>> this hearing is entitled housing america addressing challenges and serving people experiencing homelessness. i now recognize myself for three minutes. homelessness in the united states is an unnecessary and worsening crisis. between 2016 and 2020, homelessness increased in the richest nation of the planet by 6 percent by 580,000 people including children experiencing homelessness january 2020 is significant instability by by covid-19 and homeless service providers on the frontlines have only high-end concerns about conditions facing the homeless and the at risk population. homeless service providers but those communities and is without question they are heroes and the work they provide saves american lives. cd growing backlogs for critical housing resources have pushed some americans into homelessness and left millions more at risk. in addition the national housing resources the ability of service providers to provide a positive outcomes for americans battling housing insecurity. in the united states, 40% of people experiencing homelessness are currently employed yet unable to obtain stable housing. the build it back a better passed by the house in november includes a very, very, very important provisions for the committee for which we would now like to pass in the senate. i have heard opponents of these in the house. many of the arguments i think a rather bleak. we will get into this hopefully is this hearing proceeds. i would like now to recognize the ranking member of our committee mr. hill from arkansas for five minutes. >> will thank you, mr. chairman. thank you for convening the hearing to talk about an issue that is important to all of us in our local districts with all of our constituents. that is the issue said how we best locally and nationally address homelessness. i like to start my talk about the success we've had in my district. first, with my own team. i'm so grateful to our combat wounded warrior. we have three on our staff. and how they have worked seamlessly with our veteran community to tackle veteran homelessness and help those veterans find shelter. it is one of the most rewarding parts of my job and my time in congress. second, i would say central arkansas is a blessed by having a robust and well coordinated support system to help our brothers and sisters that are homeless. including many of our great nonprofits like the salvation army, jericho way, you knew risk in mysia. st. francis house has a particular emphasis on veterans. the veteran villages of america run by a great iraq veteran colonel mike wass. goodwill and then our house. all of them work together seamlessly to try to eliminate hopelessness and fight for shelter and the skills. from little rock to los angeles people expensing housing insecurity need not just a safe place to stay but also supported services. whether it's clinical help, career coaching or case management. that would people cannot only get housed but eventually get their own place begin their pursuit of happiness. that's organizations like our house can successfully work in little rock as well as new york we will hear from today, have an expanding array of supportive services including job-training, childcare childcare and others that are successful going well beyond shelters. how the housing first approached disadvantages, many successful local service providers like those in my district from receiving appropriate federal funding and why we should support those that provide crucial wraparound services as well as a true holistic approach to reducing homelessness. before i yield the balance of my time i want to share a story or two from arkansans who have found success in these sorts of programs. joshua is a constituent of mine. he had trouble finding stable housing after he left a prison. he came to our house and has been around and has been working there since 1987 but he quickly settled in, found a home in the shelter and join the job training program on campus. since last year joshua has worked in the guard shack or he enjoys meeting people as they come to seek help. because of his hard work and dedication, joshua selected to move into our house transitional housing where he has been attending classes to earn his certification and eventually lead to that career. joshua, we are proud of you. we are with you every step of the way. joshua story is so important. and illustrates the importance of not just providing a safe place to stay but giving people the resources on the help they need to succeed. mr. chairman i look for to our discussion today and i yield back the balance of my time. quick said you'll >> back the balance of the sign for the chair now recognizes the vice chair of the subcommittee the gentlewoman from iowa. you are recognized for one minute break i think you're chairman. it's really good we are having this hearing. i appreciate you holding this. at last count we had five and 80000 americans who expensing homelessness in over 2500 right here in iowa. tonight, the windchill in iowa will be negative 15 degrees. that is dangerous for anyone letter those who are forced to sleep outside tonight because they could not find shelter. i hope we get as many people sheltered in the short term as possible would be absolute need to use this hearing to discuss more solutions to address homelessness for the long term including my bill to give rural areas more flexibility to help people expensing homelessness. we need to implement the ideas we discussed today to get us back on track finding people to homes they need like we were a few years ago. thank you and i yield back. click the gentlewoman yields back her chair now recognizes the chair of the full committee the gentlewoman from california, ms. waters brickwork thank you so very much for the subcommittee hearing you are doing. i am here today to listen to our witnesses. i am absolutely upset. and i am unhappy about the lack of progress some of our cities are making despite the fact are doing everything we can to get the resources to them. and i spent six hours out on the street working with homeless who are intense all of the trash et cetera. i was able to offer them project home key despite the fact we are having locals telling us people did not get off the streets. every one of them excepted and are getting into hotel rooms for the night. being able to work with whomever an order to transition into permanent housing. i want to hear these obstacles are. i am not pleased at all. we have got to move the homeless off the streets. think we can all do it a better job. i yield back the balance of my time per. >> thank you madam chair. they welcome the testimony for distinguished witnesses but first we have missed adriana busch was executive director of the homeless and housing coalition of kentucky. next chief executive officer for king county regional homeless authority. then we have ms. and oliver who is the vice president for housing policy at the center on budget and policy priority. for the chief executive officer of the national alliance to end homelessness. last i will recognize mr. hill to introduce our final witness. boxers like me too do that now mr. chairman? >> yes please. next i appreciate that. i got the pleasure of introducing ms. harriet mcdonald today who serves as a president. harriet is a long time in fierce advocate for people experiencing homelessness which she cofounded with her husband the late george mcdonald. first, herod on behalf of all of us let me offer condolences to the ready, willing and able teams and family over the loss of george. you and george have truly been points of light in new york and helping the less fortunate. manhattan and new york is a much better place because of you. i've been fortunate to visit several times as i've been in congress. every time i return i'm so impressed by the work done by the men and women who are ready, willing and able to fight homelessness and hopelessness due to its anonymous challenge. it's an extraordinary success on all because it has lowered criminal recidivism and a work than virtually any other program for homeless in new york city. but, because it specializes on tapping the hardest cases and helping the most, that it's impresses me so much about this organization bring i think merrick thanked mary mcdonald for letting her expertise and i look forward to her testimony, thank you mr. jeffrey. >> thank you mr. hill. and welcome ms. mcdonald for sharing your time with us this morning. witnesses are reminded their oral testimony will be limited to five minutes. you should also be able to see a timer on your screen that will indicate how much time you have left. i would ask you be mindful of the timer and quickly wrap up your testimony when your time has expired so we can be respectful of both witnesses and committee members time. objection your written statement will be made part of our record. mr. bush will recognize you for being with us today. and we will begin -- i apologize. we are to start with ms. evian bush the housing coalition of kentucky. we will move down the witness i'll introduce them as they speak. so i will begin with ms. roman, pardon me. [inaudible] will begin with ms. bush. our nation is in the midst of a rental crisis that most severely affects low income famines were to go into the hot low health income coalition, there are fewer than four affordable and available rental houses in the country right now. and so, right i'm getting mould recognize ms. bush and bill proceed on at that time. and give time. [inaudible] chief executive officer of kingstown homelessness. i apologize mr. chair. is this a bush or speaking before me? what if you are on now. next i am on now, thank you. >> the nation is watching and waiting you are on right now. next think it mr. jones that if the subcommittee for the opportunity to speak today. on the honor serving as a chief executive officer of the king county reaches homeless authority for the authorities charge of the oversight of the entire of home assistant in king county inclusive of the city of seattle and other 38 city center unincorporated areas. we are currently facing a growing crisis of national proportions, aided and abetted by policy choices that have misunderstood the root causes of homelessness and under resourced the solutions that are most effective. our investments in the homeless space have been overfocus on services that offer sub support will leaving systems to provide the actual housing solutions that people need. a system administer for the third-largest continuum of care grants i'm here to tell you i simply does not matter how many social workers attend to a person needs, i'm the outreach workers are able to connect with her unsheltered neighbors that we do not have anywhere for them to go. that is precisely where we stand today. the reality is there is no number of social who will ever transform into a house. until we prioritize stabilizing the housing market for lower income individuals we will not end homelessness, will simply manage it. we must also recognize homelessness is incontrovertibly a racial justice issue. homelessness disproportionally impacts people of color as a direct result of this country's history of racial's exclusion from housing. will black people represent only 12% of the general population, we routinely make up 30 -- 40% or more of the homeless population. native people who make only 1% of the general population often make up three -- 6% of the population expensing homelessness. we must not forget that it was not until 1968 with the passage of the fair housing act this country step toward ensuring people of color had access to the same housing finance pools as white americans. this legacy is alive today and the patterns of generational wealth that communities can access to get through hard times like housing bubble burst, global recessions or global pandemic for national strategies and homelessness must be aligned with these fundamentals and focus on ending the racialized outcomes that continue to harm people even as we sit here today. quite frankly the times come for america to decide whether we live down to its racist history or up to the dreams that held for us. it's a core component of that. this will require us to understand homelessness is an economic issue. it is about not having money to pay the rent. at the local level is the over and over again been people are shelter system are frankly other encampments are working. what they are is making a living wage. we also have the belief homelessness is driven by behavioral health is false. but we tend to see as a people present with these concerns, he frequently began after the experience of homelessness, not before. the reality is every day we allow someone to experience homelessness, the harder it will be for us to connect them with the resources they need. because of this we must transform our home assistance into true crisis response as is been called persons the first plan in 2010. in order to that must equip systems with the necessary resources to act quickly and decisively in people expense homelessness. jurisdictions have had success solved market projects to repurpose housing support. to some degree this is a reinvestment in the sro another low income housing stock those white from the american landscape during the suburbanization of the 50s, 60s, 70s per the slocum housing saw significant role or lack thereof and the inability to exit the of her homelessness without some form of subsidy and the rise of the modern formation of homelessness itself. additionally, given the fragile economic networks a committee seized must continue to invest in diversion and other cash benefits that are tried and proven methods of keeping people from entering homelessness and prevent further public investment further down the road. this a data-driven decision-making is critical for the appropriate targeting of resources and must include prioritization of people expensing unsheltered homelessness. it is unacceptable for a policy to force people to live outside and we must make a concerted effort to in unsheltered homelessness in america. finally we must invest in our workforce. for three years our fields but underfunded, as a result see our pipeline collapse but providers are hemorrhaging staff, were no longer willing to tolerate poverty wages while trying to end homelessness. the fact of the matters as work work is done by people helping other people. there is democrats that's going to change that. housing case managers, recovery coaches. navigators is a fancy terms for people to decide the thing they want to do with their lives is help others. and we, as a country, need to decide. do we care about our caretakers? i think you and you'll back the balance of my time. thank you very much. the chip now recognized as ms. bush you are recognized for five minutes. >> good morning chairman cleaver, ranking member hale and members but honor to share our thoughts on ending homelessness in the commonwealth of kentucky. my name is adrienne busch of the executive director of the homeless and housing coalition of kentucky produced eight wide nonpartisan advocacy organization with unique perspective on administering housing assistance to people experiencing homelessness. our mission is to limit the threat of homelessness and fulfill the promise of affordable housing. too that end, we step into identify gaps read continuum of care grants emergency grant assistance when requested. additionally we convene in kentucky enter agency on homelessness, the statewide homeless policy and planning body authorized by state statute. where state partner of the national low income housing coalition. we abide by the principles that housing is a human right and housing and homelessness. here is what we know about homelessness in our small mostly rural states it. using multiple sources include the point in time count, the coordinated entry process on hospital discharge data, we know just over 4000 people enter street or shelter homelessness annually. further, we know kentucky is not immune to systemic racial disparities among people entering homelessness. most glaringly, 25% of people experiencing homelessness are black in the states are only 8% of the general population identify as black. the odds ratio of black being identified as experiencing homelessness was 70% higher than the odds of a white patient. in kentucky there three continuum of care grants to, lexington county, louisville jefferson county and then the 118 counties outside of our two largest cities incur the balance of state. each co seat maximizes to the extent possible. what lexington and louisville are often able to offer additional local revenues to support homeless assistance activities, homeless service providers and the balance of state rarely have that option and use maximum allocations of coc and tsg funds. each coc prioritizes projects that implement housing for since principles and strategy appeared they offer housing with safe management, connection to employment and others tailored to the needs of the household and the community. barriers to ending homelessness and housing insecurity at large are driven by the lack of affordable housing. as members of the subcommittee i am well aware housing crisis in prevalent nationwide. and in kentucky were cost-of-living is theoretically lower than the coast, prior to the pandemic we are short nearly 78000 affordable and available rental homes for extremely low income kentuckians. the average rage winters earned card to pay for to better rental house. service and care sector jobs were many labor shortages are occurring have it median hourly wage of nine -- $10 per hour here in kentucky. it is also important to recognize that not all job of living wages are spread equitably across regions within the state. this is acutely true in areas of long-standing depressed economy such as apalachee, kentucky. congress, through the leadership of house financial services committee has taken bold steps to reduce homelessness through the housing provisions in the cares act and the american rescue plan act. now is the time to continue that work to the "build back better" act and other legislation for consideration today. we know what works and kentucky communities whether in larger cities like louisville to our small rural towns. given the challenges united states faces and coming out of the pandemic, now's the time to correct course away from the affordable housing crisis and provide the foundation to end homelessness through legislation incorrectly scaled funding. thank you for your consideration of my remarks this morning. and i yield back the balance of my time. >> thank you very much ms. bush for your testimony that you are now recognizes you are recognized for five minutes. >> thank you and ranking member hill i am the vice president for local policy at the center on budget and policy priorities. i want to commend the subcommittee for the housing related relief centers enacted during the pandemic rate thank you as well for chairman waters and representative torres for your continued leadership on homelessness. including the introduction of the ending homelessness act of 2021. which, if enacted would address many of the challenges we are discussing today. the housing investments made and part of the nations pandemic response are helping communities to keep families in their housing, and are providing critical resources for those experiencing homelessness in significant ways. >> all the reliable evidence tells us that the situation for people experiencing homelessness is urgent and the homelessness crisis which predates the pandemic persists outwards an intervention. the survey continues to show that millions of households are and people of color continue to be disproportionately impacted by the pandemic. in 2020 it was the first time since we started gathering this data we found in increasing the number of people and families with kids living in shelters and the number of individuals living on the streets exceeded the number of individuals living in shelters also for the first time. the reports are more than 580,000 people experience homelessness on a single night in january and 2020 and nearly 1.5 million experienced a sheltered homelessness at some time in 2018. people of color are disproportionately impacted by homelessness. families experiencing homelessness are headed by women, many young parents and include a high percentage of young children. youth, veterans, and adults experiencing chronic homelessness are suffering on the streets and in the shelters every day. the data shows more than half of sheltered people into 40% of unsheltered people experiencing homelessness work but still can't afford housing. homelessness assistance is a daunting challenge. a scarcity of available affordable housing units, but new challenges have also emerged. rising rent, funding and keeping permanent housing difficult for extremely low income people. the urgency created by the pandemic has stretched as the staffing resources create unanticipated implementation challenges. shelters and improvement to the unsafe environment for people who often have underlining health issues. criminalization of people experiencing homelessness is rising and more resources are needed. communities report that they need more housing and service. expanding the program and building new units through well targeted programs is the most important and effective steps congress can take to adopt the crisis. congress should pass a build back better act that maintains critical housing investment which currently includes voucher expansion that we estimated for the serve about 300,000 extremely low income households including about 80,000 households at risk of homelessness and estimated to 70% of whom are people of color. i regularly partner with people that have experienced homelessness and their priorities are clear. one, create more affordable housing options into support and a target of those most impacted develop and support dignity based services led by the community's most impacted by homelessness. three, reimagined the shelter and crisis response options. for, and the process and policies that criminalize folks experiencing homelessness. the need for housing assistance is urgent especially for the historically marginalized people. now is the time for action to increase housing and affordability nationwide to partner with people for solutions and to set communities up for success by making them more accessible. thank you and i look forward to answering your questions. >> we appreciate the testimony. the chair recognizes you for five minutes. >> thank you so much, chair man, ranking member and members of the subcommittee for inviting me to testify today. the ceo of the alliance of homelessness which is a nonpartisan nonprofit education policy capacity building organization. briefly a few comments on where we stand on homelessness it's been going up slightly every year. due to the pandemic where the numbers stand today the alliance has four surveys of the nations continue to care during the pandemic and most feel that the number is up. it's our belief that the children of homelessness is likely increased and it's possible as others have said people of color are disproportionately and the assistance they receive. therefore we stand with homelessness today thanks to your work for the opportunity of the moment to make a dent in the problem. and the major solution to homelessness people don't need services and everything works better when people have a safe, stable and affordable housing. i think we can all say that. during the past two years you've generously provided through the cares act and the american rescues act that people experiencing homelessness needed to return and build back better should it advance will build upon those resources. these resources are not going to be enough to end homelessness. it's a significant opportunity for us to make a difference. of course there are many challenges as well to making progress. a key challenge is to supply the resources that you have provided in the most strategic ways. agencies and their staff. possibly unsheltered but to reduce homelessness, we really need to focus on the latter, not the former. the critical priority is to address the needs of unsheltered people. it's not acceptable that in a nation with of the resources and capacities of hours, 230,000 should be on the streets. those that are unsheltered of much more serious health problems in a shorter life expectancies than those living in shelter. this group should be a top priority, and i'm not sure that it is. another challenge's staff shortages. the report significant shortages and staff across the board while we welcome and appreciated new resources it can be a struggle to implement to follow up on those resources without data. similarly, new funding requires the creation important but hard work left many to feel to overwhelmed the moment. one final challenge is the possibility that there will be a significant post pandemic increase. many federal support them to an end and face a period of high inflation. the resources we should be prepared for a way to decrease in the summer or next fall. given these opportunities and challenges, there is a key solution that we encourage communities to invest in to reduce homelessness. we recommend they help those that experience chronic homelessness, people disabilities got families with children and older adults. on the other hand we recommend they not be used for the prevention of homelessness if there are other resources available for that. we recommend they allocate resources to strategies that are specifically designed to reduce racial disparities and eliminate the disproportionality. it's important to focus the resources on solutions such as housing first, not housing only. we recommend that jurisdictions take the opportunity to investigate the possibility to convert the commercial space to housing and we recommend investing in those partnerships. in closing while people experience homelessness in ways that are resources you've provided that have ended >> thank you for your testimony. the chair now recognizes ms. mcdonald for five minutes. >> you are now recognized for five minutes. >> now you can hear me. i want to thank you all for this really wonderful opportunity to testify about my 30 years of experience working mostly on the ground in this area. i'm the president of the dough fund and asked that we keep the concept of opportunity at the forefront of our mind. opportunity for true self-sufficiency. a vast majority of the people we've served are minority people and that is for obvious reasons the lack of opportunity at every level for minorities. the doe fund 30 years ago was a similar moment for urgency. homeless people were living on pretty much every street corner and one of the major areas you could see this play out was grand central where thousands of people literally were desperate to survive. my deceased husband and i made it our business to spend and enormous amount of time and in grandcentral with homeless pd what we learned from that is what they told us over and over again, that they wanted a room and a job to pay for it. we heard it constantly, a room and a job to pay for it and that is what we set out doing. we started with 70 men that we literally picked up off the floor of grand central and decided we would create a work program that was a new innovation in the area of homelessness. work came first even before a contract for transitional housing we got a contract for work. at that time everyone thought homeless people were either too lazy or crazy to work. from the beginning, those 70 men demonstrated the obvious that was true. they worked so hard that we got our transitional housing and what we realized was that we needed a three legged stool approach to end homelessness. we have very expensive social services. we have paid work of course, transitional housing and training for jobs and an introduction to work. we clean 150 miles of new york streets every day and we also have an oil business. even in this period of the pandemic, we've grown our culinary arts program and served people in the communities in which we work. the population that we serve today is honestly no different than the population we saw in. i believe that these single adult men made up the largest part of the homeless population. that is who the program serves. we serve about a thousand people at a time and it's been replicated in six cities across america whether they are rural communities, other large cities or more suburban areas. >> is that my five? can i add one little thing? but i'm asking for here today, i know the critical need for independence, permanent housing. with so many people can be independent. i ask you to consider funding additional models. >> thank you for your testimony. and i will now recognize myself for five minutes. i would like to follow the witnesses. not far from my office here in kansas city missouri a young person a 28-year-old woman was burned to death, burned to death in a homeless encampment under a bridge on i 70, not far from where i am right now. the fire was so bad traffic was blocked on the freeway. the fire was under the freeway but the traffic was blocked. anywhere you go in any major city you will find that a theme. in washington, d.c. not far from where i live there's an encampment of homeless individuals. there's all kind of issues there. one of the things i think we have to do because i grew up in public housing if you don't want to work how do we, are there things we can be doing or the committee can do are those of us that our thinking about this issue seriously to try to erase all of this stigma attached to homelessness? they want to be homeless, they don't want to have food, whatever. give us any kind of direction you might be able to provide us ms. mcdonald. >> my experience is people desperately want to be independent. they want to be contributing members of society. i get calls from guys saying i'm so excited. people want the dignity of being in the mainstream. we also do permanent supportive housing. we have 14 buildings and i'm not saying that's not critical for people with any kind of infidelity but 95% of the people that come to us have very serious drug problems and we deal with that on-site. always have. we offer free drug tests and if people are dirty for drugs we don't ask them to leave but we ask them to give up the paid work. we can't put them on the streets. >> thank you. that's very helpful. do you have a response to what can we do to erase the stigma and also getting more money but i think all of you are talking about. >> thank you mr. chair. my response to that would be the best thing we can do is incorporate people that have experienced homelessness into the work that we do. i myself have experienced housing instability. i have a condition i've been hospitalized twice. these are not things you would know about me unless i talk about them and being honest about that history and how i got here and how that influences my work, i think that's the most stigma disrupting thing we can do. you yourself spoke to public housing. i think we have to talk about it more. those of us that have made it out. i also think that folks who are currently experiencing homelessness do have critical voices and insight into what is necessary and they are often highly refined thinking like i've been quoted regulation chapter and verse by people experiencing homelessness saying these are the things in my way right now to getting where i want to be and the more we pull those voices to the center the more we can disrupt the belief that is out there that folks want to live and they don't know what is best for them or how to get where they need to go. >> thank you so much. appreciate your testimony. my father turned 100 on july 17th and i saw him cry about 30 years ago when he was told he was looking at the news and told where they talked about how people didn't want to work who lived in public housing. mr. hill you are recognized for five minutes. >> thank you. every january there's an annual homelessness assessment report released to congress that provides estimates on the local races of homelessness in america despite the federal reliance on housing first that was the approach to ending homelessness that rate has increased over the past several years. i hope we would have that data before the hearing i look forward to that report soon and hope that we can bring attention to it in the future. in my opening statement i mentioned the story of the success that he found out our house which is our shelter for the working homeless. it's been in place since 1987 and has been such a success in part of our strategy to reduce homelessness in my hometown. adults are required to work full time and save 75% of their earnings and we try to get them that important savings account and deposit for the next apartment or that a down payment for a future home but there are specific challenges facing homeless families with children. they often get left out of many federal policy conversations and the focus on housing first often leaves out nearly all families with children who are experiencing homelessness. our work shows homelessness among families with children can be solved but it takes this kind of holistic approach and i'm glad they've put together a huge nonprofit that works in that way that brings in city, private philanthropy and some federal grant resources to achieve that. harriet mcdonald, again thank you for coming today. it's good to see you again. i'm so sad about the loss of george, but so glad about your continued work and passion and personality that you show to the committee today. let me think through the doe fund and tell me the concerns you have when you combine paid work with transitional housing and supportive services. does that make it harder to get federal grant funding? >> absolutely. up until 2016, we won many awards because of our strong data. new york state study does and found we produced recidivism -- reduced recidivism. had stopped funding us because they decided the only thing they would really fund was permanent housing. we have 14 buildings now of really beautiful supported housing. the only people who qualified had very distinct illnesses, whether it's mental health, aids, being elderly and at a point in their life where they are not going to enter the workforce and it is an essential part of the solution for people with disabilities. however, the majority of people on the street don't suffer from that. >> when you throw some numbers there, the vast majority of your clients are what we consider transitional he homeless. from incarceration, out of work come out of luck, they have a drug and alcohol dependency, but it seems they would be able to reenter society fully. is that right? >> absolutely, and they do. we reduce recidivism by 62%, one of the highest numbers in the country and we've now served 29,000 people in the past few years who entered the mainstream, paid child support. it's actually a requirement at the doe fund because the mothers are incredibly poor also and the men overwhelmingly want to be involved with their children. when you learn how the big legacy for instance hardship your children are maybe even more important. >> thank you for your work in new york and a society and i yelled back to my friend. >> of the chair will now yield to the chairwoman of the committee ms. waters of california thank you very much. i'm going to try to raise a few questions and go quickly may be for each of the witnesses and i don't mean to be abrupt but i am now into trying to understand systems and how they work in the various areas. for example, i want to know from each of you who is responsible for your homelessness programs is it a department of the city council or another agency that has been organized by the city council and let me start with ms. bush. >> in kentucky we have three coc's and the balance of state is led by the state housing finance agency as the collaborative applicant. in louisville it is the nonprofit organization the coalition for the homeless and then in lexington the office of homelessness prevention and intervention within the city of lexington coordinates their applicator, activities. >> thank you for the question, chairwoman waters. obviously i don't run a continuum of care at this point. i worked in the district of columbia continuum of care where a nonprofit organization was identified as a collaborative applicant but what i would say is probably the most important piece of the work is the public and private sector partners that nonprofit organizations are working together to achieve a common goal and to ensure people with limited expertise are helping to make that transition. >> where does it stop? who has the responsibility for making sure the funds that we receive are utilized in the way that they were intended to be, where does the buck stop? >> in many communities with the collaborative applicant which is sometimes the nonprofit and sometimes the government. >> thank you. what about you. who has the responsibility? is that the city council or a nonprofit or a combination of agencies? >> thank you, chairwoman. it stops in our community with me. i run an agency that was created through legislation that combined the effort of the county and at the city of seattle into a single organization that has spanned the policy controlling funding for everything in the county and i would add that we are one of only i believe three organizations similarly situated in the country and it does make a big difference to the complexity of the answers you are getting is actually why it is so difficult to implement things appropriately. it should be possible for people to say to you it is my job. >> thank you. ms. roman? >> i'm in the district of columbia, so the same answer. it's from diane nonprofit. >> and if so, how many people know or have seen a database of the property that's available that could be used. how many people have seen that database? how many people believe what we could be involved with is seeing how we could get the ability for housing developers that develop affordable housing to have access to that land if they can build these units in a very affordable price, would that help? and do we believe that there are other laws and policies that could be made available for the use of city-owned property or removing obstacles in the city and to expedite the housing development for low income developers do you think that can be a better job done? >> it would result in a lot more housing how many people believe that we have systems that deal now that it's working inside of the process, what do we do, do we have a process? we've got to look at the process. in greater los angeles about the process we just got a report that $3 million was returned and that was on the spend. i talk with my public housing about the cares act. they've not been able to get their money out we've got to look at these processes. thank you and i will yield back the balance of my time. >> the chair recognizes mr. posey of florida for five minutes. >> thank you, chairman. homelessness is a sad. some critics suggest we focus on housing the homeless with many collectives as you mentioned to dealing with the addiction issues that explain the homelessness. tell us what you think the strategy should look like. >> we developed a three legged stool. that was always our concept from knowing the people and their needs we concentrate on work, services including working with people on their drug addictions which 95% of people have had, and job training and increasingly we do in trade to the higher level secure jobs like union jobs. for the first time in america because so many people were in the construction industry are retired or have retired. they could never afford it. it's like saying i will pay for college. okay. and we want people to go to college and to secure jobs. they have a right to support their family and get pensions and healthcare. to an earlier question, having the number of people that we've had for all these years, cleaning and serving the community has truly changed the perception of minority people and homeless and incarcerated people. we are all different and homeless people are different. they are not a monolith and as i said before, people definitely need permanent housing. is housing too expensive now for even working people? of course. but breaking the cycle is an incredibly important part of this and i've got to say certainly due to the prejudice history of the racial inequity. almost all the people that we serve our minority people so i believe still people feel i've known thousands personally. it's not true. the most important thing i think funding for the social programs in transitional housing is critical for a large segment of the homeless population. >> we need to move beyond housing to deal with the reason people end up homeless in our streets. i imagine it could be hard to get the chronically homeless to enter treatment programs. that might be even more difficult since the voicing case. do local governments. [inaudible] >> thank you mr. chairman and ranking member for holding these important hearings. new york city's lgbtq population has a problem with homelessness and particularly parts of the lower east side of manhattan. nearly one in four of the lgbtq populations was reported living in substandard housing. can you speak to the unique challenges of what the seniors face not only in new york but across the country. i appreciate the question and i've had an opportunity to do quite a bit of work. the thing that folks need this community. one of the things folks lift up quite frequently is because they've navigated the world and being able to engage in the network inside the housing options they have is really important and when we think about that we need to be prioritizing that. we also need to be very clear that particularly for our trans community there's quite a bit of housing discrimination and so folks do need robust protections as they access the market rate housing but even in the homeless system itself we continue to see there's quite a bit of discrimination and the other thing i would say he is again in speaking to that experience and community aspect for folks experiencing homelessness at any age range who identifies as lgbtq one of the things in the data is the pathways inside are often framed inside connecting with someone like them who they relate to and understand the things that they are going through. for the case managers around the transition support for trans women it was a detailed medical information that wasn't part of what most people know. we have to be thinking about seniors broadly and i think the rest of the panel can talk to that. >> thank you for your answers. one of the central tenets is to stop it before it starts. there's no denying for millions president biden into the congressional democrats have responded by allocating more than 46 billion for rental assistance. can you explain how this has helped keep individuals and families housed during the pandemic particularly those on the lowest end of the spectrum? >> i would be happy to do that. thank you for the question. to think about how we want to strengthen the affordable housing system to be better equipped for the next crisis or another crisis down the road. as i mentioned in my testimony more than 3.2 million households have been served with the emergency rental assistance program between january and november of last year and according to the treasury's data 88% of those who were served were low income or extremely low income and that means it is well targeted to help the folks who needed the most. to receive the rental and utility arrears to get caught up as well as to help support stability through the difficult circumstances to help people get back on their feet and it's largely credited with the potential eviction at the end of the federal addiction moratorium. >> i will yield back my time. >> did you finish your comment? >> thank you for the opportunity to finish that thought. i think what i was trying to say at the end is we know as we heard it is strapped to capacity right now permanent rental assistance resources based on the needs so the next time we have a crisis we will be more prepared. >> thank you very much. mr. rose of tennessee, you are recognized for five minutes. >> thanks to the ranking member for holding this hearing i also want to thank the witnesses for being here today. i was disappointed, however, to see that the democrats tax reconciliation bill that has already passed the house. a few months ago i visited tennessee in my hometown and the district of tennessee which is a nonprofit organization dedicated to helping individuals combat drug addiction. they are funded through the charitable organizations with the department of the substance abuse services in addition to payments that they receive from their residence. they also offer financial assistance to individuals when funds are available to assist to those that cannot afford the program. independence asks each to follow a set of rules to participate in the program. these include attending meetings, respecting curfews and submitting her random drug screenings all of which are aimed at providing structured structure andpromoting the indil responsibility. however, these common sense rules are disfavored under the housing first approach. your organization states that creating pathways to self-sufficiency and independence is at the heart of everything you do. could you please speak more about the importance of ensuring that individuals leave programs like this with the ability to maintain a stable job in addition to their sobriety? >> absolutely. you couldn't live on the street without having trauma. as i said, they need a three legged stool approach. the reason the paperwork for $15 an hour is so effective is because among the poorest people it is essential, so we do not put people on the street to create jobs if they are using because that isn't good for the community. so it does mean drug testing. it does mean intensive case management and drug services. the other thing i want to say is 70% of the staff are graduates and that is a key to our success. the other is obviously see them as role models and give some hope. hope is important. if you want people to give up drugs and you want people who go to work to need to have a hope that they will achieve that and there's no one that knows better. i learned everything i know from the people we serve. they are the experts and the homeless people on our staff, formerly homeless. do we have rules? yes. we need to be drug tested, yes. we have metal detectors. so yes there are requirements for doing that. we don't throw anyone out on the street though. you don't get paid for work. we called the police like anybody else because you have to protect all of the other people. i yield back. >> missus beatty of cincinnati. >> thank you mr. chairman. to the ranking member, thank you so much for hosting this hearing today and also to all of our distinguished witnesses for being here today. certainly we know our chair man spent a lifetime fighting and being an advocate for those in need of housing. you as witnesses have made a commitment to that. with that said, let's talk about the american rescue plan that democrats passed earlier this year and signed into law by president biden. i am so proud i could be a part of that because it sponsored approximately 17,000 emergency housing vouchers for persons at risk of homelessness or survivors of domestic violence or human trafficking, something i've also spent a lot of time with coming to congress and now in congress. i guess i want to start with you, ms. roman. can you tell me what kind of impact is this going to have on the homeless the data that we have been able to do this? there should be 70,000 vouchers, so it would certainly not to solve the problem, but it would have an impact and turn the corner. as i mentioned in my testimony, the fact that the systems are so beleaguered and overrun at the moment, it makes it more attractive to people with health. there are a lot of challenges going on. so people do get the services and more of what they need in the housing is a challenge. >> thank you for mentioning that it goes to other things. to make sure congress appropriated $20 million for family unification vouchers and that was the first time that this had been funded since 2010 and each year it's continued to be funded. is this helpful, or the population as most of you know for those that are aged out what kind of impact is it having and the reason i'm asking you as an expert to respond to this because we have so many people whether it's build back better or the rescue plan that didn't vote to support this and we would be so protective of our children or antihuman trafficking and others understand when they cast that vote it's so important for those watching to know the response ability we have to this population. >> a lot of people that have behavioral both issues have those issues because of being homeless, they were not the issues that caused the homelessness. it really is important to have these resources and it's another thing i will say we've been going in but the homeless members are not going down. the reason they are not going down is it's totally outside of the ability of the homeless system to control. more people are coming in and one of the systems sending people in his foster care so the first voucher that you provided are effective and the mechanisms to stop people from entering foster care and sadly becoming homeless. >> thank you. i yelled back. thank you to the witnesses. >> of the chair recognizes mr. steil of wisconsin. >> appreciate you holding today's hearing. i want to build on what my colleagues have been discussing as it relates to housing first. as you know and we are all aware there is been a big shift in hud and among practitioners to housing first. my concern is the shift is ignoring the fact that many individuals need more than a home support to overcome. it really reminds me i went to a homeless shelter in wisconsin and it provides a lot of the wraparound services. the local church group was preparing dinner before 5:00 and i met a young man. he came out and said hello and he just woke up and i was kind of shocked. it's almost 5:00. i asked him and he said he was going to work the night shift at the amazon facility just down the road. it's $20 an hour depending on your exact shift. this young man fell on hard times and didn't have a family support structure and found himself in the center and they also provided the connection into a local job to make sure they get back up on their feet and also to provide the next step to be able to own a home and move a along. the housing first policy is sometimes missing some of the other key components of homelessness. could you comment in your experience, so think about addiction or mental health challenges how often is that contributing to homelessness and then assuming that is a factor, can we address some of the key challenges of homelessness without the key wraparound services? >> i think what is available today through permanent housing is certainly essential and designed and funded to serve people that are chronically, mentally ill and suffering from other disabilities. that's important as i said. but that is not the majority of the people that live on our street. they have systemic lifelong problems due to terrible education. yes, foster care. we have tons of young people that come out of foster care and incarceration. we can't lose sight of that piece. when you come out of prison, how are you going to get a job, where are you going to live, and that is a very substantial part of the population we serve. >> i looked at some of the work that you've done with the fund and then the question starts to become how has the housing first policy impacted the fund? >> when the policy was first embraced in 2016, we lost all of our hud of money because we were not a permanent housing solution. you need both. and to say that these people can live in the permanent housing and there's no way that out of the residential base -- >> we have limited time unfortunately. the housing policy is negatively arming the populations that you work with? .. is that better mr. chairman? thank you very much for this hearing is exceedingly important. like you i've people living under an overpass near my office. it is heartbreaking to see young people there. to see persons who appear to be associated with the military there veterans or they claim to be. my questions has more to do with how we approach the problem. there is a debate that looms whether we should have centralized for persons with her of all the approaches in one area as well as the i bring this up intentionality was to do good to help people the concentration of services. need to get to them because they do not have transportation. if you decentralize than transportation becomes a real issue for the homeless. so the question i have is for persons who can help me with the question of centralized or decentralized. mr. jones would you care to respond please? >> i think it is important we create avenues for folks to get as much as we can and a one-stop shop. that does not have to be skid row. there are a lot of ways to do that. in portland, organs in which leverages by health center. i think it's very possible to do in a way that doesn't create in other jurisdictions he is what housing first. is not housing only. as i would spend services involved. we just have to have that as what is true in this conversation. >> and q mr. jones. mr. miscellany like you to respond to the question. >> thank you for the question sir. >> i agree with mark and there's a number of ways we can be providing both housing and services to people experiencing homelessness. in outset a couple of things about that. whether centralized or not centralized i think it's important to ask people who are experiencing homelessness how they would like to receive what type of services they would like to receive it. really providing a choice to accept and service support they want and need. i also have to make sure housing first is not a program. it is an approach. it actually provides folks with a choice what they want and need. it is not housing only but those are really important pieces that have been mischaracterizing this hearing. >> thank you for your comments on housing first as well mr. jones i think you two. let's move to ms. mcdonald. drug tests are required of the consequences if he failed a drug test please? >> yes thank you. it's really not having people go out to work. because number one they work in communities all over new york city. and you cannot be high. a second of all may be the most successful part of it is that people want to make money and that is what they lose. all the people i have housing. they want to get back with their children. they want to be functioning members but they cannot do that if they are continuing to get high. >> my time is expired thank you month mr. chairman. oxo chair now recognizes the gentleman from texas, mr. taylor. we appreciate the witnesses being here. ronald reagan's, the best social program in the world is a job. so employment is really a key feature to helping people not the wood of the homelessness which is a very serious we try to continue to address in our society. different places have different levels of success. it certainly sees there's a consensus that they are the wraparound services addressing mental health. as well as the housing employment try to help a person may contribute members of society. but it's ultimately all of our objectives that we are trying to see. one thing i will express concern about i believe one of the big drivers of inflation last year was the rise of rent. and making housing more expensive as a result of exhaustive deficit spending over the last two years. truly the last year. as a result of the inflation we are borrowing money, creating inflation, which creates more homelessness. you are in the middle of saying something about your work i new york city. i want to commend me for your work and success you've had a lot of success. also the wraparound services. that is why we start in order to be successful in earning money so that makes them able to save money. and contribute to a job for it. for the vast majority of people job is essential to independence. it is independent. focusing on jobs, economic growth i'm from an employment is completely recovered from the pandemic. while other states these are choices different leaders have made. having a harder time recovering. thousands of homelessness would you agree? >> absolutely. i was actually going to tell you about a current participant. to clean the streets in a much broader area because of the pandemic. this young man entered that way. at that time he lived with his brother. he had a long, long history of substance abuse, lack of education and training. when his brother moved out of the state he called us. we already employed him. the result, as it is in so many cases this same week and he went to her ninth birthday party. and she told him, he was her hero. and i heard children saying that. next i see my time has expired i yield back. the chairman recognizes mr. vargas of california for five minutes. >> thank you very much mr. chairman. before i say anything else, mr. mcdonald thank you, god bless you pretty have to tell you, i cannot say how much i've appreciated your testimony today, honestly. reminds him jesus admonition in jon 1511 what others i have loved you and matthew 19 you love your brother as yourself. i never met your husband but i assume you probably had that in mind too. i assume you are republican because all republicans are asking a question. i have to say normally people who are incarcerated or undocumented them on the other side talking to them are humans are brothers and sisters. since undocumented people go sideways. just listening to you as uplifting so god bless you. and i made mean that god bless you. >> again all the work you have done we talked about this a little bit gone up that is because so many people to be homeless we paid $176,000 for it. that's what we paid. you put inflation calculator it's about 130,000. my neighbor just sold his house and bought at the same time i did. people for $1.6 million. how can you afford that? it is ridiculous. the toilet so much how most of the price of housing in california. we need more housing. so i appreciate that. i want to ask one particular question my good friend and colleague asked me too ask about naomi schwartz or he has proposed so many people now live in their cars, they have a grant for the cities and localities can help people transition at least have a safe place. i understand mr. roman you know a little bit about this? can i question on that row quickly? >> sure. >> when you think about it? >> to tell you the truth, a while ago i would've said i didn't think it was such a great idea. but he really have been changing my mind about it. there are a lot of people there only asset is their vehicle. if they're going to stay in a shelter would probably lose their vehicle because there's no place for them to park. especially in california. and in the west of the going to get to jobs which we've said repeatedly the witnesses had said 40% of people who are homeless are working. most people are homeless get out of homelessness by working. the average length of time people are homeless is six weeks. a car or vehicle is really important. it is an asset. they get ticketed birth they can't pay the ticket they may get cited or incarcerated because of that. it allows them to get their kids to school. >> you think it's a good idea? this is such a complicated issue. i feel like i oh, you this time. you are dealing with really hard core issues it sounds like. how about families utility families? >> we started much more recently in our permanent housing. it is a different animal. they have very young children. and those children needs a home. they can't go to work in the beginning for sure. and there is no daycare. and i just want to tell you, i am not a republican. [laughter] i am not. i don't say i am a republican or democrat. but i am not a republican. and i am not a democrat. >> a tight little secret i like republicans. >> v2. roxie is mind too. >> i know a lot of other amazing republican leaders. arthur brooks, general arthur been so helpful to me and has been one of our great champions. there are huge fans who are democrats. >> thank you, appreciate you coming. the chair now recognizes the gentleman from california, mr. sherman you're now recognized for five minutes. >> thank you mr. chair. in my homelessness which is designed to allow public housing authorities to share with local government agencies. with nonprofit organizations engage in a continuum of care. and according to research done by the trust this a data sharing pave the way for the state of virginia to become the first state, in their words functionally and veteran homeless on this. we passed this bill in 2020 through the whole house. and i look forward to giving the support of our colleagues in passing it again and hopefully the senate will take it up. i think a lot of people had made the point that housing is too expensive. rent is too high. it is a matter of supply and demand. rent is not expensive everywhere. but it is expensive and my district and many of the other districts that are represented here. i turned to colleagues in other parts of the country where you can build an apartment for $100,000. it might city is trying to build just a shelter for homeless people and is spending five or $600,000 to do so. we've got to bring down the cost of construction and that means a lot when people build it's very controversial on a local level. given the complex nature of housing policies, we've got to look for ways to increase the supply of affordable housing and provide those families and individuals with assistance. do you believe that passage proposed by our colleague from new york but help prevent families who fall on hard times from experiencing homelessness? and of course this is a bill that provides $3 billion in short-term assistance to targeted low income people who were living paycheck to paycheck. an art risk of being evicted. >> thank you so much for that question sir. rental assistance is a key component of our strategies in order to address the homelessness and affordability crisis. so really would been talking about it's partially included in the bill we talk about is a three-pronged approach. make sure were keeping the units are affordable in our community on affordable housing. i think one of the most important pieces as you pointed out the expansion program. make that it's to folks at the lowest income in the right now "build back better" serve about 300 households leading 80000 household expensing homelessness, 700,000 people in total. >> a mi squeeze a one more question for you. we need to build 328 new part it's been 300 the l.a. area. what policies do you advocate in order to create additional apartment needs? >> what we really are focused on is ensuring we have affordable housing that is affordable to folks who are at the lowest income. targeted program to do that is the national trust fund. exclamation squeeze in one more question we've got section 82.1 million households are in their rent. perhaps for the record you could tell us what we can learn from the private sector to make the section eight program work better? work very quickly. >> on affordability, what is affordable to extremely low income constituents. the power of the government but the private sector and address those needs, thank you. >> thank you. the chair now recognizes mr. lawton of florida we are pleased to see her continuing to recover now five minutes. thank you for the great job you are doing homelessness is a big issue in my district. especially my question is to the whole panels and anyone on the panel can respond too early to know the effects of covid on homelessness. the lack of supplies food facilities all over the country among staff particularly rapid turnover. better assess these shelters make sure facilities are receiving order to help people in need. and can anyone on the panel can address it. i can go first representative. in our jurisdiction for quite frankly we need funding to pay people more making poverty wages trying to end homelessness the burnout rates are expansive. and folks are simply leaving. we need to be able to can pin you at the local level we cobbled together money to emergency funding with hazard pay kinds of things. we need money to continue to do that. that would be the most helpful thing that art jurisdiction could receive for the federal government right now. next i want anyone want to respond? >> i would be happy to go next. [inaudible] what to make sure for the record. i agree with mark completely left to invest in our workforce in order to make sure that workforce is stable, well-trained and not also dealing with housing instability for people they are serving. i talked to a person is experiencing homelessness who told me they cycled through ten case manager in their time at a particular program. that's not good for the case managers it's also not good for them to build their own address the needs and shelters jurisdictions across the country might across the country the investments i talked about earlier in the trust fund and expansion of the program for it that make everybody's job easier. >> and going to try to get in the next question for the panel. fewer people will live in shelters and motels and on the streets. it is widely available how do you suggest we quickly get individual families and shelters approved in homes? definitely more vouchers are what are needed. we did this vouchers with someone with the highest need flexibility to reduce some of the requirements in terms of documentation and so forth we have a more organized sector that was doing a landlord coordination. defined units to navigation to help people who are homeless buying the units. it's not prox over someone living in a shelter to be going all around town need to build up more infrastructure there could be happening faster i went to say this before you cut me off, we talk about this homeless for the last four years. and we have the ability in congress to do something about it. all of us should be we allocate money for everything else. we really should take people off the streets and give them a safe environment, a place to live, to put a roof over their head. but we are not doing it. we are debating what it's all about. the chairwoman wanted to do something about it. and with that i yield back. >> thank you "build back better". the vice chair of the subcommittee you are not recognized for five minutes. >> thank you, mr. chairman free thank you for the witnesses were being here today for this is such a critical subject for this committee to be working on. and unfortunately not as much progress we would like to be seeing here. 2007 -- 2016. we have now seen increases in the number of people experiencing homelessness for each of the last four years. sadly in iowa at the increase of 14%. just in this last year. which is unfortunate the third largest increase in the country. but one thing that really jumped out at me as a large increase the number of unsheltered people which is a lot more than 25% in the last four years. that is especially true in our rural areas were 44% experiencing homelessness or unsheltered. working on that issue like to start by asking you describe some the challenges on homelessness big challenges is not the homeless infrastructure in rural areas because they are not as many people who need it. numbers wise not percentagewise. there is not necessarily an entire homeless infrastructure, shelter, services in every community. because of that people double up it's not necessarily their having housing problems. i think probably what is needed is more direct assistance to households just to get re-house and a lot of intermediate things we have the bigger cities could be avoided. get into housing more quickly. >> thank you for that. i have a bill we are considering to work on those exact issues and to expand the use of homelessness of funding for rural areas. i think you have seen the bill. you think this would help get people sheltered in rural areas? >> i do think it would help a lot. when it's reauthorized but got something similar to this for rural errors. it's never been implemented. for financing reasons. i do think focusing on the relocation assistance short-term lodging things like that it would work very well and rural areas and help decrease the numbers there. >> thank you. are there any additional flexibilities you would recommend to this legislation? i don't have to think right now but we can to about that. except think that out i would appreciate that. moving on, on eve done a lot of work in this area as well jump any thoughts on the bill? you brought up a few things i heard resources on meeting more people to help out. many have mentioned that. jeff any thoughts on this bill any additional uses for the funding that you would suggest? >> thank you for the question. i believe in my last year end service at the department of housing and urban development we were proposing something similar to what your bill reflects. to make the continuum of care programs a little more flexible for the rural areas especially since we don't have a program that is specifically designed for rural areas. i think the bill makes a lot of sense. talk to folks the housing assistance council about their thoughts on the bill as well. flexibilities going to be really important. those of the kind of things our rural communities have been asking for. >> thank you put out tell you what, my goal is to make some simple changes. just to make sure we are helping rural areas with homelessness. enter your point is a different approach that's needed and are bigger areas we do not have connectivity necessarily the homelessness in the way we do and some of our old larger urban areas. i am hoping we get this bill through so we can address the different solutions you have all talked about here and put those into practice very quickly. this idea originally came from hud under the last administration. i am hoping we can recognize this is a common sense solution i should say that it is. thank you so much for the work you're doing and thank you for answer my questions. i yield back. i asked the judge late yield back the chair out recognize ms. when the solutions of homelessness can hear me? >> breeze police. >> the solution to homelessness is affordable housing made it illegal to build affordable housing have more affordable housing and less homeless. homelessness is a public policy choice. i have a few thoughts to offer on street homelessness in particular. for me there something profoundly dehumanizing about the american discourse around street homelessness. we often speak as if those living on the street or quality-of-life conditions to be cleaned up for sanitary conditions to be swept away we speak of the street homeless the recycled and out of the criminal justice system. most people pass without the barest acknowledgment of their basic humanity. firming the street how much should be seen not as a threat to our quality of life, but of people in need of housing and service. the homeless should be seen not as an aesthetic light on our society but our society should be seen as that moral light on the homeless languish on the streets on house and uncared for. even though most homelessness is essentially a consequence of the affordability crisis. i do blow there's a mental health to chronic stream homelessness. made the intersection of housing and healthcare underscore the urgent need to supportive housing which is housing with services. my first question, is it fair to say supportive housing is not one of the most humane but the most cost-effective approach for addressing street homelessness? >> indefinitely housing from the supportive housing can prove ineffective over the years quite substantially it would do the same for chronic homelessness, yes. >> it's the fact psychiatric hospitalization, correct? >> there is a lot of data with behavioral health disorders housing and services is less expensive than lead them on the street or in a shelter and overusing emergency assistance act it's more cost-effective than the shelter system get there more people they get mental health care from jails rather than supporting housing developments. one of the largest providers of mental health in the united states is rikers island. in fy 2020 cost new york city nearly half a million dollars to incarcerate an individual. fy 2017 a cost new york city $70000 to provide emergency shelter to a family $38000 to provide emergency shelter to an adult. so even if you have no compassion no core belief in housing as a human right, the fact remains permanent housing for those in need is far left x less expensive than incarceration or temporary shelter. you share that? >> i do share that yes. that is what the data indicates. in the homelessness act which codifies housing vouchers for all would radically reduce homelessness in america. i know of no other policy that creates so much affordability for so many so quickly. united states were to implement housing vouchers for all hundreds of thousands of units may be even millions of units would become affordable to families almost overnight. does anyone have any thoughts on housing vouchers for all? >> there is a supply issue. having housing vouchers but there would need to be subsidy for other supply. that is the solution. i will also say briefly with oberg on housing issues which was in the late 70s we had poverty, mental illness, we did not have homelessness. that's because there is an adequate supply of affordable housing at the time. >> if i may. to everything dan just said which i agree are we are have the universal housing voucher we would be lifting 9.3 million people above the poverty line. people of color would benefit from that. on the way she rolled it out. >> the power to create affordable housing were lacking is the political will. execute a full opportunity to read your question i didn't know? >> i did. to make one more point? >> please burn going to allow the republicans, democrats, anybody make sure your final thought out. >> is a local example new york city that illustrates the power of housing vouchers. recently passed a law raise the value of city vouchers before the law passed through only 564 units affordable to city vouchers after the law passed their 72000 affordable to those with the city vouchers tied to section h. that is one example of the sheer power of a housing voucher program thank you mr. chair. >> now recognizes a gentleman from massachusetts for five minutes. >> thank you. [inaudible] the pandemic with the eviction crisis subjective and violent events. but also the short term, yes? >> were getting some interference trying to get it straight now. apologize may have my time back mr. chair whenever it's good to go? >> absolutely. re: good franklin? okay sorry we apologize. >> no problem take two. thank you chairman cleaver, think of her witnesses for being here. the pandemic is drawn new attention to the eviction crisis and how it contributes to homelessness, racial and gender evictions are devastating, disruptive and violent events only destabilize families in the short term but also make it more expensive and challenging to rent safe housing in the future. apply for credit, borrow money, or to purchase a home. in massachusetts black art more likely to have. [inaudible] boxer having a problem again. i apologize. we are trying to get it straight here. i tell you what, let's try to get audio straightened out. and the visual as well now. we will come back to you have your complete five minutes time. for now recognize i want to recognize my fellow kentucky audrey and how are you. as executive director of the homeless coalition of kentucky, adrienne and her team of than some truly life changing and the commonwealth. while we may disagree on the merits of exclusive reliance on the housing first policy, i do want to thank her and her team for their advocacy on the behalf of the over 4000 street in sheltered homeless and disadvantage they adopted housing first as exclusive solution to combating homelessness, unsheltered increased more than 20% despite substantial increases in federal funding. this increase came after a decade of decline in homelessness. roughly 31% between 2007 and 2014. in california which doubled down on housing first by requiring all state funding go to housing first programs they are more telling between 2015 and 2019, unsheltered homeless in california rose 47%. so, in my view the data is clear. housing first has been a failure. last year interest housing promotes a livelihood and ultimate success act with the housing plus act which would make more inclusive the allocation grant money to combat homelessness. we tried an exclusive housing first model and it did not work. now we should expand the toolkit and bring more providers into the fold. miss mcdonnell, what impact would it have would i propose have on combating homelessness? i will allocating federal funds to more rather than fewer qualified providers including the dough fund. without help transition people out of homelessness? >> you need to turn on your volume there. okay. go ahead please. >> yes. as i said before, homelessness is not made up of a monolithic group of people. and i think it was a disservice to stop funding any transitional programs that provided housing as well as more communal services. on the great benefits to us into the people we serve been our ability for strong communities of upwardly mobile people and get support from the staff that are vastly in majority who who are formally homeless. i think there has to be a multiple of answers to a very complex issue. we are fortunate because we are social enterprise. so we get contrast to the work we do. and a lot of donations because of her high visibility on the streets. but social enterprise can be a port piece of some homeless programs. that money that allows our guys to get paid and all of those things because we run businesses. they are competitive with for-profit businesses for. >> my time is running out. i do appreciate that found in similar organizations we need to identify homelessness not just of lacking a roof over your head. overlying causes for homelessness. last lack of case management financial literacy substance abuse disorder, we need to meet these folks where they are. i subscribe to my good friend citation we need to care for these people not just a warehouse them but care for them. engage my constituent your testimony strongly advocates the use of housing first in your coalition is based on my district. this issue was brought by another constituent organization in franklin county. when i was visiting that transitional housing facility that cater to women recovering from substance abuse disorder one of the ladies told us please, please, please begged me not to force her to live in a shelter for their other active users. to be surrounded other people who are active addiction you could understand that was going to compromise her recovery. so i invited her feedback on that. quick sure. it's good to see you even overcame her computer. the director of the franklin county women in family shelter is who i think you are referring to. we have known each other for a long time. having done this work in a rural community i spent 15 years of my life in eastern kentucky, i have worked the overnight shelter shift. i know we have folks in varying stages of recovery. in any of substance abuse issues may have come after becoming homeless. you do want to be careful. i will say franklin county women shelters needs to have pivoted. their mission really is tied to recovery. they are recovery facility. things that may be more appropriate to the recovery and quite frankly more generous than how the grant program is funded. they may end up being in a better place. and i just want to say, i have worked in transitional housing program that was a continuum of care grants funded back in 2000. i have done transitional shelter. i became a housing first advocates because i thought that is what works for my perspective. and i think you're absolutely right. we need to meet people where they are. one of things i like about true high fidelity is that it doesn't meet people where they are. and it prioritizes choice and opportunity. thank you. >> thank you. again we apologize what happened. you are now recognize. x all right, thank you mr. chair will try this again. just going to my first question to speak to the policy ever porting or consumer reports, how about worsens the homelessness crisis? makes it harder for people to find safe affordable homes to access the financial tools they need to be successful? >> thank you so much for that question. it is really an important question to think about homelessness perfection overall. we note eviction perpetuate cycles of homelessness and housing instability. on the lot use consumer reports during their initial screening they may choose has a history of eviction. that happens even when eviction filing is ultimately withdrawn. sometimes it doesn't show up without the additional context of our ability that prospective tenant should be able to explained what happened or the context. he also noted this is a particular problem especially for renters of color and in particular black and latino women are more likely to be evicted than their mail counterparts. it really does have a huge impact not be able to exit homelessness. >> thank you. i mean it's clear the u.s. credit system perpetuates racism and economic justice also benefactors attempt to pass it off as an objective metric of financial trustworthiness. in reality this further entrenches injustice and acts as a barrier to families ability to realize the basic human rights the housing and opportunity. we know prior to the pandemic is estimated 3.7 million evictions are filed every year. that has a arete around seven per minute. even though the date is very jarring it still may not show the full story of the eviction crisis. would you mind defining what are illegal evictions? how prevalent are they and how dare they carried out? >> is a legal eviction is an eviction when they don't vote local laws include the number like changing the locks, removing someone's belongings from the unit without court order. we've heard of people who remove the front door to units as the method of an illegal eviction or turning off utilities. but i would also note sometimes just the threat of an eviction from a landlord for all the reasons we just talked about is the impact and eviction can have on somebody's record can incentivize a family move on. these are illegal. we don't know exactly how many of these happened. a lot of times they happened because landlords have access to legal counsel. they must have access to legal counsel but only 10% of tenants on their fighting. >> thank you for that. required to inform tenants of their rights. that helped to correct out on this illegal evictions illegal and also incredibly demoralizing in so many ways giving the imagery you provided about what happens? what if they were required for these cracked down convictions and reduce the numbers? >> the more tenants know about their rights the better. and the better equipped they are illegal or unjust practices. but they also need access to counsel strong local protection. at the end of the day if we can make housing more affordable to more households through an extension of our affordability all of that would lessen the burden on these tenants. >> are almost out of time. there required to provide justification for eviction writing type introduce the housing emergencies. not only to prohibit of the consumer report that cracks down on illegal eviction in that exact way. i hope my colleagues will support it's a critical part of a larger long-overdue strategy to end homelessness. and i yield, thank you mr. chair. >> you have any wheat mess you up. i am all set. answered my questions and was also a speak about my legislative solutions and responsive thank you. >> thank you. like to thank all of our witnesses for the testimony today. without objections, all members will have five legislative days of which to submit written questions the chair. and it we forwarded for their response. ask witnesses to respond is probably as you're able. without objection all members will have five legislative days for materials for the chair for inclusion in the record. i will remind members written questions and materials for the record should be submitted to e-mail addresses provided to your office. there are no pertinent questione covid-19 restrictions. 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