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"the five" starts right now. ♪ ♪ >> eric: all right. the d.c. debt deal dominating the news. and rightly so. the country is or was on the verge. here is the deal. $2.1 trillion in cults. with the ceiling rise of $2.1 trillion in tramples. maybe twoin -- tranches. based on a panel, super panel if you will, with triggers. the good news is the spending cut by $2.1 trillion. the bad news, we're still overspending by $2.1 trillion. the good news is no news taxes in the deal. bad news is the democrats are still trying to see taxes in the deal. bottom line, tea party, game-changers. thank you, tea party. take the win and live to play another day. in honor of the tea party, we'll say thank you for a big, big old bag of tea. >> is that for real? >> eric: a big bag of tea >> kimberly: just for bob beckel. >> eric: a game changer, my friend. look at that thing. drop a tea party. they changed the rhetoric, changed the dialogue. >> bob: i'll give you that. they did it. i give them credit for bringing this thing up, which is going to be in my mind a horribly cruel, cruel outcome of this. we had to do it. i understand why some liberals will have to vote for it so we don't go over the ledge that you and the tea party want to take us. i'll tell you something. the losers are poor kids and winners are millionaires and billionaires. congratulations, tea party. >> eric: let's talk about that again. we need to point out -- greg, we talked about this in the green room, we are still raising the debt ceiling because we are going deeper and deep in debt. just not $3 trillion more deeper in debt. >> greg: exactly. you are increasing the spending by 70% over a decade. this is like being on a diet and taking the olive off the meat lover's pizza and bob is complaining about the olive. this is ridiculous. here is the deal. a great line from the movie "the sush suspects." the greatest trick the devil ever did was convincing you he didn't exist. that's what the dems have done. they convinced people that increasing is spending cuts. it's an amazing trick. >> kimberly: are you saying they are cricky? >> greg: i am. kimberly, nothing goes over your head. >> kimberly: i'm telling you. >> andrea: speaking of the devil, we need a devil sandwich, because this is what the democrats said about the plan. you can eat the sandwich. >> eric: sugarcoated devil sandwich, i believe. >> bob: if i could ask to pull up a graph. i want to show my different eric, who has been complaining about barack obama and how much he contributes to the $14.55 trillion. all right, if you look at who contributed to it by presidents, before ronald reagan it was $1 trillion. reagan, $1.9 trillion. bush, the elder, $1.5 trillion. clinton, $1.4 trillion. george w. bush, $6.2 trillion. and barack obama, $2.4 trillion. that adds up to your $14.55 trillion. >> eric: that's wrong. i don't know where you got that. >> bob: does it add up to $14.5 trillion? >> eric: i tell you, when mr. obama took office january 20 of 2009, the national debt was $10.6 trillion. it's now $14.5 trillion. that is almost $4 trillion. >> bob: let me finish. allow me. >> eric: that is $4 trillion in two-and-a-half years. george w. bush was eight-year term. if you want to extrapolate obama adding to the debt, that comes to about $12 trillion over eight years, doubling the debt from when he took over. >> bob: that number is wrong. not only are your politics terrible and your economics, but you can't add. that is something -- >> eric: i can add perfectly. that number is wrong. >> kimberly: tea party math, right? >> bob: right. >> kimberly: you said that about the tea party. >> bob: tea terrorists. >> kimberly: bob, they want the best for the country. you know what is interesting, there was an article on sunday where he quotes miria cardona, democratic strategist. you might agree with this. she said the 87 little tyrants have no understanding the fall-out of blocking a debt deal because they never covered and have no interest in compromising and have no clue about the government or how government really works. >> eric: we may have lost your mic. let's talk about this. house vote on the rule so they're ready to proceed for the vote on the debt deal. what do you think of the debt deal? we'll work on the mic. >> andrea: i don't think it's ideal. but i do love that the liberals hate it so much. they have been completely embarrassed. rendered irrelevant because of it. think about it. the reason the tea party a conservatives were successful, the left disappear and the democrats don't care about them anymore. i will say this, though. even though the plan is all right, take the deal. i'm very skeptical about the committee, the super committee. we already had a super committee. frankly, i feel like congress is already an elected committee we pay to do the job. i'm very skeptical about who is going to be on and what cuts will be made. >> bob: the committee is a difference. the commission they appointed by law originally supposed to report to the congress, they had to do an up and down vote, same thing. before they satish down to meet, they took away automatic. this is a committee of the congress, select committee of the congress. water gate was select committee of the congress. this is an important committee. if they come up with something -- if, that is a big if -- it will be for the first time since baseloading up or down vote no, amendment and no filibuster. >> eric: they have to come up with something. if they don't, the triggers are in place. by the way, the triggers one of them is on, one of them that would hurt the republicans they feel, 50% of the cut that has to happen if you are going to go ahead and raise the debt ceiling, 50% of the cut that has to happen has to come from the military, defense spending. tough medicine. >> andrea: that is right. stimulus plan bloated the discretionary spending that upsets democrats do mestic spend willing hit the viewers at home the quickest. the defense spending probably not as much. i think that will be a powerful leveraging tool for the democrats to push for tax increaseswa do you want, republicans? do you want defense cuts or tax increases? >> greg: it always comes down to the polarization, defense, versus domestic. the left prefers to increase dependence through entitlements. that's why they want domestic spending. whereas everybody else in america wants to increase the defense, because that is how you preseven independence. it's about independence versus dependence. >> bob: everybody else in america? >> greg: everybody else. except for you, bob. >> bob: no, no, no there are is a lot of people who get social security and medicare that might think it's an important thing. one thing that is going to happen, the debt committee if you call it that, has to report the revenue increases, the taxes have to go up or what we'll do i hope is when the republicans who have to put a bill forward to keep the bush tax cuts going, obama will veto it and ought to. >> kimberly: my mic is back up. bob tried to cut it off. we got it back. >> andrea: no pulling out kimberly's microphone. >> kimberly: i love the sabotage. it's very good. this isn't pro-growth economy. this is a problem. this is a president that is moving country forward or someone who came up with leadership and plan an idea here? yet you criticize, right, bob, tea party and other people that were the ones driving the debate, that actually were the ones that were the game-changer in mid-term election and they were the party that defineed this debate and the cuts that needed to take place? >> bob: i said the tea terrorists drove the debate no question about it. but when you say that is leadership, i consider it terrible stuff they have come up with. you say, so you say we should -- should i sit back and applaud because they brought this outrageously disgraceful, sickening bill up? >> eric: no. what is outrageously disgraceful? we are still going to spend $3.6 or $3.# trillion? what is bad about the tea party saying okay, stop. enough is enough. don't spend $4 trillion. you don't need to spend that. >> bob: they're taking money out of programs that matter. they're taking it out of education. out of the infrastructure. taking it out of women and children. and the w.i.c. program -- >> greg: why spending 70% more money? >> bob: why don't you raise taxes on people who are wealthy? >> greg: it doesn't work, bob. >> bob: bull. >> greg: here is the problem. >> bob: that was close. >> greg: in 2008 everybody elected president on hope and change. it wasn't a principle. it was a feel good euphemism. now the tea party is based on a singular principal: smaller government. they're not acting for much. they're saying stop. you can increase spending but cut it back a little. obama does not have a reaction to that. he doesn't know how to respond because he ran on a euphemism. he ran on a bumper sticker. >> bob: tea terrorists ran on cruelty. bo >> bob. >> kimberly: even before we had the debate, moody and the credit agencies are still saying they might downgrade us. >> eric: all right. we're going to leave it there, but before we go, take a look at this. thank you, tea party. thank tea party. also thank mr. obama. because mr. obama, you are the reason the tea party exists today. coming up, the picks for the winners -- don't do it, bob beckel. don't do it. and losers of the debt deal. we like to hear what you have to say. e-mail us at [email protected]. don't rip it! 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>> kimberly: thanks. nice, in a respectful way like they taught me in girl scouts. you want him to do well. but even democrats are not happy with obama. maurd dowd said that the democratic lawmakers worry that the tea party neutered the president. that doesn't sound good to me, bob. another quote. we are watching him turn into jimmy carter right before our eyes." >> greg: are you really a girl scout? >> kimberly: i didn't make the girl scouts. >> bob: i made boy scouts but i got thrown out on a camping trip because i took liquor with me. >> kimberly: shocking facts revealed. >> bob: i think obama -- >> greg: every story by bob. >> bob: let me say this. i'll give credit here, the top winner of this is the tea terrorist party. >> greg: tea partiers, bob. >> bob: that is what you call them. >> andrea: stick to the president. >> bob: the president won for this reason. when it comes out for the country and the campaign -- he doesn't have to have another vote on this. he won there. >> andrea: i agree there. >> bob: in 2012. he gets to take it up against the republicans and say that everybody else put in except for rich people, that the republicans look to protect. we'll wait for another segment to talk about mitt romney. by the way, doesn't eric cantor sound like gomeer pyle.? seriously? doesn't he? >> greg: what do you sound like, bob? >> bob: recovering drunk. which is what i am. i give mitch mcconnell credit. he held back and played it smart and came in at the end. the other winners clearly are eric's pals, millionaire and billionaires. >> andrea: eric? >> eric: obama won by default. he stepped back and let the process take place. his crep tryst left decided -- centrist left allowed him to get through the election to win. tea party won and lost. they won because they changed the debath and changed dialogue but they still are raising the debt ceiling. it will be harder, hard-pressed to get the tea parties to vote for the final deal in that respect they lost. harry reid is a loser. he was important for five minutes in the whole process. >> andrea: to bob's point, tea party took the president and drug him kicking and screaming to the middle. don't think he will jump up and down and take credit for this in the election. >> kimberly: here is the problem. where was the president's plan? everybody kept waiting. come up with something. the bend and snap or snap, crackle and pop. something that people can understand. >> bob: i agree with the tea party in the long run, in the long run tea terrorist will find themselveses in a better position. >> greg: that is five times you said it. you can't say it before. i'm tired of the phrase. >> andrea: greg, who are your winners and losers? >> greg: obama won because he got it off the table. unless tea party people keep the debate alive. big government won because it expanded. anthony weiner lost because he is going why didn't my problem happen during this? because if his scandal had happened now, no one would care. >> kimberly: so dominique strauss-kahn and stephen strasburg. they'rand arnold schwarzenegger. >> eric: the left lost. nothing in this for them. >> bob: you're exactly right. exactly right. nothing for us at all. >> andrea: doesn't that hurt ennewsiasm going into an election? >> bob: a good point but i'll tell you what it does. the fear of actually having republicans controlling the senate, the house and the white house, enough that the progressive base will come back en masse in big numbers because they don't want the tea terrorist party to have that much influence or be completely controlled by the republicans. >> andrea: they are so mad. this is up with of many columnists krugman from the far left, saying i mean lambasting the president saying he sur rendered, sur rendered last december. he surrendered on a scale of raw extortion, he says. >> bob: that's what it was. >> andrea: he says we are witnessing a catastrophe on multiple levels from paul krugman of the "new york times." there is it. raw, tortion over the debt ceiling. >> eric: if this does somehow work, the economy turns around not because of it but in spite of it, the tea party will be credited with saving the economy. they're going to be in 2012, they will say look what we did? we turned the dialogue, growth and jobs came back to the economy. this isn't obama's win. this is tea party win. >> bob: you are an economist of sorts. one reason they kept spending cuts factored low next year and growing as they go along is taking spending out of the economy right now is the craziest notion imaginable. >> andrea: so is taxing. >> bob: i talked to a lot of liberals over the weekend. everybody is furious about this, i am, too, but i think obama had a gun to his head. it was extortion. he went along with it. regretly, he had to. worst legislation i seen. >> andrea: where you and i agree it's done damage to the republican party. the president because he ducked out of the debate for a long time, he hasn't been hurt by this. he is the absentee dad that shows up, doesn't play a role in the kid's life and college graduation he's in the pictur picture. i'm here now. >> bob: did we do the sandwich thing already? can we get it off the table? it smells so bad. >> kimberly: even the washington beast says the tea party has taken over washington. there is no left wing -- >> greg: the coffee party, the answer, remember the answer to the tea party? there is the real winner. >> andrea: all this talk of food and drink makes me huppingry. we have to go. coming up, we examine how the debt debate can influence the 2019 presidential election. stay close. ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ >> bob: it's me. right. okay. we've been talking about the presidential race in 2012, the presidential race. and the republican candidates. how does this debt deal if you want to call it that, this disgrace affect the presidential race in 2012? go ahead. >> andrea: i think a lot of candidates will be fearful to come out and support this thing, given full endorsement because they're afraid of your friends in the tea party. they will be careful. they have been quiet up until this point. it will be interesting to see when the super duper committee comes out in november which was just a few months before the ames straw poll to see how they handle the situation. before the straw poll, they are going to be -- the caucus, sorry. veer far right, i believe. expect them to be con servetive and -- conservative and not in favor of the plan. >> greg: the great thing about it, it will make the debate about one crucial question. reducing the size and cope of government. everybody will have the right answer, including the democrats. not just going to be the republicans that will be talking about reducing government. going to be your guys. >> bob: ahhh. >> greg: no one can talk about big government without looking irrelevant. >> bob: let me be irrelevant. i'm for big government. >> kimberly: let me be really relevant. i'm for small government. >> bob: really? being between you two is like you talk about a devil sandwich. >> greg: that sounds good. >> bob: a good sandwich on one hand. but a devil sandwich. >> kimberly: our horns hold up our halo. >> call me the business expert, i'm the one that has done this before. >> bob: you have. >> eric: i really think going forward in the election the economy will turn around a little bit. we'll see job creation and no way does the far left take credit for it no way does obama take credit for it. it will be a tea party victory. that's why people like mitt romney coming out saying i'm against the deal, bachmann saying i'm against the deal. rick perry when he gets in and wins will say i'm against the deal, i'm a tea party. they'll take credit. rightly so. >> bob: you are an excellent businessman. off beech house facing the ocean in new jersey. that's good -- you have a beach house facing ocean in new jersey. i had a shack in the back on a pond once myself. mitt romney, now is that a big surprise? that mitt romney would turn quickly and say no, i'm not for this thing? he is unbelieveable way he switches back and forth. it will cost him in the long run. perry, by the way, he was out addressing the most conservative republican tea party group in the west. western conservatives. he had a straw poll and the speech was terrible. he got 13% of the vote. the pizza man, mccain got 39%. perry got 13%. this is from