alongside with brian shactman, joe will be here shortly, don't worry about that. on set senior political editor and white house correspondent for "the huffington post" sam stein, president of the council on foreign relations, richard haas. good to see you. author of the book "foreign policy begins at home the case for putting america's house in order" and in washington columnist for bloomberg view al hunt. start off talking about a-rod, look tat the front page of "the new york post," a-roid rage has the last laugh in the sixth inning. >> i will say i'm a red sox fan, interest of full disclosure. these are the things that can turn a season around. when the red sox won the series in '04 that spat with jason vary tech and a-rod where vary tech took it to a-rod when he seemed bigger than the game turned his season around. if he gets to play out the rest of the year it's big for the yankees. >> also something wrong with the rules of baseball. after the pitcher goes after a-rod, the idea he's not tossed out of the game, both teams equally warned, that's outrageous. girardi was right, should not have been thrown out of the game. the pitcher should have been thrown out of the game. >> i thought it was just pitching him inside. >> don't you love that? >> what are you talking about? >> crowding the plate and he clearly threw a few balls and a-rod stepped into one. >> no funny business there. >> the key is, people -- there are players -- i think it's funny when they go after the game i was pitching him inside, and girardi said he only hit half a dozen guys in his career, there are players, from friends that work in baseball, players are angry he's getting to play and help that team win. the red sox are in a pennant race. what if he helps beat tampa bay or baltimore or oakland? people think he shouldn't be in the game at all. >> strike him out. don't go out -- >> that's a lame excuse. they have a process negotiated by the labor union. he can appeal it. i hate a-rod's guts but he can play while appealing that's fine. >> al hunt, do you care if he gets pegged? >> i think the guy must be a yankee mole because a-rod was the most unpopular figure on the face of the universe and he gave him a fleeting moment of sympathy and the yankees won the game. a stupid thing to do. >> yeah. >> i loved it. >> everybody at fenway got a treat, though. >> i luvz it. >> yankees win the series, what more do you want to know? >> you're right about the fact that here's a guy appealing the suspension, so he's presumed to be innocent while he fights this. can he pull redemption out of the hat if he keeps hitting home runs. are new yorkers going to care while every other team is spinning and p.o.'ed. >> unlikable character, right, but the truth is we did give him more than a little bit of sympathy last night. there's a lot of people that hate the red sox cheering for him. >> the nature of the new york yankee fan to root for a guy like a-rod, so -- it is. >> it's difficult to root for him. last night -- >> the process is beginning now. >> not quite. >> we can go a-rod all day in my book. with key portions of the affordable care act set to go into effect a showdown brewing for a september fight between the president and congressional republicans. in his weekly address the president accused republicans of trying to, quote, gum up his health law and jeopardize the federal government if the law isn't defunded or taken off the books. >> think about that. they're having a debate between hurting americans who will no longer be denied affordable health care because they've been sick and harming the economy and millions of americans in the process. and many republicans are more concerned with how badly this debate will hurt them politically than they are with how badly it will hurt the country. >> meanwhile the "san francisco chronicle" reports many people uninformed about obama care are falling prey to scams. the scams can take the form of e-mails or phone calls from people pretending to be representatives of the federal government and even solicitors going door to door trying to sign people up for fake medical cards or seeking personal information. what do you think about what's going to happen this fall? >> oh. it's hard to predict. obviously with respect to the budget showdown i don't think the president is going to budge. i don't see why he will or would because this his signature legislation. if they're saying delay the thing for a year i doubt that he would do that. but, you know, the weekly radio address was very interesting in part because we're at this point right now where there is a, you know, sabotaging going on of the plan or an attempt. the biggest move is to get people to burn their obama care cards as if they exist but encourage young people not to sign up, avoid the exchanges as a way to make sure the overall bill is sabotaged. this is a very critical juncture and it's not just about this budget showdown, it's about the implementation of the law and getting people signed up and making sure the system works. >> it's not as if the people against it are getting traction with the delays. the delays are separate from the movement against it. they're delays in the imme mentation. >> and it comes to a head on october 1st. al, you had a chance to speak to grover norquist over the weekend. each side trying to call the other one's bluff. that is come october 1st. >> it is. grover now is into this let's delay the thing for a year. couple months ago it was kill obama care as part of the debt ceiling or continuing resolution. they won't do that. i agree with sam, delay will not fly either. here's the danger here. the republicans privately believe obama is a lousy negotiator and usually caves and the democrats in the white house privately believe that the gop has a really bad hand here. they've suffered in the past. they won't do it again. if both can persist in those beliefs, there really could be a train wreck some time in november. >> this is where i thought newt made a good point. if the republicans don't like it they have to put forward an alternative. it can't just be against obama care. then you have to have a positive alternative and we haven't heard that. >> off al's point the timing works for obama here in that there's two showdowns, one over funding the government and the other over the debt ceiling. he would rather go off the cliff with respect to a government shutdown than a debt ceiling. if it comes down to calling someone's bluff my guess is the president would say fine, i'll let my bluff be called, shut down the government rather than let's default on our loans or default on our debt. >> they're both very dangerous tactics. >> but one is super dangerous and one is dangerous. and that would be the debt ceiling is super dangerous. >> super dangerous. >> let's move on to another bluff being called. >> sure. >> imagine a republican primary where rush limbaugh, sean hannity and mark levin run the debates. >> yes. >> if the rnc has its way it will become a reality. the conservative radio hosts are being looked at as the 2016 debate moderators. meanwhile the rnc is going to ban, not partner, with cnn and nbc from hosting presidential debates because of the networks plans to run hillary clinton themed biopics. the committee voted unanimously on friday to ex-clued the networks and while it was reported that fox was in talks with nbc to produce the mini series, "the new york times" now reporting the studio will not take part. according to the times cbs and fox networks passed on picking up the mini series. priebus defined the vote as part of a process to take back the primary process from the last cycle. >> i'm trying build a party that's year-round, fix a data and digital operation, a debate debacle i called a traveling circus. the fact of the matter is i've got to protect this party and our nominees. look, if you're not going to have 23 debates these guys are making it easier for us to pair that down to a reasonable number in front of people and entities that give a darn about the future of the republican party. >> you are also -- >> but al, i thought that speaking only to your base was not a way to win? >> well, i am just simply outraged this discriminatory and exclusionary policy. where's glen beck? glen beck has to be in the mix here somewhere. look, this is -- this is, i think, probably a lot of do about things that are going to take a different turn. i don't like these whatever you call them, biopics, i don't think it's such a great idea, but the debates, i mean i like reince priebus but the idea that the debates are what killed the republicans last time was nonsense. it wasn't the circus, it was the animals in the circus. hillary and obama debated through may of 2008 and didn't hurt them. my guess is this is going to shake out in a different way and debates are determined in the end not by the rnc chairman but by the frontrunner. if the frontrunner participates there are debates. if he or she doesn't, there are not. >> i would disagree over the didn't hurt them between her and president obama. i think, you know, obviously president obama came out on top after that, but it didn't make anybody from the democratic national committee challenge how many debates they were going to have. here we have the rnc now pulling through on their autopsy results which they wanted less primary debates. they wanted less blood letting of their potential contenders. i thought the republicans were about capitalism. isn't that -- these biopics are about money, not -- reince saying it's tipping the thumbs on the scales of the election but this is about capitalism. >> this whole thing is so silly to me. chairman priebus had the option to see the biopics before deciding to canceling the debates. could have assumed they were pro hillary love fests but he could have watched them and said okay that's unethical, not journalistic, we're canceling the debates. this is for raising money, following through on what you're talking about which is to limit the debates. i think it's overstated but, you know, it's amazing to me how much traction he's getting out of this because it's a stupid issue. the candidates could do the debates if they want to. it wouldn't be rnc sanctioned. he has little power over this process but he's making a stink over it. >> states can do what they want. >> i think the debates from mattered. the definitive moment of that debate is when she couldn't answer the question on eliot spitzer's i.d. law for undocumented workers in 2012, mitt romney famously said, his self-deportation line during the debates. there are moments where these things can matter. i think the quality of the candidates is far more important. >> doesn't it matter the quality of the candidates hooked up with the rnc and who reince wants to steer with the funding and money he's been able to amass. he's pretty good -- he spends five hours on the phone a day fund-raising. >> there's no perfect formula for how this works but he's trying to limit the amount of debates what is it comes down to. >> the other major story overseas, egypt, the i vens escalating and it's now on both sides. at least 24 policemen were killed this morning. the officers were on their way back to their bar racks when they were ambushed by militants on armed with machine guns and rocket-propelled grenades. we want to get the latest from egypt. nbc's ayman mohyeldin live from cairo. good morning. >> good morning. there's a few developing stories here. we'll start with the latest out of a cairo criminal court that involves the former president hosni mubarak, he's gone through a series of trials since he was removed from power back in 2011. a cairo court has ordered his release. he has been acquitted on previous charges involving the 2011 revolution, charges of corruption, but now a cairo court in the appeals process has decided that he is now free and should be released. now we were just speaking to judiciary sources who say that he will not be released just yet. there are other pending investigations against him. and those investigations will still allow limb to remain in prison. the fact that a cairo criminal court in itself has ordered his release, that is a significant development. certainly going to have massive repercussions here, at least some reactions in egypt because of the tense situation. the other story you're talking about developing this morning out of the sigh my peninsula, police officers that are conscripts in the security courses were am bushed near the city of rafah along the gaza/egypt border. 25 were killed. two others injured according to multiple sources. an indication of the growing rise of the militancy in the sanaa. obviously a very disturbing piece of information late last night, that involves the ministry of interior. that again, according to security sources, say at least 35 people were killed. 35 prisoners as they were being transferred from a police station to a security prison here. the muslim brotherhood said they were not trying to escape. that's the line out of the police force. these people were trying to escape and the police had to put them down leading to their deaths. the muslim brotherhood say these people were tortured and killed deliberately by the police. a lot of developing stories this morning here, brian. >> amman, please be safe. ayman mohyeldin in cairo. i want to throw to senator lindsey graham bite and richard, i want to get your take on the potential downside of this whole situation. have a listen. >> he had new elections, the brotherhood would get creamed at the ballot box, but they're going to be a very formidable force on the streets. they're going to get a line with al qaeda. al qaeda is going to come uninvited into egypt and a failed state and that means gas prices go up for us, the suez canal gets compromised and egypt becomes a staging area for terrorist acts against israel. this is an absolute disaster in the making. >> it's possible. one of the first rules of the middle east is things have to get worse before they get even worse. we're beginning to see that in egypt. it's hard to exaggerate the degree of polarization. you're having all these killings on both sides. this is clearly winner take all, loser lose all politics. the united states has virtually no influence over the trajectory of egypt, continue our aid, cut our aid or find a halfway house, the dynamic is, if you will, in motion right now. >> i want to ask anyone can take this, if the united states said okay, listen, what was happening was not working, let's have an election and see what happens from there, could that have worked or was it already -- morsi -- >> why do we have the power to call an election in their country. >> to push or advocate for it which we did not do. >> people on the muslim brotherhood side would have argued with some legitimacy that you already had an elected government. it had several more years to run. and the process -- there was no basis, legal basis, under egyptian law for ending the government, calling a new election. my hunch is they would boycott it and know they would lose and this thing continuing to be fought out in the street. the economy is tanking, no tourism, no investment. this is -- >> we continue to see false starts? because what we've seen with morsi getting elected in and then there was this ultimate buyers remorse think there wasn't enough inclusion in what we huz doing for egypt, so moving forward, the president saying there's going to be a lot of false starts, democracy is hard, for it to take and plant seeds. we want it to take seeds but we're not giving the guiding hand it potentially needs. >> i'm not sure there is a guiding hand to be given. you have to have constitutional reform, civil society. normally you have prerequisites in laplace, checks and balancesf compromise. none of those things is in place. you can have new elections tomorrow. it's not clear, though, that in the aftermath -- first of all the elections whether there would be enough inclusion for the elections to be legitimate and then afterwards there's no concept of loyal opposition. >> why do you think the cutting off of aid wouldn't be effective? >> billions going into egypt unconditionally from arab governments. it's really interesting, this is actually a snapshot of how the u.s. position in the world has changed. even if we cut off our billion dollars plus of military, don't have a symbolic impact, but first of all there's enough anti-americanism there the military would use this to fuel themselves. secondly the saudis or uae or one of the arab countries that hates the muslim brotherhood and does not want them to gain traction would offset the u.s. money. we're not in a position to control the outcome of the events here. >> that's uplifting. >> i am -- >> morning sunshine on a monday. >> coming up on "morning joe," republican governor from wisconsin scott walker will be here with us on set. and later, if you think pope francis is going to change the direction of the catholic church, think again. that's the cover story of the new republic. editor frank fore joins us. and later -- >> 2 ww my star, my perfect silence. ww. you figure that out. woodrow wilson. >> willy wonka. walter white. >> star of the show "breaking bad" dean norris will be here. top stories in the politico playbook. first bill karins and a check on your forecast. hey, bill. >> good monday morning to you. over the weekend idaho was the battlegrounds for a huge fire versus about a thousand firefighters on the ground. so far this point the fire has been winning. this is the beaver creek fire. 100,000 acres. picture how big that is. this is going up and over mountains. pretty much unchecked. right now, it is only 8% contained. look at those pictures there from the fire control center and the weather is not going to cooperate over the next two days either. there's other fires out west too that are also causing problems. but this one specifically now, as i mentioned, about 1,150 firefighters on the ground. ten helicopters fighting the blaze. they're picking firefighters up and dropping them off almost like military personnel into the fire areas because it's so remote and difficult to get to. thousands people evacuated also. forecast for this and the firefighters does not look good. 95 degrees with gusty afternoon winds. over the weekend, it was just a kind of crummy cloudy miserable weekend in the southeast. now we're going to watch the weather pattern changing for new england and the mid-atlantic. warmer weather is going to return during this week. not today. later this week. right now we still have more rain over north carolina, virginia, south carolina, cool down there, atlanta could pick up 2 to 3 inches of rain. towards the end of the week, a lot of us will see summer again. d.c. near 90 on wednesday and thursday even the southeast around atlanta who has been anything but hot should be mid to upper 80s later. washington, d.c., carry the umbrella today. chance of light rain. cloudy and cool. that will change later this week. you're watching "morning joe" brewed by starbucks. [ school bell rings ] ♪ school's out [ male announcer ] from the last day of school, back to the first. they're gonna write a lot. so make sure they've got somewhere to write it. this week only get composition books for a dime. staples has it. staples. that was easy. this week only get composition books for a dime. pcentury link provides reliable yit services like multi-layered security solution to keep your information safe & secure. century link. your link with what's next. [ sneezing ] she may be muddling through allergies. try zyrtec®. powerful allergy relief for adults and kids six years and older. zyrtec®. love the air. welcome back. look at that, nothing. just like the flintstones. time to take a look at the morning papers. "dallas morning news" from our parade of papers senator cruz released a copy of his birth certificate to the "dallas morning news" which shows he was born in canada. the morning news says cruz technically has a dual citizenship as his mother is a u.s. citizen. u.s. law requires presidents to be born in the u.s. which includes children born overseas to a parent who is a citizen. >> what's wrong with canada? >> nothing wrong with ka nada. this next story, i saw this next story, i'm like, come on. >> let's talk about this. >> sell tabloids but this is something. >> this is interesting. "the telegraph" new information into the death of princess dianaing a stir days before the 16th anniversary. new allegations that princess diana may have been murdered by a special service soldier sparked interest in the case. scotlandp yard confirming it's receive the new tip. as of now the royal family having no comment. >> we have tina brown next hour, talking to her on this. but everybody remembers where they were, when princess diana died. sam stein remembers where his mother was. >> i was in the womb. >> new york -- financial centers are more apt to recommendation the treatment for patients with prostate cancer. looking at ways to save money in medicare. investigators say other treatments for this form of cancer can be equally effective and less costly. and, you know, richard, this is -- i mean this is the bottom line problem with american health care is that the incentives aren't guided towarded wellness. they're guided towards profit. but not in a free market. in the screwed up, multilayered sort of system that has nothing to do with free market capitalism. so all the incentives are perverted. >> they are for service, fee for treatment. if you go around the country you will see certain hospitals perform ten times more gallbladder surgeries or 15 times more heart procedure or back procedure. there's a pattern here if you will, supply is determining shall we say the demand. this is the opposite of a free market. >> it is the opposite of a real market. thomas, important news from the "new york daily news." >> very important news. a man from ohio finding 285 pounds of marijuana in a safe he bought on-line. had a tweet i said i was going to be on mj you know what that stands for right? mary jane. a mexican manufacturer sent the safe to his house. >> how did he get our safe? >> the marijuana estimated about 425,000. wrapped air tight. preventing detection by the drug sniffing dogs. >> the "l.a. times" -- >> only way to get across the border. >> lee daniels of "the butler" beat expectations for its opening weekend. the film pulled in $25 million. oprah's first acting role in 15 years. thought to be strong competition for the "butler" but opened with $13.6 million. and that is, of course, thomas, the movie that -- >> jim carey was in and then said it's newtown. >> didn't want to be involved with the movie. >> not going to promote the film. >> too violent. second place ain't bad. >> it's not. i'm sure they spent a lot -- >> someone has to be second. the world needs ditch diggers too, joe. >> amen. don't know what that means so i'm going to keep moving. >> "caddie shack". >> that was "caddie shack" i thought you would get that. >> i haven't seen it in a while. i need to go back. >> richard. >> you seen "caddie shack". >> about ten times. >> what's your favorite part. >> i'm asking this of the president of the council on foreign relations. >> your honor your honor. >> we have an on-line survey on "caddie shack." with us now from politico playbook, editor in chief, john harris. john, democrats are actually blaming barack obama for some political problems their members are having. >> terrific story this morning. our senate reporter went out to arkansas where mark pryor really has a tough race on his hands and he says to senator pryor, do you approve of president obama or not? long pause. he said, is there another option there? pryor is doing something that's very difficult, he's trying to distance himself from president obama to some extent in a really conservative state, at the same time he's not doing that well with african-americans in arkans arkansas. you've got a road, middle of the road to walk there. if you just run away from the president, if you're in a tough race, it's death. on the other hand if you embrace obama wholeheartedly it's also death in place like arkansas. tricky political task that mark pryor has got. >> al hunt, mark pryor trying to walk this fine line. the guy is in no man's land. i ran against a guy in '94 who was trying to distance himself from bill clinton and it just allows you, either you're for your president that's from your party or you're not. and it's easy to beat him up and pick one issue after another after another. pryor is in trouble in arkansas. >> he is in trouble. michele nunn who democrats think has a shot in georgia is facing the same dilemma. how much to criticize obama, how much does that alienate typically the african-american base, joe, and my guess is, that what mark pryor and maybe even michele nunn will count on in the end is the big dog, particularly in arkansas, that the one person who i think can talk to some of those independents and red necks he has to get and also has great popularity among the african-american community is that person who your candidate a had to defend in 1994 your opponent, bill clinton. >> i just want for everybody to know s when al calls me a red neck, he does it with love. >> yes. >> complete love. >> joe, i haven't even talked about the alabama football team yet and ask you whether you're going to have more first round draft choices or felons. >> oh! >> what is this? where is this coming from? >> confusing alabama and florida. >> al hunt, thank you for joining us. do we have a seven-second delay. i think there's -- i think al is a little bitter because the nationals got pounded by a team from the deep south. atlanta braves. anyway, al, isn't it fascinating that we have -- back to politics -- fascinating we have republicans who were -- had a scathing take down on them in politico talking about all the mistakes the party has made this year and they've made an awful lot of mistakes and said a lot of terrible -- sent a lot of terrible signals but i was thinking yesterday, about writing a column, but then thought better of it and watched baseball instead, about, you know, it's not going to be easy to run as barack obama's democratic candidate six years into his presidency. that's always traditionally the worst time for the party in power to run. so i think republicans could -- i mean either side could still have a big year in 2014. >> joe, i agree. it's i think the republicans will have a pretty good year in 2014 which is fascinating because it's a party that is more unpopular than ever but it's the cycle to begin with. it's the lack of enthusiasm for democrats. it's some of the setups particularly in those senate races and for '16 if you look at 1989, look at 2005, look at other times, this is so early. there's -- the candidates haven't formed, issues haven't formed yet. i think the republicans are hammering about their problems now are engaged in enormous edge rags. >> little early. >> depends on 2014 whether the fed has started to quote/unquote taper, the markets are in some disarray, and that could be the context economically for the election. >> we'll see what happens. you just know traditionally six years in for a presidency, the party in power, it's a terrible time for them, sam. >> but at least three major things that can -- i mean the jobs market is one thing. if we have a shutdown over the debt ceiling. >> no doubt. >> these are major game-changing policy issues that will inevitably effect the course of 2014 and what shocks me, not talking about 2014, we've already begun the 2016 conversation which makes me almost nauseous we're this early in as we segue into a 2016 conversation. >> exactly. john harris, thank you very much. appreciate it. coming up, alex rodriguez gets hit by boston pitching but eventually gets some revenge. highlights from the best rivalry in sports coming up next. ever ybody has different investment objectives, ever ideas, goals, appetite for risk. you can't say 'one size fits all'. it doesn't. that's crazy. we're all totally different. ishares core. etf building blocks for your personalized portfolio. find out why 9 out of 10 large professional investors choose ishares for their etfs. ishares by blackrock. call 1-800-ishares for a prospectus, which includes investment objectives, risks, charges and expenses. read and consider it carefully before investing. risk includes possible loss of principal. i was having trouble getting out of bed in the morning because my back hurt so bad. the sleep number bed conforms to you. i wake up in the morning with no back pain. do you toss and turn? 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[ male announcer ] ...office space. yes, we're loving this communal seating. it's great. [ male announcer ] the best thing to share? a data plan. at&t mobile share for business. one bucket of data for everyone on the plan, unlimited talk and text on smart phones. now, everyone's in the spirit of sharing. hey, can i borrow your boat this weekend? no. [ male announcer ] share more. save more. at&t mobile share for business. ♪ time for sports. the yankees/red sox rivalry in full effect last night. some tweeted the weather was perfect. >> it was unbelievable. friday and saturday, took my boys up to see the sox game. phil griffin took his boy up. of course they were cheering for a-rod and booing everybody else. >> followed joe on twitter had some good pictures. >> the weather was absolutely -- it was a perfect weekend to boo a-rod. >> that's exactly what the fans did. >> now batting for new york, the third baseman, number 13, alex rodriguez. [ b >> boston started ryan dempster by the way. equally unfriendly. take a look at this. this guy, maybe had a control problem last night, i don't know. throws it behind him and then the next pitch, a couple pitches later actually, boom, right on the arm. both teams get a warning. joe girardi was in the a happy camper. he's defending his player. >> so tell me this -- >> don't think it was intentional. i really -- >> i'm serious, tell me, after the pitcher throws behind a-rod the first time. >> got to warn him. >> if you're the ump you walk up to the mound and say if you come within five feet of him on another throw i'm throwing you out of the game. why do you give him a warning -- i say this as a red sox fan. i have no love at all for a-rod. but why? i mean, guys can get hurt with 90-mile-an-hour fastballs. throw it behind him the first time and the ump doesn't walk out to the mound. i'm sure girardi is saying the same thing i am, you give him the warning the first time. if he hits him, he's gone. >> if this were medicine we would call it malpractice. this is outrageous. >> i disagree. >> sam -- >> a-rod could get hurt. there's so much ped protection around his arm. his arm is like sam's quad. >> barely felt that. >> this is where the drama is. forget about that. he got a chance of redemption, top of the sixth. takes dempster. this is the deepest part of fenway park. >> look at this. you know what, so many times when you hit somebody it comes back to get you. look at that. >> still down 6-4. this bases clearing triple by brett gardener gave them the lead. win 9-6. we decided maybe the yankees don't have enough to come back but the kind of win for a team to turn around a season. >> i can tell you the sox are still very concerned about the yankees. they still are. they just -- and they actually believe that team could rally around a-rod. there was booing, nonstop booing all weekend. a-rod, say what you will about him, he performed. that's one of the things that phil griffin was saying. the guy loves the booing, he loves the cat calls. and he responded. i'll tell you what, like you said. he took it to the deepest part. >> hit it the hard way. >> he came through for the team. >> he did. all weekend, he came through. >> he's now a sympathetic character to some. >> no. >> here's what he had to say. >> whether you like me or hate me, that was unprofessional and silly. kind of a silly way to get somebody hurt on your team as well. >> how would you describe the feeling when you hit the home run and went around the bases? >> it was awesome. it was the ultimate bayback. >> play for the yankees while fighting with the yankees at the same time? >> i think it's just important for us to -- for me to focus on the team and helping the team win. it is a very challenging situation. >> dempster has hit three guys in the last innings. he threw the first one behind him, intentional, next one inside, didn't hit him, at some point the ump has to give him a warning. everyone knows it was intentional. i don't understand why he's left in the game and to give us a warning. >> somebody asked a-rod if dempster should be suspended. and a-rod is like i'm the wrong guy to ask. >> girardi, who by the way i know we're most of us are red sox fans. >> speak for yourselves. >> i love girardi. >> good. >> i think girardi is such a good man. a decent man. a good man. and i think he's dead right there. i mean, again, why in the -- >> manager of your candidate considering all the distractions around, to have them where they are. >> i don't understand why you don't give dempster the warning when he throws behind his knees. >> i agree. >> it was a wet night. they couldn't grip the ball. >> right. >> okay. >> sam, he's getting flimsier every time. >> a weak wicked. >> can libertarians save the gop? why one party leader thinks so. >> whoa. >> why some cameraman should not operate cameras when krunk. they say rand paul can't win the presidency. that's next. right now, 7 years of music is being streamed. a quarter million tweeters are tweeting. and 900 million dollars are changing hands online. that's why hp built a new kind of server. one that's 80% smaller. uses 89% less energy. and costs 77% less. it's called hp moonshot. and it's giving the internet the room it needs to grow. this&is gonna be big. hp moonshot. it's time to build a better enterprise. together. iand we're talkingl time with diane about the walmart low price guarantee, backed by ad match. you got your list? let's go! look at that price! i like that! they need those for school. wow! that's the walmart low price guarantee backed by ad match. save time and money getting your kids ready for school bring in ads from your local stores and see for yourself. gotta get that bacon! bacon?! bacooon! smokey bacon, meaty bacon, tasty bacon! bacon? 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that this libertarian strain is a great opportunity for the republican party. >> absolutely. >> to grow itself, attract younger voters. >> yeah. >> infuse itself with the type of energy. >> i mean, in at least two very obvious ways. there's a real pessimism and concern about the extent that we're engaged overseas. >> yeah. >> that's obvious across any polling data. the country moving towards a civil libertarian bend respect to the drug wars and gay marriage and don't want the government involved in their personal lives. >> most of the republican party's problems over the past decade, we've had a lot of them, have been when we moved away from a lot of libertarianp views -- conservative views with a libertarian slant, that we actually don't just believe in small government at home, we believe in small government abroad. we don't engage in military adventurism. we worry more about people's pocketbooks and bedrooms and on and on. as we got away from this, the party got older. we just didn't attract this many younger votes. bring in from washington the atlanta ace molly ball for his piece titled "america's libertarian moment." interviewed the executive vice president of the cato institute for his take on the recent libertarian momentum. molly, so your interview with david and the cato institute underscoring a real divide in the republican party between the old guard which, you know, chris christie, jeb bush, and the newer guard people like rand paul? tell us about it. >> sure. yeah. as you say, paul believes this is the way to expand the party. you bring in the young people, the rand paul people, rand paul's dad got thousands of kids to come out on college campuses in the last two elections and rand paul saying that's how we make this party a bigger tent. we bring those people in, we bring in the youths. he's been doing a lot of outreach to minorities telling black voters standing down in the drug war and loosening a lot of sentencing laws is something that the republican party should stand behind and then you have what david boez described as an emergency committee of the neocons, sort of attacking him and chris christie voicing this conservative -- this more conservative republican line on national security trying to say, no, we can't go soft on national defense by, you know, they would frame it as backing down. >> right. >> on foreign interventionism. >> that's the real big difference between chris christie and the libertarian wing is chris christie appears to, you know, follow the bush program, the bush/cheney program. let's talk about another guy that you brought up, ted cruz. does david consider ted cruz who may be rand paul's competition on the right in 2016, does he consider ted cruz to be a libertarian style politician? >> he does not. he described ted cruz as a two-fisted goldwater conservative. in particular, he sees ted cruz as being more interested in tangling church and state than libertarians tend to prefer. when ted cruz was a government lawyer in texas he defended having the ten commandments on the grounds of the texas state capitol. ted cruz is quite socially conservative. gay marriage, ted cruz is against that. libertarians believe the state shouldn't be involved in telling people who they can and can't marry. ted cruz's views on foreign intervention are a little bit more in line with the traditional republican line than libertarians would prefer. >> al hunt, bring you in here. it's fascinating what's happening within the republican party. and it seems to me that rand paul does have -- again, i'm a little biased here and i've said i voted for ron paul in 2012, but it does seem that rand paul does make a good point if you want to attract younger voters, certainly at least supporting an influx of this libertarian wing of the gop would be a good way to do that. what's your take? >> well, joe, i think you're right but also, it causes great dilemmas as i'm sure molly can attest, are you going to weed out the evangelical part of the party that believes strongly against gay marriage, that thinks abortion should be a prime issue. what parties are about, successful parties are about building great coalitions. that's why reagan was so successful and why some democrats have been successful in recent years. i think that split is real and i think how you are able to find common ground is something that has allueluded -- eluded republicans on this issue? when i was researching your article i did a google for the libertarian moment. a 2008 article came up. this is something people predicted before in the pastp why is now any different than when anybody was predicting the libertarian movement 5, 10, 15 years ago? >> back to the 1970s there was a headline in "the new york times" magazine saying the new right credo libertarianism. not only nothing new about libertarianism as a fill lossy, nothing new about people hyping it as the next big thing for the republicans and right. the reason and what david would say the reason is libertarian is having a moment now is a couple things. number one, what they see as overreach by government has expanded in the bush years and the beginning of the obama years, they see obama care as a big violation of individual liberties has gened people up and gotten people to react. all the revelations about the nsa, the irs, these are other examples of what libertarians see as overreach by government that are getting people angry, to move to a libertarian position. another thing is generational. as you said before, the younger people are in favor of gay marriage, marijuana legalization, live and let live tolerance and that's a libertarian position as well. >> you keep talking like that and sam stein may jump parties. >> whoa. >> molly, thank you so much. we greatly appreciate it. molly's piece is on-line at the atlantic.com. al hunt, thank you so much. i forgive you for your bitter and angriness. the next time the braves come to town you may be able to take a couple. >> i doubt it. >> thanks a lot. still ahead on "morning joe," governor scott walker here. with us on set. but first, one of the best "price is right" guest entrances ever. not talking about shactman. that's next on news you can't use. so i'm checking out the jetta. 34 hwy mpg. check. no-charge scheduled maintenance. check. and here's the kicker... 0% apr for 60 months. and who got it? 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nbc's mandy clark is reporting this. >> controversy surrounded princess diana's death on august 31st, 1997. nearly 16 years ago and still grabs the headlines dramatic new claims splashed across the british papers. allegations that diana and her boyfriend dodie al fayed were murdered by a soldier a member of britain's elite special forces. the information was reportedly brought forward by family members of another soldier and passed on to police. scotland yard confirmed it received the new tip and assessing its relevance and credibility and stressed it has not reopened the investigation. skeptics question the claims and the timing. >> every year, at the time of the anniversary of princess diana's death, there seems to be fresh allegations that resurface, new revelations about how she was so-called murdered. the problem is there's no evidence. >> reporter: meanwhile, prince harry is back after spending last week in angola visiting land mine clearing projects, walking in his mother's footsteps. his way of carrying on her charity work, perhaps her greatest legacy. princess diana visited the country in 1997. the iconic images of her wearing protective gear in a mine field drew attention to the suffering caused by land mines. one of her last big charity trips before her sudden death. conspiracy theories have continually surrounded the deaths of the princess and her boyfriend but repeated investigations have been consistent. that their driver was drunk when he lost control of the car and hit a cement pillar in a paris underpass at 80 miles per hour while trying to loses the chasing paparazzi. >> tina brown, conspiracy theories surrounding everything. i was trying to convince my son this weekend that neil armstrong walked on the moon. they continue. you know, when you read this over the wire or breaking this weekend, scotland yard is actually taking it seriously? >> the only interesting part is this for the first time isn't coming from the crazed vengeful quarter of mohammed al fayed, dodi's father who kept the inquest going. >> and always suggested they had been killed. >> it was a hit by prince philip, ordered by prince philip which was such a bizarre idea prince philip would order this hit. it will be blown up. one of the things that amazes me is how the same things keep coming in. the grassy noll craziness all over again. the flash theory the idea that this sas soldier, you know, disguised as a paparazzi could have flashed a strobe light into the eyes of the driver. the fact is that operation pageant which was, you know, overseen by lord stevens of scotland yard when i was researching the book i spent time with, he created this whole kind of laser computer reconstruction of this car crash. the fact is henri paul the driver lost control of that car before he got into the tunnel and he lost control because he had mixed six drinks that french love so much with triapid and prozac and he was drunk, although didn't look drunk or buzzed, not fully in control of his senses, he careened into this tunnel at 75 miles an hour, a tunnel which had already 15 deaths in the last few years, and a fear came up this right-hand side. he swerved to avoid the fiat. ricocheted on to one pillar and the next and then crashed into the 13th pillar in the tunnel and crashed the car. now one of the things that is interesting, of course, was the fiat, the car, where was it? nobody could find this. in my investigations in the book the fiat they did find the owner. he turned out to be a vietnam -- vietnamese immigrant. the reason he didn't come forward he didn't want to get mixed up in any leaving the scene of the crime. didn't want to be mixed up. he repainted his car and disappeared. he wasn't a sinister figure. >> that's what he wants you to believe. >> that's what he wants you to believe. >> what about on the back end of ambulances not getting there quickly, ambulance then pulls over on the side of the road carrying princess diana and waits to go to the hospital that's farther away than the closest hospital to the scene in all of those -- >> that was also absolutely medically correct. the ambulance was having to crawl because she was undergoing all this incredibly delicate procedure in the ambulance trying to stabilize her. if they had gone faster she would have died. they also were trying to get to the hospital which had all the equipment they needed to get her rescued. if they had gone to the nearer hospital they didn't have that equipment, those doctors. so they were trying to get her to the place where she had maximum, you know, ability to be saved. >> my other question, how did prince philip get to you? >> you know prince philip paid her off. >> you have to think the queen and prince philip are saying, exterminate her. it is bizarre. the truth is, it was a tragic series of hideous small things and for it to be a murder, all kinds of crazy variables would have had to be true. nobody knew henri paul was going to take that route to her apartment. nobody knew that she was going to have a drunk driver. no one knew he was going to have that driver. he was dodi's chauffeur, a last-minute decision. >> perfect storm. >> so last minute there was no way that murder could have -- >> the lesson don't drink six cocktails and drink prozac before you drive. >> or get into a car with someone. she wasn't wearing a seat belt. she wouldn't have died had she been wearing a seat belt. the bodyguard was wearing a seat belt. he buckled up himself but dodi and diana weren't wearing seat belts. dodi died instantly and diana died shortly afterwards. >> all right. all right. you just do wonder why scotland yard even gave this any oxygen. >> i think maybe because they're so anxious for it to not look any -- there's any sort of repression of a theory they probably say they're having to look too it. looking into it is not reopening the inquiry. >> right. >> it isn't. >> it's not reopened yet. the rnc, of course, has a new plan to win back the presidency. you heard about it this weekend. replace nbc and cnn's brian williams and anderson cooper with rush limbaugh and sean hannity. the washington examiner is reporting the radio hosts are being looked at as 2016 debate moderators. the rnc is going to bar cnn and nbc from hosting presidential primary debates because of the network's plans to run hillary clinton-themed shows. the committee voted eunanimously friday to exclude the networks. while it was reported fox was in talks with nbc to produce the series "the new york times" is reporting the studio is not going to take part according to the times, cbs and the fox network passed on picking up the mini series and fox officials said that it had nothing to do with politics and everything to do with profits. they didn't like the money deal. priebus defended the rnc's vote as part of an effort to take back the primary process from the last cycle. >> i'm trying to build a party that's year-round. i'm trying to fix a data and digital operation. i'm trying to get ahold of a primary process and a debate debacle that as you know i've called a traveling circus. the fact of the matter is, i've got to protect this party and our nominees. look, if you're not going to have 23 debates these guys are making it a lot easier for us to pe pare that down to a reasonable number in front of entities that give a darn about the future of the republican party. >> bring in chuck todd. what do you think about the developments this past weekend? >> well, look, if the rnc is trying to limit the number dev baits that's smart because that will mean, what? about half the republican field from 2012, if they didn't have the debates they wouldn't have run, right? they simply ran for exposure to get a talk show or for exposure to get a radio deal or a column or a deal with fox or whatever. whatever it is, their reasons for running, it wasn't because they thought they had a viable shot. one of the things on the celeb brification of the presidential cycle it allowed for this underbelly of candidates that -- whether it's herman cain or dennis kucinich, people like that to say, i can show up, i get to be on national television, on various cable networks or, you know, so if you do that, then that is smart, tactical politics. it is kind of funny, joe, imagine if the rn clshgs put the same effort they've been putting in this to get immigration reform passed. i think they might have -- they might have gotten that done by now. >> chuck, i have a question because you probably know this better than anyone here. how much power does the rnc have over whether a debate takes place. can't the candidate circumvent the rnc. >> sure. the only precedent that there is, 2004, and the dnc decided to play this role and all of the folks that were running at the time, agreed to it. now that said, so that meant that the dnc decided they gave basically a debate i believe to -- even fox had one, nbc had a couple, one was i think on msnbc and one was on cnbc, abc, they spaced it out. i think they did six over six months, one a month and they chose the debate site. there is precedent to do this. all the candidates have to agree to it. there were still rogue quote/unquote forums. i remember moderating a forum, an aarp forum in 2004. it was not a sanctioned debate but five of the seven guys showed up who were campaigning in iowa. so you can -- it depends on what the campaigns do. i think there's going to be motivation by the frontrunner campaigns, by the real -- the people that want to be the nominee, to allow the rnc to play this role because they never want to have to say no, but they would love to have somebody else say you know what, let's limit the number of these things. >> chuck, you had an interesting point this weekend on "meet the press." you were saying that hillary clinton emerging as a frontrunner is bad news for the obama administration. why? >> well, it's the timing of it. right? there's lame duck status happens to any second term president in two phases. one is in washington in the ongoing back and forth with congress at some point you sort of just run out of political capital. the president is running up against the clock on that over the next year. but then the second phase, of course, is, are you leader of your own party? and at some point, the outgoing president is no longer, you know, sort of a -- is a leader at large but no longer the rallying point. and if you're barack obama, you want that to start as late as possible -- as you possibly can. when you're watching all of this movement around hillary, whether it's the super pacs, whether it's grassroots organizing by emily's list, what hillary herself is doing with various speeches, that is something that accelerates that process and it's an unintended consequence. nobody is saying this is what hillary clinton is trying to do or anything like that. this is an unintended consequence. it's going to make it harder for barack obama to stay leader, marshall resources. ofa is struggling enough as it is to prove itself as an enit it -- entity outside of a presidential campaign. having to compete with hillary clinton makes it tougher. >> tina, it's a problem, obviously, for barack obama because you're already having people line up holding fund-raisers for hillary, promoting hillary for president. >> i'm not sure it's so great for hillary clinton actually. there is the curse of the frontrunner situation for her now. this is just getting so much kind of focus on her, so much early, you know, garbage about her, so much anger about her which will build and by the time she runs, she will be an old story again which i think is a problem. you can see the freshness of a chris christie if he were to be the nominee and new story, fresher story. that was one of her problems last time. she felt like old news. i don't necessarily think it's so great for hillary clinton that all of this -- >> i'm with you, tina. i don't understand why she's out so early right now. i don't know why they didn't take the entire year off. >> we will all remember back to 2007, there was already clinton fatigue. >> right. >> remember when david getten gave his famous interview to the "new york times" and ripped into the clintons. you could almost hear, you know, the entire democratic staeshment quietly going here here because there was clinton fatigue and that was 2007. i'm not good in math. went to the university of alabama. don't have to be good in math. we're number one. only have to count to one. >> where's al hunt? >> that was six years ago we were talking about clinton fatigue. we're going to hear about this for the next three years. >> right. >> i agree with all of you guys. that's -- >> it was a golden thing going on for her when she left the state department and suddenly back into clinton land. i don't think that press is great. the huma abedin stuff hasn't been great either. >> the other side, which if you're the clintons you say all right, you know it's inevitable that she's going to get started being treated as a politician. playing devil's advocate here, i don't agree with what they're doing. you say get it out early. lose the shine from independents and republicans now. get it all out of the way and then slowly build back up sort of make the -- make the negative stuff feel like old news. >> i'm not on either side. i'm on the side this is pointless speculation and we have no idea what is going to be the situation. >> if only we could be as cold-hearted and removed as sam stein. >> that would be great. >> and all of us should send president bill clinton a happy birthday. >> it's his birthday. >> 67. >> happy 67. >> so the big dog. all right. fantastic. >> happy birthday. >> thank you so much, chuck todd. greatly appreciate it. we'll see you at 9:00. go comers. th dodgers. came out of yesterday. >> what's the record in the last 50 games, chuck? >> 42 -- what are we now? 41-9. >> wow. amazing. >> after losing yesterday. >> that's insane. all right. thanks. still ahead on "morning joe." >> cheetos not fritos. >> wait. >> i must have said cheetos like ten times. need me to write it down for you? >> no. i don't need you to be mean about it either, mr. grumpy. >> i said cheetos. ch sound. virtually impossible to confuse cheetos with fritos, seems to me. where are you going? that's how t.j. actually treats everybody in the control room. so rude to them. from about the breaking bad" dean norris joins us about the hottest show on tv. wisconsin governor scott walker, he joins us on set. you're watching "morning joe" brewed by starbucks. 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"stubborn love" by the lumineers did you i did. email? so what did you think of the house? did you see the school ratings? oh, you're right. hey babe, i got to go. bye daddy! have a good day at school, ok? ...but what about when my parents visit? ok. i just love this one... and it's next to a park. i love it. i love it too. here's our new house... daddy! you're not just looking for a house. you're looking for a place for your life to happen. hey, with us now the republican governor of wisconsin, governor scott walker. sam stein, i wouldn't let -- you can't let sam borrow the money. he will go out and buy pot with it and suddenly you're in charge -- >> wow. >> this conspiracy -- >> nothing wrong with that, right? >> you said it, not me. >> i'm glad you didn't go to baseball because -- >> no. >> i want to talk about packers football if anything. >> i know. we were talking beforehand you're up here for -- >> bond rating agencies. your neighbor to the south illinois is an economic basket case. you guys in wisconsin are doing so well, sam was asking to borrow money. it's crazy. you guys are going to get a huge up on your bond rating because i guess you're just a wash in cash up there. >> four years ago we had just over $25 million cash balance at the end of the year. fiscal year '09. now we come in with over $1.8 billion. pretty sharp contrast. it's the same thing. couple years ago when i came in $3.6 billion deficit. we have about a half billion dollar surplus. >> let's talk about, then, ryan braun, what happened? >> i could see a-rod threw him under the bus. >> that's right. >> do you think he will ever get booed if he plays in hawk. >> a lot of fans that watched that pitch being thrown imbollic of how america felt about all those guys. i was defending ryan braun, literally sunday night before the story broke. >> isn't that unbelievable? >> i feel like some of the lance armstrong supporters. i was saying it could be, makes sense and then just like a shot to the gut. for my sons, 18 and 19, both big brewer fans, a lot of fans across america, these guys let us down. >> they really did. >> with ryan braun, bad for the juice. that's what matters to me. >> that's what matters to you. >> the good news, so many baseball players, you have your lot to pick from. >> hank green burg, ryan braun -- >> of course you have sandy, but you know. >> sad part, we were talking to tina about heroes, a guy like ryan braun was a quiet, soft spoken guy, as a sports figure, hot shots you don't really want your kids to gravitate towards but this was a nice, quiet, decent guy. >> every single person, every iconic figure, seems to bite the dust. who do kids admire? >> so there are different ways to handle it. everybody makes mistakes, terrible mistakes. but i'm -- i have taken my boys up to see the red sox and yankees play and, of course, everybody is booing a-rod but there's andy pettitte on the mound, andy pettitte, testified and said he used performance enhancing drugs but admitted it up front and said i had a shoulder injury, took some stuff that i probably shouldn't have taken, healed me up faster and i'm really sorry. that was the end of it. every time i see andy pettitte on the mound i hate the yankees but go that guy was decent. >> he took responsibility. >> that's the problem for a lot of us with ryan braun that got upset, a lot of brewer fans, here it was all this stretch when he was in the news, he kept telling us it didn't happen, kept putting out a plausible defense. for a lot of us, this is a decent guy, seems like a quiet guy not over the top, defending him until the very end. >> he became the john edwards of bicycling. the constant lying. >> shouldn't be people in the media or sports, they should be our parents or our kids our neighbors. we were talking about not only military personnel but the families th family support them. look in your own backyard, find your heros nearby. >> let's talk about the republican party. they had their summer conference. >> yeah. >> how are we doing? democrats, democrats ain't doing great, but we're not -- >> i would say it's the tale of two parties. you look nationally the last two presidential elections real issues at the federal level. look at the difference, 30 states have republican governors. nearly as many states have republican legislative majorities. most of the states that obama won the last time around, the battle ground states, wisconsin, iowa, ohio, michigan, virginia, florida, have been coming to bat, all have republican governors. >> that's a great question. what's happening in the states that we're getting right, 60% of the governors in america republican. the majority of state senators in america. republican. huge landslide since 2010. what are republicans not doing in washington, d.c., that republicans at the state and local level are doing? >> three big things. governors as state leaders we're more optistic than our friends in washington. we're not just against something. we're laying out a plan and vision. >> you have to, right? >> that's how you lead. you don't sit back and nick the other side. you have to lay out a plan. we talk in terms more relevant and to give you a good example, sequesters most people goes over their head, debt ceiling, fiscal cliffs, we talk about balancing our budgets to live within our means, helping our neighbor to get a job again. the whole thing in addition too optimism and relevance, having the courage to act. a lot of american voters look at washington and don't think anybody has had the courage to do anything. >> they don't have to do what you have to do. republican and democratic governors alike have to balance their budgets. run the schools. they can't run up massive debt. they can't push up -- you talk about being for something instead of just being against something. you caught my attention a couple weeks ago when you came out and you thought, you said you thought it was a bad idea to shut down the federal government over obama care. >> right. >> why? >> well, i have real problems with obviously obama care and i've laid it out in my state, didn't take the medicaid expansion, state exchanges but you're disconnecting things. there's a huge problem. you know it back from the mid '90s. >> we did it. we helped re-elect bill clinton by shutting down the government. >> people want things to work. now a lot of people like myself, we talked before about libertarians, a lot of people like my sons 18 and 19 want less government than there is. most americans even if they don't like the size and growth they want something to work. something fundamental to work. that's the difference between washington and the states. at the state level we may want as republican governors less government but want the government we have to work. >> sam? >> you mentioned sequestration as something that goes over the head of our people but from your perspective as a governor how that policy has impacted your state, your ability to do your job? >> well, it has an impact no matter what, whether the shutdown or sequester. i remember back in february all the governors get together every year with the president and white house and the president, obviously, back early was adamant against -- in his opposition to the sequester. i said very respectfully to mr. president, when we sat down with all the governors, do with your cabinet what we've done in states all across america, that is, if you don't like the sequester plan have your cabinet put together an alternative plan and find a better way to do that. unfortunately, at that time he was pushing for more revenue, meaning meaning more taxes. come back and say we have a better way to deal with this. we saw it with the department of transportation, air traffic controllers. we saw it with the department of defense, some of the furloughs they've had to do. social services. >> i mean, governor, we see more and more that it's almost as if washington becomes irrelevant and all the sort of movement takes place on the level of the state of the governors and mayors too actually in the front line of getting pracle things done. what can be done in washington then? we can't just sit here with this stays sis forever. how can we coopt change, reorganize so this doesn't happen anymore? >> i've always thought, not just going back to reagan, some of the things that bill clinton did, give more power to the states. doesn't matter whether it's democrat or republican governors. more funding. block grants. medicaid, education, other things like that. the history of this country is based on democracy, driven by democracy at the state level. the more that power is pushed to the state and ultimately to the local level the better off we are. the more it's pulled in and gravitates towards washington, doesn't party democrat or republican, you know, i could argue it's better one party or the other, but in the end more power concentrated in washington isn't good for anybody in america. it's better pushed to the states and local level. >> how are the pack going to do? >> i'm getting ready to size up a super bowl ring. >> come on, man. >> defense looks good. we got bama, give us a good running back. what was it like 62 in the -- >> boy, he's good. >> he looked good the other night. >> that was a steal. you got a steal. what round did he go? >> like number 62 in the whole draft because he was injured. looked good against the rams. >> eddie lacy, he's powerful. >> yeah. >> get a running back with aaron rodgers, kyle back healthy, jordy nelson, there's no stopping the pack. >> ain't no stopping us now. all right. scott walker, thank you so much. >> good to be with you. >> still ahead on "morning joe," from the hit shows "breaking bad" and "under the dome" dean norris is here. keep it here on "morning joe." honey... it's time to go. no. honey, it's too perfect. over a quarter million properties... you'll never want to leave. booking.com booking.yeah little things anyone can do. it steals your memories. your independence. ensures support, a breakthrough. and sooner than you'd like. sooner than you'd think. you die from alzheimer's disease. we cure alzheimer's disease. every little click, call or donation adds up to something big. it's delicious. so now we've turned her toffee into a business. my goal was to take an idea and make it happen. i'm janet long and i formed my toffee company through legalzoom. i never really thought i would make money doing what i love. [ robert ] we created legalzoom to help people start their business and launch their dreams. go to legalzoom.com today and make your business dream a reality. at legalzoom.com we put the law on your side. the recall effort against bob filner is now under way. filner has been accused by at least 16 women and a great grandmother of unwanted sexual advances and now those trying to get limb ousted from office have a little more than over a month to get more than 101,597 signature. they took to events across the city to get out the message. despite admitting his behavior was wrong he's resisted calls to leave office. while residents try to recall the mayor, city officials could also try to remove him by investigating whether he misused city issued credit cards. now now a new poll says 81% of san diego residents want the mayor to resign. i really do think -- >> who are the 14% who said no? >> i don't know. >> great grandmother, i think that's the final straw. >> it's embarrassing. i feel like it embarrasses the country when stuff like this happens. you have to recall them. that's a lot of signatures to get in a city like that. they've tried in the past and have not been able to recall mayors there. >> they have the 81% saying he should resign, 72% say they would sign the recall petition if they put one before them and on sunday those are out, so we'll see how they load them up. >> see how it goes. i think they will be able to get their 100,000. all right. coming up next, pope francis takes on the vatican. this could be a knock down, drag out to the end. why change for the catholic church is not going to come easy. the new republic's frank forejoins us coming up next. the secret is out. hydration is in. [ female announcer ] only aveeno daily moisturizing lotion has an active naturals oat formula that creates a moisture reserve so skin can replenish itself. aveeno® naturally beautiful results. aveeno® over 20 million drivers are insured with geico. so get a free rate quote today. i love it! how much do you love it? animation is hot...and i think it makes geico's 20 million drivers message very compelling, very compelling. this is some really strong stuff! so you turned me into a cartoon...lovely. geico. fifteen minutes could save you fifteen percent or more on car insurance. welcome back to "morning joe." beautiful look at the white house this morning. let's go to washington and talk to the editor of the new republic frank. the new issue takes a look at pope francis versus the vatican. the cover story reads in part, francis renewed emphasis on the poor is welcomed and valuable and there are circumscribed areas the pope may achieve real reform. when prose gressive catholics pine for change, they mostly mean they want to see the church brought into the ethos of modern liberalism, including its embrace of gay rights, sexual freedom and gender quality. and that simply isn't going to happen. to hope or expect otherwise is to misread this pope misinterpret the las vegas gasy of his pred ses tors and misunderstand the callsy fide structure of the church itself. the pope mindful of money telling admirers from argentina, saying don't come to the vatican, give the money to the poor in your home country. >> symbolically the guy is exhilarating. traded in his armored mercedes suv for a ford for cuss. he's based himself with the poor. and when it comes to some of these social issues, especially gays, he's been -- he said things that are downright revolutionary in rhetoric. the question is, will this rhetoric, revolutionary rhetoric, translate into the deeper changes that people think are not just necessary for the church's survival but would be great moral goods. and on those, on the question of where the rubber meets the road you have these big questions damon draws out in the piece. in some ways francis is like obama. he's come in with all this great hope. seen as a transformational figure. there's all these expectations. but will those expectations translate too reality? he's confronting a bureaucracy and an organization that is in some ways as athem intocle to change as the u.s. congress. >> there's another example that damon brings out on holy thursday pope francis watched the feet of two women in juvenile detention, one a muslim breaking from the tradition that restricts the ritual to men and mostly to priests in the vatican entourage. lot of people will look at things like that and other things he's doing, what he said on the plane about, you know, not judging other people, that -- or trying to find god. that actually -- >> when you look at -- >> that is symbolic but it is powerful symbolism for a billion people in a church that actually, if this guy were a priest in argentina, that would be one thing. but how he lives, what he says, has a real impact in the direction of the church. >> absolutely. all these things are setting the wheels in motion for changes that over the decades and over the course of the next century, will have a powerful impact on the church. but the church faces a fairly immediate crisis. if you look at one very simple question, the question of how many priests fill their ranks and in the '70s there were about 60,000 priests in the united states catholic church. now it's -- the number is down to 39,000 and many of those guys are close to retirement age. the question is how do you replenish the ranks. >> how about letting the mayor in. i think it's fascinating this pope doesn't live in grand surroundings. he has a modest guest house. he says he just can't be alone. he doesn't like being alone. i go back and think about, you know, what we read in genesis where, you know, god said, man was not meant to be alone. how about letting -- >> right. it seems like he's -- his inclinations reside in that direction. his statements on the question of marriage have left the door open for the church to reconsider. but the whole bureaucratic process of reconsidering a question like that which seems to you and me to be pretty essential to the survival of the church, he's -- to get there, he would have to go through this very long complicated process. he has to bring along all these forces that are conservative. the teachings of the last two popes have put such a strong emphasis on sexual ethics and they've argued that if you pull at the church's teachings in one direction on the sexual questions then the whole fabric comes completely unwound. so yeah. >> frank, what do you think -- >> i think it needs some sort of papal intercession in order to recover from this abysmal start. your guys are off to a decent go. >> really good start. couple of important stops. we had a great weekend this weekend. all right. frank, thank you so much. >> thanks, joe. >> hope to see you in the studio soon. the issue of "the new republic" is out. thanks again, frank. one of the busiest actor in tv, star of two hit shows including "breaking bad" actor dean norris joins us next. you're watching "morning joe" brewed by starbucks. 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[ male announcer ] with 15 calories per serving and real cream, iand we're talkingl time with maria about the walmart low price guarantee. you got your list? let's go. if you find a lower advertised price they'll match it at the register. really... yeah, in a "jif". you ready? what?! that's the walmart low price guarantee backed by ad match. bring in receipts from your local stores and see for yourself. good and close. discover the new way to help keep teeth clean and breath fresh. new beneful healthy smile food and snacks. he'll love the crunch of the healthy smile kibbles. you'll love how they help clean. with soft, meaty centers, and teeth cleaning texture healthy smile snacks help keep a shine on his smile. it's dental that tastes so good. new beneful healthy smile food and snacks. ♪ it was you! all along, it was you! you son of a [ bleep ]! you drove into traffic to keep me from that laundry. >> calm down. >> that call, telling me marie was in the hospital, that was -- you kill ed her to save your sorry ass. eisenberg. >> he's lying. >> [ bleep ]. >> think. think where this is coming from. >> i swear to christ, i will put you under the jail. >> that was a scene from the season premiere of amc's "breaking bad." i don't know if you know this or not, dean and i, we went to middle school together. >> double dated at the prom, right? >> the the two girls had a good time too. i'm going to tell you something about dean that he'd never tell you. he's got the number one show on cable. what are you going to do? >> i'd never brag. >> t ball. that was unbelievable. let's talk first of all, we've got so much to talk about here, let's talk first of all, all about breaking bad. there's so many people i know respect say it's the best television show they've ever seen in their life, tv history. >> yeah. >> over "the sopranos," over "the wire," all this stuff. >> some great company. >> it is. >> what do you think? >> i think they're right. it's a great -- i mean, you know, obviously, it starts with the writing. it's one of the best-written shows i think ever. and ben skillegan who is the creator and writer is a man would -- the detail he attends to is just unbelievable, you know, everything, everything, from the costumes down to the cinema doi cinematography, he's awesome. >> did you ever see it coming? i remember when the show started, we had bryan cranston on here and everybody said, hey, "malcolm in the middle," that was a hit, and he sits here, starts telling us. so you're going to die and you're a drug dealer and -- i mean, could you ever imagine -- when did you figure out, hey, this is a rising star, i'm glad i'm holding on to it? >> right, you and everybody else thought that. they tried to sell this show to a -- all kinds of networks and nobody picked it up. >> amc's incredible. >> i said at the read-through, i said, bryan, thanks for the five-year job. because at the read-through, he was that character, that awesome. it was unbelievable. he was great. we all knew when we read the pilot it was a special show. when we saw it on the screen, at the screening, we're like, wow, you know, no one will ever match that. and they were able to -- how are they going to write a second episode? and they did. then it was like how are they going to write a second season, and they did. it was awesome. >> with this and "under the dome," you have two great shows. what's the secret sauce? how do you make a great show on tv these days? >> it starts with the writing. it's about characters, you know, you have to have characters that people care about. if you have that, i think that's what the show -- that's what makes a good show. >> you have amc and cbs. >> yeah, amc, is a small intense cable show. the cbs show is a big intense sci-fi stephen king/steven spielberg show. you either enjoy watching the characters or you don't. i think that's really the secret sauce for both of them. >> when these shows get so popular like "breaking bad," everybody at this table will talk about it and see it, even before you sit down with us. what superstars or icons do you know watch the show? in this world of social media, we get to find this stuff out. whereas people would find mail or whatever in the past. >> that used to be one of our favorite things when we were doing the show is to talk about who was watching our show. in hollywood, it's amazing, "breaking bad" was even at the beginning was the hottest show around. all the top producers. all the top, you know, directors. all love the show. michael mann, oprah winfrey, you name it. tom hanks. >> yeah, guess who watches our show. >> a lot of fun. >> one guy who is not big is do donny deutsch. donny gave his prediction for the finale when we had anna gun on the show. for some reason -- roll this clip. >> it ended last season where his brother-in-law who's a dea guy finally figure, out, wow, w.w. is walter white. i'm assuming that's a big thread. >> it's a huge thread. >> my guess is he becomes part of the empire at the end of the day. that's my guess. >> that's an interesting guess. >> donny deutsch ought to stick to advertising. that's what he does, right? >> exactly, yeah. so what are you going to do -- we're going to leave it there. what are you going to do as the season moves forward? any big plans? any big finale plans? how hard will it be to leave "breaking bad"? >> we already left it. we ended shooting in march, april. it was an emotional time. we were in new york doing a final tour of the pr stuff, and it really was emotional. because, you know, it's six years of your life. people have been married, they've been divorced. people have died. people have kids. it's a whole thing for six years. and being a great show. so we did that last -- couple weeks ago. it's sad. >> yeah. >> but you got "under the dome." >> under the dome. >> they're in your rearview mirror, baby. now it's "under the dome" for at least six years. >> as long as it's profitable for the foreseeable future. >> that scene where bryan cranston's staring at the crash. it's what it's like in his mansion. he's got all of these hit shows, man. that's great. congratulations. really great to have you here. >> thank you. >> "under the dome" airs on cbs tonight. at 10:00 p.m. 9:00 p.m. central. of course "breaking bad" airs on amc on sunday nights. dean, thanks a lot, congratulations. coming up next, we've got -- actually, lewis black is going to be on set, that's tomorrow. up next, british police are looking into new information related to the death of princess di. was it an accident or murder? we're going to go behind the grassy knoll to see when we return, "morning joe." peace of mind is important when you're running a business. century link provides reliable it services like multi-layered security solution to keep your information safe & secure. century link. your link with what's next. [ sneezing ] she may be muddling through allergies. try zyrtec®. powerful allergy relief for adults and kids six years and older. zyrtec®. love the air. and kids six years and older. peoi go to angie's listt for all kinds of reasons. to gauge whether or not the projects will be done in a timely fashion and within budget. angie's list members can tell you which provider is the best in town. you'll find reviews on everything from home repair to healthcare. now that we're expecting, i like the fact i can go onto angie's list and look for pediatricians. the service providers that i've found on angie's list actually have blown me away. find out why more than two million members count on angie's list. angie's list -- reviews you can trust. good morning. it's 8:00 a.m. on the east coast, 5:00 a.m. on west coast, as you take a live look at new york city. back with us on set, we have sam stein, thomas roberts and l.a. dodgers chuck todd in washington. here on the set, the editor and chief for the daily beast, tina brown. also the author of "the new york times" best-seller, "the diana chronicles." my gosh, tina, what the hell is going on be? the british police are examining new information related to the death of princess diana. and she died of course tragically in that car accident in 1997. and nbc's mandy clark is reporting this. >> reporter: controversy surrounded princess diana's death on august 31, 1997. nearly 16 years ago. and still grabs the headlines dramatic new claim splashed across the british papers. allegations that diana and her boyfriend, dodi al ffi fied wer murdered by a member of the special forces. the new information brought forward by new members of another sas soldier and passed on to police. scotland yard confirmed it received this new tip and is now assessing its credibility. it also stressed it has not reopened the investigation. skeptics question the claims and the timing. >> every year at the time of the anniversary of princess diana's death, there seeps to be fresh allegations that resurface. new revelations about how she was so-called murdered. but the problem is there's no evidence. >> reporter: meanmeanwhile, pri harry's back after spending last week in angola. walking in his mother's foot steps. his way of carrying on her charity work. perhaps her greatest legacy. princess diana visited the country in 1997. the iconic image, of her wearing protective gear in a minefield drew the world's attention to the suffering caused by land mines. it was one of her last big charity trips before her sudden death. conspiracy theories have continuously surrounded the death of the princess and her boyfriend but repeated investigations have been consistent. that their driver henry paul was drunk when he lost control of the car and hit a cement pillar in an underpass at 80 miles per hour while trying to lose the chasing paparazzi. >> conspiracy theories surrounding everything. i'm trying to convince my son this weekend that actually neil armstrong walked on the moon. so they continue. when you read this breaking other the wire this weekend, it's like scotland yard is actually taking it seriously? >> well, that's -- the only interesting part of it is this for the first time isn't coming from the crazed vengal quarter of dodi's father. he's the one who kept the inquest going. >> and always suggesting -- >> always kept saying he was killed. >> always kept saying it was a hit by prince philip. which was such a bizarre idea that prince philip would be able to order up this sas hit. i don't think there's any truth in it. one of the things that amazes me is how these same things keep coming in. it's like the old grassy knoll craziness. the flash theory. that the idea that this sas, you know, soldier, you know, disguised as a paparazzi could have flashed a strobe light into the eyes of the driver. the fact is operation pageant which was, you know, overseen by lord stevens of scotland yard who when i was researching the book i spent time with. he created this whole kind of laser computer reconstruction of this car crash. the fact is henry paul, the driver, lost control of that car before he got into the tunnel. he lost control because he mixed six drinks that the french love so much with triapid and prozac and so he was drunk, although he didn't look drunk. he was buzzed. not fully in control of his senses. he careened into this tunnel at 75 miles an hour. a tunnel which already had 15 deaths in the last few years. and a -- into this right-hand side. he swerved to avoid it. he ricocheted on one pillar, into the next, finally crashed into the 13th pillar in the tunnel. and crashed the car. now, one of the things that is interesting was the fiat uno, this car. no one could find it. in my investigations in the book, what came out, they did find the owner. he turned out to be an ingran immigrant. the reason he didn't come forward is because he didn't want to be mixed up in it. so he repainted his car and he disappeared. but he wasn't any kind of sinister figure. so all of these clues -- >> that's what he wants you to believe. >> right. masquerading as a vietnamese -- >> what about ambulances not getting quickly there? an ambulance pulls over on the side of the road and waits to go to the hospital that's further away than the closer hospitals to the scene? all of those -- >> that was all absolutely medically correct. the ambulance was having to crawl because she was undergoing all this incredibly delicate procedure in the ambulance where they had -- they were trying to stabilize her. if they'd gone any further, she would have died. they also were trying to get to the hospital which had all the equipment they needed to get her rescued. in they'd gone to the nearer hospital, they didn't have that equipment, didn't have those doctors. they were trying to get her to the place where she had maximum, you know, ability to be saved. >> how did prince philip get to you? you know prince philip is behind it all. >> yeah. >> you also have to thing he's sitting there saying, extern exterminate her. it's so bizarre. the truth is, it was a tragic series of hideous small things. to be a murder, all kinds of crazy variables would have had to have been true. nobody knew henry paul would take that route to her apartment. no one knew she was going to have a drunk driver. no one knew she was going to have that driver. all of these things are -- was so last minute that there was no way that murder -- >> i think the lesson is don't drink six cocktails and tail pro zach before you drive. >> or get into a car with someone. plus, final thing, she wasn't wearing a seat belt. the bodyguard was wearing a seat belt. incredibly. he buckled up himself. dodi and diana weren't wearing seat belts. why dodi died instantly and diana died very shortly afterwards. >> you do wonder why scotland yard even gave this any oxygen. >> i think maybe because they're so anxious for it to not look any kind of -- you know, that there's any sort of repression of a theory. they probably say they're looking into it. looking into it is not reopening the inquiry. it really isn't. >> the rnc of course has a new plan to win back the presidency. you heard about it this weekend. replace nbc and cnn's brian williams and anderson cooper with rush limbaugh and sean hannity. the "washington examiner's" reporting that the radio hosts are being looked at as 2016 debate moderators. meanwhile, the rnc will bar cnn and nbc from the debates because of the network's plans to air hillary clinton themed shows. while it was reported fox was in talks with nbc to produce the series, "the new york times" is now reporting the studio is not going to take part according to "the times," cbs and the fox network passed on picking up the miniseries and fox officials said that had nothing to do with politics and everything to do with profits. they didn't like the money deal. priebus defended the rnc's vote as part of the effort to take back the primary process from the last cycle. >> i'm trying to build a party that's year round. i'm trying to fix a data and digital operation. i'm trying to get a hold of a primary process and debate debacle that as you know i've called the traveling circus. i've got to protect this party and our nominees. look, if you're not going to have 23 debates, these guys are making it a lot easier for us to pare that down to a reasonable number. in front of people and entities that actually give a darn about the future of the republican party. >> you were also -- >> hey, chuck todd, what do you think about the developments this past weekend? >> well, look, if the rnc is trying to limit the number of debates, that's smart, because that will mean what, about half the republican field from 2012, if they didn't have the debates, they wouldn't have run, right? they simply ran for exposure to get a talk show or for exposure to get a radio deal or a columnist or a deal with fox or whatever. whatever it is their reasons are running. it wasn't really because they thought they had a viable shot. you know, one the things on the whole celeb ra ification of the presidential cycle is it has allowed for this underbelly of candidates, whether it's herman cain or dennis kucinich, people like that say, hey, i can show up, i get to be on national television, on various cable networks. if you do that, then that is smart tactical politics. now, the whole -- it is kind of funny. imagine if the rnc put the same effort they've been putting in this to get immigration reform passed. i think they might have gotten it done. >> fair point. >> i have a question because you probably know this better than anyone here. how much power does the rnc have over whether or not a candidate takes place? can the candidates just circumvent the rnc? >> it all depends if candidates do this. the only precedent there is 2004. and the dnc decided to play this role. and all of the folks that were running at the time agreed to it. now, that said so that meant the dnc decided -- they gave basically -- they gave a debate to every -- fox had one, nbc had a couple. one was on msnbc. abc. you know, they spaced it out. i think they did six over six months. so it was one a month. they chose the debate sites. all the candidates have to agree to it. i remember, there was still rogue forums. i remember moderating a forum, an aarp forum, in 2004. it was not a sanctioned debate. but five of the seven guys showed up. so you can -- it depends what the campaigns do. i think there's going to be motivation by the front-runner campaigns. by the real -- the peep that actually want to be the nominee. to allow the rnc to play this role. because they never want to have to say no. but they would love to have somebody else say, you know what, let's limit the number. >> you had an interesting point this weekend on "meet the press." you were saying that hillary clinton emerging as a front-runner is bad news for the obama administration. why? >> it's the timing of it. right. there's lame duck status happens to any second term president in two phases. one is in washington and the ongoing back and forth with congress. at some point, you sort of just run out of political capital. the president is running up against the clock on that over the next year. but then the second phase of course is are you leader your own party. and at some point, the outgoing president is no longer, you know, sort of a -- is a leader at large but is no longer the rallying point. and if you're barack obama, you want that to start as late as you possibly can. when you're watching all of this movement around hillary, whether it's the superpacks, whether its what hillary is doing with various speeches. that is something that accelerates that process. it's an unintended consequence. nobody is saying this is what hillary is trying to do or anything like that. but this is an unintended consequence. it is going to make it harder for barack obama to sort of be able to marshal resources. ofa is struggling enough as it is to prove itself as an entity outside a presidential campaign. having to compete with hillary clinton makes it even tougher. >> so tina, it's a problem obviously for barack obama because you're already having people line up, holding fund-raisers for hillary, promoting hillary to be president. >> i think there is the kind of curse of the front-runner situation for her now. this is just getting so much kind of focus on her. so much early, you know, garbage about her. so much, you know, anger about her. which will built. in a way, by the time that she runs, she'll be an old story again. which i do think is a problem. you can see the freshness a chris christie, if he were to be the nominee. a newer story, a fresher story. that was one of her problems last time. she felt like old news. i don't necessarily think it's so great for hillary clinton. >> i don't understand why she's out so early. i don't understand why they didn't take the entire year off. >> we all remember back to 2007. there was already clinton fatigue. remember when david gave his famous interview to "the new york times" and just ripped into the clintons. you could almost hear, you know, the entire democratic establishment quietly going "hear hear." because there was clinton fatigue. that was '07. i'm not good in math. went to university of alabama. we're number one again. >> where's anaheim? >> exactly. that was six years ago we were talking about clinton fatigue. we're going to hear about this for the next three years? i agree with all you guys. >> it was a thing going on for her when she left the state department. suddenly it's back into clinton land. don't thing that is great. obviously the huma stuff hadn't been good either. >> coming up, mayor bloomberg, can he go out on a high note? "new york times" reporter michael barboa and jim dwyer. some amazing pictures of "the times" yesterday. parts new york city before bloomberg and after bloomberg. quite a transformation. in just a few minutes, screenwriter of "game change" and "recount," danny strong will join us to success a wildly successful new film "the butler." we'll ask what it was like to work with oprah and forest whitaker. first, here's bill. you don't want to ask me what it's like to work with this guy. bill. >> or vice versa. let's talk about what happened over the weekend. we had a lot of flooding. cold, cloudy, miserable weather in the southeast. the bigger story was the southwest. brutally hot. one of the fires out there erupted and exploded. this is the beaver creek fire. this is rural, rugged terrain. it's kind of sporadic. it covered 100,000 acres. it's a huge area. there is over 1,000 firefighters on the ground trying to fight this one. it's been a beast so far. ten helicopters and 100 engins. thousands evacuates. it's in rural terrain. but, i mean, just a very difficult fire to fight. especially with the forecast today. to 95 and sunny. some gusty winds late in the afternoon. now, the southeast, i mean, the end of this week will be feeling like summer. it hasn't felt like it for much of this month of august. still raining in north carolina and virginia this morning. it's kind a light rain. it's kind of dreary. it's going to be kind of cool with the cloudy skies. as the week progresses, the warmth and the heat from the west will move across the country and yaareas like atlant you should be near 90 by friday. it's kind of interesting. southeast has been cooler than the northeast. one other spot in the country that will heat up, chicago, kansas city, and our friends in st. louis. get ready to start cranking the ac once again. you're watching "morning joe" brewed by starbucks. so i'm checking out the jetta. 34 hwy mpg. check. no-charge scheduled maintenance. check. and here's the kicker... 0% apr for 60 months. and who got it? this guy. and who got it? this guy. and who got it? this guy. that's right... 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"the new york times" looks at the bloomberg years in their special edition of the metropolitan section. with us now, two contributors to the special section. "new york times" reporter michael barboa and "times" columnist jim dwyer. yesterday was fascinating. front page, seeing certain parts of the city before bloomberg and after bloomberg. as you guys dug into it, all of the time he's been in office. michael, what was the prevailing theme that came out of the years? >> contradictions. which jim can speak to. really powerfully. but i took a look at a poll, for example, of how new yorkers feel after 12 years, and it is full of contradictions. i mean, i'll give you the best example. you ask people philosophically, do you like all the kind of nanny state measures that were taken, calorie counts, soda bans, these kinds of things? in theory, they tell you they were interference, they didn't improve our lives. it was so split. then you go one by one through them and almost across the board, overwhelming majority is they like being told what to do. >> when he came in, replacing a guy who was unpopular after eight years but was a strong mayor and extraordinarily transformative mayor, rudy giuliani. i for one didn't think he could follow giuliani. that he wasn't going to be strong enough. boy, proved me and a lot of other people wrong. >> yeah, giuliani had this big operatic volcanic personality. bloomberg is this guy kind of who comes at you in a plain brown wrapper. but he's very efficient. >> by the way, $23 billion brown -- >> 2 -- >> is it 27 now? >> you get his number low, he will go, i'm worth more than that. $27 billion wrapper. but yeah, he doesn't come across in person the same way obviously giuliani did. and far different leader than giuliani in the ways. >> yeah, i think that a lot of his -- he actually hired a very capable group of commissioners. and he more or less led them think on their own two feet. bloomberg didn't say build 200 miles bike lanes. the commissioner came in and did that. that's changed the streets. bloomberg didn't say necessarily i want to ban smoking in every restaurant and bar in new york city. when his health commissioner came to him and said, let's do this, bloomberg was on board with it. >> and about the impossible mayor of the possible. mayors rarely leave office in new york on affectionate terms. in the case of mr. bloomberg, a relationship that was always fraught and frayed. yet as he enters the final months, the full arc of his era is coming into view. mayors are forced to play the hands dealt them by history, the economy, the public, their allies, campaign contributors. as much as any mayor of modern new york, mr. bloomberg has been a transformative figure, a shaper, of his time. michael. >> take a look around the city. you had some photos up before of a simple place like columbus circle which was a barren public place which he has turned into a truly vibrant meeting place all other the city that rivals, you know, the clock at grand central. what jim said is so important. he completely insulated commissioners from the kind of criticism that would normally either change the way they behave or change the way a ma r mayor -- >> you look at all the remarkable changes. the one thing he couldn't push through, that jets stadium on the lower east side. >> you wanted that? >> yes, i wanted that. come on, you think i wanted to go over to queens on the train to get to the jets? >> i don't know. when i look at his legacy -- >> or jersey, i'm sorry. >> the jersey, not queens. i think of someone who's done for more public health. just the smoking ban and how that sort of had a domino effect for other cities going forward. and then you look at the gun control stuff. the environmental legacy. talk about how the reputation, the legacy that he leaves on public health alone. >> i think it's unique actually among mayors or any kind of local leader. >> sure. >> because you look at what happened, you know, sometime, you got to think about, you look at a movie, right, 15 years ago, you say, wow, i didn't realize the world changed so much in the last 15 years. maybe there weren't cell phones or whatever it was. bloomberg, when he came into office, i think this is something that began with him in a very profound and simple way. he didn't want people to be smokinging in bars or to be exposed to smoke in bars or restaurants where they worked. that's now the norm. everywhere you go. >> you're right, if you look at a '90s movie -- >>er eer everybody's got a cigarette. >> now wherever you go, you're shocked, anywhere in america, you see people lighting up. >> there's 48 countries that have adapted smoking bans of some sort. >> when the mayor gives his speeches, a lot of times he takes about how new york city's life expectancy is actually greater than the average of america. i think he said up to 85, 86 years of age. >> that's right. say public health distinguishes in more than any of other stuff. some of the physical changes are just things that are like photographs that have developed, right, somebody took the picture 15 years ago of the high line, and now we can see it. because that has taken a long time to emerge. that's true for a lot of physical developments. it's always true of mayors. the stuff that happened before them or started before them has emerged during their time. that's going to continue to happen with bloomberg. smoking is something that he started and that he quickly propagated through the whole world. >> one more thing, in the poll you wrote about, what struck me is just 3% of new yorkers said his policies favored the poor. that's a legacy i think is really impacting the mayoral race. >> poverty is not a word mike bloomberg used often. his policies have a fairly limited set of impacts. he'll talk about the personal money he put towards it. he'll talk about some of the programs he used. but his administration spoke of new york city to some degree, and he actually used these words, as a luxury product. where bringing in a lot of big businesses and corporations, making sure there was a lot of wealth in this city. that's an agenda that his would be successors are grappling with in a profoundly critical way. folks like bill debla blasio, t are running as the anti-bloomberg because they've read the poll numbers as telling them there's a huge amount of frustration with the fate of an underclass in new york that has grown under the bloomberg administration. >> you look at the poll numbers in "the new york times." approve, 49%. disapprove, 40%. after 12 years of running this city. that's pretty good. >> that's not bad. >> right? what was it, the ungovernable city, was it lindsey who said that? >> they may have written that during his time. >> a lot of people thought the city just couldn't be governed. it was unmanageable. michael bloomberg certainly we can say he's proven that wrong, right? >> we have huge vital communities coming into new york all the time. you have incredible immigration. brings a lot of energy to the entire city. not just manhattan. so it's really not just mayors who change things. it's the public. and that's what's happened here. >> so do you actually like to go out to jersey to see the jets play? >> no, but you don't think it would have made it a parking lot mess? >> bloomberg would have figured out a way. >> i guess, the impossible. >> if you're from the suburbs, it's bad. >> i don't mind going out to jersey that much. >> you know what, if harold ford were here, you know what he'd say, one word, healtl helipad, , helicopters in and out. one of these days, we won't have to go to jersey. >> god forbid you cross that bridge, right. >> where do you live? you don't even live around here! you don't even count. get out of here. go back to the 'burbs. which is everything but manhattan. thank you so much. we appreciate it. jim, thank you as well. it's of course a great ret retrospective of michael bloomberg's time as new york city mayor. make sure you read it online at least. coming up, the voice behind oprah and forest whitaker. emmy award-winning screenwriter of "the butler" join us next. peace of mind is important when you're running a successful business. so we provide it services you can rely on. with centurylink as your trusted it partner, you'll experience reliable uptime for the network and services you depend on. multi-layered security solutions keep your information safe, and secure. and responsive dedicated support meets your needs, and eases your mind. centurylink. your link to what's next. bob will retire when he's 153, which would be fine if bob were a vampire. but he's not. ♪ he's an architect with two kids and a mortgage. luckily, he found someone who gave him a fresh perspective on his portfolio. and with some planning and effort, hopefully bob can retire at a more appropriate age. it's not rocket science. it's just common sense. from td ameritrade. you may be muddling through allergies. try zyrtec® for powerful allergy relief. and zyrtec® is different than claritin® because it starts working faster on the first day you take it. zyrtec® love the air. ♪ every now and then i get a little bit tired ♪ ♪ of craving something that i can't have ♪ ♪ turn around barbara ♪ i finally found the right snack ♪ ♪ picasso painted one of his master works at 56. doris taerbaum finished her first marathon at 50. not everyone peaks in their twenties. throughout their lives. passion keeps them realizing possibilities. an ally for real possibilities. aarp. find tools and support at aarp.org/possibilities. something special's going on down here, dad. >> what's so special about another colored man in chains? what are you doing with my hard-earned money? are you even in school? >> i'm trying to change the way negroes are treated -- >> you're breaking the law. that judge just sentenced you to 30 days in the county work horse. >> if i can't sit at any counter i want, i might as well be dead. we're fighting for our rights. >> what rights are you talking about? hey! who do you think you're talking to? i brought you're into this world, i'll take you out of it. >> wow. "the butler" opened strong at the box office this weekend. the civil rights film starring oprah winfrey and forest whitaker. opened at number one. pulling in $25 million. with us now the man who wrote the screenplay for the film, danny strong. we were just talking about this film. i mean, double the projections of what everybody expected. it's on its way to being a big, big -- it's already a big film? it's extremely exciting. so difficult to get an adult drama made in hollywood. you have a movie like this come out and do extremely well. hopefully it will be encouraging to other investors. >> you look at this film. you look at 42. you look at "the help." there certainly seems to be an interest in this chapter of american history. the civil rights chapter of american history. >> it's an extremely powerful dynamic chapter. it's extremely ripe for dramas, for movies. i think there should be more of these films. it's the story of our country. of who we are. of how we got to where we are now. i think you'll see are mo of them after this. >> you actually to better understand what you were writing about, i understand you actually took a trip and you went on the same route, traveled by the freedom writers to have a better understanding of that time. >> yeah, i took a road trip through the south, through alabama and up to help first and i went to montgomery, selma, birmingham, memphis. all these major civil right sites that are portrayed in the movie. just being there was an extremely powerful experience. montgomery is such a rich city. it's not just the civil rights movement but the civil war as well. this is one of the centers of american history over the last 150 years so -- >> danny, how typical is it -- with "42" and "the help." and now this being a success. this has been a long time coming. you have to be so emotionally and professionally invested for so long. it has to be rewarding to see the big payoff, of it doing so well. >> we're elated. everyone's through the roof. lee daniels and i were calling each other all day friday. when it was number one, we couldn't believe it. our producer who took over from our legendary producer who passed away, has made it a mission to get this movie made in his memory. for it to get made and to succeed so far beyond our expectations is exciting. >> even the curiosity factor of steve be jobs, you have a matt damon big budget vehicle as well. the thing that fascinates me the most is i'm amazed that this story hasn't been told before. i mean, this man's life is amazing. and yet we -- i hadn't heard nothing about it. will haygood's story, i didn't read those either. are you surprised this had not company to the front yet? >> well, will haggard really found egene allen. it was a terrific piece of reporting. he found 50 different people trying to find this man, ejune eugene allen, trying to find him. it really captured people's attention. so it's long overdue. now, in the film, the character's name is cecil gaines. he's inspired by eugene allen. >> it's really historical fiction, right? >> all the history is true but the family itself we're centering around is a composite of many different people i interviewed who worked at the white house. >> how hard was it for you to write the fight scene like we saw between father and son. very emotional scenes for oprah and the back story on her life as the wife and the backbone of this character. how were you able to get in all of their heads to come up with how they would, you know, speak and the interaction, the fights? >> sure. well, it's the same i do on any other project i work on. do a lot of research. and then you just go for it. and you just try to do the best you can. >> now, will haygood actually wrote the book on the white house butler who the film's based on obviously. will joined us recently on "morning joe" and he told us about the first time in his meeting with that butler. take a look. >> after 57 phone calls, a man picked up the telephone. i said, hey, this is will haygood with the "washington post" and i'm trying to reach mr. eugene allen who worked at the white house. and he said, you're speaking to him. we got to the center of the basement and turned on light. and when we did, all of these archives, photographs, letters from the president, from harry truman and ronald reagan, jack kennedy, just a sweep of history. and i said, mr. allen, now, are you sure no one has ever written a story about your life and times? >> he took a step closer to me and he said, if you think i'm worthy, you'll be the first. >> wow. and the rest, as they say, is history. before you go, i got to ask, why does john call you, quote, the angry jockey? >> that's one of the nicer things he calls me. >> danny of course wrote the screenplay for "game change" and you had to work with heilman, which is very hard, to climb through all those mounds of cocaine and, you know, acid to get to him. but you worked with him. yeah, the angry jockey. >> i'm also an actor. when i first met then, i was auditioning for a part on "luck," for a jockey who was an angry jockey. and i told him i just auditioned for this role of an angry jockey and so he took that to mean that's going to now be my new nickname from him. it's been an amazing three years of being called the angry jockey from john heilman. >> get ready, "game change 2." >> i'm very excited, we'll see. >> we're excited you here, we really appreciate it. >> good seeing you. >> coming up next, mark zuckerberg's facebook page gets hacked. details on why he was a target of a cyberattack. when "morning joe" returns. how do you do a summer clearance event the dodge way? 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[ male announcer ] share more. save more. at&t mobile share for business. ♪ as your life changes, fidelity is there for your personal economy, helping you readjust along the way, refocus as careers change and kids head off to college, and revisit your investments as retirement gets closer. wherever you are today, fidelity's guidance can help you fine-tune your personal economy. start today with a free one-on-one review of your retirement plan. it's time for business before the bell now with cnbc's kelly evans. kelly. >> good morning. >> jpmorgan, there's been a lot of incomings lately. it looks like another one. how much trouble can jpmorgan be? >> a lot of focus today. we'll keep an eye on prices once we open here. jpmorgan under scrutiny. a couple of international bodies as well. this weekend, "the new york times" reporting that the line that jpmorgan put in its latest quarterly reports about people looking into its dealings in hong kong had to do with the fact that they hired princelings, in other words, the offspring of state-owned company officials, into its bank. the real question, not whether there was something wrong in doing that, because, by the way, we know this has been a long-standing practice in a lot of parts of the world. but whether, in fact, by doing so, jpmorgan then won a lot of business in china. so that's the matter that's being looked into right now apparently by u.s. authorities. it's just the latest. as you mentioned, in particular, a lot of of ddifferent investig into this company. jamie diamond has kept his ceo role. they're going through the dealings. even going back to last year when the sec was trying to get it to admit wrongdoing, so a lot of different things coming at this company. >> a lot of incoming. let's talk about housing. some housing numbers out. >> exactly. we've got jpmorgan we're going to keep an eye on. the broader landscape is we're coming off a week that was the worst so far for markets this year. it has something to do with the fact we were also at record highs just a few weeks ago. so some correction or some reprising perhaps due. but also the fact there were a lot of retailers who were reporting some worrisome signs about the consumer. >> really? >> you probably saw this in the headlines. whether it's the macy's of the world missing estimates. some big box department stores saying they're not seeing the growth they were expecting for the back to school season. >> we didn't read those in the headline because in our business around here, we just don't read news. after we -- >> surely you at least saw the headlines on it. >> no, no, because unless they were like, you know, running across the bottom of "caddyshack" or "the three stooges." >> suggesting people are on vacation and watching different kinds programming? >> no, it's us, i'm just suggesting we don't read headlines. but we did, though, somebody did tell us, maybe it was one of those "three stooges" chat rooms, somebody told us that zuckerberg's facebook page was hacked. tell us about that. >> here's an interesting one. >> we often know in the news business, they'll say show it, don't tell it. that's what a palestinian programmer did when he was trying to raise facebook's attention about a flaw in their software that would let you post on the wall of someone who you aren't friends with. so this palestinian programmer said, guys, you know, i'm trying to raise this issue, there is a security concern here. he tried to report it through their white hat program. but he was basically ignored. so he hacked mark zuckerberg's wall and wrote on it, i'm sorry to do this, but i wanted to show to you that even though we're not friends i can take advantage of this. you guys have a problem. >> wow. >> and not so many words -- >> that's one way to get his attention. and ours. as i just told you, hard to get our attention on any news item. >> now we know how, we just have to hack your facebook page and write on your wall. check out what macy's just said about the u.s. consumer. >> exactly, kelly, see, look at this, why she's doing this, amazing. what are you following today? >> i got to say, today it's really going to be just a question of federal reserve. the jackson hole meeting this week. the jockeying for the position as who's going to be head of the fed. i know we've already been talking about it to death. hugely important though. a lot has to do with what you're covering, the debt ceiling/government shutdown debate. more concern about that, the fed, what's going on in egypt as well. we have plenty to cover here on cnbc. >> all right, very good, kelly, cnbc's kelly evans. we greatly appreciate it. and appreciate your patience with us. >> have a good one. >> all right, you, too. so prince william opens up for the first time about being a new father. the new sound out just this morning. and we're not going to play it, instead, we're going to be showing you clips from "caddyshack." i'm joking! iand we're talkingl time with diane about the walmart low price guarantee, backed by ad match. you got your list? let's go! look at that price! i like that! they need those for school. wow! that's the walmart low price guarantee backed by ad match. save time and money getting your kids ready for school bring in ads from your local stores and see for yourself. a quarter million tweeters is beare tweeting. and 900 million dollars are changing hands online. that's why hp built a new kind of server. one that's 80% smaller. uses 89% less energy. and costs 77% less. it's called hp moonshot. and it's giving the internet the room it needs to grow. this&is gonna be big. hp moonshot. it's time to build a better enterprise. together. the interpretation of the imagery is this was a modern monarchy. was it that we were reading too much into it? is it just you doing it your way? >> i think so. i'm just doing it the way i know. if it's the right way, then brilliant. if it's the wrong way, well, i'll try and do it better. i'm quite -- i'm reasonably head strong about what i believe in. i've got fantastic people around me who give me great support and advice. >> that moment when you came up with the car seat, i mean, we had some warning you might be doing that. fathers around the planet will be cursing you for doing it so easily. >> believe me, it wasn't my first time. i know there's been speculation about it. i had to practice. i was terrified i was going to do some -- it was going to fall off or it wasn't going to close properly. i had actually practiced. >> all right, coming up next, what, if anything, did we learn? 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[ female announcer ] only aveeno daily moisturizing lotion has an active naturals oat formula that creates a moisture reserve so skin can replenish itself. aveeno® naturally beautiful results. welcome back to "morning joe." a nice bump-in shot. a picture that carly took, mika's daughter. the family likes to go up to northeast harbor while mika summers through the south of france. it works out very well. time to talk about what we learned tlearn ed today. >> what didn't i learn? a-rod, sympathetic character. sam stein loves royal baby talk. >> you do love that. >> i learned today birthday of my favorite man in the world, my dad, happy birthday, dad. >> that's a nice one. >> not your birthday. >> yeah, dad. >> i learned

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