As i said earlier, it was a different genre. Also, it was sort of easy because it was done. It wasnt like you had to go in and try to do a lot of guesswork. There were marks on every page. Ninetytwo, i think, in total. So i think there were 150 or so marks. So the editing process is really nothing more than following these instructions. So was discovered thats not quite the right word, but the more question is what have we forgot to ask about. So what you have here is the last word of what he wanted the manuscript is a. Just. Is a magazine article. Yes, thats right. Make you very much. This has been wonderful. I wanted to thank you so much for that. Hugh davis and john summers, it has been so wonderful. Thank you all very much. We will view in the lobby. [applause] booktv is on facebook. Like us and interact with guests and viewers and watch videos and uptodate information on booktv. Booktv sat down with Oscar Goodman to discuss his memoir, being oscar from mob lawyer to mayor of las vegas. He talked about cases that he handled during his career as a criminal defense attorney and he shared stories from his returns is the mayor of las vegas. This is about one hour. The book is being oscar. It is written by Oscar Goodman. Mayor Oscar Goodman, why did you come to las vegas . We came here in 1964. I went to a wonderful liberal arts college in philadelphia. I loved every day of college. I went to law school at the university of pennsylvania and it was the time of the Civil Rights Movement were was very active. The students that were there were interested in Corporate Law and the like. I had just gotten married. I felt bad that i wasnt supporting my wife. One day i decided to walk down to city hall to the das office and say, you have a job. And i was very lucky because they took me to the office of arlen specter. He was just coming off of a win of the conviction of a teamster. I think im the only person that did that. And a wealthy widow was killed. Two fellows took money and took it out to las vegas and they assigned me to going over there on a motion to suppress this. At the end of the meeting, they said, what are you doing here . And i said, where else is there. They said las vegas. I went home that night and i said to my wife how would you like to go to the land of milk and honey, and she said that we are not going to israel and i said no, las vegas. So that is how it all happened. We had great educations. Wherever joe went, there was a cloud over his head. I have been very lucky. What kind of logic you practice . Anything that paid me. If they wanted a divorce, whatever they wanted, i would take care of them and try to make them very happy and i was happy as well. Believe me, this is not water. Water is for washing. And i said, may i post you. Please go right ahead. It is 5 00 oclock somewhere, is that what youre saying . And yes, exactly he meant we will get to the fact that you had a martini delivered to you while we speak. I want to go back to this subtitle, which is being oscar from mob lawyer to mayor of las vegas. Now, how did you become known as a mob lawyer . There have been offers over the years that suggested that i was sent out by monsters on the east coast to represent mob interests. Because las vegas was referred to as an open city. In other words, they did not have a stronghold on any particular casino here. It was open for anybody to take a little piece of it. And i came out here and i wasnt even practicing criminal law. A fellow came to me for bankruptcy and i took care of him and we had met him as a car dealer. And we had not told him to concern himself with us. It was very romantic. And we did the bankruptcy thing. And i think i charge them 250 and he was happy and i was happy. A couple of weeks later a phone call comes in to the pit where he was dealing. The person said who is the best criminal lawyer in las vegas. Well, it was no different than that was now. They said who is the best criminal lawyer in las vegas. And that is the way it started because the fellow who made 80 phone call was a reputed boxer from the northeast who was involved in making lewd videos and his brother had a problem he hadnt seen his brother and i said, by such and such a place. Well, i was scared to death. Being the brave person that i am, i said, how would you like to take a ride with me. And we look at this exclusive neighborhood and im not from the neighborhood door and he said, you dont have three dimes and i said, okay. He said you better win the case. And i saw 3100dollar bills and ive never seen that much at one time in my life and i got very lucky because this is a case that i couldnt win if i traveled a thousand times. I tried it on st. Valentines day two years after i got my license in the federal courthouse. As a matter of fact, i think the jury, i believe, they felt so sorry for me but they brought up the not guilty. The brother was so happy that he had hired the best criminal lawyer of las vegas and he tried the case for him. From that point on, he would be talking to folks around the country. The mayor was one of his friends and i got a phone call one day about the first wiretap case on the bill, which was taking place in miami, florida. The Miami National airport had its phones surveilled with wiretaps and they were taking videos of it. The fellow that was providing this information to the bookmakers as a bartender here in las vegas. They had him here and i went down to miami and got lucky there again. Everybody else was found guilty and it had nothing at all to do the wiretap or anything. It just wasnt mentioned for the first two weeks of trial and from that point on, it was just every single mob case in the country. I had a least one client and then in december 12, 1970, i was on a case, a wiretap case in 26 different cities reputed mobsters. The bottom line is i was hired in 26 cities because of this reputation is developing. Once again, i got lucky and i was able to ascertain that. I had one case after another all piled up on the floor. And it was clear to me there was is something wrong with it. My client says although these signatures bore the name of the Deputy Attorney at general of the United States come they were in different handwriting. So i investigated it and i took John Mitchell who was part of the deposition and he said yes, we did something that was an appropriate here, but it shouldnt involve the dismissal. But again, the reputation kept on growing and the legend kept on growing. And i wouldnt say that, because i thought it was all luck. I did want to ask. When you use the word talking about your career, reputed mobsters. You use the word mob. Are you troubled by that word . Whitey always a reputed . Welcome i will never forget there was a judge in san diego who is presiding over a case that i was representing a reputed mobster. And he had a storied career in san diego and everyone was referring to him as a reputed mobster. The judge said after a while i thought that was his name. And i said, you have to understand, your honor, the reason why we use this as a is not a monster until he is convicted of being a monster. He is reputed because that that is the reputation of the Law Enforcement has given him. If somebody is convicted, for a mob related crime, then i think it is fair to call them a mobster i always took it as a badge of honor, given the sense that they could hire anyone in the world and they chose me. Does the government play by the rules . No, i hate to interrupt you, but that gets my dander up. I may not have actively practiced over the last 13 years and i was the mayor, but i was practicing particularly during the 70s and the 80s. The ends justify the means and they really didnt care that much. They just felt that my clients were so bad that they had committed these crimes that if they could get them its not supposed to work that way either. If they could get them, then i was their job. And they would do anything to get my clients. And i rarely put a client on the witness stand. Many of my clients were not smart and i thought i could do a better job for them to the jury. I really believe that. Allowing them to be questioned by a bright prosecutor. So the end of the story with these people who are prosecuting and the Law Enforcement agents had to be my target. Invariably i caught them in a lie. I caught them in a violation of the constitution of the United States and people said, oh, he won the case on a technicality. I dont think the Fourth Amendment is a technicality. It is probably the embodiment of one of the great laws of this country has. You can go into someones home and violate their personal liberties without having a warrant issued by an impartial judge. I want my cases. Based on the attack of the government were their credibility. My favorite story is one that people dont talk about. The one about mattie baker. A caricature of the way people have characterized africanamericans in a prior life. Basically he shuffled and mumbled, but he was a smart guy. A nice guy. But he was probably dealing in serious amounts of heroin and Law Enforcement. Word that he was going to be involved in a transaction, at all places, arkansas. They saw him drive up in his catalog. And they had arrested somebody coming in from san diego that was going to make the delivery of jokes to him. For Police Officers, all big fat guys, they were hoping to testify. And i brought up the exclusionary rule that says if youre not testifying you have to leave the room so they cannot hear what the other person is testifying to. First person gets on the stand and he said that he will tell the truth and takes the oath. He said, well, we saw this guy sitting on the curb and i went up to him and said, sir, right off the bat, nobody had ever called him stir in his entire life. So i knew this was the beginning of some kind of concoction and he said sir, would you mind if you got out of your car. And he said certainly, no problem. Welcome i know that he would listen to the Police Officer and then he said, would you be kind enough to hand us the key out of your ignition. And i said i knew that would never happen. And then we said, please open up the trunk for us. And no one in the liber says please. And they found a bag and then they said, sir, could you open up the back and they said no, he opened it up and we found 262,000. Well, he starts getting a little bit hot and says, you know, mr. Bittman, they are lying. And i said, i will have three more white cops that will come here and testify about the same answer. So let me take your venue disappear quietly. So the next hop comes and he takes the oath to tell the truth. The same testimony hand in glove, he says, they are lying. Next cop comes in and he has the same testimony. He opened it up and he was polite he said that they were lying. And they said, you know, they think you are a big deal or of drugs. Nobody will believe you over for white cops. And he said that they are lying. The last one that i had the affair, thank goodness, he says he will swear to tell the truth, and truth. And i said, well be talking about . And they said, you saw it in there and he said yes, im sure that they saw. And i said, you have to be kidding. I said to the judge, your honor, can i have a day where i can find some very important evidence to produce for you. And i said i will give you half a day, thats what he told me you can come back tomorrow morning. He didnt think i would be able to do anything. But the public doesnt generally like drug dealers. But i dont think they like lying cops even more. So i went back to my office and i knew when the flight was coming in and i was able to ascertain the airline and i had one of the fellows call and they found the name of the pilot to the airplane and i said, sir, i am Oscar Goodman and i represent a fellow who was arrested at the airport in arkansas. He says, well, maam, that was like miami vice. And i said, what do you mean . And they said that they pulled us out of the car and pushed his face into the curb and they put cuffs behind his back and a gun to his head and they went to the trunk and they were kicking him. And i said, we testify to that. He said yes. I said come on down here and i will make sure that you have a nice room and if you want to bring a friend, i will make sure that everything will be taken care of her year. You dispute my office tomorrow morning at 7 00 oclock and he came down and we put him on the stand. You know what the stupid prosecutor said . He said there is goodman supporting perjury again. The judge looked at him with such disdain and 10 disdain and said there is absolutely a constitutional violation and he said thank you. Heartbreaking whole thing was how he told the way it is. The lying cops from the prosecutor because no one remembers them exactly like the last person. And they will be able to do it to some other guy that doesnt have a good lawyer like i did. Youre watching booktv on cspan2. We are talking about mob lawyer to mayor of las vegas, only in america is the name of the book. Who are Lefty Rosenthal and tony scott but . Well,. By the way, why were you in the movie . Think i was one of the consultant. Martin scorsese said who should play the lawyer. And he was the one for trade by mr. Dinero and he said, let mr. Dinero do it. Nevertheless, they hired him to play myself and it was great. Every time they watched, this was is a wonderful thing. It had supplemented income unbelievably over the years. So who were they . They didnt call him lucky to his face. He was the front man, basically, from the mob at the corporation that owned about five Different Hotels here in las vegas. Very bright guy, very demanding. Before he came along, it was a little hole in the wall like you would imagine. A movie in the making. He has these ideas a grand jury and he is a very astute person. Tony was a childhood associate of his and according to Law Enforcement, tony was set out by the chicago mob to look over their interest here in las vegas. And according to 26 people, murdered them. I was always chastise by local police would say, how can you sleep at night. And i say, how come you are so dumb they havent been able to spend one day in jail if you killed 26 people. I never got a satisfactory answer along those lines. But tony did that here and unfortunately he was killed and buried in a cornfield in louisiana. He never spent one day in jail except for one time when we were representing the bosses in kansas city. Tony was arrested for murder and he didnt want the other attorney to represent him. Mr. Bittman, is there such a thing as a mafia . There was a time that i would have sworn that there wasnt. I had had the head of the fbi, that there wasnt. They said it was the greatest lie ever told. Ally of a century that there is no mafia. Were at really found out about what i was doing ,com,com ma because i was representing families, i have no idea of this until i began to listen to the wiretaps and read the search warrants and see the movie casino to find out had i really knew what i was doing and representing, i would charge a lot more. After a while it came about this way and i was representing vinny the animal. You never called any animal to his face that was clear. I get a phone call one day and he says, you are through, oscar, and i said, what does that mean . And he had the you will never be able to say that there is no nokia. They met in the room and the palau tonight and then they write the card and they say if your brother is an informant, you will kill your brother and your mother is on her sick bed, you will leave your mother. I would laugh at that because i thought it was ludicrous. Welcome i got a phone call from the prosecutor and he said that we have reported surreptitiously a mafia induction ceremony where your client is on the tape. Welcome i wasnt going to say he didnt record. I have had to hear it. What i heard was that they put a gun on the table and the whole works. And i said this is really remarkable that we used to make fun of, apparently it had some validity to it. So this is the case but he said the fbi agent to prison for 10 years up in boston and that is a whole different story. I get the feeling that if the case is ever going to be resolved, i could wrap it up if i were able to resolve it before the problem began. The agents were lying on on the stand. But i could not prove it at the time as far as taking testimony from informants and the like. I sat down with me and his associate who is a very patrician looking fellow. Jr look like a roman centurion and had a regal manner about him. I believe boston college, whose accounting major and i said, you know, fellas, i can win this case. I can beat the murders and i could be the extortion and i could be a kidnapping and all of those. But i said what i have a problem is on the tape of the induction ceremony. And i said i dont have a problem with the picking of the fingers and people are used to that. And i dont have a problem with if your brother is a rat you are going to kill him. But i do have a problem with saying you are going to leave your mother on her deathbed. So he turns to jr and this next time we will leave that line out. Mayor goodman. What was vegas like when you first moved here and what was it like, pardon me if im saying is wrong, but where the mobs in control of the city and do they still have a presence today . There is no mafia presence basically from the time that Howard Hughes and then being subjected by gated control supervision and age has done its part as well. As well as fbi surveillance and wiretaps. There is no mafia in the traditional sense. They have no bearing whatsoever. When i got here in 1964, my wife and i were driving to the east coast and we came to the top of the hill to overlook the entire valley and there were a couple of sprinkling like and because of that i dont believe there is a building taller than two stories high there. A tumbleweed came rolling through. I had not seen one outside of a cowboy movie. And she said, where have you bought these. And i said it was a different kind of town. It was a friendly town. 75,000 people, now we have millions. We had a social life that revolved around this. You saw the alleged mobsters and you saw the politician and sometimes they may have been saying. He saw the lawyers and the doctors and the rabbis and the priest and it was a very close community. It was different doing business in those days. Maybe it is the same everyplace else for a handshake was all you had. Were the only thing it would do is cause a lawsuit. And you gave a person who her word. It was smaller a