American library association. To her left is the director of the center for the future of libraries. Examining innovation in libraries and the communities they serve. And finally, susan parker, who is the Deputy University librarian at ucla, where she leads building you just Building Design and renovation projects. And serves as the librarys chief financial officer. Susan parker, let me start with you. Favorite library moment and or what you like about libraries . Are you sick of that . If you worked in a fast food joint, you stop eating it. Do you still like libraries . I love libraries. They are obviously a place i feel very comfortable. It is what the that attracted me to libraries that kept me coming back as it is a place i was always welcome even as a small child. You develop affection for the people who treat you kindly, and even more so they live or you in re you in with bigger and better book and you get excited in thinking and looking things up. Is there a moment in your childhood you said this is the coolest place . Probably the first time i ever went in. Cincinnati, ohio, on the west side. The first time i went in there, i thought this was the coolest thing. I had seen books before, but not that many. Miguel, what is your fondest Library Memory and or why do you like libraries . I think a lot of people have fond memories because they are welcoming places. It is one of the places as a child where you have a certain degree of responsibility. At the phoenix Public Library, it used to be a yellow card, but it was laminated. It felt so adult. A tangible expression of kind of growth and opportunity and responsibility. It opens things to you. It is a predrivers license. The state of kind of deputized you . Oh my goodness. Yeah. Susan, favorite Childhood Library moment . I was an only child and moved a lot. I would usually move after school got out, and i would hit a new community and have no friends. What would i be doing in the summer . I would go to that library. It was my second home. It was welcoming to me, and the librarys and books were my friend. They helped me early on decides to become a librarian, because i found many years ago a paper from junior high where i said i wanted to do this. So it made me feel good when i , was young. Christ do you recall the reason you wanted to do that in that paper . Frankly, i didnt want to be a teacher. I did not want to be a nurse. Librarians have to want to teach today. I did not want to be a nurse. Im old enough that there were not that many other choice is. I knew i could find a job pretty much anywhere in the u. S. Did you want to leave your hometown . Was that part of it . Just curious. I wanted to be mobile. Not necessarily that i wanted to run away, but i was living in a time where they graduated from college and left home, they didnt go back home. [laughter] big if you didnt know it. The warmispensed with and fuzzy part. Again, talking to people about the bad things about libraries. The first thing no disrespect to anybody was homeless and porn. The second is what is it for . My father is a library freak. He lives in or make burbank. He said last week they advertise that it was so hot, everybody could go to the library. It was library as cooling center. Library is a place to sleep during the day. Form distribution. Porn distribution. That irks a lot of people. People dont understand it. One of you i spoke to earlier said lets hit head on. Lets talk about homelessness and porn at the library. Having worked at many urban libraries, dealing with all kinds of customers and populations is challenging, and we are one of the only free opportunities for people to come out of the cold, the heat, whatever. In terms of dealing with people who are homeless, we once to make sure we are helping them in their struggle. For instance, the San FranciscoPublic Library as well as many other libraries have social workers on duty to do interventions with homeless folks. Libraries have very well thought out rules of conduct. We expect everyone to behave so we have a safe and comfortable environment. That has to do with the issue of pornography, and looking at inappropriate information. Our codes of conduct really address that. I have to say, and i have said in previous interviews, sorry folks, but people have been looking at pornography and masturbating in Public Libraries for a long time. We have had to deal with this for a long time. It is just in a different container as we say about all our information. There is a visual. You grimace at that. Susan parker, want to go to you next. Susan i can tell you that you may think that a persons homeless by the way that they look, but you do not know that. Again, libraries are a place where we are trying not to be judgmental on those levels. When we have a budget crisis a few years back at ucla and decided we had to roll back the 24 7 library, we heard from the Student Association right away that we had some homeless students at ucla news to me it opened my eyes. And they were depending on the library as part of their support system at night. I think since a lot of us were surprised to learn this, because you do not necessarily know by looking at people what the situation is that they are dealing with. In so libraries traditionally are about helping people in a private way. You know, i do not know the identity of everybody. Privacy in the library is a key element. You mentioned the introduction of a social worker in San Francisco. What year was that . We began working with the department of social services when i was working there. That was probably 2004. I believe they now have a full time social worker on staff and has been for several years. It is addressing issues and helping our population. At some point, does that possibly dilute the purpose of is it some way making librarians and librarys responsible for social ills that all of us should be tending to . You guys are so generous that you are going to help . Is there a limit to what you can do and that library . Unfortunately we exist in a system where a lot of the normal services that would support Mental Health issues, Poverty Issues etc. Have been stripped away, whether it is the economy or other political decisions. Because the library is among the few civic assets that is still relatively open, that is inevitably what happens. I think the best libraries realize they can be part of the solution. They engage with community partners, whether it is Public Health workers. Tucson Public Library has a nurse on staff. Social workers on staff. Food banks, other kinds of things. A library can be a fundamental platform for a lot of players in the community to come together. We are a wonderful Distribution Channel not only for information in book or database format, but also in general civic information. So to all of you, at no point does tending to social ills make your job your primary job, which is presumably archiving and distributing information to the broader public does it ever come into conflict with other aspects of your job . We are comfortable providing information, whether that is Health Information or where you can go get a meal. We are comfortable with providing information. One thing i will say about pornography, if you have any available access to free information, it will be used toward some of these more negative ends. Case in point, new york city introduced their kiosks that replaced public telephone booth. This past week, they announced they would be disabling internet on them because individuals were using them for pornography. If they had asked librarians about this at the time it is not the nature of libraries, it is the nature of information. And of a public place. Yes. There is a survey by pew 2016 most recent on libraries. 69 of respondents say their local libraries contribute a lot to providing a safe place for people to spend time. What did surprise me is that 50 58 think they contribute a lot toward creating Educational Opportunities of all ages. So, the notion of safe space actually had more respondents saying yes then the notion of creating Educational Opportunities. Does that surprise you . It actually doesnt. I cant read your face well. Because you look slightly surprised. [laughter] well now, it doesnt surprise me. I say space especially and our contemporary society is more valuable. Neutral space. People are seeking that. Those numbers are pretty close. As much as seeking educational opportunity. Eu you wont say that come november 9 that those numbers are close. To play library start that role . Of safe space . We have always played the role. Of safe space in our community. I think that is a consistent goal and value to our communities on our behalf. Just in terms of the educational statistic, there are many people who may not use libraries or not be as aware of libraries. They do not understand the role libraries play in educating all ages, all levels in our community. Libraries brand is books and many folks still think of libraries as book warehouses. We have gone far beyond that. Depending on who pew was surveying, i dont think everyone understands that we are part of the educational ecosystem in our communities. Filling gaps afterschool weekends, so that educational role is critical, but i dont think it is as recognized as i would like it to be. I talk about it constantly, that role. Society shifting. Our idea of education is front of room to an audience. Increasingly we are learning how learning is,r facility learning. Those are things we have in libraries. We are made learning that what we are doing is of educational value. I find it odd that you say the link is not really taught. That is the number one link to me. None of you think it is our that space comessafe before learning . I find it a branding issue. I think it is still part of the what is a library for. Use does you say this for all of these things. It is a hard thing in america when you cant say what your principal reason for being is. I dont get what your principal reason for being is. So far, it is everything. What dont you do . This thing about safe space is maybe more important today. If you asked that question to an audience 10 years ago, it may not have resonated the same way. Another Important Library moment for me as a child was being able to have the privacy to go and look up information that was maybe kept from me at home. If you have people who are gay or trans or any number of situations, it is a safe space for people to find out about themselves. That is really interesting. So it is a safe space intellectually as well . Absolutely. That may be the librarys best brand. People want to contest what is contained in a library because they care what messages people have access to. Our value for intellectual freedom. Host one of the classic arguments for the necessity of libraries is that they exist to nurture unenlightened electorate. Again, i will just let that lie. Im obsessed, im sorry. Is that still true . Youre all going to say yes it is, but im not going to the library to look up prognostications and Opinion Pieces and polls in florida today, im going on the interwebs. One of the challenges we now face is there are multiple spaces where people are segmenting themselves into. We have private health clubs or starbucks or any coffeehouse or something. We do not have the opportunity to mix anymore. The Public Library hopefully remains one of the civic spaces where you encounter people from different perspectives, where you are on a level playing field, where it isnt necessarily a program space. I think our society is tending to move towards a state where we are spending less time together, i worry if we continue to play that role, i think city support libraries and Community Support libraries, the way that they should, we can move away from that. Host you mention starbucks. They seek to be a place where people convene and read even. All sorts of the cafe culture. Does that in any way diminish the popularity or compete with libraries at all . I think it is funny that coffee houses and restaurants are trying to become more neutral spaces where your full transaction is not the menu item. They want you to come in and work and socialize with friends and do lots of Different Things. I worry that that always comes at a cost. It is funny that they are stealing a lot of the elements that have made libraries what they are. We have always allowed you to do any number of things. However you want to function in a library, and you dont have to give something to your loyalty app or order something off of a menu. You could in here and be who you are. I dont know if they are intentionally doing it, but they are certainly taking some of the elements away from libraries. I would think when you said there is more corporations seeking to create civic space at a cost. You have to pay for the latte, right . You see it as a potential threat. I think it could be a potential threat. I think it should also be taken as a complement to a certain extent that we have been doing things the right way for a long time. We hope people become aware that you pay for that freedom in those spaces with your user data, by signing into their wifi networks, any one of a number of things. Are their efforts afoot in libraries across the country to create new ways to convene people . I definitely think there are many ways. We have had a convening role in our history. For instance, many Public Libraries have embarked on maker spaces, which are really great opportunities to allow kids and families to be creative together. There are many ways we are engaging people. Sortspaces, all different of things. But in terms of your question about democracy and how are we supporting democracy, i think that libraries have a great opportunity to really take on a significant role in the community as a community facilitator. There is so much dissension in some of our communities as we have segmented groups, and the library can play the role of bringing those controversial groups together. When we do that and i think as we do not, and we see this in some areas, it could be clashing somewhat with are very much respected role of neutrality. So, neutrality is a huge value for libraries. If we do get into the space of bringing differing points of view together, that is a huge service for our community. We can support informational resources to understand those discussions. We also have to make sure we are very trained to do that effectively, because we do not want to lose that concept of being a neutral place. So this will be convening more than providing information. At ucla, for example, we provide public programming in the library that is open to anyone, not just the university community, but on a range of topics. Sometimes it is designed to highlight collections that we have, especially if they relate particularly to los angeles. Depending on the library and the focus, they may be able to curate audiences, that are defined in ways like you want to hear about art from this one are expert and then look at the paintings on display next door. There is different combinations to do that. Veryries definitely are forward in looking at programming and trying to convene different kinds of interactions. More on third spaces. Miguel, do you envision evolution of this . Are there any as this competition occurs, as you see willow are libraries convening be a larger function in 20 years than it is now . We see libraries already rearranging their spaces so we make available more flexible seating. You can go into a library and rearrange the furniture. The librarians do not get mad. Notn p susan h anymore, no. Miguel we see spaces that can space one day, an auditorium the next day. I want flex ability to accommodate the range of activities. No longer the third between work and home. We are also a third space between what you want to do yesterday and what you want to do tomorrow. Gregory are you the most responsible arm of government . Susan h absolutely. Great very that was a softball, susan. I know that people want the fire department, but you do not want them to come, because you would have a fire. But i think libraries are so beloved and respected by their communities. And i think one of the challenges is that sometimes well,not understand in a way it is good if we are seeing is not part of government, because that is not always positive. On the other hand, i think people generally do not have a very clear understanding in particular of how Public Libraries are funded. They see it on the corner. They expect it to be there. It is going to be there. It is funded in different ways, and it is complicated. That can be difficult. I really do think that in terms of the ability to help our communities and also be a gateway to other government functions, that people have a hard time understanding, library is the place that will do that. Gregory i want to get to reading for a second. I found myself it is depressing. I am a late adopter to all things. I have young employees who teach me to use computers. The other day, i was reading the genocide,e rwandan and i found myself reading it on my phone, and it seemed a bit wrong. There is a kindle app on my phone. I was waiting for my wife. There was something what is great, i can still read, right . , i dont was something know, slightly disrespectful, slightly unfulfilling. Slightly it was not sort of a relaxing, sensual experience. You dream of a leather chair that i never bought. But it seemed like a slightly diminished reading experience. Susan p there is something to that. I am not a digital native. Sometimes it is more convenient when we asked her students, which you rather have print books or ebooks . They go, we would rather have print books, because they help us learn better. And we have expensive gregory why . Susan h why, because they can focus. Sometimes students have many devices on at the same time, many apps, and that is a distraction. But there is nothing about the book except you and the book. Studyiting a research with ucla students last year. Gregory i find when i read books on kindle, i often do not know what the title is and who the author is. I just read this great book. Who was it . I dont know. Because you are not picking up and looking. From an attention perspective, we can argue. The common enemy is not reading. That is somet