My name is jerry streets. I work at a church in you have in new haven. I was also a chaplain of Yale University for 15 years and have been a member of Divinity School since 1987. For 63lived in basia years. Was from a prominent africanamerican family in and part of my family was polish catholic. Members i have of that kind of experience is how home at basia, but in the neighborhood, it was considered just black. We think about our local experiences and our history of race. For me, i think one of the greatest challenges for us, to have a different kind of language and critique for the world of culture and racism, not culture and race. Draw station i tried to from that, all the good things, one of the ways culture functions is that it can be a conduit for ideology, four perspectives. And racism for me is the ways by which we take any aspect of any Ethnic Community and privilege it or disqualify it over others. So it is not just a matter of looks. It is a language, it is the distinctions we make of language, gender, sexua orientation. Ideology, that also relates privileges and sometimes is used to [indiscernible] people who use those characteristics. I am aware in some situations, what i walk into a room, my gender and as per serves my gender and race as perceived by those people and when there and how theyion are going to fit together what they [indiscernible] in an actual presentation. And sometimes as a pastor and a worker, bothal eras of professional practice i am engaged in, i see so many signs of hope as you indicated, in interesting dating. If you take [indiscernible] from families were multiethnic, to where the world [indiscernible] and to some extent that is true. But i think we have to allow for the fact that it is not either or, but both and. That is, you have this multiplicity of blending community, but at the same time you can have [indiscernible] or taketill privileges a certain aspects of people and use that as a means of discrimination. Let me say, just recently there has been in the call for education, an article about the makeup of leadership of all the ivy league schools, i was actually disappointed and concerned about a comment made attempted to a senior administrator who indicated and im paraphrasing that for minority people, african rican people, opportunity does the person dominate accommodate the dominant culture to make people feel comfortable . Thenought was, if they do, what does that mean, and what happens when you do make everyone feel comfortable, but the ones that youre making feel comfortable are still looking at you through the lens of those folk and how does that get negotiated and in spite of how comfortable you can make people feel, there still is because you are not invited, you assume conversations because and the the ambiguity, same people youre making feel comfortable still identify your language, looks, gender, out of their prism of his and of history. Lastts pick up on that point. Everybody on the stageto be a white man. [indiscernible] [laughter] we all know how to make other people comfortable. Yeah. The question i want to put to future, how much additional room will there be for us to have allamerica edges, all of our expressions, ity understood without feeling [indiscernible] . We can always hope. I want us to go back first to this issue of interracial is him becauserracialism, there is increasing visibility of interracialism and intermarriage, but we all know it is nothing new. As jerry pointed out already. And i cannot help but wonder if some of the sort of celebration of interracialism at the celebrity level might also function sometimes to obscure racialized systems of oppression that we call racism, and i do not want to go any further in the conversation here. I want to mention because it is a book that has had immense impact in my crow,g, the new jim because we had this as a common read this past year. And she talks about how a maskslind society in fact a new jim crow, which she diagnoses as the system of mass incarceration and the drug war color,eps communities of particularly africanamerican men, but not exclusively the same could be said for hispanic man and immigrants and illegal immigration is being tackled through mass incarceration, and native americans are also disproportionately incarcerated of theat every level criminal justice system, we know there is racial discrimination, and that goes on under the rhetoric of a Colorblind Society that then makes us believe that it is not because of race that so many people of color are kept in a kind of permanent underclass, both in prison and through the felony laws that keep them away from full participation in the society after their release. So i think it is important in any conversation about race i find to make that point, kind of like a reality check, if we are talking about increasing it is not again, and just a happy picture. Lets not allow that conversation to obscure what in fact is still structured in our society. There is huge Racial Disparity that we need to tackle. I think there are signs of hope in the increasing awareness of the issue that we see in, for example, at the Divinity School reading this book, and there is immense attention to this book around the country, in various churches and faith communities. But i do not see that going away. I do not see racism and White Privilege disappearing as a result of butou make a double point, the cause you also suggested because you also suggested the reason for continued disparities is incarceration, and that is structurally similar to what was being said earlier, that even if judgments about race are based on color, yes, but you are removed from it, some other factor that is tied to race or his survey was very much connected. The point i am getting, even as race itself on the face of things becomes less visible, or just way more complex, thanks to Kim Kardashian [laughter] it does not mean that and life prospects and possibilities are thrown away. [indiscernible] betweeno distinguish culture and racism, but i want to make the same point between the internal experience of identity and what is described by the society. Both of you spent a youof time or i suspect having read your essays, and i know you have experiences with theines a plug experience of trying to sort out your own identity in the world, but finding it differently how you see your own life, and it is becoming more difficult for people over the next 40 years, where there own internal sense of who they are in racial, whatever else terms does not necessarily map onto what they being told about themselves. I will combine that with the question you asked radius. Previous, where we are always negotiating, learning how to be white guys. Absolutely. Sometimes i identify as it indianamerican hindu, raised in the south. I am a proud southerner. Very proud to be from atlanta. I am hindu, also. Fine when i amis teaching and i want to wear my the long outfits, the topic comes down to here, but to a formal function or something among even a formal function on andus, i will wear a sari, that is good because it makes the university looks good. I will be out there. That is one thing. Then to beer thing able to actually have access to the president and the board of advisors, which is the various Vice President s, and do they really want to hear what i have to say there, right . So there is acceptance of diversity, but in certain locations. Who defined those locations depends on who has the power to him and that is very real for me. Simply because i cant get indian food wherever i because i can get indian food whenever i want, and i can dress however i want, and it is seen as cool and fashionable does not need that i still have not fighting my way to have my voice heard in ways that really impact , for example, my students or the Larger Population in general. And it takes so much energy, for those of you who have to do it, we have torategy, strategize as to how we are going to play it. That is neverending. I do not know how to do that everyday there were a lot of double negatives there. [laughter] absolutely. I was teaching my first second animation Asian American studies class and at and ad of that class, second of expected an ax and out of view, does not a southern one. [laughter] i share the same experience in this sense that i have a very ethnic name. In neworn and raised england, and i always have teachers or faculty members, even at work, folks will assume that i do not speak english, or they will assume that i just came from such and such country. It was very hard for me growing up with an ethnic name. It has been hard for me with the things that im doing. This year, after share the invocation during commencement. Of trusty members looking at me like, what is she doing here . And when i was introduced as the chaplain it was like, of oh, youre the chaplain . What is that supposed to mean . You look younger. I thought you were one of the students. Well, thank you very much. That idea has not been the first. Walking into classrooms, i could remember my friend and i at the divinities school, we were at the graduate School Campus and we would say, this building was so beautiful, but it was not created for people like us. There were white men at one point sitting here, and now you have folks of color looking around and you look at the ictures and it is like, whoa, dont see anyone who looks like me. What does that mean . It has definitely been an experience to be the first, or even to walk and carry the torch of someone who passed it to me. I remember my experiences as a law professor and looking some on the wall, and i saw men and women of different shades, but every picture looked exactly like every other picture. There was a stronghold, and a few were willing to fit into that picture, you could be there. And increasingly, that is the kind of bind that we find ourselves in. Everyone on this panel has something to do with religion. [indiscernible] [laughter] about religion and race. Religion has played a significant role in maintaining, or justifying racial and other hierarchies. That often the case religions can play a role in prodding societies to dismantle racial and other hierarchies. I want to give you guys to think about the future. Looking forward, what do you think would be the role of the future . Within the larger christian world, the more difficult questions and what it means to live out a Christian Life has a deep ethical and spiritual implications. It is hard to have a conversation about because we tend to talk a lot about ideological, an political, values conflict, which is important also. But the deeper question about our common humanity and how we are called into community with one another and how that sense of community can undergird and make sure our core values as a Democratic Society become a for religion. In the late 1700s, a very insightful slave was converted to christianity. He made the assumption based on his conversion that he was now equal to his master. And he said so, and the master said, no, i dont think so. And they called a conference to discuss this question. Converts to christianity, is he or she now . Qual to his master and the conclusion was, yes, but only in heaven. [laughter] of the slavetatus remains slave. Not free, but slave. The spiritual status was equal, but that was something he the only experience in heaven. Religion then, wheels ofe of those ideology that continues to oppress people. Religion, like any ideology, can be used for good or for evil. [indiscernible] i want to share a couple of things that he said. Ne, hes been careful about it of thes an understanding self and why we are here on planet earth, can that be mined . O break down saidso said is often that in these two situations , im aure describing christian now and im free, i guess, in heaven. There is the separation of church in state. The state was still free to shackle him. I actually wrote about this in my essay in reflections magazine if anyone wants to follow on that topic. This 17th century moment, or 18thcentury moment , canyoure talking about slaves convert to christianity and then become equal, it was not only a moment of christianity facilitating oppression, but also a moment in which racial and religious identities are clearly separated. Prior to the time, there had been an assumption, and continue to be in some ways that it was he dance that could be enslaved could leak hat could be enslaved. Race andories of religion were not clear the distinguished in that. Biden is kind of moment, now theres a separation between, ok, a slate can be christian, but that does not change their status as black, and therefore inflatable. Enslavable. And want to get back to the question that you asked. I do not always do that. Will religion play . This may be a cop out answer, and i will elaborate a little bit, but i think that inevitably our religious communities will continue to be both. Continuing to support the status quo of racism in many ways, but at the same time, we will also at times and in certain ways, prophetic voices for change. There are signs for hobe on the latter end hope on the latter end. There is new attention in many communities on the question of effort totice and an make Christian Churches as speaking specifically with the lakers in context as well, more multiracial. And i am speaking specifically within a christian context as well, more multiracial. We have been some of the most segregated races in general in america. Changed. Has not but there is an increasing awareness of that as a problem and a challenge. And the reason it is a problem you know, segregated, safe communities have sometimes been a positive resource for racial minorities. Within the context of a racist society, sometimes segregated, save communities have been a kind of necessary and good as a means to gain support and spiritual sustenance. While these communities save cultural experiences, it is predominantly churches, be they , that reinforces a justification that an affront to them is an affront to the gods that all of them serve. And no one should be satisfied of america indiscernible] thank you. But rethinking what everyone has to do, it is not just rethinking what we think about blacks, but also about whites. As hard as this work is, it has the potential for [indiscernible] there is a sociologist at who named michael emerson, has done a good deal of work on multiracial churches, or the challenge of how the churches can become more multiracial. That he also has an essay in the reflections magazine. If the United States is to successfully tackle the problems of racism, it has to be done at the level of churches. And he is talking specifically about churches, but we could clearly broaden that out to other faiths faith based groups more broadly. Segregated communities within based communities play a role in setting up boundaries. With the in group and the how group and what connection is that you have and how you can benefit in terms of getting a job and all of the other you know. He says it is an ethical obligation and the only way that the United States can tackle Racial Justice is to get at it through religious communities. For about one minute and 26 seconds. I will stop. For a long time, their work on race and religion continues to be done in a christian context. Were looking a blackandwhite in a crushing context. Dohink about what we need to is toce and religion 2. 0, consider the christian context, but then again, this situation. Withn hispanic protestant an indian background, with an arab muslim, all of these things are like juggling balls. At one sense, looking at black and white in the christian context, you have a control, if you will. It is much more difficult when we are considering all of these balls up in the air. Its christianaid norm activity. Because christianity affects all of the religions in terms of what they are when they come here. Im talking about some 300 years ago and im talking about someone who landed at Newark Airport yesterday. If you come with me to travel on a monday night, you will see my mom and dad put themselves before the deities and prostrate themselves. But that can be seen as kind of crazy or really overzealous. Because the normal way of praying is to sit in a pew with your hands folded. Depending on your tradition. The way i envision it is a dna double helix. I think that is a common feature that we will have to look at while still juggling these balls. Religion and its connection with race in the future, what can you . In aam hindu and i grew up hindu community. One of the things that will continue to affect hindu communities and other immigrant religious communities is migration. In immigrant live communities live transnational lives. In my case, theres more than one place a call home. I call atlanta, ga. Home, and i call india home. Im still working on calling new jersey home. But i will get there. [laughter] how does travel back and forth, family members travel back and in myimpact how hinduism case, i went to india every summer. Did,hankful that they because im flynt in the language and everything. But only three months a year with what i see how hinduism is lived in india, which is very different from the United States. There, its on thursday and everyone has thursday off. Class andcancelling tried to explain my students why they have thursday off. Hostility could grow. Me, it is this constant negotiation. But i think transnational as some is going to continue to affect how religious communities form in the United States. The immigration peace toce has the potential continue affecting the american scene. Since the 1970s, we have had the Hindu Temples at all across the netted states. Done in the end the indian architectural style. All of this blood, sweat, tears was put in by these immigrants who came over pos 1965. Generation, second theyre not going. Them as thelating concert migration. Is goingo see how that to last and what kind of impact there will be. Theyre not necessarily going to houses of worship. Theyre trying to figure out how hinduism relates to their lives. They want it, but they are struggling. And that is probably different panel. A few years ago i had the privilege of sitting down with a and they be married, waited for a whole year. The reason for that intensity was the groom was first generation pakistani and muslim and the bride was a first generation corrine in christian. Corian and christian. There were educating their families and parents about why they made the choice of the make that th