Ill just say that i think a choice not to get a vaccine is not a riskfree choice. Its a choice to take a different and more serious risk. The time has come, actually, where we need to explain ourselves better. For my parents, as brian alluded to earlier, for my parents generation, vaccines were not something you had to convince people about nor my generation. But i think the Younger Generation today dont see these as they didnt grow up with them. I think you need to explain what it means to not get a vaccine, and we need to step back and show that this is not something that sells itself anymore. We have to make it clear why its so important to do this. We have to be patient about making it clear, because its very frustrating when people dont see this thing thats so easy for us, but i think brian sort of makes that point. Thanks. A very short one. If someone comes up to me now and says, i dont believe in vaccines, instead of jumping back and saying, its not about faith, its about science, i now ask why. And it opens a whole different conversation, so i would encourage people just to ask why if you hear that. I think my last message is we tend to focus in Health Education about writing facts. But in my line of work, context is everything. We need to help parents, we need to help the policy discussions, understand the context of vaccination. It is helping people to imagine how life without vaccines will be different than life as it is now with vaccines and the vaccination race that we have. 70 years ago, 80 years ago, parents said things like, no, son, you cant go to the pool today because of the epidemic. In the u. S. Today, we dont say things like that, precisely because vaccines have accomplished the goal of making these diseases rare. But if we move forward and do not, as a society, maintain vaccination rates, we open the door to a different kind of life, to a return back to a life in which parents have to fear, parents have to think about these types of questions in their daytoday life. Its that kind of choice that we need to remind people of as theyre considering and weighing all the elements of the vaccine picture. Ill just reiterate the point about what can be done. There have been state legislatures in different parts of the country, it was mentioned Washington State and california and others that simply just make it more difficult to opt out. And its not only a matter of making it more difficult, but also, from what i understand, most of the ways this is done is if you want to opt out instead of just signing a form and giving it to the school principal, you have to sign a form and then have a conversation with a medical professional, pediatrician or practice nurse, et cetera, and then they sign it after you have the conversation, and just that extra step is very helpful because hopefully people are becoming convinced with that extra conversation or maybe just the extra hoop to jump through makes it that they would rather just go ahead and get the shots. So that does seem like its working in some states, according to early returns, and so thats all i have to say. Thank you. Id like to thank you all for coming. Id like to thank the panel for an interesting discussion. Id like to thank nova for embracing such a film. I would like to thank the Journal Institute for cosponsoring this briefing with us. As a reminder, youll be able to see a webcast of this session in the next few days, and you can follow all the conversation about the film on twitter with the atvaccinesnova. Again, thank you so much for coming. [applaus [applause] new york senator Charles Schumer will be at the National Press club tuesday. Well have that live at 10 00 a. M. On cspan. On cspan2, a discussion on the negotiations of the iran nuclear program. The talks will be extended another seven months. Thats by the brookings institution, and you can watch it live at 10 30 a. M. Eastern. And later in the day, president obama will speak about immigration policy at an event in chicago. It will be live at 5 30 eastern on cspan. This thanksgiving week, cspan is featuring interviews from retiring members of congress. Watch the interviews through thursday at 8 00 p. M. Eastern. Ive often said the republicans do have a legitimate argument here, by the way, in that theyre not being allowed to offer amendments. Well, theyre not being allowed to offer amendments because of filibuster bills. The best way to get rid of it is just get rid of the filibuster, but at the same time guarantee to the minority and new rules in the senate that the minority will be allowed to offer jermaine amendments to any bill thats on the floor. Jermaine amendments to that legislation with reasonable time limits for debate. I wont even qualify it by saying probably. The most eloquent order in the congress. Henry told me one time i think i remember this correctly he said, im not wild about this, but there are 23 americans serving prison sentences for committing perjury. How do you justify that and then turn a blind eye to the president . He said, i cant do it. Ill always remember henry saying that. Also on thursday, thanksgiving day, well take an American History tour of various native american tribes. Thats at 10 00 a. M. Eastern following washington journal. Then at 1 30, attend the groundbreaking ceremony of the new Diplomacy Center in washington with former secretaries of state. And Supreme Court justices clarence thomas, samuel alito and sonia sotomayor. Look at the use of technology in Disaster Relief efforts, including the search for lost airliners and people. He moderates the discussion with matt gross and others about whether or not its possible to become lost in todays interconnected world. The new America Foundation event is just over an hour. Thanks very much. Well, welcome, everybody. Thanks for coming out. You know, were here to talk about technology, and so much of the time we tend to turn to technology to solve our problems. And weve gotten so good at it that a lot of times the technology solves those problems before we really had a chance to think about whether the problems are really entirely problems or maybe theres something that were losing in the process as well. Maybe that thing that we saw was beneficial to us in some ways. So tonight were going to talk about a way that technology has made our lives better has maybe taken something away from our lives. My name is jeff wise, as you heard. Im a science journalist and ive recently been writing a lot about mh370, the missing malaiysian airliner. People have been baffled by this case because if i lose my iphone, i can find that. How come we cant find this 250footlong plane with 200 people on board . How is that even possible . But before that, i was very interested in the idea of being lost. I was a travel writer, originally, and i saw what a value in that sensation of being lost, so i might have two parts of this question, and i think from our panelists, youll see a kind of divide here. Are we in favor of getting lost or are you against getting lost . Let me introduce you to the panel thats here with us tonight. To my right we have wendy harmon. She is the director of Information Management and Situational Awareness for Disaster Services at the American Red Cross. Maybe she can tell us a little more about herself as we dive into this topic. Next to her is clarence ordell who is a Research Scientist at cna safety and security. Cna doesnt stand for anything, im told. Im sure it stands for a lot of important values. Next is matt gross. Hes the editor of bon app er bon appetit. Com. Hes an expert at getting lost everywhere. And he also, in fact, did an eightpart series for the times about specifically trying to get lost. So hes in favor of getting lost. Hes going to tell you how to do it. But, anyway, maybe just to take really, these people have fascinating things to say. I dont want to monopolize the mic here, but people say, get lost, buddy, or lost at sea. Its a terrible problem. Nobody wants to get lost. But there was kind of a positive aspect to it when you think of the chet baker song, get lost, there is a feeling of getting disconnected or getting lost from the part of the world youre obligated to. In the last 10 or 20 years, say, since the turn of the century, we found ourselves any adult human being is presumed to have a smartphone and has not only instant communications to the whole world, but they know where they are. Theyve got the gps right there in their pocket, and the authorities know where you are, too. If you dial 911, they know where you are so they can come help you. Thats a great thing. You can get help wherever you are whenever you need it. Here we open it up, in that, is there a problem in that . Have we lost something in that we no longer need to venture out in the world with this question looming in my brain where am i . Am i going to be able to get back to where i started from . Maybe i could open this up there are positive aspects of getting lost. Do you work for American Red Cross . I do. How do you help people who are lost and what are certain situations . Well, part of the mission of the red cross, really, is to reconnect families with each other after major disasters happen. Whether thats actually a war from our international rc, an arm of the red cross, or here domestically, we have a whole system called safe and well where, after a disaster, we encourage people to register themselves so their friends and family can find them. I dont want to get too deep right away, but how many of you know what google person finder is . Thats something google came up with which is entirely open to looking and checking for people. Ours is a much more antiquated system but thhas all these safe measures in it, so you have to know about the person youre searching for when you find them. A tsunami hits, we get swept out to sea, we have to find our way back. Is that the kind of situation youre talking about . Probably less that than just being unexpectedly displaced and maybe not having been at work or something and then a disaster happens and you end up in a shelter or some other location which frequently happens in c s catastrophic events or big ones. It happens in most significant disaster events where there are definitely families who get separated from one another. Is this inconvenience or is it lifethreatening . It depends on the situation. Its more about less about life threatening and more about when youre feeling lost, you just want to reconnect with your family. So having the tools to be able to do that, and i think honestly, it probably is more a demand on the side of people looking for the lost people, yeah, than it is the people who are lost. I did a research for an article about search and rescue, and 20 years ago, most search and rescue operations were initiated because someone hadnt shown up at the appointed time and place and their relatives or their friends called the search and rescue center and said, you know, joe blow wasnt here, can you go find him . Nowadays, most search and rescue operations are initiated by the person who is lost. They call up and say, come and get me. Im in a canyon somewhere. Part of compounding this problem is because people have this power, this immense power in their pocket, they will go out in the wilderness without first looking at a map, and there is a certain over reliance. Overreliance and overconfidence. Maybe something we can talk about is the difference between information, like knowing that your phone is telling you to go north and then turn left, to actually understand where you are. If you look at a map, you have to say, okay, the lake is over here, the mountains are over here, i understand the environment. You dont have to have any understanding when you have a phone, because if youre lost on a map, at least you know where the map is. There was a case a few years back, and this kind of thing happens recurringly. A couple got in their car. Vegas. They were in canada. They plugged in destination vegas and they said shortest route instead of faster route. It took them through logging areas and cabins and the man ended up dying. I forgot to ask you more about your sort of background. Maybe you can tell us a little bit about what you do and how information and all that sure, sure. I guess i kind of owe what i do in part to wendy. Ive been at cna safety and Security Team for about five years now. We do a lot of work on Disaster Response but also accident responding. Shortly after i got to cna in 2009, 2010 was the haiti earthquake, and that was really kind of the first time it entered the powerful consciousness about text messaging and these new technologies to aid folks after a disaster. Since then, i ran across wendy there was a crisis data conference at the red cross, and it was the first time you saw these technologists come together with the First Responders and started talking about issues amongst the two. Since then ive really been interested looking at the intersection at that space on a couple levels. One is in terms of emergency responders, like the people who are charged with finding them if they get lost. As you say, we may make a phone call when were lost, but disasters as well, they did some great work on people sending out tweets or facebook posts after a disaster. I know the first earthquake i ever experienced was actually in virginia a couple years ago. You couldnt get any texts or anything out, and i actually didnt know what an earthquake was. I went to check twitter to see, is this an earthquake . Yeah, there was one in new york a couple years ago and i was like, what the heck is that . Yeah, you go to twitter and 30 second ago, it said, earthquake. So in haiti, do people have cell phones in the density they have them here . Definitely, definitely. The developing world, if you will, is smart not smartphones, but phones. Penetration would be probably more than an american venture. Not smartphones, though. Text messaging becomes a very kind of good way for folks to communicate and get all types of information after a disaster. So people are putting the information out there, so the work ive been doing is trying to understand and look at, okay, how can we use this information to understand peoples behaviors better but also understand kind of movements and how can Emergency Managers use that information after a disaster . Theres been a whole host of kind of interesting competitions, case studies and research in that space around how can we use the crowd source, if you will, for locating people in a disaster situation. I think we have a real life example here. I want to ask the audience how many people heard a screeching from their phone about 3 00 this afternoon . Yeah . And a buzzing. I guess it could manifest itself in different ways, but this is an example of what he was talking about. I happen to have gotten my cell phone in los angeles 15 years ago now, and i still have the area code 323, and yet my phone was telling me about flash flooding in this area. So clearly they knew where i was. I dont know how accurately, but this is a great benefit, potentially a little bit weird and scary, you know, and we were talking on the phone a couple days ago and i asked him, can they find so if theyre expecting some kind of Natural Disaster trouble in a certain area, they can find everyone who is in that area. Youre saying yes. How accurate is that . Its pretty accurate, i think. I dont know all the technical specs for doing it, but its based on cell tower pings. So anybody within the area that cell tower is serving can get it. Can they say, okay, lets find the cell phone numbers of everybody in this campsite . No. As far as we know. Right. Weve been hearing about the usefulness of this really saving lives, important things like that. But i do want to look at the nuances of this. Do you have a smartphone in your pocket at all times . You were telling me recently youve been traveling for fun and for work. Oh, yeah, who doesnt have a smartphone in their pocket all the time . But theres two kinds of travel that i do. Theres travel for with my family on vacation and going somewhere where its practical and needing to know how to get from point a to point b. We were at a pool party in suburban new jersey this weekend, and my wife and kids would not have appreciated it if i threw my phone out the window and just tried to wing my way to ridgewood, is that a town . Yeah, ridgewood. But then theres the travel for a travel story, and specifically the travel stories i do for the times is a getting lost series where i decided after years of intensive attention that i paid on all these technologies on my phone, on the internet that had sort of trained me in being very astute and capable and a research traveler, i was just tired of that stuff. I kept thinking of great times earlier in my travels when i was in my early 20s or even when i was almost 8 years old and got lost in an Amusement Park in denmark. The world seemed so much more full of possibility and openness. That was not a terrifying experience . It was terrifying. Getting lost, especially when youre seven years old, is terrifying, but its also a moment when you learn what youre capable of. You learn how you react in a situation that youre absolutely unprepared for. And what you do with those moments determines, you know, the course of your life in some ways. It shows you who you are. It teaches you, hopefully, that youre capable of dealing with these situations. You set out to intentionally get lost. I quickly realized that there were different ways of defining lossness. What i would do is i would pick a destination and i would go there with no hotel reservation, no plans, no contacts, no guide book, no map, no looking at my phone at googlemaps, just show up and be there for a week or so, lets see what happens. Get off the plane and i really have no idea where im going to go, what im going to do. And so what i realized the problem of getting lost for me on a basic geographic level is i have a really good sense of direction. I can look at the sun and know what direction im heading. Every man thinks he knows where hes going. I really do. The first time was in morocco. There was a huge medina with all these twisting alleyways with no sig signs. As i walk through the medina, its on a hill. If im going downhill, im going toward the sea. If im going uphill, im going away from the sea. When youre traveling and youve been around, its hard to tu