this question -- is the press guilty as equally to blame when that may not be the i'm howard kurtz, and this is "reliable sources." that phone hacking scandal had been spinning out of the control for months, but this week they made some stunning disclosures that went well beyond rogue journalists they access the the phone of a 13-year-old, and hacked phones of families of victims of the bombing. >> they interfere with her messages, raising hopes she might still be alive. >> it is frankly a staggering -- another staggering development in this whole phone-hacking scanned add. >> the news of the world is to be no more after this sunday. the final episode because of the problems that has beset it. >> an extraordinary moment, "news of the world" is to close, victim of its own phone-hacking scandal. >> the 168-year-old numbs has now fallen victim to scandal joining us emily bell, director of columbia for video media. here at washington, toby harden, and matt frey of bbc world news american soon to join channel 4. how angry are people at the latest disclosures, and directed at rupered murdock. >> i think it's been an extraordinary six days here, because it really has -- this story has almost swiveled on a dime. that the guardian han bringing forth disclosure after disclosure around the story, but largely it was about celebrity phones being hacked and people who are in the public eye. the tipping point's when millie's phone had been hacked and messages had been erase d a that point the temperature change and really willings in to speak out, a small group that had been willing to push this story and how there is no other story here. >> matt frey, tabloids do a lot of crazy things in londsen, was it that far out of the mainstream? >> yes, it was the phone hacking into the bereached people who are killed soldiers killed in iraq, it's something that's enough. but this is a general problem about the culture of tabloid journalism in britain, which has been addressed by people like david cameron himself. almost a corporate shake speer and drama, it's about really a battle between two bruised institution. murdock's decision to close the paper, is it damage control? it because the goism is worried -- >> i certainly thin that's a huge part. >> you're saying he may be close the paper in part because of business and finance reasons? >> clearly. >> this is a debacle. >> exactly. no and very, very strong opinion was this was to protect rebecca wade and a former editor who was the editor when her phone was hacked. >> she's now the chief executive. let me put this conversation on paw. we're going to go for a bit of breaking news regards the 135th and final space shuttle mission. john zarrella is standing by to talk about a docking manure which is under waite. john? >> about sick feel separates it. this is the final time a space shuttle will ever dock with the international space station, less than five feet away. you can see in the live picture that you have a camera inside the docking ring on board the space shuttle "atlantis" action and looking at the docking ring on board the space station. the space shuttle ren day viewed with the international space station flying within tandem. >> docking is confirmed. capture confirmed, 10:07 central time. you heard from the voice of mission control. >> so the docking has now taken place. remarkable, howard. we've seen this so many time. pinches john zarrella, thanks so much. great to watch it. it's almost become routine. more ahead in this program. let resume or conversation. emily bell, yes, we can come up with business reasons, but in some way, hadn't it become a toxic symbol of gymism? >> i think the public sent meant, and potentially readers i think meant when they did the mental calculation, this enormous kind of gesture i have no doubt at the base of it there was a business decision here. it had to become a difficult symbol. it had been for a long time sort of a cheeky sort of reporting, slightly sleazy details of people's personalized type newspaper, everybody in britain grew up with it, kind of like a cultural metaphor, if you like, for a certain type of very kind of intrusive investigation, but it employed a lot of journalists who were not corrupt. there's a great feeling of anger and regret as well. >> and most didn't have much to do with it. >> i think the crucial thing that's happened. it has overstepped the line where it's taken on not just the celebrities or politicians sore of considered to be fair game s. but for the first time, it's taken on institutions that represent the readers themselves. when you start talking about relatives, start hacking the phones of relatives many people in iraq, then you are messing with your very constituency, with the blue collar workers. >> i think it's important to also remember how much this is about politics. this is about the influence of news international. david cameron's spin doctor was andy coursen, "news of the world" editor. >> and for people who don't know the names, he had been -- he became a communications director for the prime minister. he was arrested on friday, and that's a political problem for cameron. before we go to break, i want to ask you this question. where was the public outrage last year when the "news of the world" report, known as the fake sheikh, posed as a. >> the tipping point was when it was about a murder victim. i mean, the fake sheikh, 250 convictions, he's got a story today about a bull gardian and sex slaves, very legitimate stories, but yes it was a media class, an elite class that were campaigning and doing some amazing work on this, but a tipping point on monday. bhil margaret thatcher was taking on the mining union, he was taking on the immediate use -- david cam rho admitted as much the other day. we're going to talk about the close, some would atoo cozy relationships between british journalists and politicians, on the other side of the break. stay with us. it's the only complete multivitamin with ginkgo to support memory and concentration. plus it supports heart health. [ bat cracks ] that's a hit. one a day men's. at liberty mutual, we know how much you count on your car and how much the people in your life count on you. that's why we offer accident forgiveness, man: good job. where your price won't increase due to your first accident. we also offer a hassle-free lifetime repair guarantee, where the repairs made on your car are guaranteed for life or they're on us. these are just two of the valuable features you can expect from liberty mutual. plus, when you insure both your home and car with us, it could save you time and money. at liberty mutual, we help you move on with your life. so get the insurance responsible drivers like you deserve. looks really good. call us at... or visit your local liberty mutual office, where an agent can help you find the policy that's right for you. liberty mutual insurance. responsibility. what's your policy? man on tv: ...rbis and 36 homers. swings at the first pitch and fouls it deep back into the stands. [ding] [fans whirring] announcer: chill raw and prepared foods promptly. one in 6 americans will get sick from food poisoning this year. check your steps at foodsafety.gov. david cameron attempting to distance himself on the "news of the world" scandal. he spoke on this friday after the arrest of andy colson. >> the truth is, to coin a phrase, we have all been in this together. the press, the politicians, and leaders of all parties, yes, including me. because party leaders were so keen to win the support of newspapers, we turned a blind eye to the need to sort this issue, to get on top of the bad practices, to change the way or newspapers are regulated. >> emily bell, ruper murdock's son endorsed david cameron. he's not kidding, is he? >> well, no, but as somebody said, some of us are more in it together than others. that's undoubtedly the case that david cameron lives very close to rebecca brooks in a part of the countryside, there's a chipping norton set like a poughkeepsie set may in the united states, not very glamorous, but at the heart of the -- but previously there was a close relationship between brooks and the murdochs and blair and some of his ministers, too, so the working of that soft power network, where you have the politicians, the media owners and regulations, it's not like the sectors, a much closer nexus there already, and the murdochs have been absolutely superb at courting and capturing the political classes, and making sure that they -- that they bend to their will. the political class -- >> let me jump in for a second. let me bring in toby. as he admitted, politicians sort of -- because they wanted support from the media and pleats were paid off. >> taking payments. some payments were in 1992, it was the sun what won it, the conservatives, an it's been a received wisdom that you needed the endorsement of "the sun" to get into power and get your messages across. that dam seems to have burst, but david cameron, his background is a pr guy. he had a great performance there. it suited him absolutely. i've got about half a minute to break. you worry this could lead to regulation of the press in britain? >> absolutely, yes. maybe that's a good thing on one level, could be a bad thing on another level. this is the crucial political question. he will have to put his own commitment to the test, whether his government ends up approving the deal that he's interested in. that's about 12 billion pounds. "news of the world" only had a retch of 1 billion. if cameron and the government says yes to that deal, then the opposition has a very clear narrative in the next election to say they are in bed together. >> the telegraph had the best headline when it said good-bye cruel world. emily bell in london, matt frey, to be harnden, thank you. we saw the dramatic docking of the shuttle, and the final liftoff. we'll be back with this question. did the media's boredom with these launches help kill the program? it was a time when i was growing up when the space program was one of the most exciting adventures in the world. the last 30 years nasa has sent so many space shuttles into orbit, the launches have become somewhat routine except for the heartbreaking disasters. last friday, the tlas shuttle lifted off. >> 2, 1, 0, and liftoff, the final liftoff of "atlantis" on the shoulders of the space shuttle america will continue the dream. >> it is time to see what is in effect the end of the u.s. manned space program, as we've come to know it. >> and an absolutely perfect launch from the kennedy space center in florida. >> 30 years now of history concluding really today with this launch action and then of course, the return days from now. >> joining us is pbs science correspondent miles o'brien. you were down there in cape canaveral. >> on a personal level it's sad. i've watched 40-plus launches, it's a part of my life, but the truth is all good things must come to an end. the a time to say good-bye. it's complicated, expensive and frankly not the safest way to get to the station. and frankly it's time to think of another mission. it was my sense the media's interests really plummeted. remember when walter cronkite would narrate. america stopped. i wonder if the declining public interest is related to the declining media interest. >> there is a lot of that, but let's go back farther. really, the weighing interest on the part of the american public began with the splashdown of apollo 11. thing about it for a moment. the perfect navy tiff. let's beat the russians to the moon, honoring the wishes of a martyred president. it was mad for tv. so we did it and americans began tuning out. think about the shuttle. it was built as reliability access to space, a space truck if you will. that's a snoozer if you're trying to think of a way to selling the story. >> but talking about selling the story, and i think in the '60s, there were cheerleaders for the system, but how much access did you ever have to astronauts? it's still a human story. i don't know the names of most of these people. >> first of all, nasa at the outset wanted to make it seem routine, right? so to the extent they didn't want to create another set of mercury 7 superstars, they wanted to make them more like airline pilots, but when you think about that'sa in the 1960s, the public affairs people had a palace guard mentality, protect the astronauts and their families. you transition to the shuttle program, and the onslaw wasn't there, but the palace guard remained. there was a sense of keeping the astronauts in a bubble there were many instances when i was rye buffed. that's a shame. truly the human stories are what sell newspapers and make people watch. >> and the one, of course, that jumped out recently was mark kegly, because he's married to congresswoman gabby giffords. you were let go by cnn 3 years ago, the unit you headed was largely disbanded. >> no, it was completely disbanded. is that another sign that television cares less about nasa and space? >> yeah, let's face it, you work in a newsroom. i cam in as a history major. i learned science are not along the way. we deal with editors who are the political science, english, history majors, maybe scientific-phobic, there is not a sense that this is necessarily important. they don't embrace thinks subjects very well. >> or are they reflecting the judgment that the public has largely tuned out, it's not the hot story, lever let's do other hot stories, and this doesn't deserve front page or top of the newscast coverage. >> you could do a dive to the bottom. you've been talking at the top of your show twha happens when you start going after those stories. the fact of the matter is, there is an audience out there that wants this kind of coverage. i've been doing webcasts, for the last ten shuttle launches. we draw in about a couple hundred,000 people watching us for six straight hours talking about space. inch wining, 500 miles deep. so there is an audience out there. the mainstream media, for whatever reasons, feels they could gather up enough eyeballs, because it's probably a bit too expensive. will nasa be covered at all now that there's no exciting new mission, president obama's idea of going doesn't leave much of a story line. >> it's tough in the human space program, because we don't know precisely where it's headed. there's a very exciting world right now in commercial space, trying to make a buck in space. >> mylobrine nice to have you back on cnn. >> a pleasure. coming up in the second part of "reliable sources" the casey anthony frenzy. why was twist so obsessed. did the legal pundits engage in character assassination? plus as the president and congress struggle, are journalists wrongly portraying democrats and republicans as equally to blame for the impasse? we have never had a segment on this program about the casey anthony case, an that's not by accident. i saw no reason to join the frenzy. but with her mother acquitted of murder and manslaughter, most television news outlets, even cnn which had been playing down the story went utterly bongers. many of the legal pundits made clear they disapproved. >> the jury delivers a stunning blow to justice with a not guilty on all major counts. >> i was shocked and i was stunned, and i stared at my television set in utter disbelief. >> obviously anyone who listened to this case who heard about this mother waiting 30 days to report her daughter missing, i mean, you couldn't help but be outraged. you couldn't help think this is a bad person or bad mother. >> obviously casey anthony doesn't defer to walk free. just the fact he doesn't report her 2-year-old miss fog 30 days means the woman should spent a long time in prison. and impassioned words from her lawyer. >> i hope this is a lesson to those of you who have indulged in media assassination for three years, bias and prejudice, and incompetent talking heads saying what would be and how to be. i'm disgusted by some of the lawyers that have done this, and i can tell you my colleagues from coast to coast and border to border have condemned this. and don't have the experience to back up their words or the law to do it. >> he has a point, doesn't he? joining us to talk about the coverage, diane dimond, and lauren ashburn. lauren, what do you make of the sheer overwhelming volume of the coverage. >> let me guess, you think it's outrageous and overkill. so do i. i think we have gone crazy. why this case? why now? why her? i'll tell you one reason. the only reason is ratings, which equals advertising dollars, which equal profits. >> diane, this is your job to cover crime stories, but when you look at the broad landscape, how can this excess possibly be justified? >> well, because people watch it, frankly. let's talk about the elephant in the room that you haven't mention. it'sen cnn's sister station, hln, who has covered this from the get-go, top mom. flag flag has something called a sunshine law and everything that the police know gets released to the public. if the immediate gentleman does not cover it, i would tell you i think they're remiss. i think where the overkill happened was on the national scene. how many young children are killed every year in this country, it's a sad fact, and we don't do nearly this kind of coverage for any of them. yes, it was overkill. >> on that point, you've covered murders of children. >> of course, by their mothers. >> that don't make national news. >> right. i was a local reporter for five years, harrisburg, new york, washington. in harrisburg, on a hot 100-degree july day, police found two children in a soiled crib with baby bottles that had roaches in them. they were did. that woman, african-american -- african-american we got a vosot on the air, talking about in outrageous case. why didn't that become national attention? well, at the time there were no cameras in the courtroom in pennsylvania. and i'm not saying that sunshine laws shouldn't exist and we shouldn't have cameras, but that is one of the deciding factors on whether or not these cases come to television. second of all, there were no racy pictures of this woman, as there were with casey anthony. number three, there was not a cute toddler and pictures of those children. >> i think you hit on something. diane, you say we put it on tv because people to watch. but casey anthony is white, middle class and attractive. you don't get these friendsies, for example, over african-american families where these things happy. >> there's enough hi pawaii poc sills to go around. i listened to a bite of cheney mason this morning online where he said, the defense is full of beans. well, then he became one of the defense. >> let's put up a picture of him telling the media with a sing the gesture -- >> class act. >> diane brought up the question of hln, which has carried a lot of the live testimony in this trial, nancy grace, of course, the billing star there. when nancy grace and other legal pundits say this woman is guilty, guilty, guilty, are they part of the problem? >> of course they were. but before we get to that, in helping you keep your job here, i think it's amazing that cnn has this program to attack or to analyze and talk about this case on a cnn network. i think that that is great journalism so, okay? you happy with that? let me answer your question. >> kudos. >> the question then becomes, is this something that we should pay attention to. there are a lot of people that want to make their careers. don't you think the attorneys saw an opportunity to become a national figure? does that -- i want to know, does that affect the outcome of the case? did nancy grace getting up there talking all the time about this tot mom, a murderer, affect the outcome? >> of course these people want to become famous. a lot of people who are legal analysts today,