Would just stop, and i would go, take a couple of big breaths and look around and i would see the people and i would say, man, is this not fun . Is this why i am here . And it would energize me to finish the tournament. I mean, to me that is why i was there. I mean, to me, the finish at noon on sunday and finished 30th is something i have no desire to do. Right. But to come down to the stretch of a Golf Tournament and have a chance to win that Golf Tournament and be there, enjoy and have fun with those people and yourself and the competition with your fellow competitors, that is why we play the silly game, thats why we love it. Rose an encore presentation, Jack Nicklaus for the hour. Next. Funding for charlie rose was provided by the following. Captioning sponsored by Rose Communications from our studios in new york city, this is charlie rose. Jack nicklaus is widely regarded as the greatest golfer to ever play the game, he won a record 18 majors, he burst on to the scene in the 1950s with a mix of power and finesse that would revolutionize golf, the great bobby jones famously remarked that nicklaus plays a game of which i am not familiar. Nobody has been a masters champion more than nicklaus, in 1986 at age 46 he won his sixth green jacket, making him the oldest player to ever win a major, this year, marks the 50th anniversary of his first win at the augusta national, last week i visited him at his home in north palm beach, florida. Anything that you want in life you didnt get . If it is, i dont know what it is. These are the things that testify to the material things. These are toys. Rose but inside is a place where your wife, barbara, this is a remarkable marriage you have had. A great time, we live in the same house now. Rose it was when you were a sophomore in college. I went, and met barbara in a class. Rose and after that . Then we dated and got married, and we got married, engaged over 19, married when we were 20, we had our first child after she got out of college when she was 21, and jackie is now 51 years old. The week of the honeymoon did you play golf . Well, those stories barbara had such a great honeymoon we got married on saturday, we drove sunday to hershey, pennsylvania. Rose right. And we played she got to see Hershey Country Club on monday morning, which was in columbus, so we went there and went to new york and we went down to the, and pesky, hey, mickey, you have room . So it was pouring down rain, there were three people on the golf course that day, me, barbara and my caddy. Honestly. Rose and you wanted to play. And i played, and so after a couple of days, we were in two weeks in astor, no longer there, we saw camelot, and we, you know, went to dinner, and the things honeymooners do. And she said lets go some place else. Where did you want to go . I have never been to atlantic city. And we were right by the golf course. And she saw it from the outside, and david took her around the property, and peeked over a few gates where she could watch me play, at pecan valley, and finally the next day, she said, she was now we have seen the boardwalk, she said lets go home, so we went home and that was our honeymoon. Rose we begin by looking back 53 years ago in the 1960 u. S. Open. You might have won the u. S. Open. Uhhuh. Rose but you didnt. Incidentally that was the best thing that ever happened to me. Rose why . Not winning. Rose why . Well, i learned so many lessons, i got to play with hogan, i saw how to finish a tournament, i learned from the mistakes i made, if i had won that tournament i would never have found all the mistakes i made which i never really repeated in my career. Rose like what kind of mistakes . Oh, like i had a, one shot lead but i had been leading after nine holes, nine holes to play, at the end of 12 holes, six holes to play i had a one shot lead, i looked at the leader board, started worrying about hogan, palmer, crow, cherry, sue jack, those are the ones, and i was five under and i got nervous over the next hole and i had a little i had a 12foot putt for birdie and i had a ball mark in my way and write have the presence of mind to know that i could fix a ball mark, i know it wasnt mine but you are not thinking clearly, so i three putted that and three putted and 16 i missed eight footer at 17 and bogeyed 18 to lose that tournament, you know, arnold won the tournament thats fine. Hogan, he selfdestructed on 17 and 18, but, you know, all those things, if i had won that tournament i would have gone, oh boy i am good and wouldnt have learned the lesson and wouldnt have learned how to do Different Things and it really was one of the greatest things that happened in my career, a great experience playing with hogan. Rose why . Oh, he was unbelievable ballstriker. He hit to the previous 18 greens in regulation, he hit the second hole, every green in the second round, in the first 34 holes i played with him the last day, he hit every green in regulation, 52 greens in inflation. He was a machine. And i mean, he couldnt have been nice tore play with, he was just he played just like i did. You know, he gave me a few nice things to say and didnt really talk a lot and he talked a little bit, whe when it got to e his time to playful to it was all business, sort of what i was. I was always business when it was my turn to play and what i was trying to do but i tried to be pleasant inbetween. Hogan was pleasant inbetween and it was, he was the kind of guy i enjoyed playing with. Rose as good a ballstriker as anybody in golf . I would say one of the best and trevino. Rose pure ballstrikers. Uhhuh. Rose so in 63, you go to the masters. Go to the masters. Rose and people are asking the question, can he validate what he did at the u. S. Open . Uhhuh. Rose this guy . How did you approach it . I played masters in 59, 60, 61, 62, i felt i was really in a position to play well in 62, because i came very close in 60, 61 as an amateur, and 62, i didnt play very well, i finished 14th and i said, that is not very good tournament for me. And so, you know, going into 63, actually, 1963 i didnt know what was going to happen because i hurt my hip earlier in the year, and i was in San Francisco and i hit a second shot into the green in the proam at lucky international, which was harding park and i couldnt hardly walk by the time i got to the green, and i went and played the next day and missed the cut. I could hardly walk, i went down to see dr. Wagger, a 49er doctor and he injected my hip, and he said, come on back, i want you to come back on monday morning, i want to do another injection before you go, i came back and he gave me another injection on monday morning, i went to palm springs and won the tournament but i couldnt play left or right and i had to play around it and i proceeded to have 25 injections in my hip during the next month, ten weeks. And zoo finally, my hip got all right but during that period of time i couldnt swing into it, i learned how to play right to left, because i could play around my hip. And so i went to augusta knowing that i never played rightleft before but i could play rightleft if i had to because i did all spring, i went there with confidence and i felt like i would play and shot 74 the first round, not a very good round but i came back with 66, in the second round, put me in great position, good position to be right in what was going on, and, you know, i ended up finishing it out. Rose but i am told that augusta favors a hook right to left. Yes if you are right handed. Rose all of a sudden thats what you had. All of a sudden thats what i had and i never played augusta was always not that difficult a course for me but there was always half a dozen shots that really needed to be played left to, right to left and i couldnt play them because i didnt have confidence and playing all spring gave me the confidence. Rose do you remember putting on the green jacket . I do, sort of. I think rose because arnie was giving it to you. You will enjoy this story. I went in, and they didnt have they grabbed a coat out, a 46 long and i am a 43 regular. So the sleeves are down to here and the coat is down to my knees and so after i won the tournament, and it was supposedly my jacket, i came back the next year and they said, well, you know, we dont have a jacket, so they gave me tom dewey, exgovernor of new yorks jacket, for the next ten years i wore tom deweys jacket and never got my own jacket, never gave me a jacket. I mean, i won six masters and never got a green jacket. Finally in 1998, i am sitting down with jack stevens, and we are talking about the tournament, honoring me at the tournament with the drinking fountain they put at the 17th tee, and i said, he said, well, i told him the story about the jacket, he says you mean we have never given you a green jacket . I said no. Six masters. I thought i was going to get one but i never have gotten one so i went home, after practicing i went home and came back and there was a note this my locker, you will go to the pro shop and get your green jacket. So in 1998 i got my first green jacket. Rose now where was bobby jones . Well, when i first met jones was in 1955, he was speaking at the my issues u. S. Amateur i was 15 years old in richmond, virginia and he then had two canes that he walked with, he really didnt walk very far, by the time i got to the masters in mean pivot nine, he was in a wheelchair, and i really enjoyed his company. There was a note in my locker when i got there, and he says, he was inviting my father and me down to his cabin to talk. I thought that was very, very nice and he did it every year. There is a little note every year. Rose he put mitt your locker. He put it in my locker and i thought that was very nice. Rose but there was a time he came to watch you play. Rose much earlier . And that was the first u. S. Amateur, spoke at the banquet and saw me hit a couple of shots on the golf course that day, and he came to me after the banquet and says young man, i want to watch you play tomorrow so i was playing bob gardner who was a very good player from california and new york, and bob, had bob one down after ten holes, and all of a sudden here comes this cart down the fairway, i had been looking for it all day, and, oh, absolutely, and as i got to 11 i went bogey, bogey, double bogey and lost all three holes to gardner, my dad, or bob jones turned to my dad and said, charlie, i dont think i am doing jack any good, i am out of here. So anyway, that was my first meeting. Rose but he was who he wanted you to be. He was terrific. I loved h he was my dads heo growing up. My dad watched, my dad was hike 12 years old but watched jones at the opened in 1926. He came back to ryder cup in 1931 and my dad then was 18 years old, i guess, and had the ryder cup and my dad was walking and my dad looked a lot like jones he parted his hair close to the middle and that kind of stuff, and he said, hey, mr. Jones, we will take you into the clubhouse, well my dad didnt know what he was talk about, he was escorted in the clubhouse, 18yearold kid and they thought he was bob jones. So 1963, didnt win in 1964, i won in 1965, and that year, i had broken the record and shot 641 round and 271, broke hogans record by three shots, and he said, he said, then, mr. Nicklaus you play a gym of which i am not familiar. Meaning obviously a game that he had not seen the likes of, which was very, very flattering saying that, you know, here i played better than anybody he had ever seen play. Rose what you added to the game at that time was power. I added power. I definite i never liked being a power player. I always had power available. I love short golf courses. I love shot making course, i love to cut the ball and i love to play the shots. But i had the power and i had it available, and when i wanted to use it, you know, i had it and that was a tremendous advantage. And particularly at augusta, there were several holes you went ahead and did it and took advantage of it. Rose you played with power as well as finesse and thats the job because today everybody plays with power. The game when i was playing was about ten to 20 percent power and 80 percent shot making, today the game is about 80 percent power an about 20 percent shot making. Rose this is what you said, i added power, i was the first player to play with real power and i was successful and was able to play with at this mess today. Today they all play with power so i took the game at that time in a different direction. I did. I was probably the first, as he say, power hitter who was successful. I mean, certainly whoever guys hit the long before me, but i guess my ability to hit the ball with control and hit it long was what people hadnt seen. Arnold famously said the big guy is out of the came, we better start running. A. That was the open in 1962,ndd after that he said, the big guy is out of the cage, you better watch out. And so arnold, arnold has been terrific to me, i like arnold an awful lot. He never treated me as a younger guy and just an upstart. He always treated me as an equal, and i always appreciated that and i have always i have always enjoyed his company. Rose and in fact you shared an agent. Mark mccormick. Rose mark mccormick. The masters, it is said, asks every question of your game. It tests every part of a golf game. Well, that is the idea of what a championship golf is all about, to be able to use every club in your bag and be able to fight and take command of all of the conditions that you might play. You might play with wind or firm greens or difficult short game, the masters is the first of the ones that actually says, hey, i have got a test for you, see if you handle it. You dont play your opponent, you play the course. I always lay the course and me. Actually. Rose you play yourself. I am my opponent, the only person i am in control of is me and i cant control anybody else and what they are doing, and so it is the golf course and me and what can i do on that golf course . Thats what i always did, and to me, you had to learn i have got a lot of young kids that come to me today and they ask me how i played and what i did, i said the most important thing you can do is learn who you are and what your abilities are, what your shortcomings are and what your long suit is, if you can take advantage of your long suit and minimize your shortcomings, you know, you can be a really good player. As long as you play smart and play within yourself you will be a good player. Rose you always said you love the precision of the game more than the power of the game. Yes, i did. I always, have i love precision, to me it is always more pun to play a really interesting little cut shot into a green or a little high, soft draw or a little bump and run or something. Those were pun shots. Rose you see the club as an extension of your hands . I see the club what i am playing golf with, the golf club and i like to feel and try to figure out how do i do i visual lies what i can do, and i female what my swing is, and if i can have the golf club in my hands in a way that i feel like i can perform the shot i want to perform, thats what i try to do. Obviously it takes practice to do that and you learn how to do it, and you learn where your hands need to be and where the club needs to be and how you can put it in, but to me that was the fun of the game. The fun of the game was being able to outsmart theful to cart, outsmart yourself and play within yourself and make sure the golf club is doing what you want it to do, to control the golf ball. So if you needed more power you had it. Playing within yourself meaning you shouldnt do something uh you should dont if you went to the 15th hole in augusta and standing back 250 yards and you are saying, well, you know, i am in good position in the tournament here, but, yo, you know, i think i cat home, what are my chances of getting home . Five out of ten . Not very good odds. I said, i dont like that, now if i hit it down 20 yards further and sitting with a two or three iron in my hand, then i am saying, mmm, 19 times out of 20 i will put the ball on the green or right around and have control, those are theed zero, i dont want 5050, i want the 19 out of 20, and i am going to try to make sure that 20th doesnt happen an that is playing within yourself. Rose and it is also playing smart. Most people believe that you hit a one iron better than anybody had ever hit a one iron. And i love the one iron. I just love it, because of all of the things i could do with it, and when people say why didnt you carry a four wood instead of a one ierp, four wood is in the air and too much in the elements, a one iron, i could always control the elements by keeping it down or hooking it, and i go back and look at maybe my three favorite shots that i ever hit, are one iron shots, 67, u. S. Open, pebble beach in 72 or the masters in 75, and 15, all one iron shots and, oh, was that fun. I love, when i hit a good shoti really loved it, it got me charged up and excited. That was fun. Rose but what was it about you andful to that everybody said, we are going to a new era . Well, that would be pretty difficult for me to answer. I was a 23yearold kid, and in mean 63, and, you know, my whole goal was to go out and play the game i knew how to play, play it to the best of my ability, and try on the best at it that i could be. Obviously, the u. S. Open fell to me in the 1962, a masters in 1963, and i always i always tried to climb a mountain, i always felt like, you know, here i am, there is a lot of other guys out there that are awfully good, but all of a sudden, i thought i must be better than i think i am, gee, lets just keep playing an lets just keep trying to get better and thats what i did most of my career, so i never really thought about that i was chaining something. Rose this is from Johnny Miller who said, the difference between jack and me is when i get to the top of the mountain i stopped, advantage would simply say, where is the next higher mountain to climb . You were constantly thinking what is next . I did that all my career. I always wanted to get better and obviously there was a certain point in my career but it wasnt until i was in my 40s sometimes that i felt like, you know, i dont think i am going to climb any higher mountains but i had a long run and i was very i had a lot of fun doing that. Rose 18 majors came in second, 19 times. That is bad, i got beat too many times. Rose why do you think that was . Well i think it is because of the way i played. I dont think that i played conservatively, although some people might have said that. I think i played to try to play, do the best i could do, prepare myself the best i could and do the best i could within myself. And i always felt like, you know, you have got 100 other guys or more playing against you, and there are going to be weeks where you play your best and Somebody Just plays better and so i just accepted that. Even though obviously i didnt like losing. But i didnt try to i never tried to i couldnt be in a position to shoot myself out of the tournament. I always felt, i look at tiger coming along now, and i see tiger coming down the stretch and through most of his first ten wins or so, and, you know, tiger didnt have to do anything, he knew that all he had to do was play within himself and everybody else