracks . Remove them as a threat . No, no. Shooting somebody in the arm would not stop him in his tracks. Shooting him in the face and certainly a bullet into the brain is going to stop him pretty much in his tracks. There will be a little bit of
movement, momentum of the body. Not anything of a prolonged, sustained, deliberate nature. Hank you so much. Thank you for coming on today. I thought you were great this morning. A missouri grand jury could be hearing evidence wednesday in the shooting death of Michael Brown. Joining me now are two attorneys. Mid win charles who hosts a raid program on wbls and philip hollow holloway. Ms. Charles, thanks for joining us. What do you think well get from the science about the nature of the incident . We dont know its a crime yet. What can we tell . I think what we can tell from the autopsy, at least with the one we have by dr. Baden is how Michael Brown died and the manner in which he died. That makes autopsies so important, so relevant when youre talking about criminal trials. They paint a picture. They let people know exactly what happened which is so important for justice. Thats the purpose of a trial. Sure. When you start to look at the autopsy and you take it along with the one done by the medical examiner of ferguson as well as the one that will be done by the federal government, you put all three together and i dont think you will get disparity from the three different autopsies. Once you put it together you start to put together pieces of the puzzle with respect to what happened on that day. Thats what the people of ferguson want. Its what america wants. What do you think you could tell from the number of bullet holes, if you will, in the body of Michael Brown and perhaps the sequence in which they were fired . Can you tell that he should have been no threat to anyone after being shot three, four times in the arm. Therefore there was no justification for shooting him in the head if those were the subsequent bullets. What can we discern here . Ill tell you this. I have spoken with several nypd officers. I have one or two who do investigations at my law firm. They have said six bullets to
someone unarmed is a little bit unusual. Usually you would fire off one shot. Then you would determine that the person doesnt have a firearm or is not necessarily a threat. Six bullets is excessive. I think the six bullets, the fact that he was unarmed as well as some of the witness statements that we have seen so far give us enough probable cause for at least an arrest. I think a lot of the problems we have seen now is that people have been conflating a trial with the standards for arrestment they are different. You said probable cause is based upon the number of bullets. For me, yes. The number of bullets and the fact that Michael Brown was unarmed. Let me go to phil holloway. The same question to you. What can you discern from the evidence so far we have gotten in the two autopsies . Im going to defer to dr. Baden who said today we dont
know from the forensics he was able to achieve today with his autopsy. We dont know what happened in the critical moment when shots were fired. Youve got to remember, Police Officers, whether or not somebody is armed or not, they are authorized to use deadly force if they believe they are in danger of losing life or limb. Police officers are trained to shoot, to stop the threat. They are not limited to a number of rounds to achieve that goal. They will shoot until the threat, as they per ceo it to be, is eliminated. The question for investigators is what is the truth of the matter at the time the shots were fired . Each and every one of the shots. Muzzle to target. Distance becomes an issue. These are things that a good investigator will look at. How do you discern between defending yourself against an immediate threat and anger which would cause you to keep shooting . A lot of it might be in the eye of the beholder. A good investigator, as i was saying, will follow the evidence objectively to the truth, whatever the truth may be. We have already seen a lot of witness statements. We heard initially in the days following the shooting he was shot in the back. We now know thats not true. At the most he was shot in the top of the head. Everything else was to the front. We know some of the eyewitness accounts arent accurate. For what reason remains to be seen. A lot has left to be done. We need to fingerprint the car, look at the evidence. We need to look at shell casings, where did they land, what did the officer say . Can it be corroborated . Those are things to be looked at before we can get to the truth of the matter. What do you make of the phrases . There have been loaded language here. Execution, broad daylight. Yeah. As if this Police Officer, people truly believe a white Police Officer was driving along and saw a large black africanamerican fellow and decided just to shoot him. Gun the guy down. Do you think thats what happened here . You are serious about believing the officer was wrong. At what level . He didnt like the guys looks or what are you accusing him of now . Im not going to try him before the evidence is in. But you want him arrested. Of course. Tell me why youve gotten that far with this thinking . Because he killed an unarmed 18yearold with six bullets. Where i come from thats probable cause. I dont know why people want so much evidence. This is not a trial. From my perspective, especially when you listen to what dr. Baden said where his head was somewhat bent, the bullet enterered through the top of his head. That was perhaps the fatal bullet. Whats important is how the bullets came in. What was the number of the
bullet. What would you charge the officer with . At least manslaughter. Reckless endangerment. Officers have been arrested in new york at least who have been arrested for putting bullets into people. I want to get your thinking. If you were the prosecutor you would do it if you thought you could get a conviction. Sure. So you think you could get a conviction as the prosecutor. Right. Remember, prosecutors dont arrest. The police do. We have to do this in order. You said a minimal charge of manslaughter. You must believe you could get a conviction for manslaughter. Do i. Already, based upon no follow up so far . Nothing beyond what we heard in the first moment . No, nothing yet. We are still waiting. By the fact its six bullets you believe the pan man should be convicted of manslaughter . I think you have enough to try him for manslaughter, absolutely. You said you think he should be convicted. I believe he should be convicted as well. You have enough evidence. Already . Okay. What do you think of that assessment, mr. Holloway . What you just heard . I think its putting the cart way before the horse. Dr. Baden said his wounds were equally consistent with someone who might be charging at the officer as well as someone who might be surrendering to the officer. Unless you have something to break rethe tie, six bullets in and of itself doesnt amount to the standard of probable cause. Its not enough to charge someone. I disagree. A lot hr has to be done. You have to be thorough, unbiased and objective investigating all shootings, especially one like this thats caught national attention. Last word, ms. Charles. I disagree. I think you have enough probable cause. When you are talking about convictions you need an entire picture. You need all pieces of the puzzle. At the very least for probable cause, to get an arrest you have it here. You have it. You have six bullets. You have a young man whose head was bending down and the bullet entered the top of the skull. How is that . Especially when you take into the fact how Ferguson Police handled this investigation. If you were defending this officer, what would be your defense . Well, right now they seem to be doing a good job with respect to how they have been leaking out the information. What would your defense be . The defense would be he feared for his life and the fear was reasonable and thats why he shot him. Thank you so much. Please come back. I want to hear your views again. Absolutely. Mr. Holloway, im sorry for being slow in getting your name. Nice to meet you. This is a hot situation on national television. It is. Up next, back to ferguson. Once again protesters are taking to the streets. Well follow the events tonight. We dont know where they will end up. This is hardball, the place for politics. This is the first power plant in the country to combine solar and natural gas at the same location. During the day, we generate as much electricity
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evens knowledge that the National Guard is in town. Have you noticed a difference in the troublemaking crowd in exploiting the situation for criminal purposes . Are they from out of town . Older than you think. Whos been breaking the windows and looting is this whos been doing that. Theres been a lot of speculation about the trouble makers or the contingent of people looting. Given the circumstances under which thats happening its hard to interview them to find out who they are and if they are organizing. At this point, as far as i can tell from my journal lis tick perspective its all speculation. I havent seen a lot of interviews with folks who are looting. That would be a fifth amendment issue, i think. Right. Whats it like to loot. There is a lot of rhetoric
about the small contingent. Its undeniably the case that there is a large group of people outraged and angry, exercising First Amendment rights. Even, i would say, in the form of civil disobedience. People were violating the curfew. Its obviously violating the law. They were violating the curfew in a peaceful manner. Other people are breaking into stores. You could see it last night. I saw a fire set in a market. Its been difficult. We have one report who saw someone fire a gun. Theres been reports last night on a key incident. Well have more details in my show about molotov cocktails being thrown. People who participated in the march in question which precipitated the heavy response right near the Police Command center. I talked to three clergy members who said it was a peaceful march and there were no molotov cocktails. Its very difficult amidst these circumstances to separate fact from fiction, whats going on. There is a small unspecified number of people acting in a way thats frankly not lawful and violent. How many there are or what the motivation, who they are is completely unknown at the moment. We have reporters like you. Thank you for being out there. You will be live tonight at all in. Well continue to watch whats happening in ferguson now tonight. Up next, the scenes we have seen so far looked like something from the Civil Rights Era when the dogs were out. Why is it still happening 50 years later . This is hardball, the place for politics. A body at rest tends to stay at rest. While a body in motion tends to stay in motion. Staying active can ease arthritis symptoms. But if you have arthritis, this can be difficult. Prescription celebrex can help relieve arthritis pain, and improve daily physical function so moving is easier. Because just one 200mg celebrex a day can provide 24 hour relief for many with arthritis pain. And its not a narcotic you and your doctor should balance the benefits with the risks. All prescription nsaids, like celebrex, ibuprofen, naproxen and meloxicam have the same cardiovascular warning. They all may increase the chance of heart attack or stroke, which can lead to death. This chance increases if you have Heart Disease or risk factors such as high Blood Pressure or when nsaids are taken for long periods. Nsaids, like celebrex, increase the chance of serious skin or allergic reactions, or stomach and intestine problems, such as bleeding and ulcers, which can occur without warning and may cause death. Patients also taking aspirin and the elderly are at increased risk for stomach bleeding and ulcers. Dont take celebrex if you have bleeding in the stomach or intestine, or had an asthma attack, hives, other allergies to aspirin, nsaids or sulfonamides. Get help right away if you have swelling of the face or throat, or trouble breathing. Tell your doctor your medical history. And ask your doctor about celebrex. For a body in motion. Welcome back to hardball. A new poll shows sharp racial divisions in reaction to the shooting. Africanamericans are far more likely than whites to say Michael Browns shooting raises important issues about race itself. 80 of blacks say it does. Just 37 of whites agree. 65 of blacks polled say the Police Response to the shooting has gone too far. Again, fewer whites at 33 agree with them. Americans elected an africanamerican president twice now. Yet division is still cut along racial lines in response to things like the ferguson shooting. Eugene robinson is with the Washington Post and msnbc contributor. Michelle ber nartd from the Bernard Center for women, politics, public policy. Gene, i want to start with you. The reason we believe as almost a religion in diversity is we
know there are different perspectives. If you go on television with white guys you will be ignored and should be. We dont know the american experience. Right. We dont know the experience as a group. Tell me your reaction to the whole thing. I think there is a need for discernment right now. Whats going on . You know, why is this happening now when, as you mentioned, there is an africanamerican president. There is an africanamerican attorney general ordering a new autopsy and is on his way to ferguson. The Police Commander on the scene, the head of the state Highway Patrol is an africanamerican. Yet there is a civil unrest that is reminiscent of the 60s. I think the reason isnt that complicated. Some africanamericans have done extremely well over the last five decades and moved into the middle class and beyond. Assuming positions of power, influence and wealth undreamed
of in previous decades. A large minority africanamericans havent done well. In fact, i would argue are worse off now than they were back then. There is anger and frustration are at the feeling. But the deck is stacked against people. I think africanamericans in general recognize the situation. Im not sure white americans are aware that, in fact, black america is not a monolith. I agree. Im a white guy and i think there are elements of social justice here sh not just criminal justice. Not just what the cop did or shouldnt have done or whether there is murder here. Its the social reality that people in ferguson have the Unemployment Rate through the roof. An 18yearold kid. He was going to hab go to vocational school. We dont know his prospects. They probably werent great. A lot of the frustration is about that. Not whether you hate the cops or not. I think. I think thats a large part
of it. I think the greater story in looking at whats happened to this young man, what happened to Trayvon Martin and what we see happening to so many kids, i think i will summarize are it easily by what my son said to me. Hes 11 years old, outside tonight. He said, is somebody going to shoot me is this my daughter watched the news and said, why is it they only do this to black people . What did you say . I didnt have an answer for her. I dont have an answer thats palatable to look my children in the face and say there are people in this country who not only do not like africanamericans but they despise black men. There is a war on black boys in this country. There is a war on africanamerican men. I think the fact that president obama has repeatedly had to stand up and look at members of congress and say i am the president of the United States. Get over it. It enrages people. We are seeing the economic effects, the effects of a
horrible Public Education system that discriminates against our kids on the basis of race and their zip code. Things are getting much, much worse. Its a deplorable situation that the United States which is supposed to be the greatest nation on earth sits back and allows black boys to be murdered. I cant let you go without your response to that. How much of this is about profiling and prejudgment. When you judge an africanamerican kid as dangerous for all kinds of reasons of history, numbers, statistics, whatever youre thinking about and the larger question of poverty leading in many cases to crime. The situation with that is the only hope to get ahead. Its clear to me both are involved. Michelle is right. I have had that talk with my sons. We discussed it on your show. She had the talk with her son about what to do when youre confronted with police and you happen to be a black man. Its different from tex appearance that other americans have in dealing with the police. The relationship with the police is different. We get profiled and thats the truth. Michelle said also zip code. Zip code is a factor here. The social realities on the ground in ferguson, on the ground in a lot of low income africanamerican communities around the country are distinct, are different, are worsening and do contribute, in my view to the anger, especially and the frustration that we see stemming from this incident. So, yes, it has to do with profiling. I think the social realities are there. You cant ignore them. I wish we didnt listen so well in crisis, and listened more at other times from you folks, i mean you two. I dont mean blacks. I mean you two. Sometimes we do the right thing when there is no other alternative. I think churchill said that. America does the right thing when there is no alternative. This will turn into genocide if it doesnt stop. Thank you, michelle and gene. Well be right back. President obama deploys attorney general eric holder out to ferguson. Its a federal case. The president s response is ethics. This is hardball, the place for politics. Theres a saying in our family. You can do anything. If you keep a good head on your shoulders. Thats why we use head shoulders shampoo and conditioners. It keeps us 100 flake free. So i just have gorgeous hair. Head shoulders. The worlds 1 dandruff shampoo. [ male announcer ] during the cadillac summers best event, lease this 2014 ats for around 299 a month. Hurry in this exceptional offer ends soon. [ male announcer ] thats why theres ocuvite to help replenish key eye nutrients. Ocuvite has a unique formula not found in your multivitamin to help protect your eye health. Ocuvite. Help protect your eye health. Well be back with president obamas response to the protests in ferguson, missouri. Hardball returns after this. [ woman ] if you have moderate to severe Rheumatoid Arthritis like me,
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some of that experience, like weve all seen happen to africanamericans. So he does have that. He also is, look in the mirror, hes africanamerican. Hes part of the community and does know hes part of it and his children will face it. Theres empathy that comes through like today. It definitely does come true. After Trayvon Martin, the president talked about how he experienced people crossing the street when they saw him coming. All those things you speak of, he has lived. He also has lived through now three cases where the issue of race has been brought up in this criminal justice sense. You had the he doesnt bring it up. The news seems to come to him. It does come to him. Yeah. But back in 2009, when he said james crowley, the Police Officer in boston, had acted stupidly when he erroneously arrested Henry Louis Gates at his own home, the president looked back on that and said i should have calibrated my
remarks. He did today. Today. I thought it was interesting how he showed discernment about the whole thing. The guy is unbelievable sometimes. He also pointed out that he dealt with this, as he said he said, before you guys knew how to pronounce my name and when i still had black hair, i was a state legislator in illinois, and i dealt with these issues. He dealt with racial profiling. He dealt with the need for the Police Interrogations to be recorded. This has actually been a fairly longstanding, public and legal and political concern with him for decades. Its really the first and real he, frankly, only thing that he really did in springfield when he was a state legislator. Constitutional rights on the street corner. Yes. Hes a constitutional lawyer and he also is the president and he did make the remind people that this is both peace and justice and order on the streets of ferguson. Save and develop your thoughts. Well be back on this tomorrow night. Big story for our country. Not a good country but a learning experience. Howard fineman, thank you as always, my friend, and Jean Cummings, thank you. Well be back after this. Unlimited. As in, no limits on your hardearned cash back. As in no more dealing with those rotating categories. The quicksilver card from capital one. Unlimited 1. 5 cash back on everything you purchase, every day. Dont settle for anything less. Ill keep asking. Whats in your wallet . Ill keep asking. Since robert taira openedsion kings hhis first bakeryd, in a small hawaiian town. Making bread so good, that people bought two loaves one to take home, and one to eat on the way. So good, they grew from here. To here. To here. But to grow again, to the east coast they needed a new factory, but where . Fortunately, they get financing from ge capital. We not only have teams dedicated to the food industry,
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threat . Was it . The other reality is the question, do young people like Michael Brown suffer an injustice that atakes them early in their youth that says you aint going anywhere in this world, youre going to live in this neighborhood and die here, and in between, nothing good is either going to come your way or hit you as a possibility. Is there another better word for that than injustice . Is there . I know all the focus right now, all the pressure, all the heat is now on the Police Officers involved. Or the police generally in this country. Perhaps it should be. But this is as good a time as any to deal with the job we give some police in the country that is stocked with injustice. When we assign blame, lets not ignore the way the world really is, the way Economic Opportunity is really shared in thus country of ours, how unevenly it is shared. It is not the cop who decides how much money a family has, what jobs or Life Opportunities are passed out to the young people of ferguson, what neighborhood kids get to grow up and live in, what hopes they can hold when they two to bed at