A plea deal could be in the works. The Washington Post first reported and corsi later confirmed he was in plea negotiations with the special counsel. If the two sides do reach a deal, it could be key in determining whether trump or his advisers knew in advance whether wikileaks planned to release stolen democratic emails during the president ial campaign or if trump was merely a wikileaks super fan. This just came out. Wikileaks. I love wikileaks. I love wikileaks. They have to Start Talking about wikileaks. The wonder of wikileaks. Wikileaks. They have revealed a lot. Wikileaks. Wikileaks. That came out on wikileaks. This wikileak stuff is unbelievable. It tells you the inner heart. You have to read it. Lets bring in mya wiley and paul butler. Also Matthew Miller and elliott williams. Thank you all for being here. Ill start with you, mya. Jerome corsi, friend of roger stone, is in plea talks with muller. A person familiar with the talks said the prosecutors presented mr. Corsi with evidence that he had not be truthful when investigators asked him whether he knew beforehand that wikileaks was going to publish emails stolen from democratic computers during the campaign. He knows he lied. He said it on his own show. Right. So it doesnt seem to be the wise move to lie to the fbi. Thats what he did. Hes admitting it. That means what . It means hes facing at minimum a perjury charge. We dont know if there are other charges, and if hes in plea negotiations it means he has something to offer Robert Mueller and his team. Yep. The important question becomes what might that be. There was some suggestion and exchange earlier this week that there may have been information about whether or not he knew that there was a conversation with donald trump, between roger stone and donald trump. Remember we have a lot of lying from a lot to of folks. Yep. Who have been connected with the Trump Campaign. Yes. Hes just yet another. Roger stone is the person who is most likely right in the cross hairs in terms of who might be indicted next. Theres no question that he and mr. Corsi not only have a relationship but have been having a lot of communications about the email exchanges. Lets talk about who jerome corsi is. He started the birther lobby. Was infowars d. C. Bureau chief. Writer for the world net daily. Roger stone testified to the House Intelligence Committee that corsi gave him Opposition Research in john podesta in 2016. Here is roger stone yesterday on his radio show. The assertion that jerry corsi knew in advance that John Podestas emails had been obtained and would be published would be news to me because he never told me anything of the kind, and he never obviously passed on any such documents. Okay. So, paul, roger stone is very good at saying i didnt know anything. During the campaign he said i know whats coming. Youre going to be in the barrel next. Hes doing a good job of saying i dont know anything about anything. What is the thing that could be offered thats bigger than you if youre jerome corsi . Again, it could be that Robert Mueller does not come for people lying to his investigators. He already indicted gates, flynn and popodopolus. More likely is mueller is throwing the book at corsi to force him to tell the truth. So im a chicago cubs fan. Theres the famous double play, so think. Jerome corsi to roger stone to donald trump. Corsi and donald trump were bonding over their shared lie about where the president was born. If corsi talked to trump, if he talked to Paul Manafort, roger stones former Business Partner about anything to do with the timing of the wikileaks hack email, if they coordinated, thats collusion. Thats conspiracy, thats a federal crime. So elliott williams, lets go to that. If so we know wikileaks published the stolen emails. Theyre trying to pass themselves off saying theyre a journalistic outfit that received this leak, thats what they did. We know the emails were stolen and hacked by a russian outfit, 13 members of which have been indicted. Is it required that someone in the campaign or someone associated with donald trump told him, hey, these emails are going to be dumped out. And is just knowing that this stolen material was going to come out in and of itself a crime . Again, people are sort of hungry for the smoking gun, the smoking email, the email from vladimir kremlin. Ru. Donald, here are the emails, i will serve them for you on a platter. We have a constellation of people who may have been passing knowingly passing this information on to the campaign. So while there may not be the direct nexus that i think people who are unfamiliar with this stuff might be expecting a direct link, this is how investigations are built. Theres a web and a network of contacts between potentially corsi and wikileaks, corsi and stone and stone and the campaign. Robert mueller and the counsel team are working to put that together. Theres the saying that history is written by the victors sort of. Here i feel like the Public Perception is written by the people who are tweeting. The one person were not hearing from is Robert Mueller. So we dont know exactly what they have. We are hearing Jerome Corsis crack pot theories on his podcast. I will say six words im not proud of, i listen to Jerome Corsis podcast. What are you doing with your time . Excuse me . I know. Its 63 minutes of my life i wont get back. But the simple fact is theyre presenting these theories, and all this information. But its there. Theres potentially a link there. Who knows what Robert Mueller has and what the special counsel folks will put together. We dont know yet. By the way, on this question, we had this discussion for how long have we been doing this . Almost two years . About whether collusion is a crime or whether you have to call it a conspiracy. Theres a guy named Randall Eliason who says it is a crime. He says it can be and the crime is conspiracy even if no other independent criminal violations are identified. Muellers use of that theory in his indictment is a textbook example of a 371 conspiracy to defraud the u. S. , and that theory has been validated by the trial judges ruling. Both of you are nodding thats true. Yes. Part of it is these 19 russian Intelligence Officers were indicted for conspiracy to defraud the United States. Again, its not a vague conspiracy just to mess up the election. Its a conspiracy to get donald trump elected. One important point, you dont have to they dont have to have actually influenced the outcome of the election in order to be guilty of a crime. Moreover it carries with it the same sentence as the underlying offense. If you conspired to commit wire fraud or whatever, you can be charged and sentenced and prosecuted for the full offense. Its like if you conspire to rob a bank, even if you didnt come away with the money, you are guilty. Drove the getaway car. Exactly. All of this hinges on the fact that well have an unfettered investigation, that mauler will be able to complete it. It wont be interfered with by the Justice Department. You used to work there. Now were looking at a guy named Matthew Whitaker running the Justice Department. How can the American People be confident that whatever it is that mueller comes out with will, a, become public, b presented to congress in a way that it can become public and transparent and that it wont be interfered with by Matthew Whitaker . I dont think they can at all be confident in that fact. There are strong institutional pressures for someone inside the Justice Department to do the right thing. If you try to quash an investigation without evidence that it ought to be ended. If you interfere, if you do something inappropriate, there will be people who write memos about it. People will leak about it and it will come out to congress. That is probably true. But it doesnt mean that if you have someone who is in that job solely to unduly influence the investigation, someone who is there so quash a subpoena for the president or keep a report from coming before congress, they may decide its worth taking that risk. Its worth taking the political scandal of quashing an investigation, thats what theyre there to do. They cut a deal with the president to do that. Thats the concern i have about Matthew Whitaker. Ultimately if we get too the end of this investigation, the special counsel said he cannot indict the president and he has submitted a report to the grand jury and wants that to go to congress or wants to submit a report directly to congress, thats the kind of thing where you could see the acting attorney general reaching in and stopping that report from being made public. You would see it subpoenaed, litigated, and that litigation could go on for months if not years. So people should not have confidence that the attorney general cant do that. They need to fight as much as they can to ask for muellers conclusions to ultimately be made public in some shape or form. Absolutely. The concern is that litigation could be going on right now and we wouldnt know. Under the regulations the only things we find out right away is if whitaker fires mueller. If mueller comes to whitaker and says i want to subpoena donald trump to the grand jury or i want to indict jared kushner, whitaker says no, you cant do that. Under the law we dont find that out until the end of the investigation. Under the regs he is supposed to notify congress, and with the democrats coming into the house in january that does at least give them the power to try to create accountability there for those decisions. The other thing is really important, if this corsi plea, whatever becomes of it, turns into an indictment of roger stone, which we expect it will, the indictment itself and whatever comes forward from the indictment cant become public if theres a trial. Thats a small little ray of hope. That could also take a long time. Remember that this is roger stone is a key player in this in the sense that hes the one who got Paul Manafort hired by the campaign, he started he tried to buy information from hacked emails from Henry Greenberg back in the spring of 2016. Hes the same guy that in july of 2016 kept saying that the russians had emails. Then the day he was supposed to have dinner with Julian Assange he started saying it wasnt the russians, it wasnt the russians. Thats a suspect Public Record already. So an indictment of roger stone may not be a small thing. Indeed. The other things people are concerned about is whether or not if there is a subpoena. Rudy giuliani this week said he doesnt think that mueller would win a battle to subpoena donald trump, which you would think the nixon press dented cedent is thd win that battle. Its hard to take just about anything Rudy Giuliani says seriously. Im serious though. This is an individual, he has a career as a prosecutor and so on but has gone off the rails the last couple of years. Lets start from that framework. Sort of like matt had said before, any question over subpoenaing a president will end up in court and it will take a very, very long time to litigate. There are very strong arguments for why the president ought to and could have to submit to a subpoena, but ill be candid that there are reasons why that argument might lose. It will open up a lot of complicated litigation that could last certainly through the president s through the presidency and beyond. Again, potentially Robert Mueller or the special counsel team that stuff in the hands of other prosecutors offices, in the hands of other offices within main justice that could get that information another way. Just because of the legal complexities that might be created by either whitaker shutting it down or funny business from the white house. Its going to take a long time and it just remains to be seen how this shakes out. If it wound up in the Supreme Court, now donald trump has his ring ner in there, brett kavanaugh. But a chief justice who is willing to scrap with him. At least verbally. Well see. Thank you all very much. Coming up, more on Donald Trumps saudi arabia first policy. I saw my leg did not look right. I was just finishing a ride. I felt this awful pain in my chest. I had a pe blood clot in my lung. I was scared. I had a dvt blood clot. Having one really puts you in danger of having another. My doctor and i chose xarelto®. Xarelto®. To help keep me protected. Xarelto® is a latestgeneration blood thinner thats. Proven to treat and reduce the risk of dvt or pe blood clots from happening again. In clinical studies, almost 98 of patients on xarelto® did not experience another dvt or pe. Xarelto® works differently. Warfarin interferes with at least 6 of your bodys natural bloodclotting factors. Xarelto® is selective, targeting just one critical factor. Dont stop taking xarelto® without talking to your doctor, as this may increase risk of blood clots. While taking, you may bruise more easily, or take longer for bleeding to stop. Xarelto® can cause serious, and in rare cases, fatal bleeding. It may increase your risk of bleeding if you take certain medicines. Get help right away for unexpected bleeding or unusual bruising. Do not take xarelto® if you have an artificial heart valve or abnormal bleeding. Before starting, tell your doctor about all planned medical or dental procedures and any kidney or liver problems. Learn all you can. To help protect yourself from another dvt or pe. Talk to your doctor about xarelto®. Hey, everybody. Its thanksgiving week. Im here at the greater chicago food depository. How are you . They do great work making sure that those who are not as fortunate well, happy thanksgiving to you. That was former president barack obama spending his thanksgiving volunteering at a chicago fo food bank. On the whole other side of the ledger it goes without saying that this is a hell of a transition. It is highly unusual for republicans to criticize donald trump. Well, they actually did criticize donald trump. They criticized him this week. They joined democrats in condemning trumps shocking defense of saudi arabia following the murder of Washington Post jamal khashoggi. Instead of backing his own cias assessment that Crown Prince Mohammed Bin Salman did this, he made executions. Their vehemently denying it. We have hundreds of thousands of jobs. Do people really want me to give up hundreds of thousands of jobs . It should be noted what you heard is not true. The u. S. Is not dependent on saudi arabia for jobs. Far from it. Were not even dependent on them for energy. We get four times more oil from canada than saudi arabia. The Trump Administration itself cited ten times fewer jobs than 400,000 when it discussed saudi deals last may. Still trumps behavior while shocking should not be surprising at all considering his belief that authoritarian figures over his own intelligence agencies. It raises some familiar questions about his motives. Lets go to our guests. Thank you all for being here. So, let me play one of the republicans who actually took exception to Donald Trumps stance on saudi arabia this week. This is somebody who never breaks with donald trump. He is one of his chief supporters and excuse makers, Lindsey Graham. Heres what i believe. Saudi arabia needs us more than we need them. Its not too much to ask an ally not to butcher a guy in a cans lat. This is not world war ii. Im not going to look away at what mbs did. So this is unusual. To even have republicans criticizing donald trump making an excuse for the saudis. Its not unusual in the world. I know youre privy to the way the world is watching Donald Trumps a reaction to Jamal Khashoggis murder. How is the world reacting . They are dismissing donald trump and they know that donald trump will never stand up for the rule of law for morality legality. But they are moving forward. And if you saw the hearings this is where the next congress and senate can play a role, the hearing at the European Parliament last week where there were many testimonies, i was one of the people who gave expert advice and within hours germany decided to stop to have an embargo of any sales of weapons with saudi arabia. Denmark followed. They decided germany led the way, and they decided to bar the 18 killers, the saudi killers from entering any european count country. Its an unprecedented thing. They need saudi jobs, actually. They need to import and export with saudi arabia. However they decided to uphold the rule of law. They understand that america is on a different path many diplomats whisper privately that the next senate and the next Congress Intelligence committees and other committees should investigate any financial ties between saudi arabia and donald trump and jared kushner. Yeah. I think thats the point a lot of people are getting to, david. Washington posts fred ryan wrote a piece trumps dangerous message to tyrants, flash money and get away with murder. It is well known because donald trump keeps saying it that he has financial ties to the saudis, here is donald trump in 1991, the royal family purchased the yacht princess for 20 million. 2001, saudi government purchased the 45th floor of the trump world tower. Here is donald trump talking about his business with the saudis back in 2015. Saudi arabia i get along great with all of them. They buy apartments from me, they spend 40 million, 50 million