The battle in 1836 when the mexican army vastly outnumbered forces. The alamo has a 300year history, going back to 1718. It was where it was established in san antonio. It moved a couple of times. What we are talking about today will be very much a part of that history. Xasare talking about the te General Land Office and the a lamo endowment joined forces to do and that is to coming up with a master plan to preserve and reinterpret the alamo site. We will talk about the details of this project. Id like to introduce the three people who are here. On my left immediate left is senator jose menendez. A formerenendez was city councilman in san antonio. Former democratic representative for district 24. During his time as a state representative, he spoke on the appropriations committee. He was on the House Committee for defense. One of the states Largest Mental Health programs. In february of last year, he won the election for state senator for district 26. Andncompasses san antonio one other mission. Inator menendez was a leader securing 25 million from the legislature. Improvementsr the on the present alamo facility. He was a senate sponsor on the bill that late thaid the groundwork. On his left is george p. Bush. George p. Bush has been a School Teacher in miami. He served in afghanistan. A businessman. Since january 2015, the commissioner of the texas General Land Office. The glo took over management of the alamo. It operated the site. Commissioner bush is the chair of the board of directors of the alamo endowment. It is really complicated. [laughter] to his left is phil collins. Hes phil collins. [laughter] theed that description in the program he is described as a musician and alamo enthusiast. Those are both underwhelming descriptions. He is one of the great musical icons of our age. Former lead singer and drummer of genesis. Artist whoble solo sold 100 million albums. An extension of my art. Seven grammys. The reason he is here i know the reason you are here is him i know the reason he is here hes the worlds leading private collector of alamo artifacts. I had the opportunity when i was writing an article to hang out collectionnd see his which is just amazing. Just to give you an idea of the stuff that is in it, you probably all know the famous letter that travis wrote from the alamo. Victory or dead, we will never surrender. There was a postscript that sa ys p. S. The lord is on our side. We had 20 heads in our alamo. Phil has the receipt from the bought. Hat he he has given it to the state of texas. [applause] so, we are going to talk about this master plan. Sometime in late november, the design firm will present the first draft of the master plan which will detail the recommendations for the alamo site. This will not be an easy task. Texas has been saying remember the alamo since 1836. But, exactly what we are supposed to be remembering has some confusion and controversy. That confusion extends to the alamo itself, beginning with the idea that this is the alamo. This is merely the perch of the eacrewhich is a thre mission compound. It looked much different back in the days of 1836. One inas a painting d 1847. You can see the alamo did not have its taco bell facade and much different looking. Someone a painting by phil knows well. He did some illustrations for your band. This is what the alamo complex look like in 1836 during the battle. This is the church which is what we saw in the early photos. These are the long barracks which still exist. Everything else is gone. Walls on the left side of the alamo are now i will show you. You have to reorient yourself. This is the alamo church. This is the convent, the long barracks. This is what used to be the western wall. This area here is the alamo footprint. Few pictures i took a few weeks ago. This is what used to be on the west side of the alamo. Various things like this. These buildings are historic thedings that were built in early 20th century. As you can see, it is not historical interpretation we might be talking about. I want to give you a little bit of grounding. Before we talk about the project i will get rid of that picture. Sorry. Beginning with, you senator menendez, a personal question. What the alamo means to you. You grew up Mexican American in san antonio so it might be a complicated place for you. What does it mean . Sen. Menendez absolutely. My mom and my uncles and aunt, she came to the u. S. Most of her family state in northern mexico. I would hear from them all the time. They gave me a hard time about the alamo. Becausehe oddest thing , whetherp in School People know what your answer yourery or not, mexican. When you go visit your family in mexico, you are gringo. Aboutide you a little bit texas and the u. S. Taking it. It was somewhat difficult, but i i alwayswing up, me, held onto the notion what is beautiful about the alamo is that is where the movement, the foundation, the strengthening of the movement to our independence as a nation for a while. I love the story that it was people from all walks of life. There were people of mexican descent, indians, people from all walks of life in that alamo fighting for one cause. They were given a choice. They could have left, but they chose to meet certain death. There is such a wonderful sentiment of just courage and determination. It is a great source of pride, but it has some mixed emotions. Loyalty,sarily a mixed just the fact of our history and how intertwined our history is with mexico. I think the best respect we can pay everyone is to be honest about it. Speaking about being intertwined, commissioner, you have a mexican mother and a texas born father. What is your experience with the alamo . Is it as complex as the senator . Mr. Bush my standpoint is more of a historic perspective. Ive loved the unique features of texas. I love military history. I served in the military myself. When you look at the alamo, it provides tourists a compelling experience. The opportunity to reimagine the alamo and for us to take that to another level. Who we are as a people, as texans. The alamo can be a centerpiece for taking on the controversial issues of the past. Whether it is slavery, whether it is mexican control of mexican texas. For a student of history, that is what draws me to this issue other than being land commissioner and day to day manager. I think it is an incredible educational opportunity. Phil, you are kind of the odd man out because you grew up in england. [laughter] had the longest fandom of the alamo. Phil in england where i was growing up, we had a little black and white television. On and the turned it wild frontier was on. Inre was something about him the jacket that appealed to me. When he went to this place, which was the alamo, and the impression i got, the memories i have of my impression were that these group of people knew that they were going to die but they went or they were there. ,here was something very noble very romantic in a way. Moved me. From that moment, i was obsessed. I used to draw the facade. Indians, orboys and mexicans and texans. [laughter] as ive gotten older, ive years, to the last 25 i have read every book i can. Ive found out a lot more. It was not quite as black and white as it was portrayed by hollywood. In john waynes over romanticized films, as beautiful as it was. I loved it was not quite as black and white. That is one of the things i think would be good in this day and age. Thatt it into context there were brave men on both sides. Bits that make up this story. Hat is what i am very keen on prejudices lot of that still exist. In this day and age, it all needs to be much more addressed. It is a wonderful place. Im totally obsessed by it. Collecting as well. The firstd me once, time you saw the alamo was like meeting a beatle. Phil it was. 1973, itrst came in was me and Peter Gabriel and our tour manager and we had two to three days off. I said we have to go to the alamo. You could drive you could the alamo was on my left. It was a time i saw it wonderful experience and it still is. Go there quite often i still walk around the ground and think about what happened there. Im in love with it. I would like to invite you to a ceremony that happens every year. Theyin the mid1990s, found some bones and they saw who was very. Bburied. It was native americans. The descendents once a year have a ceremony. I want to thank the commissioner for helping make sure that still happens to honor their descendents. It is one of the most moving experiences. Of the natives americans were buried at sunrise. They go for a run. It is a very moving experience. It is something unlike you would ever see. Phil that is the kind of thing have beenpeople battling with this. 1836, but there is more that must not be ignored. With theve discussed endowment. , the indianremonies these ceremonies should happen. 1836, it was built on an indian burial ground. Can you walk us through the history of this project . How it began, how you got involved . Sen. Menendez when i came into offic mr. Bush when i came into office, it was scheduled to expire. The then attorney general greg there was an audit on the Financial Management of the alamo. It resulted in the legislature to hand over the custodian ship. And i it tough decision decided we needed to go in that direction. I put together a board to come up with day to day management. Fromtexans, most of whom san antonio. Im not sure we have any Board Members here this morning. We have gene powell, Brett Mccombs in said antonio. San antonio. We are excited about the board. One of the first things they wanted to commission was conducting a global search. Im pleased to welcome the owner. He comes to us from philadelphia to help restore Independence Mall in philadelphia. Conducted very exhaustive searched. I encourage everyone of you to meet him. E secondw, were in th phase of a five phase master plan which we are open on a transparent basis on how to restore the site. ,e want to bring authenticity restore credibility, and reversibility to any construction. George will be commissioning those designs in december. I encourage you to visit our website to communicate with the public, facebook, twitter. We have the social media platforms. There were three buildings on the west side of the plaza. Crockette and buildings. We are the landlords of that beautiful slide you s howed earlier. Those leases are fairly longterm. They are unbreakable. In that instance we are very open and honest with merchants in the vicinity. I happen to be a small businessman myself. Even Business Owners in the area recognize the need for more his storystory. To those who have visited other battle sites in the u. S. , that is what we are trying to create. Sen. Menendez my understanding though in that those businesses in the area somehow the solution to their relocation, if they are willing to be a party to amending those contracts, they will be willing . Mr. Bush that is my understanding. They have been more than understanding. It is not acrimonious. We are optimistic. What was the process like . Is there bipartisan agreement on this . Sen. Menendez you gave me a lot of credit. Room. Ked him in the back you should be listed as a joint author on the bill. Who helps you get the legislation through. And i love about the alamo san antonio is that when were welcoming people, please consider it your second home. People feel so welcome. For people that have anything to government, everyone feels the alamo is a part of the state. It is located in san antonio, but it is really where our honest, earnest definition for our independence started. Phil came to the capital last session and was gracious enough to take lots of selfies, sign autographs and hang out with a lot of elected officials. I think after they heard phils story like we heard a few moments ago, even though they had it is unfortunate. Sometimes when somebody is in your own backyard, you dont think of it as much. Phil refocused that for a lot of people. It was not as hard as anybody might think. The issue was how much. We were able to agree we needed 5 million for the foundation. The commissioner had that on his list of what he needed to keep the place up and running. Some of the leadership in the senate were very clear with me. Were going to entrust you with this. Dont go out and get a low bid for shoddy workmanship. That is what is so important that led us to george. Having worked on the supreme court, Independence Hall, a worldrenowned restorer of Historic Places that is what we need. I took a group of neighborhood leaders on a tour and the alamo is one of our stops. Many of them were saying we have not been here in years. Is that it . It was a feeling that they got off the bus, you have to cross a street. It didnt feel like an Independence Hall or gettysburg. Regardless of where you come from, i really dont care what originates the feeling of concern for this piece of history, but i want every child to have an opportunity to get the importance of what this place was and where it stands in our history. It is almost like getting to watch the birthplace of a great state. Id love to see it given that respect it deserves. Philsof the elements of collection the master plan is yet to be unveiled or presented in a draft, but phil, do you have a sense of how youd like your stuff to be shown . [laughter] yeah. Anybody. T upset as an englishman, i feel more dangerous. I started to think about what youroing to happen in affairs. My accountant asked what am i going to do with the alamo . It should go to a museum. My youngest child was a little upset. He can name all the people involved. I went to a couple of museums and looked. Iyou know, its like went into one of them, but it. As very pristine things were arranged very neatly. It didnt seem to be what i wanted or what i imagined. Here and theyseum wereave some exhibits that reserved. I think that is what i would like. Times. And i met a few d on getting that kind of feel. Ivet would like collected a lot of things, but i lots of smalld things. Soldiers. I think itd be nice to show that to those people rather than most museums put them in boxes and you would never see them. I think it would be great to show most of the stuff. I dont want it to be in boxes. There is no point in having this in boxes. Yes, id like it all to be displayed in context. I think that is probably what would happened. I will be involved in how its displayed. From being a five or sixyearold who loved the whole story. The only story i knew was what we were all fed by hollywood. , we know eachow other very well. To be sitting here talking about this place that i have loved since i was six years old is extraordinary. Im very proud to be here and very proud to put my collection in these hands. No one ever saw it. Now, people will be able to see it. I think that is a great thing. People will enjoy it. [applause] i think the alamo is a unique historical site. The alamo was given to the daughters of the republican to operate as a shrine. Deep at the base of the alamo story is the noble selfsacrifice. Even today, its regarded a shrine. There is a sign on the front of the alamo church. They are really serious. You leave your hat off when you go inside. Is there a ask tension between the idea of the site anda historical bridged . Gap be think it isz i positive. When people do not care, you ignore it. I like that. I think the alamo is enough of an important place to have phases. I think the chapel is a place where religious ceremonies, wheres, weddings, important rituals have been that should be. You have more on those grounds to expand. I think the chapel should be recognized as what it was. As we do the master plan, we have opportunities to lay out. Opportunityan however it goes forward may be ieces the soldiers laid out and he fell there. It is something that doesnt take eight minutes that the average visitor spends today. You actually experience what it was like. You have these very important battles. So many people have written to me, particularly from outofstate. There is nothing about rewriting history. We want history plus. Therefore, there is the opportunity to say this is where agriculture took place. This is where all the things happened. I think your collection and all the things we find will tell a broader story. When i started collecting, my view was to get things from the alamo. Aware of whate led to it and what came from it. The obsession grew. This is like a little umbrella underneath a huge umbrella. Two things. From garytalk foreman about rebuilding. I think it will end up like a movie set. Herehow you people come people come to see the alamo because of what they know about. And constructing tease people. You cannot play a lot of new things. You play what they know. In certain parts to gain their trust and then you hit them with something new. Ims psychological warfare, sorry. [laughter] it is the way you end up winning an audience. That is the similar thing we ,ave to do if you lay out 50 100 years of history before 1836, people will glaze over it. The way it could work best as a museum. Sense of have an the wrong way to do this . In terms of bridging the gap. I guess another question is what kind of push back the get from people . The senator mentioned people are saying you are going to ruin it. Pope is a kind of mom and feeling to the alamo that some people might miss. How do you incorporate all these constituencies, these no stalgic constituencies to the place . Mr. Bush i agree with the senator. That is what makes this place so special. For an example, our group had a chance to travel. Ofw do you tell the story slave quarters in the vicinity where 100 years before that the drafters were working on this important document . I cannot think of anything more difficult, more complicated than that. For those of you who may have had a chance to visit it, we know great things were drafted, but there is also a story to the postcolonial era. That is what we are attempting to do. Threes not about the panelists in the master plan. We are fully engaging the publics opinion, knowing we have to prioritize. Our senator also mentioned i welcomen he would millions to ground zero and into the museum, he noticed whether it was relatives of somebody who lost a loved one on 9 11 or someone from the middle east, everyone has their own interpretation, connection to the visit itself. It is thecognize biggest challenge we encounter. Is annal point, and this important timeline for us, the philactual agreement with is we have to have a permanent demonstration for his private collection. Unless you are willing to amend that agreement. This will be a challenge. That is why we welcome Public Feedback as we move forward. The timeline is also constructive. We need to have a little pressure on it. Does deserve a seat. Councilman worked very hard to start interest in renewing the alamo space. We had a great partner in getting it passed through the senate. He has been very active and vigilant. He has worked hard from his days on city council and now as a state rep. He continues to be fully engaged. Million 31. 5 million, that is not the cost of this thing. That is the startup money. Guys will have to raise and citizens will have to raise a ton of money so beware. I have asked for 5 million. With the type of budget, it will be more difficult. The private sector will be a part of it. If you include phils collection, which we can estimate the value of that, the city has a bond package going to voters this november. Hopefully, there will be future contributions. We are looking at a nine digit number to make this happen. Most people recognize we have to do it. One other you touched on this we will reach024, the 300th anniversary of the construction of the church. That is a deadline we are all seeking to stick to. We have time for questions from the audience. Are there microphones here . Go ahead. Bob . It is hard to see with the lights. There are microphones. Good morning. Great panel. Congressman had language in to 2017 appropriations bill start negotiating with all of the possibility of a Federal Building being part of the master plan. The beautiful historic buildings, it would be a great place for phil collins collec tion. The communication didnt work out for the library. It has a home. Why doesnt the state move to purchase that . The state currently does not have the funds . I can address that first question. The congressmen deserve a lot of credit. At the federal level. Was right within his district. He recognizes this is the most important historic landmark we have. He joined us during a reception honoring phil. He gave us an update on the master plan activities. We are thankful for his support. With respect could you tell people what the garcia building is . Mr. Bush the Federal Post Office building is located at the northwest location where the original compounds were located. Regretfully, there is very little, from my understanding, of what we can do to redevelop and repurpose it. It is a building that the federal government has invested quite a bit of capital into. There are federal tenants in there. A few members of the state legislature have offices. It could be utilized for exhibit space, administrative space. All options are on the table right now. Because of our partnership with the federal level, we can utilize that building potentially and the contributions of the master plan. That is right with the wall was. Mr. Bush it sits on the original footprint. [laughter] it has wonderful mosaics. A beautiful building. A new federal courthouse in san antonio. The could be some possibilities. We are constantly in communication to look at any and all options. It is my understanding they have their agreement. We feel confident that the allection will be good from management perspective. Were not only opportunistic with respect to real estate, but with respect to historic collections in the area. Just to be clear, the litigation that the daughters put against the state, as you mentioned that is an important point because a lot of people think it was over the daytoday management of the alamo. We are constantly in contact. Now that we are out of the litigation, we can now focus on the Bigger Picture items. Is there are microphone . Today, the alamo is compared itthe first time i saw it, was like you turn a corner of downtown and there it is. Could you address how it went rded and all that property being used for other purposes, and today where it is public ground. There is land, lets put a building here. Thebush as was mentioned, earlys was there as an 20th century construction. It is protected by the historic code. Imagery of overhead the vicinity of the alamo. Tourists visit the grounds, why is it in the middle of san antonio . So, this is the most visited site in the state. We hear just about everything. That will be one of the challenges we face. I think there are other case studies in the country where state governments have come together to create more of that. There are complications that we have. We are in Constant Contact for alternatives. My question was more about the interim period. It was a Pivotal Point in history between 1836 and the early 19th century, was it just another place . And helps to look at very old photographs. You can look at some stables and the hotel. We lost. To remember one of the things we find interesting is not a lot of places honor where they had a tremendous loss. Typically, you try to remember your big victories. What is important is the wwe have grown up to accept what happened as a turning point in our history. There was a time where the city was growing and people were trying to go on with commerce. It was just the center of the city. We cannot be responsible for the mistakes of the past. Here we have a gentleman from england to tell us a story how this move him as a child, to collect for his whole adult life, and that it is so important that he is probably one of many examples. We have to impart that same type of reverence on our own citizens, our own people in the state to understand what happened so maybe they will get interested in what happened. His son probably knows more about most of our kids. I think im so glad to have them working in partnership with the members of the legislature because i want us to understand our history so we can better understand ourselves better who we are. In doing so, we will live better. In the very beginning, it was said there was a lack of authenticity, genuine and honest with each other. The more we do that, the easier it is for us to get along. City i also think that the sites inare very few the middle of a town. Encroached upon the compound and the footprint. The only thing i can think of is the tower of london. You still have the walls from medieval times. London has grown up around that achingt actually encrochi on that area. Most of these site are out of town. Here you have traffic. Court thereally system and the way you modify it. Fntertaining the idea o changing it. My question is related. I want to set the record correct senator menendez, you did not oppose the bill. Sen. Menendez i dont know what side you are putting me on but go ahead. [laughter] and land use that is the controversy with the master plan. Others have been declared historical site. All of a sudden come around it , around it is real estate sites. Makee congregations and sure that development is keeping with those closeknit communities and neighborhoods and it doesnt become hotels. Mr. Bush i cannot really speak to the other master plans. We areect to our plan, constantly engaging local entrepreneurs, Business Owners, asset owners. I was in galveston meeting with owners in terms of ways we can work together. We can do this in a collaborative way where everybody wins. One of the best suggestions we is that a lot of local Business Owners are impressed with the fact that we engage them on a daily basis. We will do this in a sensible way. We will do it in a way that the Community Benefits and the community will be more engaged than ever. Im interested to know why you said we didnt lost. They didnt lose the war. That battle. Ns won i have friends who are hispanic that take their children to the alamo to remind them they didnt lose. Sen. Menendez this is what i love about texas. The first thing they say is im texan. Have yout say noticed that . [applause] me and my cousins got into a lot of arguments. Im proud of our history. Every society has had its blemishes. Slavery is the biggest we have had. The issue for me is i just want us to be honest. I tell my children the same thing i feel. My parents were immigrants. You are an american of hispanic descent. Im proud of my mexican family my cuban family. So in american, a texan view history through that. I want to be honest about that. I want to be mature enough to say, yeah. [laughter] [applause] i think we have time for one more question. I was going to ask a question to phil. With your love of alamo history a recordingt as influencew much of an has alamo history been on you as a recording artist . What is the piece you really want to see get a good location within the alamo . Ive leftnt think songs about the alamo and texas for other people. They would do better than i would and there is a lot of it. I think one of the things that relating to the gentleman before about winning and losing and who was right and wrong, good guys and bad guys. I was was five or six, fed who were the good guys and who were the bad guys by hollywood. It was the romance of the thing. In my songwriting, that feeling comes over with a lot of my music. There is ay albums, song where i put a couple of lines about that. One of them was to always try to do the right thing. That is one of the things that i kind of remember thinking when i saw the wild frontier. They were at this place and doing what they thought were as right. In terms of the collection, theres so many things. On any given day, i could go down when i was seeing it every day in my house, i would just go down there to look, grabbed a book. Each day, there would be something and i would think that is amazing. Bowing knife. The i have another items like a sword that was taken at the alamo. Any given day, it changes. Givenrst thing i got was to me by my wife. It was a receipt for john w. Smiths saddle. I have had a constant fascination with him ever since because there are no images of him. He was the first anglo mayor of san antonio. His wife had a photograph. Fearsome looking woman. [laughter] women were different in those days. There are no images of john w. Smith. I was fixed on that piece for the receipt of the saddle. How many miles that saddle had gone. Going in and out of the alamo. That was a fascinating piece for me. Littlees the receipts, scratches of paper. There is so much story behind them. It is going to be great that people can see this. Im excited thinking about it. We are out of time but thank you all so much for coming here. [applause] you are watching American History tv, 48 hours of programming on American History every weekend on cspan3. Follow us on twitter for information on our schedule and to keep up with the latest history news. History,tures in professor Heidi Hohmann teaches a class on the development of automobiles and parkways and how innovations made for those were later used in development of americas freeways. She highlights the she describes how many early parkways were seen as as that it experiences, not just a road. Her classes about one hour and 10 minutes. Ok, gang. Ann today we are looking at the development of roads and the role of the Landscape Architect in early road development. You guys probably know that you dont know a lot of Landscape Architects who do roads. It is not something we associate with land that Landscape Architecture, but it was not always so. The modern freeway that i drive every day has its roots in
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