They dont want anything to work with the president s name connected to it. Our top political priority should be to deny president obama a second term. You lose good day, sir there are a lot of opinions about what direction to go. Wasting the publics time. And in this case, time is money. Were talking with our members on both sides of the aisle. You cant fight in here, this is a war room. That really does compromise Speaker Boehners leadership. Sabotaging a good faith, bipartisan effort, coming out of the senate. And after all this mess is over, do we really want to compromise john boehner as leaders of the house . I dont think so. My favorite playbyplay guy over the years has always been keith jackson. He would probably call it like this. Oh, nanny, we got us a tea Party Showdown tonight. Thats right, folks. In this house, there actually was some progress today. We got some breaking news off the top. House republicans are putting forward a new version of a bill to keep the government open and to avoid default, which i still think is a very real possibility. I think were going there. I hope not. And ill tell you why later. The version released late this afternoon would keep the government funded through december 15th, and extend the debt limit through february 7th. Theyre playing around with the dates a little bit. This plan also eliminates the special obama care protections for labor unions in the senate agreement. Well, the labor boys arent going to like that. It also includes the vitter amendment. This amendment takes away the government employer subsidy to help purchase insurance on the obama care exchanges for congress, the president , cabinet members and hill staffers. John boehners office said a vote is expected on all of this tonight. Interesting, that last part is what boehner was for a month ago. Now hes against it. You know, this is a far cry from their earlier bill this morning. Stop the president and the treasury from using extraordinary measures to raise the debt limit. Theyll do anything to go after the president , wont they . It also delayed the medical device tax for two years, and the new bill does not strip the medical device tax. This is a big win for the president , if it goes through. There is no doubt that this was a day of capitulation for republicans. Will the tea partiers revolt tonight . Stay tuned. Earlier, in their earlier bill, it received a storm of criticism from democrats this morning, and there was no way that it was going to pass the senate. After republicans released the first version of their bill today, Senate Majority leader, harry reid warned, credit agencies were eyeing another possible downgrade. The debt is here. The deadline is looming. Rating agencies are talking about downgrading us as early as tonight. Again that is, i think, the curveball that was thrown to boehner and the republicans. That took them to the very point holy smokes, this might be the real deal. So there was capitulation on a number of different measures. And, of course, the backdrop is public opinion, is really damaging the republican party. But there was such a brouhaha over the weekend about veterans. I had an interesting phone call to my radio show today, a veteran, 57 years old, said, this is the consequences of a default. Hey, ed. Im a navy veteran. And no coward. But i am truly frightened to the bone right now. The republican recession of 2008 cost me my 401 k . Ive worked all my life. Done the right things. Put money away. The only asset i have left is my house. And thats paid for. But this we go into default, i lose 100,000 in value on my house. That day. Interest rates for mortgages are going to go up a minimum of four points. And when that happens, the prices of houses go down. Thats the only thing ive got left. Im 57 years old, man. I dont have a lot of time to rebuild my nest egg. And these guys are just taking it all away from me. And theyre taking it away on a daily basis. And im just thinking at this point, man, you know, when you take away everything everybody has got to lose, the consequences of that to the guys that take it away are not good. Theyre really bad. Is that the kind of phone call that maybe some of the tea partiers have been taking to their offices in recent days . Have they been shaken to their bones that maybe this would be the beginning of the end for them as a party . I dont know. But i do know this. Tonight its going to be a very interesting vote. Will the democrats come on board and give boehner a yes vote on this, because there are still some provisions in there that are a little bit shaky. But for the good of the country will they go along . And how tough will the tea partiers play it tonight . Going to be interesting. Get your cell phones out. Tonights question. Do you trust republicans to keep us from the countrys firstever default . Text a for yes, text b for no to 67622. You can always go to our blog at ed. Msnbc. Com. Well bring the results later on in the show. Late this afternoon, the president brought in leadership on the democratic side from the senate and from the house. And i thought that this was somewhat of a no ransom moment. This has been very fluid. Its almost like the sausagemaking season. We think its going to taste good, but were not sure. In that meeting late this afternoon was congressman Chris Van Hollen of maryland who met with president obama and House Democrats. Congressman, great to have you with us tonight. Great to be with you, ed, as always. Where are we . What was this meeting like with the president . Was this a noransom moment, was this a hold the line moment . Where are we, congressman . Well, it was a very productive moment. The president indicated that he thought they had been making progress in the senate on a bipartisan basis, that that effort had been, you know, coming together. What weve seen on the house side and our caucus, the Democratic Caucus in the house, is not fooled at all. Is a deliberate effort, once again, by the reckless tea party faction, to try to shut down the government and default on our debt. Thats exactly whats going on here. Its a deliberate effort to undermine and torpedo the progress in the senate. Because you continue to have members of the house caucus who think that its a good idea if the United States defaults on its debt, despite the terrible consequences you just talked about. And i thought that was a really important case to show, because it shows the this is an impact on millions of americans. Were already beginning to feel the damage. We need to stop that now. Pass a bill to keep open the government, pay our bills. Okay. So the democrats tonight are here. Open up the government, pay the bills, set a date, get a Conference Committee appointed and lets get to work on the budget. That basically is where the democrats are right now. You would vote for that. Well, thats exactly right, ed. Okay. As you well know exactly. Thats where we are. Okay. Now, what is in there that you dont like, from what you know of the republican proposal in the house right now . Well, there are a number of things, but the overriding issue here, ed, is continued effort by House Republicans to try to extract demands by threatening the United States will not pay its bills. We have been very clear that you cannot go down that road of political and economic blackmail. Because if you start that process, every time the United States faces the issue of paying its bills on time, somebody is going to try to attach something unrelated. Thats not going to happen again what guarantee do you have it wont happen again . Ill tell you one thing that will guarantee that it does happen again, if you feed the beast. In other words, if you start adding these extraneous provisions now. So what were saying here in the house, ed, is stop it. You cannot bring down the full faith and credit of the United States by trying to attach these extraneous provisions. And if you let it happen this time around, it will certainly theyll certainly try to again. Now, very specifically here in the house, their proposal would take away from the secretary of the treasury their ability to take what are known as extraordinary measures in order to try and prevent a futurity fault. So the next time we come up against the debt ceiling, the republican proposal would make it impossible for the secretary of treasury to take those measures to prevent default. Thats a nonstarter for the democrats . Yeah, well, anyone who is for that is for dramatically increasing the risk that next time around the United States defaults. With all the negative consequences on millions of americans. And on the entire american and world economy. So that is absolutely a nonstarter. Okay. This just in. Fitch Rating Service has maintained its aaa rating for the United States, but places it on negative watch, citing the prolonged congressional negotiations over a hike to the borrowing limit. This is getting very serious. This is exactly what harry reid was talking about earlier today. Will that news is there any news that will shake the tea party to reality . Well, unfortunately, ed, we have been hearing from those Tea Party Republicans over the last weeks, and they have been very open about it. They actually think going into default is a good idea, and they have this theory, as you know, that somehow it will be okay, because the United States will be able to pay our debts to the Chinese Government and to all the bond holders. Of course, that would be at the expense of all the folks on Social Security. All the folks who rely on medicare. Our troops in the field. So republicans continue to push this notion that somehow it would be okay, even though it would be terrible not only for all those americans, but it would immediately undermine the Credit Rating of the United States. As youre hearing, just in anticipation of the possibility of going over the cliff. Imagine if we actually did. So the damage is already being done. That should be very clear to people. And so tonight, we can expect a very tough conversation amongst democrats when it comes to the treasury and the power of the president to take extraordinary measures. This is the big Sticking Point at this hour for the democrats. Thats what i get from Chris Van Hollen, correct . Thats right. Our view is this is a prescription for default. Okay. And keeping the government shut. Okay, so quickly, what are the chances of boehner bringing up the senate bill if that passes . Well, of course, thats always been the question. Whether the speaker will finally stand up to the Tea Party Caucus and exert some real leadership. And at the end of the day, thats whats going to have to happen, in order to prevent the default. Because as we have been saying, there are a lot of members in his caucus who have said they want to see that happen. So he needs to stand up to them, make it very clear the dangers for the country. And as i say, step up. Because so far, his sort of approach has been feeding the beast, thinking that, you know, maybe at some point theyll be satisfied. All they get is hungrier and bigger. Okay. Thank you, congressman Chris Van Hollen. Nancy pelosi i thought i had that. I guess i dont. Lets bring in senator Sherrod Brown of ohio. I appreciate it, congressman, for joining us tonight. Senator, whats the latest out of the senate at this hour . When america woke up this morning, they saw harry reid and Mitch Mcconnell, the leaders of the democratic and Republican Caucus conference in the senate come together on an agreement. And it looks they were very close to that agreement. John boehner then let it be known that he wasnt happy with it, and those negotiations, while theyre still still in the works, but its delayed it a bit. Were still hopeful that senator mcconnell, senator reid, it come together, we can vote on something tonight or tomorrow morning, get it to the house. But ultimately, it rests with Speaker Boehner. Hes got to decide, as congressm congressman van hollen said, hes got to decide is he peeker of the far right republican right wing or speaker of the United States of america . Mitch mcconnell stalled today. Can you trust the guy . Here all of a sudden boehner comes up with a proposal, and then mcconnell takes a step back from all of this when he was working so good with harry reid. Is mcconnell still stalling in talks with reid . Well, i dont know if hes stalling. I hope its only a hiccup, its only a bit of a delay when the clock is ticking on something so very, very important to our Economic Future and our reputation as a nation. I am still hopeful that mcconnell does the right thing here. I know hes faced with a difficult tea Party Primary in kentucky. We know what that makes politicians do sometimes, how fearful some can be. But im i believe that in the end mcconnell will do the right thing, work this out with reid, send it to the house. And its up to john boehner to show some leadership. Okay. So is it 50 50 on default, in your opinion . Where are we . Do you think boehner is going to move to protect the countrys credit . Nancy pelosi says she believes new legislation put forth by House Republicans is Speaker Boehner giving republicans one last chance to resist, which pelosi says is unfortunate, because time is ticking. Your reaction to that. Yeah, i leader pelosi is right. I have been on the phone a lot this week, talking to Business People in ohio, most of them republicans. But leaders of various kinds of businesses from banks to running research institutions, to entrepreneurs to all sort of businesses. And theyre pretty scared, but theyre theyre theyre beginning, i think, to put a lot of pressure on john boehner, to do the right thing. And i mean, this is this may be his speakership on the line. But this is the countrys economy on the line and the countrys reputation on the line. It does senator, it doesnt sound like whatever deal mcconnell and reid come up with is going to be a problem for a yes vote. That it will override the stupidity of ted cruz getting in the way again. I think if mcconnell and reid come up with something and i think theyre close, theyll get overwhelming support. Okay. If not unanimous from democrats it, close to it. And a lot of republicans. So well have an overwhelming vote in the senate. And boehner has got decide, does he want to do the right thing or playing games. Chris van hollen a minute ago said they really do buy into this prioritization. You pay off some of the chinese bond holders in wall street and a few Pension Funds and you may delay Social Security a little bit, but well get through this. No, this is a highrisk, terrible idea in lurching from manufactured crisis, one to another, is terrible for our country. Thats why the president and the House Democrats have stuck together on this. Senator Sherrod Brown, great to have you with us. Going to be an eventful night, thank you so much. Remember to answer tonights question at the bottom of your screen, share your thoughts on twitter. I think were going to default. I think the tea partiers have still got boehner by the jugular. Takes character to break one of those. Well have more on the breaking news from capitol hill, coming up next. Plus, the gop is sending in the clones. 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Time now for the trenders in the social media world, this is where you can find us, facebook, twitter and on our blog at ed. Msnbc. Com. And this is where you can find me on the radio. Sirius xm, channel 127, noon to 3 00. I think ive lost ten pounds since that picture. All right. The ed show social media nation has decided and we are reporting. Here are todays top trenders, voted on by you. Hail to the redskins the numberthree trender. Personal foul. The nfl franchise that represents the Nations Capital has maintained its name. Ask yourself what the equivalent would be if directed to toward africanamericans, hispanics, asians. Its an insult, a slur. Glenn beck is seeing red over the redskins debate. What about whites . I mean, can we at least be thrown in as people of a race . Bob costas is trying to make us hate each other even more. Where does that arrogance come from . That arrogance came from manifest destiny. It came from the government. Youre crazy, man. The numbertwo trender. Pawn stars. We think its atrocious that our military is being used as political pawns in a political game. People are being used as pawns. Palin pushes the Tea Party Agenda at the world war ii memorial. Commander in chief, the president today, he could be here today, standing up and saying, yes, we will tear down these barricades. The shutdown