Revolution. Notorious lobbyist turned anticorruption campaigner Jake Abramoff here to tell us the dirty secrets of the d. C. Swamp. We meet the man inside corporations literally write the laws the rest of us have to live under. And theres hope, we talk to two congressmen, one republican, one democrat, working together to drain the swamp. Evening everyone and welcome to the next revolution. Im steve hilton and this is the home of positive populism. When we started this show, we promised to keep watch over President Trumps pledge to drain the swamp. Over the past few months, weve brought you swamp watch investigations that exposed everything from the military Industrial Complex to the saudi arabia lobby. In a moment, well bring you highlights from some of your favorite swamp watch segments. First with me kimberly strasel who writes the column for the wall street journal. Kim, im so pleased you could join us to talk about this. There are very few people who know more about the topic than you. Drain the swamp, obviously, was a very effective slogan, and i think its an idea that captured the imagination in terms of generalized sense that washington is run by a bunch of insiders and their own interests. Because of your detailed knowledge, id love for you to break down the elements of the swamp that we should be most concerned about. Yeah, you know, first of all, its great to be here, steve, thanks for having me on. I think when you hear for instance donald trump talk about draining the swamp. A couple of categories come to mind. One would be oldstyle establishment politicians used to doing things behind the scenes in closed doors, smokefilled rooms that arent necessarily accountable to the people. The second category are the lobbyists and were about to get a view of that in the tax reform debate. Every company in the world is going to be descending on d. C. To keep their special tax break and their special thing with government. But the one that i think is the biggest swamp gets overlooked and that i spend a lot of time writing about is the bureaucracy, we live in an Administrative State where so much of peoples lives is controlled by federal bureaucrats. Tens of thousands of them. We know from the irs scandal, et cetera, that the people have immense power and no one is holding them accountable. Steve i completely agree with you. I want to dive into that in detail with you. Just one aside, a personal story, i remember when i was preparing to enter government with David Cameron in the uk and went to talk to tony blake, the former Prime Minister to get his advice and how things worked and he warned me about the Administrative State. He said have you no idea the permanent bureaucrats literally believe theyre the ones who hold the National Interest in their hands and job is to survive the here today gone tomorrow politicians. What can we do about that . What are specific things the Trump Administration can do to attack the Administrative State . The first thing is hold some accountable for those that have committed wrongdoing. A good example right now is we are seven years after the irs, one of the most powerful agency in federal government deliberately isolated and targeted nonprofits because of their political views. And helped to silence them during a crucial midterm and president ial election. To this date, no one is held accountable. We have various Tea Party Groups and other organizations that sued the federal government. The Obama Administration unsurprisingly battled those lawsuits, tried to keep everything quiet. One of the things thats disturbing is nothing seems to have changed under the Trump Administration. The Justice Department is still fighting those lawsuits trying to keep information quiet because the holdover attorneys from the obama erar still there. So i think cleaning house and Holding People accountable that are responsible for past abuses of power would send a powerful lesson to the other bureaucrats that there could be consequences if you overstep your boundaries. Steve what about the sheer scale of it . Physically, the number of agencies and the number of people that work there. Is there anything we can do about that . Well, obviously, the quickest way that you can reduce the power of the state is to reduce the state, and thats why i was cheered when i saw President Trumps budget that did do some pretty big cuts to some agencies because by the way, organizations like the Environmental Protection agency wanted to do a good job but historically role was to work in partnership with the states and a lot of the work it does would be better done at a local level where there is more accountability to local voters, for instance. One other thing that we can do too is weve got to work hard to make sure that the important decisions of government are returned back to the hands of people who are held accountable by voters. You know, for instance, on the irs thing again. The irs, bureaucrats should not be making decisions about whether or not a nonprofit engaged improperly in politics. We have the federal Election Commission with commissioners that had to be appointed and confirmed by the senate, who hold public hearings. Those are the people who ought to be making those decisions. Steve so in terms of moving agenda forward, what should we be looking to within the administration . Whos really running with this agenda, if anyone . What are you picking up . Theres a couple first of all, you need leadership from the president. I think next what youre seeing, if you go from agency to agency, the secretaries that President Trump has installed, one of the things that is encouraging, though its got almost no attention is how each of them are taking very hard looks at their own departments to see ways in which they with return accountability. Guys like the interior secretary zinke engaged in reorganization efforts at the interior department. Jeff sessions, we need to have more accountability of attorneys, et cetera. Those are the people. Also look to congress who are attempting, now that they own both branches to pass legislation that would further require more transparency and accountability for bureaucrats. Steve well, i know that you are certainly keeping an eye on it and well follow that closely, appreciate thank you very much you sharing your insights and hope can you come back and let us know what progress is being made because this is so fundamental to the kind of change people voted for. Kim, thank you for joining us. Id love to. Thank you. Steve now, heres a look at some of your favorite swamp watch moments. Some of the swampiest parts of washington operate in the dark, places you never think about, perhaps have never even heard of. A right with corrupt behavior because they dont face public scrutiny. Places like the Exportimport Bank. What is the Exportimport Bank . The what . I dont know. What . [laughter] i dont know have you heard of it . You should. Its a federal agency dishing out corporate welfare, and its in the cross hairs of tonights swamp watch. Amazingly, then senator barack obama, the candidate for president in 2008 explicitly called out the banks swampy behavior. The Exportimport Bank that is a little more than a fund for corporate welfare. Steve well said, senator. But then what happened after the election when it was time to reauthorize this swampy institution . Youll hear some critics suggest that, well, this is just corporate welfare for big multinationals. Steve excuse me . Some critics, you were one of them obama got swamped real quick. The Exportimport Bank uses our tax dollars to provide subsidized loans and loan insurance to foreign buyers of american goods, if air india wants to buy planes from boeing, exim will loan them the money at below market interest rates. Im not sure if the american taxpayers are fronting the money for it, but the defenders of the bank claim it exists to support american Small Businesses. Really . Over 60 of financing helps 10 giant corporations like boeing, caterpillar, ge and bechtel, the same giant corporations that spend millions in charge of the Exportimport Bank. Every year, a few dozen members of congress set the defense departments budget. A job which practically guarantees huge contractors. They received on average 430,000 from defense contractors. Its more of a jackpot if you chair one of these committees. Come on down dick durbin of illinois, the second highestranking democrat in congress, and someone who is constantly popping up on tv screens pomp usually pratteling on about the Trump Administrations ethics violations. Durbin became chair of the subcommittee which led to a wave of cash that made him the top recipient of that election cycle. Durbin counts northrup grumman, boeing, United Technologies and bae systems among top seven largest contributors. The local hospital with the friendly doctor replaced by vast mega hospitals run by administrators on multimillion dollar packages. Like michael downing, a former government bureaucrat who in 2015 raked in 10 million of north Shore University hospital in long island. 10 million a year . Lets all join a nonprofit. The insanely expensive hospital bills you get are not making wide eyed fresh out of med School Doctors and nurses wealthy. In fact, if youre a gogetting chief executive, health care and pharmaceuticals is the sector to be in. Exploiting sick people through vital but vastly overpriced services that might bankrupt them. Its a great gig. Among the 200 highest paid executives, those in health care and pharmaceuticals are paid on average 37 million. More than telecommunications, real estate, they dont come close. And the tax exempt hospitals are cash cows. The largest nonprofit compensation package went to the ceo of nonprofit hospital ascension, he made a cool 17. 6 million. Dont get me wrong, i have nothing against high pavement i believe in marks and i believe people who create value in the marketplace should be rewarded. Its got to be fair especially in health care where there are vast amounts of taxpayer money slushing around. Its a rigged market. Lobbying in political donation keep the health swamp going. To his credit, republican congressman tom garrett has tried to expose this corruption. Talking about why nothing ever happens to clamp down on the Health Insurance companies he wrote why, hasnt it been done . Lobby and special interests. This is a sitting congressman telling thought Health Insurance industry not our elected officials are driving health policy. One of the reforms the congressman is pushing for would expose the Health Insurance companies to real competition. Right now, thats blocked by mccarranferguson antitrust act of 1945. Yes, the government specifically exempts Health Insurance for most federal antitrust laws. This means that markets are artificially restricted and have what the congressman calls government sanctioned oligopolys in Health Insurance. The House Financial Services committee regulate the banks, guess which industry is the biggest donor . The amount of money slushing around this committee made it highly desirable governor congressman. So much so that its known on capitol hill as the Cash Committee because sitting on it guaranteed our congressman here is nodding. Its true because it guarantees fundraising success. Whats more, Many Committee members, not the one here, have direct and close ties to big banks. Representative Steve Stivers is previously the top lobrift for bank one. Representative kevin yoda got 211,000 from the securities and investment industry and 145,000 from commercial banks in two years. 2015 to 2016. A good deal for the banks. In 2014 yoda introduced legislation to allow banks to carry out the same practices that some argue caused the financial crash. How lovely for the banks they have all the members in congress fighting in their corner . And wouldnt it be great if we could come up with a system to have working americans interests represented in government . Coming up later, my exclusive interview with jack abramoff. Not all d. C. Dwellers are swamp citizens, i talk to one democrat and a republican who are working together to drain the swamp. Unbelievable, i know, dont miss it. [grandma] you misplaced your debit card . You have wells fargo, right . [grandson] yeah. [grandma] open up the app. [grandson] okay. [grandma] and turn off your card. [grandson] grandma, how are you better at this than me . [grandma] you know, you can use that phone to call me. 83 try to eat healthy, yet up to 90 fall short on getting key nutrients. Lets do more. Oneaday 50 plus. Complete with 100 daily value of more than 15 key nutrients. Oneaday 50 plus. If you have moderate to severe plaque psoriasis,. Isnt it time to let the real you shine through . Maybe its time for Otezla Apremilast . Otezla is not an injection or a cream. Its a pill that treats plaque psoriasis differently. With otezla, 75 clearer skin is achievable after just 4 months,. With reduced redness,. Thickness, and scaliness of plaques. 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I sat down with two members of congress, republican Mike Gallagher from wisconsin and california democrat roconner working together to reform american politics. Take a look. Lets start by defining the problem that youre trying to solve. We can use big phrase like drain the swamp, everyone would agree with that. What specifically are some of the problems . Ours started with term limits. We are both of the opinion, correct me if im mischaracterizing your view that congress shouldnt be a career, that career mentality where people wait and wait until they are a subcommittee chairman 12 years from now, that is the fundamental dynamic and result spend all their time raising money as opposed to grappling with complex problems. Exactly, exactly. Steve how do term limits help with that . Steve, weve got a 98 incumbent reelection rate. Steve right. The turnover rate in congress is less than european monarchies, the economist had an article about that. Term limit says you serve six terms twotwoyear terms in the house, two terms in the senate and do something else. People say, well, if someone is not doing a good job, the voter can vote him out. Thats not the case, you have so many advantages in incumbency and we need turnover. Steve what are the elements of the plan . We talked about nonpartisan redistricting. Politicians shouldnt choose and draw their own districts. We also talk about five year lobbying ban. Steve hasnt the president done that or not done that . Where does that stand . It has to Pass Congress in terms of a ban on members of congress. Steve ban on members of congress . From after youve done service, you shouldnt go and work for an industry that you were regulating. So you go, you serve in congress, you cant work for the defense trade association. Steve that is a huge thing, weve been pointing out in swamp watch. That is a classic thing. You did Public Service and you didnt go make tons of money afterwards. Harry truman who won world war ii, afterwards there is a famous story him being invited to speak and he shamefully writes and says can you pay the train ticket for me and my wife. Now you do Public Service and people are making millions of dollars, thats not what there is supposed to be. Steve theres a ban on that . A ban on that. Steve we were talking to someone about lobbying. Very much in line with that, the members themselves, because they dont spend the time on it. The policy work is contracting to start and junior on the stand and the lobbyists come in and hand then the ideas that benefit the corporations because the members arent really engaged enough in that. You talked about flying around the country raising money, whats that . I think that the costs of the campaigns continues to skyrocket. What was spend in the georgia race, 50 million. This is a profitable industry. In the military we used to call absurdities, a selflicking ice cream. Im in a relatively cheap media market and campaigns cost 3 million. Its getting out of hand. Steve that feels like arms race. Anything we can do about that . When you talk about campaign spending, you get into the territory of the constitutional objections to that. Whats your view on what we can do about that . I dont take pac and lobbyist money. Steve this all sounds great, is anything going to happen . How are you going to make it happen . Well, i do think the