writing for a 5-4 majority, he latched onto the penalty part, calling it a tax and deeming that constitutionally kosher. >> i know the debate over this law has been divisive. i respect the very real concerns americans have shared. i know a lot of coverage through this health care debate has focused on what it means politically. well, it should be pretty clear by now that i didn't do this because it was good politics. i did it because i believed it was good for the country. >> president obama today. here's mitt romney. >> as you might imagine, i disagree with the supreme court's decision. and it agree with the dissent. what the court did not do on its last day in session, i will do on my first day if elected president of the united states. and that is, i will act to repeal obama care. >> governor romney called it bad law and bad policy. but keeping them honest, it is also nearly identical to his own plan as governor of massachusetts. as for the mandate, well, keeping them honest, justice roberts today contradicted a key claim the president made. the president said that mandate was not a tax. >> for us to say that you've got to take a responsibility to get health insurance is absolutely not a tax increase. what it's saying is, we're not going to have other people carrying your burdens for you. any more than the fact that right now everybody in america just about has to get auto insurance. nobody considers that a tax increase. >> nobody that is except chief justice john roberts. republicans have been running today with his formulation. but keeping them honest, if justice roberts is right, if the obama care mandate really is just a tax, then so is the romney care mandate in massachusetts. listen to how then governor romney defended that. >> it's not a tax hike. it is a fee. it's an assessment. we're currently assessing our employ years, the great majority of employers in massachusetts are assessed this fee right now. >> the fee tops out at $1,200 now. it was somewhat lower when governor romney was defending it. just like president obama, mr. romney said the fee, or tax or penalty, whatever you want to call it, was there to make sure nobody was free ride on the health care system. that was six years ago. a lot's changed since. including, you'll remember these, those town halls three years ago. >> this is more about taking power and control than it is about health care. it's only the first step to socialism. >> i don't want this country turning into russia. turning into a socialized country. >> we do not want this nation to be socialist. >> we do not want them involved in our health care decisions. we do not want obama care. >> why are we willing to take the best health care system in the world and throw it right out the window? >> government isn't the answer, it's the cancer. >> i believe our country is being stolen from us. >> how in the world are we going to pay for it? >> you need to get the government the hell out of our way. >> that anger was palpable. has it cooled since then? how will today's ruling change the dynamic? a lot ground to cover tonight. including legal and political. an expanded panel joins us momentarily. i want to start now with barbara comstock. barbara, good to see you on this important day. we just saw governor romney on tape there, insisting a mandate is necessary and that it is not a tax. most of the republican party today spent the day insisting it is a tax and it isn't necessary. does that complicate the message? the comparison between massachusetts now, as a matter of fact, only two people in this country who have put a health care mandate in place, he's one of them. >> no, not at all. he was talking about a state policy. this is a national policy where we're imposing from the top down on every single state. what governor romney has said he will do on day one is he will give the states, all 50 states, a waiver from this national health care bill, so each state can go about doing what they want to do here. this is about federalism. allowing states to decide what's best for them. in the case of massachusetts, he decided there. but here, what is now happened is you have the american people having this $500 billion taxes imposed on all of them. whether their state chooses to or not. $500 billion in medicare cuts which nobody expected was going to happen in these things. this is something the president very strongly said was not a tax. argued with people like george stephanopoulos. you know, most of the members who voted for this bill said it wasn't a tax increase. today, it's been made very clear. there are a lot of hidden tax increases in this. like taxes on investments. taxes on medical devices. the takeaway taxes on flexible spending accounts that many families with special needs children use. so, this is totally different. and the good thing is that, as president -- >> you said -- >> is going to repeal and replace, and not impose these taxes, these increased costs on states, you know -- >> barbara, let me jump in for a minute here. you say it's completely different. but if the mandate is, in fact, a tax, does that mean mitt romney introduced an ambitious health care plan that raised taxes in massachusetts, during a struggling economic recovery? which is exactly what he says the president did? >> it's totally different. on the federal level, you're not allowing federalism, allowing the states to decide. in that state, massachusetts decided what they wanted to do. here, we're going to have a situation where, you know, he wants to have national bills that can do things like buy across state lines, you know, get rid of pre-existing conditions. there's a lot of bipartisan agreement on things we could do on the national level. then allow people on the state level to decide what they think is best for them. we could block grant medicaid. that would be something he supports. and would be great for, you know, all the states if they choose to do it. i'd prefer to have that in virginia. be like welfare reform. where virginia would be able to go about and see their unique population, throughout their states. what would be best for those populations. and using those federal medicaid dollars and how best we can do it. instead of having the state tell us, the national government telling us how we should do it. whether it is cost prohibitive. and i know obama care is going to cost my state millions and millions of dollars, it will cut into k through 12, college, transportation costs. and that's why we were the first state to reject obama care. that's why you'll see virginia, a swing state, be very unhappy with this. this will hit our small businesses, high tech companies that really need to get out from under this type of huge tax that's going to be hitting our small businesses and our families. >> barbara, if you go to the governor's campaign website. it says if elected president he would nominate judges in the mold of chief justice roberts. anything about today's ruling maybe going to have the governor rethinking that one? >> well, i think he also sails chief justice roberts and alito, as i recall. i disagree with justice roberts' decision today. i obviously agree with the dissent. but i think you want to have a judge who foul loams the law, who doesn't make it up. i think what the dissent pointed out is that this sort of the, trying to turn the, you know, rewrite the law in order to say it's okay, really wasn't the way to go. but, hey, the good thing is, we have a democratic process. now people are going to be talking about this. and if we want to repeal and replace obama care, which, there's bipartisan agreement that we should do that, then we need to replace barack obama, because he will not do it and mitt romney has promised on day one he will do that and not impose all the tax increases that the president has promised us, not only in obama care, but he has another raft of tax increases. we are going to be hit in january with barack obama, if he's still around in january, with the largest tax increase in history, when you combine all of these tax inkreelss that he's promised the american people. and that will crush our economy. >> the american people get that choice, barbara, in 131 days. >> that's why we need a president, mitt romney. >> with us now, ari fleisher. paul begala. who is advising the top obama super-pac. political analyst jeff toobin, and because at the end of the day, this is about your health care and the health care system, "360" m.d., dr. sanjay gupta. you said, instead of going on "anderson cooper" tonight and thundering about the injustices of the justices, i will be reduced to mewing about the mandate. better for the americans to be sure, but tougher on me. damn that roberts. he outsmarted me again. i i want to give you that chance. have at it. mew away. >> it's astonishing. when someone as gifted as barbara comestock, in that long, one-sided soliloquy, still can't defend the indefensive, you know there's something big going down. it was kind of a tongue in cheek thing. i like to fulminate and scream and yell. i did something good for the soul. i visited teddy kennedy's grave. i said a prayer. what he would be saying now, he would be thundering, begala, get your head out of all the baloney and talk about the people. and sometimes hacks like me forget that. there's tens of millions of people with pre-existing conditions. with special needs children. who are going -- moms who need mammograms. grandparents who need to get medical care. folks like me who have kids in college who want to keep them on their health care. tens of millions people benefited by this decision. people like me tend to forget that sometimes. >> gloria, in all the conversation today, it's no question, the court gave president obama a policy victory. some people say did he hand mitt romney a political rallying cry? will this be a national referendum now on whether or not to keep obama care. >> yes. >> yes, yes on that question? >> yes, yes, and yes. i mean, and we just learned that the romney campaign since the decision has raised $2.7 million. just like that, john. and it's given republicans new enthusiasm for mitt romney. even though, as you know, of course, and you just asked barbara comestock about, that mitt romney was governor of the state of massachusetts when it passed a mandate. but what's going to happen in the 2012 election is that we're going to relitigate health carol reform. republicans believe what happened in 2010 which worked for them, they took control of the house, is going to work for them again in 2012. democrats will say, like paul, now the president is unleashed. he's liberated. he can talk about the benefit that health care reform is going to have for americans, particularly those who are uninsured. so it's going to sound a lot like 2010 to us, john. >> ari, remember, during the republican primary, a lot of the conservative challengers said mitt romney was the wrong messenger because he had a plan, it had a mandate, the obama plan was largely modeled on massachusetts. does that complicate -- they think this rallies the base. now, if you are dog to defeat 0 bama care, you have to defeat the president himself. they think it helps them. does his own record make it tricky? >> it does make it a bit tricky. here's the thing. mitt romney is imperfect carrier of this message. given the fact he's running against president obama and given the fact he has promised to repeal obama care on the first day, he's plenty good enough. that's what it comes down to. an obama/romney race over the issue that gloria points out, energized voters to come out for republicans in huge numbers in 2010. let me respond to something paul said earlier. i wish health care was as simple as paul said. you could wave the magic wand. extend the insurance to people who don't have it. put people who are 26 and under on parent policies. and make it all not cost a lot. it doesn't work that way. the problem with giving health care away free so afternoon is, it drives up the cost of insurance for everybody else. and makes insurance harder to get for everybody else. that's the real problem with obama care. which now is going to become known as obama tax care. it's a big substantive problem too. it doesn't solve the problem. it adds to the cost. >> you say he's an imperfect messenger. let's listen to one of the clips that democrats are gloating over today. mitt romney when he was massachusetts governor. >> with regards to the mandate, the individual responsibility program which i proposed, i was very pleased to see the compromise from the two houses includes the personal responsibility principle. that is essential for bringing health care costs down for everyone. and getting everybody the health insurance they deserve and need. >> now, the democrats say it's proof he loves the mandate. >> barbara responded to that by saying it's a federalism issue. which is a sound issue. but the real point is, elections are about the future. mitt romney has made that pledge that he repeal it on the first day. of course, president obama has to deal with his tax problem now. he promised us it wasn't a tax, indeed, if it was a tax, this congress would have never passed it, or the previous democratic congress never would have passed it. now, it's been sold to us as a penalty, but it is, indeed, a tax. the president, who said he wouldn't raise taxes on anybody who made below $250,000, now he's threatening to raise taxes on tens of million who make far, far less than that. >> david gergen, you can see from the reactions on both sides. the white house is trying to raise money. think the president kept his commitment. now with the help of the court to a signature issue of the democratic party. you see the romney campaign going to the right. raising a lot of money already. but what about the middle? it may be a small middle. how do the centrist swing voters, who tend to decide 50/50 elections, do they want this fight over or do they want to litigate it again? >> excellent question, john. there's no question, there's no doubt this galvanizes the right. in talking to conservatives who were in state legislatures who got elected by the tea party folks, they say, look, this is what is going to bring the tea party out. this is the issue that ignited those town halls. i think it will give a lift on the republican side. but mitt romney cannot win with simply the tea party as a base, that part of the base. he needs to bring in some of the people from the middle. in talking to a variety of folks today, john, my sense is there are a number of people in the middle who will have said "enough is enough." we've been litigating, talking about this for a long time. the supreme court was going to provide the decisive test. it has come down in favor of the president. let's give it a shot. let's get back to the critical issue in this campaign of jobs and economic growth. so, it's not clear to me that if mitt romney can ride this horse all the way to the white house, he's going to have to find a way to appeal to the middle. >> jeffrey, we're having this conversation on television. no cameras in the court. you were one of the lucky 500 in the room when the decision came down. not the ruling most people expected. including yourself. take us back into the room. play out how it happened. >> john, i've been in this building right behind you many times. and i have never heard a silence as profound and tense as the one that took place in the minutes before 10:00. the supreme court is a prompt institution. the stroke of 10:00, they walked in, they dealt with a relatively minor case, and then the chief justice said, i have the opinion. and the national federation of independent businesses versus the department of health and human services. roberts looked different than he usually does. he wasn't as confident, as outgoing, seemingly, as he usually was. he was almost downcast. and as he began to speak, he spoke first about the issue that we had all been talking so much about. the commerce clause. does the congress have the power under the commerce clause of article 1 of the constitution to impose an individual mandate? and it became clear that he was saying no, congress doesn't have that power. and that seemed like it was it, that the law was going to be invalidated. and then, he turned to what had been a relatively minor issue. the taxing power. and you could see as he was talking, and several of us were looking at each other, saying, is he saying what we think he's saying? at that point, he said, this is something that is legitimate, that is tolerable under the taxing power. he was approving the law and i saw antonin scalia, sitting immediately to his right, who is the senior associate justice now and he looked distraught because he had lost this case. anthony kennedy who we thought was the swing vote, he later wrote a scathing, angry bitter dissent. where he said he would have invalidated the entire law. so that's how close this was. but the result was quite clear. >> sanjay, you heard governor romney a few moments ago say on day one he would act to repeal it. if you go to his website, it gives a pretty detailed view of his positions on health care what we don't from him is a sequencing. if on day one, i'm going to try to repeal it, you take the stems you can, you ask the congress to do things. you've talked to his policy advisers about this. how do they do the sequencing? the governor says, he would keep the pre-existing condition thing, keep the other more popular things. but how would they do it? >> well, you know, it's funny because i've asked that same question, john. there's not good answers on that particular issue. even with regard to some of the bigger components. i talked to his health care policy provider. one of the things he pointed out was that, and this is obviously before the decision, and he said that the governor would keep the nondiscriminatory clauses, not allowing insurance companies to discriminate based on pre-existing conditions but get rid of the whole mandate. that's very different than saying rebeautifuling the whole thing. a couple of things he brought up, john, was this idea that people should be allowed to purchase insurance, health care insurance, across state lines, allow more competition and drive down premiums that way, was one of the things. and then, he was talking more about incentives for people being healthy, doing things that would make them healthy. so, again, i didn't see anything about the sequencing. i'm not sure this is a radical departure. as it's been described. from what we're talking about now. those are the things that stuck out, talking to the health care policy adviser. >> ari, paul, david, thank you. let you know what you think. we're on facebook. you can follow the program on twitter. i'll be tweeting @johnkingcnn. it's very important to understand how math and science kind of makes the world work. in high school, i had a physics teacher by the name of mr. davies. he made physics more than theoretical, he made it real for me. we built a guitar, we did things with electronics and mother boards. that's where the interest in engineering came from. so now, as an engineer, i have a career that speaks to that passion. thank you, mr. davies. ♪ what started as a whisper every day, millions of people choose to do the right thing. there's an insurance company that does that, too. liberty mutual insurance. responsibility. what's your policy? 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