Historically, the few instances in which iran has backed down under pressure, its when its faced against significant multilateral pressure. Rose and we look ahead to super bowl li with peter king of Sports Illustrated. That is what we have been trying to figure out. At age 39, dan morino, jim kelly, john elway, they were all retired. Peyton manning threw 11 touchdowns and 17 interceptions when he was 39 years old, his last year where he limped to a super bowl championship. But think about it, tom rady this year right now, 33 touchdowns, four interceptionings at age 39. Now, a lot of people will make fun of brady. He eats pristinely. You know, for him, you know, a wild night is a bowl of avocado ice cream. So i think were now seeing the result of all that for tom brady. He simply is beating age as well as every other team in the n. F. L. Rose we conclude with raoul peck, the director with the new documentary about James Baldwin. Ten years ago, i decided to make this film because i felt that the world around me was changing. Somehow we got lazy, and after the end of the civil rights movement, you know, things that we have monument, black history month, Martin Luther king day, as if everything was now perfect, and a new generation has started to come out, and i felt it was time that the words of James Baldwin had to come back on the front line. Rose the u. S. In iran, the super bowl, and James Baldwin, when we continue. Rose funding for charlie rose has been provided by the following and by bloomberg, a provider of multimedia news and Information Services worldwide. Captioning sponsored by Rose Communications from our studios in new york city, this is charlie rose. Rose we begin tonight with iran. Friday morning the Trump Administration announced new sanctions against iran. The move comes in response to the test firing from an iranian Ballistic Missile earlier in the week. The sanctions target 12 companies and 13 individuals with ties to irans Missile Program or the countrys revolutionary guard kountze force. Joining me david sanger of the New York Times and Karim Sadjadpour of the Carnegie Endowment for international peace. I am pleased to have them here this friday afternoon. First i begin with david sanger. David, why are they doing this . Will it be successful, and what will it achieve . Well, charlie, theyre doing this because they want to set a new tone and they want to set it right away. You heard from general flynn, mike flynn, the National Security advisor, he issued a Statement Today in which he said the old method of washing a missile firing and then gathering the United NationsGeneral Assembly or Security Council together to issue a pronouncement against iran, that those days were over and that was ineffective, so h he announce advise of sanctions that quite frankly looked a fair bit like the kind of sanctions the Obama Administration issued just a year ago. The difference was that, in announcing it, they revealed a bit more of what they knew about the networks of suppliers that the iranians have for their Missile Programs, blowing the cover of a number of front companies, and signaling to the iranians, we know where you live and youre in a new era now where we can make your life a little more miserable. The question is what do they do after this . Sanctions are within the 40yardlines of how we know of what you do to deal with an adversary like iran. Do they intercept shipping, take more aggressive actions within the gulf, do they step up the pressure in a way the iranians would feel forced to react . Rose when you look at all the controversy about the nuclear deal signed, all the critics would pounce on the deal that it does nothing about iranian behavior. And this new administration, talking about iranian behavior right away and linking it to the iran deal now specifically by talking about missiles. Will it have an impact on iranians or how will they react . I think irans comfort zone is to have contained with the United States. The u. S. Government made them uncomfortable with their overtures. The Trump Administration is now unpredictable for them. But iran has always liked to show the external pressure is not going to modify their behavior. Theyre not going to give in as a result of pressure. I think that what was key about the geopolitical context now is that, under obama, the United States managed to assemble a pretty Robust International coalition to isolate iran financially, politically and force iran into a nuclear compromise. I think iran probably senses now with President Trump in washington and a president in tehran whos thought to be moderate, the Prime Minister whos thought to be reasonable, its going to be much tougher for washington to assemble this broad, International Coalition against iran, especially when you look at the context of the middle east, a region which is unraveling, and a lot of the countries around the world, especially china, russia, europe see, todays iran middle east is actually a force for stability and a tactical ally against the more nefarious force, which is i. S. I. S. So i think that iran probably feels that they have to, obviously, watch the first weeks of the Trump Administration carefully. But what happened under rose explain what the u. S. Say they violated. If theyre doing the missile testing, whats the purpose of doing it . The purpose of doing the missile testing is to show with were still here and for the Iranian Revolutionary guard corps and others who built their reputation inside iran by opposition to the United States showing that, despite the nuclear deal, they are continuing to muscle their way through the region. I think the very good question that karim raises here is do the iranians sense that no ones really going to join the United States in standing up to them here, partly because lots of countries in the region have missiles, and, so, a missile violation seems to many in the region to be a concern, but of concern around the margins. I think, secondly, the iranians feel that they did a very good job in watering down the United Nations resolution on missiles that was passed just days after the Nuclear Accord. You may remember this was negotiated july 2015, right after the Nuclear Accord was sealed, by john kerry and jay bad zarif, his iranian counterpart. Mr. Zarif was pleased that wording would change from prohibiting missile tests to merely calling upon iran to show restraint and not to launch any missile that could carry a nuclear weapon. So the iranian argument is this missile wasnt designed to carry a nuclear weapon. Now, obviously, it could be modify to do so at some point in the future. So tare arguing there is no United NationsSecurity Council basis for any sanctions at all. Just an hour or two ago, we heard the iranians promise theyd issue a set of countersanctions against american individuals and companies. Those wont amount to much, but, politically, in iran, i think this could be significant in helping the hard liners once again have their favorite adversary in the fore. Rose Michael Flynn the National Security advisor said even before announcing sanctions that the u. S. Was putting iran on notice. Philip gordon said by issuing a warning so precise and in such a dramatic fashion, he has set himself and the the United States up for either an embarrassing retreat or a risky confrontation. Are either of those likely, karim . Charlie, i do think that we are in the early stages of an escalation which could culminate a military conflict either between the United States and iran or israel and iran. You know, i think the issue here is that iran argues that any new sanctions are a violation, an abrogation of the nuclear deal, and theyve said on several occasions that if the u. S. Violates its end of the deal, then iran will reconstitute its nuclear program. Again, i think its going what we saw in the nuclear deal and historically, the few instances in which iran has backed down under pressure, its when its faced against significant multilateral pressure. The Trump Administration, so far, has shown, you know, limited ability to work well with allies, and, so, it appears its an administration which doesnt really have a coherent Foreign Policy vision, an its coupled with these kind of emotional outbursts on twitter, taunts against not only countries like iran but also american allies. I think we do get in a very dangerous escalatory situation, and i would also add israels threshold for taking military action against iran is lower than americas threshold, and whereas the Obama Administration always exercises restraint over israel and Prime Minister netanyahu and prevented them from taking military action against iran, trump has so far been very indulgent of Prime Minister netanyahu. So it may be whether the United States decides to take military action against Irans Nuclear facilities down the road or whether the u. S. Would be willing to provide israel a green light to do so. Were certainly not there yet, but i think we do seriously have to think about the risks of such an escalation. Rose is it clear they cannot have the same impact they have had previously, that these sanctions will not, cannot will not have the same force that the previous sanctions did and, therefore, are doomed to failure . Certainly, my view would be, if you look at these sanctions, theyre frit narrow. Theyre against individual companies and individuals. The sanctions that brought iran to the table in the nuclear deal prevented iran from banking around the country around the world, prevented iran from delivering its oil in ports around the world. And, so, it had a broad effect on the iranian economy. These sanctions will not. Rose what is the attitude and how significant is it in the Overall Concept of trump Foreign Policy, the attitude toward iran and what they call radical islamic terrorism, that they see this coming, thats how trump and his colleagues see the world shaping up . Karim . It may be difficult to talk about a trump doctrine but we can talk about a steve bannon doctrine. If you look at his writings and media interviews in the past, he does believe the threat of islamic radicalism is the greatest threat the United States currently faces, as communism was during the cold war. I think one of the strategic mistakes theyre making is gratuitously alienating people in the muslim world and islamic world and in particular iran. As we recall this executive order passed last week, it turned away thousands of iranians who are legitimate visa holders, iranian green cardholders, and it caused great consternation in iran and amongst the iranians. There is a very prominent Iranian Community in the United States thats thriving and they have close ties with people in iran. I think in the past, the u. S. Administrations including the george w. Bush administration, they always tried to distinguish between the Iranian Regime and the iranian people, who are always thought to be the most pro american, modern population in todays middle east, and i think the Trump Administration is making a strategic mistake by lumping both the people and the regimes of the middle east of the islamic world into one category, and i do fear that theyre actually going to strengthen islamic radicalism rather than reduce it. Rose david, to that point, i would love to have you comment on this, the idea is most of what is conceived to be i. S. I. L and other aspect al quaida is mostly sunni muslim rather than sheena which is iranians, and the iranians, in fact, their f. M. Spokesman said it is a shame that the u. S. Government instead of thanking the iranian nation for their continued fight against terrorism keeps repeating unfounded claims and adopts unwise policies that are effectively helping terrorist groups. The iranis have said many times how opposed they are, you know, to i. S. I. L and other sunni groups. Well, i think youve gotten two of the contradictions in the trump Foreign Policy so far. Number one is that while mr. Trump talks a lot about terrorism and most of that, of course, is sunnibased, he tweets and occasionally comments on irans influence in iraq and, of course, its role in syria. On the other hand, by talking about cooperating with the russians in syria, hes implicitly talking about having to cooperate with iran, which is obviously working with the russians pretty closely. There is a second contradiction, and i think it goes back to your earlier question to karim, which is that in the interviews that we did with president elect or then candidate trump last year, there was none of the clash of civilization discussion. There was no talk about the United States coming battling for influence in the middle east with the iranians or battling for influence in asia with the chinese. That is bannon. The trump doctrine has been much more a we will pull back behind our borders if need be and strike out if anybody strikes at us. And no one has yet sorted out that contradiction in this white house. Now, its early yet, but we dont know yet whether the forces of confrontation represented by mr. Bannon or the forces of lets calm this down and try to manage it, which we assume to be the argument that Rex Tillerson will make, the new secretary of state, that jim mattis, the new secretary o secf defense will make, we dont know which one of those will win. Rose david, i know you have another appointment. Thanks for joining us. Great to be with you, charlie. Rose karim, one last question for you. When you look at this in terms of iran versus in its own struggle with the saudis for influence in the region, does it have any impact on that contest . Absolutely. I think what the Trump Administration is keen on doing is resetting relations with americas traditional allies in the middle east, namely israel and saudi arabia, which means confronting iran and irans proxies in the region, whether thats syria, yemen, iraq, lebanon and elsewhere. So i think that, you know, among the countries in the world which are quite pleased by the Trump Administration, other gulfarab country like saudi arabia and the u. A. E. , whereas like obama where he tried to appeal to iran, the Trump Administration recognizes who americas real allies in the region are. So i think the chances of really reaching a resolution in a place like syria are made infinitely smaller if you dont have any cooperation from iran because iran is the chief backer of bashar alassad. So i think it doesnt bode well for Regional Security to take a more antagonistic approach toward iran. That said, the Obama Administration tried hard for eight years to have a more cooperative relationship with iran, and that wasnt tremendously successful either. So striking that right balance is very difficult and, ultimately, a lot of these conflicts are conflicts that simply have to be managed and contained and not really resolvable. Rose karim, thank you for joining us. Thank you. Rose david sanger of the New York Times, Karim Sadjadpour, Carnegie Endowment for international peace. Well be right back. Rose the new England Patriots and the Atlanta Falcons will square off sunday. The patriots are vying for a fifth super bowl title in the tom brady and Bill Belichick era. If ngz wins, brady will surpass joe montana with the most super bowl rings by a q. B. Joining me from houston is great peter king, seen your writer for Sports Illustrated and widely regarded as americas premier writer. Welcome. Thanks very much, cheacialtion greetings from houston. Rose thanks for dressing up for the occasion. Youre welcome. Rose bill bill check has had two weeks to get sz his team ready. Does that make a difference . I think it does for a couple of reasons. Number one, the vast majority of the faction, more than 90 have never been in a s