from penn state university. that doesn't add up. let's go "outfront." good evening, everyone. i'm erin burnett. "outfront" tonight, party time. both sides spinning the health care verdict. the president celebrating his individual mandate ruling at the supreme court. >> today, i'm as confident as ever that when we look back five years from now or ten years from now or 20 years from now, we'll be better off because we have the courage to pass this law and keep moving forward. >> and republicans seeing a way to rally the base. after all, this is now a fight for the underdog. hey, the supreme court failed to repeal what republicans see as a hated health care act. a big overreach of big government. but if you like mitt romney, he is going to slay the health care dragon. >> what the court did not do on its last day in session, i will do on my first day if elected president of the united states. >> well, that was pretty loud and clear. both sides were celebrating. partying it up. like guys at a bachelor party. but the problem is no one was a winner today. and soon they're going to wake up feeling pretty hung over. in fact, just like how the party ended in, well, "the hangover." >> you okay, buddy? >> no, i am in so much pain right now. look at this place. >> i know. phil, they have my credit card downstairs. i am so screwed. >> how does a tiger get in the bathroom? he almost killed me. >> yeah, we just woke up with a tiger in america's bathroom. in all seriousness, the point is this, we're all losers. why? because even if you love what this health care bill does, things like covering pre-existing conditions, you have to hate what it does not do. because it does not deal with surging health care costs in america. as we've been saying, in our country where we spend the most on health care per person than any developed country on earth, we rank number 27 in life expectancy. more people are covered, thanks to the supreme court ruling? which may be a great thing. but under the so-called affordable health care act. health care analyst dan rip says premiums will rise 7.5% a year. four times more than the inflation rate. and the spending is getting worse. according to the centers for medicare and medicaid services, health spending in 2010 grew about 3.9% from the year before. but in 2014, when the president's health care law takes full effect, spending will jump 7.4%. that is a massive fail. nick gillespie is editor-in-chef of reason tv and reason.com. ben smith is buzz feed editor in chief. roland martin is political analyst at cnn. erick erickson is also. but also the editor of red state.com. great to have you with us. ben, let me start with you. obviously, quick to have victory laps going on both sides. republicans are trying to say, oh, look the supreme court gets you off, obama, only because you're raising taxes on the middle class. will that stick? >> no, this isn't an issue mitt romney can fight and win. he passed a very similar law in massachusetts. i think both he and the president are going to want to stop talking about this after the holiday weekend. the winner is john roberts. who really set up the court and set up himself for this much increased stature. i think the political campaign is going to move away from this fast. >> erick, it may be that roberts was the only real winner today. >> oh, i think roberts was probably the only real winner today. the republicans are going to make the democrats own this. let's not forget the big issue here isn't just going to be presidential races but ballot races in the house and the senate where the democrats still have more seats at stake in the senate. most of them don't like raising taxes. you can bet the republicans will make them want to vote again on the biggest health tax increase -- >> you think this will motivate the republican base more than a victory which would have sort of, you know, eliminated the big, hey, if i get an office, i'm going to repeal it, argument? >> oh, yes, absolutely. it has taken the supreme court off the table for the left. it's made it an issue for the right. mitt romney's raised $2 million before sunset today just on this issue. >> start's. and roland, ting latest number is $2.5 million from the mitt romney campaign. i just got an e-mail here. the obama administration is saying -- say you're with me on affordable care. they're trying to raise money. who do you think will benefit more when it comes to fund-raising off this? the winner barack obama or the seeming loser mitt romney? >> i know we love to go right to the heart of the political issue. but, again, i will say the very people out there, the millions of people who are now covered, the folks with pre-existing conditions, the folks who are sitting there, if you're a young person on your parents' health care -- let me tell you something, erin. look, i know how this feels, okay. 2000, covering the democratic national convention. my appendix ruptured. five days in a hospital in l.a. $100,000. no health insurance. had to file for bankruptcy. house almost foreclosed on. i know what it feels like not to have health insurance. and so we can get caught up in the political arena. but the reality is, we now have to deal with people who now can be protected. and so now, how do you fortify this? how do you make it better? how do you bring down costs? this is a start. this is not the end. this is the beginning of a real discussion and real national health care plan. >> nick, the problem is this seems to fall in that category of it's great more people are covered and you want that outcome, but this was done without dealing with the costs. we're looking at costs rising 4% in 2009. 7.4% under this law. kostz costs are going to rise more under this law than they were before. >> if the -- the health care costs are going to be jacked up even more. the government, whether it's state, local or federal, already spends almost 50 cents out of every health care dollar and prices have been going up astronomically, far above the rate of inflation. you bring the government even more into the matter and the prices are only going to spiral up more. then the government will say, well, we got to subsidize rates more. that will jack it up the next time. i think the question for roland to ask -- and i say this, i'm not a republican, i'm not a democrat. my book, which is out in paperback is "the declaration of independence." why would it cost 100 grand to fix your appendix? you know, it's partly because of the heavy subsidies and the government involvement already. to go back to the republicans, mitt romney's the last person you want to be arguing in a world where obamacare has just passed constitutional muster. he has no plan to counter what was just -- you know, what he did at the state level, at the federal level. it's a real problem. >> let's not sit here and we talk about costs going up. but somehow it's only because of the affordable care act. one of the reasons costs are going up in this country. >> that isn't what i said. >> no, i'm not saying you said it. one of the reasons we're seeing rising health care as well is because our nation also is becoming more obese. we also don't want to confront when it comes to wellness. when you begin to deal with the issue of wellness, when you begin to have folks who have regular check-ups, when you begin to have folks where you're able to catch something earlier as opposed to to late in the game, then you're dealing with that. so i say you have to deal with the cost. this is simply the beginning of a process. it's not the end. >> then you're getting issues of saying, okay, look, if we're going to deal with obesity, that means people who weigh more will have to pay more. that is something that just doesn't seem to have muster in this country. >> they can be taxed -- >> learning in the first round of this thing is that any attempts for the government to impose cost controls. death panels so called were the outstanding instance of that. the obama administration backed off very fast. people don't like the idea of the government saying this treatment is cheaper. so we're only going to pay for that. right or wrong. >> erick -- >> there were never death panels. where is that coming from? >> they weren't death panels. they were a small step in that direction -- >> they were imposed to restrain the cost of health care. going forward, i get what roland's saying. when i hear democratic pollsters say that people like individual pieces of health care, that's fine. but the roberts decision means the democrats are going to have to fight on the gop turf on this which is full repeal. 60% of americans in some of the worst polling on obamacare, 60% of americans still don't like the bill overall. they don't like tax increases. we're going to november with the democrats being forced to fight on this republican battlefield. the republicans may need a plan. but right now, their best plan is just to say "repeal it." >> if you're a democrat, erick, you should go to those states with the worst health care and when it comes to the folks in worst condition, mississippi, alabama, louisiana, arkansas, texas, west virginia. you talk about health care. go to those states that are red states. >> the real problem, why health care costs are going up, and roland is right, this was happening long before the affordable health care act was passed. that's going to pour gas on the fire. it's because of increasing government involvement. we all know when the government becomes the main provider of something, costs go up because costs will never be accounted for properly. that's the big issue. get the government out of health care and you'll start to see prices come down. romney can't sell that. the republicans have had plenty of time to do it. the last time they controlled the federal government what did they do? they gave us the prescription drug plan for medicare which is the most egregious handout to relatively wealthy seniors. it gives free or reduced price plans. this is why americans are moving away from the democrats and the republicans. because you hear chatter. it's a red team. it's a blue team thing. and the american people, erin, like you said at the beginning, the american people are the losers. because we're stuck with the bill but we're not going to get the access to care that everybody seems to be after. >> a democrat or a republican will be president. >> that is true, but of course we want to eat what we want and drink what we want and then we want to make sure we have care. we don't want to pay more for it. i mean, there's a big problem. by the way, there's specific reasons health care costs are surging in this country. we're going to talk about it more in just a couple of moments. next, today's vote to hold eric holder in contempt. he says it was all political. the white house says it was all political. why did 17 democrats vote for it? 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[ female announcer ] new ensure clear. nine grams protein. zero fat. twenty-one vitamins and minerals. in blueberry/pomegranate and peach. refreshing nutrition in charge! our second story "outfront." an historic day on capitol hill by a vote of 255-67, the house today for the first time held a sitting attorney general in contempt of congress. this stems from the fast and furious operation, where the government sold about 2,000 guns to drug runners hoping that would lead to breaking up cartels. critics say the attorney general failed to hand over documents related to the operation. all but two republicans voted in favor of contempt. and about 100 democrats didn't even vote. they walked out in protest. but here's the thing. 17 democrats voted in favor of contempt. congressman jason altymyer of pennsylvania was one of them. congressman, good to see you. >> hi, erin, good to be here. >> why did you go against your party? the white house called this vote a political stunt. you voted in favor of contempt. why? >> there were two issues. one is i couldn't get around the fact i'm a member of the house. the house has asked for documents related to the investigation. i understand the attorney general holder doesn't want to give them. he has reasons why he doesn't feel he's obligated to provide them. but the fact is he didn't provide them. and when there's a vote on contempt, that's something you have to consider. we asked for the documents. they were not provided. i hope that the documents will show nothing was inappropriate or wrong regarding the operation or the attorney general's involvement in that. i have no reason to believe that in any way they're going to show anything that we wouldn't want it to show. but he was asked for the documents and he didn't provide them. the second reason is i was here in the congress in 2008 when we had a very similar vote during the bush administration. and the democratic controlled congress had two members, high ranking officials in the bush administration, that we held in contempt under very similar circumstances relating to an issue. and as a result, i had the vote in contempt for that. so i just couldn't reconcile the issue being different just because the political party in power's different. >> well, all right so fair point. you made the bipartisan point. let me ask you about this conspiracy theory. nra has a theory -- national rifle association about fast and furious. they say the obama administration allowed these guns to be sold knowing they'd go into mexico, knowing they'd be used in violent crimes. that would cause bad headlines and allow the government to impose more strict gun regulations here in the united states. do you believe that theory? >> i don't. and that has nothing to do with -- i've heard it. that has nothing to do with the reason i voted the way i did. i cast a similar vote in 2008. it's consistent with the vote i cast today. as a member of the house, i believe we do have the power of the investigation and oversight over the executive branch. we asked for documents that were not provided. because the vote was held on the floor, i voted to hold the attorney general in contempt because he did not comply with our request. >> okay. so the national rifle association. they said today's vote, they're going to look at it when giving letter grades. i know you got an "a" on the last scorecard. i know they've given you about $19,350 over the last four years. i also know you're not running for election. but the nra's support, letter grade, had to matter to you. >> well, as you saidi'm not on the ballot in the fall election. so i don't know how anyone can make the claim that that had anything to do with the vote that i cast today. you have every right to bring that up. but it wasn't part of the reason i voted the way i did. >> you might run again one day, right? >> i have no plans to run again. that had nothing to do with the vote that i cast. i cast again because i want to be consistent with the vote i cast four years ago when president bush was in power. >> look, we applaud the saying, you know, i'm not going to just go with my party, i want to be bipartisan. so i want to make that clear. but i wanted to ask you sort of a personal question. because, you know, when i was looking at your vote, i know a lot people would say, how can you be a democrat and care so much about the nra? how can you be a democrat and want to have a gun? it's the same thing a lot of people say, how could you be gay and be a republican. people just don't understand how those things can go together. does that frustrate you? >> the way you articulated it, if that is a criticism that's being levied, yeah that would concern me. but i haven't heard that in response to the vote. the district that i represent is overwhelmingly in support of the second amendment. i believe there are more nra members per capita in the 100 mile radius surrounding the district that i represent than anywhere else in the country. so i'm just representing my district when i cast votes that the nra would support. again, in this case, i voted that way for consistency and because i believe that it was the right thing to do based on the vote we cast and the issue that's at hand. >> right, no, no, i understand that. i'm just wondering, it was presumably near your district when the president when he was running last time around made the comment about guns and bibles. >> well, i represent western pennsylvania. i believe that that was one of the regions that was part of that articulation. >> yeah, but it must have -- i guess what i'm getting at, does it upset you people want to say negative things about people who have guns? or say if you're a democrat, you can't be for guns. clearly, you're a democrat and they're for guns. >> yeah, again, i was elected as a democrat three times. i had the support of the nra two of those times. and i'm not running for re-election. so that wasn't part of my consideration this time when i cast the vote today. >> all right. well, thank you very much. i really appreciate your taking the time, sir. still "outfront," the decisions made by the obama administration make the surge in afghanistan ineffective. and cost lives and dollars. our guest was there. he tells us why he thinks so. and the number tonight, cars, money, stick shifts. and ferris bueller. 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