Transcripts For MSNBCW All In With Chris Hayes 20160716 : co

Transcripts For MSNBCW All In With Chris Hayes 20160716

The military having said they had achieved total control of the nation. And now, it has been essentially run over by opponents to the coup, supporters of the government, who are now essentially occupying that studio and broadcasting out in the midst of this unfolding series of events. We do not know the whereabouts of the turkish president erdogan, an extremely controversial figure being although he has face timed into media stations, urging people to take to the streets after the coup became clear. People have responded. All of the various opposition parties, even opposition parties that have been relentlessly persecuted by erdogan, have also expressed their opposition to the coup. We also have reports of gunfire being exchanged. Weve seen videos of helicoptering shooting down at civilians. We have word of explosions in ankara. I want to go straight to our nbc news producer on the ground in istanbul. What have you heard . Reporter well, i can certainly tell you that weve been hearing fighter jets hover, what seems to be fighter jets, flying over boss purr use. Weve heard in the past hour, a sound that sounded like being an explosion in istanbul. Of course from the point right here, were not able to know if it was, in fact, an explosion. The fact is, this city is under great tension. Youve been watching the images of jubilation in the airport, where citizens seems to have been escorting out the military or the fraction of the military that attempted a coup. But there are reports in other places in this city, where theres tension, theres armed civilians, theres armed people of no uniform, and this is certainly the tension is still going on, according to every report were getting from around the city. Yes, i want to give people just a sense of the timeline here as they look at these live images that are coming in and set the table a little bit, so folks can get a sense. We started getting reports, most of it through social media. Again, keep in mind, turkey is a place where internet and media control have been tightly constrained, increasingly by an erdogan government that is viewed by many that is it edging toward more authoritarian control. We got reports of soldiers in istanbul at the airport. The coup plotters proceeded around 5 or 6 00 p. M. , to announce that they had taken over the country. This is an image earlier of gun shots over a crowd. And in response, erdogan face timed and urged people to take over the streets. Thats what happened. Urging people to take to the streets, to essentially preserve the government, preserve turkish democracy. People have taken to the streets around the nation. Weve seen incredibly dramatic images of people throwing themselves in front of tanks. We see people arguing with soldiers, weve had reports of violent clashes and exchanges of gunfire between different parts of the Turkish State Security apparatus. There have been reports of policemen and military exchanging fire. We have reports again, unconfirmed against the hazy fog of this situation, of attacks on the parliament in ankara, where several members of Parliament May be inside. But by and large, what has happened across the country, and the images you are seeing, is essentially, with the aid of social media, the internet, and crucially mosques, which have been calling people out into the street to demonstrate. There has been essentially a Popular Uprising in the face of the coup. People going out into the streets to oppose the coup. People taking over the state media studios, as you see on the left of your screen there. And now it remains unclear what the fate of this coup is. Its a very dangerous moment. The coup plotters, those connected to the army, are facing incredibly harsh punishment should they fail. They have essentially nothing to lose, and we do not know how all this would play out. These images youre seeing right now, i believe that is a live shot of istanbul, am i right there . That is istanbul. You see people out with the turkish flag in the streets. None of the opposition parties, including the leftist hdp which has been relentlessly persecuted by erdogan, came out in support of it. This is incredible. I have senior fellow at the center for middle east policy, author of islamic exceptionalism and a scholar of the region. Can you give us a little context for what is happening in turkey right now . Well, i mean, what were seeing is an attempted coup thats hanging in the balance, as a lot of other people have said. And thats what makes this a little bit unusual. Turkey has a long history of military coups, but traditionally, theyre been quite decisive. There hasnt been Popular Resistance, and the army has been more unified in imposing its will over the country. This is really the first time where we see a coup attempt that hasnt been as approximately planned, apparently, and the country is very much divided. And were seeing the images right now. Its remarkable to watch, that people are resisting in large numbers, they are going out into the streets and this is where the ruling party which is islamically oriented in turkey, is not backing down, as they might have in previous moments in turkish history, and you are seeing a real effort to counter the coup. And thats what also makes it quite scary. Because the country is so divided and polarized and there is a risk of civil war. You know, there are already reports of police being killed, and the parliament being attacked, so it is a frightening moment, and its one that will have ripple effects, not just in turkey, but across the region. So i want to do two things with you while i have you, so people can make sense of some of the images and what is unfolding here. First, lets talk a little bit about the context, i want to say that Taye Ip Erdogan is tweeting, calling on everyone to go to city squares and airports, i also will be with them. Thats the tweet from president erdogan. First, lets talk about the concept here, a nation that has been ruled with a very strong military. Has had four coups since joining nato in 1952. Often at times an intensely secularist part of the military wresting power away from a part of the government they viewed as being too sympathetic to an islamist bent. To be clear, this is a coup against a democratically elected, proislamic government. The government of erdogan and his party has had a bad record of human rights and repressing journalists, so there is that. But at the same time, this is and was a democratically elected government, so that really brings to bear the questions of how they feel about military coups against elected governments. And i remember, and this is why i feel like theres almost some kind of deja vu here. I remember july 3rd, 2013, where there was a military coup against a democratically elected islamist government in egypt. So this has been a long running tension in the middle east is, what happens when islamist parties come to power through free elections, when you have a military, or a kind of secular establishment that isnt comfortable with them in power. And thats part of what were seeing play out here. I want to hold you right there. I want to go to i want to correct something i said earlier. Its not turkish state television, its a Turkish National tv station, trt. Well try to listen live to what is being broadcast right now in a studio that has essentially been occupied by opponents of the coup, after that woman that you see there, had been given a statement earlier to read by the coup plotters. She is now surrounded by people who are opposing the coup. Lets see if we can listen in with the translator. Translator they are shooting, but they seem to be shooting in the air just to scare the people so they wouldnt keep walking. I dont know if, it seems to be a big i dont know whats happening right now, but people are cheering yeah, people are cheering in, like in the name of god, saying things like that. I think the crowd wants to keep walking and they are shooting and trying to stop them. They are shooting in the air. And some people seem to be trying to reason with the soldiers. I am this keeps do i have control of this . Whats happening . As you can tell, its a totally chaotic scene, both on the streets of turkey. Right there on the left, you can see folks essentially opposing tanks with their bodies. We have images coming through of [ gunfire ] uhoh. Are those live images from the left, control room . [ indiscernible shouting ] on the right, we have that Turkish National tv station, which is apparently just going about its live coverage of this, with a crowd there. Most of the images, we should caution you, most of the images are from ankara, some from istanbul. Turkey is a large nation, its very polarized, and it can be polarized regionally as well. We have a key american airbase there. Many of the missions against isis are out of that area. Turkey, a nato ally has played a vexing role particularly lately with regard to isis. I have ambassador sherman. Ambassador, it took a little bit of time, but we saw a readout from president obama and john kerry essentially condemning the coup, calling for the restoration of democratic control in turkey. What is the u. S. Relationship with the erdogan government and the turkish state like . I think the white house statement really summarizes where our government is, which is to support the democratically elected government, and as you pointed out, chris, even the opposition parties have called against the coup. The statement from the white house also says there should be restraint, no bloodshed, that indeed were going to do everything we can to protect american civilians, our diplomatic posts. And as you mentioned, we have military assets in inser link which is a critical area for the middle east in our efforts to stop terror in the middle east. This is a very tough situation. It appears that erdogan may be getting the upper hand here in this divided attempt of a coup. Were all careful about using that word, because when our government says that a coup has occurred, it has legal implications about how you then will conduct your relationship with that country. So we dont want to go there right at this moment. We want to see how this all plays out. That actually explains, i think, to me, a little bit of the kind of sub text of the deliberations that must have been happening behind closed doors, as this started to play out. And again, we are in the midst of this unfolding situation, which could go either way. Honestly, there have been reports that the coup plotters have essentially been rolled up. That has been put down. But of course theres also tremendous incentive on the part of certain parties to disseminate misinformation. What we do know, the opposition parties have opposed it, the american officials have put out a statement calling for democratic principle to be adhered to and opposition of military takeover. But we dont know how this will carry out. We have reports of gunfire exchanges between different parts of the security service. Embarrassed, let me ask you this, when you say, be careful with the word coup because it has legal implications, what do you mean by that . Well, it defines how were going to relate to a country, whether assistance, aid, partnerships, it has a whole lot of implications. So we are very careful to call anything a coup or to define something as a coup until there is absolutely no other choice. Turkey is a nato ally, as you have pointed out. I believe the secretarygeneral of nato has put out a statement, along similar lines, as has chancellor merkel of germany. This is a very serious situation. I can imagine your viewers must feel like theyre watching an unbelievable situation. Weve gone from dallas over the last few days, which has roiled this country, to nice, which has sparked concern throughout the world, to now, a democratically elected government, maybe an imperfect one, one which we do have some tensions, but is still a critical nato ally and partner in the middle east, now having its own future hanging in the balance. It is very concerning and we need the kind of steady leadership were seeing from the white house tonight. Ambassador, thank you for joining us. I want to keep you around as well, as we continue our live coverage here. Lets go back again, this is a National Broadcast station, trt, that has essentially been occupied, not in any sort of military sense, and we are going to listen in to what is being broadcast by the crowd that has taken over the studio, through the words of a translator. Take a listen. They are on the street, but nobodys harming each other. And again, im i want to emphasize that our some of the military people who used their power, their power in chain of command in the bad sense and they took advantage of their power, but they are not getting anywhere. And this attempt will not reach anything, anywhere. And we have did everything to stop this in a very brave manner. And we want to say that all of the institutions of democracy did really behave very well, and i want to say that in the trt studios, everything is back to normal, and our people, you see the people here, and nobody here is hurt. Everybody is calm. And we are able to continue here at trt, the national tv studios with our usual program. And everything is controlled, and we are here, we are able to talk from here, thank god our trt studios are very clean and safe and we will be able to go on with our programming. And trt was invaded for a short while, and some people were taken hostage in the studios t and we are right now everything is safe right here and i want to thank all the personnel in the studios and everybody was very brave and we were able to stop the uprising. And we can, as i said, continue with our broadcasting. This was the director of trt, the gentleman who was just speaking and he emphasized tha. We are able to continue with our programming. Okay, so weve just been broadcasting a live feed from Turkish National broadcaster, trt, which you can see is in this remarkable state of upheaval, in the midst of an attempted military coup that is playing out in front of the nation right now, in turkey. They had a man just saying that everything is normal, were fine, were safe here on trt, theyre going to their correspondents in the street, clearly opponents of the coup, who have taken to the streets and to the studio to oppose it. I want to also bring you up to date on, again, there is some word that the coup plotters are being pushed back. Now this is an explosion that happened in Turkish Parliament in ankara. We got some reports of this starting about 30 minutes ago. You can see folks in the parliament building, members of parliament. There are images emerging of the damage of that building. We do not know where those explosions came from, or who carried them out. These are some of the remarkable images were seeing of live demonstrators taking to the streets and putting themselves in front of military vehicles. Those military vehicles being operated by, presumably members of the military who are loyal, or at least taking orders from the parts of the military that had attempted this coup. And you can see how entirely outnumbered and overwhelmed they appear in many of these images were seeing. I want to go now to wall street journal reporter diane messen balm who is in the street in istanbul. Can you tell me what youre seeing there right now. [ indiscernible ] hello, diane, are you there . Im here, can you hear me . I can. Its very loud. Where are you and what are you seeing . Caller im just down the street from taxeen square. The streets here are deserted. Weve heard jet fighters flying overhead. Theres been sporadic explosions and gunfire. There is a sense, as you were suggesting, that this coup may be faltering, but its unclear from here exactly who is in control. There are i had seen reports, toxeen square, its been the site of other protests, gatherings. I had seen reports of the deployment of tear gas, gunfire . Did you see anything like that . Reporter yeah, the scenes youve been seeing on your screen are remarkable. You had people heeding president erdogans call to go to the streets and defend the democratically collected government and challenge this military coup. So you have police clashing with soldiers on different sides. Youve got president erdogans political rivals backing him. Youve seen people storming into the airport to protect the democracy. Its remarkable scenes. There is a sense that things are turning in favor of president erdogan, who we are hearing is now just landing in istanbul, but the coup plotters are not giving up without a struggle. This is going to be a life or death fight for them. If they lose, theyre going to be essentially hanged as traitors for trying to overthrow the government. Yeah, this is we are also getting word we should just give a note here, i believe president erdogan, who has been in power for a very long time, a transformational, very controversial figure in turkish politics. He, i believe, was vacationing somewhere else and was essentially on a plane. There were reports he was asking for asylum, but those have been knocked down by the spokesperson for the turkish president. What is this image on now that were showing from earlier . Do we have okay, this is him addressing cameras, he also face timed in. We believe hes on a plane and will be landing shortly, at least that is what folks on the ground are saying. That is whats circulating in turkey. Dion, youre in istanbul. Can you give a sense, the people who have taken to the streets, are these hard core supports of the freedom and Justice Party that is the erdogan party, or is it all different spectrums af know extremely polarized nation . Reporter thats an important question. I cant answer from what ive seen so far. Weve seen supporters waving the flag of the party that he founded. So his supporters are definitely out on the streets. He has a lot of supporters here in istanbul where he served as mayor. You know, it is a diverse city with secular elements and conservative elements. We have seen the president getting support from across the political spectrum. So its likely that others have been out there on the streets, trying to defend him. But hardcore supporters are going to come from the party that he founded. I just want to let folks, the images that we were just showing, i believe, were the ataturk airport. The president had addressed people through face time and told them to take to the streets. I believe its ataturk, if im not mistaken. Weve seen other parts of the airport. Can we talk for a second about, the president has accused of forces plotting this coup, he made reference to the country, cannot be run from pennsylvania. And that is reference to a cleric named fatula ghoulin who lives in a compound in the poconos who has a religious movement adhered to by many people in the state Security Apparatus and is viewed with no small degree of suspicion and paranoia by erdogan. Thats exactly right. The ghoulness were a force that helped prepare erdogan to power initially. They were close allies and erdogan and the g

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