trying to reform his life particularly by going back to african-american pastors insane help me fix what i have done. >> on that note of hope i thank you very much once again, the book is wonderful. it is a great collection of memories with their stories that can give us all guidance and some reassert assurance in this crazy election season. >> i hope so, it was really fun thank you. >> c-span, where history unfolds daily. in 1979, c-span was created as a public service by america's cable television companies. it is brought to today by your cable or satellite provider. [inaudible] [inaudible] [inaudible] >> good morning. welcome. my name is luis, i am president of acc, national capital national capital region and i welcome you today. on behalf of the chapter think i can speak with for everyone here about exactly how excited and how honored we are to have justice ruth bader ginsburg and former solicitor general teded olson with us today. [applause]this event i also want to think so much james william, former member ofa our board of directors, jim who is a vp for programming, and idly, our executive director for all of the work they put into this event and they deserve a round of applause.and so [applause] so with that, i will turn things over to james and he will do the introduction. thank you. >> thank you for those very kind words. it's a tremendous honor to be here to introduce our guests. it is always difficult when we have guests of this caliber to find the right superlatives and adjectives in terms to describe them.tans, dedi there are a few that come to mind. titans, dedicated, principled, dynamic, engaging, brilliant, thought leaders, and pioneers.nf what has been most personally inspiring for me is the role of thvil rights leaders. whether it is the fight for racial or gender equality, or marriage equality or freedom from discrimination based on sexual orientation or gender identification, both ted and justice ginsburg have crossed all of these fronts our country continues to honor its promise of equal justice forts c all. justice ginsburg was nominated by president clinton for associate justice of the supreme court taking her seat in 1993. prior to her appointment she served from 1980 until 1983 on the bench of the united states court of appeals for theo district of columbia's circuit. she was professor of law at rutgers law school from 1963 until 1972 and a columbia two and a columbia law school from 1972 until 1980. she has served on the facultiesi of the american studies at the aspen institute and as a visiting professor at many universities in the united states and abroad. in in 1978 she was a fellow at the center for advanced study and behavioral sciences at stanford, california. in 1972 she was instrumental in launching the women's rights project p of the american civil liberties union. g lastly, she does not only has the distinction of having the best nickname in the history of any supreme court justice, the notorious, rgb.984 he was ted olson is a partner at the d.c. office, he was solicitor general of the united states during 2001 - 2004. - 2004. from 1981 until 1984 he was assistant attorney general in charge of the office of legal counsel. he has argued 62 cases before the supreme court and has prevailed in over 75%. , a remarkable achievement. his cases have involved separation of powers, federalism, federalism, voting rights, the first amendment, equal protection and due process, sentencing, jury rights, punitive damages, takings or property, the commerce clause, telecommunications, the 2000 presidential election, i telecommunications, the 2000 presidential election, i think we remember that one.bere bush versus coke gore, campaign finance, site same-sex marriage, and other federal constitutional statutory questions. i'm. i'm grateful for all they have done.qu at the end of this chat we'll take questions from the audience and a chance for you to interact. without without further to, justice ginsburg and ted olson. [applause]n imagine what >> thank you james and louise. you can imagine what a pleasure this. >> is the microphone working? minus. >> can you hear me? i think someone is in the way of the camera. you can imagine what a pleasure it is for me, and advocate to be able to ask questions of a supreme court justice. [laughter]r] however, i suspect you'll hear her turn the tables on me very soon after we get started. and at the risk of repeating a couple of the things that james said about justice ginsburg i wanted to add a word or two of my own before we start our dialogue, i don't know where the fireplaces, think it is behind is james i'm sure felt the toughest thing about introducing someone like justice ginsburg is that it is tempting to say either too much because she has accomplished so much and has led a such a distinguished life in our society and our culture or too little because you already know who she is and what she has done and you're here to hear from her and not for me. but i cannot resist the opportunity to say a couple of words about this woman, this remarkable woman, a, a remarkable career and the life that we all admire. i understood this event sold on in an hour and 15 minutes, that is a tribute to the fact that people have such great respect for you, justice ginsburg. if i was limited to five wears a couple of them came up when james introduction as a pant pioneer, commitment, courage, passion, it's, courage, passion, and to me most of all, war year. i would like to explain that. justice ginsburg grew up in brooklyn, her older sister died when she was six, her mother struggled with cancer throughou his high school years and passed away the day before her graduation. her. a very daunting beginning for her. she attended cornell university, was elected to phi beta kappa and graduated first among the women in her class. then harvard law school, one of nine women in the classified hundred. when her fellow when her fellow student and husband marty whom she met on a blind date was diagnosed with cancer she attended class for both of the, took notes, typed her husband's papers and care for both him and their infant daughter. when he recovered and took a job in took a job in new york city she transferred to columbia law school, she became the first woman to become elected to twod major law reviews, columbia and harvard. i saw the picture in the book, the rgb, to woman out of 60 at the harvard law review and they have your picture equally balanced to women among 60 men. type your first integration in a graduate class in columbia. was turned down for united states supreme court clerkship x because she was as a new york times reporter because she was a woman. w if she was discouraged she remained undaunted. as a professor the second woman to join the law faculty at rutgers she founded the woman's rights law recorder anden leadership the aclu women's right project. she she became the first in your professor at columbia law school where she authored a book on judicial procedure in sweden. after mastering swedish. somewhere early in our in our relationship she saw the name olson as she thought maybe that might be swedish and she asked if i could speak swedish. i had to point out that i was norwegian and i did not speak swedish or norwegian. she later transferred the swedish code of civil procedure into english. now, solar procedures tough enough, but in swedish, as an advocate for women's rights and gender equality she change the world. she personally argued six cases in the supreme court winning all but one and one out rear first a little another kate without even an argument. the cases that she once started an avalanche. for gender equality. justice ginsburg served for 14 years on the d.c. circuit, was the second woman after sandra day o'connor appointed to the supreme court.yron she reported replaced justice baron white. she is is now senior of three female justicesr on the court. just a word or two more. she was diagnosed with colon cancer 1999 and 99 and underwent surgery, radiation, chemotherapy, she missed zero days on the bench. e in 2005 she was diagnosed and underwent surgery for pancreatic cancer, 12 days after that surgery she was again back in court to hear arguments. her husband for over 55 years, martin ginsburg, an internationally respected professor died in 2010. she was back in court the next day just as he would have wanted. you'll find out today that justice ginsburg has a wicked, mischievous sense of humor. so be careful. and i can tell you from personal experience having argued over 50 cases while she was on the bench that she is as well-prepared are better prepared than any jurors that i have ever experienced. she is often the first justice to break the ice. and ask questions. those are penetrating, focus, and tough and as an advocate, very intimidating. so, i wanted to say those few words about you because i did have the opportunity to do this and i thought we would start off with there's about to bebe published or is being published, you can tell us the date. >> october 4. [laughter] >> october 4, who is paying attention, right. this beautiful book, my ownon words. it has excerpts of justice ginsburg speeches, speecheshi about her, some things aboutg marty ginsburg and other things like that, it has a beautiful cover, beautiful pictures in it and i'm going to ask you to tell me about about the book. but first of all have to do it james did in the other book which is really fun is the notorious rvg which is a fabulous book with all kinds of fun stuff in it in terms and lessons about how to be ruth bader ginsburg if you can think about that, you are an icon. what justice on the supremeft court is named after a rapper? my wife lady pointed out on the way here that baskin-robbins was wanting to name an ice cream was that what it was? ben & jerry's. i get ice cream people mixed up.ix i will eat any of it. ben & jerry's wanted to name an ice cream ruth bader ginger. and i heard something about this can't be true, about about a praying mantis. >> it is absolutely true. >> tell me about that.ying mants >> would you want a praying santis named after me? >> to this praying mantis to things that other praying mantis. >> the pictures i've seen is it is wearing a collar. >> tell us about this book, and my words, in my own words, tell us about how it came to be and what is in it. >> will this book was originally planned to come out after my official biography, i have have two official biographies who chose the speeches and the articles that are in that book, they started writing about me and 2003 and it is still a work in progress. so i said let's flip the order into the articles of the speeches first. they said this is done with my writing in an introduction to each section bye-bye official biographers. they came to me in 2003 and said like it or not people are going to write about you so you might as well select people that you trust. and we volunteered. and so far you still trust them? >> yes. until you have read some of those italicize introductions, they are very good. they're both very good. them, i >> ice on one of them i can't remember which one of the books, the advice advice that you got from your future mother-in-law about mary. >> from his mother, yes yes it was the best advice i ever received. it was on my wedding day and we were married marty's home. his mother took me aside anduldl said, dear, i would like to tell you the secret of a happy marriage. and the secret was, it helps, sometimes to be a little deafau and with that she handed me the para maxi earplugs which were the best earplugs. that advice i followed through 56 years of a wonderful marriage. and in every workplace including my current job something thoughtless or unkind is said, you just to know. >> it works in the supreme court too? >> yes it does for me. >> what is it like to be such an icon. what is it mean to you that people know who you are, the notorious rgb, there is there is an opera named after you and justice kolea and all of these things, what does that mean to? is it awkward or do you enjoy it? >> i think it is amazing. i'm 83 and everyone wants to take a picture. this notorious rgb is a creation of a second year law student at nyu, now graduated and it started when the court announced a decision in the shelby county case that declared it unconstitutional part of the voting rights act of 1965, this student was displeased, angry, and that she said well i heard from someone i admire that these are useless emotions, they don't em advance anything sub s let's do something positive in the something positive was to put my dissent in the shelby county case on the tumbler and then it took off into the wild blue yonder from there. and when -- heard about this tumbler they said will do you know who the notorious rgb comes from and i said of course i do. the notorious big a night were both born and bred in brooklyn, new york. >> have you thought of writing any of your dissenting opinions and wrap? [laughter] they're doing that on broadway now. >> let me ask you, it is so much fun, i have to talk about the opera. you are a great lover of the opera a great lover of shakespeare, were spending a little time today talking about some of these things because they're such fun things and you'll have a chance to ask more probing questions about the supreme court, but your relationship with justice kolea, a lot of people are mystified by that because you are on somewhat opposite ends of the spectrum, you served served together in the d.c. circuit, you wound up often on opposite sides of cases decided by the supreme court, sometimes justice kolea wrote in such a powerful fashion would be harsh in his language and yet you are great friends. how did that happen, how were you such great friends and what does that tell us about life on the court? >> our friendship should not have been surprising to people who watch the court. they would've known that justice kolea was exceedingly fond of justice -- who is also the opposite side in many cases. and justice brennan usually enjoyed justice kolea's company as i do. or did. he has an extraordinary ability to make you smile. even left, and when we are on the d.c. circuit togetherjustice justice kolea i had everything, all i could do to avoid laughing out while i sometimes had to pinch myself. people say will blows your favorites kolea jokingly said i know what it is but i can't tell you. [laughter] it was such fun being at the washington national opera with him twice and to be part of this school he eight, so some of my feminist friends say why is it ginsburg's kolea will seniority is very important in my workplace so scalia, although he was three years younger he was appointed to the court many years before i was, that it is why it was scalia ginsburg, it en is a comic opera as you would expect, it will be, it had its world premiere virginia last summer, it will have its next production at the plymouth festival in cooperstown new york, so if if you're interested you can go to the baseball hall of fame and you can see the scalia ginsburg, but the set up, i should tell you how it came to be. very talented young man was a music major, has a a masters in music, and then decided it would be useful to learn a little bite about the law. so he enrolled in his hometown law school, the university of maryland, he is taking a constitutional law course and he is reading these dueling opinions, scalia and ginsburg and he says to himself, this this could make a very funny opera and i'll give you just ado taste of of the opening pieces. so starts off with scalia's rage which goes like this. the justices are blind, how can they possibly support this, the constitution said, absolutely nothing about this and then i explained to him that he's searching for bright line answet solution but the great thing about our constitution is that like our society it can evolve. so that is the set up and that is roughly based on the magic flute, justice kolea is locked up in a dark room, he's he's being punished for excessive dissenting. [laughter] and that they come to help them out i enter that scene through the ceiling and then as in the magic flute i join him for the last trial and we sing a duet, we are different, we are one, different in our approach to the interpretation but one in our fondness for each other, our reverence to the constitution and the institution we serve. >> and that friendship and relationship tells us so much about how maybe we all could learn from that. the relationship with people who have different perspective,u mas justice kolea was saying that you made his opinions better because he would run them by you, correct me if i'm wrong and you point out the various vulnerabilities or weaknesses in his opinion and he would go back and sharpen his words or try to make what he said in your participation. he learned this when you are together on a d.c. circuit, you exchanged opinions and he respected your intelligence so much that he wanted to run themo by you. >> well i was the beneficiary of that relationship more than he was. when i wrote an opinion and he a wrote a dissent he identified all of the soft spot so every opinion of mine is much better than the first draft. he was also known on sometimes he will call me whether we were on the same side are not in point out that a slip i had made in grammar. sometimes i would call him and say why don't you tone it down, this is so striving you're going to lose your audience. you'll be more effective if you just put it down a level. most of the time he did not listen to me. i could tell by reading some ofe his dissenting influence particularly there is ance difference between when you have to write for the court and it when you're writing a dissenting opinion. you are explaining that. he obviously he obviously didn't temper some of the language, thinking of that marriage equality case, the two cases and so forth. >> but you can also pick up onef of the 25% that the vmi case,. so let's talk about that one. [laughter] i had forgotten about that case. i argue that case, it was for the virginia military institute. i represented the commonwealth a of virginia and as you know, it was an all-male institution, part of the university of virginia system and it was a relatively small component of the system and it was taught ono an adversarial system is what they called it in the theoryo that some young men needed to be in an all-male environment in order to get their bearings. >> to get through the rat line. was at so the challenge was that it evaluates the equal protection clause because women were denied admission. i argued that case and there was a 70 mac one decision. i got one votes. i had six people, the the chief concurred in the judgment about the opinion and you captured justice kolea, unit need to capture him,. >> even by advocacy it wasn't necessary to win. >> it didn't do any more than that. >> i was just saying the story about the aftermath of the vmi case, i had a letter from the vmi guys he had met many women, he had a teenage daughter and h was glad that she would have the opportunity if she wanted to to attend vmi. then i heard from him some sixve months later that i keep the letter every time i want to be lifted up. in the letter have some tissue paper and it would look like a toy soldier. it it was a pin. the letter said, this was a key to the pen, it is is given to the mother of every vmi graduate at the graduation ceremony. my mother died last month, i think she would want you to have her key to that pin because in some way you are grandmother to the future generation. . . >> >> you were one of the few people to bring these cases to challenge the statute in particular of equal rights to women. >> are men. >> >> i said it reminded me of justice thurgood marshall with some of legal defense fund to say what is the difference but then that was the segue? i copied his strategy and then to develop that law you probably remember when texas realized by to african-americans simplyaf because of their race. that was vastly imperious so thurgood marshall argued before the court today. :people make that comparison but thurgood marshall's life was in danger. and then to represent someone. let my advocacy was a challenge. and another difference that people understood that racial discrimination was odious but we started to argue the cases to strike down those arbitrary gender lines so as a good has been ended good father they thought that they were protected when they shouted. and then there was that wonderful image that you use to. >> but all too often it turns out that it protects women achieving whatever they could. so getting judges to understand that gender discrimination goes back to the society it is bad for men and four children. none of the cases in which represented second as a complaint and that of those were a test case these were everyday people somewhere from idaho and then to the and whiff those disabled people. and then to have a young son . father applied for custody and then to say the father is becoming a custodian but then one day when he was in a severe depression to a dow one of his father's gun sand committed suicide. >> i'm sorry addend to say that there must be preferred . but then through three levels i did not cannonball to until there was an appeal to the supreme court. this is the everyday womanand ii and then to be an obvious injustice. and then the lieutenant in the air force. with that medical and dental facilities of man whose wife died in childbirth and the social security benefits of one a child is left in the care she is female. so they thought that was an obvious injustice. >> do you think the nature of those cases because so many had come before with similar issues were raised? so summarily they were just dismissed back clacks and you have to change thech culture as well as the of law. so was that the teacher with your advocacy? how did that have been? in this day completelyle different world now people say of course, .as >> i was there a three-time. and then with the good old days. and then issue again passed a law that you have to be male unless your husband or father is the owner of the of the establishment sabah the women add before. today we would call for a battered woman. and has spent a humiliated her to the of breaking point so she had tim over the head with a baseball bat. [laughter] they did not put women on juries but the supreme court to banal but of course, there would react but data lead the way. but they can't get there is a whole series of cases. in the '70s have a certain division of the way women are and the way men are. and that women's but if looking at the way people were ordering all negative and so my children attend years apart my daughter was born 1955 just before i started loss school. -- law schoolwork there were very few working moms. but 10 months later my son was born 1965 to families were no longer unusual. so now i did not have take this class on monday at father. so so many things worked in that direction but one very important fact so we will find them but we will do and inflation was another if you wanted them to go to college >> and then to be ahead of others when the united nations declared when people were not traditional. so the corps was catching up to a change that already occurred in society. >> and i think you would agree there is a synergistic effect because you brought those cases in because of your leadership and who you are then they would see as you explain the the kiss each thing makes that kilobit easier. your the fourth woman to be appointed to the united states supreme court. which care recce long after? >> with center david o'connor is based and produce in will be on trial.dide but then with the members of the minority groups and the federal court. but then to leave the of people who laugh laugh but when ronald reagan became president not only will likely continue to appoint women to the bench but i would like to go in the history books as a president the who appointed the first woman to the supreme court. that he cannot put the super nominee, sandra day o'connor . but she was one and for 12 years there was a bathroom and she had to go back to her chambers that was evident so there was a woman's bathroom equal inside. [laughter] one. >> now there are three women on the court and there must be a huge difference and there are three. with that public perception and with them in the court they can see all over the bench areas i have been around so long. we are one-third of the corporate but my a colleagues are not shrinking violets so the competition between those that could ask the most questions. but none to be performing very well in response to my question was justice o'connor. [laughter] >> but it was the male justices so what it is it like if there are argumentsnt blacks when i first argued it case 1983 para not very many questions but now justice thomas famously very seldom asks the question because he feels there's aly lot of questions being asked if he has his reasons but essentially the justices asked questions all the time so worried trying to accomplish when you're asking questions? are you trying to find the strength or the of weakness or are you speaking to your colleagues quack. >> is to give the advocate and so as a chance to answer that so it is talking past the of to each other. and weighed and you think about the case. >> some people find that strange because you are in the same building you can talk to your colleagues about the presence of the lawyers doesn't that dialogue take place prior to oral argument? >> so that would be dead discussion. we don sub to discuss those cases but then then treadmill will move faster faster. there are exceptions and we do but it is very close. >> but those conferences that express how you want to vote? >> such stock about the case is then friday morning we go round the table with strict seniority order sometimes it is a close discussion thenre another chief justice will say enough. and then we go on to the next case. >> would like to keep asking questions but david being freed with me this is been a pleasure for me. >> please work your way to the microphone no questions about pending cases that goes without saying laugh laugh any questions please come forward. don't be shy. we set aside this time for you.nk you for being so if you talk about the evolution of society have a question talking about the discourse and where thebe world is right now especially in november. >> i am very hopeful and that no dame it was a huge audience. and all the people that i met were very determined but then i can see it in my own granddaughter. and i can advocate for the future. >> thinks for making your appearance here tonight. first of all, my wife is born and raised them brooklyn and my name is chris wallace the fund birth name of the notorious are beachy is chris wallace the wood is that opinion will you are on the defense that you are ashamed or disappointed? >> ashamed? [laughter] >> but ashamed of how the majority came out.ou >> i would say disappointed. i was disappointed to citizens united. what a better case but they are up to no good can you fix it? >> banality is in the congress court. >> thanks for coming today justice ginsburg was hoping you would share faucets since you are a added a hit in to me we would share but he said chile's. >> aiding terrorism or been any country in the world that they have an obligation to give back. but i tell my law students but then you are a plumber and then to do something as they said before to give back but if this tremendously important from the if through society but we still do not have that notion through the upheaval. >> diane made 20 year practitioner headed said graham i urge when the did you have a question c regarding the daily stop that ended with what i've thought of the second reconstruction of the south? so what is the impact of shelby county on future civil-rights legislation or existing litigation? >> debut read the newspaper that to pre-clearance process is no more but there are a number of cases to the voting rights act. and some of them before the court so i don't want to bet there is still the it i am optimistic and it that the fourth rebuff for theormula. jurisdictions that to. >> eight think we better leave it there. >> thanks for coming here. one but even going back to the biblical times but the constitution can be amended. but i will never forget, think of someone who once the state constitution then they go on and don? dated famed the constitution but it is a bad washington d.c. area, was a resident had this physicians so very tight-knit is a supreme court right. translator: i have seen the risk. >> so these three people will offer questions then we will wrap up. >> as the father of former but the majority of the students were foreign. foh. >> so with a lender standing land your context do you have many renditions for the students with lot debtors husked but i do think we all appreciate the but this is the longest surviving constitution and the courts did the supreme mitt none of the of 111111111111 mw be be wound while one be been one mw one mw one mw 111 mw why why would be one mw want one mw one wound illness into either with each other to say what do they want to but then to make it known and then to illustrator example that you can have a home life and work life. and with a three day