that, ismael? >> right after the first officer that responded was actually the officer that was fatally shot, this officer without any fear, he didn't care. he went -- he went up and stood up to that pillar, he was you know engaged in a firefight. came up to the back of the assailant, shot a few rounds. was not able to damage him or wound him at all. the assailant then turned around, came around the corner. the corner to where the back of the officer was. and he ended up shooting the officer point blank about maybe a foot, half a foot away. was just point blank. there is no way he was moving -- then stood over the police officer as he was down, and then shot him another three or four times in the back. and then extremely, extremely saddening and tragic to watch that happening. >> stand by. ismael, i want to bring in an anthony may who was an atf and explosives firearms expert. according to ismael, anthony may, he said it looked like clearly an ar-15, they say the shooter had lots of 30 round magazines, so many that were falling out of his pocket. when you look at the video, what do you see? >> well, it's kind of difficult to see, don, the 30 round magazine is a typical magazine with an ar-type weapon, we use the term ar-15, but there are a variety of weapons out there that look similar to that. they do have a large capacity and are able to fire in rapid succession on a semiautomatic mode. your eyewitness talked about how the officer apparently did engage and fired shots and the officer is carrying a standard duty weapon, either a 9 millimeter. and the guy is wearing body armor, up to and including level 4, that weapon would not do anything to the perpetrator as he turned around and engaged the officer. >> neil franklin, retired maryland state police officer. we hear all the time from law enforcement and even you know we talk to william bratton, the police commissioner here in the city. oftentimes he and other officers around the country are out-powered by people on the street. >> yeah, i mean, it's very true. this really began back in the 1980s, when we saw a rise in drug activity in our country. and gangs and crews were arming themselves for the business that they were in. and so then we law enforcement have been in a game of catch-up ever since. and it's a very, very troubling situation for law enforcement. but you know, we have to figure out a way to head in the other direction. i don't know how we're going to do that. it's going to be a very difficult task for us in this country. but we just -- we cannot continue to go in a direction of heavy fire power, more fire power again. you know, this is something for society to eventually deal with. >> as you look at the video, and i know it's very difficult to see. just in our system here at cnn. we haven't had time to enhance it or blow it up. what do you read in this? what does it tell you about a coordinated attack, the fire power, what does it tell you as a law enforcement expert? >> well, what it tells me is that this individual has really some skills. he is -- he appears to be very proficient with his firearm. from the time we came on the show to apprehension, so he has skill sets. again, the planning of it, we don't know. but if it is related to the incidents that occurred over the past couple of days it's very quick planning. or is this something elsewhere he had been planning something for a very, very long time and this scenario over the past couple of days presented an opportunity for him to put to use what he had been planning to do for a very long time. it's very difficult to believe he just decided to do this over the past 36 hours or so. >> do we have new video? or is this just the enhancement to the video? we have new video in to cnn. can we play it, please. [ gunfire ] [ sirens ] >> they're shooting right now. and there is an officer down. it's coming from the right over there. from around these buildings, i don't know where. main street and lamar. main street and lamar. there is an officer down. they're moving in on somebody. i think they might have got somebody. don't worry, i'm behind a tree. i think another officer is down around the corner over here. they got s.w.a.t. over here. i can't really -- i can't really get any closer. i'm safe, man, don't worry about it. i appreciate it, though, i love y'all. so they just -- >> and there is somebody else down over there. as you can see around this corner i don't know if y'all can see that. >> get over there! >> get out of the street! >> they're telling me to go, i got to go. i got everything, man, i got everything. all right, i'm going to have to switch over to another app, because i got -- i got to get my bosses in on this. all right, i love y'all. >> all right, so that video is from michael kevin on facebook. i'm going to rerack and play it. but tom verney, retired new york city police officer. this appears to be another angle of the same shooting we have some ismael dejesus. so walk us through it. there is a lot of fire power and lots of officers are on the scene pretty quickly. >> yes, well, as the other gentleman was talking about he talked about the shooter being on one of the pile ons of that building. and this guy is clearly well armed and very well protected. and certainly out-gunning the officer. so unfortunately he was able to shoot him, and to add insult to injury after he was down he basically executed him. after he grabbed him around the corner it was just a horrific situation taking place down there. >> well, we do know according to the police there was one suspect in a shootout. one can assume possibly this is a suspect. and the one who is in custody this evening. you heard him say ismael dejesus, who we had on the phone live saying the suspect pulled up. the shooter pulled up in a dark suv. put his flashers on, started shooting randomly in the intersection and then was engaged by the police officer. and then shot that officer which we saw on two different sets of video sets. and then as tom said, shot him execution style. also, when we saw the police out on the interstate earlier, from the aerial shot we were wondering what was going on. we were being told by the dallas police officer, the public information officer that there are other persons of interest being questioned. a dallas police officer observed a person carrying a camouflage bag walking by a police officer, a mercedes sped off in a high rate of speed. officers then followed the vehicle on i-35 east, and performed a traffic stop. and police are questioning both occupants of the vehicle now. so that is what we saw earlier from the video shot. from the technology age, it's just unbelievable the things you get on camera. we have witnessed the execution sadly of a dallas police officer. one of four killed this evening. is ismael dejesus still on the phone? ismael, are you there? ismael is not there anymore. anthony may is here. i want you to take a look at this video, anthony, and read to us what you are seeing from this angle as well. >> well, i'm going to have to agree that the perpetrator here is fairly well armed. you said he pulled up in the suv and gets out and randomly shoots. it appears he was trying to draw police into that area. to engage them in this. he is very well trained and must be, must be wearing body armor. i'm sure those officers didn't waste an opportunity to take a shot at him to try to take him out. but apparently he was still able to continue with what he was doing. the officers -- talk about being out h out-gunned. that has been a problem for our criminal officers. and they were in a state where people were complaining that the police were looking like military with the bear cats and these other types of equipment. well, that type of equipment would have been very useful here. in these early stages. so you know the complaint of militarizing the police, they're out-gunned. they need to be able to match the fire power out there on the street. >> yeah, i want to go to the law enforcement experts, neil franklin, you talked about this other video. what do you see? >> yeah, it's very difficult to see exactly what is going on from these angles with the police cars in front. but obviously, we have a number -- a large number of police personnel on the scene. and yet one person is still able to hold them at bay. it reminds me of the bank robbery in l.a. many years ago, i believe it was in the '90s where the two bank robbers were heavily apartmermed. semiautomatic rifles, and heavy body armor. they held police at bay for a long time and injured a lot of police officers. it went on for quite sometime. we heard that this individual may be wearing body armor, it's highly likely from the report from one of your witnesses there who filmed the video there, i believe from the hotel room. and this is one of the things that unfortunately this is what law enforcement is facing today. as we attempt to do our job. >> yeah, and again being, as anthony may said being out-powered and out-gunned on the streets there has been lots of discussion about whether police departments should be militarized. and there is you know, obviously a difference in thinking. some people believe it is too much. as anthony may said, others believe you have to keep up with the criminals because they have bigger and better guns than police officers. >> yeah, and neil brought up a good point earlier. i came to the police department in 1992. and started out with a revolver. and switched to 9 millimeters to glocks because that is what we were facing in the street at the time. neil is correct to bring that out. this was in the early '90s and he mentioned the '80s as well. and now you deal with the situation where people are walking around with ar-15s, or some other large sniper rifle with a large capacity magazine. and when you get somebody who is clearly deranged. for all practical purposes this is a terrorist act, committed by a crackpot with a fire power, so i understand the apprehension, saying the police should not be militarized, but with the public at large you have to be able to have hands-on -- >> you say a crack pot, but a guest said it appears he was trying to draw officers in in order to injure the officers. and by the way, condolences to the families of the officers, can you imagine what they were dealing? >> you can be smart and still be crazy. think of the mental place where this person is in that they feel the need to start picking off police officers. as enraged as they have been by events, we don't know what drove them to it. i find it hard to believe that it's a coincidence, but somebody who feelins the need to assassinate police officers. >> but totally tips over into the gun debate. this idea of having to match fire power for whatever people can have on the street, because what we're seeing is that there are a lot more types of these weapons. and this is where i think a lot of minds can meet. we want our police officers to be safe and our communities to be safe and the more of these sorts of weapons out there the more that police have to defend themselves against those types of weapons. again, we don't know about this. i think it's a discussion for another day but i think we need to put a pin in it because we have to come to this discussion about the idea that more and more people are in open carry states. they can carry these sorts of weapons around. police don't know if the person who has the weapon out in the open is just a protester or not and that puts them in a very kind of awkward position of having to make guesses about it. >> and areva martin, how much more fire power, where does it end? go ahead, areva. >> yes, i wanted to say i think the point was illustrated by one of the witnesses on the phone. they say we saw a man, probably not the shooter. but he was a man walking around with a rifle and they didn't know if it was normal or not. that is scary to me as a parent, as an american, a woman, an african-american woman that i could be in a city at a protest and someone is walking around with a high powered assault rifle and yet, i don't know if that is okay. because we're telling people if you see something, say something, if you see something, do something. but people are confused. they don't know if that was a legitimate place for him to be with that gun or not. so i wonder how many other people may have seen somebody at this protest with a gun and they didn't contact law enforcement because they didn't know if that person had the right in this open carry state to have that gun. that is a really scary -- i think proposition. an issue we have to deal with in this country. and it goes right to that gun issue. >> and if i may say, open carry just started in january in texas so this is a new phenomenon for all the citizens there. as to whether or not you see somebody with a weapon do you say something or not? >> and we'll get into the gun debate later. and as charles so brightly and eloquently pointed out that is maybe a discussion for another day. right now our thoughts and prayers and our hearts go out to the victims this evening. and that is the 11 officers shot and of course the four police officers killed and their family and friends. and all of their brothers and comrades around the country who are tonight i'm sure watching this in fear. and they're scared. and sad. and saddened by it. and neil franklin brought up the point earlier, it was with a shaky cracking voice saying it just reminds him of officers and friends who he has lost. you know, for -- for people who you know, shoot and kill police officers. neil? >> yeah, so -- while -- yeah, this whole gun debate is for another day. but also the militarization piece, yes, we need these pieces of equipment in law enforcement. what is really important is when we deploy them, when they're available the image that we portray, how we use them. again, not using them when there are non-violent protests. not having them out in the open. but they should be readily available and the people who are assigned to use and properly trained with very strict protocol about when and how they can use them for different situations, we've got a lot of work ahead of us in this country again, and i'm going to repeat this again, with the violence in general. >> can i ask you something, neil? >> yes. >> so ismael dejesus, who is one of the eyewitnesss who took the videotape, i think he said this is terrorism, right? tom, you said that this was a terrorist act. neil, do you think it's terrorism? >> well, yeah, i mean, it's a form of terrorism. because it's something that causes us -- it's an act of a person or people that is causing us to change our way of life. how we live, how we go about our daily business. and right now i guarantee you there are a lot of people watching this unfold who have been watching it for the past couple of hours. they're going to change the way they conduct business on a daily basis, how they go about their lives. so whether it's -- you know, despite the intent, whether it's terrorism from you know isis or whether it's terrorism from one of our home grown groups or organizations, or whether it's terrorism from one individual it's terrorism. it's causing us to alter our way of life and freedoms in this country. >> anthony may, same question. >> anthony may, are you there? >> and no one agency can agree on what -- >> anthony can you start over, we missed the first part of the response. >> yeah, the problem with terrorism, there are so many definitions of the term, terrorism, and different agencies and definitions. but clearly, this act is not a random somebody that just got upset a few hours ago and decided to go in downtown dallas and start shooting. this is something that was pre-planned. equipment was purchased for this. and they went out to create as much terror as they can. and our police officers, they're doing their job in an active shooter situation. they're not standing around waiting for s.w.a.t. and you saw the other officers engage with their handguns, going after them with a long gun. that is why they can't take a knife to a gun fight in this particular manner with those handguns. but terrorism, yes, there is no doubt. our cities are being terrorized now. and what we need to understand, not all terrorism comes from the arab nations or isis or al qaeda or boko haram, or like that. we have a lot of terrorist groups that are active in the united states that have the ability to do what happened here tonight in dallas. >> i have some new information to report here as we watch the situation unfold in dallas. and this new video, two different videos that have come into cnn. so the fbi and local authorities respond. and this is according to our local justice correspondent evan perez. the fbi and local authorities responded to a possible hostage situation at the el community college. the police have cleared the omni hotel. there were reports that there was a gunman holed up. but that appears not to be true. also, i need to tell you that they have restricted and stopped the -- the faa says it has issued a temporary flight restrict over downtown dallas over the area where the shooting occurred. now i want to bring in sarah murvash from the dallas morning news, she is on the phone. sarah, what information do you have for us? >> so things have calmed down here a lot in downtown dallas. a few hours ago, tons of police arrest protesters were on the scene. i witnessed one person get arrested. it was not a shooter, the protester, wearing a mask. but things are calmer now, i can see one officer in the parking garage where theshooting. he is up on the fifth or sixth floor. >> do you know anybody about the other suspects because they were saying that they had one suspect in custody? one person of interest in custody, but they fear there could be more people involved. have you heard anything about that, sarah? >> so i have not personally confirmed anything. i know there was a sort of car chase on interstate 35, where there was some sort of package, it sounded like there was another suspect there. but i have not confirmed that. the person of interest, it sounded like there was a suspect, a separate person of interest who i talked to people who said that person was in the area with them and not a shooter. according to the protesters themselves. >> so yes. so what happened to the incident on i-35, they witnessed a person throwing a bag into a mercedes, and they had two persons of interest. sarah you say it is calmed down, but still not back to normal? >> oh, definitely not, this is the most crowded i have seen downtown in the four years that i have lived here this time of night. people, witnesses are out walking their dog s to see what was going on. i spoke to one, a son, a black boy, 16 years old. he is wearing patriotic gear and had his hands up as the cops drove by just to be safe. >> yeah, have you been able, sarah, to -- excuse me. to look at any of the video coming in, because there is lots of video, it appears of the suspect shooting and coming into news sources. >> reporter: i interviewed one of the marchers who took a facebook video. a facebook live video of the shooting itself. and i have seen that. >> michael kevin -- was it michael kevin? >> reporter: michael -- >> same person, go ahead. >> reporter: and so he witnessed what he said was the first officer go down. and he saw that officer being dragged into a car. the officer could not move or get up on his own. >> all right, sarah mervosh from the dallas morning news, sarah, thank you so much. and referring to the video you see on the screen right now, shot by this and michael kevin on facebook. again, he witnessed the shooting. the same -- it appears to be the same shooting of the officer from a different angle, as ismael dejesus, who was in a hotel in the area who shot the video from this, of a higher angle from his balcony. he said he came out just around 10 p.m. eastern time because he heard shots. pulled out his camera and saw an suv that was parked. and a man who was shooting randomly into an intersection. and then police -- at least one officer engaged him. and then he turned around and started shooting the officer. and then eventually ended up firing at the officer execution style. and one witness said they believe they saw them put the officer into a vehicle and rushed him off to the hospital. we do know at this point four dallas police officers are dead. 11 shot in a chaotic scene happening in the business district of dallas tonight. right during a protest that initially was peaceful. we're seeing on the air for you this evening. because we're awaiting a news conference and update from dallas police at any moment. they gave us one a couple of hours ago led by the chief, david brown. and at that point, you know, the information was a bit different. there were not as many officer whose had died then. the number of injured was just one shy. they also told us in the press conference that there was one civilian injured in all of this as well. there were several officers who were still being treated and still in critical condition. but hopefully, the number of injured and killed will not go up this evening. and i want to say as often and as strongly as possible, that our thoughts and prayers go out to the officers and their families and their colleagues and friends involved in all of this. police officers around the country are watching this and saddened by it and also frightened. as some of our guests have pointed out this evening, we are now living in a culture of fear for police officers, who are being shot by citizens and a culture of fear of citizens who are in fear of being shot by police officers and also in fear of people walking down their own streets in fear of being victims in their neighborhood. and neil franklin, a retired maryland police officer. police major is here, tom verney is a retired police officer, detective from new york. areva, talk to me about the culture of fear. that is indeed one of the truest things said this evening. >> yeah, i think we can't over-emphasize this, don. we started the show a couple of hours ago talking about the police shootings in baton rouge and minnesota. and we were going to talk about the courageous woman, the fiancee of mr. castile, who did that facebook live video. and now, here we are three hours later looking at facebook video. looking at video that was taken by citizens and how the video was used to show us the violent exchange with the police officer and that woman, the fiancee and her little girl in the back seat. and now to look at the violence on the video that we have been watching for the last hour of this police officer being shot. and the shootout between the police officer and the suspect. this violence is not something that is abstract. not something that is removed from us. it's something that we all witness on a daily basis through these types of videos. and it's chilling, having a traumatic impact on us, not just our kids but all of us. and i think i'm sitting here almost numb watching this violence play out as we start at the couple of hours talking about horrific murders of citizens. and we're ending three hours talking about four dead police officers. it's just mind boggling, don. >> and as you can see, areva, and the audience, we're waiting for the news conference from the dallas police officer. charles blow, where do we go from here? because this is not a world i want to live in. >> right, and a couple of the guests before were talking about terror and how you define it. and i think as a society we have to say who among us at this point is not living with some level of fear of terror? right, that if the police officers feel like they are in fear of their lives, when in cases like this, which are obviously -- which are obviously terror attacks. but also just in comments with individual citizens, but also the citizens feel that terror. >> let's go to the press conference now in dallas. keep you updated with as much information as we have realtime. and that is the purpose of this press conference. i'll make a couple of comments after chief brown. and then we'll hear a couple of questions. and then you probably won't hear from us in person until in the morning again. we will be sending information out as we get it on line. i do want to say that i have -- heard from both the white house and the governor's office. extending their help and we're sure going to be able to use some help from the governor's office and we've got so many police officers out tonight that we want to make sure that they're backed in the right way. but there is news to be given to you. and i'll let the chief talk about that. >> currently we are in negotiations with a suspect involved in these shootings at the garage in downtown dallas. the suspect that we have negotiated with has been exchanging gunfire with us, and not being very cooperative with the negotiations. before i came here i asked for plans to end this standoff and as soon as i am done here i'll be presented with those plans. in addition to this second floor garage, as we recap the previous press release, we have in custody a female who was in the same area of the el central garage. and we followed a mercedes with two suspects who had camouflage bags, who officers ended up stopping on traffic in the old cliff area near polk and 67. and they are in custody and being interviewed. the suspect that we are negotiating with that has exchanged gunfire with us over the last 45 minutes has told our negotiators that the end is coming. and he is going to hurt and kill more of us, meaning law enforcement. and that there are bombs all over the place in this garage and in downtown. so we are being very careful in our tactics so we don't injure our citizens in dallas as we negotiate further. we still don't have a complete comfort level that we have all the suspects. so we will continue a very, very rigorous investigation and search of downtown. we'll likely be working throughout the early morning hours of friday. until we are satisfied that all suspects have been captured. and have an opportunity to be interviewed so that we can fully understand what has motivated this attack on our officers. as i mentioned in the press release before we came out one of our officers who was in surgery that we had hopes would survive passed, bringing the total count of officers that passed away to four. three dallas police officers and one dart officer. we're continuing to ask for the public's prayers and support and encouragement. but i could just tell you i've never been more proud of a police officer and being a part of this great noble profession, seeing the courage, the professionalism. and just the grit to stay on scene in an area looking for suspects, knowing we are vulnerable. we don't know where they are. and our downtown is very large with a lot of high buildings and some of the stories i've heard from officers talking about what happened, running toward gunfire to help the injured. officers to get them transported to the hospital by patrol car. not having the time to wait for an ambulance and just so many stories of great courage. so we continue to fight the good fight to bring this to a conclusion. but it's still a very tenuous situation. and again, we as soon as the mayor is done we'll take additional questions from you. then we'll have to be leaving. thanks. >> thank you. >> concerning what is going to happen tomorrow morning this is still an active crime scene. and we are determining right now how big that crime scene is. there are many people that work in the downtown area. we ask them to stay away from that crime scene. now how are you going to know where it is? we're going to post it on dallas city news.net. and you can check with your buildings that you work in, and make sure that those buildings are open. we've got to support our police force and do their job to make sure we get to the bottom and the root cause of all of this. so please, make it easy for the police force and other citizens to check your traffic routes in the morning before you -- you come in. i want to add that it is a heartbreaking morning to lose these four officers. that proudly served our citizens. to say that our police officers put their life on the line every day is no hyperbole, ladies and gentlemen. it's a reality. we as a city, we as a country, must come together, lock arms and heal the wounds that we all feel from time to time. words matter. leadership matters at this time. i'm proud of our chief. with that we'll take questions. >> is this someone local -- what brought this person to dallas? >> at this point, we don't have a lot of cooperation to find those answers. but we will be continuing our interrogation of the people we have in custody. we just are not getting the cooperation we would like to know that answer of why. the motivation, who they are, but our detectives are d s are discussing it with these people. >> you believe they were all working together? >> that is our assumption, working together with rifles, t triangulated at different points where the march ended up going. so there had to be some speculation from us that there was knowledge of where the route would be, otherwise how would you know where to be? but we're waiting for the suspects to break and let us know what they're doing. >> but it's clear you have a lot of resources at your disposal. were these people on anyone's radar? you have the fbi here and i know you have a lot of other agencies. we were monitoring social media and had attended many of the planning meetings for the protest group. and we have yet to determine whether or not there was some complicity with this. >> do you know if they were with the rally or holed up at that time? >> that has yet to be determined. >> there was a person on facebook making comments about the shooting of dallas police officers. did you guys take a look at that? was that person involved in any way? >> yet to be determined. there is a lot of things that get posted on social media that we monitor and follow up on, whether or not there was connections to that post with any of the suspects we have yet to determine. but we have yet to determine to a connection that we can prove and charge a person with. >> the chief and i have some business. h he has got to make some tough calls. he and i are going to go to the hospital. right now it's important that we do that. >> our sympathies, chief. >> okay, that was a police conference, news conference that is being wrapped up just a short time ago with the police chief david brown and also mayor mike rawlings, giving us new information. also the mayor being very emotional. let me give you the readout here. what they're saying they are still now trying to engage with the suspect who is in a garage there. and he is still shooting with them. so there is a standoff. they say he is in the second story, a two-story garage. still in the standoff with police. they're still shooting. there has been gunfire exchanged. they're also telling us that they have three people in custody. one of them is a female. the other two people came from the car. we saw it on the interstate just earlier where there was -- where we saw all of the police cars flashing lights or what have you on the interstate and there was somewhat of a chase. according to the mayor and to the police chief there the suspects are not cooperating. they said they don't know who the person is in the garage. they're not giving up any information. they're not being very cooperative. they're also saying that the person -- that the person in the garage saying the end is coming. they're going to hurt more of us. hurt more police officers. law enforcement officers. so that there were bombs that were placed all over the place. they don't know where the bombs are being placed. they said that basically almost the entire downtown is an active crime scene and they don't know how big the scene is and they don't know who is going to be able to get to their place of business tomorrow. their work tomorrow. and if they want to find out they need to go to dallascitynews.net to see if you can get to your job tomorrow. the mayor said at a very poignant moment, with his voice cracking, that it is a heartbreaking moment for dallas. it is not just hyperbole, he said, for police officers who put their lives on the line every day. it is a reality. again, we don't know why the suspect was doing it. not cooperating. he said the suspects were, he believes, were working together in a triangulated area downtown, through elevated areas, as well, targeted and leaving us to believe that this had been planned. and it appears to have been planned in a coordinated fashion in order to do this, it would have to be planned over a period of time. so we're being careful, although this did happen when the protests were going on, as neil franklin, our retired maryland police major pointed out we need to be careful about that because we don't know if indeed it is involved. it happened during the protests, but in order to coordinate something in that amount of time it just seems like it was a short period of time. it could be, but we don't know at this point. the police chief also saying that four officers are dead. they were hoping that one of them would pull through. he was in critical condition. but they were hoping that one would pull through. four dead, three of them are dallas police officers. one of them is a dart officer, which is a dallas area rapid transit officer. 11 people -- 11 police officers, total shot. and then one civilian. and he said that he is asking for prayers. for people to pray. and for the citizens of dallas, basically to be vigilant, and what i'm reading into that is he is saying maybe you should think about not going to work tomorrow, if you work in downtown dallas. and here is what is interesting, why, they don't know how long this operation is going to go on because they're still in negotiations, in a standoff. in negotiations in a standoff with one suspect and they are not confident they have all the suspects in custody at this point. this is suburb. >> it also seemed based on what he was saying, the people that they do have in custody are not all that willing to cooperate. so that is extremely unnerving that these people are already in custody and they're not forthcoming with their information to cooperate with the police. i would absolutely advise people who work in the downtown dallas area, if you can take tomorrow off tomorrow may be a good day to take off. police are going to have an unbelievable investigation on their hands. you know, we don't know the scale of what is taking place tonight. we don't know how many actors are involved so until police feel confident that they have rounded up all the people they needed to round up that people needed to be extremely cautious if the people who live in the downtown area see something that is out of the ordinary of the area that they live in or even work in, for the overnight people they need to report it immediately just to make sure all the bases are covered to make sure that every single person that possibly is involved gets apprehended and you know, my condolences to the families of the officers. and you know, kudos to the chief. he has got a tremendous, unbelievable scenario that is unfolding by the minute. which i'm sure they had not planned on -- starting off -- >> yeah, i just wanted to say one of the things that the chief said was he talked about the fact he believes or at least at this point they believe the shooters may have had knowledge about the route of the protests because of where they were posted throughout the route. and you also said that the police were involved in the planning of this rally. so i just hope that to the extent anyone involved with the planning of what was going to be this incredibly powerful yet peaceful protest, if they have any information that they come forward. that they give that information to the police. because what i know about the protesters that have been protesting the shootings of african-american men by police is that they want to protest in a peaceful way. they have been for the most part been peaceful. they wanted to lift and raise the issue of police shootings but not in any way that would cause any harm or damage or injury and definitely not death of police officers. so i hope anyone that was involved in the planning of that rally that may have information that they cooperate fully with the police. >> go ahead, charles. >> right, and there is two things that the chief said that i found really fascinating. one was you know, the idea that he has been told by -- at least one of the suspects that they have bombs planted all around downtown. and that may just be bluster. however, if this turns out to be true, in the last 36 hours -- the building of, the transporting of explosives is not something you do in the last minute. the second thing is kind of something he actually did not say. which is whether or not they had id on them or whether or not the truck the guy got was registered which would lead you at least to know whether or not they were local people or something else. and one thing he did not say is i think a lot of america is very interested and keen to know at this point was whether or not they associated themselves in any way with the protests, he may not know very much, but it didn't give any indication so far that that was in associate that the suspects were willing to make at this point. >> i hear you saying yes, but people are pointing out to me that there was a woman and other men in custody that did not give any other information about ethnicity or anything like that. >> i find that interesting as well. they want to id these people quickly and have ways they can do that without the cooperation. something that still sticks in my mind is what is the significance of dallas when there hasn't been, none of these incidents that we started to show with the shooting in baton rouge and missouri, what's the significance of dallas. why pick this protest in dallas unless this group of the individuals are based in dallas which is probably likely because the transporting of the weapons and explosive if that is in fact the case. >> knowledge of the city and knowledge of the routes. >> knowledge of a lot of knowledge and obviously they are not flying in by plane from either up north or baton rouge. i guess driving in from louisiana, i guess you could do that in a short period of time, but what's the significance of dallas? why not baton rouge? why not missouri. protests are occurring there. that's sticking with me as well. >> why not minneapolis where the shooting happened just overnight that we were reporting. you bring up a good point and i did find it interesting that the details they did give and details they did not give. i'm sure doing it on purpose because investigative techniques. >> you can't show all your carts. this is clearly an active investigation. there is going to be some things that you put out there and they are in an active negotiation with the shooter. >> it's some sort of terrorist group and it could be. look at the san bernardino shooters. it had to be during a holiday party. is that a coincidence? that was the time they chose. this was a clear opportunity for the person or a group of people to use the armament they clearly have to cause all kinds of chaos and targeting the police. the fact that there was a bystander that was shot with the proximity of the police and that was a shot that they meant to shoot the police and missed, it's disturbing across the board. i mentioned before that my condolences to the families as we started off this broadcast, each of these incidents that someone dies as a result of their interaction with the police. absolutely should be investigated to the fullest extent to find out what was the cause of why things ended up the way they did. baton rouge is a separate situation from what happened in minneapolis. and they have to be investigated and brought to their -- make our judgments on each case. if race has something to do with either of those or both, that's a serious problem. the president made a statement that we can do better as a country. this is not doing better. regardless of whether or not the country was upset about what happened in minneapolis, things have to be changed to make sure that that doesn't happen again. this is not the answer. complete and utter chaos for anyone. >> this is just me, and the person who perpetrated this act was listening to the president today. >> they were out planning this. >> the president comes out to make sure. >> i don't think that the people were part of the protest that wants to raise the issue up on police brutality. this is not the mo of the typical protesters. >> it does seem odd. what were you saying? >> i agree 100% and doubt it seriously. from my experience, this is an independent group organization of folk who is came together to inflict harm with their own agenda. we need the police to get a quick handle on it to find out who else is involved. i doubt it if the ones that you currently have app handed and the ones they are trying to apprehend, i doubt it if they were the only ones. i mentioned earlier about the significance of cell phones. cell phones had to be used to coordinate this attack. the police had the cell phones that would have been used and quickly accessed them to find out who else may be involved. >> when i was talking about that in the background, why is that? are we had a number of homegrown terrorist groups and we pay tension to the muslim terrorist groups from isis and al qaeda. we have a number of groups that are up to terrorizing groups of peop people. i don't know what the fbi is doing behind the scenes, but we still need to make sure we have a good handle on those groups as well. >> i asked this earlier and said i don't want to live in fear like this. where do we go to? what do we do from here? >> i think we all have to go home and kiss our loved ones and say prayers and roll up our sleeves and get to work. i think there are solutions to these problems. i think we saw efforts being made in the congress a couple of weeks ago around this issue of guns. what types of guns people should be allowed to have and who should be allowed to have them. the answers are here in front of us and it is a question of our will and courage to face these difficult complex issues. i think we can solve them. i'm with the president. we can do better. >> okay. we can do better. every time there is a mass shooting, everyone said this will change it. you have 20 something kid who is die at a school and people who die in a church. you have terrorist acts that happen all over the country and everyone said you know, this will change it. none of these acts seem to change anything. >> isn't that the depressing thing. >> it's the reality of it. is this the final one? >> you asked yourself how much blood has to be spilled to change their mind and it seems like we haven't reached that. >> people at least work together. >> working together is changing minds. there are minds that refuse to be changed on these particular kinds of issues. i think again, we have to figure out who is this? where did the weaponry come from? how did they obtain it? was it legal or illegal or whatever? at the end of the day, we know this for a fact. a group of people have used a certain source of weapons, at least some of these weapons to terrorize and shoot 11 cops, kill four of them in a major american city. that's not separate from the decisions about whether or not we want to have a debate. these are the choices that we are making if in fact depending on how they obtained the weapons. that's something we have to wrestle with. >> we are wrestling with a lot. what a day it was. we went to bed with the shooting in baton rouge and then minneapolis, minnesota. all caught live on tape. we end the day and begin the morning with 11 police officers shot. four dead in dallas. and police and city leaders calling for calm and saying police officers put their lives on the line is reality. we have to figure out how we get a grip on all of this. on violence and citizen violence and all of this coming together as a country and how they said so eloquently today. as we are about to go off the air on this broadcast, the headline is ambush with a photo of a grief-stricken police officer where the wounded officers were taken. stay with us for the latest on this. i'm don lemon. our coverage continues with john and aisha. welcome to our viewers in the united states and around the world. >> breaking news out of dallas, texas. >> four officers have been shot dead and two snipers from an elevated position in a peaceful protest. >> 11 officers were shot and at least one civilian was wounded as well. police have three people in custody including a woman. this is what it sounded like from a nearby apartment. >> oh, my god. there is people laying on the ground. i hope they are just hiding. >> somebody is really armed to the t. this is not one person. this is a person with a big -- [ gunshots ] >> one suspect is out cornered in a parking garage and there is how the police chief described the ongoing negotiations. >> we are in negotiations with a suspect involved in the shootings at the garage of el centroin downtown dallas. he was not cooperative in the negotiations. before i came here, i asked for plans to end this standoff. as soon as i'm done here, i will be presented with the plans. in addition this second floor garage as we recap the previous press release, we have in custody a female who was in the same area of the garage and we followed a mercedes with two suspects who had camouflaged bags who officers end up stopping on traffic in the area near polk and 67th. they are in custody and being interviewed. the suspect that we are negotiating with that has exchanged gunfire with us over the last 45 minutes has told our negotiators that the end is coming. he is going to hurt and kill more of us, meaning law enforcement. there are bombs all over the place in this garage and downtown. we are being very careful in our tactics so that we don't injury our put any of our officers in harm's way including the citizens of dallas as we negotiate further. we still don't have a complete comfort level that we have all the suspects. we will continue a very, very rigorous investigation and search of downtown. we are likely to be working throughout the early morning hours of friday until we are satisfied that all suspects have been captured. we have an opportunity to be interviewed so that we can fully understand what's motivated this attack on our officers. >> that is the seen right now in dallas as the police chief was talking. this was the moment at the end of a peaceful protest when the gunfire erupted. hundreds turned out to demonstrate the shooting of two african-american men earlier this week and shows the chaos on the ground as the bullets started firing. >> a bomb squat secured the suspicious package and you heard from the police chief that they are still making searches in and around downtown after this cornered suspect said they planted bombs. here's a lock at the front page of friday's dallas morning news. >> the headline reads ambush along with a powerful photograph of a woman accompanying a police officer after the shootings. ashley landis joins us now on the line. downtown is considered a massive crime scene. what's happening there right now? >> right now, hello, by the way. had right now everything is in order, i think. the police are still sweeping the city. that's when it looks like to me, anyway. most of the people have gone home and figured out ways to go home and there are tons and tons of vehicles that are stranded. a lot of people are taking quite a while for everyone to clear out. >> ashley, you mentioned the police are sweeping the area. talk to me about what you are able to see. what are they doing? what does it look like from your vantage point? >> i see s.w.a.t. officers with gear and shields and everything. in the parking garages, looking through and making sure. this is total speculation on my part. i haven't talked to the police officers about what they are doing. i am standing in a parking lot and have been for a couple of hours and i have seen them go from building to building and make sure they are not looking for another shooter. >> ashley, you were at the protest when the shooting began. can you describe what that scene was like? >> yeah. i was about the middle of the pack where several hundred people were. it was peaceful and i didn't see threats of any kind. i was in the middle of the pack when everyone started running towards me. i tried not to get trampled and i didn't know if they were reacting to a fight or a backfire on a car or something like that. as i got closer and i saw more police officers rushing towards the scene, i heard gunfire and i was around the corner and i went up to the parking garage right there. the el centro parking garage nearby and there were s.w.a.t. officers trying to secure the building. they swept us out and everyone was making sure they were safe and they swept us out across the street and pushed us back from that. it was mass chaos for a while. >> you saw people being trampled in the chaos? >> it was the kind of situation that could have been very terrible really quickly. more terrible than it already was. i didn't see anyone hurt. everywhere got away from the area safely. it was still very chaotic. everyone was running from the scene. >> a photographer for the dallas morning news there on the line from dallas with the very latest. thank you. >> appreciate that. we are about to show dramatic video from the shooting in downtown as it began to unfold. extremely dramatic and the video shows police running with guns pulled out. you can hear more gunshots and you see an officer on the ground. [ gunshots ] >> they are shooting and there is an officer down. i don't know where main street and lamar. >> i'm behind a tree. i think another officer is down around the corner over here. they got s.w.a.t. over here. i can't get any closer. i'm safe. don't worry about it. i appreciate it though. i love y'all. so they just dragged one of the officers into the police car right here. there is somebody else down over there. you can see around this corner, i don't know if y'all can see that. they are telling me to go. i gotta go. i got everything, man. i got everything. i'm going to have to switch over to another app. i have to get my bosses on this. i love y'all. >> down in los angeles, cnn contributor former fbi agent and counter terrorism agent, tim clemente. >> the civil rights attorney, thank you to all of you for being with us. looking at that video we shared with the viewers, you look at that and what jumps out at you? >> what i see are uniformed officers not knowing where the shots are coming from. that is standard when you have a sniper. they have high ground and you can get a quad rant and maybe they are coming from you here, but that's all you know. you have to stay basically on the ground low. you don't even know if you can pop up to take a look. the sniper could take you out. one is corner and the chief of police said he wanted to play to bring that to an end. what about the options? >> it's to try to keep this guy alive if possible. he is a threat to the police and public at large. the benefit of keeping him alive long enough to find out if there other shooters and what others might be involved and where they might be locate and how to disable them and who has the command and control. maybe he does have a death wish, but are others going to be in greater danger? >> they are exchanging gunfire. it's not going to be helpful. >> the police obviously have the capability to use their own snipers and they are out with the armored vehicles. they would have a great capability. i was a sniper for the fbi and they are specific in their usefulness. they are not giving green light to kill anybody. it has to be a reason why you take somebody out and that's the threat to their lives or your. also that there are bombs he placed in and around downtown dallas. >> the problem is that no bombs had gone off and in the middle of an attack, some might have gone off already. the longer it goes without a sign of an ied, the less you are believing this. how often do you have two snipers? the police could have taken them already. they could have him. this could have been over. this is how much care they are taking to take him alive for the intelligence reasons that tim discussed. so that it dispels some of the myth that all police are trying to kill people. >> to you, we still don't know motivation for this attack. we don't know who carried out the attack and people are making a lot of assumptions. why should we be careful or why should people not assume too much? >> we have to be extremely careful because as i watch the press conference, they never made an association between the protest and baton rouge and minneapolis with what's happening on the ground in dallas. he talked about the things that they know about the shooters, but he never made a correct correlation and we have to be cautious. what i know about the peaceful protesters around this country who have been out trying to raise the issue around police brutality is they are not snipers or people armed or people who have the intentionality of harming police officers. this is not the mo of the typical protester that we have seen over the last couple of years. we have to be cautious and use our judgment and wait on the facts. the police are going to get to the bottom of who these people are. we can't associate the people protesters. >> there is a lot that is not known and thing that has been said over the last couple of hours on the air, these kinds of situations, what we are seeing playing out in dallas deepens a sense of fear. fear on both sides. amongst police officers and of course we know in the black community they are talking about the sense of feeling under attack among some. talk to us about that and the implications of what is playing out in dallas. >> no doubt about it, everyone is at a heightened sense of fear. when you wake up on tuesday and you hear about the alton sterling case and now thursday into friday, 11 officers, four who are dead. of course everyone is fearful. this is a culture of fear that we live in. we have to talk to our children not just about the horrific video that we saw with alton sterling, but now a police officer being gunned down by a criminal. our kids have to live with this terror. we have to live with it. i think the president talked about how we have to come together and we have to have empathy and do better as a country. i think his words, they mean so much more even now because when he was talking earlier this evening, he was talking about the two police shootings. he was not talking about what we watched unfold in dallas. the words have more meaning and we pray for the families of the police officers who have been tragically gunned down. >> everybody, please stand by. we have a lot more here on the situation in dallas. in the meantime, we will take a short break and come back in a moment with more on the officers who are shot at this peaceful protest. they were out there protesting police brutality. you are watching cnn. at the beginning of the 21st century, the earth needed to find a new way to keep up with the data from over 30 billion connected devices. just 30 billion? 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>> they told don lemon more about what he saw. >> they came out to the balcony and i did hear popping sounds and thought it was fireworks at first. a man had a rifle and ar 15 clear as day. pretty big magazine. you can see on the video here, he drops a few mags. >> behind the railing, this is him next to the column, correct? >> this is him right here to the right that was white pillar. shooting to the bft. he turns around and shoots to the right and the other side of the pillar. he was shooting at something and aiming at somebody. he turned around and checked his back and it didn't end very well. that is the officer shot right there. it looked like the execution. they shot them maybe three or four more times and i don't know if he was confirmed dead, but he was down for about five more minutes. >> back with us again here in los angeles, they had the former terrorism agent. are you looking at that video of the shooter there. the witness said it looked like body armor and he knew how to use it. he wasn't an amateur. >> unfortunately he is shooting that officer and point blank range. he shot them from about 15 or 20 feet away. went up to the officer and shot him more times in the back according to this witness. not a high level of skill necessary for that. the officer is outgunned if this has a vary ant and the length of the barrel makes it much more accurate. even with greater training and skill that the officer may have had. he is mismatched in the battle. you will note that the officer ran towards this man even though he was outgunned. this is the epitome of what he does each day. as a rule, they put their lives on the line for the average person every day. >> knowing that the officers were executed in dallas, your feelings was going through your mind and the conversation among law enforcement tonight. >> my feelings besides revulsion and grief is that we need to keep a calm head here. law enforcement has to show that we are above vigilanteism. we have to prove that the vast majority of law enforcement are brave, good people. we need to prove through this the integrity of law enforcement. >> the planning that went into this, the snipers on roof tops, that i triangulated to shoot as many police as possible. it looks like they were training with at least some preparation. >> what i mean and it's possible that it's not necessary to do what they did. they have the advantage and what height gives you is the advantage to hide behind the police car. it's hard to get protection from a low object. they are trying to engage that gunman on the ground. that's because of a long gun. the greater capacity of a weapon. as far as the planning, it couldn't have gone very far in advance. they couldn't have been planning this for months. this is spur of the moment. and most, every attacker is by preattack surveillance. they saw the presence here tonight to protect this protest and the peaceful protesters that are out there marching that have ever right. and they toox advantage of the situation by trying to kill these officers. >> we have to go to break, but do you agree with that assessment? >> generally. my blink on this and i could be wrong, this was an attack planned long before waiting for an opportunity to go. they may not have planned the location and the advantage points. that's the guess. >> possibly in camouflage. that does make sense. you have to stick with us. we will take a short break. stay with us on cnn. we are following breaking news from dallas, texas. a city under siege. four police officers gunned down. stay with us. ♪ amazing sleep stays with you all day and all night. sleep number beds with sleepiq technology give you the knowledge to adjust for the best sleep ever. it's the final days of the lowest prices of the season sale, with the our best buy rated c2 queen mattress now only $699.99. know better sleep. only at a sleep number store. >> hello and thank you for staying with us. four officers were killed by snipers in downtown dallas thursday as crowds protested alleged police brutality in the u.s. here's a part of that chilling exchange caught on video by a witness. >> approximate are . >> oh, my god. people are playing on the ground. >> somebody is really armed to the t. this is not one person. this is a person -- >> oh, my got. >> officials say 11 officers were shot and the dallas police chief said it's not clear how many snipers were involved in this attack, but one is cornered in a parking garage and he claims there are bombs planted throughout the city. a short time ago, chief david brown said he impressed he is with the work the officers are doing under dangerous conditions. >> i never have been so proud of police officers and seeing the courage and the professionalism and the great knowing we are vulnerable. we don't know where they are and our downtown are high buildings. some of the stories are talking about what happened and to help the injured. to help them get transported to a help. stories of great courage. >> for more on the story, what can you tell us about what's happening. >> i'm in downtown from central college, there was just an explosion in the city and i can not witness or hear it. my colleague reports that they told reporters to move and there was a lout move and shattering glass. i don't know if this was something they threatened about. i don't know if they were trying to disarm someone. >> the other three suspects are talking to him. >> i'm on the ground and i'm not investigating suspects. i cannot speak to that, but what i'm seeing here on the ground. >> what are you seeing for your vantage point? >> as of a few minutes ago, i saw a few cops. they have two of the major landmarks in dallas. a lot of police officers are hanging around and one of the police officers just gave this 7-year-old boy a sticker and this is a young black boy. >> have you had a chance to talk to the people downtown? they were in disbelief. >> one was one he took a facebook video he had in part of the shootings. he couldn't even remember his phone number, he was in such shock. they wanted their kids to be here for the black lives matter movement and never imagined it would turn into this and a lot of people are happy to be safe, but now it's after 1:00 here and people can't get home because their cars are locked up. >> we will continue to check in, but thanks for the update. >> it was a peaceful protest. and of course everything changed with the shots beginning. the latest information from the deadly shooting. from dallas in just a moment, but we have a short break. welcome back, everyone. i want to welcome and update you on news from dallas, texas. under siege after a horrific attack. police moved in after four officers were shot dead and several wounded. at least two snipers fired on them ambush style. this was the scene when shots were first heard. >> dallas say this is still an active shooting situation. they have been negotiating with the suspect who was calling in the garage. reporters moved away from that scene by police and sounded a loud boom and glass. they claimed explosive devices in the downtown area. >> 11 officers were shot and they have three people in custody at the moment. >> many people said they witnessed police being shot. >> an officer was shot dead with an automatic ar 15. and then the police officers tried to sneak up on them and he missed the dude and the dude shot him with the ar. >> and cnn law enforcement, the police are saying this is an active crime scene and they are trying to clear it for possible explosive devices. >> you have to realize that shifts have to come on in about hours tory leave them. the longer the siege goes in the parking structure the worse it's going to be for manpower. if that detonation or loud explosion was in the vicinity, that could have been besides disruption of an ied, it could have been a diversion before an assault on that suspect. >> to you as a civil rights attorney. >> the words that 235 s thas th us, we are in a situation where officers were ambushed and 11 shot, four dead. >> devastating. i'm numb and i watched the police shootings unfold and now to be watching four police officers killed in the line of duty is just numbing. there is a way we want to raise awareness about police brutality is not by attacking police officers. that's not what civil rights is about. we are not fighting a street fight. the police officers are not all bad. that's never the point of any of the protests. we recognize that there are great police officers doing great work. we saw those police officers tonight. we heard the police chief talk about the courage and the brave men and women who are out there to protect the protesters. i don't want anyone to get the impression that when we are protest being police brutality, we are trying to send a message to harm or injury or kill police officers. that is not the message. i mourn and grove for the officers and their families in the same way i mourn for the two african-american men shot by police earlier this week. >> the protests are planned for friday and over the weekend around the country. security will be increased. >> the police targets? >> the protests are targets as well. >> you don't know again with any situation like this. these people who perpetrated this are not obviously mainstream civil rights people. they are head cases. >> if this attack on police is lack lives matter -- >> from the police. and they believe they have to -- >> yes, now i understand the question. that is a possibility. you have extremists on both sides. and at the same time that we are trying to bridge gaps between the african-american community and the police who seem sometimes militaristic, you are having to show up in armored cars. it is counterproductive for so many reasons. that's glossing over the fact that we lost four good people tonight. >> what does this mean for the protests? and what he knows about the shooters, some people are going to forever attach any peaceful protest with the shooting of the officers. i would hope that people will accept whatever the evidence is and the facts are. they need to be prosecuted to the fullest extent. there peaceful protesters and people who mean harm for the police. >> this is a chain of events. >> thank you. >> a short break and we will continue to follow the breaking news out of dallas. four police officers have been killed by snipers as crowds protested the police brutality. more in a moment. tokyo-style ramen noodles. freshly made in the japanese tradition, each batch is small. special. unique... every bowl blurring the line between food...and art. when you cook with incredible ingredients... you make incredible meals. fresh ingredients. step-by-step-recipes. delivered to your door. get your first two meals free blueapron.com/cook. we want to update you on the breaking news. an active crime scene on dallas, texas. a suspect who has been shooting at police and said bombs have been planted in the city. the man was cornered after other attackers and snipers shot 11 officers, killing in the protest. authorities have three suspects in custody and the ambush happened as they were marching peacefully over the police shootings of two african-american men. barack obama talks about the shootings on thursday, saying it's not just a black issue. >> i just ask folks to step back and think what if this happened to somebody in your family? how would you feel? to be concerned about these issues is not political correctness. it's just being american. >> there is president obama obviously speaking before the shooting in dallas. he is currently at warsaw at a nato summit. we are yet to hear from him on the shooting in dallas. we are hearing from eyewitnesss and seeing dramatic video of the shootings. >> here is the footage now and those firsthand accounts. >> everybody that was a mixed community and this came out of nowhere. >> somebody is really armed to the t. this is not one person. >> this came outer of nowhere. we were towards the end of the protest. >> get back. let's go. get back. back! >> all of a sudden i saw and heard to eight shots. it looked like two officers went down. i didn't have time to get a good look and i ran back and i was screaming run, run, run. active shooter. active shooter. >> let's all coming to and support our police officers. please, let's come together right now as a city. >> nothing short of a nightmare in dallas right now. thank you for watching cnn newsroom live from los angeles. >> george will continue breaking news coverage after this. you are watching cnn. ♪ amazing sleep stays with you all day and all night. sleep number beds with sleepiq technology give you the knowledge to adjust for the best sleep ever. it's the final days of the lowest prices of the season sale, with the our best buy rated c2 queen mattress now only $699.99. know better sleep. only at a sleep number store. this is cnn breaking news. >> welcome back to our viewers here in the united states and around the world. we continue following the breaking news out of dallas, texas. i'm george howell. >> and i'm natalie allen. welcome to our viewers. we're live in atlanta this hour. and we have live video now for you from dallas, texas, where people, police are still in a standoff at that garage in downtown at this hour. this horrific attack that has gripped dallas, texas has been going on for hours now. four police officers have been shot dead after at least two snipers fired from an elevated position ambush style during a peaceful protest. dallas police say this is still an active shooting situation, and they are now negotiating with that suspect cornered in a garage. three people are now in custody. >> in total, 11 officers were shot, and at least one civilian was wounded. i want you to listen here what it sound like from a nearby apartment. [ sirens ] [ gunshots ] >> oh my god there is people laying on the ground. i hope they're just hiding. [ gunshots ] [ bleep ]. >> somebody is really armed to the teeth. >> oh my god. >> this is not -- this is not one person. [ gunshots ] >> this is a person with -- a person with a big rifle. [ gunshots ] >> oh my god. >> the shooting happened as marchers were ending their protest, protesting the death of two african american men this week elsewhere in the u.s. at the hands of police officers. chaos on the ground spread as gunfire rang out. >> just look at this video. you see so many people just running for their lives after hearing all of these gunshots. police also say a bomb squad has secured a suspicious package. and they have three people in custody, including a woman. earlier the dallas police chief spoke to the media. >> and this is how he described the active shooting situation. >> the suspect that we are negotiating with that has exchanged gunfire with us over the last 45 minutes has told our negotiators that the end is coming and he is going to hurt and kill more of us, meaning law enforcement. and that there are bombs all over the place in this garage and in downtown. so we are being very careful in our tactics so that we don't injure or put any of our officers in harm's way, including the citizens of dallas. as we negotiate further. we still don't have a complete comfort level that we have all the suspects. so we will continue a very, very rigorous investigation and search of downtown. we're likely to be working throughout the early morning hours of friday until we are satisfied that all suspects have been captured and have an opportunity to be interviewed so that we can fully understand what's motivated this attack on our officers. >> david brown the police chief speaking a while back. let's bring in cnn law enforcement contributor steve moore. he joins me live from los angeles. and steve, thank you for being with us. >> sure. >> this was the end of a peaceful protest. and suddenly police are targeted. they're ambushed. they're shot up. what does this sound like to you? >> well, it sounds like an attack by a fringe group or somebody whose not well whose found other people who are not well. who decide to engage in vigilante justice, which is an oxymoron. i believe just based on how much the logistics that would be required for this, that this might have been something that had been planned not for this night, not for this occasion, but planned after previous police killing controversies and put into action very quickly after last night's stuff. >> yeah, because it was just -- if there are bombs, these bombs were made and perhaps put around downtown dallas. it almost seemed like it was just done so quickly. it certainly wasn't amateurish, that's for sure, for these people to is carry out something like this. so many police officers shot. there were 100 officers on hand. i agree, and we've been talking about it in the newsroom. was this something that was the result of just this protest? it doesn't sound like it. what does it sound to you as far as the weaponry that they had and the fact that they ambushed police, and they were targeting police? >> it, again, sounds like -- the problem we've been having in america is what a certain -- what a certain minute percentage of police officers have been doing, which has tarnished everything, tarnished law enforcement around the country. this is i believe not an organized group who are protesting this. this is a fringe unstable group of individuals, no different than say the ku klux klan who just decided that they were going to engage in their own vigilante justice. this is less terrorism than it is simply a hate crime. and an organized hate crime. people had to be driven there. they had to be dropped off. they had to scout it. they had to know where things were. and they had to have ammunition and weapons ready. >> steve moore, former fbi and our law enforcement contributor, thank you so much for joining us. we appreciate your thoughts. >> we're also getting some new information here into the cnn newsroom. according to dallas police tweeting out this information, that a fifth officer has now died. so, again, five police officers killed in the line of duty this day. this is the tweet from the dallas police department. it has been a devastating night. we are sad to report a fifth officer has died. >> certainly absolutely is just devastating. and the fact that the police chief could come out and address reporters and talk so eloquently as he did when you've got to know that they are struggling losing their own, dealing with these families, and trying to save lives at the same time. it's just unreal. earlier this evening we were saying how many? just four. four. that's more than anything. now it's five. and of course our thoughts are with those who are in critical condition. >> it's been a difficult several days. you keep in mind that there have been so many americans heartbroken by the police-involved shoots that have happened. and now we're hearing about the deaths of these officers. just a terrible couple of days. >> one of the protest organizers talked about thursday's chaos. they say it was peaceful protest until the shots rang out. >> we may have some trouble getting to that audio. we visit now. >> we've done protests before, and they've all been peaceful. they've all gone smoothly with no issues. so we didn't expect anything to happen this time. we came out. there was blacks, whites, latinos, everybody. there was a mixed community here protesting. and this just came out of nowhere. as a matter of fact, we were towards the end of the protest when the shots started firing off. i'm still kind of startled, shaken up. as you know being in the front, it's almost like the gunshots were coming at us. it was complete pandemonium. i actually knew a couple of guys that had guns on them, the rifles. and i found them and told them hey, put that gun up. give it to a cop, because i don't want you to accidentally be mistaken for the person that is shooting. so it's bananas. >> i turned the corner up there upwards of a dozen gunshots. >> i would say probably about 20 gunshot, rapid succession. >> i was walking right next to you, one of the officers who was helping us with the protest. and all of the sudden i saw and heard six to eight shots. it looked like two officers went down. i didn't have time to get a good look. i ran back. and i was screaming "run, run, run, active shooter, active shooter, run, run, run." and then they told us that there still was an active shooter. so we felt like any moment would see bullets come off of the parking garage. >> what a chaotic, terrifying night for the people there in dallas, texas. and a painful time for these families that are getting word, again, a fifth officer now killed in the line of duty. let's now bring in tyler sieswerda. you are four blocks away. you live in that downtown neighborhood. what you hearing? what are you seeing? >> it's eriely quiet. there are many roads blocked off still with the fire and ambulance keeping things clamped down here. they told us to stay off of the streets and for obvious reasons with the standoff behind me only four blocks behind me. you see the building with the green neon, it is right next to that building where all of this happened. it is very sad, especially now we know a fifth officer has died tonight. to be this close to everything. >> so, you know, we hear from police, tyler that, you know, they're not confident that they have all of the suspects, you know. they think there may still be people at large. and they're also concerned about the possibility that there could be bombs placed, planted throughout the downtown dallas area. so what are -- what interest authorities telling you, and what are they telling people who live there in downtown? >> well, i think that's the reason they've not only said you know to stay away from that area. but they said to stay inside. because they don't know where these devices, if there are any, could have been left. as you said, i'm four blocks away from where this happened. the protest started in the same place where the shooting happened tonight. and it came up my direction and wrapped around my building. so i was actually able to watch it come up and i watched it directly below my apartment as it went past. so there was a huge police presence guiding these people through this route. it breaks my heart that potentially one of those officers i saw keeping a watch on these people and stopping traffic is one of the ones who was injured or killed tonight. >> indeed. >> if you could just paint the pick dmoers our viewer hoarse in the u.s. and around the world of what you saw and what you heard. you say it started as that peaceful protest. then the moments to come, what all did you see? >> yeah, it was. it was a very peaceful protest. my guess i eight 800 people or so. it was a large group. and they were chanting "black lives matter" as they marched past. it was very loud. it was very vocal. but there were people of every color and ethnic background that you could see in this group marching side by side. around downtown dallas. it's sad to think what began as a peaceful protest has ended like this only four blocks away after i saw these people go past. and it's not only the police as well, it's all the other people who were there who ran for cover. your heart just goes out to them tonight as well. >> tyler sieswerda, a journalist who lives in that neighborhood four blocks away from where all of this happened. tyler, thank you for a your time. we wish you safety and others in that neighborhood. we'll stay in touch with you. thank you. we continue to following the breaking news here on cnn. parts of dallas, texas under siege as snipers kill five police officers. up next, we'll hear from an eyewitness who watched it all happen from his hotel. stay with cnn. kellogg's® frosted 8 layers of wheat... and one that's sweet. for the adult and kid in all of us. ♪ kellogg's frosted mini-wheats® feed your inner kidult "you don't want to live with mom and dad forever, do you?" 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"credit karma. give yourself some credit." this is cnn breaking news. >> we continue following the breaking news here on cnn. a crime scene, active scene still in dallas, texas. police say snipers shot 11 officers during what started as peaceful demonstrations. right now there is no indication the shooters were associated with that protest. but at this point we know the death toll has risen now. five officers shot have died. >> we learned about the fifth death during this hour. police say they are negotiating with the suspect holed up in a downtown parking garage that is associated with the college there. there was a gunfight with that suspect who claims there are bombs planted all over the area. three people are in custody. >> some context here and background. marchers were demonstrating after police in minnesota and louisiana killed two african american men this week. two witnesses described the chaos. >> right about right here and around like 30 minutes ago, an officer was shot dead with an automatic ar-15. also right here behind this column, and then a police officer tried to sneak up on the other, he missed the dude. the dude snuck around him and shot him with the ar. he emptied a whole clip in the police officer's chest. we live out here in dallas. this is live. >> you saw what happened? >> i saw this with my eyes. >> turned around and tried to shoot at him, hit, boom, fail. boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, kept going. sounded loud, boom. she fell, got up and kept running. >> ismael de jesus was inside his hotel in downtown dallas when he heard the gunfire and started recording what they just described. he told cnn's don lemon what he saw. >> man had a rifle, ar-15 as clear as day. pretty big magazine. and you could see towards the end of the video here, he goes ahead and drops a few mags. >> this is him behind the railing next to the column, correct? >> yes. this is him right here to the right of that white pillar, shooting to the left. turns around, shoots to the right. shoots on the other side of the pillar. he was shooting at something and aiming at somebody. then he turned around, checked his back, make sure there is no one coming. but the officer did come across the right side of the screen to that piller to the right and try to take him one-on-one in a firefight. and it didn't end very well. it's very tragic. >> that's the officer getting shot right there? >> no. i didn't get video of the officer getting shot. that is the officer down right there. it was -- he -- it looked like an execution, honestly. he stood over him after he was already down, shot him maybe three or four more times in the back. so at that point, i didn't know if he was confirmed dead or anything. obviously. but he was down for about five more minutes until anybody could come get to him. >> how clearly could you -- how far way from the suspect were you, and how clearly could you see him? >> maybe about 50 yards. >> what did he look like? >> honestly, in the video, i don't know the exact skin color. i can't throw that out there. but he did have some tactical pants on. he had a tactical green shirt on. i honestly don't know what race he was. i can't, you know, just throw out a race out there. but it did look -- it did look planned. he just parked and he knew where to stand and open fire. he had ammo ready. he was ready to go. >> video there by ismael dejesus. bringing in now cnn law enforcement analyst cedric alexander to talk more about this. it is important to point out there is a great deal of speculation about who could be behind this. but the truth of the matter is we don't know. >> well, what we do know is that we have five police officers in dallas dead and six injured. and throughout the course of the morning and the afternoon, i think we're probably gather more information. but what is going to be critically important here, george, is that he has been holed up there in the parking garage as we know. and how that's going to end, is yet to be determined. who these person, who this person or persons are involved is going to be interesting as well. are they local? did they come from somewhere else? are they terrorists? are they domestic? are they foreign? we can do a lot of speculating. but this is still very early in this investigation. >> and i appreciate the fact that we're not doing the speculating. in fact we're going to wait. we're waiting to hear from officials to find out who is behind it. but again, this active situation. >> the video we just saw and the man describing seeing this this officer was shot by this person many times. we can see a grainy vision of a shooter. that does not look like an amateur. that doesn't look like someone that was just out to shoot somebody. >> it's two reasons why it doesn't look like amateur to me. the way he moved around those columns. and the secondly, your witnesses at the top of your show who described his movements. and these were young men who described his movements. and his movements and the way they described them appeared to be very fluid as well too. now that's a stretch. but i think it's important to consider this. we don't know who these subjects are. but they very well have been confident, well-trained. >> confident, yeah. >> technically capable of carrying out an attack against a whole police department. so it's going to be interesting to see going forward. >> you know, so suggesting that there could be some planning involved here. cedric, the two are not related as we know at this point. but keep in mind you and i were talking about this before. just about a year ago there was a person who went through downtown dallas and shot up the police department. so they've dealt with these types of situations before in that downtown hub. >> yeah, they have. and dallas is a major community. it's a major city. but, you know, we are living in a very, very different time. and still we don't know who these attackers were, who these killers are of these honorable servants in that community. but our hearts and prayers good out to those police officers and their family and the entire community and to the dallas police department this morning. >> clearly they were ambushed. this was planned to target police officers. >> this was a murderous ambush. it's nothing short of that. and we're going to see how this is going to end this morning. >> i want to ask you, cedric, downtown dallas. it is an important hub, as you mentioned. and the dallas/fort worth metroplex. so tomorrow when it's time for business as usual, it won't be business as usual. >> it won't be business as usual for that community. that community along with this country right now is watching this. so that area i'm quite sure is going to be cordoned off, that whole downtown area is going to be cordoned off for the safety of the citizens and officers and those involved. but what we're looking at as the day gross closer for us, george, is that this is going to really be very suggestive of us, to us as a nation. and as a community is this the new normal for us. because we don't know. orlando was tragic. san bernardino was tragic. and i can go on and on just in this country alone. but these types of events are becoming very frequent in this country. and we've got a lot of work to do. >> i heard some reports there in dallas that this area could be cordoned off off for more than a day or more than a few days. this is a huge crime scene. >> it is a huge crime scene, as you can see that stretches for blocks. but here again, as morning continues to unfold, we'll learn more going forward. >> cedric, cedric alexander, thank you for coming in. well, the standoff in dallas continues between police and a suspect in the mass shooting of the officers. stay with us. we'll have more for you of our breaking news coverage right after this. this is cnn breaking news. >> i ask everybody to focus on one thing right now. and that is dallas police officers, their families, those that are deceased, those that are in the hospital fighting for their lives. >> the mayor of dallas, texas mike rawlings, the mayor calling this horrible attack heartbreaking. welcome back to our viewer here is in the united states and around the world. we continue with the very latest. we know from dallas, texas at this hour and at this point we know five police officers are dead. six others wounded, this after at least two snipers fired on them during a peaceful protest there in the city. dallas police say this is still an active shooting situation at this hour, and they are still negotiating with the suspect cornered in a garage. that suspect is shooting at police and claims that bombs are planted throughout the downtown dallas area. >> this shooting happened as hundreds, you see them here, about 800 people were protesting a peaceful protest, the death of two african american men this week at the hands of police. it happened elsewhere in the u.s., but dallas was showing solidarity. and this is what happened. all of the sudden shots were first heard there in dallas. police say they have three people in custody. one of them is a woman. they wouldn't say anything more about who is in custody. and we're about to show dramatic video of a shooting in downtown dallas as it began to unfold. the video was shot by michael kevin and shows police running with guns pulled out. >> so you can hear more of the gunshots toward the end of the video you'll actually see an officer on the ground. so we do want to the warn our viewers as we now play this video. [ gunshots ] >> holy [ bleep ]. [ gunshots ] >> they're shooting right now. and there is an officer down. it's coming from the right over there, from around these buildings. i don't know where, main street and lamar. this is main street and lamar. [ sirens ] >> there is an officer down. they're moving in on somebody. i think they might have got somebody. don't worry, i'm behind a tree. i think another officer is down around the corner over here. they got s.w.a.t. over here. i can't really -- i can't really get any closer. i'm safe, man. don't worry about it. i appreciate it, though. i love you all. so they just dragged one of the officers up into this police car right here to get him attention. and there is somebody else down over there. and you can see around this corner. i don't know if y'all can see that. >> get out of there, get out of there! >> get out of the street! >> they're telling me to go. i got to go. i got everything, man. i got everything. all right. i'm going to have to switch over to another app because i got -- i got to get my bosses in on this, all right. i love you all. >> just a man standing there with his iphone getting incredible footage and seeing two officers down there. ashley land is a photographer for "the dallas morning news." and she joins us now on the phone. ash wi ashly, we're told you're just a couple of blocks from the scene. what is going on right now that you can see? >> right now they pushed it back quite a bit. but right now there is still a lot of officers downtown. a lot of police car, a lot of streets that are closed. a lot of people, well their cars, anyway, stranded. >> ashley, i want to bring up the cover of "the dallas morning news." i want to show viewers what they will see in the morning. "ambush." that's the way this was described on these officers. snipers triangulating their attack, firing ambush-style. some officers shot in the back per the police chief. >> unfortunately, it's not current now that there are five dead. >> that's true. >> right. >> look at that headline. that's changed. i wanted to ask you, given what you saw, kind of explain to us, are the streets deserted at this point? and is there a sense that downtown dallas will be closed off for some time? >> i have that sense. if nothing else for just the investigation. they have opened up a few streets now. and i think the exits on the highways to get to downtown have been opened. but as far as where these shots were actually fired, i have no idea how long it's going to be closed. >> ashley, were you there covering the protests earlier? >> i was, yes. >> what did you hear and see yourself? when did everyone in the crowd realize something has gone horribly wrong? >> they marched towards the old courthouse. and they had -- they stopped for a moment there for everyone to catch up. and they turned back towards the east. and i was about middle of the pack. and all of the sudden i saw a bunch of people running back towards me. and at that point i figured something had happened. but i didn't know if it was -- you always feel it's not something so bad. but -- sorry. >> i understand. >> sorry. >> it's been a long night for you. >> you hear a lot of people, you know, a lot of people turn around and you just didn't know what it is. i didn't hear gunshots at first. but then i went down the block and i could hear them. >> ashley, give us a sense of what people were saying at this happened. obviously this started as a protest against two deadly police-involved shootings. people frustrated with the fact that that has been happening so many times. but now seeing that this happened. now seeing that five police officers lost their lives in the line of duty. what are you hearing from folks on the ground there about what happened in your city? >> i mean, you hear -- you hear eyewitness account, and you hear what people saw and how people reacted. but at this point i think everyone is just pretty much in a reactionary mode. >> right. >> you know, everyone initially was looking for their loved ones and just trying to figure out where everybody was, because there was a lot of chaos to start with. >> well, we'll certainly be looking for your pictures as you were there testimony documenting this for "the dallas morning news." we really appreciate you taking the time to talk with us. we know this is a difficult time, a different night for you, and a very long night. ashley landis, thank you, take care. >> be safe, ashley. thank you for your time. cnn continues following the breaking news this day. parts of dallas, texas under siege as snipers kill several police officers. next, the latest developments and analysis with our law enforcement contributor steve moore. this is cnn. let's feed him to the sharks! squuuuack, let's feed him to the sharks! yay! and take all of his gold! and take all of his gold! ya! and hide it from the crew! ya...? squuuuack, they're all morons anyway! i never said that. they all smell bad too. no! you all smell wonderful! i smell bad! if you're a parrot, you repeat things. it's what you do. if you want to save fifteen percent or more on car insurance, you switch to geico. it's what you do. squuuuack, it's what you do. the fastest food truck min brooklyn. meet mylanta® tonight. it's also fast, but unlike godawgs, it makes heartburn after dinner, history. new mylanta® tonight. faster than heartburn. this is cnn breaking news. >> updating our breaking news. sniper shooting 11 police officers in dallas, texas, killing five. and it's not over. >> police have three suspects in custody, but have been negotiating and exchanging gunfire with another one. that suspect presently holed up in a parking garage, saying, quote, the end is near, and claiming that there are bombs in downtown dallas. one monitoring group says this has been the deadliest day for u.s. law enforcement since the terror attacks of 9/11. >> it all started, the shooting started toward the end of this right here, a peaceful protest in dallas, in downtown dallas after two african american men were killed by police in other parts of the country. here are some of the firsthand accounts. [ gunshots ] [ sirens ] >> black, white, latinos, everybody. there was a mixed community here protesting. and this just came out of nowhere. >> somebody's really armed to the teeth. >> oh my god. >> this is not -- this is not one person. >> let's go! [ sirens ] >> this just came out of nowhere. as a matter of fact, we were towards the end of the protest when the shots started firing off. >> move back, get back! let's go! let's go, get back! back! >> let's go, let's go, let's go, let's go! >> all of the sudden i saw and heard six to eight shots. it looked like two officers went down. i didn't have time to get a good look. i ran back, and i was screaming "run, run, run, active shooter, active shooter." [ gunshots ] [ sirens ] >> let's all come together and support our police officers. please, let's come together right now as a city. >> let's bring in cnn law enforcement analyst cedric alexander to talk more about this. cedric, so let's put it into context for the past several days. many americans have been heartbroken from that graphic video showing these deadly police-involved shootings in minnesota and louisiana. an investigation under way in both of those cases. but now we're seeing this on television. we're seeing this live and in person for people there in dallas. five administrators who died in the line of duty. >> tragic, training, hurtful to that community there in dallas, and of course to this entire country. and can we draw any correlation between the other two shootings and what occurred with those officers tonight? we don't know yet. but i think as the day go on, we're going to learn more. but let me say this. we certainly live in a very, very different time. and if we go back, if we look recent events from bangladesh to baghdad and here in this country in san bernardino and orlando most recent to this event in this country, it certainly does create a great deal of pause. but where this attack come from, we don't know yet. and we don't know whether it had anything to do with the events that took place in minneapolis or louisiana or is this some other attack that may occur tonight. for some other reason. >> it's just important to make that point. because we don't know if the suspects in this case are related to the protest or not, are related to some other group or not. we department know at this point. the best we can do is wait for officials to give us better descriptions and backgrounds on the people that they're dealing with. >> and they say they planted bombs. they don't know that yet. they've got a lot of investigating to do. and with still someone at large engaging with someone, it's going to be a while in this investigation. >> right. and they certainly are going to take those bomb threats seriously. we're talking about persons here whoever orchestrated this attack, it appeared to have been planned. they appear to have had some experience or training. so the reality of some bombs being there could very well be possible. so they're going to secure those areas. they're going to take their time, i'm quite sure, and go through every inch, every block of that community to render it safe as you heard chief brown mention earlier tonight. so there is a very large crime scene there. it is still a very active crime scene with an active shooter that is being holed up there in the parking lot of the el centro community college. so i hope our prayers go out to the family of those officers, to those slain officers who are courageous and diligent in their duties tonight. and i think that's something that we need to note as well too, that those officers who lost lives and those who are wounded, and to all those officers that responded to that call tonight are courageous individuals. and we cannot overlook that throughout this entire case. >> absolutely. cedric alexander, thanks again for joining us. >> thank you for having me. >> thank you. you're watching breaking news here on cnn. we'll be right back. wanna drink more water? with sodastream® you turn plain water into sparkling water in seconds. and because it's so delicious, you'll drink 43% more water every day. sodastream®. love your water. 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dallas, texas on thursday. this as crowds protested alleged police brutality in the united states. six other officers were wounded. >> it is not clear how many attackers were there, but the police chief says downtown dallas is still an active crime scene. and one gunman is cornered right now in a parking garage. police say he is shooting at them and claims bombs are planted throughout the city. three other people are in custody. we heard some emotional words from the dallas mayor earlier. >> he spoke alongside the police chief, who has been giving updates about the situation. listen. >> it is a heartbreaking morning to lose these four officers. that proudly served our citizens. to say that our police officers put their life on the line every day is no hyperbole, ladies and gentlemen. it's a reality. we as a city, we as a country must come together and lock arms and heal the wounds that we all feel from time to time. words matter. leadership matters at this time. i'm proud of our chief. >> important to point out now that five, though, police officers are dead, updating from that sound we heard earlier. >> well, let's bring in cnn law enforcement contributor steve moore. he joins us again from los angeles. >> steve, so just you know, your thoughts given where we are right now. an active situation, standoff still under way. and five police officers killed in the line of duty. >> it's crushing. and right now we have to -- we have to resist jumping to conclusions. in this situation, we have to give the protesters and the people who might be wrongly blamed for this, we have to give them the same benefit of the doubt that we ask for policemen who are involved in these kind of shootings. and right now i've got to tell you, i've never been more proud to be in law enforcement just watching what these officers did. i think the crucial thing right now is to resolve the situation with that one gunman. for one reason, you have to find out if there are others. it could be that you have one or two snipers who you think you've got them all, and there might be another one still out there moving. so this is a time not of relaxing, but of finishing up. and it's not even mop-up. it is ensuring that your situation is over. >> yes. i just want to get your opinion on the gunshots that we heard, steve, being fired over and over and over again. you know more than us how much firepower that was. >> that was -- that was an immense amount of high caliber ammunition going down range. that was at least an ar-15. and the number of shots that were being fired and exchanged, you could tell the difference in the tone between the ar and the pistol shots going back and forth. the ar can reach out and get you 100 yards away when you're not even in range, accurate range with your pistol. so it was terrifying to me to hear these kind of heavy rounds echoing in a downtown area. >> a simple fact again that we know, these six officers were wounded. that five are dead. we know that in the next couple of hours, if not already, there are families throughout the d/fw metroplex that are learning their loved ones will not be coming home. >> it's -- it's heartbreaking. i have a brother-in-law who is a uniformed officer in texas. i've got a cousin who is a uniform in virginia. i cannot imagine having to call their wives and say they're not coming home. this is -- this is something that law enforcement officers, fbi agents, every type of law enforcement agency, they put on the uniforms every day they go out, and there is so much that people don't realize you sometimes just don't know when they're coming back. >> that's very true. it's a very, very dangerous job. and we certainly saw that unfold in front of so many people there in dallas. thanks again for joining us, steve. we appreciate it. >> thank you for being with us here on cnn. i'm george howell. >> i'm natalie allen. more coverage of the shootings just ahead. we will join cnn usa for "early start with christine roman and boris sanchez. thanks for watching. . . this is cnn breaking news. [ gunshots ] >> there's an officer down. i think another officer's down around the corner over here. they got s.w.a.t. over here. i can't really -- i can't

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