Library many years ago to work on the book, a staff come up to me and say to me, unsolicited, do you know that so and so was here, so and so and listing all the famous historians but then they said to me, you know who our favorite is . David mccullough he was here and he was the nicest and said to this me. He was appreciative. Im enjoying the stories. So what i did was that night before i came in the next day to finish my research, i went out and bought doughnuts for the staff figuring they might Say Something about me. Not in the same breath as David Mccullough but in that respect. One other thing, i think we would all agree and its without question that David Mccullough is the most celebrated, revered historian of our times. Hes a National Treasure. [ applause ] hes a National Treasure not only the president ial medal of freedom and multiple pulitzers, National Book aday and as gay said, too many awards to announce. But also, the voice which was alluded to earlier. I have always loved mr. Mcculloughs voice, narrating the american experience, ken burns wonderful documentary on the civil war, reading when iz books and other things. So on that note, theres something i wanted to say to him but i thought i would share it publicly. When i grew up, jacque cue stow was my hero. I remember a line said to jacque cue stow. Loved and used to have it on the office door at the university. If the ocean could speak i would have a french accent is what they said to him. So ive always felt that whenever i go to a battlefield or president ial home or a Historic Site when it talks to me it sounds like David Mccullough. Thank you. History sounds like David Mccullough. So lets start our question and answer. I want to discharge something. Joseph ellis, who helped to organize the program and it was our first speaker, he pulled me aside and said you have to ask David Mccullough the following question. I said, of course. Heres his question. He would like to know if you would like to tell the audience, is there a secret love affair of Abigail Adams youre willing to admit to . Who has he been talking to . [ laughter ] i am i feel very strongly that if i can with my work bring to light, bring down stage to full theatrical recognition people who deserve that now but didnt get it at the time or havent gotten it, that im fulfilling a need that is important. Its one of the reasons i wanted to write about harry truman. I thought he was vastly underrated and didnt get enough credit for what he did that took a great deal of courage. I felt the same way about john adams. I felt the same way about emily robling, the wife of washington robeling, the builder of the Brooklyn Bridge and when he contracted the bends and put out of commission, apparently early in the project, she took over. And never got sufficient credit for it. Right, right. She was a brilliant, brave and impressive person. I felt the same way about catherine wright, the sister of the wright brothers. I dont think they would have succeeded with their bold innovation had it not been for her. And the same, of course, with innumerable qualities of evidence, Abigail Adams. Its the vogue now to be recognizing women. And its long overdue. And i thought one of the most [ applause ] the day of the womens march was to me one of the most uplifting events of the last 20 years or so. Agreed that. That it wasnt just happening in washington or new york or los angeles. All over the world. High time. And i dont years ago i read a book called the natural superiority of women. Marvelous book by anthropologist at princeton of ashley montague. Did your wife recommend it to you . No. I forgotten who recommended it but ashley montague, as i said, was a professor at princeton. He was a graduate student and working for another anthropologist and just discovered a huge collection of bones. Human bones. And this boy, this young mans assignment down the basement of one of the princeton academic buildings was to sort the female bones from the male bones. And so he did this all day long and he began to look at the bones. He realized that as it appeared to him the womens bones designed by a brilliant sculptor and the male designed not by a very good student of sculpture trying to learn the trade and he thought are there other indications of women being better designed, better equipped to survive . And he saw that women live longer, as we know. Women are less susceptible to disease. Theyre stronger. On if you dont use weight. Right. They can lift certain things in certain ways that men cant do very well. His theory was that this all had to do with survival as a race. As an animal thee chcreature, i will. Only thing the men had to do is kill the bear or whatever and bring it back to have dinner. Where he had to plant his seed but the women, women had to survive much longer because we are the only species that we have to wait for the brain to mature. And every other animal comes on the earth and is ready to roll almost immediately. Right. Whereas we cant. Women have to be around much longer in order for the species to continue. And then i began studying my own dear wifes memory and her ability with words. And i thought, whoa. Were missing something important here. In our whole way of life. That maybe, maybe they are superior. So lets put them in charge of everything we can. And let them also have the freedom to do what they are biologically designed to do, which is to give birth and raise children. That giving birth and raising children is not in itself a sub standard role in life. But if you have a desire or if theres a need or if theres an obvious opening for you to do something else, by all means, do it. Ive had wonderful time writing about people like willie kather and mary ka sat and wonderful americans of considerable importance and whose path through life is a lesson we need to learn more about. Were raising these kids who are by and large historically illiterate. Its a form of creeping amnesia. Its dangerous because if they get to the point where they dont appreciate all that we have, as a people and as a country, and by tradition, theyll be careless about it. They wont guard it. They wont stand up for it. They wont defend it when its under attack. And in the world were living in, where danger is so much more prevalent and immediate, education about all of this is of the utmost, not just history, but all of it. And keep in mind, information isnt learning. We sold this bill of goods about the Information Age and everything. Yes, its important and valuable. Yes, it is essential. But information srnt learning. I like to tell students that if information were learning, if you were to memorize the world almanac, you would be educated. If you memorize you wouldnt be educated. You would be weird. Right, yeah. Right. On that topic of historical illiteracy, too Many Americans are historical illiterate and a theme previous speakers spoke on and a point of the series that gay was keen on and others. You have the ability to write for not only scholars but a very broad audience who might be unfamiliar on the topic s. Part of the answer improving the historical literacy, the narrative and focusing on the people than just dates. I think so. One of the huge influences on me as a writer and as writing history was barbara tuckman. Yes. Whose works i read when i was quite wrong. March of follies. A classic. She said theres no trick. Tell stories. A story, stories are one of the reasons we have survived as a species. Because its been our way of passing vital necessary information on to succeeding generations. When everybody was illiterate. And so the art of the story is something that developed as a very important element in survival. And we love it. We need it. One of thens well tolerate the ads on television. The people who are doing them. Almost always a little story, a little mini story of some kind. And we hang on that. And theres nothing wrong with that. In fact, theres everything to be said for it. Now, theres a great analysis of the difference between information and a story. If i tell you that the king died and the queen died, thats a sequence of events. Its not a story. If i tell the king died and the queen died of grief thats a story. Yeah. You have to get inside the emotional and human aspect of it. I have two confessions to make sheer in this wonderful with this wonderful gathering. Okay. First is that i dont consider myself a historian. I didnt major in history. I was an english major. Yes. Who wandered into writing history. And thats a whole other story. But i consider myself a writer who wants to write about real people and what really happened. And i do all the required research and then some because i use a lot of Research Resources that most academics that i know dont use at all. And secondly, ive never undertaken a subject that i knew much about. Because if i knew all about it, i wouldnt want to write the book. For me, finding out about the subject is the adventure. Im landing on a continent i have never set foot on it an im setting foot to find out what i can. So its all new to me. Right. All most all of it. And its amazing how if you have that point of view you will find things that other people who rightfully claim to know all about it wont find because theyre not seeing wit a fresh eye. Ive never undertaken a book i knew much about, a subject i knew much about and never undertaken a book in which i didnt find something in my research that nobody had found before. Right. On that note thats very exciting when it happens. Process of discovery. I agree. I often come home just bouncing around and my wife says, whens going on . I said i found a letter today. Exactly right. On that note, how do you pick your topics, the topics come to you . I loved your point earlier of scholars ask you whats your theme . The theme comes as you learn the historier and personal narrative. How do you pick your topics . Well, sometimes i think they pick me. Okay. But that sounds a little phony so i wont stick with that. I liked it. Its different each time. It can be something somebody says at lunch. Something i have just read. It can be something that sparked my interest writing a previous book. When i finished my first book on the johnstown flood, the johnstown flood was a horrific, awful event that need never have happened. And i was questioned often whats your theme . I had no idea. It was only toward the end that i realized my theme and my theme was never assume it can be mistaken and perilous that because people are in positions of responsibility theyre therefore behaving responsibly. Cant assume that. [ applause ] the dam in the mountain that is broke need never have broken. If people had been carrying on their responsibility, none of it would have happened. 2,500 people died. Thats as many as in new york at 9 11. 9 11. It was a worst disaster that ever hit the country. It need never to have happened. Right after my book was published i was approached by two different publishers. One wanted know do the San Francisco earthquake and the other wanted me to do the chicago fire. I was only 32 and i was already being typecast as bad news mccullough and i didnt like that. So i thought, why dont you try to find a subject thats a symbol of affirmation . And thats when i came up with the idea because of something someone said at lunch about the Brooklyn Bridge and the minute that subject was expressed as it was, how they had no idea when they started what terrible problems they would have to address. Right. I thought, there it is because they succeeded. Again, because they would not give up. Do you often find yourself as you alluded to earlier, going to write on Jefferson Adams relationship and find compelling and easier to know and jefferson is guarded . Do you find yourself in that case where you shifted and focused on adams, do you find yourself pursuing what you think is a book on this direction but you find information that moves you in that direction . Has that happened for you . Not often but it has happened. I think what appealed to me in adams in particular, heres this mountain of marvelous material that nobodyd worked with. Right. Only Something Like a third of the correspondence, adams correspondence had ever been looked at, literally. By anyone writing a book or essay or whatever. So thats exciting. Right. Thats pioneering and i like that. Ive read the john and abigail correspondence and what strikes me is not only does abigail emerge as, of course, a partner in his life and someone but the intellectual abigail emerges where they will discuss classic works of literature or plays and almost assume the roles of characters. She offers her advice. He so lit lis sits and shes terrific. And i want to embark a little bit on another medium, film. The tom hanks production of my adams book on hbo. Right. I thought laurie linneys portrayal was superb. Good. As was paul ji mattie. Absolutely marvelous. And by the way, ive never seen people work harder to get the story right than that crew. And down to the props, the costumes, the sets, everything was historically accurate as best as they could possibly do. And tom hanks is a National Treasure. Hes just phenomenal. I had met him and discussed whether i would agree that he could do the book. And this was over lunch in catcham, idaho. He got to the little coffee shop before i did and hes sitting there in the corner with a baseball cap on. Nobody seemed to know who he was. And he certainly wasnt trying to get people to notice that he was there. And id had many producers approach me wanting to do my book. Or a book of mine. I introduced myself. He got up. As we sat down, he said, well, i loved your book. And i thought, oh brother. Because every producer id ever starts with that line. Then we started talking and i realized theyd never read it. Theyve never read it. He said but i have a few questions and leans down and i didnt see it and on the floor was a copy of my book and he picked it up and this is ten times as many postits in it as that. He said about this. Do we have to have this scene . Wow. So i was really impressed. Hed done his homework. So then i said, there are two things that i would really insist on. Okay. I said, one is that you it isnt a costume pageant. That you show that people had bad teeth and suffered from bad limps or yeah. And that life was gritty and dirty and literally. And he said, fine. No problem. I said, the other is that you stick to the english language of the 18th century and you dont have them tossing off little cute phrases of our time. You be the bad cop. You be the good cop. Stuff like that. He said, you can count it. The fact that theyre both classically trained actors, never had a complaint i know of of people not being able to understand the 18th century english language. Well, we have been working on the set down in virginia for about three or four days and i tom hanks is a brilliant man and not just a great actor. Hes smart as hell. And a good man. So i went to lunch one day with craig sa dusky, his number two man. He said, what do you think about tom . Do you like working with tom . I said, very much. He said, anything surprise you . I said, yes. I cant get over how normal he is. Oh. And he said, oh, he does normal very well. [ laughter ] you were on set for some of the filming . Oh yeah. Did they solicit your advice for it . I recall reading this. Yeah. You were pleased overall with all the por trals . Absolutely. A little well, i dont want to go into that, no. One of them i thought wasnt quite right but thats all right. That was minor. And the yeah. Tell us. Well, it was the man who played jefferson. Oh, okay. I didnt think he was right for the part. Yeah. You would have been much better. But i dont know. Well get the i wouldnt wear the wig so back to your selecting of your topics. Has there been anything in your books you said the process of discovery is what drives you and i suspect that part of your the appeal of your writing is youre writing it as if you, wow i just discovered this. Is there something about the john adams book you were really shocked to find a nugget in there that you said the history is completely missed this aspect of john or abigail . I think that what most historians and people who teach history have neglected about adams is how he risked his life. Oh. When he was away . Yeah. And that was no easy thing. And, of course, he stood the chance of being captured. Yep. And hung. Yeah. And there was every reason why he need not have gone at all over to europe. It wouldnt have come out the way he did if he hadnt. And not just the french came in but the dutch came in. The dutch, why. Financially in a big way. And his insistence on learning and the constitution of the commonwealth of massachusetts. Yeah. He wrote a constitution almost ten years before our constitution that had everything in it thats in our constitution plus a bill of rights. And he deserves infinite credit for that which he never really got. Theres something about president who is are elected to a second term that puts them on a different level of focus. And oneterm president s dont get the attention they sometimes deserve. Theres some mythology about the presidency. The idea, the great president s are only all president s during time of war. Not true. One of the greatest president s we ever had, theodore roosevelt. No war during his time. None. He wished there had been i think. Yes, yes. But he was phenomenal. Yep. Absolutely phenomenal. And historian. Our best president s have all been students of history and about half of them were authors of history. Woodrow wilson was a professor. John kennedy wrote history. I think Dwight Eisenhowers crew kraed in europe is one of the west written and wrote every word of himself. No ghost writer at all. Great. Grants memoir. Izen hower is a miss hes not gotten sufficient credit but one thing he did not go into vietnam. Right. You have to judge president s by what they do and what they dont do. And thats extremely important. Adams as i mentioned it earlier didnt go to war with france and thats extremely important. Eisenhower didnt go into vietnam. Kennedys sense of history was very profound. Of course, he wrote a very good book or three good books. American history. And harry truman who never went to college probably read as much history as anybody we have ever had in the white house. He loved it. Truman always had a great line the only thing new in this world is history you havent read yet. Thats right. He understood the lessons. Thats right. The other