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> announcer: this is cnn breaking news. >> we're following breaking news on the catastrophic damage from hurri">
you're in ""the situation room"". >> announcer: this is cnn breaking news. >> we're following breaking news on the catastrophic damage from hurricane michael. tonight the death toll from the storm is up to six and it's expected to climb higher as rescue and recovery crews reach the hardest hit areas across the florida panhandle. we've been getting shocking images of the destruction in mexico beach. it is being described as ground zero for this disaster. michael's 155 mile per hour winds shredded entire neighborhoods, home after home after home. it flipped cars and trailers and up rooted trees. nearly 1 million customers have lost power in florida and five other states pounded by this ferocious storm. our correspondents, analysts and guests are standing by, including our team in the hurricane disaster zone. first, let's go to cnn's erica hill in panama city beach for us in florida. erica, it's really difficult for emergency crews and journalists for that matter to reach some of the most devastated areas along the panhandle. >> reporter: wolf, that is one of the big est 8 challenges today. as we made our way here early this morning, the number of downed power lines, trees and just debris in the road did make it difficult. the other issue that first responders and officials are facing, there is virtually no cell service at this point. so without some sort of satellite phone, it is almost impossible to get in touch with people. and, of course, all of this happening as this state is still trying to assess the full extent of the damage. from the air, a first look at a beach town almost completely wiped out. >> our lives are gone here. >> reporter: daylight exposing the force of hurricane michael. this category 4 storm which made landfall near mexico beach, packing winds of more than 150 miles per hour. >> we had furniture in our house that wasn't even our furniture. >> reporter: getting into mexico beach a challenge in itself. roads clogged with downed power lines, trees and debris. >> all the stores, all the restaurants, everything, there's nothing left here any more, you know. all the homes and on this side of the road of the beach, they're all gone. >> reporter: the need extends far beyond mexico beach. and panama city, neighborhoods reduced to rubble. >> oh, god, panama city, there's nothing there, nothing. i never seen nothing like it. >> reporter: this middle school nearly flattened. the gym's roof torn off. >> it was heart wrenching. i know what the school means to our kids and our community. and to see that type of devastation on their school and realizing that that devastation not only is their school, but also with their homes, because the kids live nearby. >> reporter: and panama city beach, a massive boat storage facility at this marina now a twisted cage for the vessels stored inside. the damage resembling the work of a strong tornado, especially when seen from the sky. as the reality of what's left behind sets in, many people here still trying to make sense of what happened. >> where do we start now? i mean, what do we do? there's nothing left here. >> reporter: wolf, just recently an 85 mile stretch of interstate 10 that was closed has reopened. that is good news. the first order of business today, though, was really clearing those roadways so first responders could get in and so that folks can get in to check these devastated areas, to help hopefully with rescue efforts. wolf? >> so awful, so awful. erica, thank you. let's go to cnn's brook baldwin. she's in destine, florida, for. you did manage to get into mexico beach. bring us pictures of that decimated community. >> reporter: yeah, i just got back from our chopper ride back, 90 miles east to mexico beach, and just starting to process the destruction that i saw firsthand. you know, we woke up this morning and i just wanted to get to the hardest hit area because i think the world needed to see how bad it really is in parts of the panhandle. you know, being in mexico beach, it had been described as ground zero, but i wanted to see if for my own eyes. to take this helicopter ride early this morning, here from destine, 90 miles down the way, east of where erica was in panama city beach, we actually flew over the marina and it was just obliterated. i saw it from the sky. to land in mexico beach, we were one of the first journalists there. we were broadcasting live from a road -- it was just eerie. looking from my left and to my right, the mattresses, toilets, homes that were carried by the storm surge, flipped upside down over highways. here's a picture of what it took to get there. look at this marina down below. these warehouses of boats, destroyed. just toppled over and crushed by the sheer force of the winds. it's obliterated and it's awful. it's awful to look at. i mean, just -- as we watch the deterioration along the coast line, it was bad in panama city beach, but i'venever seen anything like this. just imagine this is your home, this is your livelihood, this is where you love. this is beautiful, pristine mexico beach, florida, along this gorgeous part of the florida panhandle. we saw national guard. we saw fire and rescue from a bunch of different cities around this area. and, you know, i think one of the moments that will really stay with me is walking around where the homes were and you hear all these beeps which i think were smoke detectors that were blown off of homes, a smoke detector warning you of danger to come, and that's the noise that actually is still haunting me a bit of my day in mexico beach. i saw this woman. we knew instantly she was looking to see if her home was still there. we shoved our satellite phone in her hand just so she could try to get up with her sister to tell her sister that she was okay, because there's no cell communication. we're in a bubble all day being in mexico beach. no cell at all. and she was able to tell her sister she was okay, and then we walked with her as she just lost it, wolf, as she was trying to figure out where her home was, only to realize it was right in front of her, or it was right in front of her and she could only tell because of how her sidewalk was paved. the rest of it was totally gone. and that was just one story of people trying to come back. those who didn't ride it out, and some people did, and we talked to them as well. we don't have a death toll yet out of mexico beach. i was talking to city of miami fire and rescue. they're still going door to door to door trying to figure out who is left, wolf. >> oh, so heart breaking. all right, brook, thank you very much. the strongest hurricane on record to hit florida carved a path of destruction across the panhandle and beyond. cnn's gary is in crawford ville for us not far from the state capital tallahassee. gary, what kind of damage are you seeing there? >> reporter: well, wolf, it's a sad testament of this hurricane that we are 90 miles east of where brook was today, mexico beach. because it was so large and so strong, the stories here are very sad, too. we were in this very small town, shell point beach today, and we were there as people came back to their homes. everyone evacuated this town tuesday night at 8:00 p.m. not only because there was a mandatory evacuation that said they had to be out. they knew this was a strong hurricane. they had been hit by hurricane dennis. they knew they would be obliterated so they left. when they saw it came 90 miles to the west and the eye missed them by quite a bit, people were hopeful when they came back to their homes today. they only came back today because it was under water until this morning. the water dissipated, they came back, hoped for the best. for many it was wishful thinking because when they came back to their homes, many of the homes were destroyed and many more were heavily damaged. it's such an interesting community. it's buy the beach, a great place to live. mansions, mobile homes, a combination, but the people all have something in common, they suffered from the hurricane also. wolf? >> awful, awful, awful. all right, gary, thank you very much. moments ago i spoke to linda olbrecht, a member of the mexico beach city council. do you know when you'll be able to return to mexico beach? >> well, my desire was to go back today because as an essential employee, you know, they're giving the okay and as a council woman i could have gone back today. but the roads weren't open. and so now i'm thinking i can go back tomorrow, and then friends of mine say, that's crazy. first of all, what if you need gas in the car, what if you need this, what if you need this, all the things you don't think about. and so i don't know if i'll return tomorrow. i have to. >> i'm sure there is no power and no electricity in mexico beach and a whole bunch of other communities along the panhandle. >> and no cell phone. so once you're in there, the communication between each other is very minimal. like you said, there's no power, no cell phone. >> and i think you told me, but i'll ask. do you know how your own home fared? >> no, i do not. -- snap a picture, don't sugar coat it. i just need to know. you know, i am the first one -- i'm on the "frontlinefront line. i'm not on the beach side. there are no buildings on the beach in front of me. it's the gulf, the beach, the road and myself. so i am on the front line. no, i don't know yet. >> i know you're getting eye motional and it's totally understandable given what you've gone through, so many others have gone through. and you don't know what the state of your own home is and all your possessions. were you able to board up the house before you left? >> yes, it's very interesting, because michael just started last friday as a thunderstorm south of the yucatan. i said, okay, it's going to be a tropical storm. we've lived through that. and then there's a couple of boat captains that started passing the word, they were concerned about michael on saturday. they were concerned. and with texting everybody else, i started to get nervous and i did start to pack some things up sunday and they just kept saying, this is something to watch. do not play around with this one. this one is going to be serious. you know, that's their business. i mean, they're boat captains and they know the waters. so i just -- you know, they're the -- they know more than i do about the waters. >> yeah. >> and so i did do a lot of packing and some of my friends laughed at all the things that i've taken. but i really thought, okay, so it's going to be a cat 3, i'll come home and everything will be fine. little did i expect for it to be almost a 5. >> yeah. >> little did i expect. >> that was linda albrecht, city council woman. just ahead there is breaking news on the mueller russia investigation. we'll tell you how mr. trump's legal team is responding, and a rather bizarre reality tv moment at the white house in the oval office. we're going to break down kanye west's long-winded gushing diatribe that the president calls impressive. >> trump is on his hero's journey right now. he might not have expected to have a crazy [ bleep ] like kanye west run up and support, but best believe we are going to make america great. not in this . 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>> oh, it is good energy in this. >> isn't it good energy? >> reporter: the president? r somehow finding the time for a meeting and lunch with loyal trump supporter that devolved into an incoherent televised rant. >> this right here is the i-plane one. it's a hydrogen powered airplane. this is what our president should be flying in. if he don't look good, we don't look good. this is our president. >> true. >> he has to be the freshest, the fly est, the flyest planes. >> reporter: he kamt to the white house for a meeting on prison reform but capped off his appearance by cursing in the oval office as the president smiled. >> trump is on his hero's journey right now and he might not have expected to have a crazy [ bleep ] like kanye west run up and make america great. >> reporter: it was a far cry from what he said about president bush in the days after hurricane katrina. >> george bush doesn't care about black people. >> reporter: asked about that today, he said this. >> and we also as black people, we have to take a responsibility for what we're doing. >> reporter: a striking scene as the administration scrambled to deal with devastation from hurricane michael ravaging florida's gulf coast. a second straight day of a major slide in the stock market and an escalating diplomatic crisis with saudi arabia. >> i have a very busy day today. >> reporter: the president said he would visit florida early next week to assess damage from one of the most powerful hurricanes to ever strike the continental u.s. as he faces another test for how his government will respond. >> the path that it chose is incredible, the kind of destruction, we've not seen destruction like that in a long time. >> reporter: less than four weeks before the midterm elections, the nation's rosy economic picture suddenly facing a new reality check as the dow plunges more than a thousand points in two days, amid rising interest rates. >> i think the fed is out of control. i think what they're doing is wrong. >> reporter: most presidents shy away from criticizing the federal reserve, let alone blaming it for a stock sell off they believe is a correction for a soaring market. the disappearance of jamal khashoggi, a foreign policy columnist for the washington post, is threatening to up end relations with saudi arabia. he's not been seen since entering the saudi consulate last week in istanbul. turkish officials say he was killed and dismembered in a plot most likely ordered by the saudi crown prince who is close to the president and son-in-law jared kushner. as they call for tough action the isn't taking a wait and see approach saying the journalist isn't a u.s. citizen, but he is a u.s. resident who lives in virginia. >> it's not our country. it's turkey and it's not a citizen as i understand it. but a thing like that shouldn't happen. it is a reporter with the washington post and it's something like that should not be allowed to happen. >> reporter: the president seemed to take off the table economic sanctions or kiting off arms sales to zrag from the u.s. >> i don't like the concept of stopping an investment of $110 billion into the united states, because you know what they're going to do? take that money and spend it in russia or china or someplace else. so i think there are other ways -- if it turns out to be as bad as it might be, there are certainly other ways of handling the situation. >> reporter: so the president clearly taking off the table the idea of economic sanctions or stopping the sale of arms to saudi arabia. many republicans on capitol hill who are concerned about this raised their eyebrows at that. but, wolf, we have seen the president time and time again pound his hand on the desk and essentially call out allies, some of our most traditional allies, around the world. that is something he has not done at all in this case. there is a sense of urgency about the disappearance and likely death of this journalist. wolf, you do not feel that sense of urgency here when the president had so much else in public, at least, on his plate and agenda today. wolf? >> all right, jeff, thank you very much. we're going to have a lot to talk about with our political and legal analysts. i want everyone to stand by. there is breaking news. also in the special counsel robert mueller's investigation, we'll get to that in just a minute. the day after chemo might mean a trip back to the doctor's office just for a shot. but why go back there... when you can stay home with neulasta onpro? 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let's say it in a really low voice. carl? lowest price, guaranteed. just stick with badda book. badda boom. book now at choicehotels.com we have breaking news on the russia investigation. i want to bring in our analysts including gloria borger who has new reporting on robert mueller's efforts to get answers from president trump. what are you learning, gloria? >> one of my colleagues dana bash and evan perez were reporting that finally, after almost a year, president trump's legal team has received questions that they can answer in writing from robert mueller about collusion. so that would cover, wolf, the pre-inauguration part of this controversy. so they're working studiously on getting those answers back to him. it doesn't mean, however, that in the end, bob mueller will, a, be satisfied with their answers, or, b, won't say to them, you know, we need to talk about obstruction, and i need to talk to the president about that. but i think there was an agreement reached that after going back and forth and back and forth for so long, they had to finally get this started. and it may be an indication, of course, that bob mueller is gearing up to get to the end of his investigation at some point in the not too distant future, obviously, after the midterms. >> the president and his legal team, laura, are going to be drafting all the answers to these questions. >> well, as gloria likes to call, this is a take-home test drafted by the lawyers. so you kind of -- he struggled to think about what information are they going to glean from this and what value is it to them? but to the extent that there is anything that they say in those answers, even if it's drafted by the lawyers that conflicts with something they already know, it goes to how seriously you can take this and the credibility. but at the end of the day, if he doesn't answer a single question on obstruction of justice and is not subpoenaed and does not have to actually sit down for an in-person interview, that's a win for the president. that is a huge deal if he never has to -- we don't know that, we're not there yet. but the fact we're at a point where he's getting written questions and that's all that we have at this late date is a sign. >> the president keeps saying he's willing to sit down with mueller, but as you know, his lawyers don't want him to do so. >> right. they're probably as laura and gloria are saying, probably happen about this open book test, at least to start. at the same time, though, the president from a political point of view, not a legal point of view, does have to keep up this facade or veneer that he's willing to just talk freely because he doesn't want to look guilty, even if he and his team don't think he's guilty, they understand someone who won't answer questions, it doesn't look good. >> and also, there is the question about pre-inauguration. the legal team obviously understands that the president is not protected by privilege. so they would have to answer these questions anyway. i think, when it comes to the question of obstruction and why the president fired james comey, the legal team believes they may have some article 2 issues, and they may be able to say, look, you know, the president's conversations are completely protected. and mueller could very welcome back and say, the president is the only person in the world who can tell us what his intent was, and we need to speak to him about that. >> everybody stand by. there is more news that we're following. there is an important development that occurred at the white house today. kanye west was there in the oval office with the president of the united states. we'll assess after a quick break. >> it was something about when i put this hat on that made me feel like superman. you made a superman -- that's my favorite superhero, and you made a superman cape. 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wine. it has multiple notes to it. the liberal will try to control a black person through the concept of racism because they know we are very proud emotional people. so when i said i like trump to, like, someone that's liberal, they'll say, oh, but he's racist. you think racism can control me? oh, that don't stop me. that's an invisible wall. would you build a trap door that if he mess up and you accidentally -- something happens and you fall and you end up next to the unia-bomber -- let me get this guy. >> i love this guy right here. hey, man. >> he did most of the talking in the oval office. don, what did you think? >> wolf, listen, i have no animosity for kanye west. i'm just going to be honest and i may get in a lot of trouble for it. i actually feel bad for him. what i saw was a minstral show today. him in front of all these white people embarrassing himself and embarrassing americans, but mostly african americans because every one of them is sitting either at home or with their phones, watching this, cringing. i couldn't even watch it. i had to turn the television off because it was so hard to watch. him sitting there, being used by the president of the united states. the president of the united states exploiting him. and i don't mean this in a disparaging way -- exploiting someone who needs help, who needs to back away from the cameras, who needs to get off stage, who needs to deal with his issues. and if anyone around him cares about him, the family that he mentioned today or whomever, his managers, maybe some other people who are in the "man of the woods" i can business who know him, they need to grab him, snatch him up and get kanye together because kanye needs help. this has nothing to do with being liberal or a conservative. this has to do with honesty. and we have to stop pretending, sitting here on these cnn panels or whatever network panels, and pretending like this is normal and let's have this conversation about kanye west. who cares? why are you sending cameras to the oval office for kanye west? did you send cameras to the oval office and carry it live when common visited the kmous? common visited the white house and did a beautiful poem, spoken word, talked about how black people are kings and queens, how we need to rise up and do better. he didn't disparage anybody. he didn't speak in nonsecond we turs. he didn't do anything awful. the only people who criticized him, the only people who really covered it were sean hannity and his band of hypocrites who are now -- who are now applauding kanye west, the same people that many in that group called the n-word because of taylor swift and because of george bush. and now all of a sudden, he is the person who represents the african-american community? he does presidenn't. we need to take the cameras away from kanye and from a lot of this craziness that happens in the white house because it is not normal and we need to stop sitting here pretending that it's normal. this was an embarrassment. kanye's mother is rolling over in her grave. i spoke to one of her friends today or texted with one of her friends today from chicago. i used to live there. i know him. she said donda would be embarrassed by this. she would be terribly disturbed by this. and kanye has not been the same since his mother died. he kept talking today about oh, i put the hat on and the hat made me feel strong and wearing a cape. he needs a father figure. he needs someone to help him and to guide him and he needs a hug more than anything. kanye, back away from the cameras. go get some help. and then come back and make your case. nobody -- if you want to be conservative, if you want to support donald trump, that is your business. but as you're doing it, have some sense with it. make sense. educate yourself. >> you know, don, we just played a one-minute clip of that exchange. but it really went on for more than half an hour, if you watch the whole -- >> talking about hydrogen -- the last time we really talked about hydrogen, seriously, do you remember that, the hindenburg. so kanye, come on, man. stop embarrassing yourself. it's not even that. we're doing it. we're watching someone's demise in front of our eyes. and the president as well. the office is sacred. can you imagine if president barack obama had kanye west or any rapper or any person entertainer in the oval office who said m.f., can you imagine -- everybody's heads would be exploding. not just over at fox news, not just the conservatives. everybody's heads would be exploding saying, what's happening? this is not the first time that donald trump has denigrated that office. he brought ted nugent in who said some very disparaging things about the former president. google it and you'll see. had him there in the oval office. so this is not the first time that he's had someone that denigrates that office that didn't live up to the respect of that office in there. and today was another example of that. he is disrespecting the oval office more than kanye did because he invited kanye in and splo exploited it. >> davis, what did you think? >> i think don is onto something, wolf, and i just want to focus on one little piece of what don said. there is one data point i want to drill down on. that is this. look, don said if kanye west wants to be conservative, he can be. there is absolutely a robust discussion being had, has been had, will if not to be had in the african-american community about political ideology. there is not a monolith in the black community. but a lot of what you hear kanye west saying today and what he said recently is about critiquing president obama. i want to point to one number, this is always pointed to by kanye and others around him, black unemployment. the unemployment rate for african americans went down from 7.8 to 6% under trump. that's good. trump should brag about that. but under president obama, the only african-american president, it went from 12.7 to 7.8, almost a 5 percentage point drop. so, if there is a discussion to be had about what republicans or democrats or african americans or white politicians are doing for black people, let's have it, but let's not have it on the basis of bogus information. >> gloria? >> i want to add to something don said and agree with him about the president using, using kanye. he thinks the -- the president thinks he's boosting his popularity with african americans. we haven't seen that. and he thinks he's good for him. but he sat there and smiled the entire time. he was clearly uncomfortable. but when kanye dropped the f-bomb and all the rest, he didn't do anything about it. he didn't say, stop, this is the oval office, we don't do that in the oval office. and this also happened on a day when you had thousands of people -- thousands of people losing their homes -- >> thank you, gloria. thank you, gloria. >> -- in florida, and instead the president is sitting and meeting with kanye west because it makes him look good. i know they're supposed to discuss criminal justice reform, et cetera, et cetera. but it was like watching a train wreck because it was, and the president just sat there. i remember when presidents used to say, you know what, need to put on your jacket to go into the oval office. >> let me jump in here. i'm sorry to hog this panel. this has got engluten me -- we o stop putting people like kanye west and kim kardashian. no shade to kim kardashian. kim kardashian helped get one person free. this is no comprehensive overhaul of the criminal justice system. this president loves celebrities, so that helped. but kim kardashian brought no experts in that i know of. no one who knows about criminal justice reform, no one who can overhaul the system, nothing. she sat there, another celebrity with another celebrity at another time, former administration, we would have criticized this and said that he was disparaging the office. so let's not pretend. we should stop putting kanye west and kim kardashian on the same plane as jamal khashoggi who deserves more coverage than kanye west and the people in the panhandle and the devastating storm. we should be focusing on them than kanye west in the oval office. he has no credence in the black community on these issues. >> we're going to focus on that, guys. thank you very much. don lemon telling us how he really feels. by the way, you can see his show later tonight. he'll elaborate 10:00 p.m. eastern. that's going to be later tonight. i want to get back to the other breaking news we're following. more devastation from hurricane michael revealed by the hour as emergency crews struggle to reach areas ravaged by this record-breaking storm. at least six people are now confirmed dead. let's go live to the up center of this disaster. that's mexico beach in the panhandle. cnn's miguel marques is there. miguel, from what we've been seeing, there is not much left of mexico beach. >> reporter: well, i want to show you what is mexico beach today. we drove through the entire town today. what you are looking at, 24 hours ago, 36 hours ago was beachfront property here, beautiful holds ames and busine completely wiped away. there are parts of mexico beach that no longer exist at all. the drive in here utterly treacherous. thousands and thousands of trees downed, snapped in half, all in the same direction. it is something reminiscent of a nuclear blast that came through here, just entire forests mowed down all the way down here. emergency services just getting up and going in mexico beach right now. florida task force 2 is here, louisiana task force 2 is here, the urban search and rescue are going through home after home. there's 165 of them working pretty much 24 hours a day trying to get through here. they have found a lot of people who survived the storm here. and if you would allow me, i just want to name a few people who are okay. they want their families to know they are okay. they're all gathered in an area we couldn't get a live shot out of earlier so we're here now, but i want to read their names off. robin retslof, her family is from kalamazoo, michigan. she's okay. don vickers and heron tire family are okay. robert brock, he's okay. david sea berg. he wants his mother in mobile, alabama to know he's okay. annette co-field, she and her mother are okay as well. but there is just the amount of need and the disaster that is unfolding here is immense. there are so many people hanging out in town here, waiting, hoping for a ride out of here at some point. emergency services only able to deal with those who are actually injured, actually sick right now, that they have to get out on an emergent basis. everyone else at this point will have to wait until they can do that. but people rode out this storm. their homes are now completely gone, entire neighborhoods. i mean, this is the sort of stuff we see everywhere. 80 to 90% of this a large pors portion of it is completely gone and it will be a long, long time in rebuilding here in mexico beach, florida, just enormous damage. what you're looking at now is across 98. 98 is the main drag that goes along mexico beach. there are giant chunks of 98 that are now gone as well, completely washed away. there is literally nothing left. it's almost impossible to traverse this town very quickly because there are so many dangers on the roadways, in the town, and in some cases, literally the roadway has just completely disappeared into the ocean. i mean, what you are looking at, that was once a thriving community, and it is completely flat. it is completely gone, and entire areas are like that near town. we were up near the public beach here a little while ago, and that is exactly the same way. all of those apartment complexes and condominiums right by the pier are completely gone and washed up on to 98. boats and everything. it is just going to take a massive effort to get mexico beach back up and going. joe? >> i'm glad you got there, miguel. i'm glad you shared those names. there are going some people who are going to be relieved but god knows how many others are still waiting for the news. we're going to have much more on this story coming up. there's other important news we're following tonight. another u.s. official tells cnn that the united states is working on the assumption that a missing saudi journalist was murdered inside the saudi consulate in istanbul, turkey. the republican chairman of the senate foreign relations committee tells cnn there's no question, direct quote, no question in his mind that the saudis were behind the killing of a resident of the united states and a contributor to "the washington post." this as cnn has learned about u.s. intercepts of discussions among saudi officials that seem oh so incriminating. our global affairs correspondent elise labott is joining us. you were all over the story of these intercepts. >> reporter: that's right, wolf. u.s. has intercepts of saudi officials in recent months talking about a plan to try and lure jamal back to the -- to saudi arabia, perhaps to detain him, perhaps to kill him. it's really unclear what the plans were, but certainly this is all very concerning in light of what might have happened to him at the consulate and as our colleague, barbara starr, is reporting, u.s. officials do believe now the working assumption is that jamal was killed in the embassy, and so those intercepts are part of a larger issue. look, saudi officials have been very concerned, wolf, on jamal's writings, very critical of the kingdom for the last year, they were trying to bring him back into the fold, talking about giving him a job in the government, perhaps setting him up in a think tank. he really could write his own ticket. he said, no, i really feel this is my calling. i need to continue to speak out. really, he was seen more of a threat come september when the "washington post" started printing his articles in arabic and that's when it seems that this plot was hatched. the timing is very unclear, but to try and lure him back to saudi arabia. the suspicion is that he would not fly home. he was concerned for his safety, and now this consulate, what might have happened there seems this may be a fallback plan to get him. >> and it comes at a time when the u.s., when the trump administration has embraced the crown prince of saudi arabia, mohammed bin salman, 33 years old and that puts the u.s. in an awkward position right now in spo responding to this. >> the u.s., president trump himself, jared kushner, so far in front on seeing mohamed bin s salman, this young ruler as the future of saudi arabia and really the lynchpin saudi of the u.s. relationship in the gulf, but in the face of this mounting evidence, and you've heard president trump come out and say it looks like the saudis are involved. i don't think the president would come out so far if he wasn't -- didn't see some evidence that perhaps -- and you heard from bob porker, that the saudis are involved, but i will say, at the same time, wolf, for the president to say i think the saudis did it but i really don't think i can help those arms sales, it's too important to the u.s. economy, that's also very concerning that the u.s. would so blatantly disregard american values of human right in that way. >> the president says if the u.s. doesn't sell those weapons to saudi arabia, china or russia or someone else will, and creates jobs. his point, creates jobs here in the united states. elise, i want you to stand by. i want to talk a little bit more about this major development. the former canadian ambassador to saudi arabia, dennis, is joining us right now from toronto. mr. ambassador, thanks so much for joining us. how should the united states and allies like canada, for example, respond to the disappearance, the apparent murder of this saudi journalist? >> good evening, wolf, it's shocking. it's surprising. it's tragic. i believe it's true. we don't have the firm evidence but all signs point to it. it's difficult to respond. the saudis are going their own way in a lot of respects. the reform program covers a lot of positives, but on the political space, it's shrinking and this is taking it into a darker turn. how you respond is something i think that all the governments have to consider what their best options will be. sanctions have been discussed, i heard earlier in the program. i'm not sure they would be overly effective in dealing with this particular case, but again, it's the sort of thing we've seen dissidents before. we've seen arrests before of people who are vocal on the political space, and the saudis are going their own way on this so it's hard to say what would be effective in changing track. they want to close that political space for saudis. >> i want to point out to our viewers, mr. ambassador, it wasn't that long ago the saudis kicked you out of saudi arabia. you were for, what, three years the career diplomat. you served as the canadian ambassador to saudi arabia. they were angry. apparently the crown prince was angry about a tweet from the -- your foreign ministry about some human rights abuses in saudi arabia, and then they didn't only kick you out but they did a lot of other things, including punishing canada, removing canadian -- saudi students from canada among other things. >> that's right. that's right. it was just this past august. it was a tweet. it was a serious overreaction on the part of the saudis. if they were concerned about it, the normal course of events would be to call the ambassador in and have some discussions about it and perhaps lodge a formal complaint. to react like they did over a tweet, i think, is reflective of the kind of impulsiveness we're seeing out of the regime at this point, and this incident with jamal khashoggi is another illustration of how sensitive they are to certain criticisms, whether it's via governments via a tweet or by journalists. it's unusual. they've had dissidents writing about saudi arabia for decades and to take this kind of action against jamal khashoggi as a result of writings that he had is, again, it's a serious overreaction, much more serious, obviously, than what happened with me and what happened with us. but certainly, they've tried to punish canada because of a tweet, perhaps as an example to others, this is what happens if you criticize us openly, because i think everyone agrees it was a serious overreaction. >> what do you think of the crown prince, the young crown prince of saudi arabia, mohammed bin salman? do you believe he would be the one who would order, if, in fact, these reports are true, the execution of this saudi journalist? >> it's hard to say. the saudi decision making processes are very, very opaque. that being said, it's hard to see anything really that's happening in saudi arabia these days from even minor things to obviously to very large things like this would be, that is not going through the royal court. whether it's the crown prince himself or the people around him, it's hard to say and again, trying to track how that decision making process works in saudi arabia is difficult, but a lot of things are being -- virtually everything is being funneled through the royal court these days. >> what do you think of president trump's decision, his announcement that no matter what happens, no matter what the conclusion of the u.s. investigation, the united states will continue selling lots of weapons to saudi arabia? >> i'm no longer a canadian diplomat, but i am a bit reluctant to comment on what american policies should or shouldn't be. i'm sure a lot of people will be upset that they're putting -- that the president is putting jobs and arms sales and money ahead of principle here. but again, it's not for me to say. >> what kind of a relationship does saudi arabia have with canada right now? >> it's a very difficult one. we didn't have a very in depth and detailed -- very deep relationship beforehand, which i think was part of the problem. but certainly right now, it's on ice. i've been a bit out of the loop for the past couple weeks since i retired, but it's going to be hard to build back up for sure. they're angry. they've taken a lot of steps. they've drawn a line in the sand on the tweet, again, overreacting, but nonetheless, that's what it is, and it will be difficult to patch back up. they've done it with other countries that have had problems with them, germany and sweden, for example, both had issues with saudi arabia. those relationships were built back up, but it takes time and it's going to take a lot of effort. >> dennis, the former canadian ambassador to saudi arabia, thanks so much for joining us. >> thank you. and to our viewers, thanks very much for watching. "erin burnett outfront" starts right now? . right now. "outfront" next, wiped out, hurricane michael taking out entire towns and at least six people are dead, including a child. tonight, the powerful storm leaving much of the panhandle looking like a war zone. the working assumption is that a "washington post" contributor was murdered. my guest, senator lindsey graham who said there will be hell to pay if the saudis killed him. is president trump on the same page? and the f word dropped in the oval office. kanye west's bizarre meeting with president trump. let's go "outfront." good evening, everyone, i'm