thank you for watching "fox and friends." we have special healthcare coverage next live from washington, d.c. with neil cavuto. tomorrow morning, join us extra hour early for coverage of the healthcare vote. >> 6:00 a.m. eastern. >> 6:00 a.m. eastern. see you then. captioned by closed captioning services, inc healthcare showdown. what's really up, doc? now, live from the nation's capitol, neil cavuto. >> welcome, everybody. well, do they have it? do they have the 216 votes they're going to need to make the largest piece of domestic legislation law? are they going to have that? and are we going to have what some people have been calling new deal ii, a reality in the next 24 to 36 hours? it's too early to tell. but democrats are already insisting they're getting there and they're making a great deal of progreprogress. battle here is not only whether they have the 216 votes, but whether the means by which they're getting those votes, congressional budget office score is reliable. we're getting indications from the c.b.o. they'll look to potentially restore a lot with new data taking into account medicare disbursement to doctors. some of them have been complaining they're really hurt by this and the best thing to do would be to more generously compensate for them or at least curtail the cuts in medicare. if that were to happen, obviously, it changes the c.b.o. math. all of that has to be decided likely in the hours ahead. later on today, president obama will be going to the building behind me to meet with the democratic caucus, all 253 members. many of whom are already guaranteed no votes on this thing. 36 by last count. who are going to more or less be there to hear the president and his pitch, but beyond that, just sort of hear the big guy out. that is set for 3:00 p.m. harry reid has already skipped a political fundraising event in nevada to make sure he is here for that big event, again at 3:00 p.m. eastern time. then we have the tea partiers. they are here right now and they are going to be coming probably in droves. you might be able to see some of them behind me. they're beginning to assemble at the west lawn at the capitol. some of them, believe it or not, have been stuck in traffic getting in this city, but they promise to come we're told by the thousands. all right. also this hour, we are going to be hearing from the likes of people who are very much involved in the vote. you heard a lot about the democratic congressman altmire, who is very much sort of wooed and cajoled to join everybody and make sure he was going to be on board. even a personal meeting with the white house did not change that. we're going to hear from don imus as well. the radio icon on what he makes of this fight. mark levin, another radio icon but in his legal foundation role here challenging the constitutionality of the so-called slaughter amendment, the new rule that would effectively mean the house doesn't necessarily formally vote yea or nay on legislation. tom delay will be here as well. the former majority leader. who better than the hammer to count the votes here? right now, to congressman altmire who joins us on where he stands right now, indicating late last night it would definitely be a no. congressman, you were certainly wooed appreciably by no less than the president of the united states. still a no. why still a no? >> i think a lot of people were wooed. in the end, i had to vote for my district, and i have serious policy concerns about the bill. there is 135,000 medicare beneficiaries in my district and i don't think this bill would have been fair to them. a lot of them are on medicare advantage. in the end, cost has to be an issue. as we talked many times, i was waiting to see a way this brought down the cost of healthcare. unfortunately, it doesn't. it just moves money around and changes who is paying the bill, shifts the burden from one group of people to another but it doesn't change the healthcare delivery system in a way to bring down the cost of healthcare. >> neil: all right. when you met with the president earlier in week, congressman, how did that go? what did he say? what did you say? what? >> it's been an ongoing conversation. i'm on a committee of jurisdiction that began taking up the bill in the summer, and of course, had the vote in the fall. it's a continuing conversation about what my concerns has been. the president was very precise about what the details of the bill were and how they felt they had addressed a lot of issues i had raised. in the end -- >> neil: sorry, sir. did you tell him where you were leaning and you would be hard-pressed to go the other way? >> i've had a conversation about my vote, yes. >> neil: was he disappointed? was he angry? what did he say? >> no. it's a vote for my district. i have things unique about my democrat with regards to medicare advantage and i have concerns that i don't feel were addressed enough in the bill with regard to bringing down the cost. i think i have to vote for my district first. i'm a representative. >> neil: okay. so there is this meeting, the entire democratic caucus, all 253 members, includes you. we'll be meeting with the president when he comes to the capitol later today. harry reid is going to be there. are you going to be there? >> i plan to be there, yes. >> neil: are the no guys, you know, there are 34 to 36 of you. hard to tell. are you in a separate cordoned off area? how is that going to go? >> i don't think so. it's open seating. i want to hear what the president has to say. it's a historic vote regardless of the side you're on. everybody would agree with that. it appears it will be a razor thin margin. every vote is going to count. we'll all be there to hear what he has to say. >> neil: what do you think, congressman, to some of your colleagues defying the majority will of their constituents? maybe for a variety of good reasons, whatever. but the vast majorities of whom argue this is not good and don't want their congressman to vote for this. what do you think of that? >> i'm not going to question the motives of any member. i can only judge what i'm doing with regard to my vote. i have to be accountable to my constituents. it's clear the overwhelming majority oppose the bill. again, i have very serious consideration with the policy of the bill as well. when you put the two together, no vote is the right vote for my district. >> neil: quickly, sir. assuming it does pass, a big leap i grant you, are you worried how the leadership will treat you, how the president will treat you going forward? >> i can't be worried about that. my main concern is i have to live the rest of my life in western pennsylvania and look my family, friends, and neighbors in the eye about the biggest vote of my career and i have to do what i feel is right. i'm confident i made the right decision. >> neil: congressman, always good having you. thank you very, jury m very muc. >> thank you. >> neil: at this hour, there is a meeting of the so-called rules committee in the house. it might seem arcane, but nothing arcane about what could be going on today. this is the committee, remember, that came up with the so-called "deem" rule that would effectively mean not formally vote up or down on healthcare but sort of deeming a vote. without getting into mechanics, suffice it to say the four republican minority members of the committee, have a slew of amendments, over 100, that could slow down the process or delay the vote. our producer chad joins me on the phone. what can we expect out of the rules meeting? how long could it drag on? >> neil, it's chad. i'm hearing somebody else here on the line. >> neil: all right. we'll try to correct that. but go ahead. okay. we're having problems with chad hearing me. >> i'm here, new york. hello. new york? >> neil: if you could fix that while i talk here. what we're looking at with this rules committee, and the reason it gets such attention, this could be at the least a vehicle by which republicans who are no fans of this measure, all 178 republicans are dead set against this, manage to find a way to pass this. we have the former house majority leader tom delay joining me, as good a count as anything staging something forand against on -- forand against on the hill. you see what is going on. are the votes there>> not right now. hard count is 31 to 33 democrat noes, which means that the noes are at 209-211. which means they're only four away from killing this bill. and -- >> neil: okay, you need 38 democrat democrats if republicans hope to stop it. >> actually 37. >> neil: all 178 republicans are against. >> 215 is a dead bill. >> neil: interesting. >> 215. if you tied 215-215, the bill does not pass. i'm focussed on the noes. >> neil: interesting. >> if they get 215, it won't pass. they're four away from getting 215. there's about ten pro-life democrats that are holding firm. and speaker pelosi is in a box she cannot get out of, because she cannot give them what they want. if she does, she loses 50 pro-abortion democrats. >> neil: in other words you might bring in bart stupak and the other midwestern largely catholic democratic representatives, but you lose tens of more pro-life. >> yeah. exactly. she had offered them last night a vote in this deeming rule on con current resolution, which means, resolution that has to be passed by the house and senate. >> neil: wouldn't the pro-life group hate that? >> the pro-abortion group would hate that. they would vote against the rule and the rule couldn't pass. >> neil: in other words, you have to be very careful if you're speaker pelosi the deals you make one with group backfire and have you lose another group. >> right. >> neil: does she get through it and find the mechanics or the means to get it through? >> i just think she does. i don't know. it's really up to the american people. if the american people will support the ten pro-life democrats and show them the support to give them the strength to hold firm, then she will lose. >> neil: all right. we're going to chad shortly. but this rules committee thing, and all the amendments and the republicans trying to slow it down. if you're right, they could be slowing down inevitable, delaying the inevitable. >> no. delay is good. [ laughter ] >> neil: very good. all right, tom delay, thank you. good seeing you. now back to chad. i hope we got the audio jinx fixed. can you hear me? >> i do, neil. >> neil: so, to the rules committee and what they're doing and what could come out of it. what are you hearing? >> the rules committee is the speaker's committee where they put together the final package of the reconciliation measure which will be on the floor yesterday. almost every piece of legislation that goes to the house floor must first get a rule to tell you what amendments are in order, how long people will be allowed to talk so on and so forth. that's what they do right now. the interesting rub in this, they will attach a self-executing provision to the rule, which will basically when they approve the rule to get the reconciliation bill up on the floor tomorrow, this will pass the senate bill. it's something that is used from time to time. it's not talked about much. the very arcane, in the weeds, parliamentary procedure here and it has a lot of people really upset. some republicans are saying well, there are not going to be a final vote on the senate bill. there will be a vote on the rule, and that will be the vote that passes the senate bill and sends it to the president to be the healthcare reform law of the land at least for now. >> neil: so, as things stand now and all the amendments that largely the republican minority, the four of them want to push, can they run out the clock? can the majority say we're putting a time limit on this, so you can't yap forever? what? >> the rules committee expects it to go for a long time. in the house, you have limited debate. the reason you have limited debate in the house is because of the rules committee. they'll set up tomorrow how long they will debate the reconciliation package. you can have almost unlimited numbers of amendments be offered. they are close to 100. only a couple offered by democrats. grayson and moore of wisconsin, and the others have all come from the republican side. this is the last-ditch shot to change the bill here. i almost said compared it to sysafis, the guy that rolls the rock up the hill and it comes back down on him each time. that's what happens especially when you have the speaker on board. that's what will probably happen to republicans today. >> neil: thank you. we have a reluctant bluedog everyone is trying to woo join us. hernry cuellar and the latest counts we are getting from people in the know in the building and whether they add up to what tom delay is adding up. who are we to doubt tom? we're not going to even try. pot bottom line, beautiful day in washington. traffic with the tea partiers trying to get here. it may affect how many get here. they want to protest this affair. in the middle of the you can't make this stuff up department, we have the national marathon going on. thousands of runners starting at the stadium and they're running away from the capitol. away. more after this. (announcer) we're in the energy business. but we're also in the showing-kids- new-worlds business. and the startup-capital- for-barbers business. and the this-won't- hurt-a-bit business. because we don't just work here. we live here. these are our families. and our neighbors. and by changing lives we're in more than the energy business we're in the human energy business. chevron. sweet & salty nut bars... they're made from whole roasted nuts and dipped in creamy peanut butter, making your craving for a sweet & salty bar irresistible, by nature valley. >> neil: all right. welcome back to the nation's capitol. neil cavuto here monitoring the sausage making up close and personal. on a grand scale, this is about as big as it gets. the single biggest domestic piece of legislation since the new deal. many argue certainly since medicare in 1966. that was then. this is about a $940 billion. some say excess of $1 trillion measure. now much depends, of course, later on when we get the final score of this from the congressional budget office, but that is later on. with us right now a guy who is being wooed aggressively both side, texas democrat qua henry cuellar. where do you stand? >> i looked at the c.b.o. numbers and the bluedogs with promising reduction of $38 billion on the deficit in the next ten years. $1.2 trillion after that. but i'm also now looking at what sort of impact will it have on the state budget this texas? i used to be on the budget for ten years in texas. been talking to some of my former colleagues to make sure we, you know, we analyze the impact that it has on texas when you expand medicaid expansiexpansion. in texas we have about 5.9 million individuals without insurance. texas without a doubt would become the biggest winner of funding that would flow in the state, $120 billion. the other thing, i'm a big tort reform democrat. i had language in the house bill, not in the senate bill. i think they should have tort reform, liability, limitations and i'm still working on it to see what we need to do to make sure what the texas medical association needed to protect the state tort laws is somehow we need to get this done. >> neil: all right. well, it sounds like you have a lot of ongoing concerns, but nancy pelosi has indicated that the bill is largely as-is. that, you know, there is no changing down the road. she could look at adding things and that sort of stuff, but if i understand her correctly, congressman, the bar is closed. no more add-ons. if that were the case -- if it were, and i know it's a big leap because i know things change rapidly in this city, are you going to vote no or yes? >> well, again, i'm still looking at the medicare expansion and how it will affect the state of texas. there are certain numbers that have come out. i've been talking with henry waxman and i'm waiting for analysis on the impact in texas. sort reform, i intend -- >> neil: i understand your concerns. if the c.b.o., the congressional budget office comes out later and says the efforts to compensate doctors for the medicare-related cuts they're looking at significantly add to the deficit and potentially cost even in your state, are you off this? >> well, at this time, i'm still doing the thoughtful analysis that i think i need to do. this is my district. this is the people that i represent. i'm still looking at that. i will return before the vote and make a decision. >> neil: but is the other stuff true that you're not taking the president's calls? >> put it this way. the white house has called, with all due respect to the white house, this is a decision i need to make for my district. it's not the white house decision. it's my decision. at the end of the day, i have to go back to my constituents and say this is the best decision i make either way. >> neil: i understand that. so the president calls and they say it's president obama on line one, you just don't pick up? >> the white house calls, i decided not to return the phone calls. >> neil: man! >> i'm going to see the president later on this afternoon. >> neil: all right, congressman, thank you very much. of course, he will be seen along with the many democratic colleagues when he descends on capitol hill later today. congressman joe sestak will join us, crucial vote in his own right. what he does see that the other congressman did not. then mark levin suing over slaughter. the great one after this. 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