Transcripts For KQED PBS NewsHour 20150918

Major funding for the pbs newshour has been provided by and by the alfred p. Sloan foundation. Supporting science, technology, and improved Economic Performance and Financial Literacy in the 21st century. Support also comes from Carnegie Corporation of new york. A foundation created to do what Andrew Carnegie called real and permanent good. Celebrating 100 years of philanthropy at carnegie. Org. And with the ongoing support of these institutions this program was made possible by the corporation for public broadcasting. And by contributions to your pbs station from viewers like you. Thank you. Ifill the word from the fede Interest Rates arent going anyw the announcement ended weeks of speculation, but wall street wasnt sure what to make of the news. The Dow Jones Industrial average lost 65 points to close at 16,675. The nasdaq rose four points. And the s p 500 slipped five. Well hear some of what the fed had to say, and examine its reasons, after the news summary. The flashpoint in the crisis eng fresh scenes of chaos. Thousands of people poured into the country, at a key Border Crossing with serbia, after hungary closed its border yesterday. Jonathan miller of independent Television News reports from the scene. Reporter on the croatian front of the crisis threatening to overwhelm this continental, even riot police proved hopelessly unable to contain the onward surge of refugees and migrants. Hours waiting for a train which never came in blazing heat with insufficient water and in a total information vacuum was too much for the multitude who streamed across the serbian border into the European Union in the past 24 hours alone. The desperation here is incredible. Theyve been pushing women through and man handling little children over their heads to get them out of this crush. This chaos the knockon effect of the closure of the gates to hungary 100 miles northeast. Its been obvious for days that a new route would open up through the western balkans, but somehow no one had expected this. The u. N. Refugee agency was nowhere to be seen, the handful of croatian red cross workers were stretched beyond their limits. Women fainted, children became separated from their parents, but police did not use their batons. From early morning, fresh arrivals have streamed across the fields to the station just 500 meters inside croatia. Thousands crowded on to the railway tracks. Theyve been told the train was coming to take them to zagrab. Many here acutely aware that in western europe, where theyre headed, there are large numbers of people who do not want to let them in. We want to live in peace because we leave syria to live in peace in europe. Reporter as the temperature rose, so did the frustration. No sign of any train. Croatias interior minister turned up. Are you overwhelmed . Absolutely, yes. Because this country in this moment, the figures are very important. During the nine months croatia has 1,500 Illegal Immigrants altogether. We have in this 24 hours 6,500, and you ask me are we overwhelmed. Yes. Absolutely yes. Reporter he said he spoke to the u. N. Refugee agency to inform them this was their problem now. After weeks and sometimes months on the road, this International Mass migration is unstoppable. There has been barbwire and tear gas, water cannon, boat capsizes, thirst, hunger and exhaustion, but they keep on coming, and they keep on keeping on. Ifill austria and slovenia h checks ahead of an expected surg traveling through croatia. In south sudan, a truck carrying killing more than 100 people. It happened in a town west of the capital, juba, as people were trying to siphon fuel. Officials say a crowd had gathered around the truck, when someone lit a cigarette. Meanwhile, twin suicide bombings at least 23 people and wounded n the bombers blew themselves up at Police Checkpoints in mainly shiite sections of baghdad. The Islamic State group claimed responsibility. Thousands in chile spent the day after a powerful earthquake stru at least 10 people were killed. The quake had a magnitude of 8. 3, so strong that was felt across much of south america. Today, people in small towns along and near the Pacific Coast picked through what was left after the quake and small tsunamis hit. translated we never imagined the water could do so much damage. The earthquake didnt do that much damage; it was the water. It was the tsunami that destroyed part of our lives. It destroyed our memories, pictures. Ifill more than a million pe evacuate their homes, but most o major damage. The military in burkino faso sei shortcircuiting a democratic tr instead, the army installed a general with close ties to a former president who was ousted last year. Troops then broke up attempts to protest the coup. Hospitals filled with victims of the street clashes. At least three people were killed, and dozens were wounded. Back in this country, two more b northern california. That makes five People Killed in two major wildfires in recent days. The latest victims died in the socalled valley fire raging near napa valley, north of san francisco. And in southern utah, the death toll hit 19 in mondays flash floods. Search teams discovered another body today. An american soldier accused of d went before a military judge tod Sergeant Bowe bergdahl disappeared from his post in 2009 and was held by the taliban for five years before being exchanged for five taliban commanders. The hearing at fort sam houston, in san antonio, will decide if bergdahl is court martialed. The three americans who helped f train bound for paris, got a white house welcome today. President obama posed for pictures with Airman First Class spencer stone, Army Specialist Alex Skarlatos and anthony sadler, and thanked them for confronting a wouldbe gunman. They represent the very best of america, american character, and, you know, its these kinds of young people who make me extraordinarily optimistic and hopeful about our future. Ifill the men were also give they already received the legion of honor medal, the highest award in france. U. N. Health agencies report malaria deaths have fallen 60 in the last 15 years. That means more than 6 million lives saved. The vast majority of them are children in africa. Officials also say the disease is far from eradicated. There have already been 214 million new cases just this year. Still to come on the newshour, what the Federal Reserves decision on Interest Rates means for american highlights from last nights republican debate. And much more. Ifill its been seven years since the Federal Reserve took the unusual step of lowering Interest Rates to near zero. More extraordinary, rates have not moved up since then. For much of this summer, the expectation was that this would be the day the fed would announce a change. But once again, the fed decided to leave rates where they were. Jeffrey brown picks up the story from there. Brown expectations began to change just weeks ago following market turmoil and worries over china. During a press conference this afternoon, Federal Reserve chairwoman janet yellen spoke of those factors, but also said a hike may still be in the cards. Most participants continue to think that Economic Conditions will call for or make appropriate an increase in the federal funds rate by the end of this year. Of course, there will always be uncertainty. We cant expect that uncertainty to be fully resolved, but in light of the developments that we have seen and the impacts on financial markets, we want to take a little bit more time to evaluate the likely impacts on the United States. Brown some insight now into the this decision and where the fed may head soon. Krishna guha is the vice chairman of evercore isi, an independent Investment Banking advisory firm. From 2010 to 201 he served as the head of communications at the new york Federal Reserve. Nice to see you. Brown the fed made clear the recent turmoil was a factor here. I think thats right, but its not just so much the turmoil in the markets per se. The fed is saying it looks like the market weakness was driven by concerns about china and the emerging markets, and if thats right, thats something the fed should be paying attention to, not market volatility from day to day, but concerns about global growth. Thats really what they focused on. Brown the release today said the fed is monitoring developments abroad. Its that bland kind of statement. Of course, theyre always monitoring developments abroad, but this says theyre really watching and worried. It says theyre paying close attention to these developments. Now, i think one of the reasons why the stock market was a bit jittery today is people were wondering, does the fed know something we dont. I dont think thats the case. I think theyre being prudent. I think theyre saying, things look weak in china and other emerging markets, weeker than we thought a few months ago, and the markets are telling us that there may be some problems here, so lets take a short time out at least and evaluate these developments, see what happens and then we can make a better assessment of what they mean for the u. S. A short time out. There were some real divisions that have come out about what happens next. There was a minority, but stale strong minority suggesting nothing should happen even through at least through the end of the year. So i think, youre of course right, and fed officials give you their dots, where they think Interest Rates will go. Brown their tally. Thats right. Most of them still expect a hike by year end. Four are now saying, no, 2016 or maybe even 2017. So i think theyre leaning toward december, but theyre giving themselves the option to delay if the world looks threatening at that point. Brown is this unusual in your experience to have that kind of division vocalized or put down in the tally form in. You know, not really. I think thats a good thing not a bad thing. You dont want group thinking at a central bank. You want people to have their own perspectives, difference of views. Right now there is i think a fairly cohesive mainstream view that were getting closer to the point at which the domestic economy will support a rate hike, but its worth paying attention to these international developments. Now, you have some people, jeff lacquer dissented, who would like to hike today, and you have a few who are already pushing back into next year, but i think the mainstream is saying, by the end of the year probably, but well keep an eye on things. Brown just briefly, you have people breathing a sigh of relief in europe and elsewhere who are looking to the u. S. Economy as a driver still. Yes to some degree, but its also the case that of course, if youre sitting in europe right now, the fact that the u. S. Is not raising rates means the doller is a bit weaker, means their currency, the euro, is a big stronger, and if your economy faces a lot of challenges like the european economy, you would prefer the fed was hike sog your currency would weaken and you would pick up some more trade. Brown all right. Krishna guha, thank you so much. Thank you. Ifill the republican candidates now have two debates under their belts and the discussion about who won last nights event will go on for days. A clear winner was c. N. N. Who according to neilsen ratings claimed 22. 94 million viewers. While donald trump continues to be the marquee draw, Business Executive Carly Fiorina and senator marco rubio are trying to elbow their way into the spotlight. President Reagans Air Force one served as the backdrop for 11 republicans who hope to have their own president ial planes someday. But they first had to survive the night. As expected, the primary target was frontrunner donald trump, who has upended the race and left previously strong contenders like Wisconsin Governor Scott Walker in the dust. This is whats wrong with this debate. Were not talking about real issues. And mr. Trump, we dont need an apprentice in the white house. We dont need an apprentice in the white house, we have one right now. Ifill walker and former Florida Governor jeb bush tried to use the faceoff to reestablish lost footing by linking trump to the leading democrat. You got Hillary Clinton to go to your wedding. Thats true. Thats true. Because you gave her money. Maybe it works for Hillary Clinton. I was. Excuse me, jeb. It doesnt work for anybody on this stage. I was a businessman. I got along with clinton, i got along with everybody. That was my job, to get along with people. But the simple fact is. I didnt want to. Excuse me. One second. Ifill trump came prepared to criticize bush as well, over his stance on Womens Health programs. I know, but why did you say it . I heard it myself. Why did you say it . We increased Child Support we increased Child Support with a broken system by 90 . You said youre going to cut funding for Womens Health. You said it. I have a proven record. I have a proven record. You said it. Ifill meanwhile, Carly Fiorina, a former Hewlett Packard c. E. O. Who was relegated to the second tier debate last time, seized the moment to slash at trump while presenting herself as a leader. I also think that one of the benefits of a president ial campaign is the character and capability, judgment and temperament of every single one of us is revealed over time and under pressure. Ifill the only woman in the field also came prepared to belittle trump, who in an interview, had criticized her looks. You know, its interesting to me, mr. Trump said that he heard mr. Bush very clearly and what mr. Bush said. I think women all over this country heard very clearly what mr. Trump said. applause ifill trump, in turn, dismissed fiorina as a failure in business. But new jersey governor chris christie, struggling in the polls himself, repeatedly returned to his theme of the night that this campaign was not about them. While im as entertained as anyone by this personal back andforth about the history of donald and carlys career, for the 55yearold construction worker out in that audience tonight who doesnt have a job, who cant fund his childs education, ive got to tell you the truth. They could care less about your careers, they care about theirs. applause lets Start Talking about that on this stage and stop playing the games. Ifill each member of the 11 candidate took turns trying to break through. For florida senator marco rubio, it was on foreign policy. The United States military was not built to conduct pinprick attacks. And were not going to authorize use of force if youre not put in a position where they can win. Ifill and in an earlier forum, South Carolina senator Lindsey Graham targeted former senator Rick Santorum on immigration reform. How Many Democrats did you have on your bill . I dont know how Many Democrats i had on my bill. I can tell you none. But, the point is is that i had a bill. That went nowhere. Ifill the attention turns now to the democrats. Clinton used an appearance on the tonight show last night, to mock her competition. The democrats first debate is october 13th. Ifill stay with us, coming up on the newshour making sense of pope francis critique of capitalism. An american trained soldier, now a leader for the Islamic State group. How body cameras changes our views of justice. And, after a texas teen is arrested for taking a homemade clock to school, what its like to grow up as a muslimamerican. Ifill but first, General Motors and the government reached a settlement today over how the auto maker handled a defect that led to deaths, injuries and the recall of millions of vehicles. The agreement may resolve many of the cases involved, but theres also real concern over whether the government let g. M. Off too lightly. Hari sreenivasan has the story from our new york studios. Sreenivasan the formal announcement from u. S. Attorney Preet Bharara in new york followed years of recalls, lawsuits and congressional hearings. G. M. Agreed to pay 900 Million Dollars over faulty ignition switches that shut off engines and disable safety systems. The company now admits it hid the deadly defect for more than a decade. They didnt tell the truth in the best way that they should have to the regulator and to the public about a serious safety issue that risked life and limb. Sreenivasan an independent monitor will check g. M. s compliance, and pending criminal charges could be dropped after three years. But the deal does have its critics. In a statement today, Democratic Senators ed markey and Richard Blumenthal said the 124 families who lost loved ones deserved individual criminal accountability. It is shameful that they will not be held fully accountable sreenivasan back in new york, prosecutor bharara defended the agreement. Were not done and it remains possible that well charge an individual, but the law doesnt always let us do what we wish we could do. Sreenivasan and in warren, michigan, g. M. s chief mary barra summed up the automakers perspective at an employee town hall. This is a tough agreement. It further highlights the mistakes that were made by certain people in gm and it imposes significant penalties and obligations. Sreenivasan g. M. Also today said itll spend 575 Million Dollars to settle civil lawsuits. Lets learn more about this settlement and the questions surrounding a lack of charges. David shepardson of the detroit news was at todays press conference and joins me now. It seems that we kind of learned today the limits of the law. Gm wasnt necessarily found guilty of the ignition switch problem, but more of the wire fraud connected to the coverup. Its basically the same charge the federal prosecutors have used for years for gangs and different crimes, you know, using a telephone or any Electronic Device across state lines. The u. S. Attorney said there is not a statute that makes it a crime solely for an auto company to sell defective vehicles. And they were not able to determine whether individual employees, you know, were engaged in a coverup or intentionally committing a crime without that specific statute, and so they said theyre not giving up, and theyre in the ruling out any criminal charges in the long run, but realistically, this is probably the end of the criminal side of this case. Sreenivasan a lot of families of victims are saying, listen, my loved one died and theres not a single human being at General Motors thats responsible for this that we can find criminally negligent here . You have 124 deaths and gms independent Compensation Fund is died to this, 270 injuries, some of them very serious. Gm had this silent culture where no one was taking responsibility, the c. E. O. Has called it a culture of incompetence and neglect, and essentially because of this huge, incompetent company, no one is being held responsible and it is, you know, like i said, there are a lot of families the u. S. Attorney personally knows the families and says he was sorry and theyre as aggressive as any office in the country, but they cant find a statute to specifically go after those individual employees. Sreenivasan thats probably discomforting for pi auto owner that there is no law to prosecute, this but how much has gm paid so far, and it seems like this is less than what toyota was fined with for the sticky accelerator problems a couple years ago. Thats right. In fact, the toyota sudden acceleration problem, which was linked to about five or six deaths, resulted in a 1. 2 billion fine. Gm is paying to the u. S. Government 900 million. Theres about 1. 2 billion more in settlements of lawsuit including to shareholders and people who sued overric night switch defects and theres the independent Compensation Fund thats awarded about 600 million. The u. S. Attorney said were essentially going easier on gm because they fully cooperated, not only did their attorneys, you know, turn over information to us before they even told the executives, but they created this Compensation Fund and they quickly said, were going the change our culture. Toyota was accused of misleading government regulateors and not coming clean for much longer. It took them four and a half years the reach that settlement. So thats part of the reason for the difference of the fines. Sreenivasan this also doesnt count what it costs to fix the ignition switches of all these recalled cars. Thats right. Gm last year took about 4 billion in charges, much of it in the 30 million vehicles they recalled, including another 12 million vehicles beyond the ones involved in this criminal case for other ignition problems, for other key issues. So the expenses are significant. Theres many hundreds of lawsuits left to be resolved. So its not over yet. Sreenivasan what are the next steps . Is gm essentially on probation . They didnt have to admit any wrongdoing. They didnt have to plead guilty, but they already we inquired to admit to the information thats laid out in these two charges. So for the next three years they will be on probation. If they violate the law, the government could seek to reinstate those felonies and actually going through a conviction, but the reality is there are not a lot of penalties to a big company. Companies dont go to jail. You know, individuals do. For the most part wall street has basically baked in this cost of the settlement, so the stock was up a little bit today. Sreenivasan David Shepardson of the detroit news, thanks so much. Thanks, hari. Ifill Pope Franciss upcoming visit to the u. S. Next week is generating huge interest and expectation. Part of that excitement is rooted in the different tone the pope has taken on a variety of issues, from marriage to the role of women in the church. But he also issued a tough critique of capitalism and called for tougher action to deal with Climate Change. We kick off our coverage of the popes trip which will continue all next week with a look at those issues from our economics correspondent paul solman. Its part of our weekly series, making sense, which airs every thursday on the newshour. Reporter are you excited that the pope is coming here . Yay its a blessing that the pope is coming to visit us. Especially the poor people that need a little bit more. Reporter a Senior Center in east harlem, the poorest part of manhattan with the closest ties to latin america home to jorge mario bergoglio, the argentinian jesuit priest now known as pope francis. And just to the south of this district, we have the wealthiest district in the city of new york in the upper east side. Reporter Melissa Mark Viverito is the first Puerto Ricoborn speaker of the new york city council, where she also represents el barrio. There is a real contrast, which speaks to the vision and the philosophy of what the pope is all about. Reporter the pope put that vision and philosophy bluntly in june, with his controversial encyclical on Climate Change and poverty, blaming what he calls unbridled capitalism for ruining the earth with tragic effects on those he cares most about, the worlds poorest. Thats why the popes visit is so important, so that we continue to shine the light on those challenges and continue to challenge us as government and as leaders in our communities to overcome them. Reporter and presumably, thats why francis will come here to challenge government to do more for the environment and for the poor. But will government respond . The issue has already entered the race for president. I dont get Economic Policy from my bishops or my cardinals or my pope. Reporter conservative americans like president ial candidate jeb bush, a convert to catholicism, say the pope should steer clear of politics. I think religion ought to be about making us better as people and less about things that end up getting in the political realm. Reporter but francis seems to think politics is about making us better as people more generous, kinder and gentler to the poor, to each other, to the earth. Activist naomi klein it kind of felt a little bit like being invited into the worlds oldest secret society. Reporter klein is one of the popes more Surprising New advisors, a selfdescribed secular feminist. My views about Climate Change about the economy,are pretty radical. There are people out there who are saying this pope is a closet socialist, and then for them to invite somebody whos written a book whose subtitle is capitalism versus the climate is saying, well, were not backing down, frankly. Reporter moreover, says progressive evangelical jim wallis, pope francis is squarely within the tradition of his vow ofpoverty namesake and of jesus, who told the rich man hoping to enter the kingdom of heaven that he should give away all his possessions. Jesus says, you either serve god or mammon. Thats pretty radical. Mammon means money. You serve god or you serve money. Reporter isnt that why people say that jesus is a socialist . How we decide the morality, the integrity, the righteousness of an economy is not how the wealthiest do but how the poorest do. Thats in the text. Now, that is more radical than communism and socialism. Reporter i tried to be even more provocative with marie dennis, who heads a catholic peace and justice movement. Is the pope a communist . No, the pope is not a communist. Pope francis keeps, as the church ought to do, keeps a distance from any particular system, whether its communism or socialism or capitalism, in order to be able to critique whatever system is not serving the needs of people and the planet. But in his encyclical, he is stridently anticapitalist, or at least the unbridled version as he calls it. His critique of unbridled capitalism is very strong, absolutely, and he is very serious about it, because of his experience. He lived his whole life in a latin america that was on the receiving end of some very destructive economy policies. I think what pope francis is trying to do is trying to amplify voices that have been calling for a different system for decades. Reporter a different Economic System . Is what the pope argues for really what the worlds poor need . Well, i would say that the pope is probably not a well trained economist. Reporter New York University professor richard sylla. Economic historians like myself study these things and were pretty big fans of capitalism reporter the popes argument is not that historically capitalism has not done a good job. Its that now capitalism is a new form of colonialism. Its suppressing the poor and keeping them down. I have to disagree with that because in this age of globalization. My view is that capitalism is actually working to make the lives better for the poorer people of the world. Theres so much poverty in the world. Hasnt capitalism created that . No, capitalism is not the culprit. Capitalism when its allowed to do its work some of us would say work its magic has this tremendous ability to raise living levels for the people who live under that system. That doesnt mean its perfect but i think to sort of say that capitalism is the problem, lets get rid of it as the pope may be hinting, is to throw the baby out with the bathwater. Reporter the pope, however, is more than hinting. He writes that a market that does not the pope being unavailable to respond to economist richard syllas defense of markets, i asked his radical bedfellow, naomi klein for a reply. Yes, this is a system that has pulled many people out of poverty but it has also thrown many people into destitution. Now, my goal here is not to say capitalism has never done anything good, its to say we need a better system because now the fate of our species hangs in the balance. Reporter or as reverend wallis puts it is our Economy Today good news for the poor . The economy is for, more and more, the very top, the very few, and the middle are all very insecure and half of gods children, half the worlds people are left behind by the economy. Gods economy is very simple. There is enough if we share it. Its really as simple as that. Reporter well, maybe its simple, maybe it isnt. But that seems to be what pope francis believes. And the new york neighborhood hell visit, with its homeless, its mentally ill, its drugravaged denizens, cries out for help, says local resident rodney johnson. Theres a lot of changes that need to be made. Reporter like what . Like people getting housing, people really getting help on their drug problems, people, somebody really sitting down and understanding people on what they been through in life, and what they need in order to get off the streets, because theres really no, theres really no compassion out here enough to help people on their feet. Its not out here no more. There used to be but its gone. Reporter from east harlem, among other locations, this is economics correspondent paul solman, reporting for the pbs newshour. Ifill there were reports today that the United States and russia will begin militaryto military talks as russia moves into syria to bolster its ally. As they come to the aid of bashar alassad, russia may be coming up against a man theyve fought before. Chief Foreign Affairs correspondent Margaret Warner has that. Warner the man is Abu Omar Al Shishani, the Islamic State military commander for the Northern District of syria, seen here last august as the group pursued its lightning march across northern and central iraq. translated it is time for the sons of the Islamic State and the ummah to defend the Islamic State of iraq and sham and defend our imam who the world gathered against with all its strength. Warner unlike most i. S. Fighters, he was speaking russian. His real name is tarkhan batirashvili; hes an ethnic chechen reportedly born 30 years ago in the country of georgia then part of the soviet union to a christian father and muslim mother. Tapped as a special forces soldier in the georgian army, he fought fiercely against the russian army when the two countries went to war over the province of South Ossetia in 2008. Mitchell prothero of Mcclatchy Newspapers has just written an exhaustive profile of him, with startling new information. I spoke with him via skype from his bureau in northern iraq. How significant a military figure, is Abu Omar Al Shishani . If hes not the overall military commander for the Islamic State hes the commander of the northern front, which is the most serious and active. Warner you uncovered very interesting twist in this story. Some of his skills came from americans. In 2005 to 2006, a lot of cooperation between u. S. Military and intel training the georgians. He had been tapped for training by us but there was nothing that would flag him as a Security Risk on paper. Warner how effective was he versus the russians in 2008 . Everyone i spoke to said he was a fantastic soldier. He was considered a rising star of the georgian military, a senior n. C. O of the special forces eyes and ears of georgian military one of their most successful battlefield commanders of the brief 2008 war before russians rolled over them. Warner yet scarcely six years later, he was in syria, swearing allegiance to the Islamic State. Its an unusual evolution for a man brought up in a moderate muslim enclave in the predominantly christian nation of georgia. Warner shishani was arrested in 2010 on what his family called a trumpedup weapons possession charge and spent 16 months in prison. And once released, he fled to istanbul. At that point, he was radicalizred perhaps in prison. Some suggest his mothers death. He had a religious awakening, adopted her religion. In june 2012 ends up in aleppo and built movement that became part of isis. I was told part of why he was convinced to bring his unit and become part of the Islamic State was a promise that is would organize an emirate in the caucuses and go after the russians. Mary and, says prothero, al shishani has emerged as an effective recruiter of other muslim fighters from other former soviet republics. They have a tendency to be very professional fighters former military. Theyre considered the shock troops, moved around. There is a core of these very disciplined fighters as opposed to guys from europe. Warner what makes him so particularly effective . Hes quite capable of thinking strategically and tactically, which you dont get even with fierce fighters. It takes more than that to run an army. Warner today Abu Omar Al Shishani is on the u. S. Treasury departments list of specially designated global terrorists and has a 5 million bounty on his head. So as the Russian Military appears to be moving its way into syria, this hardened chechen fighter may have the battle coming that hes long been waiting for. For the pbs newshour, im Margaret Warner in washington ifill now how body cameras on police and cell phones everywhere are changing our views on justice. Charlayne hunter gault has the latest installment in our series, race matters. Reporter from the Michael Brown Fatal Shooting by a policeman in ferguson, missouri last year to new york city last week when a plainclothesed Police Officer roughly threw former tennis player james blake to the ground, police have been under fire for attacks on black people, but in many instance, Police Representatives have pushed back, insisting their offices were nearly doing their job. How to narrow the profound fractures between the public and police is the subject of Extensive Research by brian jackson, a senior political scientist at the rand corporation, a nonprofit thinktank working on improving policy and Decision Making. Brian jackson, thank you for joining us. Your study focused on what you describe as profound fractures between the public and the police, and you say its been a long trend. Can you expand on that just a little bit . Well, of course, policing in the United States isnt something that started a week ago. Its something that started near the beginning of our country, and the relationships that police have with their communities goes back to events that happened during arab segregation, during war protests when police didnt always take actions that today, you know, we see as appropriate. And so for individuals who have an interaction with a Police Officer today, theyre often seeing that interaction as part of a pattern that went become a long time, and this is part of why its very challenging to build and maintain trusted relationships between Police Officers and different communities, because the police have to sort of take on and understand this history that goes back probably well before any of the officers who were on the force now were Police Officers. Reporter so its going on in the heads of black people or people who were victims, but not in the heads of policemen . Yeah, indeed. And its not just the minority community. You have people who were members of protest communities during the 60s and 70s who have very different views of police. Really this is a question of the many communities that exist in the United States and the fact that all of them need good relationships with the Police Departments that protect them. Reporter but i think you see statistics showing that blacks are three times as likely as whites to be killed by police. That widens the fracture, doesnt it . Absolutely. When you have a sort of preexisting breakdown in trust, these very serious incidents, and police use of force is always a serious incident when it results in loss of life of a citizen. Thats always something that is a challenge in a democracy. Reporter so how do you see race fitting into this . Our country has a very complex history around race to make a very sort of obvious and understated point, and so race is something that is behind all of this. And its not that individuals are necessarily racist. There are folks who study unconscious stereotypes and how race can affect the way that people make judgments about another person. Reporter unconscious stereotypes . Indeed. Someone may view someone else as a threat because of stereotypes that exist around race and they may not even realize that influences their decision. So you can train people to understand there are stereotypes to let people step back from themselves as they make these incredibly important decision, sometimes in a very short time, and work through those issues to make sure theyre making the right decision for the right reasons, not because of a stereotype that theyve learned overtime. Reporter so are you saying this can be fixed . Im an optimist by nature, so, yes, i am saying it can be fixed, although this is a training issue. Its about sort of teaching people about other cultures. Its. This is embedded in sort of the notions that are behind community policing, of Police Departments, building connections with the community so they have a way of understanding where people are coming from, understanding what their needs are, the problems that police should be involved in solving, and part of that is about building these persontoperson relationships that mean people are making judgments less on mental shorthand and more about, you know, who is this person that is in from the of me and understanding what is going on. Reporter in your report you talk about narrowing these gaps and divisions being a twoway street, that the police have responsibilities and the community has responsibilities. How do you work that out . When you look at the rhetoric around the challenges about police oversight, police are concerned that members of the public who dont know what highpressure interactions where the Police Officers are at risk work and are concerned that theyre not going to make fair judgments about, you know, about the Police Officers Decision Making after the fact. Members of the public are obviously concerned about that Decision Making because its in that Decision Making where we get uses of force, where we get decisions about who gets searched and who doesnt, who gets stopped and who doesnt, and so there is an element in this where, you know, increasing transparency in those interactions, to give the public more data, more information im a researcher, so i go back the data and information as a solution. Reporter it sounds like that may be happening in the ferguson case where weve just had a report by a commission that looked into those incidents there, and they said that people need to engage with the report, discuss, debate and argue about it, even though it is likely to be difficult and take a long time. Is that what were looking at . They are going in the right direction. These are not easy questions. We expect the police to use force in situations to save lives, and we expect them to do it appropriately. Where is the line . Well, thats a tough. Thats a tough line to draw and it varies place the place. In a democracy, thats done by people coming together and having those debates, having those discussions. Brecken windows policing or order maintenance policing, as its called, because philosophy of trying to control crime. But that approach has a lot of impacts on the communities that are affected by it. So part of what needs to happen, they are around a policing tactic, is for people to come together and say, well, do the benefits that we think were getting from reducing crime worth the side effects this has on everybody in the community where its done . Is there a right and a wrong answer there . No, but the answer for me there is going from more transparency. So these bad incidents that happened, and there are terrible incidents that happened where we get the one cell phone video, they travel the internet, they have a very large effect. On that same day, a lot of interactions between the police and the public happen that were very positive. Sometimes those go viral, for example, there was the case of the African American Police Officer who was helping a white supremacist at a Confederate Flag rally who was being overcome by the heat. And theres a picture of this officer leading the gentleman away so he could sort of get water. Again, it went viral. Reporter is there anything in this whole equation that gives you optimism that this fracture can be narrowed and maybe even resolved . Yes, absolutely. I mean, were seeing sort of explorations with use of Technology Like body cameras, although theyre not the answer to everything. Were seeing, you know, Police Departments proactively sort of reach out to communities. Were seeing the public debate and the public debate is part of it. Its about, you know, what the country wants from its police forces, what the right balance to strike in a democracy about the power given to police versus citizen oversight, what the society wanted from police 30 years ago is not the same as what society wants from police now, and i dont know what the changes will be, but im quite sure that in 30 years there will be changes. What im optimistic about is that we have a process going now where people are focusing now on this issue and where we will work through the problems to come up with Better Solutions over time. Reporter thank you. Thank you very much. Ifill on monday well expand on that conversation in a pbs prime time special america after charleston. Join me as we explore the many issues propelled into Public Discourse after a white gunman shot and killed nine African American worshippers in charlestons emanuel a. M. E. Church last june. Ifill 14yearold ahmed mohamed, who was suspended from an irving, texas school after officials mistook his School Project for a bomb, spent another day out of school today. Mohammeds arrest, hed brought a homemade clock to school, stirred a Global Social media frenzy. Haris back with that. Sreenivasan the hashtag i stand with ahmed went viral for a Third Straight day on facebook, twitter and elsewhere. President obama jumped in yesterday, too, inviting him to visit with a tweet that read cool clock, ahmed. Want to bring it to the white house . We should inspire more kids like you to like science. Its what makes america great. For his part, the teen said he did not plan to return to the school and was grateful for overwhelming support. When i showed it to her, she thought it was a threat to her. So it was really sad that she took the wrong impression of it and i got arrested it to later that day. Thank you to all my supporters on twitter, facebook, social media. Thank you for helping me. I never would have got this far if it werent for you guys, and not just you guys, everybody. Sreenivasan now for some perspective. Michael philimr. Nihad awad hasg with ahmad and his family. When this happened to the family, the family contacted our office in dallas, and we recognized this was another case of unfortunate islamophobia and targeting of young people just because of their faith tradition, not because of their deeds or their behavior, and we managed to tell his story and his narrative now dominated the story. The school officials, i think, failed him when they accused him, when they called the police on him. He was arrested. He was detained, interrogated without the presence of his parents, and this was totally unnecessary. Sreenivasan mr. Awad, why is this story resonating so much even with nonmuslims around america . I think this is a human story. This is a young genius inventor who wanted to impress everyone, and he wanted to do better. He wanted to build things to improve the world. I spoke to him yesterday, and he told me that he wants to create things, and his father told me that he fixes everything around the house. So at this young age to have a brilliant teenager who is involved and has a passion in science and innovation, we should cherish this. And thats why i believe he was able to fill his story through his invention, hes young, hes cute, adorable, intelligent, and i think that got him a lot of support, definitely with the help of an Advocacy Organization like ours. We managed to also get his story out. Sreenivasan are you advocating for him to take legal action . If so whats the basis of that action and against whom . I think the most important thing is to restore his confidence. The president has supported him and he stood for him publicly. He led by example. Mark zuckerberg and other leaders in our faith tradition have stood by him. And that was the most important thing, to restore and reinstate his confidence and his dreams to change the world to be a better world. The legal action, i think, is being considered. We just want to make sure that this experience does not happen to other people. Sreenivasan is this indicative or emblematic of actions against muslims around the United States . Is that one of the reasons that people are paying attention to this, where they can see this in themselves . Unfortunately i have to say yes. It is widespread. There is an atmosphere of islamophobia that has plagued our countries, cities and towns. It has centered even through the school system. We hear many, many stories like this. Luckily ahmad med is clever. He was able to tell his narrative, but there are many Untold Stories nationwide, and we as a nation have to start a frank conversation, and i urge our national leaders, our religious leaders at their home, in their places of worship, everywhere, we have to fight against xenophobeback any kind of phobia, and just reward diversity but not punish diversity or punish people just because of their traditions. Sreenivasan what would you like to see happen at the school, at the local Police Department . I would like to school to look really at what happened, and they should not justify what they did. What they did was wrong. And they have sent the wrong message to teenagers nationwide, not only in their schools, and i would like that to be the last story, but unfortunately knowing the history of our society, we learn sometimes the hard way. Sreenivasan nihad awad, director of the council on American Islamic relations, thanks so much for joining us. Ifill on the newshour online for the last two weeks, we have been showing you some of the extreme conditions faced by migrants and refugees as they wind their way through europe. Correspondent William Brangham spoke to many of them along the hungarian border, as they tried to make their way to a better life. He talks about what he saw, on the latest episode of our podcast shortwave. Find a link to listen, on our home page pbs. Org newshour. And thats the newshour for tonight. On friday we reunite with Syrian Refugees in germany. We first met on their journey through hungary. Im gwen ifill. Join us online and again here tomorrow evening with mark shields and david brooks. For all of us at the pbs newshour, thank you and good night. Moving our economy for 160 years. Bnsf, the engine that connects us. The lemelson foundation. Committed to improving lives through invention. In the u. S. And developing countries. On the web at lemelson. Org. And with the ongoing support of these institutions this program was made possible by the corporation for public broadcasting. And by contributions to your pbs station from viewers like you. Thank you. Captioning sponsored by newshour productions, llc captioned by Media Access Group at wgbh access. Wgbh. Org report, with Tyler Mathisen and sue herera. The committee judged it appropriate to wait for more evidence. And wait it did, the Federal Reserve says now is not the right time to raise Interest Rates. But with the economy strengthening, what held them ba back . Confused response. Stocks that rose, then fell, then rose, and fell again as the market tried to figure out what the fed decision means for the economy and your money. And tuning in, a Little Known Company makes a big acquisition to become a real player in the fastchanging u. S. Cable business. All that and more tonight on nightly Business Report for thursday, september 17th. Good evening, everyone. And welcome im