Start . With its the debt ceiling, do i go into the president ial politics, the candidates in the gop field . Do i look at the investigation, the Special Counsel investigation . What do i start . With you tell me. I will tell you that point, the rnc, first debate is this august . Like, are we there already . When did that happen . We are there, we are officially there, my friend. Have a good show. Welcome back, we must. You good to see you, enjoy the rest of your evening off. Good evening, welcome to ayman tonight. Warning, there are tapes, new reporting on the incriminating trump reporting about a classified document he had in his possession, after he left the white house. And then, the Porcelain Candidate. That is around desantis is being described after refusing to engage with reporters. But how long can he hide in his safe space . And republican rollback, the latest gop trend is loosening Child Labor Laws. I will speak to democratic senator John Hickenlooper, one of the most outspoken critics of that effort, and much more. Lets get started. Caught on tape. In understanding the development, an msnbc news can now confirm that jacksons office has attended Audio Recording of donald trump admitting but he retained classified document from his time at the white house. Now, on that tape, trump acknowledges he was in possession of a sensitive Military Documents, related to iran and confirmed that it was classified. Msnbc news reportss been in a july 20 21st meeting at trumps golf club in new jersey, with people who were helping ex witness chief of staff mark meadows wrights memoir. Nbc news has not heard the tape but cant report that it has been provided to the grand jury investigating the matter. Of course, trump denied knowing anything about this and said that everything that he did, with classified documents, was quote, right. Trump might claim he does not know anything, but that does not mean that the recording does not exist. And if it does, it would strike at the core of his defense, that trump has long maintained he had the Constitutional Authority as a commanderinchief to declassify all material he took with him when he left the white house. Believe it or not, even last year, he claimed he could declassified documents just by quote, thinking about it. But on the state, he explicitly mentions the material is still classified. Several sources told the guardian during that recording, trump could be her talking about how he could not discuss the details of the document, because he no longer possesses the sweeping president ial power to declassify. According to the guardian, trump expressed regret about not declassifying the document what he had the chance. This suggests trump not only knew that he had retained material which was sensitive to National Security, but was also well aware of the limitations around him in discussing it, and the proper declassification process. You cant think youre way out of a declassification. Remember, this was 2021. This was months before trump was forced to hand over several boxes of documents to the national archives. More than one year before maralago was ultimately raided by fbi agents who recovered even more secret and highly classified documents. To make matters worse, there is new reporting from the New York Times which suggests the secret material trump referenced in the 2021 meeting might still be missing, may still be at large. Now, late yesterday, the times reported after learning about this recording, federal prosecutors subpoenaed to trumps lawyers, seeking the documents return. Trumps legal team has now informed the Justice Department they were unable to find any such records in his possession. So, as more details emerge, and the timeline of this continues to become clearer by the day, trumps handling of this seems to be a not to do. I mean, all you have to do is look at mike pence. He was also accused of Mishandling Documents and Classified Material, nbc news now reports the Justice Department has closed its investigation into pence with no charges filed. I guess you could make the argument that mike pence did things by the book. He returned the materials to the authorities, he agreed to cooperate with the investigators. In fact, he even sat down for an interview. Not that the investigation has run its course, he could put that matter behind him. , the same cannot be said for donald trump. Lets bring in my panel this evening, former congressman and republican congressman, carlos curbelo, former federal prosecutor, and the professor of law at new york university, cohost of the strict scrutiny podcast. All three are of course msnbc analysts. Great to have you all with. Cynthia, lets start with breaking down the latest for us, the impact that this tape could have on jack smiths case. Well first of all, just for jump street, let me say jack smiths case is good. Lets remember that. Lets also remember that, Zach Classified Document is not classified for the statutes we are talking about the trump will likely be charged with. So with that in mind, this tape might ease trumps waters. The way that it does it is either he is admitting he has classified documents, which is illegal, he is not returning them even though they have been requested, he now has this story that they cant find it. Thats also remember he has lied to his lawyers in the past. So you cant really trust, the lawyers cant find it because, he has misled his lawyers in the past. Or, and, or, he made the whole thing up because he was mad at General Milley and he needed to come up with a quick lie to explain his behavior, which would not be shocking, given what we just saw in the e. Jean carroll case. Also, it highlights as you did, he understands the difference with the classification that he doesnt have the power to always do it. So it muddies his waters in many different ways. Jack smith already has a strong case for the espionage act, the retaining of documents act. The 1001 having an agent lied to the doj for him, and the obstruction. So i think it makes, it makes the memo longer, but the memo is pretty complete. Congressman, lets talk about confidential material for a moment. You served as a lawmaker, you had access to confidential material, you had intelligence briefings. What do you make of these reports that trump allegedly handled a sensitive Military Document in a room full of biographers, clearly people who i would say, you know, safe to say at least did not have the proper security clearances. Does that pose a possible National Security threat that donald trump has a document allegedly showing something militarily to do with iran in his possession, outside of a secure zone . It could, ayman. This is clear this is why donald trump did this. He wanted to take these documents, maybe to both that we have them, to show off, who knows he wanted to monetize these documents for this information so that is why his case is complicated. I think in the case of former Vice President pence, its clear this was something, careless for sure, let me tell you. One thing congress does better than the executives handle Classified Material. Members of congress are not Walking Around with Classified Material, taking Classified Material to their homes. There is a Scif Facility at the capitol, where you review classified information. You leave it there, you cannot take it. The Executive Branch really has to learn a little bit from congress in this regard. But in trumps case, yes, he is out there, talking about this information, showing off, telling people about it. And of course this could pose a serious threat to National Security. It could get people killed. Melissa, let me ask you about this revelation, yesterday, that document that trump discussed on this report the recording has still been located. And if the material is still missing, how does that impact the case . So again, i think it is important here, if you cannot find this document, if it is still missing, you still make the case that something has not been turned over properly. It has gone missing, which might strengthen jacksons case about the attention of documents issue, to the point the congressman dismayed, its not simply that the retention of these documents, the careless handling poses real concern for National Security in terms of those in the field who might be compromised, because this is handled so loosely. Again, its also in the losing of this document, it might underscore, meaning our allies cannot trust us with this kind of information Going Forward. It makes it much harder for members of the Intelligence Community to function, to work with foreign intermediaries to keep us safe. So there is a lot here. All of it goes to those questions around the nature of this act, which is about preventing National Security information from being carelessly handled, compromising the National Security, more broadly, focusing on the idea that those in control of these documents have to control them safely, they cannot withhold them willfully or knowingly. They such an important point u brought up, which is besides the legal aspect of all of this, our allies are watching thinking, my goodness, if we gave the americans any secretive information it might end up in maralago. Who knows where else . Cynthia, after this news broke, it was expected that mike pence, when news broke of mike pences investigation, you had trump react on truth social. He did it quickly, he posted this, asking, when am i going to be fully exonerated, i am at least as innocent as he is. Lets talk about the differences in these cases. I think time make people forget, these are very different cases. Even if there were any similarities, donald trump was asked to hand over documents, asked to cooperate. The only reason why we are at this point is because, a subpoena was issued on him and his lawyers did not cooperate. Ultimately, this led to the fbi raid. Theyre a different, even if they started from the same point, the results and outcomes have been very different. Right. I dont think they started at the same point. Lets just say they did for arguments sake. What is shows you is when you find documents you are not supposed to have, and if you call the department of justice and tell them, if you allow a voluntary search instead of blocking one, if you dont have your lawyers lie to the doj, and instead they tell the truth, if you agree to an interview, instead of hiding, if you do not move boxes around secretly, if you dont have Security Tapes that are a, not turnover properly, and be, might have gaps in them, if you dont talk to difference choice but what happened and makeup nonsense stories about how you classify them, then a light will shine upon you in the department of justice. [laughter] that is what happened, the light you know, the department of justice is busy, they dont have time to prosecute it isnt people i was going to say. And i feel like the department of justice will probably give former executives, you know, officers in the Executive Branch the benefit of the doubt like we did with mike pence. There is no time to prosecute these people, cooperating, doing the right thing even if you want to. They are too busy melissa, let me ask you about the new reporting from the New York Times regarding jack smith investigations. This time, into trumps alleged election subversion efforts. The times are reporting that smith had subpoenaed Staff Members from the trump white house, who may have been involved in firing the governments top security official, we all got to go very well, favres after his agency judged the election as quote, the most secure in american history. That is of course at odds with how the trump narrative was around the election. How does the Firing Of Krebs go into this broader case around Election Interference . Hard to say, given we dont know the contours of that case. But you could imagine, based on what we do know part of the firing of crabs, that donald trump did not want any information with discredited his own discredited theory of how the election was stolen from them, by joe biden. Having a top cybersecurity guy say they were no cybersecurity problems, this was a safe, well conduct election, and when that was made, presented to him, then he later fired this individual. It appears more like retaliation and go to this question of intent. Donald trump knows what he is saying was false, and Going Forward, stating those falsehoods even in the face of very credible credible evidence, saying in fact it was not the case the election was stolen. Congressman, quickly, i will see people here, for republicans like jim jordan, being seriously weaponization, investigating weaponizations of the government, wouldnt the Firing Of Krebs be a good place to start . 100 , ayman. What is shocking is so many republicans have rushed to endorse donald trump, even florida republicans, with all of these controversy, scandals and criminal exposure surrounding him. They are not going to use these committees to investigate trump or any of the people around him. Instead, they rushed to endorse donald trump, someone who by the time primary season comes around, might have been indicted three times. Lets say, its not a profile encouraged by jim jordan. Stick around, a lot more to discuss after the break. We will discuss the growing chaos engulfing trumps legal team. Lets her pick exactly what she wants, and save on every perk. Sadies getting her plan ready for a big trip. Travel pass, on. Nice iphone 14 pro cute couple. Trips dont last forever. Neither does summer love. So, sadies moving on. Apple music . Check. Introducing myplan. The first and only unlimited plan to give you exactly what you want, so you only pay for what you need. 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With global secure networking from comcast business. Attorneys for donald trump its not just possible. Its happening. Have always had a fraught relationship with their client, and each other, quite frankly. But theyve never seen this legal team as fractured as it was this week. According to a recording from the guardian, former trump lawyer, told a grand jury he had been steered away from looking inside of Trumps Office as he searched maralago for classified documents in response to a Justice Department subpoena. The guardian says that corcoran did not specify who waved him off of the search, but months later as we now know, the fbi ended up seizing more than 100 classified documents, including in that office, but he was told to not search. So the guardian says this suggested that corcoran was materially misled as the Special Counsel jack smith sa