very interesting that kathleen sebelius was in the front row. an opportunity maybe for the president to thank her for helping to turn the page. instead he sent a shoutout to democrats like nannies pelosi. pointedly did not mention kathleen sebelius. that raised a lot of eyebrows inside the house. you mentioned sylvia burwell. highly respected on capitol hill both parties because she has a business background. what senior administration officials are telling us tonight is that the president now wants someone post sebelius to be all over not just the web site but signups. the full implementation of this law in a way perhaps that kathleen sebelius inside herself she hadn't been able been up to doing that job. they are praising kathleen sebelius tonight. but they are obviously expressing relief that there is going to be a change here. i think sylvia burwell, someone before being the office of management and budget was also someone who ran the wal-mart foundation, ran the bill gates foundation. this is someone who is a manager, bit of a business background. ran major projects and, let's face it, that's what this is. the full implementation that he is trying to make of the wall as republicans still try to repeal tore change it it final point i will make is while she may get through this confirmation process, sylvia burwell, the senate republicans now have leverage in the confirmation process, something they always felt they would have that they might now in order to get her confirmed the administration might have to turn over documents they have refused to turn over so far, okay, more than 7 million signups but how many of those people have actually paid premiums? how many are actually insured. there is information republicans have been pressing for they haven't gotten. a leverage perhaps in that process to at least get some of that greta. >> ed, it's very convenient in this town to throw somebody under the bus and blame everybody. do you know i have heard that the white house had been micromanaging this rollout for the last two and a half or three years. and that she was sort of the one that was very -- the very public face of it but, how much responsibility should be assigned to her? >> well, i also have spoken to people very close to kathleen sebelius who say that she felt hurt because she thought the white house did have their hands all over this big project and then when it went bad, she got all of the blame. and so there is probably at least some truth to that on the other hand, if you aren andn charge of something that is ♪ just any law, it's the signature domestic achievement of this president, it's going to be for better, for worse, his legacy. have you got to be all over it. obviously the blame also goes in the oval office president's legacy on the line and maybe he should have been more hands on. for the point person you are going to get a lot of blame, gte. >> ed, thank you. joining us more on political susan ferrechio, nina easton and the rich lowry. how much blame does she get? if you are going to say she is the point person and the top person, who is the president, i have heard lots of stories in the last couple years about her hands being tied on a lot of. this sure, i mean, she wasn't the architect of the law, the blame on her is about the rollout which was full of problems. the crashing web sites. not having continue interpreted properly into spanish. not enrolling enough people on time. that's all on her shoulders as ed said she was the point person. moving forward people complaining about doctor choices, higher premiums, loading their insurance. that's not going to be other shoulders. it's on the president's shoulders because it's about the law itself and not the glitch-filled rollout. >> shocking when the president came up with the pep rally 7.1 million. very happy in the rose garden and he didn't have his point person standing next to her. i thought he dissed her at that point and not mentioning her in the audience. i thought the writing was on the wall. if even if you don't think you are doing a good job that's humiliating with-to-her. >> that's trouble with cabinet secretaries is everything. back to donald rumsfeld who did not resign when the iraq war was going really badly but left after an election. and i look at her now, she is able to write the narrative better for herself now. she -- if she had resigned in the middle of the obamacare problems, the web site problems when even allies from calling the rollout a disaster, that would have been her legacy. now she can go out and claim it's a success. the white house is going to claim it's a success. here's the thing going forward, going towards the 2014 elections, you are looking to a nomination hear, that's going to put obamacare and its problems back in the headlines and i think at the end of the day that's going to be good for republicans. >> maybe i'm the quintessential defense lawyer, wes, if this thing does go belly up, she won't be here, you know, to be the one belly up. but she certainly who's -- has taken loot of hits and deservedly so. >> a ton of hits on this. nina's point is great. the timing on this is really everything. they hit the 7 million mark they said in the beginning that's the goal post. she can lee and her legacy is that while this was rocky, this could have been better. >> legacy would have been if she hadn't taken the job she would have gone on "time" screen naming her as one of the five best governors at the time. she is going out now with this around her neck. >> remember where she was her stature coming into the obama administration. d.p. nomination. run for president one day. she doesn't have that legacy now. but, in some ways that's what you take when you take on one of these big jobs in d.c. >> interesting dynamic. she endorsed president obama in 2008, not secretary clinton. interesting dynamics in all of this, isn't it? >> that's right. and she wasn't the first choice for h.h.s. secretary. >> that's right. >> tom daschle first choice, he had his tax issues and she came on. at the end of the day, i help, this was on her shoulders and she didn't apprise herself well and she she can go out, you know, six months after this rollout and try to claim that there is a success. >> my guess is that can't wait to get out of dodge. >> i think you said rose garden ceremony where she was dissed. i think so. in terms the nomination process, the rules of the senate are now changed. it only takes a 1 votes to get a nominee through for executive branch. >> there still has to be a hearing where you ask those questions. >> they will be fighting. the leverage for republicans is not as it would have been if it required a 60 vote threshold it only takes 51 to get her through. >> panel, stand by. bring you more on this breaking news as we get it but, right now, an american cowboy taking on the federal government. nevada rancher bundy threatening to launch a range war after the government sent snipers and helicopters to seize his cattle. now, what started as a land battle is a giant standoff. on one side, armed officers sent by the feds to surround bundy's ranch. on the other side growing crowds supporting the rancher. the confrontation getting violent. at one point rangers shooting bundy's son with a stun gun. [siren] what is this fight about? rancher bundy and his son join us. good evening, gentlemen. >> good evening. >> good to be with you tonight. >> what's going on? tell me the problem. >> well, i guess it's a range war. >> why are their helicopters and snipers? >> well, i had asked that question, too. i think we are in america but maybe not. it seemed like the united states government operating with unlimited power over we the people in the state of nevada. this started back in 1993 when we started this battle. what provoked the beginning of the dispute with the federal government, administrative regulatory views. the bureaus kept cutting our cattle, causing so much trouble we couldn't ranch. they brought the desert toward us in as a surrogate specie and started to create what they call full force and effect decisions which basically took 52 of my neighbor ranchers out. >> where is this headed? >> it's not about cattle cattle. it's about federal government abuse on state rights and state sovereignty, state law public land a.b. access. the worst part of it all is the sheriff's policing power. i looked at a court order there is a court order that says the federal government can can do this. what's your response to that? i respond to the wrong court. i never had due process in a nevada state court. are a court of competent juction. >> go ahead. >> i like my dad's little story to use to explain the situation if someone came, in busted into my house and abused my children and so i call the cops and they don't respond and then i take them to court. i show up in the courtroom, look on the stand and it's the very person that abused my children looking down at me in a black robe. how in the world are we going to get justice in that court? >> tell me, how many people standing around supporting you? can you get a an idea? >> i don't know for sure. i know that most of the protesters here right now have moved about 30 miles south on the west side of lake mead, where the cattle are being gathered right now i'm not there so i don't know how many people are protesting. i'm guessing 100 people in the area protesters. there is about 200 armed guards they are by the overton beach. >> why -- why were you -- >> lake mead. >> why were you tasered? what surrounded that incident? >> well, right here where we were protesting, we could see coming out of the mountains 14 federal vehicles. one of those vehicles was a backhoe and it was hauling -- it was a dump truck hauling a backhoe. and it was being hesitate courted by the 13 other vehicles with armed -- i don't know if military personnel but they had full weapons there was two to each vehicle. they had dogs as well. we know that they have been running this cattle around with these helicopters and running and understanding this country and how hot it is and the cattle also separating cavs from the mothers. we are -- the cavs are dying as well. we believe that it was a rendering truck, and we were going to find out and so we stopped the convoy and we found out. >> gentlemen, obviously this is not going to end very soon, can i tell by that thank you very much for joining us, and, of course, this monday night, sean hannity will give you an exclusive look behind the scenes at the ranch and the standoff. that's monday night at 10:00 p.m. 10:00 eastern on hannity. be sure to tune in on that. now a threat from a democrat congressional candidate. mike dickenson tweeting if elected i promise war on the tea party, fox news, nra and/or trash and mike dickenson joins us. good to see you, sir. >> good to see you too. >> why do you hate me. >> i have a problem with all the fox news. >> what about me? i'm fox news. i'm trash apparently what's the problem with me. >> i don't have a problem you personally i have a problem with the company you work for. i think the facts are misrepresented. every day is an attack on obama. >> do we misrepresent here on the record. >> i can't say personally that do you. >> you don't watch that much. >> i don't watch that much. i can say like the previous story with the two cowboys. you have that story and. should be pressers by the fact that they're breaking the law. >> did you not hear the court say the court order that you read. >> that guy he is no hero. >> did you hear me say that. >> i did hear you say that. >> did you want me to say it twice or three times. >> you still put them on in my mind it's encouraging people to fight the police and fight the government. and like it's so federal government situation. >> let's go back to this war on fox news. all right. tell me exactly what your problem is with me. >> my problem with you is you have guests like the previous story. encourages people to fight the government, obama and federal government big bad authority that they are coming to take your land and coming to take your house and coming to take your cattle. >> you must have a potato in your ear because i said the court order. i did some people watch. >> they have potatoes in their ear and they didn't hear that part. >> yes. >> the problem is not so much what i do but that the viewers have potatoes in their ears? >> yes. >> all right. now we got that sorted out. the tea party, any tea party arrested in your jurisdiction? >> in tea party arrest? >> yeah any arrests. >> there is a strong like tea party movement. >> anyone arrested? >> not that i know of. >> you don't think it's first amendment, do you? >> the tea party? no, i love the first amendment. >> why can't they have their position? >> i think they can have their position, i think they misrepresent their position. >> they got potatoes in their ears? >> the tea party is not the we the people, flag flying eagle soaring. not the movement that they portray. their movement is the me movement. it's not we the people, it's me the people. they want rights that apply to them and they don't want to give those rights to anybody else. >> you don't want them to have the right. >> i think they have right. >> have a war. you say you want a war. you don't want to hear what they have to say? >> i think they need a war on them because of the fact that how they portray themselves. they portray this image as totally not who they're. it's totally not who they're. >> that's really bad to portray yourself as not how are, right? >> it's terrible. >> teak speaking of that letter to the "times" dispatch you wrote. you claimed you were the ceo of mid atlantic show clubs which is a group of strip clubs and stuff, right? >> that's correct. >> that wasn't true, was it? >> i worked -- i was a consultant for them. >> it says ceo of mid at lynn particular were the ceo. >> consulting operations. >> that wasn't quite true, it was? it was a lie. little bit of a lie, right? tiny one, little bit of a lie. >> that's true. >> you like transparency i went to your campaign web site and talks about how are. it says meet mike. okay. meet mike and do you know what? you didn't put in here about how you were lobbyist for strip clubs and you learned from larry flint not to sugar coat but tell it how it is. >> if somebody asks me i it will them what larry flint. >> you didn't meet mike. >> you learn about mike on twitter every day. >> twitter is another thing. let me ask the other thing you say you don't like about is the that loop of partisan bickering? >> yes. >> i'm curious what you think when you sort of tweet about people being like you just go out there and tweet like have a war on fox news, including me, i guess, that you have a war on this free speech of the tea party, you don't like that stuff, do you. >> i don't care for the tea party. >> it says on your meet mike that you don't like this partisan bickering? >> my deal with the party bickering i think all political party are fake somewhat. >> but you don't like it but you do it. >> i don't partisan bicker. >> if you don't let's go to your twitter account? your twitter account has been suspended, right? >> no it's been reactivated. somebody complained that i was being mean on twitter. >> would that be that partisan bickering you don't like in the meet mike? >> no, ma'am, no. >> you don't think so? >> no. >> you don't think the think you said on meet mike you you don't like partisan bickering and your twitter account get shut down for partisan bickering. >> somebody said i was being mean i was expressing my opinion. politicians should say who they are and. >> then we go back to meet mike. you don't mention any place in this little paragraph on your web site about working for larry flint and writing stuff for him. you don't write about that at all, do you? you don't write about the strip clubs. you don't write when you lied to the newspaper and bragged you were the ceo of a strip club organization that you are not? >> i also didn't put all the stuff i put on twitter on there either. >> you want to take back your war on fox? >> no. >> you don't? >> no. >> why are you running? >> i'm running for office because i think we need politicians who say what they think and who don't hold back. you should not sugar coat and you should not lie. >> you lied to the newspaper. how can can you possibly say that to me? >> i mean, i think politicians should just be honest about what they think. >> why did you lie to the newspaper? >> there is a lot of politicians out there at war with fox. how many other ones have come out and said it it would you agree with me on that. >> you know, mike, it's going to be a long election. will you come back. >> i will come back any time you like. >> you are a piece of work. mike, thank you. good luck in your campaign. straight h. head secretary sebelius not the only woman in washington having a bad day. wait until you hear what happened to lois lerner. also the news everyone is talking about. and we do mean everyone. even karl rove. stephan coal bay taking over david letterman's chair at the late show plus greg gutfeld who is here. post your thought using #greta on the new stephan #greta on the new stephan colbert with david honestly, i'm pouring everything i have into this place. that's why i got a new windows 2 in 1. it has exactly what i need for half of what i thought i'd pay. and i don't need to be online for it to work. it runs office, so i can do schedules and budgets and even menu changes. but it's fun, too -- with touch, and tons of great apps for stuff like music, 'cause a good playlist is good for business. i need the boss's signature for this. i'm the boss. ♪ honestly ♪ i wanna see you be brave ♪ honestly the owner of a vehicle, with a bumper sticker, "turrible" your lights are on. you wanna get that genius? not mine. on the passenger seat, there is a collection of charles barkley highlight dvds. must be a big fan. and the license plate reads "sir charles." i'm gonna get some drinks with my capital one venture card. be right back. earn unlimited double miles with no blackout dates from the capital one venture card. forgetting something, sir charles? what's in your wallet? is just a short time ago the oversight committee voting to hold the former irs official in contempt. >> what are you fearful of ms. lerner? >> this contempt will be laughed out of court. >> guilty or innocent. ms. earner has a constitutional right to remain silent on this issue. >> lois lerner did not remain silent. >> i have not done anything wrong. >> what she did was s. worthy of probably an academy award. >> i have not broken any laws. >> if you honestly believe that you can make 17 separate factual assertions, and still invoke your right to remain silent, then, please tell me what waiver is. she was successful in gagging and also hog tieing conservative groups in this country. >> if lois lerner won't talk to us, and the irs won't give us their emails, how in the heck are we going to get to the truth? >> she acted in contempt and she must be held in contempt. >> and representative jim jordan joins us. nice to he so you, sir. >> good to be with you. >> what is next. >> goes to the u.s. attorney. the statute says shall take it to a an attorney. goes it to a judge and a judge will make a you will can a. our position is got something this important attack on first amendment right to political speech. the most important speaking out against your government. one of the most rights that we have when you have the systematic attack and the irs won't give us emails and she won't talk and the justice department investigation is a joke, you have to use every tool, every means at your disposal to try to persuade her to talk to we can get to the truth. that's what we did today. >> what's the time line? how soon befor