on real america, a 1936 film on tuberculosis. find our tv schedule at c-span.org. let us know what you think of the programs you are watching. or send us al us, tweet. join the c-span conversation, like us on facebook, follow us on twitter. forum for the senate in south carolina. >> this is the only joint appearance he between senator lindsey graham and democrat brad hutto. this is just under an hour. >> thank you. good afternoon. my name is chris william. i'm honored to be on this dais with these two distinguished gentleman. thank you to the south carolina chamber for inviting me down here. where are you? thank you for hosting us. [applause] thank you to the words of wisdom about whispering in the back. that will happen. i'm going to introduce these two gentlemen who do not need an introduction. they have been exceptional public servants. -- it happened so much in election season. it is important to remember this. it is a little bit long. teddy roosevelt said it is not the critic who counts, not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles or where they could have done better. the credit belongs to the man in the arena's face is marked by valiantly, knows a great enthusiasm, the great devotions, spends himself in a worthy cause, knows that the triumph of high's achievement and who at times fails, but at least he fails while daring greatly so -- place is never i think that says that about those who put themselves out to run for public office whether it is at the highest level in this land or whether it is in the -- havinglic servant said that, i would like to introduce our guests. in man who does not need to be introduced, a favorite son of south carolina, both our favorite sons of south carolina. he also spent some time in the congressional delegation from south airline in the third district. he is now the senior senator from south carolina. his aim sits on committees like appropriations, armed services, the judiciary. please welcome the honorable lindsey graham. [applause] southr favorite son of airline, an eagle scout, i guess i will not be able to needle you. he also sits on a committee here . he is a member of the joint citizen and legislative committee on children. it is important to know that his district come his senate district is the only district that has six county seats. please welcome the honorable senator brad hutto. [applause] how is this going to work? we need you to silence your cell phones. thank you for streaming this rod and c-span will the broadcasting this later on. the important distinction is to make sure to remain seated if at all possible. there will be live streaming and cameras to minimize your movement to -- throughout the room. three minutes. we have a timer. we will show you these red and yellow warning as stop and go. you have three minute opening statements. what is the priority for you, senator? >> i want to thank the chamber for this post. this is a chance to talk an indirect in a way that i think will be conducive to a good discussion. if elected, i would like to take care of the home permit to make sure the port of charlotte that's that completion. engineersof recommended -- to all of those in the statehouse, you all made a very good decision of putting the $300 billion a matching funds aside telling the federal government that we are ready to deepen the port and that tells me a lot. had he get the money? -- how do you get the money for the port? come up with a comprehensive effort to modernize the ports us is it deteriorating in terms of getting cargo up and down the river. coast, come up with a may -- way to modernize reports. the highway trust fund is going broke. take some of the onerous regulations and see if we can -- do something on obamacare. set aside sequestration. the cut to have in place for the rec -- rest of this decade only to the smallest army since 1940, missiles the smallest air force of modern times. that is in thing. it will reduce anything for about 30%. i think we all know maybe that is the place we should up our game. to do that, you need to get them in a room to find alternative cuts. and when to do revenue by closing loopholes for the few at the expense of the many to tie down sequestration's. that is where the real money is at. to go back, i will tied to find common ground where possible, being a strong voice for conservatism in a practical way, above all else, make sure the men and women who defend the nation have what they need to keep the rest of us say. >> priorities? chamber and to the to you and everyone who made this possible. i'm bad hutto. -- brad hutoo. -- hutto. i grew up on a farm and learn the values of family and hard work. it is those values i want to take to washington. i respect him. i like him. he is a good man. we have disagreements about some things. that is why i'm giving you a choice. being the junior secretary of state -- that is what the focus has been. wanting tong about put boots on the ground everywhere. if you want a senator who will education, jobs -- the focus needs to be on improving south carolina. .ducation is a priority when we have a majority of our children graduating who cannot qualify for the military, education is a natural -- national priority. those of the things i would like to focus on with my time in washington. senator graham has repeatedly been on television about one to do infrastructure in places like afghanistan. i think it is time we invested in south airline a. it is time we invested in our future. people worked and prospered. jobs are out there. that is something i want to focus my time on. improve the quality of life in south carolina. poll has said the biggest issues to voters is juncker a sure and [indiscernible] -- job creation and [indiscernible] how do you answer this question about building jobs? what about the cultural issue and in acute argument we here? reach across the aisle. my number one job is the united states senator to defend the nation. i hope you have that priority. if you don't, we will all regret it. it was planned by 20 people they spent less than a million dollars. look at the damage they have done to the country. yes, i'm very much worried about what happens over there. not one soldier, not one penny of aid that did not work out well for us. i will never repeat that mistake again of ignoring the dangers. the dangers are real. you got to make solving problems better than just saying no. let's start with the highway trust fund. hybridy of you drive a car? not many. 10 years from now, a lot of people will raise their hands. how far can you travel on a gallon of gas? the trust fund is running out of money. we are $9 billion short this year. you have got the same trouble in south carolina. how would i start to break gridlock? i would get republicans and democrats in the room and say -- i'm working with barbara boxer for a one-time good deal at 10% and apply the revenue to the highway trust fund to be clinched it in the short time. immigration, highway trust fund, working on the margins of obamacare, so many opportunities that would help jobs. >> same question. jobs and gridlock. >> i agree jobs is the biggest issue. work.l pay for equal i think in colombia i have been seen as a pragmatic problem solver. i do not believe compromise is a bad word. i look back on the day's when they worked well and took votes. it wasn't just having to people's voices heard. we are all entitled to be heard. i think the process in washington is broken. i think it will take a new and different kind of senator with new ideas, but washington is broken. senator graham has been there 20 years. we all liked what he has done. it is the tea party radicals we have problems. and you to offer a clear alternative to him. i look for to going to washington. the talk of the issue of foreign policy. ebola -- it seems like ebola has taken the crisis in a different turn. is the dialogue going around ebola represent the management or a broader national security dialogue? >> i think ebola and radical islam is dangerous and we want to keep it over there. the best way to engage ebola is to deal with it in western africa. i have been there. the chinese are all over africa. they have a bond of view of america's president. we saved a whole generation of african children. ebola has to be contained. support our military. , ishe end of the day somebody comes back having been exposed to ebola, i want to make sure that they are safe to mingle with the population. of a bowl and islam is similar -- deal with it at the source. ebola and islam is similar -- deal with it at the source. >> one of the many talents we have appear, here we go -- same question. representbola crisis ac/dc and health challenge to the united states? is it a national security issue or a broader dialogue? >> it is a world health issue. that it affects the united states, i think we will see that will be very minimal. more people die in car accidents in the u.s. then they die of ebola. but does it mean nato have a right to be scared of it. it is a scary thing is that we need to keep it over there. africa. to to ebola in this country, i think there is a lot of scary things that are going on that people do not understand. we have health care professionals who know how to deal at that. i think they will properly contain it. if we're going to eradicate it, it is something we have to try to do. graham, when we talk about national debt, it goes to gridlock and partisanism. is it still a looming crisis? has that same does from feeling the pain of national debt? -- if they weren't able to reach across the island get something done, how can any single senator from any single state do that effectively? >> they did do something job. congress just didn't adopt it. what drives the debt? anybody born after '64? we want our money. [laughter] work hard. what did simpson bowles do? we all know that 80 million baby boomers are coming in another entitlement programs. there were 60 workers. in 20 years, there's going to be two. on the state requires us to tell young people these trust funds are going to go broke unless we adjust the eligibility by a couple of years. 80 million baby boomers are going to retire. unless you have [inaudible] any volunteers? we better have a rational immigration system. the national debt is driven by entitlement spending. medicare and social security combined would take up all of the revenue collected. requiresowles generating revenue not by raising tax rates and closing loopholes -- i would do that if i could find a democrat who make the structural changes in entitlement. if you make over $250,000 a year, the government gives you $109 to subsidize. -- adjustment generate revenue to pay down the debt. i think that day is coming in washington. the people you know in politics, who is more likely to be in that room doing this bill? same question. how do you fix national debt? how do you do in the highly charged partisan environment? >> strive to have a balanced budget. a balanced ajit every year. -- budget every year. we need to focus on what our priorities are on spending. i do not think anyone likes paying taxes. we have faced crises before. we dealt with it. we will have to deal with them again. -- we made as commitment to our senior citizens. you'll be entitled to social security at a certain age. that is a commitment we have got to keep. i do not leave social security should be privatized. change entitlements or a combination of other things. that is something people with good will have to sit together and hammer out. i'm convinced we have done it before and we can do it again. i would like to be part of that conversation. >> i want to drill down deeper of interparty relations. you have taken some arrows on this. i would like people to talk a little bit more. how do you reach across the aisle and not worry about -- how do you get effective policy done when everyone is so polarized? is there a secret to it? >> there are bills to be made. if you don't understand what is driving the debt, don't go to washington. what is driving the debt long-term is entitlements. a system where we made promises we cannot keep. you'll pay more in and take less out. some has to go to the young people and work a couple of years longer. eliminate the deduction and not just cutting taxes with it, but pay down the debt. are am a kratz that would tell you if you asked them, you have got to extend the life of the trust fund by asking people to work a couple of years longer. you just and i have enough money -- you just do not have enough money to honor -- they are telling the party something they do not want to hear. we will say social security and medicare and not adjust the age or requirement. if you're looking for a republican, you have to violate some of your ideological principles. sign me up. after this election, there will be a desire by american in general and give them the political cover. it.ll never forget how did they do immigration? democrats, the chamber the room and they found a way to come up with a program to solve the problem on the border. when i talk about these things, it is not just talk. i have been in the room were hardheaded people were able to produce a company answer bill from the left and the right. partners.ble you hold hands and you do it. hutto.ow it is [laughter] on the time.lax if you feel a queue could go over a few seconds, you have got that latitude. the key to bipartisanship is real in the blank. what is the key to bipartisanship? how do you get things done? >> out don't disagree with getting people with goodwill. have them sit down and stay there until they work it out is how you resolve these issues. going on having press conferences, that is not how you resolve. you got to bring the people together who are willing to give up something. that is the nature of compromise . the process that he described, i don't want to disagree with it. the problem is some of these problems till exist. he is talking like he wants to do it. he has done it on some occasions . i think it is time for a change. the voices that are there now cannot come to an it agreement. >> i think it is important to ask for a hollow up. a feeling that voters are getting your tipping point when it comes to interrelations in d.c. are at the statehouse? are they getting to a point where there will be led in the streets? occupy washington, occupy columbia. >> i would hope that voters would get that engaged. part of the problem is we have some voter apathy. voterd like it if every had a working knowledge of what the issues were so when we talk about them and engage them, they will know exactly what we're talking about. engage the to voters. ofthe point to think violence? i do not inc. so. i do think it is important that we have inspired groups of to espouseoth sides their positions, but in the end, they cannot have them my way are highly approach. they could talk about what they perceive -- every time i go into a room, i have a preconceived if in of what i would do were the only vote in the room, but i'm not the only vote in the room. there's another guy or whoever in the room. we have got to come together. that is something that i think will take working together across the aisle and being independent and nothing controlled by your party or anyone else for that matter. come up with the best you can come up with. >> disability -- is civility -- >> if you reach across the aisle, there's some group out there that doesn't want you to do this or that. just fill in the blanks. i have learned to trust the public. i will give you an optimistic view of things in south carolina. democratic judges that i thought were qualified, but i would not have chosen them myself. how do the conservatives get there judges if liberals do not have the ability to -- iowa's that the worst i could do is go to washington and destroyed the judiciary by over politicizing it. i voted to increase the debt ceiling because i didn't want to default. the easiest path was just to say no. i worked on immigration with bush and obama because i know if we do not get immigration fixed in a rational way, it will hurt our economy. we need workers in the future. it is a cultural problem. away.ren't going let me tell about that republican primary voter in south carolina. they rewarded a guy who went down a road or the path of least resistance. i think the general voter election is going to pick up where they left off. they should be encouraged by the state, all ofur my sins of working with the other side when it made sense, doing what i thought was best turned out to be an asset and not a liability. >> senator, i will read from a notes to be accurate on this. congress doesn't reauthorize this funding come especially since some of the work the state roughly half a million or 800 million dollar bond issues to do something about the roads in south airline, if it doesn't happen, what will you do in addition to the rings -- south carolina, if it doesn't happen, what will you do in addition? >> we need to look at the trust fund a new post up look at sources outside of gasoline taxes. off the grid, maybe we need to talk about replenishing the trust fund. the money that i think we can capture in the short term is a deal between republicans and democrats and barbara boxer is the real deal it comes to democrats, but i like barbara. we haven't talked that a one-time good deal to bring money held overseas that have trying to come back into the country at 35%. they will not bring it. that is bad business. dedicate the entire revenue stream to the highway trust fund . start. a there is a bill looking at the trust fund a new of raising the federal gasoline tax i cutting taxes in other places to generate more revenue. -- by cutting taxes and other faces to generate more revenue. create jobs because we all win in all drive on roads and bridges. our infrastructure is falling apart. it is one of my top priorities. >> we need to invest in our infrastructure. it is something that needs to be reauthorized. we need to take step to make sure it is fully funded. they are working on it. we have got a lot of roads and bridges in the state that haven't been worked on in years and years. there is a great opportunity. we need to provide jobs. istime you look at work that going on, there are men and women behind the staircase doing work. there are companies that are making money will stop it is time for the company to invest in ourselves -- there are companies that are making money. us to invest in ourselves. it is time we invest in this country and yes, we need to fix the trust fund. they could take more money to invest in ourselves. now is the time to do it and put people to work. >> thank you. workforce development, you hear it over and over again. that is the kids, the folks, the young people, the old people, not completely married up with the skills and technology. -- how do we fix the skills gap? >> you do not do it overnight. you have to invest in the public school system. at -- to lookok at 0-3. age.t in them at an early we have a skills gap now is of the infrastructure that is back up the pipeline. you cannot just turn them around and expect by the time they graduate that all the sudden they want have -- you have to start with the youngest. they really are the future. you have got to invest in them. ,ake sure the qualified vibrant, intellectual teacher in the classroom. one who cares about those kids. we have got to make sure that technological resources -- it is one thing to put a computer on a child's desk or in ipad. but if they cannot access the internet when they get home -- we have to look at the technology it would take to make sure our children have the technological needs. we do have the benefit of having in the college system state. we need to make sure they are fully funded. >> fixing education or the skills gap. >> we are doing a good job there. i think tim scott has been terrific. trying to great a sense of herpes, the duplication is just incredible. at the end of the day when a school fails your kid, do something about it. let's not talk up throwing money at it. parents are lining up around the allowed --e thery're private education. first person my family to go to challenge. do not allow the teachers unions .o basically stop progress the kids are the biggest losers. shake things up. come up with an alternative. one thing you can do for a kid is to give them a job while they are in high school during the summer so they will have a resume of working and when they get ready to get out of the world, they could say, i worked this summer tagging groceries or whatever. groceries or whatever. is the worst it today in job creation. it is not the minimum wage going from $7.45 to $10.10. it is everything else business has to contend with. obamacare is coming into effect .verywhere our power comes from coal. it -- betweenake the epa, obamacare, and that you make it almost impossible to hire a young person in south carolina. take on the education of bureaucracy. i cannot let that go. i have to ask about a comic here -- obamacare. >> in a job killing bill. it is about taking over health care. the goal is to make it so costly that you drop coverage on your employees and they go into this data exchanges. 90% of the people signing up for obamacare are entitled to federal government subsidies. all you got to do is fill out a piece of paper. we really do need income verification. i would take that part out that makes sense. you cannot he denied coverage because of pre-existing illnesses. i would start over again. if you are hiring someone at 40 hours a day and they are covered under obama care and you reduce it, you are going to do it. you're hurting the people you are trying to help the most. thousands will become part-time employees because of obamacare not because of the economy. thousands will lose health care because the company had to drop health care to go into an exchange where you get by the government gives you when they decide to do it. this is a nightmare. it is not going to work. it helps grow the government, but destroys ability to create jobs. it has been about a single payer plan. i will go back and fight the heck out of it. >> year the passion and senator graham's voice. o, he said if he could go back and change obama care -- you cannot go back and change obamacare. to be thinking about doing differently about obama care that seems to be here now? >> you cannot live in the greatest country in the world and have a system set up where you get sick and go broke. that is what we have. childrenan be good get on our policy until you are 26, i am for it. if you maybe won't have lifetime , i'm for it. if you cannot be denied coverage by pre-existing conditions, i'm for it. maybe you should talk to governor haley about it. during these last years since we had obamacare, number of jobs in the state has gone up tremendously. i don't see being a job killer. perfect, neither is any major piece of legislation we have ever had in this country and perfect first time it was passed. he wants to go in to fight in i want to fix it. that is what needs to happen. we cannot go back to a time when we didn't have safeguards in the system that protected people who didn't have insurance. under the affordable care act, but was opposed to happen is we were supposed to have 300,000 people in south airline on medicaid. we do not have that. we have got to fix that. we have got hospitals that have .losed and are closing some of them are on the brink. we cannot have small communities lose their hospitals. therefore safety we cannot have them close. that is what will happen if we do not fix obamacare and the affordable care act. get them insured. it is not going to be a job killer. it will be a job creator if done properly. >> senator graham, is it fixable? >> absolutely not. about 20ived it different times because of the election. guess what is going to happen to your company if you are a covered entity? you have to be covered by the employee mandate. i'm telling you this is a trained make -- train wreck in the making. you have to look and play in the i and say, i am sorry. we cannot afford this. to the to money going exchange. is that really what we are trying to do here? 80% of americans before obamacare felt good about the insurance coverage. not feel good about it after obamacare. at the end of the day, i hope republicans are smart enough to make sure that we challenge democrats. would you vote for a 40 hour work week to be 40 hours and not 29? to make sure someone works at your company at 40 hours without making them a full-time employee under obama care. what good is it to reduce that her since work hours for insurance purposes? reduce that for work hours for insurance purposes? business. to your i went to turn this around while we still have time and start -- i was on that bill. it is not about health care. this is about government owning health care. do we have time left? we have five minutes left. last word on the obamacare. senator graham is good i fear mongering. he's doing it again now. -- is good at fear mongering. he is doing it again now. he would make a great chicken little. obamacare is not going away. even if republicans controlled the senate, it is not going away. the president -- it needs to be fit. it needs to be taken care of. ae idea to advance it -- we have got to work together to come up with solutions that will ensure that people have insurance. a lot of people do not have insurance. we need to get people insured. it will create new jobs. this is not the sky is falling scenario. it does need to be fit. there are things that need to between. the idea of fighting it is not right. that is why i would like to go to washington. >> no surprise that south carolina -- the export import bank is an important financial spine to that act to video and many manufacturers. and manyty manufacturers. it is always at risk. how could we reauthorize? is it important to reauthorize? how can we fix this process? the talent is that it mostly comes from my party. party who aremy rightly concerned about the role of government and business. i would love to live in a world where -- there are people who say it is not right, it is not your capitalism to have a government bank to make loans. everything should be done in the private sector or are. that makes sense to me, but i live in the real world. he is not going to help in this regard. you need republican to that planes made in boeing are eligible for financing. who does boeing compete against? airbus. france has two. to help sellank tiny's products that has a volume greater than france, britain, canada combined -- sell china's products that has a volume greater than france, written, canada combined. combined., canada market.risky they will go to airbus and by an airbus because france will help make that deal a reality. gas turbines, 80% of them are eligible for financing. -- you get republicans and democrats speaking truth to power. i'm not going to disarm internationally. i will not put my companies at risk because of an ideological argument. i was the leading republican to get it reauthorize the first time. the argument being made make sense in a -- but not in the world of which we live in. my head is not in the sand. it is not in the sand about obama care. my head is not in the sand about the threats made from radical islam. you better believe i'm worried about where this country is going. >> senator hutto. >> i believe him on the import export bank. when he talks and ask like a democrat, we all like him. acts like a democrat, we all like him. absolutely needs to be reauthorize. >> is very creative way to keep it from coming up every two years and being in a crisis every two years? >> get rid of the tea party republicans who are causing problem. >> that is not fair. there are plenty of groups. president obama opposed the authorizing that. the recent criticism is coming from our corner of the party. i would like to reauthorize that -- >> we have got one minute left. this day last question. howtor, on a scale of 1-10, would you rate governor haley and president obama? >> neither one of them lived up to expectations be had for both. i would probably what both at around 5. you both done some things you could point to and say they have done good things. obama and iesident support senator shaheen. doubtt think there is any about senator graham that he is a republican. both of these leaders have not lived up to expectations. >> last word. >> you could always do better and you can always do worse. i will give obama a 1. [laughter] just assuming we haven't hit bottom yet also my give the governor an 8. i would give myself an 8. i believe you could always do better. i'm a better senator today than i was years ago. i learned from my own mistake. place.ld is a dangerous talking about it won't fix it. someone has to get out there and a gauge it. .he policies have blown up i think that governor has done a good job of writing that ship. i look forward to supporting her. let me just say one last thing about the world -- the lowest ranked person from the chambers point of view and the statehouse senate was republican. i ran against him. end this0% -- i will on a positive note. it makes every state better. god bless you all. >> anything you want to say about the world? >> about the world? the situation with isis, they are bunch of thugs. they should be eradicated. they are terrible or the world. -- for the world. we are the greatest country in the world list that we have overcome many things -- world. we have overcome many things. i thank the chamber. this is great to have the forum. senator graham and i disagree on policy, and in them a wade, equal pay, women's issues -- but those are things -- minimum wage, equal pay, women's issues -- but those are things the voters will vote on. >> thank you for your public service. thank you for showing us congenial south carolina politics. [applause] [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2014] [captioning performed by the national captioning institute, which is responsible for its caption content and accuracy. visit ncicap.org] >> thank you for joining us and thank you for watching. on wednesday, the final debate for the louisiana u.s. senate race was held the train mary landrieu and her to republican challengers -- bew twon mary landrieu and her republican challengers. if no one gets a majority, a runoff will occur between the top two candidates. in this portion, a campus talk about economic prosperity and the standard of living in. -- the candidates talk about economic disparity and then standards of living. with her parents. that is very frightening. what is the role of government in promising economic prosperity for my generation and future generations? colonel? >> i thought the congresswoman would go first. the firstnote that real gasp of the night came from the moderator. [laughter] >> first of all, that is a legitimate concern. try to lift the economic power of our country. i am in a particularly great position to help create millions of high-paying jobs so that your generation could and if it. i'm excited to be here at lsu where we have science, technology, engineering, and math. number two, i think access to education is important. my opponent refuses to sign onto a bill to lower interest rates on student loans that are 21,000 11% interest. he has refused to do that and won't sign onto my bill. smartoor students who are and want to work, but come from families that cannot afford the cost of education. i can tell you government doesn't create permanent jobs and if they do, it is. you don't want to have. the greatness comes from the american people. government gets in the way. if the president would allow the keystone pipeline to be permitted come it would create jobs with benefits. by the way, she speak of her clout. she said her first priority is becoming chair of the energy community. she hasn't been able to -- she says she has done ever thing her power. it means she is not very powerful. there are other things. the president's health care law as it amber on the economy. ofk at those in the lowest income earners. obamacare law hammered them. 400 custodial and food service workers had their hours reduced because they could not afford the obamacare law. get government out of the way. colonel? >> the main thing she has been able to accomplish on energy is the push through obama up off anti-energy appointees and we don't need that kind of clout. what we need to do is pull of obamacare out by the roots. i have been in all 64 parishes and talked to small business owners all over. 85,000 miles on my pickup truck. everyone of them gave me the same message -- sir, you have got to do away with obamacare, we cannot afford the restrictions, we cannot afford the new fees, we cannot afford the taxes and we are not creating the jobs we could. that is hurting the economic spectrum, exactly what it was supposed to help. we need to unleash our energy sector in this state so we can lead america to energy independence. that is what we should be doing here in louisiana. drill, baby, drill. >> on sunday, coverage of campaign 2014 could use with a live debate between david perdue and michelle nunn. here's a look at some of the ads in connection to the race. nunn and ielle approve this message. >> today it is the leading manufacturer of power cable in north america. outsourced to have jobs to other parts of the world. every time we invest in georgia workers, they can compete with anyone in the world. proudnow how you could be of having sent american jobs overseas. have create and save thousands of jobs in america. on michelle does is attacked david. where is she on jobs come education, national security? that is because she supports present obama's agenda. >> we need a new direction. >> that is david pedue. and i david perdue approve this message. nunn and ielle approve this message. >> former ceo of dollar general and technologies that most of his career moving u.s. jobs overseas. --can use their -- explain describe your spins with outsourcing? --your experince experience with outsourcing? >> her foundation gave money to foundations to terrorists. she needed to fool your jens -- georgians to win. david perdue spent his career creating thousands of jobs. perdue will bring common sense to washington. >> i'm next, a debate among candidates running for a house seat in the virginia seventh district. after that, a debate in the alaska senate race. next, a debate in virginia seventh congressional district race between jack trammell and david brett.

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