How would your administration protect americans with preexisting conditions to have access to affordable insurance if the Affordable Care act is struck down . Well, thank you, susan, but let me just say addressing your very first question, i couldnt be more proud to serve as Vice President to a president who stands without apology for the sanctity of human life. Okay. Were going to hear from both campaigns in just minutes. Also this morning the president we know has returned to the oval office from isolation in the white house residence despite the fact that hes almost certainly still contagious, shedding the virus wherever he goes. Now cnn has new details about the president s desire to return to the campaign trail with actual rallies being discussed. Would it be safe to hold a rally right now . Almost nowhere. Look at that map right there, you can see the orange, all the states where there are cases on the rise, the beige the states where cases are steady. Scott jennings, a cnn political commentator, and cnn White House Correspondent kaitlan collins. I want to start with the breaking news which comes from the commission on president ial debates which says that the next president ial debate which is scheduled for thursday if it happens will be a virtual affair, which is to say that the candidates will be in separate locations with voters in a town hall format asking them questions remotely. This is because the president is, as of now, contagious. Kaitlan collins, to you. What do you expect the white house response will be to this and just mark the moment. I mean, this in and of itself is a statement of where we are which is it is unsafe to be near the president of the United States. Yeah, the medical experts, i believe, will say this is a wise decision. We had heard back and forth over whether or not that should be held in person in just a week from today, but notably what the statement does not say is that the Trump Campaign or Biden Campaign has agreed to t its hard to say that the president s advisers are going to be enthusiastic about this because there had been some talk about this beforehand or after in the aftermath of that first debate and it was not something that the president s advisers wanted to see and they noticeably have not said a word about this since the statement came out from the organizers of the debate, that it is going to be held virtually because of course the Trump Campaigns argument has been that the president is stronger when he is in person and can respond that way. It will be noticeable. This not only gives the opportunity for less interruptions on the president s behalf, something that the campaign was publicly enthusiastically about but were concerned about how they were going to navigate that in the second debate with voters present, but also it is going to be in and of itself sending this message that the reason this is going conducted virtually is because the president got covid19. Its going to be hard for anyone watching this not to be thinking ba that constantly because thats the reason joe biden and donald trump will not be in the same room together. It changes the entire face of the debate, obviously. President trump has just responded to this for the first time, we have not heard it yet, lets hear what he has to say. I heard that the commission a little while ago changed the debate style and thats not acceptable to us. I beat him easily in the first debate according to the polls that ive seen, but i beat him easily, i felt i beat him easily, i think he felt it, too. He wouldnt answer any questions and he had the protection of Chris Wallace all night long. I thought Chris Wallace was a disaster. But i beat him in the first debate, in the second debate we have a never trumper as a host, but thats okay because i would beat him in the second debate also and but im not going to do a virtual debate. Okay. Well, there was the news. Paul, does he have a choice . No. First lets cut the president a break here. Thats just the steroids talking. Okay . They have to do this. He is diseased. He is sick. He is infectious. Also he has covid. No sense that you could put a person in a room with donald trump. The white house, its 1,100 people on 1,600 acres. More covid cases in the white house than the country of new zealand plus taiwan plus vietnam, 124 Million People. This guy is a super spreader. He is a menace. He cant be out among people. He is a menace to Public Health. Just to remind people what the breaking news is because this is now a thing, the commission on president ial debates has said that if there is going to be a president ial debate next week as scheduled thursday night it would have to be virtual with the candidates appearing in remote locations. We just heard the president , scott jennings, say no. No. Thats not acceptable to me. It is interesting because as kaitlan points out the imagery of it would be you are in remote locations because the president is a threat to peoples health, but to say no, to refuse to debate in this way, which is deemed safe, how risky is that for the president to be seen as dodging this opportunity to engage with joe biden . Well, i mean, a couple things. Number one, if you consider that he didnt win the first debate or that it didnt turn out well for him in the polls its not risky at all. Number two, if you already consider that there are very few persuadable voters left out there it may not matter that much. Number three, i suspect the optics are secondary and the concern is like were having a conversation right now, if you decide you dont like what im saying you could mute my microphone or turn me off. If only. Please dont. Dont thanos me. I suspect what trump is worried about is the concept that he wants to try to engage i will use an industry term they pot his mic down and he wont be able to control it. I dont know if they are going to have this debate or not but i suspect that conversation of who is going to be in control of the mike tones will be front and center. Kaitlan, what a strange moment where the Virtual Reality meets sur reality. It was already going to be a different kind of debate than what we saw, it was a town hall so they were going to be able to address voters concerns. I dont think that President Trump was going to be able to interrupt or steam roll voters in the way that he had done in the first debate, but now, i mean, just the imagine it. We have all been on these zoom calls where the audio doesnt work, the signal goes out, it freezes. I mean, this is what might be happening a week from now. And i honestly dont think it would be that bad of a backdrop for the president to be somewhere in the white house doing this debate with a more president ial backdrop for voters to look at. I think it could actually work well, but the president is clearly opposed to this, he says he is not going to be doing a virtual debate so that is huge. We may not see these candidates do a debate next week as they are scheduled, but if you want to see how the president is viewing this, he also just said in these comments that he felt like he could do a rally tonight. He says he wanted to do a rally last night which was during the Vice President ial debate. That is how the president is viewing his diagnosis with covid. Its not even been one week since the president announced he had covid19 and had tested positive. This is the fateful day last week when hope hicks learned she was positive, the president still went to that fundraiser anyway and he is saying he feels like he could do a rally tonight. If that gives you an indication of how we were talking about the Trump Campaign wants to see the president back on the road around that debate next week, that was something they were already talking about and the president is making clear he not only wanted to get back in the oval office, get back to the white house, he also wants to get back on the campaign trail and return to holding these rallies despite the condemnation that hes faced since he got covid and of course weve seen the trail of events since then, but it is big news, the president is saying he is backing out of doing a debate if its going to be held virtually which i dont think the commission on president ial debates is going to back off of. Yeah, i would be surprised if they backed off after making this statement. And, again, the news this morning isnt just that the Commission Says they want to do it virtually, its that the president says, no, its not going to happen, he is not going to show up. He wont do it. And the politics of that are fascinating, paul. Scott does raise an interesting point which is maybe the president is better off not debating, however, if you are down you have to do something to change it up. Didnt you guys send a guy in a chicken suit around hounding people in 1992 . When you avoid or choose not to debate, usually it ends up being a thing that comes back to haunt you. A lot of trumps appeal to his base is that he poses as a strong man and a strong man shouldnt run away from a fight. Every politician has their strengths and weaknesses, trumps strengths is his rallies, he shouldnt do one because its a menace to Public Health, joes strength is personal intimate connections oneonone with voters. Thats what a town hall does. Joe biden loses more in this format, he is the empathetic guy, trump is terrible at that, hes not empathetic at all. This shift is a big win for trump, he can clothe himself in the grandeur of the white house and he doesnt have to look at what he called disgusting people. Thats what he called his own supporters according to olivia troy who worked for the Vice President on the task force for coronavirus. Actually if he could take a breath, chill, he would see this is actually a big win for him and takes away bidens greatest strength which is his ability to relate to people in a personal setting. I wouldnt say just because President Trump said something at 8 00 a. M. Eastern time on a thursday that we should take that to the bank for whats going to happen a week from now. Do you think he will cave . Do you think he will show up . I think the president often says two things that are contradictory so he can never be wrong. I mean, i think we know that from his style. He might Say Something completely different in his next interview. We just dont know. But that was his we do have his first response, his first blush response was, no, im not going to do that, but we will see after he talks to his advisers and it marinates. I can see its marinating with you, john berman. I dont think it will happen. Scott jennings, kaitlan collins, paul begala, thank you very much. It is time to fact check the candidates, last hour we discussed Vice President mike pence now we take a closer look at senator Kamala Harriss claims and john avalon has our reality check. Hi again, john. Hey, guys. Last nights vp debate was a game of donnell ball, quick pivots, hits and misses. The economy is still issue number one in the election and here was Kamala Harriss attack. Because of a socalled trade war with china america lost 300,000 manufacturing jobs. We are in a manufacturing recession. Relationship status on this one is complicated. Under President Trump we saw an initial gain of 483,000 manufacturing jobs, but manufacturing was in a recession back in january after trade war losses and before covid. Since then weve seen the bottom fall out, giving trump a net loss of 164,000 manufacturing jobs today. Now, pence pressed harris on whether a Biden Administration would try to pack the Supreme Court and she, like biden in the last debate, wouldnt answer. Thats probably because they want to leave the option open regardless its a question for Congress Rather than the president , but its an open question. And then theres this hit. They would impose the Green New Deal. They want to abolish fossil fuels and ban fracking. Biden does have a 1. 7 trillion Climate Change proposal that calls fournette zero Carbon Emissions by 2050 but its not the same as the Green New Deal which he opposes. His plan has no federal jobs guarantees or singlepayer health care, for example and like wise biden does not support a ban on fracking but Kamala Harris did support a ban on fracking on public lands while running for senate. We actually do know what failure looks like in a pandemic. It was 2009, the swine flu arrived in the United States. Okay. If thats got you scratching your head its because there were about 60 million swine flu cases in obamas first year but there were just under 12,500 deaths. I compared that to more than 211,000 in the current covid crisis its just not the same thing. But perhaps the biggest whopper of the night occurred in this exchange. Lets talk about respecting the American People. You respect the American People when you tell them the truth. You respect the American People when you have the courage which weve always done. To be a leader. Weve always done. All right. There are about 20,000 reasons to call bs on that claim. If only there was a quote to sum up the problem with this spin. Youre entitled to your own opinion but you are not entitled to your own facts. And thats your reality check. John, thank you very much for bringing us all of that. I know you had a late night. Okay. Pete buttigieg played the part of mike pence do you recall senator harris debate prep. Did he get it right in mayor pete joins us live next. Ack my now with the ww app, you can use voice commands. Get personalized recipes and more lose weight the way thats easiest for you. Join for free and get three months free hurry offer ends october 12th try optum perks. Its a new way to save up to 80 . And everyone can do it. Its from optum, a Health Care Company thats trusted by millions of people. You dont have to sign up for anything. Just go to optumperks. Com. And get a coupon to use at your pharmacy. Thats it. I opted in. I opted in. You can, too. Opt in and save big today. Breaking news. The Biden Campaign says the former Vice President will participate in a virtual debate. Again, the president ial Debate CommissionJust Announced that if a debate is to happen next thursday night as scheduled, it will be virtual, remote. Both candidates in separate remote locations. Why . Because the president has coronavirus and at least as of now we expect is still contagious, so the Biden Campaign says that the Vice President would do it, but President Trump just moments ago said no. Listen. I heard that the commission a little while ago changed the debate style and thats not acceptable to us. Youre not going to participate . No, im not going to waste my time on a virtual debate. Thats not what debating is all about, you sit behind a computer and do a debate, its ridiculous and then they cut you off whenever they want. Again, that was the statement from the president , the Biden Campaign their statement reads, Vice President biden looks forward to speaking directly to the American People and comparing his plan for bringing the country together and Building Back better with Donald Trumps failed leadership on the coronavirus that has thrown the Strong Economy he inherited into the worst downturn since the great depression. Again, the Biden Campaign says that biden will or would do the virtual debate. Joining me now is former democratic president ial candidate pete buttigieg. He stood in for Vice President pence during the debate prep for senator Kamala Harris. Mayor, thank you very much for being with us. A whole lot of breaking news just happened in the last five minutes. Can i get your reaction . Its a big deal. When a president backs out of a scheduled debate. I know the format has changed, but its still a big deal. Whats your take . Well, you know, the first debate went poorly for the president and maybe its a sign of waving the white flag, maybe its posturing because, you know, they can create a little bit more noise around this. I think the bottom line is what were seeing again and again is that whenever theres a choice between doing something in a more safe way when it comes to covid or a less safe way, whether we are talking about debating or whether we are talking about wearing masks, whether its the president or whether its the American People they always seem to lean toward whatever is less responsible and less safe and thats one of the reasons why we have a less Effective Response than any other country in the developed world. I think weve shown and certainly the Biden Harris Campaign has been remarkably adept at using virtual means to continue campaigning and next that in with safe inperson c