for first-time unemployment benefits just in the last week alone. you can see that all over the place. relaxed certainty on how many people are getting through. if i add this to the millions of other people over the past three weeks that have been asking for help, we could be talking up to 23 million people in the space of four weeks filing for first-time benefits. we are looking potentially at an unemployment rate in the united states of 17%. just imagine what we're seeing. just in the space of four weeks. what that means for the people involved and the worst part of this, alisyn, we're not done yet. we know states are struggling to process these claims. in the past hour, i've had a number of freelancers contact me and say in my state, i still can't get through. that could be a further 23 million people. we've got another hour and a half to wait until we get the numbers. but devastating, again, for everyone involved is the message. >> julia chatterley for us. please keep us posted throughout the morning. joining us now is the director of vaccine research clinic at university of alabama at birmingham. and dr. richelle wa len ski at massachusetts general hospital. we just got an economic report. but it's directly tied to the medical reality in this country this morning. so much so that business leaders, dr. wolensky told the president, they need to see more testing before they're comfortable reopening at the levels the president wants to right now. more than 60% of americans are not comfortable returning to old routines just yet. why is testing, in your mind, so important to reopen an office? >> good morning, john. good morning, alisyn. i think there are two kinds of testing we're talking about. we need to understand how much antibody is out there, how many people might have been exposed. presuming that antibody gives us protection against being exposed quickly again. before a vaccine were to become available. we need to understand how many might be immune. that helps us understand how crowded we can be, how much protection is out there in the population. we then need the viral swab, the swab everyone has been talking about to understand how many might have the disease right now. because of these data that in fact people might be able to transmit before they have symptoms or maybe they might get no symptoms at all, we need to understand how many people might be transmitting asymptomatically. for that, we need a lot of tests. meaning, i might test today because i don't have symptoms. i might test tomorrow and not have symptoms. we're talking about millions of tests. >> doctor, let's talk about that. this new study published in nature of medicine has gotten a lot of people's attention. the idea that the highest viral load a patient exhibits from throat swabs is two days before they exhibit any symptoms. okay. that sounds to me -- you're the medical expert. that sounds to me like a game changer in terms of how could we ever know who has the virus if it's before they have symptoms. by the way, why were people being tested two days before they showed any symptoms? how do we have this information? >> yes. thank you, alisyn. those are all great points. this is an interesting study that was done in china, published in nature medicine. it did show that the majority of virus seems to be shedding prior to the onset of symptoms which would explain a lot. that really explains why -- goes a long way to understand why this is a pandemic. how they got them to test before had to do with context. there were context of people who came down with the infection and they started testing them on a regular basis and found out that they were shedding virus before they developed symptoms. so that really explains why there's so many infections that a lot of people i talked to will -- who have gotten infected, they tell me, i got infected. i don't know anybody who was sick. that happens a lot. this explains that. >> is the answer to the question that alisyn asked, how can we know who has it if you're not seeing symptoms? you have to start testing who are asymptomatic. which means in my office right, the person in the cubicle next to me, in this case, alisyn camerota, does she need to be tested even though she's not symptomatic for me to feel comfortable coming back to work? >> i think that's what we're getting at. when you start thinking about people who work in crowded places, who might be in the restaurant industry, who might be teachers, who might be working sporting events, that's the kind of testing we're talking. we're not just talking once a month. we're talking potentially once every other day to really be able to detect this really early, isolate those folks, contact trace the people who they might have exposed and quarantine them. when we're talking about that level of intervention that we need, you need a lot of tests. >> i find this conversation to be frustrating. i don't mean our exact one at this moment. i mean the one we've been having for weeks. we don't have enough testing. >> yes. we all need testing to feel comfortable to go back. we don't have it. we don't have the capacity for it. we don't have the capacity to manufacture it right now. so that's why i always veer, dr. goep fert to treatment and to a vaccine. because somehow that feels as though we're fast tracking that even more than the capacity for testing. i know your finger is on the pulse of the vaccine and first let's talk about the treatment, your colleagues are working on the remdesivir. we've heard about that drug and that may be able to be employed. is that our best hope? >> well, recommend did he say dir, we're testing people who are hospitalized. that's a flack shonn of the people out -- fraction of the people out there with the disease. i don't think it will be much helpful, at least the way we're using it right now to sort of get us back to work. however, remdesivir could be a useful drug to help people survive. we should -- because the trial has been enrolling throughout this country and other parts of world, we should have an answer to that question within a month or so. the vaccine development -- and let me also mention that vaccines are going to be a little bit longer off, unfortunately. i think we can gear up testing much more rapidly than we can get a vaccine. remember, antibody testing, as dr. walensky mentioned, we don't have a reliable antibody test right now. although that's coming on board, too. that would be tremendously helpful in getting us back to work. to get off this quarantine stuff. but vaccines take a while. there's several vaccines now, about five that are being tested in phase one, which is just safety. we'll know the results of that in a couple months. month or two maybe. after that, you have to do another phase of testing, which takes a couple months and finally, you have to test for efficacy and you have to have enough cases to test a vaccine for efficahe have kaefficacy. >> what have your preliminary tests shown of remdesivir? >> i mean, there's no way to know preliminarily. half the patients get placebo, half of them get the remdesivir active drug. i don't know who gets what. there's no way for me to tell what's going on. that's the way we've enrolled internationally over 700 patients, close to 800 patients now. >> that's the way you do testing. it's interesting for people to see it in real-time. you're agreeing, you're nodding dr. walensky. >> i want to reiterate that we're in a point right now where the virus is winning, right? we need a multipronged plan of attack. none of them can we let off the gas. we need antibody testing, we need vie row logic testing, we need treatment and a vaccine. i think we need to go full steam ahead on all of them. right now we're losing the battle. >> i mean, that is discouraging, obviously, to hear. that the virus is winning. we can see that with our own eyes from the people that we all know and interview who are getting sickened. the governors saying how hard it's going to be to restart the economy and let people go outside. but i mean, again, dr. walensky, don't you get discouraged by saying the vast, widespread testing you'll need and then knowing we're nowhere close to it? >> well, yes and no. you know, here's sort of the way i see it. we didn't know about this virus until january 1. when you look at the extraordinary scientific discovery that has happened, the tests that we have already, the treatments that we're testing in clinical trials, the fact that we have vaccines already in phase 1. nobody would have predicted that was possible. you look at somebody who has diabetes for example. they test their blood sugars at home four times a day. we know those kinds of tests, we know that testing at a massive scale it possible in other situations. so i think we have the potential to get there. i don't think that that -- that we've lost that potential. i think we have to -- if not get there immediately. really understand that we need to sort of have the social distancing in place until we get there. and be patient with that. >> dr. walensky, i wonder if you can weigh in on a new bit of information received overnight. that comes from south korea. that 114 people there who had recovered from coronavirus and covid-19. they were sick and got better. or at least they had it and got better, recovered. have now tested positive again for the virus. can you explain exactly what that means? because obviously, one of the things we're concerned about is the question of whether you can get it again once you've had it. >> right. it's really interesting. i think we're going to be following this carefully. we know from relatively small animal studies that if you rechallenge animals who have had it before, they didn't get it. they were small studies in animals. i think there are a couple of things that could be happening with the south korean study. one is did they document the fact that they cleared virus to begin with? we know people can shed virus on average about three weeks and sometimes over a month after they've been infected. so is it the case that they actually did completely clear their virus and are now shedding it again, or is it the case that they've been reinfected or is it the case that they cleared but didn't fully clear? i think we really need to understand where in their disease course and whether it is reinfection or persistent infection? >> that would be helpful. that changes the alarm bells. because if these are just traces of the virus that they are still shedding, then that's one story. that's different than them not having immunity and getting reinfected. >> yes. i think it's also important to point out that in any type of viral infection, not everybody develops protective immunity. that's why we need things like vaccines and the community protection. i don't know the details of this study. but it is possible, another possibility is that these individuals didn't develop the type of antibody protection that's necessary to protect them from a sdweubsequent infection. it's possible that the majority of people are developing those antibodi antibodies. we don't know. i think dr. walensky rightly pointed out, this is a new pandemic. it's been january 1. we're learning a lot very quickly. i feel confident we'll get ahead of this virus. >> we're learning a lot thanks to doctors like the both of you. thank you so much for being with us. we really appreciate it. >> be sure to join anderson cooper and dr. sanjay gupta for a town hall tonight at 8:00 p.m. joe biden will join them. as well as facebook founder and ceo mark zuckerberg and dr. priscilla chan. how facebook and the zuckerberg/chan initiative are working to fight the coronavirus. this virus is hitting the underserved communities so hard. what's being done to make sure help gets where it's needed most. that's next. you know when your dog is itching for an outing... or itching for some 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cough any, not an orchestra. my heart aches over the chaos in the response. that doctor, derrick angus joins me now. he's at university of pittsburgh, school of medicine. he's a lead. covid-19 trial testing multiple therapies. thanks for being with us. explain to me what you mean by chaos. >> sure, john. first of all, it's not just at the national level. aits the international level. so as you and everyone knows, we have no active treatment for covid-19. we've got plenty of yts about what drugs might work, but we need to test these drugs in trials. otherwise, we're bungling along not knowing what works. the drug you hear about a lot is hydroxychloroquine. it's a synthetic version of quikwie nine. we thought it was a good idea for the spanish flu. 100 years later, we still don't know if it works. we have three problems with trying to do trials. the first is these trials themselves are hard, but when we try to do them, hundreds of people are having ideas about trials, but they're all in competition with one another, rather than collaborating with each other. finally, we're using trial designs that make people uncomfortable a lot of times at the bedside. no one wants to be 50/50 to get out of an -- in an active treatment tore placebo group. >> no one wants to be the place >> there's a notion it's supposed to be the national institutes of health. the director says i think we have the necessary clout to steer this ecosystem. i want to know what works and i want it answered by june or july. is that not where the direction is coming from? >> i can't -- it would be fantastic. i think they could have the clout. but that's certainly not what's happening right now. what's happening right now at university centers all over the country is physicians are being asked to participate in hundreds of different trials. they can't even choose which one to enroll in. there are 94 trials registered for testing hydroxychloroquine. i've never heard of any drug needing 94 separate trials in the same disease. >> do you think -- that's interesting. i hadn't heard that. do you think there's an overemphasis at the national, perhaps nonmedical level on hydroxychloroquine and have you seen any evidence in the some 94 trials that you're talking about that it works? >> we have no evidence at this point and the problem is, if you're trying to do lots of little trials, that's not as efficient or as useful as trying to do large coordinated trials. we've had over 2 million confirmed cases of covid-19, mainly in north america and europe. and yet, barely more than a few thousand of these 2 million patients have been enrolled in clinical trials. >> talk to me about what you're doing, the testing you're involved in right now. >> so we have tried to join in within international effort to design called a remap effort. remap trials are adaptive platform trials that test multiple therapies simultaneously and try to give as many patients as possible at least one potentially active treatment. so that there's hardly anyone in the so-called placebo group. this trial then also learns as this goes, getting rid of therapies or combinations of therapies that don't do too well and favoring over time those therapies that are doing better. we feel this is an easier trial design for patients and doctors to get involved in. what we've been doing in pittsburgh is trying to put it right inside the health record so the whole thing takes place across the entire system, not just in the big teaching hospitals, but in our small community hospitals so that any patient with covid-19 can potentially participate in these therapies. >> do you have any early signs? i know the way trials are conducted. i know you're smiling already. you get asked this question a lot. any sense of what has been working in any of these trials? >> no. look, that sounds depressing to say i don't know. we can find out -- there are 2 million people already who have this disease. if even one in ten has been able to participate in a trial, we could have gone through about 100 different drugs by now and known definitively which ones worked or not. but as it is, at this point, we could be excited about the potential of some but we can't tell among the hundreds of ideas, we have no idea which one is the best. >> if you could answer one question right now, if you could ring a magic bell and get the answer to one question about coronavirus this morning, what would it be? >> you mean other than how can we have lots of tests for everyone? >> other than that. >> for treatment, it would still be great to have a safe, easy to take antiviral that patients could take as soon as they have symptoms to avoid getting sick in the first place. that would still be an incredible -- >> i take it from your other comment, you still don't think there's enough tests in the country? >> there's not enough tests in the country or anywhere in most of the world to effectively engage in smart or precision public health. >> dr. derek angus. this is an education. i really appreciate your time this morning helping us understand. it's been really, really enlightening. >> you're most welcome, john. thanks. what did china know about coronavirus and when did they tell their citizens? if not the world. a live report from china with the facts, next. wasting time. that's why td ameritrade designed a first-of-its-kind, personalized education center. their award-winning content is tailored to fit your investing goals and interests. and it learns with you, so as you become smarter, so do its recommendations. so it's like my streaming service. well except now, you're binge learning. for a limited time, get up to $800 when you open and fund an account. call 866-300-9417 or visit tdameritrade.com/learn. ♪ that's why working together ist more important than ever. at&t is committed to keeping you connected. so you can keep your patients cared for. your customers served. your students inspired. and your employees closer than ever. our network is resilient. our people are strong. our job is to keep your business connected . it's what we've always done. it's what we'll always do. why accept it frompt an incompyour allergy pills?e else. flonase sensimist. nothing stronger. nothing gentler. nothing lasts longer. flonase sensimist. 24 hour non-drowsy allergy relief let's be honest. quitting smoking is hard. like, quitting every monday hard. quitting feels so big. so try making it smaller, and you'll be surprised at how easily starting small can lead to something big. start stopping with nicorette. we're expecting another devastating weekly jobless report in the next hour that could wipe out all the job gains of the past several years. economists are forecasting 4 to 8 million americans will have filed for unemployment in the last week. many of the newly unemployed are small business owners. we hear about their stories. what did you learn, vanessa? >> good morning, alisyn. those numbers coming out in about an hour now are going to be in the millions from the department of labor. many of them small business owners trying to figure out, one, how to save their business, but also how to save their personal livelihood. >> everything is just prospering and just growing. >> everything was actually really good. >> business is great. >> for these small business owners, it all came crashing down. like many businesses around the country, covid-19 changed everything. >> like apocalyptic. it was the scariest day ever. >> americans who are self-employed, gig workers or freelancers can now apply for unemployment. anna castillo is one of them. her family owns a cruise parking lot in miami. but with no cruises, her income is zero. >> me and my parents have put blood, sweat and tears into not only coming to the country and building something for themselves but in general, it was built from their savings, from every penny they've ever worked for. >> how business works. >> christina owns a p.r. company in atlanta and business is slow. as a single mom to a 9-year-old, she's the family's bread winner. she hasn't heard back from unemployment and rainy day fund is drying up. >> i would say by the end of april, maybe first weeks of that will be gone. >> christopher payne is in the same boat. >> the bills don't stop between now and then. the money is rapidly wiping out. >> his gaming shop in north carolina is a month away from shutting down. >> i applied for the ppp, the loan and the grant and i've also applied for unemployment. nothing has worked out at this point. >> with the backup in unemployment processing, payne believes he's weeks away from a check. >> if the unemployment came through, i would be able to turn all of that money into money that i would use for my business. >> 43% of small business owners say they have less than six months until they'll close because of covid-19. according to a survey by the u.s. chamber of commerce. for some, the pure will to survive could be enough. >> failing is not something in my radar or in the back of my mind. i know i won't be that 40 to 50%. >> for others, the wound may be too deep. >> it's not just like the business. it's like the people behind it. everything that they do to provide a service to you and to make a living for themselves. i would say support your local business. >> small businesses are running out of lifelines, john. they are having to string together multiple federal, state, local programs, one including the payroll protection program that the federal government fundied with $350 billion. that fund is already close to drying up and with these small business owners still waiting for their unemployment checks and not having access to these federal dollars, a lot of them are wondering how they're going to be able to survive this, john. >> that money is drying up. there are discussions of getting new money but they're concerned that the initial batch of money wasn't distributed in exactly the ways that were most optimal. vanessa yurk vich being thank you for that report. really important to see those stories. a new report from the associated press says that china knew about the potential scope of the coronavirus threat but sat on the critical information for six days before alerting citizens. david culver live in shanghai with the details. you've been there from the beginning, david. what have you learned? >> reporter: i'll walk you through this report, john. coming from the a.p. based on what they characterize as a leaked memo from a confidential teleconference involving the head of china's national health commission. cnn has gone through the public report from that teleconference which highlights the worries expressed by health officials to other leaders six days before officials alerted the public here. here's what we know of what china knew. take you back to december 8. the wuhan government notes the first patient symptoms of the then unknown virus. nearly a month later, january 3rd, wuhan health officials stressed, there is no obvious human to human transtransmissio. on the same day, they notified the u.s. of the virus. then the first public awareness known. a week later, january 14th, this is the teleconference we're talking about. the government release says a sober understanding of the situation was made known to top government officials. they add that clustered cases suggest that human to human transition is possible. here's the concern. publicly as late as january 19th, four days after that teleconference, the wuhan health commission said the outbreak was controllable, preventable, not contagious. then the next day, we see a very different narrative come out. leading health officials acknowledge cases of human to human transmission and stress that medical personnel had gotten infected. three days later, wuhan went on lockdown. as of now, we know that china's foreign ministry, they say it has been an open, transparent and responsible handling. china has kept the w.h.o. and relevant countries updated on the outbreak. that's how they're couching this, john. >> you can see by the timeline, there appear to be gaps in terms of how things were explained and when. david, it's interesting. in this country, there's a discussion about how and when to reopen. there's some alarm among the community by being told, you know, if we do open a restaurant, for instance, it's not going to be like it was before. people want things to be back to normal. but as you've seen in china, that's hard to do. it means extraordinary measures. >> reporter: it is hard to do. i want to show you, though, some video that's two months old. the reason it's relevant for you guys now. this is possibly what you'll be going through of the it's a restaurant experience that we had when we first came to shanghai. it was a rather lonely experience because restaurants were just starting to reopen. as the governor of california suggested, people will be wearing face masks. that's something we're seeing here still. you go in, you record your name, your temperature, your cell phone number. that's all part of that contact tracing so that they can track you. then when you sit down, the first thing that comes to the table is hand sanitizer. the appetizer, if you will, you use it before touching the menu and after touching the menu. one of the things they were doing early on, which has since stopped, they would keep a buffer space between you and other diners. so several tables would sit empty intentionally so they could keep that social distancing and they would limit the party size. the restaurant we went to, for example, you couldn't have more than four people at a table, john. >> interesting to see, david. maybe a window into our future. david culver, thanks so much for that report. coronavirus is hitting underserved communities so hard. what's being done to help ensure that help gets where it's needed most? that's next. ♪ but if you look to the land, it's a whole 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>> alisyn, first of all, thank you and respect you and all women journalists around the country, around the world for all that you do. there was a pandemic of poverty and institutionalized racism before coronavirus hit our shore. what we have to do now is find and fund a cure for both. it has been challenging to say the least for what we've been launching on the ground. because we've seen communities who always come together, but still have so much challenges on themselves. and what do i mean by that? this is everything from the family that is of the essential worker and god blez our essential workers, whether you're a health care hero or grocery worker, someone at the airport, a restaurant. when you leave and have two children at home, what happens to the child for remote learning? what happens to the small businesses that have not had the support because the federal government didn't help us fast enough. what about the person with no food to eat. so alisyn, been hit hard but we understand in the bronx things happen. we're going to find a way to overcome these challenges due to coronavirus. >> let's dive into that a little bit. what is happening for children in the bronx? if they don't have access to a laptop, how are they doing remote learning and how are they being fed right now? >> so for education, obviously, we have to figure out a faster way to get devices out to everyone. we have been incredibly frustrated by the delay. part of it, unfortunately, is because workers doing the process and delivery became ill. then we have to figure this out. if you don't have a laptop or tablet as of yet, they're essentially giving you paper to go home and complete the assignments. but the challenge, alisyn is that we are currently only tracking engagement and not true attendance and progress. wee always tell people there's a difference between activity and progress. if we made sure that the child had a tablet in their book bag rather than arrest them for a dime bag, there would be better priorities here. within that, there's the food challenges. so we are giving out 17,000 meals a day in the bronx due to our partnership with world central kitchen. with here to here, dream yard, bronx -- so many different restaurants. mont haven bar and grill. we've surpassed 325,000 meals. we've given them out since march 17th. we have to keep going. so we encourage everyone in the bronx to obviously follow us or wc kitchen and god bless chef joez jose an drez. we're going to get tablets out through dream yard. >> that's a herculean effort that you are engaging. let's talk about the $2 trillion of stimulus funds, the relief. the financial relief from the federal government that is supposed to be going out to people, you know, in dire situations. why isn't that trickling down to the bronx? >> unfortunately, alisyn, it's not trickling down because i don't think donald trump cares if black and brown people die and doesn't care if black and brown businesses die. when you think about the ppp program, it has not worked at all significantly on the ground and thank god for partners like michael brady at third avenue bid for demetrius julius at spring bank. we need to find creative ways on the ground. we've launched a relief effort to help with this as well. led by derrick lewis and julie diamond foundation and others to help our small businesses not being assisted. >> mr. blake, sorry to interrupt. explain that to us. i understand you're relying on fill philanthropy p and thank gr the folks who are helping. why wouldn't the federal money make it to the bronx to understand the disconnect. >> when you have a cash economy, a restaurant, barbershop, beauty salon, everyone has to sign up with a 1099 contractor is unrealistic. you have an immigrant community that have not been able to be engaged and are afraid of the government. therefore, they're not online. the larger banks, first come, first serve approach did not engage with us on the ground at all. it was not sufficient technology to help our smaller banks with applications. only 70 applications were approved in the bronx when there's more than 23,000. that demonstrates a broader problem. it's the reason why we co-authored an op-ed in newsweek to say that the next cares act can be an assault or lifeline on black and brown businesses. we have to partner financial technology companies with the community development financial institutions so that the next bill actually provide relief in the way it's needed. what's happening right now, donald trump is not working and our black and brown businesses are on the verge of extinction in the bronx and so many communities of color if we don't resolve this immediately. >> thank you for sounding the alarm for us and explaining how your community feels forgotten during all of this. we appreciate talking to you. >> thank you, alisyn. we want to take a moment to remember people lost to the coronavirus. billy birmingham was an emt in kansas city since 1998. he's the first city employee to succumb to the virus. the city's firefighter memorial was turned on in birmingham's honor. he was 69. he had seven kid, more than a dozen grandchildren and great grandchildren. >> david was 49 years old. he loved to fish and be around family. his daughter says he was initially turned away for treatment. eve eventually, he was put on a breathing machine. his organs started shutting down and his heart gave out. david's widow juanita is still battling the virus from a medically induced coma. a beloved member of the bedford, new york community managing a hardware store. i can tell you from personal experience he was delightful. always smiling. always helpful. never made you feel silly or incompetent. even when you were asking something silly or incompetent. the store says the outpouring of love and memories is a true testimony to his sincerity, his authenticity and the relationship he made with so many. his big smile and welcoming heart will be sorely missed. douglas childs made things better. we'll be right back. america's oldest lighthouse has weathered many storms. seeing the break in the clouds before anyone else. together, we'll weather this storm. easy to let fear in timesgrip our hearts.is fear of sickness, fear of lack, fear of the unknown. but when fear and anxiety try to plague our every thought. we can remember this one important truth, and that is god is with us... he is with us, he is for us, he loves us and he invites us to enter into his rest. we're not alone, when the storm rages he offers us peace and refuge in the midst of it. he promises hope and strength to those who turn to him. what is god saying in this crisis? among the answers must be this promise. do no fear, for i am with you: do not be afraid, for i am your god. and i will strengthen you; and i will surely help you. turn to him today. working day in, day out.e. at&t is here. providing support with advanced services for first responders. and connected temporary hospitals, mobile testing sites and emergency management centers. because until their job is done, it is essential that we all have their backs. it's what we've always done. it's what we'll always do. tums ver(bell rings)la stick when heartburn hits fight back fast... ...with tums chewy bites... beat heartburn fast tums chewy bites bleacher report update brought to you by tums, for fast heartburn relief. >> so the nation's top infectious disease expert dr. anthony fauci giving a little hope to sports fans. >> there is a way of doing that. nobody comes to the stadium. put them in big hotels, you know, wherever you want to play, keep them very well surveilled and mainly surveillance but have them tested like every week and make sure they don't wind up infecting each other or their family and let them play the season out. >> that's dr. anthony fauci talking to peter hamby about a plan being discussed by major league baseball to play games in arizona. joining us to discuss what that would look like, christine brennan, sports columnist for "usa today," the governor of arizona doug ducey is open to this idea. it is not impossible that this happens, put all the players in hotels, test them all the time, play games in empty stadiums in arizona, how would this work? what do you see as the benefits and perhaps the pitfalls? >> there is a chance that this could happen and i think right now for where we are in our society and our world, i think a chance -- a little slice of optimism is probably a really good thing. i think we're going to get used to another term here soon, in addition to social distancing and other catch phrases of our last month or so, and it will be spectatorless sports. i think this is the only chance we have for the time being with professional sports. dr. fauci has said this as well. and the idea would be that it would look a little weird on television, but you have the games, and i know you know this as well as anyone, as a sports fan, basically sports is a tv entity. it is television for most people. a lot of us love going to games, but most fans don't. and so the idea that it is a tv show actually is not that foreign to many fans and even people who just would love a distraction from being at home right now. >> i've been practicing spectatorless sports for my whole life by not watching. so -- but even i recognize, even i recognize that this is the life blood of american culture. and that this is one of the universal experiences that people like to all gather around and celebrate together. so, christine, i mean you think that -- will it make a big difference if there is nobody in the stands or will everybody still enjoy it? >> alisyn, it will look strange at first and i think we'll get used to it very, very quickly. there are golf tournaments you watch, you see no one around a green. as fans, they're not sitting there, standing there at that particular moment. there certainly are early season men's and women's basketball games in the tournament where you see big gaps where the fans from the other team are going to come later. i think that's a very minor point in this conversation. i think we'll get used to it. the bigger issue is if someone tests positive. you're going to -- you got 30 major league baseball teams theoretically in arizona. what happens if a hotel worker tests positive. you're in a big hotel, but now that person has been delivering meals to the rooms of the players, that's what we saw with the nba. of course, keep in mind the -- sports really kicked us off, that was march 11th when the nba said it was shutting down and i think it woke the world up, woke the country up to what was going on with coronavirus. so sports may well be the way back, but it also, i think, there are a lot of lessons learned in march that we need to take into may, june, july. >> two quick points. one, i'm a soccer fan also. sometimes european games, soccer games are played in empty stadiums because of violence reasons but they do it. it can be done and people will still watch on tv and we all need the distraction. your point about what happens if someone gets sick. that's real. it is also proximate because we learned the first nfl player that we know about has tested positive, brian alan, i think a center for the rams, has tested positive. that would create a whole series of problems. you can keep fans separate from this, but you can't keep players from each other. they're all over each other during the game. they're shedding all kinds of things from their bodies when hitting each other and grappling. >> without a doubt, john. that just happened, we learned that over the last 8, 12 hours about alan, the rams center. so that is exactly what happened a month ago, past is prologue. we saw that with the nba. reason the nba shut down on march 11th, because of a positive test and the dominos fell soon after. pretty much every sport was shut down. if we decide to gear up and i know everyone would like to see that in a healthy environment, once, of course, our people on the front lines get all of these supplies they need, once we gear up with sports, what happens? key question what happens when there is another positive test like the one in the nfl? and what does that do? does that shut us back down? these are the key questions that these commissioners, that our officials, that dr. fauci and others have to deal with before they can definitively say that sports are back. >> and have they figured out what they would do. this is a very real probability and they have seen it already happen. >> they're playing a lot of different models, different scenarios, but i don't think they know. i think the bottom line on this is we have to tell sports fans, people are -- i get it all the time from people, alisyn, wanting to know, emails and texts and whatever, when are sports coming back? the answer is we just don't know. golf, because those acres and acres of a golf course, they have been social distancing even before there was social distancing. the game of golf. we may well see men's and women's golf tournaments come back before anything else. >> i think the interesting answer to the question what could happen to team sports is someone ended up positive, it is testing, it is the same thing affecting every level of society now, the medical story and the economic story of sports is going to come back. it is going to take mass testing. fingers crossed because i think these games could be some of the most watched games in history. christine brennan, thank you for being with us. >> thank you very much, john and alisyn. we are minutes away from what is expected to be a devastating report on unemployment. "new day" continues right now. it is difficult to imagine us getting together in the thousands anytime soon. >> they are going to unveil new guidelines. the president has been hinting he believes there are some states that can reopen. >> we want the states to administer these tests and if we're not happy, we'll take very strong action against a state. >> why doesn't the president want to go near testing? because testing is a quagmire. no one can bring it up to scale quickly. >> checks are starting to be cut by the treasury department. we have almost 17 million americans who are out of work. >> so much of the transmission occurs from asymptomatic people. perhaps the way to really put this fire out is to start testing asymptomatic people. >> this is "new day" with alisyn camerota and john berman. >> good morning, everyone. welcome to our viewers in the united states and all around the world. this is your "new day." we begin with the crippling effect of the coronavirus pandemic on the u.s. economy. and the debate over when and how to get americans back to work. president trump will announce new federal guidelines today, but governors and even major business leaders are warning the president that widespread testing needs to happen first before they are willing to reopen. dr. deborah birx says they have identified nine states with fewer than 1,000 confirmed cases, she did not spell out at the time which

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