Republicans initial offer, having mitt romney be president. [ laughter ] there is that. Good morning, everyone. Its tuesday, october 8th. Welcome to morning joe. With us on set, we have the former Communications Director for george w. Bush, Nicole Wallace. Karl bernstein. And in washington, White House Correspondent for bloomberg news, julianna goldman. And Pulitzer Prize winning columni columnist, Eugene Robinson, along with willie, joe, and me. So were going to show these polls. Wow. Well start there. Youre surprised by those. Ive got to say, its the blame is more evenly spread out than it usually is in these matters. Really interesting. Im very interested to see what everybodys take. Americans are increasingly unhappy with the handling of the Government Shutdown by all sides, as joe alluded to. According to a Washington Post abc news poll, 70 disapprove of how republicans have handled budget negotiations. 61 disapprove of the democrats. And 51 are unhappy with president obamas role. The disapproval number for all groups are up since last month with republicans up the most. A cnn poll tells us similar story. 63 disapprove of republicans handling of the budget compared to 57 for democrats and 53 for president obama. A pew pole has republicans up from a threepoint spread last month, but compare that to 1995 when the public blamed Congressional Republicans nearly 21 over president clinton. The pew pole want eed the president to make a deal. 44 say the republicans should just make a deal without altering obama care. Its very interesting, isnt it . You tell me whats your take on the poll, and as you saw these polls, you were telling me about going to pennsylvania. Yes, i was in Lancaster County over the weekend. With jims friends and family members. You said there was just anger about obama care. Absolutely. A lot of the worker Small Businesses and Bigger Companies on mid levels, they feel like its really going to hurt them. But im personally not surprised by these poll numbers. I think when Something Like this happens, everyone suffers and im sure the white house expects that at this point. And i think the Bigger Picture is at what point do you look at the polls and you think about the future politically and at what point do you do whats right or wrong . You cant have this law taken hostage by a small group of republicans and changed. What does that mean for the future of our democracy if they can do this . Apparently a lot of americans agree with those small groups of republicans. And we knew coming into this that both sides were going to be hurt. The white house knew the last time they were down in the low 40s, the last time we had this sort of budget shutdown. But there is an asymmetry to these numbers, because those republicans that, lets say, are reading these polls and say 70 of americans are against us, see polls in their own district that show 70 of my constituents who are going to decide where im here or not, are for me. So lets just drive Barack Obamas numbers down even more until i get down in the low 60s, you know . And thats the asymmetry. Thats the problem the white house has to deal with right now, right . Yes, but were also at a great cultural moment right here. Great political, Pivotal Moment in our history. I compared it last week here to mccarthy, joe mccarthy, mccarthyism. This is about the Republican Party and what is it going to be. Is it going to be a factbased, philosophical argument or anile listic, hateful, asymmetrical in terms of facts and the truth, as in joe mccarthy. This is about media as well. These poll numbers are about a totally different media culture than weve had in the past. And as you see in that clip from comedy central, we need to start covering this story not 50 50, this much on this side, we need to cover it factually. Because there are facts here that will show what this event is about. And where, in fact, is this anger, hatred of obama coming from. What is the root of this. The New York Times did a great story the other day about how this wing of the Republican Party, call it the mccarthy wing, call it the eric cantor wing, whatever you want to kalt, h call it, has been gearing up for this. Playing the role, because we teamed up last time. We did. You came after me. But it was good. I liked it. I gave you 12 joe mccarthy references. I think its important because its the only comparable time since joe mccarthy weve had this in the Republican Party. And who is going to appease it . Ive got to move on, playing the role of bill krystal this morning, Nicole Wallace. Lets look at this from where you looked at it from a white house communication director. Theres an old proverb that says beware the man with nothing to lose. These House Republicans have nothing to lose. Very popular in their own district. I would bet if i saw 51 of americans were angry at bill clinton back in 1995, id turn to my friends and id go step on it, boys. Were going to drive him into the 30s. Im just saying thats what those guys have to be thinking this morning looking at these polls. And i bet their numbers arent just high in their district. I bet that if you poll conservatives nationally, these are the hometown heroes of the conservative movement. I bet when you look at the early poll numbers in the primary states will be the republicans skewed by the media. You and i both know the great irony of this is these hometown heroes who will hold on to the house will also make it next to impossible for our candidate in 2016 to beat hillary in the suburbs of philadelphia. Unless that candidate does what some of the like chris christie. And there are republicans in congress who have been critical of this approach. There are House Republicans showing up on television who are talking about a very different tune in their districts. Congressman dent was on tv last night. I mean, there is a divide in the Republican Party. But lets leave hate out of it just for a second. I know that wont last for too long. Its kind of hard because ive got some incredible sound bytes. Its more fundamental. The divide in the Republican Party isnt about haters and lovers. Its about governing and not governing. And there is a group that and you can condemn their motives and you can condemn the outcome, but there is a group that is simply not interested in governing and that is the divide in the Republican Party. Very wellput. Ideologically, we as a party are all on the same page. We do not believe that obama care is the right way to reform a health care system. Theres no divide in the Republican Party on the policy. But there is a great and bleeding wound now over whether we as a party are meant to govern. Thats why i call ethem annihalists. I dont know what the democratic equivalent would be. The liberal equivalent would be. I guess it would be like hey listen, if we do nothing, if the government remains in this state, then just billions and billions and billions of dollars of new federal spending are going to be spent every day. And were going to keep spending and were going to keep spending and were going to keep spending and create new programs, were going to build new bureaucracy you know, think about it. If youre a libertarian and youve squeezed it with a sequester, and even with the cr, you go back to pre2008 levels, youre sitting here going, you know . Lets see how long we can play up this Government Shutdown. Again, not about hate. But just about a governing or a nongoverning philosophy. Its true on a political front, i guess. Those are victories. But youd like to think there are some people thinking larger than winning political points in their district, given the fact now nine days until october 17th when we hit the debt ceiling. Lets bring in our washington contingent julianna goldman. Where is the white house sitting on this right now . Obviously john boehner has said youre not getting a clean cr. Thats not coming your way. On the other side, obama said were not negotiating. Were not using all of these moments whether its the debt ceiling or anything else as leverage points for you to get something you want. So what breaks this impasse . You know, willie, its really hard to see how any side right now has an end game, and the scary thing about this is that since 2011, you look back at this point where we are as were approaching that same debt limit kind of deadline, threat of a default seems so much more likely now. And the catastrophic consequences for the economy are so great, no one at the white house is sanguine about this. And its really hard to see how this gets resolved right now before that october 17th deadline. Yeah. You know, its day 8, and now its like truth or dare, or some other game like that. President obama is now telling Speaker Boehner to prove that he doesnt have the votes for a funding bill. I want to get to gene on this. Boehner has said it would not have a chance of passing the house, but some moderate republican congressmen like pennsylvanias charlie dent want to end the standoff and are siding with the president on letting congress vote. And by the way, this is already a give on the side of the president because its the republican spending levels. President obama said that, saying that the republicans are getting much of what they want. The bill that is being presented to end the Government Shutdown reflects republican priorities. Its the republican budget. The funding levels of this shortterm funding bill called the cr is far lower than what democrats think it should be. So when you hear this negotiation that democrats arent compromising, were compromising so much were willing to reopen the government at funding levels that reflect republican wishes, dont at all reflect our wishes. And, gene, as recently as september 6th, House Minority leader eric cantor echoed the president s sentiments saying the funding bill at the current sequester levels would be a victory for republicans, and in a memo he wrote this. The president would be endorsing a level of spending that wipes away all the increases he and Congressional Democrats made while they were in charge and returns us to a pre2008 level of discretionary spending. Isnt that negotiating, to an extent . Well, it would seem to me. On a fair level . Look, the logical thing would be for republicans to declare victory and end the war, right . But theyre not ready to do that. John boehner either is from some sort of deviously subtle game or just kind of winging it every day. I cant figure it out. In any event, hes not ready to give up the leverage he has, or thinks he has at this point. So he has to say i dont have the votes for a clean continuing resolution, even though basic arithmetic suggests that the votes are there. And president obama is trying the call his bluff. The Senate Democrats are going to do the same i gather with the debt ceiling and try to pass a clean debt ceiling and send it over to the house. If they vote, thats fair, isnt it, carl . Yes, and we just did a great factbased thing on the air. We showed what the positions really were. This is why i say this is partly about media. Its about the ability of demagogues, back to the mccarthy era, to get their message out. Bing can we have a bell every time he says joe mccarthy . Its very important. No, its not a bell. Its important. Ding its very important. Its about demagoguery. What you just did on the air with that quote from eric cantor, every newspaper in america, the wall street journal, ought to have it on the front page. People who are republicans like nicole ought to be saying all over the place, this is what its like. Its about truth, its about fact. Its about a wing in our party that has no interest in truth or governing or fact and its bringing the country down. It might not bring the party down. Like mccarthy, it might work. Ding. Thats the terrible thing. Ding. Mccarthy works in this country. Okay, so mccarthy. Mccarthy. Ding. Thats good. So julianna, any sense in the white house that the same people who said we will not negotiate, we will not negotiate, we will not negotiate, are starting to think oh god, 51 of americans angry with us. We may have to negotiate. I think one of the lessons that the white house takes from the 2011 debacle over the debt ceiling then was that by negotiating, the president actually came down to their level and rolled in the mud with the rest of them and thats why he came out so injured. So part of that explains the nonnegotiating posture. But look, there really havent been any negotiations with republicans. What you have seen is a little bit of reaching out through third parties, through intermediaries, to try and figure out what kind of facesaving agreement or measure we could get at the end of this, whether its a clean cr, a clean debt ceiling, and then some sort of informal agreement down the line. But it would have to be totally informal, whether its debt talks, the medical device tax coming back in, tax reform, something that deals with entitlements. But then you get the democratic pushback because they need to get something in return, if you have entitlements, then you have to have revenues as well and that might not be enough for boehner to be able to stomach with his caucus. Now, in the middle of this, were trying to get through the obama care exchanges. Its week two of those. Beginning like the first week did, some technical glitches. Error message for people trying to get signed up. Last night the Affordable Care acts primary website healthcare. Gov reportedly taken offline for maintenance and software updates. Kathleen sebelius is trying to down play issues with the website. Im going to try and download every movie ever made, and youre going to try and sign up for obama care. And well see which happens first. [ laughter ] how many have signed up thus far . Fully enrolled . I cant tell you. Because i dont know. We are taking applications on the web, on the phone, well be giving monthly reports. But i can tell you weve had not only lots of web hits, hundreds of thousands of accounts created. So its hundreds of thousands of people have signed up. Of accounts created, which means that then theyre going to go shopping. What . This is like a kayak site. Can you run it okay . We will. The v. A. s got huge problems. Im concerned. Were not running the insurance programs. Youre just running the enrollment. Thats right. The chief Technology Officer says the website was built to handle about 50,000 visitors simultaneously, but 250,000 users tried to access the site during peak traffic. His quote, these bugs were functions of volume, take away the volume, and it works. Thats why hes supposed to be in the internet business. I ran a remembers and i ordered extra servers, when i knew there were going to be really heavy traffic like the day before election day. And it worked. This argument doesnt work. This is about the republicans want to say theres government ineptitude sometimes. Theyre absolutely right. Theres a perfect example of it. But thats not the underlying issue. You just wonder why they left themselves open to this. This is a thing you have to get right because everyone else can criticize the policy. Get this part of it right. And theyve actually opted to telling members of the press that the phone number works better. Im surprised. As far as somebody told me, i think i read this somewhere, and im sure its true. Espns website, espn. Com, gets more traffic during the tournament. During the mens basketball tournament. Extra servers. They had to know this was coming. Its not like they werent warned. But if you look at the reason that republicans are so frustrated with what ted cruz is doing, its because hes made it impossible for the nation to focus on this. On how inappropriate it is for the government to be in charge of health care. Because it cant even handle the computer side of it. The ineptitude. They cant even handle the signups online. Can i address what nicole just said, though, about the government having a role in health care. Ill tell you what. Ten seconds and please say mccarthy. No mccarthy. And then we need to go to julianna. The government shouldnt be involved in health care i didnt say that. You can ding all you want at me, but thats not what i said. I said the republican philosophical objection is to this vastly expanded role of the government. And running a computer is to a republican mind i think it reveals how inept the government is in taking over all of our health care. You heard me on that, i agree. Going to be able to handle the complexities of health care, gene robinson, tell us where were wrong. This is silly. They screwed up they didnt get enough servers, as carl said. And apparently theres a problem with the software as well. But theyll fix it. Guess what, the government does know how to run computers. The nsa, okay . Thats the government. Theyre good at computers. They can take over my health care any time. Its ridiculous to say well, this just shows the government cant do anything. Well, no, the government can do a lot of things. They got this wrong. It certainly doesnt reflect well on the computer planning process for this. But they will get it right. Does anyone doubt that they will figure out how to run the computer . My point is this is symbolic for republicans about how inappropriate a larger role for the government is in health care. I understand that. Were talking about ted cruz. Love it, nsa. Just to prove you wrong, gene oh, okay. Wall street journals headline, meltdowns hobble nsa data center. They cant even spy on their own people right. One fact about health care . Carl, you are wound up. No mccarthy. Hold on, julianna. We have to get one more voice in here. Were conducting traffic stops. A lot of people are trying to get in. Too much caffeine. Julianna, the white house has to be embar