For a complete schedule, visit booktv. Org. Alan dershowitz talks about becoming a lawyer and the many cases hes handled over the past 50 years. This hourlong program is next on booktv. [applause] welcome, everybody. Its delightful to see you all, and remarkable in a funny way for the two of us to be here, alan. I feel as if you ought to be tutoring me for one of our final exams, which you used to do. Weve known each other for over 50 years, as you just heard, and i dont know how that came to be. But you say in your book that you were a dreadful student until you went to college. That during elementary and secondary school, you were a disaster. What turned it around . I dont know. I wish i knew. In Elementary School and high school, i was a c and d student. I have in my book an actual photograph of my senior semester report card with a 60 in physics, red circle around it, 60 in math, red circle around it, 65 in history, and i managed to squeeze out an 80 in english. So i had a 67 average, and i was actually suspended from the Varsity Basketball Team not for athletic defishty, but for deficiencies, but for athletic deficiencies. I went to a jewish parochial school, and my principal called me and in and said, you know, you have a big mouth but not much of a brain. You have to figure out something to do with your life where you can talk a hot but a lot but you dont have to think a lot. You could be a rabbi or a lawyer. [laughter] i wasnt smart enough to be a rabbi, so i became a lawyer. So at age 16 and a half, i was a failure. And by age 17 and a half, i was at the top of my class in brook runs college with straight as. I never got a b. And i think the reason was i didnt change as much as the school changed. I went to a college where anything went. You could ask any question. You could raise any issue. Whereas the high school i went to, you were punished, essentially, for raising questions that were heretical. So i really do think that Brooklyn College saved me. Look, if i had had better grades in high school, you and i would have been classmates because i probably would have tried to get into columbia. I was turned down wise decision based on my grades and i was so lucky that Brooklyn College was a free school and had an exam that i took. One person told me i was smart, a Camp Counselor i had a lot of respect for, told me i was smart. That sunk in and gave me a little confidence. You once told me you had two fees for your legal work, outrageous and free. Tell us about a case or two in each category. Yeah. Well, i do half of my cases free, and, um, i represented lots and lots of people. For example, i represent soldiers. And first responders. And police officers. People who, in my view, perform an enormous Public Service but are underpaid. So i have a policy of representing them for free, and in my book stand your ground, i talk about representing colonel steele, the colonel of black hawk down in mogadishu when he was being investigated for creating an atmosphere around which some of his soldiers may have acted irresponsibly. I represented him free, and we got the charged dropped charges dropped. I represented a woman some years ago who was locked in a mental hospital, and it was a case where her family was trying to be rid of a nuisance. She came up to me at a book signing and reminded me that i had, quote, saved her life. Two young boys on death row who were innocent, their father had committed the murders for which they were sentenced to death. That case took me nine years. Ann tolely she ran sky, i represented him. Somebody once asked me what my biggest fee was, and they said we didnt know he had any money. He didnt, but when i was able to help him get free and return to his wife and family and he whispered in my ear the hebrew blessing, blessed are those who help free the imprisoned, that was the biggest fee ill ever get. In terms of the outrageous fees, why not . If im representing billionaires, why not charge what the going rate is . I use my billionaire cases to fund my poor cases, and it works out. You said that the greatest legal blunder of the 20th century was committed by president clintons lawyer in the paul that jones paula jones case, this is roger bennett. Right. Could you explain that a little bit . Yeah. I just to this day not imagine why the president of the United States who had his choice of any lawyer in the country would pick a lawyer who didnt tell him that he had the option not to have to testify about his sex life in the paula jones case. All he had to do was default the case. That does not settle the case, but just to to the clerks office, have his lawyer deposit a check finish 750 which was the amount of the lawsuit, the case is over. But he never told the president that he had that option. He only told him he could either settle the case, the other side didnt want to settle on positive terms, or he would have to litigate. And when i told the president that, he was shocked. He didnt know he had this option. So i called Robert Bennett on the phone, and i said is it true you didnt tell the president of this third option . He said, absolutely, its true. Why not . He said it would have been a stupid idea. I said, isnt that his decision to make, not your decision . Well, thats what Robert Bennett didnt tell the president , and i think that was the biggest legal blunder. It got the president impeached, it almost got him indicted, and the idea that the president has to testify about his sex life doesnt mean the president should have done it, he wouldnt have had to testify if he didnt do it, but if he didnt testify and simply said that the dignity of the presidency does not permit me to talk about anything private, i think he would have survived. But thats his decision to make. A lawyers job is to tell the client what the options are. In taking the stand, your new book, you talk about the only crime youve ever committed. [laughter] you want to tell that story . Well, actually, since i wrote that book, i may have committed another one. [laughter] so let me be very clear, they both involve my sonment my son was 10 years old, and e had a very serious he had a very serious brain surgery. Hes fine, but he had very serious brain surgery, and he was 10 years old. He recovered very well, and he went back to work. He had always worked selling newspapers in harvard square, and one day two thugs came and beat him up for the 3 or 5 he had and peat him in the head beat him in the head and knocked a tooth out. Then when and they were arrested. And when they met in court again or some other time, the two kids came over to my son and said unless you drop the charges, next time were going to throw you in front of the train. So i saw these kids in harvard square, and i walked up to them, and i mentioned the name of a man i was representing at the time. I was representing him only on a marijuana charge, but he was a notorious hit man for the mob. [laughter] and he killed his clients in particularly brute always. And all i did was mentioned the name of my client and tell these kids how much my client admired me and made it clear to them that if they touched my son again, my client would find out about it. These kids got down on their hands and knees and begged me not to do it. I probably committed a crime. [laughter] but the next one was just recently, a i few months ago when a few months ago when my son, again, had a problem, went to the hospital. When he got out, he was opening a cab door, i was with him, and a woman was sitting in the cab, and she dropped her bottle of wine and it broke, and my son immediately said, oh, let me pay for it, i apologize. But a man came around and started to punch my son. And here i am, this 75yearold guy, and i reared back, and i punched him in the jaw, knocked his glasses off, and he ran away. And probably that was assault. Not with a deadly weapon, but assault, and id do it again in a minute. Anybody attacks my children, my loved ones, no matter how old i am, im going to respond. Hey, i grew up in brooklyn, we were street kids. We learned how to fight back. What has been the strangest or perhaps the single funniest moment youve had in court . Enter well, i won a case once by telling a joke. I was representing the movie i am curious yellow. Any of you remember that . You probably watched that on general television today, maybe an r rating. But the man who showed that film was sentenced to a year in yale for showing an obscene in jail for showing an on screen film. There the judge didnt seem to be getg the argument, and i said in chambers we held a little conference, and i said, your honor, maybe thisll make the point. I reminded him of a man who was Walking Around in year europe, and his watch broke. He saw a store with watches and clocks in the window and went in and said, mister, can you fix your watch . Fix your watch . I dont fix watches, i perform circumcisionings. Then why do you have watches and clocks in your window . The guy says what do you want i should put in my be window . I told the joke, the judge laughed, he got it, and he said, yeah, it really depends on whats in the window and ruled in our favor. That was a pretty strange movement. [laughter] you also once told me the story about your father and the argument that you made in i am curious yellow that your father had learned something from seeing the film. [laughter] you know, its funny because, generally, when i represent ive seen films and, believe me, ive represented my share of them. Ive done frontal nudity, backward nudity, upside down nudity. Generally, i dont watch the film. For example, i then after i am curious yellow, i represented the film deep throat, and i represented the actor harry reames. I p want to make the point to the judge, this is not about the film. This is about choice. Ive never be seen an abortion. Ive never witnessed gay sex. I favor the right of gay people and every other people to do what they want in the pryce of their home privacy of their home. I dont have to see something to think that the state has no right to control it. Ive never seen the film deep throat, i have no interest in seeing the film. I have interest in make sure that you dont have to see it if you dont want to, but you can see it if you choose to. So thats the argument when it comes to films. You know, maybe somebody will learn something from a film, maybe theyll learn the wrong thing, but you can learn the wrong thing from reading marx or the bible. Now, youre a young man be, and you are compared to you. I mean [laughter] i think you have got six months on me. I do. After 50 years only of teaching at Harvard Law School, this is your last semester. Right. What does your future hold . Oh, who knows . I dont think of this as a retirement, i think of it as a career change. Ive had the same job 50 years. Youve been Prime Minister of a Great University president of a Great University for 20 years, that may be a world record. By the way, steves new book on presidencies derailed is a brill p i cant book, and its not only about presidencies, its about leadership failure, success, its just a great book. Thank you. And, you know, i think when you get to be our age, you do think about what you would like to do that you havent done. People asked me all the time is there anything you havent done . Well, if there has been, i want to do it. Im going to write more books, im going to litigate more cases. The only thing im not going to do is teach. Ive taught 10,000 student, and theyve ranged from ted cruz on the right to eliot spitzer. Now, dont blame me for, you know [laughter] ill take responsibility for eliot spitzer, ill tell you why. Was he worked because he worked for me as a research assistant, and he was one of the best i ever had. And he worked so hard. One day i said to him, elliott, youre working so hard, go out, have fun. Well, i dont know whether that was the cause [laughter] but, you know, i take no responsibility for ted cruzs political views. My job as a professor is not to turn conservatives into liberals or liberals into curs, its to make them better analytic thinkers. If the you came into my class as a conservative, i want you to leave a smarter conservative, and the same thing is through true as a liberal. Your introduction sets the scene where the autobiographer is set as a witness taking the stand. To extend this metaphor, who do you see as the judge and as the juriesome. Thats a great question. And, you know, in america, of course, the ultimate jury are the American People. Our legal system is determined more by what the American People think than what nine judges think. No matter what the Supreme Court has said about obscenity, cheerily clearly, turn on your cable television, go to any video store, go on the internet, and we see that the public has prevailed. You can see anything. You can watch anything. Obviously not, hopefully not child pornography because that exploits young children. Thats an ongoing crime. But when were dealing with adults, anything goes. So the people govern in the end. My ultimate jury are the people. The judges, maybe my students, particularly law students. I want law students to read this book. I want them to learn about not only the law, but how to live the passion of your times, how not to compromise, how not to look back after the end of your career and say i miss this, i miss that, i miss the other thing. Oliver Wendell Holmes urged people to live the passion of their times. Ive tried to do that, and i want to convey those lessons to my judge and jury. If i was writing the screenplay to your memoir, pun one thing i would have to establish is the critical moment, the moment in which you became infatuated with the law. Of you dont mention that. Is there such a moment . No. I never, ever thought of doing anything but being a criminal lawyer. All of my life i knew i wanted to argue with people, i wanted to be contentious, i wanted to be confrontational, in your face. Thats who i was. And i think the secret of success, if there is any, is to know what you are, not what you want to be or what somebody wants to make you. The difference between my two clerkships is justice goldberg, who was a great man, wanted to remake me in his image. He wanted me to be a Supreme Court justice. I had no interest in being a judge. Judge david babylon wanted me to be myself, and being myself was always being contentious, confrontational. And as you remember from reading the book, i say there are really two characters. Theres the dersh character, overtalking the next guy and always trying to get the last word, and then the real alan who never wins an argument with his family, who is a complete and total pushover, who hates confrontation at home or with my friends, and ive tried to live a life that balances the dersh character and the real alan. The New York Times reviewer who generally gave the book quite a good review said that she wishes more of the book had been written by the real alan rather than the dersh character, and thats an actual fair point. I think mostly the dersh character wrote the book. But the dersh characters a much more interesting guy. You really dont want to read about boring al whose wife tells him what to do and whose children boss him around. Hes a much more interesting guy, the dersh character. [laughter] on a lighter note do i get a little schizophrenic . [laughter] you briefly talk about why jews are overrepresented, and one theory youre pointing at is jews faced welcome discrimination and it was a means of protecting themselves. And following this theory you mentioned that your grandfather contrived affidavits and married his eldest to save jews trapped in germany. Could you expand . First of all, i dont think so much the jews are overrepresented in the law as theyre underrepresented in professional football and babble. [laughter] you know, when i was 15 or 16, id have much preferred to have been the shortstop for the brooklyn dodgers, but nature didnt point me in that direction. So jews have dominated in parking many parts of the world, least numerically the Legal Profession. It was true in the former soviet union, its certainly been ru in the United States. And i think part of the reason is jews are always on trial. Weve always been accused. You killed jesus, you were at fault during the inquisition, the dreyfuss affair, you name it, jews have been on trial, and weve needed lawyers. Abraham argued with god. I dont think its in our nature, i think its partly in the religion. Half of jewish law tells you what you cant do, and the other half figures out ways you can get around it. Its like the irs code. [laughter] so i think its quite natural that there are a lot of jewish lawyers. I think this going to change. I notice now that some of the more. Com i cant lawyers now dominant lawyers represent racial minorities. Women are becoming. Com in a minute figures in the law, latinoamericans, asianamericans, to everything theres a season. I dont know whether the season of jewish influence in the law will continue as it has in the past. Why have you chosen to write this book now . 75 years old, 0 years of teaching 50 years of teaching, my 30th book. Its 500 pages, i could have written 5,000 pages. I only deal with maybe 5 of my cases. I wanted to write about the First Amendment and my views on National Security being balanced. It came at the perfect time because i really anticipate the nsa problems, balancing National Security with privacy, balancing censorship and National Security. I wanted to write about how science influences the law. Almost all of my criminal cases, ive had 36 cases dealerring with death, either Death Penalty cases, attempted homicide, all of those kind of cases. And in moat of them ive won most of them identify won them by science. To give you one quick example, many of you know the o. J. Simpson case, represented a woman named sandy murphy who allegedly killed her boyfriend, a much older, rich man. She allegedly had another younger boyfriend, allegedly killed her older boyfriend by biggerring him to death, that is by come pressing his chest so that his lungs couldnt expand and he couldnt breathe, and the proof was there was a button mark on his body that core responded to the button on his shirt.