at least in the visible portion today, are they an attempt to match the actual room colors in part because of how the discriminates described what room they were in by room color? >> yes. >> did you have an opportunity to go through the interior of 2207 seymour? >> on multiple occasions, yes. >> when was the first time? >> i would say the first time was either the following day or maybe the day after their escape. >> describe that experience. >> well, it was -- it was surreal to me. i've been involved in the missing persons investigations for quite some time. and so it was a difficult experience. that's basically how i would describe it. >> did you for your own benefit