political panel. the democratic strategist and former senior adviser to the 2020 biden campaign and jennifer horn, cofounder of the lincoln project and former chair of the new hampshire republican party. the latest nbc news poll out today shows the level of voter enthusiasm going into this year's election has hit a near 20-year low at this point in the presidential race, with the majority of voters saying they hold negative views of biden and the presumptive gop nominee, donald trump. if this turns out to be a low interest election, does this play to either candidates benefit? >> listen, it is hard to tell exactly who this will benefit from because we also have the outliers of what will happen with donald trump on trial, as