Significantly damaged an isisheld building. The u. S. Military has conducted a total of 115 air strikes against isis in iraq. This comes as secretary of state john kerry has written a strongly worded oped in the New York Times calling for more nation nations to help the u. S. Fighting isis. A much fuller response is demanded from the world. No civilized country should shirk its responsibility to help stamp out this disease. As concern over russias actions in ukraine continues to grow, were hearing a frightening warning from one of the top european leaders meeting in belgium today. He says russia is nearing a, quote, point of no return in ukraine. Meanwhile, a cnn team in the port city of maria paul saw ukraine kran forces stre thernt evening defensive positions on the outskirts of the city, reenforcing checkpoints, digging trenches along roads leading toward the russian border. This a day after russians foreign minister denied accusations that they crossed into ukraine despite these nato satellite images that appear to show otherwise. In missouri the fallout continues from questionable Police Actions in the aftermath of Michael Browns death. Another officer retired. You may remember st. Louis county Police Officer dan page from that video youre watching right now that sure faced watching him ranting about president obama as women as many other americans. Page was also seen pushing cnns don lemon during protests in ferguson earlier this month. Standing here all day. Get out of the way. Lets go. Lets go. Thats whats happening here. So people are here lets go. You can see whats happening. We got rights. Weve been standing here all day. They told us to come here. I cant move. A lieutenant, you see him here, he threatened and pointed an Assault Rifle at protesters during the protests. He also retired this week. The third officer in a nearby city was fired after making what he his police chief called very inappropriate Facebook Comments about the protests. For the rest of this hour, we want to focus on a crisis usually not in the headlines, drug as diks. A disease that has grown into a deadly fix for so many addicts. Prescription pill killers, americas newest drug epidemic. Hate to say theyre as american as apple pie, but they are. Theyre not going anywhere. Reporter its growing at an alarming rate, becoming the drug of choice for the younger generation. When did you first notice a problem with your son . In junior high school. Reporter experts say its leading to an explosion of heroin use across the country. How often do you do heroin now . Several times a day. Reporter over the next hour well ride along with police in massachusetts who have seen so many overdoses the state has declared a Public Health emergency. Got a visual on the guy thats selling. Reporter well meet a woman who became so addicted she would meet drug dealers while her grandchildren were in the car. Did you care who was around . Nope. Never worried . I was thinking about one thing and that was heroin. Reporter and discuss what it takes to beat addiction with former broadcaster and recovering addict, pat obrien. This story that youre about to hear shows how addiction can strike anyone. A denver woman found herself hooked on heroin on a road leading to an early grave. She was a mom and a grandmother and she tells the chilling story of going out to score drugs sometimes with her grandkids. Heres cnns anna cabrera. This park is where you would pick up . This is it. How often . Probably twice a week. Reporter cynthia scuto was an all american mom of eight with a deep, dark secret. Did you care who was around . Nope. Never worried . I was thinking about one thing, and that was heroin. Reporter hooked on heroin for nearly a decade. In the beginning it was a feel good. At the end, it was black. Reporter it started innocently enough. She had pain in her hip, scar tissue perhaps from multiple csections. A doctor prescribed oxycontin. But in just two weeks, sciutto wassed a dited. By the im i got to the other doctor she said youre taking enough for three adult men. Are doctors too quick to prescribe a painkiller . Some of them. Reporter he says what happened to scudo is not uncomm uncommon. It acts on the same parts of the brain that cause reenforcement, they cause euphoria. Reporter but heroin is much cheaper. One oxycontin can cost 80 on the street. 100 bucks worth of heroin could last scudo up to three days. Scudo crisscrossed colorado to meet with drug dealers, at park, strip malls, sometimes with her grandchildren in the car. So this is a good place to pick up because youve got sides of houses here, fences. Reporter this mom and grandmom in her mid 40s at the time didnt shoot heroin like some addicts do, she smoked it. I would drive with my knee, hold the foil in one hand, straw in my life, lighter in the other, and i would be driving down i70 going 65 miles an hour smoking heroin. Reporter driven by the drugs for nine years. Scudo thought she was destined to die a drug addict until a wakeup call one day when she looked in the mirror. I was a skeleton. I had this lovely green glow going, so i knew my liver was shutting down. The skin was hanging literally hanging off my body. Something about that moment when i saw myself triggered something in my head. Home away from home. Whats going through your mind . Chaos, hope. For the first time in a long time. Thats what was happening when you first got here . Yeah. I knew i couldnt do it by myself and i didnt know how to do it. Reporter scudo was in rehab for 33 days. This was her intake picture. I threw up every 15 minutes. I would have to live in the shower with the water temperature 120 degrees to burn the skin to not feel the pain in my back. Reporter the physical withdrawal was just the first hurdle. Scudo has worked through a 12step recovery. Its been over three years. No relapses. And scudo, now 55 and a grandmother of 18, has a new appreciation for life. The only way im going to stay clean and sober is to remember where i came from. Anna cabrera with that report. Coming up, broadcaster pat obrien shares his personal struggle with addiction and his remarkable recovery. Plus, marijuana is often called a gateway drug. But a new study says it may actually keep people from trying more dangerous alternatives. When i had my first migraine, i was lucky. That sounds crazy, i know. But my mom got migraines, so she knew this would help. Excedrin migraine starts to relieve my pain in 30 minutes. Plus, sensitivity to light and sound, even nausea. Excedrin migraine works. With a new00 volkswagen turbo. Reward card why are we so obsessed with turbo . Because we like giving you power, but we also like giving you fuel efficiency. 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In fact, Prescription Drug abuse in the country has risen so dramatically the cdc now classifies it as an epidemic. I want to bring in carl hart, associate professor of psychology at Columbia University and in atlanta were joined by dr. Ford vox. Carl, i want to start with you. Were seeing that overall drug use is down. We were talking about this from the 80s definitely but youre seeing Prescription Drug abuse increase. Why is that . Well, when we think about Prescription Drug abuse and drug use, the thing that we measure is people who have used the drug in the past 30 days. The you look at 2002 and you look at now, the rates havent changed that much. But if you start before 2002 it certainly has increased. One of the reasons that it has increased probably because people were smarter. I mean, the fact is, with Prescription Drugs, you know what youre getting. Whereas, street drugs you dont know what youre getting. So thats not necessarily a bad thing. So dr. Vox, what do you think . He says people are smarter. Theyre able to know what theyre getting maybe they wouldnt know whats in elicit street drug. What do you think about that . Part of it may be that people are smarter but a large part of the problem is that physicians really have been dumber over recent years. We have seen an explosion in the prescription of opiod pain medications, another addictive medications as part of an overall plan that were going to stamp out pain all together. Theres been a campaign called pain is the fifth vital sign and we saw a resurgence of boom really in the prescription of these medications starting in the 1990s, rising to the 2000s. And we have created this problem to a large extent thats often easier to prescribe a pill than the root problems of why people want to take the pills. How easy is it for people to get their hands on Prescription Drugs . Its extremely easy and studies indicate that over well over half of these medications are coming either directly from the physicians hands or being handed over by one Family Member to perhaps another friend freely. Physicians have a large responsibility here to recognize that we are the root cause to a large extent of the prescription pill epidemic. And we are starting to pull back, as we should, but that is creating some problems in and of itself. This has to be treated as part of a comprehensive pain program. And really we got to start out with the right diagnosis. Over 100 million americans are in some form of chronic pain. I think that drives a lot of this. I just want to make sure that we understand. Some people say its extremely easy for some people, not everyone. Obviously we want our physicians to be responsible, but i dont want us to get hysterical here such that people dont get the medications that they need. Oftentimes when you have these pseudocrisis, what we have is we have some bad policy that we implement and then we make it more restrictive for people who actually need these medications to control their pain. So i want to make sure that we dont get too craw zi here. Yeah. And some physicians ive heard that, anecdotally, some f physicians are very carefully, whereas others are not. Hydro codoen. According to the International Narcotics control board americans are consuming 99 of it worldwide. So you look at a statistic like that, why is that . We probably consume so much of that because other countries or other people around the country around the world are consuming other types of opiods. When you go to places like switzerland, germany, those places like that, they prescribe things like heroin in some cases. The fact that we prescribe we take 99 of the hydro codone is not surprising. But hiydro codone containss s met fin. That becomes a problem that we fail to talk about. Stick around. Well talk a little more after the break. We will be examining how more states are seeing a shift from people using costly Prescription Drugs in favor of cheaper alternative forms of heroin. [ female announcer ] we help make secure financial tomorrows a reality for over 19 Million People. [ alex ] transamerica helped provide a lifetime of retirement income. So i can focus on what matters most. [ female announcer ] everyone has a moment when tomorrow becomes real. Transamerica. Become a drug addict but its a fate that happens to far too many people. Sometimes it starts innocently with the legal prescription for pain pills but police are seeing firsthand how a doctors good intentions can lead to a constant craving for one of the most dangerous street drugs, heroin. Heres cnns deb feyerick. Coming upside street behind where you are at . Yeah. Reporter its just after dinner on an ordinary thursday night in chelsea, massachusetts. Got the guy, the sell sxwler the buyer, the buyer is i guess he texted them to say hes on the way. Reporter lieutenant david bets and his narcotics officers are gathering intelligence on a controlled drug deal. What do you buy . How much is it . Five bags. Five bags of heroin. Reporter chelsea is north of boston just over the bridge across the mystic river. Like many other cities and towns across america, police here have seen the demand for heroin skyrocket. Drugs are you hate to say theyre as american as apple pie, but theyre here. Near not going anywhere. Reporter the growing epidemic is fueled in part by people increasingly hooked on prescription painkiller, people looking to heroin as a cheaper way to get high. People like marie who grew up here and took her first hit two decades ago at age 16. We agreed to protect her identity. How often do you do heroin now . Several times a day. Like right now ive already done two 40 packages today. Do you have one supplier . Do you have multiple suppliers . Multiple. You always need multiple because sometimes one aint around so you need your backup dealer. Reporter police say the majority drugs at 60 are sold in and around the public park by chelsea town hall. An endless flow of traffickers, suppliers, sellers, and buyers. How do they find their way here into a place like chelsea . They almost have like a network of runners or suppliers and theyll send them out, like delivery guys in a pizza store. You go to chelsea for the day. You go to another city for the day. They will basically network like that. Whats the most number of times somebody has been arrested . That ive seen . Yeah. Well over 200. Reporter back at Chelsea Police headquarters the Evidence Room is nearly filled to capacity. These are all heroin cases and cocaine cases that weve worked on. Twist is its just the corner of a sandwich bag that they will take. Can i hold this up . Go ahead. Reporter a twist of heroin that costs a fraction of a single prescription painkiller. This batch of hair wayne is worth 300. Do you have the same amount of oxycontin or any of these drugs, what would it be . Well over 3,000. Reporter police say that about half of the people arrested here in chelsea for either selling or buying heroin, theyre not even from here, they dont live in chelsea. Theyre coming from other cities and towns. We know certain communities are a lot more affluent and will ask them, how did you end up here from, you know, a suburb of Million Dollar homes and they will say they got hooked on opia opiates, ran out of money. Theyre not available there like they are here. Reporter and though she grew up in Chelsea Marie says she wants to move first chance she gets hoping to run from the addiction she calls a life sentence. You odd five times. Did you ever once think, why did i wake up . Yes. Every single time. Every time i woke up pissed off. Im like, im such a i cant even die right. I would rather be in the ground than continue with this. Headed up there now. Reporter endless cycle of drugs in small towns trying to stem the tide. I woke up tomorrow and do it all again. My panel back with me now. Columbia professor carl hart as well as dr. Ford vox. Dr. Vox, we just saw debs report there. Do you believe that prescription pills are a gateway to other harder drugs . At this point its not really a matter of belief. We have the statistics. We know that over 80 of people who go on to heroin first have their exposure to an opiod currently, it used to be quite the reverse, well over 80 was commonly introduced first to heroin back in the 1960s and 70s. So we have to a large extent medicalized this epidemic. What do you think . I see you wanting to react to this. Im just trying to hold it together. Whenever i heard the term gateway drug it just its difficult to hold it together because on one hand, the vast majority of people who are using these drugs, the opiates, prescription opiates, do not go on to use heroin. Thats a fact. When we Start Talking about gateway drug, this is not a gateway but who is it a gateway for . Someone with a predisposition or they already have a Mental Illness and theyre medicating . Is that what it is . Youre getting at the real issues here. When we think about someone going on to use heroin, people go on to use heroin for a variety of reasons whether they have cooccurring psychiatric illness, whether they are engaged in other sort of petty crimes or other sort of behaviors but theres a variety of reasons. And to blame Prescription Medications for heroin use, later heroin use, thats overly simplistic and actually is dangerous because it doesnt allow us to focus on the real issues that people actually might face. And so it concerns me deeply that people are suggesting this simplistic sort of view. But i want you to respond to that, dr. Vox. Obviously some people are self medicating when they have other issues. But i imagine you also think that we need to Pay Attention to the supply here of these drugs. We do. Thats what were hearing now and people enter into drug abuse treatment programs. A large study was done from Washington University in st. Louis surveying the entrance of these programs. This is a select population. People who are getting the ideal treatment for drug addiction, going into a full program. But they are saying their first exposure was to a prescription opiod. I know dr. Hart has some contention with the fact that this is not the sole reason that drives anyone to heroin. That is quite true. In fact, part of the problem is that the medical system is not really reimbursing and supporting some of the correct treatments that we need for some of these patients. People face a large copay, for example, for physical therapy, may not have good access to Mental Health care. Its often too easy for the physician just to write a prescription for the pill. And this is sometimes creating part of the problem. Dr. Hart, i want to get your take on a recent study thats pretty fascinating. It found that states that have legalized marijuana have significantly fewer deaths from prescription painkiller overd e overdoses. Why is that . One of the things we have to make sure we clearly understand is that this is correlational study, not causcausation. When we talk about cause, the causes or the finding, we can be our confidence is were intrigued by these findings. I am. I think they are findings that should be followed up on. And it makes sense when we think about a basic science level, when you give opiods and cavenoid together, they work to decrease pain. Perhaps people are decreasing their opiod intake because they dont need as much. This needs to be followed up on. Extremely encouraging. It also speaks to this issue of folks who say things like marijuana has no medical potential. This just flies in the face of that sort of nonsense. And raises a lot of questions that should be answered. Thank you so much. Well, prescription pills, a potentially deadly fix that shows no age discrimination. Heres a story of a boy hooked at the age of 13 and who is still battling addiction more than 12 years later. If you want to make things that move, move better, just talk to one of our scientists. Theyll show you a special glue weve developed that bonds metal to plastic. And that makes the things youre trying to move. Lighter. The less weight. The less energy. And what you save can be used for speed. For efficiency. Or just for fun. This is the Human Element at work. Dow. Youd do that for me . Really . Yeah, id like that. Who are you talking to . Uh, its jake from state farm. Sounds like a really good deal. 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If youve had a heart attack be sure to talk to your doctor before you begin an aspirin regimen. The Prescription Drug generation has arrived. The partnership for a drugfree america reports one in five teens use Prescription Drugs to get high because they mistakenly believe that pills are safer than street drugs like heroin and cocaine. One new york mother knows this reality all too well. Her son became addicted to prescription pills when he was just 13. Now more than a decade later hes still fighting to kick the habit. She shares the story with cnns kelly wallace. He made to make you laugh. That would make him feel really good. He was on division i soccer. He was on basketball. He was on baseball. This is him and i when we were in a pool and i would be the cautious mother. What did it feel like when you realized he was addicted and addicted to Prescription Drugs . Well, at first i didnt realize he was addicted. I would find pill bottles with no names on them, so it was just straight bottle. Sometimes i would find straws. Sometimes i would find spoons. I would google everything and started realizing theres a problem here. You start questioning yourself, did i fail him in some way . Theres such a stigma and a shame attached to it. The bottom line, its a disease. How hard was that stigma for you . I really suffered in silence. Its a horrible place to be because you end up crying yourself to sleep. You start going back in time and looking at how they used to be. For all mothers who have children who ared a dit ed adds that balance between supporting your loved one and enabling. His hand was always out, always out. How scary was that when you said, done, enabling stops . I sort of think to myself, if hes so darn clever to get the drugs, he can be clever enough to find a piece of pizza somewhere. You know . Okay, you sleep in your car. Well, thats your choice. I drew a little bit stronger. But i really grew strong with the addicts mom. I mean, that group was my saving grace. It truly was. I saw women who were having the same problems that i was having, only our childrens names were different. Whats the number one piece of advice you would give any mom watching who has an addict as a child . Well, i think try to get them into rehab. Scare them straight almost, but i really think that you have to Start Talking to your children when theyre young. And warn them about everything. I dont want to hear another mother getting a knock at the door saying their son or daughter is dead. I dont want one mother out there suffering in silence and feel she has nowhere to go. Its hard to imagine someone so young developing a lifealtering addiction, but my next two guests know the battle all too well. Veteran broadcaster pat obrien almost died from hissed a dik a to drug and alcohol. They will share their stories with you, next. Just so you know its hard enough for an addict and it can also be hard on a parent or a loved one looking on and feeling powerle powerless, it may feel hopeless but there is help. Recovering addict, pat obrien and also joined by darren, certified interventionist, recovery and addict himself and host of deadly sins on investigation discovery. Thanks for being with us. Thank you. Pat, your struggle with drugs and alcohol was very public but it began later in life. Does it surprise you to hear that the generation rx or the medication generation is out there right now . Well, i mean, our society and this is a great topic to have. Our society is addicted to not suffering as much ased ed addico the med sips that help you not suffer. Thats part of our culture, is that we are afraid to suffer. Anything that will make us feel good, that will get rid of anxiety, fear, depression, resentment, somebody picking on you, a bad day, loss of a job, anything that you can get that helps you, we use that as medicine. Lets erase the people that use it responsibly, by the way. My alcoholism, im sure i was born with it, its a disease, by the way. Im sure theres a genetic connection. My name is obrien. But, you know, mine hit hard about 55. And then it just got worse and worse and worse. I didnt miss any days from work and i never drank on air. You self medicate. I worked at it. Eternal vigilance is the price of liberty and thats what i did. I stuck to it. Finally got it. I had a few rehabs. I know darren did, too. I finally listened and got it and now im recovering. Just coming up on six years. Yeah, and its inspirational to hear your story about that. It is a struggle that you deal with every day. And, darren, you know that. You also just heard the story of a boy who began abusing drugs at the age of 13. Thats when you began, roughly, abusing drugs. Yeah. Its interesting to hear pat talk about, you know, people dealing with things to stop from suffering. Its not easy being a 13yearold. Is that what drives some people who are so young to drugs . Well, it certainly did in my case. Pat was a late bloomer. I was on the other side of the aisle there. I, too, began when i was 13 years old and for me it began with a way to address just being uncomfortable in my own skin. I had a lot of chaos in my upbringing. Not that i blame any of that, but at the time that i was 13 i was living on the outskirts of a very affluent area, although we were not. Im in my lousy little one bedroom apartment. A fat kid wearing husky size tough skin jeans who just felt like i was from another planet than these kids that i was in school with that were all doing things i was incapable of doing like showing up to class, studying latin and just getting along with their fellow human being. So for me that moment when i was 13 and at a party that all the cool kids were at and when one of them passed a joint my way, there was no just say no moment. When the cool kid passes a joint your way you take it and that actually lit the fuse that caused, for me anyway, for the next 20 years, if it was a waking moment for me, i was loaded on something. I wonder for both of you, pat to you, first. Youre talking about youre both saying the same thing. Dealing with anxiety or maybe its a lack of acceptance that causes anxiety, trying to fit in, trying to fix those concerns that you have. Whats the productive way to approach this, do you think, pat, that you can communicate to younger people . Absolutely. I think that that mother who is who had the son that she was googling the drugs and im not criticizing her, but when you find this out you should never go to the internet for medical news, by the way. But you should be googling right . You should be googling Behavioral Center or addiction doctor or Recovery Center because there is a choice. There is a way out. You can get out of this. Its just that when you come down from these drugs everything that you took them for in the first place comes back. The anxiety and fear. Still there. Theres a way to maintain that. Were very good in this country of maintaining risk. People deal with gasoline every day. They fill their cars up. Nobody anymore much smokes around a gas tank or lights a match there. We know how to deal with that. Medications for some reason were not getting the message. Doctors arent doing it. The government is not doing it correctly. And you know, you go back and look at the tremendous series here ann is putting on about the 60s. That was my generation. I did drugs with timothy leery who discovered lsd. He used to think, darren, everyone ought to wear a badge that says what youre on at that very moment. But it was different then. Now you cant you cant afford to take anything off the street. I have a friend whose son died, very famous friend whose son died. Took one hit of ecstasy, half a hit, and went into a coma. You cant trust street drugs. They do them because theyre cheaper than Prescription Drugs. Its not a gateway, its cheaper. I want to get both of your perspectives ahead. Were doing to continue our conversation. Pat, i want to hear more about your personal struggle with addiction, your career, and your remarkable recovery and your message for people battling addiction. You do a lot of things great. But parallel parking isnt one of them. Youre either too far from the curb. Or too close to other cars. Its just a matter of time until you rip some guys bumper off. So, here are your choices take the bus. Or get Liberty Mutual insurance. For drivers with accident forgiveness, Liberty Mutual wont raise your rates due to your first accident. See Car Insurance in a whole new light. Call Liberty Mutual insurance. Press your tonguenture, against it like this. It moves unlike natural teeth. Do you feel it . It can happen with every denture. Introducing new fixodent plus true feel. It helps keep dentures firmly in place. With a smooth formula, free of flavors and colorants. So you get a closer feeling to natural teeth. New fixodent plus true feel. Fixodent. And forget it. We are back now with pat obrien and, pat, you just kind of brutally honest memoir on your career and controversies. Its titled ill be back right after this and it chronicles youred a direction and its about redemption and your remarkable recovery. What was the goal of your memoir . The goal thank you. The goal was to tell my story with my words. I mean, a lot of people, especially on the internet and wikipedia and comments and all this stuff, they think they have your story. And they dont. So i decided to do the whole thing. By the way, the book is also about where i grew up, its about politics. I had a tremendous blessed career in the sports world and news business. And, you know, like on a day like today i would be hosting the u. S. Open or College Football but i would rather be talking about this because its more important to me. Ill be back doing that stuff anyway. But, you know, i wanted it to be my story and i wanted people to know that there is a way out. There is a choice. You can get well. Around you dont have to suffer all that much for it if you want to when youre walking through hell, keep walking. Thats what Winston Churchill said. To those people you want to send a message to and you were very hard on yourself and your former coworkers. It is quite a read. What was for you . What was the aha moment where you said, i need to get help or im going the die . Right. By the way, i wasnt that hard on most of my coworkers. Were in the business of destroying peoples lives. When you pin somebody back a little bit they shouldnt jump so high. At the very end i my last day was in nantucket and i drank 13 or 14 bottle os of wine in one day. Just couldnt stop drinking. Thats when finally they found me. I was almost dead. I was airlifted to hazel on the. I got sober because i willed for the first time. Alcoholics are people who lie to themselves and say, i can do this, i can drink like this any day. And you cant. You have to understand. And it was the day they said to me, you you know what, pat obrien, youre going to die. I took a good look at myself, as i said and i talk about in the book, and i said thats the guy i do not want to be. I do not want to be that guy anymore. Pretty cool guy, i thought, but not a little different now for me. What is it like . I wonder how you visualize your struggle . Is it like a mountain that you will never reach the summit of . You never fix yourself, right, completely . Well, no, as i said, thats a good question because what you do is you dont see the mountain, you see the molehill. The molehill is really the mountain. But you think that you can get over lets metaphor this to death, okay . You think you can get over that mountain by having a drink. By the way, if you have one drink, one drink kind of works. Settles you down little bit. But 20, 15, i mean, come on. So i was medicating myself and thinking, well, ive got good hair and makeup people tomorrow. Ill be fine. You know . And but at the end of the day it just catches up with you. And i wouldnt go my route. I write, dont try actually michael j. Fox wrote on the back of the book, dont try this at home. Dont suggest you do. Stick with us, pat. Whats the solution . 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In delicious chicken, beef, turkey, and garden veggie flavors. Friskies grillers. Thats why i always choose the fastest intern. R slow. The fastest printer. The fastest lunch. Turkey club. The fastest pencil sharpener. The fastest elevator. The fastest speed dial. The Fastest Office plant. So why wouldnt i choose the fastest wifi . I would. Switch to comcast Business Internet and get the fastest wifi included. Comcast business. Built for business. Abuse of prescription pills, the deadly fix that is growing so fast. Its now an epidemic. So what can be done to keep people from misusing these . Lets bring back our entire panel for their final thoughts here. Dr. Carl hart of Columbia University, lgs the author of high price. We have physician and journalist dr. Ford vox and certified interventionist and pat oh bo. I want quick and final thoughts. Darren, i want to start with you. Theres always hope. When i do interventions or speak publicly i hear from parents all the time who express a great deal of frustration about their loved ones and what they have to learn to appreciate is its no longer their loved ones. Its disease of addiction that is expressing themselves through the person that they formerly knew. And as long as that person is drawing breath, then its still worth fighting the fight. And i encourage people never give up hope. Carl, your final thought . What id like people to understand is that the vast majority of people who use these drugs are not addicts. Only about 10 to 20 of people who use these drugs become addicted. In the press we sometimes focus on the people who have problems and then we act as if thats the majority and thats the typical drug users. Thats not the case. Thats one. Two, just because one has had an addiction, please understand that does not qualify people to become treatment providers. It requires training. It requires training. Dr. Vox, your thoughts . Well, im going to temper that a little bit with the fact that at this time Prescription Drugs are becoming a leading cause of Car Accidents right behind alcohol, Prescription Drugs are now a number two cause of accidental deaths, as well, in this country in terms of overdoses. I do am heartened somewhat about the fact that we have the Affordable Care act and perhaps we have more tools to treat people more holistically rather than just prescribe pills, that we can get people the appropriate me tall hailt care and other tools such as physical thera therapy, rather than just prescribing the pills. There are other things that can be done. Pat, what do you think . Whats the final thing you want to communicate . First of all, kind of look like a frightening version of the brady bunch right now. Anyway, the fact i agree. The professor is right. There are 26 Million People alcoholics who probably arent in recovery. My thought always is that its better to be in recovery knowing that youre an addict or alcoholic or being out there wondering if you are. And there is help. There is a way out. And its doctors have to be more i imagivigilant. Pharmacists have to be more vigilant. Obamacare has to notch it up a little bit. People should realize if they get put in this prison the door can be opened and they can be set free. The door can be opened and they can be set free. Weve recovered a myriad of subjects here. You all have very different perspectives. I really appreciate you all being here. Dr. Vox, thank you so much. Dr. Hart, and darren and pat for sharing your personal stories. Appreciate it. You can find out much more about the fight against addiction. The fight against addiction. Just go to cnn. Com deadlyfix. Captions by vitac www. Vitac. Com you are in the cnn newsroo newsroom. Im Brianna Keilar. Isis militants on the move in iraq in fears ukraine has reached the breaking point. European leaders meeting today warning if a political solution sint found soon the country could reach the, quote, point of no return. This as the ukraine kran port city braces for the worst. We have new developments in the u. S. Pushed to depete isis in iraq. The u. S. Military has conducted five new air strikes against isis militants near the mosul dam. The strikes destroyed an isis fighting position as well as an armed feek, weapon, and that it significantly damaged an isis building. The u. S. Military is conducted a total of 115 air strikes against isis in iraq. All of this coming as secretary of state john kerry has written a strongly worded oped in the norm times calling for more nations to help the u. S. Defeat kerry writes, no civilized country should shirk its responsible to help stamp out its disease. Right now people in the uk have fresh worries about a possible isis attack. Britain has raised the threat level to severe. Intelligence officials are particularly worried after a British Voice appeared on the tape showing the brutal execution of james foley. Karl penhaul is getting reaction on the streets of london. Reporter britain is on the high alert, the government is telling us jihadi attack is highly likely so weve come down to the streets of central lop don to see if there are signs of panic. This is kings cross train station, one of the busiest in the country. Everyone just gets on with their everyday life. Whatever happens happens. You dont think every time you get on the train anything is going to happen. Just trying to make people scared, really. Thats all it is. People are scared and then then theyll theyre more likely to support something if the government then eventually did try to go into iraq. Reporter britains no stranger to home grow enterror plots. In 2005 in a socalled seven seven attack, four suicide bombers killed 52 people in london. If you let things like that rule your life you would never do anything. Although youre aware of it and you hope that the government is on top of the situation, you just take it the way it is. Reporter the police chief is saying they will step up patrol in train stations and airports. Saturday afternoon this was no sign of that except near the one thats getting married. This group of young women out on a prewedding hen party dressed as british barbies. They pledge to crack down on radical islam is living some leaving uneasy fearing it could turn into a witch hunt against all muslims. Like the movies, alien invasion, people think about attacking them. Thats exactly the same with us. They dont know why they do it or what it is that we want from this so they go and attack it because they dont know it. Yes, there is red callism. That exists in every community. Not just islam but islam has been focused and used as a scapegoat. Were in the middle of a generational struggle. Reporter mr. Cameron said he could announce new measures to parliament this week. No word on how long the heightened terror alert this last. Karl penhaul joining me now. Its pretty interesting when you listen to people there in your peace, a lot of them are not getting too worked up about this but David Cameron is set to unveil some tough new terror policies like seizing suspects passports tomorrow perhaps. Do you think that thats doing to create more concern amongst people in london . Well, certainly as you see, brianna, there really it doesnt scare what the p. Rime minister is telling. Alarming terminology using this, describing it as generational fight, saying this is up with of the worst threats that britain has ever faced. It doesnt square with the mood on the street at all. What is likely to happen when parliamentarians where british lawmakers get back after their summer break and that will be on monday now that Prime Minister calm ran will put to them a series of measures that he thinks would be useful to combat what he calls radical islam, the poisonous ideology of extremism, to tackle not only those potential jihadis heading out to iraq and syria and there he suggests putting a travel ban on them so they cant do there in the first place. But all those also those rurping and there he is suggesting, as you say, withdrawing their passports as they get back. And so hes going to ask lawmakers if they agree with that and if they have any other measures to propose. But that would also presuppose that you can actually detect these people as they head out or as they come back. There are other opposition lawmakers in britain that say the Intelligence Services really do not have a good handle on that because the suspects dont fit the normal profile liaison necessarily radicalized disinfected young men but in some cases some from good middle class families. They says all those people are not on the usual database. They think someone is le certainly to fall through the cracks. The u. S. Is also sounding the alarm over isis. You can expect to hear much more about the terror group. Next weeks nato meeting in wales. Defense secretary chuck hagel and secretary of state john kerry will be there to try to drum up support among International Coalition to confront isis which kerry calls, cancer. In another portion of his oped in todays New York Times kerry write, quote, already our efforts have brought dozens of nations to this cause. Certainly there are different interests at play but no decent country can support the horrors perpetrated by isis and no civilized country should shirk its responsible to help stamp out this disease. Lets bring in now Cnn National Security analyst bob baer and tom fuentes. Bob, to you first. How difficult is it going to be to get Global Cooperation to take on isis . Can this be done . I think we can get Global Cooperation from the british, the everything from, and so forth. The problem is really in iraq because we have a terrorist state, the Islamic State. The real information, Real Intelligence to be gotten is in Anbar Province in iraq. We need the cooperation of the sunni muslims in that part of iraq and syria to Tell White House these people are and which foreigners are fighting with them. Without that help its always going to be a partial picture. Tom, you know, some in congress they are calling for a more aggressive military response from the u. S. Even secretary kerry says air strikes alone wont be enough. That was really the take away from his oped today. Do you think that u. S. Ground troops may be the answer and also that just seems like a complete impossibility when it comes to the will of the u. S. Public. Yeah, i think it is just about a political impossibility to get the American Public to want to commit Ground Troops again and get bogged down for the next ten years now. On the other hand, isis is growing. And i think that, you know, a lot of political leaders in this country have been crying wolf for 10, 12, 15 years and the problem is now we have a wolf and nobody wants to address it or believe it. And just kind of shrug it off. The londoners that were just in the last segment, you know, most of those people talking were probably 10 years old, you know, when the attack happened in london last time, in 2005. So, you know, for a lot of people they dont remember what it was ten years ago in london or 13 years ago here on 9 11 9 11. To be talking about al qaeda or an al qaeda type group and this group is, you know, different in that it wants to claim land. May possibly send people here to attack or just inspire people here to take on an attack who. Even dont travel there. Were heard this before, weve heard this many times. We had our color charts, our threat levels. So what. I think thats the big problem is the level of apathy to try to address this by people that are just, you know, the mainstream public is a difficult challenge to overcome. Sure it is. Bob, when you look at the region and youre looking at the neighbors of syria and iraq, how concerned are these countries in the middle east . For instance, saudi arabia, how kerpd concerned is saudi arabia . Theyre not concerned enough. The next target of them is to take mecca. If they want to establish a caliphate theyre going the need to destabilize saudi arabia. Large segments of saudi population send money to isis and support and fighters. This is ultimately a problem thats going to touch the gulf, is isis continues on a year, two more years, it will destabilize the arab countries in the gulf. I think its almost certain. Tom, you you mentioned one of the big concerns is american or brits who are inspired by what isis is doing. As twisted as that seems that they would be inspired by it we know it is a reality. How do countries combat that . A lone actor who is drawing inspiration from isis . I dont think you really can. There are so many thousands of jihadi websites where they get this information and decide to self radicalize as early as teenager, lets say. Enspire magazine out of yemen just published the 12th magazine this past may. In that magazine in all 12 magazines they tell people you dont need to travel to the war zone to learn how to shoot a gun or make a bomb or any of those sophisticated techniques. You cok. Do it at home. Drive your car on a sidewalk and mow people down eating lunch, drive a tanker truck into a school. Derail a train thats not toxic material and blow up half of a small town. Youve got theyve had issue after issue of suggestions for people that this is how you can kill other people, carry on. Thats going to happen. Its horrible to think of. Tom fuentes, bob baer, thank you for your perspective. Certainly alarming. Ukraine, lets talk about ukraine. Ukraine says the photos do not lie. Nato images that you see here of Russian Troops crossing over the border. Some european leaders fear the point of no return in this crisis is close. My next guest says we have already reached it. Stay with us. When i had my first migraine, i was lucky. That sounds crazy, i know. 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I asked Politico Magazine contributor michael wise if he thinks the conflict is reaching a breaking point. I think weve already reached that point, to be honest. Ive been talking to ukrainian officials and Civil Society activists all day here in kiev. As far as theyre concerned theyre in a state of war with russia. Awe few european leaders have come pretty close to calling this an invasion. The Swedish Foreign minister tweeted he see them fighting Russian Regular forces. There is, quote, a word for this. The president of astonia yesterday, and president obama is due in astonia on. Tuesday, to reassure them the United States is behind it, it issued one of the most robust statements calling this undeclared war. So european leaders, especially those on russia periphery and especially those who border ukraine or certainly feel the might of the Russian Military and the threat posed by Vladimir Putin are seeing this as a definitive act of war on european territory. They seized crimea and now sent over a thousand soldiers into east ukraine. Many are being killed and sent back in body bags to russia. The parents of the soldiers dont know where their sons have been buried. The combat missions have not been disclosed publicly by russia. This is a the definition of a dirty undeclared war. European leaders have condemned russia for what they call significant incursions into Eastern Ukraine and as tensions escalate both the u. S. And european allies are threatening more sampg shuns. Im joined by cnn commentators Marc Lamont Hill and ben ferguson. I wonder what you think about more sanctions. At this point it doesnt feel that even if russia and if putin and those close to him are feeling these sank shups that its really achieving anything. The first thing you want is a diplomatic solution. Thats always what you want. What you want to see in europe is a term. Angela merkel have been more conservative on these issues than say someone in astonia. People wanted u. S. Sanctions. I think getting european sanctions right now despite the costs they will have to ultimately pay is the ultimate pay. Right now sanctions are the key. I think you have to go big. I think thats one of the things here. I think when you look at this strategy what does big mean, war . Big means you do the biggest stuff you can do with sanctions when you disapprove with this. You dont do it in this slow way. Vladimir putin doesnt pluf bluff. He says what hes going to do and he does it. He understands basically response and power. He doesnt care about rhetoric. When we have these first set of sanctions. They were not very good or big. They were almost laughable. Most people sanctioned did not have money so they were meepingless. Talking about u. S. Sank shups . Yes, u. S. Sankctions. Heres what im saying. I think the president of the United States of america has to lead in a big and blunt way. What is he asking for . I dont know. Europe doesnt know. My point is is this, you may not d. C. Issue. I do say this. Its an issue of leadership. If you come out and somebody has to be the leader of the world on this one. And its always why would it be the president least at stake . Europe has the most let me ask this we have always led on these issues. President obama will be talking to a number of european leaders next week. Also, he will be visiting astonia. Yes. Sure. We just saw the astonian president calling this hes unequivocal. Undeclared war invasion. This is what the u. S. Is not saying. Many europeans are not saying. Thats what im saying about leadership. What does the president , what does he need to do and can he really get their help, marc . Two things. One, he need to name evil. He needs to say this is a war sglbs out lie will pitts about time. This is a war, a proxy. This is anwar. This is not an unfortunate incursion. He needs to encourage the European Union to sanction. Totally agree. Unequivocally and universally. The problem is they have a dog in the fight that we dont have. They are reliant on russian energy. Yeah. Heres the thing. Thats the problem. Sometimes being bold in a leader in this situation is where you have to go. Look at astonia and lithuania. The European Union is not going to lead. We need leadership of the United States of america. Astonia is when was the last time that france ever gave real leadership on an issue like this . If were waiting on them, were going to be waiting until you and i are really old men. Im actually encouraged by what france is doing and germany is doing much more than, say, what astonia is doing what is easy. We have a white house that literal little right now is not willing to even say that this is an invasion of a country which it obviously is. Invasion, a war. They are not the white house is not calling it an invasion. We will see how this evolves in the days and the weeks to come. Hang with me. Marc, ben, stay with me. Well be back with this. We do want to talk though about the first openly gay nfl draft pick. Michael sam. Well, now he is looking for a new team after getting cut by the st. Louis rams. Pat obrien joining us to talk about it next. When you run a business, you cant settle for slow. Thats why i always choose the fastest intern. The fastest printer. The fastest lunch. Turkey club. The fastest pencil sharpener. The fastest elevator. The fastest speed dial. The Fastest Office plant. So why wouldnt i choose the fastest wifi . I would. Switch to comcast Business Internet and get the fastest wifi included. Comcast business. Built for business. Two big stories that we are watching tonight, michael sam, the nfls first openly gay player to be drafted. He got cut by the st. Louis rams and comedian joan rivers is in serious condition after going into cardiac and respiratory arrest during a throat procedure. Joining me now legendary sportscaster pat obrien. I want to talk with you first ant michael sam, pat, after this announcement. He tweeted the most worthwhile things in life rarely come easy. This is a lesson ive always known. The journey continues. I mean, do you think the rams decision was surprising . Well, i mean, couldnt have been surprising to michael sam because he was drafted in the final round, 249th out of 256 players. Look, all along before the internet goes crazy and everybody else on this thing, all along michael sam and weve automatic said he wants to be treated like every other player. Guess what, he was. A lot of players got cut today. This is cut day. You dont oh we not everybody makes these rosters. Only 53 guys. But i tell you, we have not seen the last of michael sam. He had a tremendous preseason. Six sack, 11 tackles, a team like dallas which needs that position, the horrible on defense. By the way, st. Louis, wasnt that great this year anyway. They lost a quarterback, sam bradford. This could be a blessing in disguise for him. If he doesnt sign with another team, the rams might hire him back to be on their practice squad. Hes a great player. This was not about him being gay. All right. You think the chances of him getting picked by another team though are what do you think . Do you think he ends up on the practice squad . Absolutely. Jacksonville, minnesota, new england patriots, they all need help at that position. He fits into those systems. They could bring he was good. But he just doesnt fit into the rams system. As i said, blessing in disguise for him. Might be a better fit for him somewhere else. Yeah. Exactly. I want to talk to you about joan rivers. Her daughter says that she is in serious condition. What do you make of this . Obviously everyone is hoping the very best for joan rivers. Tell us about it from your perspective. Well, she has two things going against her. One, her age. Although she i know joan. She never acts her aim bge but is an older woman but any time you have an operation like this and complications, its a problem. Gone from induced coma. It settles the body down. They do that on purpose. Shes gone from critical to serious. Obvious slis li shes getting stronger and in there. Shes a tough woman. A very, very tough woman. And im not going the predict anything but anybody who gets a procedure in the hospital goes in with a chance of having something go wrong. It happened now to joan rivers. And from all i hear, of course were all praying for her and hope to see her back on the stage. The night before from what im told she was never better on stage. We need her humor back in this country, especially now. Thats what we heard. And she is a fighter and were all hoping she fights certainly and pulls through this and is back to herself. You have had, im sure, some experiences with joan rivers. Do you have any personal stories to share about moments that youve had with her . Yeah, i mean, shes never shes always out ranl jous on t outrageous on the red carpet and shes never picked on my clothing. I can always say i told her once, you dress great, age appropriate, joan. And i think she gave me the finger. Im not sure exactly. I would not be surprised. Shes a lovely woman. She says whats on her mind. Not what she thinks people want to hear. She sure does. Well, were all really hoping for her, hoping certainly that she pulls through and soon. Pat obrien, thanks so much for being with us tonight. Really appreciate it. Thank you. Were going to switch gears now. The isis threat garnering two very distinct responses from the top two leaders in the western world. President obama and british Prime Minister David Cameron. Each gave a speech within a day of each other. One threat here, two very different rep actions. We will compare obama and cameron coming up next. I dont just make things for a living i take pride in them. 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And the only place youll find it is at the lexus golden opportunity sales event. Now through september 2nd. This is the pursuit of perfection. It is a tale of two world leaders, two speeches but one very real threat. Aggressive isis militants on the move across iraqi and syria and making vocal threats to the west while theyre at it. Its up to the two topple leaders to respond, right . They did it in very different fashions. S in notice a few things. The urgency, entire of the speech. Case in point, take a look at these two word clouds. They gave greater prominence to words that are heard more frequently in the speech. First up, this is president obamas speech thursday at the white house. Assortment of words. Most of the words that stand out are neutral. They are less than aggressive. That is not by accident. Look now at Prime Minister David Cameron during his speech on friday, the day after. What are the biggest words that you see . Threat, terrorist, people. In president obamas word cloud the word threat was very tiny, meaning it didnt play a large role in his speech at all. Lets talk this over now with our cnn political commentators ben ferguson and marc la metropolitan himont hill. Huge differences. Its a problem with this white house. They seem like on these type of issues he is not comfortable being a guy that has to deal with the terrorists. Thats a problem with this administration. I think youre going to see it this week when the pentagon came out and they said it in a very different way. Everybody knows isis is a threat. Everybody knows theyre well funded. Everybody knows they have a ton of money and theyre more funded than al qaeda could dream of. They act somehow this is going to diplomatically be resolved. Is he reflecting somewhat, maybe some of the feelings of the American People . They are a war weary people, certainly they have a less aggressive posture in general than you would. Have you have to call evil what it is and a threat what it is. Youre mischaracterizing obama. Look at the words. The president has never said were going tva diplomatic solution to isis. Thats absurd. Saying, hey, lets talk . No. He threatened air strikes. He may say air strikes are insufficient. Thats a reasonable argument but hes never said diplomatic response. He is in a war weary nation and quite honestly, to be frank about this, war is bad business for a democratic candidate or democratic president or democratic leader entering a midterm election. Hes trying to use a different language to prosecute the same war. Proxy war through kurds and iraqis in the north. Syria and maybe even iran. So the president has the right strategy but hes using the wrong lange wamg. When he says he dont have a strategy, bad idea. Literally he walks up and says, i dont have a strategy. We dont have a strategy. That is what concerns me thabt administration. And i agree with you. War is bad business for democrats. When youre dealing with terrorists and allowing them to take moreland and take over more areas and have these places where there are these problems and to see a threat where David Cameron made it very clear, theyre a threat to our country. Lets not act like theyre just over there. Isis fighters have american passports, british passports. Now youre over stating the threat. I dont think im overstating the threat at all. Youre not taking it seriously. According to military exper, forget you and i, op both sides of the aisle, they dont have the power right now to defeat the kurds in the north. They dont have the means to get to the west. I dont care as much about that let me say this. Im not worried about that as much as i am, are they able to carry out terrorist attacks in the world the way al qaeda was in the past. Secretary gates said, absolutely yes. How do you fix that . Number one, get at their Funding Sources which is not public fupding bfupd i funding. Taking over banks and cities and towns. Take over syria and the town. Most of that is fine. Taking over mosul, we know where they are. Doesnt this all doesnt acting against isis come from where people are at, where the brits are at, where americans are at . I mean, weve been looking at the response from people in the uk and they say, theyre just really not worried. Some of them think its just fearmongering. Thats my point. David cameron is playing on that fearmongering. I dont think its necessary. Is it fearmongering . No. For some nations it makes sense to talk tough and be like a cowboy. Here a much more thoughtful and strategic response. Things shah have happened with james foley, awful. We need to respond to it. The things that have happened to fa s fazidis, awful. You dont fight terrorists by playing politics. David cameron was being a leader that maybe people didnt want to hear in the uk. Were going to slow the north by getting to the south . He said what was maybe unpopular. His country is war tired and weary the same way the United States of america is. Thats part of the reason why he is in a position he is right now because he was not a warmongering type of guy is how they described him in the press in the uk. But i think he also understood that when youre the president or the leader of a country, there is a point where you do have to be the reality check for what isis is and you have to be honest to the people of your nation about what they are and what youre dealing with. Thats my point, ben. Youre friending them as terrorist organization. They are. Theyre also an insurgency. Thats my point, which is why you need to think of the terrorist response and antiterrorist response, that you although they are terrorists. Theyre terrorists and theyre an insurgent. The tactics and strategy have to be more robust. The difference that were seeing between the approach from president obama and Prime Minister cameron isnt part oh right now, what is it a dozen confirmed, perhaps more, american passport holders fighting in isis . Yes. Youre talking about hundreds of british passport holders. Arent these two dealing with perhaps a different threat . Yes. Let me just there are ones who are there much more likely to carry outdo mess tick attacks based on the traping theyve gotten and work theyve done with isis than we see in the United States. Where is a domestic attack more likely . Wasnt 100 guys that committed that crime . No. Okay. 19. If youve got 12 guys that have passports and a couple others that can figure out a way to get here. Let me finish this. Isis is the most well funded terrorist organization weve seen. They have made it very clear they want to kill americans, theyve made it very clear they want to kill the british. No one is disputing that. Hold on. Let me say this. No one is proisis. How do you defeat isis . You defeat them on the crowd, fund kurds, go to syria, fund the Opposition Forces in syria. Why isnt obama saying what youre saying . I agree with what youre saying. Obama isnt saying that. His strategy is appropriate as opposed to David Cameron who is taking the george bush era approach to antiterror which will not stop an rnt in si. You cut off a head in iraq, throw boots on the ground of u. S. Forces and more heads we tried the obama strategy for six years and look where isis is now. No, this gentleman george w. Bush. No, it doesnt. Yes, it does. We will continue this conversation. We were just about to agree. I think you guys were about to like wrestle is what was about to happen. Stay with me. We are going to go on to another story that has everyone talking. A 9yearold girl accidentally shoots and kills an instructor at a gun range. What went wrong . And the debate over why this never should have happened. 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And plenty of people, including gun enthusiasts are asking, why did a child have a submachine gown shoot . It happened at a gun range in arizona that caters to las vegas tourists. Charles vacca was accidentally shot in the head as he instructed a 9yearold girl how to fire a uzi, a submachine gun. As she pulled the trigger the gun jumped out of her right hand and struck him beside her. 9yearold gets an uzi in her hand, within the criteria of 8 years old. We instruct kids as young and 5 and. 22 handles and they dont get to handle the firearms but theyre up der the supervision of their parents and our professional range masters. Incident is sparking comment from the former secretary of state. This incident with the 9yearold girl is just heartbreaking and horrifying. I mean, first of all, what 9yearold little girl is Strong Enough to manage an uzi submachine gun, which is apparently what it was. You know, the kick, the effort to control it. I mean, thats just the height of irresponsibility, to say nothing of the choice of letting your child do that. Let me turn now to my two cnn political commentators, ben ferguson and Marc Lamont Hill back with us. Theres a lot of people talking about this tragic story, guys. It seems though to strike a very different chord than the normal gun debate. Why is that . Because you dont hand a 9yearold young girl an uzi and expect her to be able to handle it. This instructor, i think, im sorry, it cost his life. This is not about guns. Yeah. No, this is not Second Amendment issue to me because you had an instructor that should have never loaded that magazine with that many bullets because there is recoil. The youre going give that to anyone that is younger you should never have it all of the way maxed out. He should have been standing behind her. Hands on the gun. You know theres going to be muzzle rise on that gun. There were so many things that happened and you and i were talking about this. We hope everyone in america goes out there and makes it clear that they want this young girl to know she did not this was not her fault. This was an accident. You should have never been put in that situation. My heart goes out to her. You should not have taken this mans life. I hope she gets the counseling she needs and i hope people rally around her. Not a Second Amendment issue but gun control debate. Many of us, and i believe in the Second Amendment. I believe people have the right to own a firearm. I own a firearm. I hope other people do, exercise their right to. The question becomes, at some point we have to draw the line to say this extends beyond our right to own firearms. I respect gun culture and people who own guns and depend themselves and defend themselves against an unjust government that arises. But a 9yearold with an uzi is such an absurd circumstance. The law said that this is what the gun range instructor was saying. 8 years old. Thats the cutoff. There you have it. Its a ridiculous law. Let me say this you agree this is a ridiculous law . Would it have made a difference if it was a 11yearold girl . Physiological yes. You never hand a gun to someone that is nervous or uncomfortable. You work them up a pro process and find out where theyre getting nervous. I would hand an uzi to my mom, i wouldnt hand it to my wife, and both of them have the physical capability with strength. But if you were nervoer inervou youre avoiding the issue though. No 9yearold girl should have an uz pirks this. What about a 9yearold boy . 9yearold girl tend not to be Strong Enough to do it. Why not have a law that 9yearold boys and girls cannot hold an uzi since they cannot handle it. I would say this no, would you agree with the law . I dont think its as simple as saying an age. Heres my concern. 11yearold girl or 12 or 13 organization 14 that dont need to have this gun. There needs to be a law accountability for the ranges. The training there was awfully messed up because theres older people, middle aged people who might not hold that gun tight or it might shock them when they come up. Gun control, thats my point. Youre talking gun control. Youre saying we should have laws to stop people who cant handle these weapons that cant handle them. We do with a semi automatic weapon pv i shot them when i was young but i also had an instructor that wasnt, to be blunt, ignorant ability how to deal with it. I had a dad that always stood behind me. He was in Law Enforcement. Always. You had an uzi . Fully automatic weapon when i was 11 years old. Not 9. Not far away. Thats not 9. Lets broaden this out. This statistic i want to focus on. According to the Brady Campaign to prevent gun violence, in 2007, more preschool age kids killed by guns than Police Officers who were kid in the line of duty. There are a lot more preschool aged kids than there are prifrs. A whole lot more. Still, its sort of when even that, you say, that is startling. Ill say this. Kids cant go out and buy a gun. Thats a kid accidents. Accidents. Thats the point. Part of the responsible gun ownership is this. My dad made sure when i was younger there was no way i went go look for a gun. He took me to the range. He explained to me the weapon. He never had the ammunition where i could get it. I never went looking because he made me respect and understand this is a very powerful weapon. A lot of kids like alcohol. Theyll be curious about it. Im saying when you have a child you make sure that they understand these are deadly weapons, that theyre not toys. Yes, but part of that is 9yearold an uzi. Im not saying give a 9yearold an uzi. I say make it illegal. It is illegal to give 9yearold an uzi at the house. At the range. What im saying is we need sensible gun control. I want people to own weapons. I think people should own weapons. Lets draw reasonable and ser sensible lines here. We dont have reasonable regulation. We dont have uzi accidents very often. If you had a responsible instructor in that situation, we wouldnt be talking about it right now. Being responsible is not giving a 9yearold an uzi. Great conversation. Just ahead, isis turns to social media to attract new recruits to its cause. We will talk to a former Police Informant to helped bust up a terror plot in toronto about what makes the jihadist tick. Well talk to him act that. Listen up. Im reworking the menu. Veggies youre cool. Mayo, corn dogs. You are so out of here ahh. The complete balanced nutrition of great tasting ensure. 24 vitamins and minerals. 9 grams of protein. With 30 less sugars than before. Ensure, your 1 dr. 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So why wouldnt i choose the fastest wifi . I would. Switch to comcast Business Internet and get the fastest wifi included. Comcast business. Built for business. Isis has succeeded in astounding the world with its rapid advance across syria and iraq and its ability to hold territory. The fighters have been as disciplined as they are ruthless and they are incredibly adept at using social media to promote their agenda. A former police operative working under cover with radical muslims in toronto. Thanks for joining us. Just tell me what the appeal of isis is to these young people who grew up in the west . The appeal to these youngsters is that its a sense of purpose, belonging, and a chance of being a hero. For a lot of these youth who are lost youth, disinfranchised, coming from abusive backgrounds, isolated, alienated, not feeling important enough, this group gives them all of that. And its interesting because we actually heard from the mother of one of these kids from minnesota who was killed back in 2009 in somalia who had joined up with extremists. She said actually when he found islam, she said it was like she had her son back. The brightness was in his eyes. He suddenly kind of got his stuff together. Then things took a turn. So, i guess how in a way do you sort of stop the turn toward extremism . This is very common. When, especially when somebody takes on the religious in a more overt form, youll go through a phase of feeling really good about yourself, life is working out, everything is okay. And the problem is that people are looking for a quick fix and a lot of these individuals have become either born again muslims, if i can use that term, or with converts who convert to islam, theyll go through this initial phase. The inoculation part comes in the traditional study of islam, being connected to scholars who have a tradition that go back to the prophet muhammad. This is the inoculation part of it. Mubin, you spent a lot of time with people who were radicalized, helped break up a terror plot in toronto. Whats the ultimate goal of group like isis . Isis has gone on to do what it claimed to do, establish an Islamic State. Had the term Islamic State in its name for some time. Theyve done what they claimed to want to do. Secondly, the idea of an Islamic State, the caliphate is something thats shared by muslims, so what theyre doing is appealing to pmusliming to say, here it is, weve established the utopian state youve been waiting for all this time. Do they want to eliminate people who dont believe as they do . Yes, most definitely, they do. Theyve been killing more muslims than theyve been killing nonmuslims. So deviant a group that even al qaeda doesnt want anything to do with them. So theyre uncompromising. Thats their problem. Wheres the reaction that were seeing from muslims . As you say, they are killing more muslims than nonmuslims. Where is that sort of strong reaction . Are we seeing that . Are we just not hearing it . Thats right. I mean, were just not hearing enough of it. Just a couple of days ago, i was participating in a press conference by the, i think its called the Muslim Public Affairs committee. Theres been widespread condemnation of this group by every i mean, every major scholar in the world. There have been rallies in euro europe, in canada we had two rallies against isis. Imams is working, the Muslim Community is working been the scenes. You may not see them on the scenes or on the street but theyre working closely with Law Enforcement and community officials. Community cohesion is most important thing at this point. Mubin, thanks so much for being with us. Really appreciate it. Thanks for having me. Mubin shaikh, former undercover jihadist. We have an update next from ferguson, missouri. Another officer who worked in the Michael Brown protests has turned in his badge. Well have details ahead. When i had my first migraine, i was lucky. That sounds crazy, i know. But my mom got migraines, so she knew this would help. Excedrin migraine starts to relieve my pain in 30 minutes. Plus, sensitivity to light and sound, even nausea. Excedrin migraine works. Michael sam, the first openly gay players drafted by an nfl team, did not make the cut. St. Louis rams announcing today sam will not make the 53player roster. He was a seventhround pick, considered a long shot but played well in the preseason and he could still be picked up by another nfl team. Comedian joan rivers remains in serious condition in a new york hospital. She suffered cardiac and respiratory arrest during a throat procedure at a Medical Clinic on thursday. Her daughter, melissa, and grandson, cooper, flew from los angeles to be at her side. Rivers performed at a comedy club on wednesday night and fans say she was just her regular feisty self. Joan rivers is, of course, 81 years old. Severe weather threats for many this labor day weekend. Cnn meteorologist Jennifer Gray has detailses bree yianna, a lot of rain o southwest louisiana during the overnight hours and wee hours of the morning. More than 7 inches of rain around lake charles. As we look into the next couple of days, about 3 to 5 inches expected in central louisiana. 6 inches or more in southwest louisiana, southeast texas. So a flooding concern definitely there for this labor day weekend. We are looking at the possibility of severe weather, slight risk for portions of the dakotas an into montana. Large hail, damaging winds the main threat. Were also going to be looking at that traveling farther to the east. By tomorrow, minneapolis, des moines, included in that severe threat. Some of our pick cities for your labor day weekend, chicago dealing with rain today and monday. High temperatures in the 80s. Well be looking at the possibility of some muchneeded rain across san antonio. Temperatures staying very, very warm. Orlando, youll be dodging afternoon showers as well. Gulf coast looks nasty across much of it for your labor day weekend. Temperatures are going to be warm. Rip currents a concern there. Also myrtle beach dealing with some showers today and monday. Brianna . All right, thanks, jennifer. I want to show you this incredible video of a small victory in iraq in the fight against isis. Iraqi soldiers today rescuing dozens of women and children from the besieged town north of baghdad. You can see the relief in the womens and childrens faces as they get aboard this Iraqi Military helicopter. More than 15,000 people are still trapped there under siege by isis fighters. Iraq and Kurdish Forces are advancing on the city. The fallout from questionable Police Actions in the aftermath of the death of Michael Brown. It continues after another officer retires. You may remember st. Louis police st. Louis county Police Officer dan page from this video that surfaced showing him ranting against president obama. Page was also seen pushing cnns don lemon during protests in fuerguson earlier this month. Come on, lets tgo. Thats whats happening here. The lieutenant who threatened and pointed an Assault Rifle at protesters also retired this weekend. A third officer in a nearby city was fired after making what his chief called very inappropriate Facebook Comments about the protests. Im Brianna Keilar in new york. The sixties begins right now. Stand by. Here we go. Take one. Watch the tv. The average Time Spent Watching Television is five to six hours per day. Holy residuals. Theres a reason for calling it the boob tube and idiot box. Lets change the channel. Here is the news. We must give the american
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