broadway i saw the empire state lay low ♪ ♪ life went on beyond the palisades they all bought cadillacs left there long ago ♪ ♪ to tell the world about the way the light went out to keep the memory alive ♪ >> it's all these human emotions. for some reason we can tap into that as musicians. >> when we came up with this idea of doing this series of in-depth interviews with really extraordinary people we started thinking about whom we should try to get and whom we should ask. and we thought about the usual political figures, obama, the dali lama. and i come back to the idea of interviewing the person i really wanted to interview, and that was billy joel. and the reason is i've been in love with his music ever since i was a teenager growing up in india. billy joel has been a rockstar for five decades. today he keeps up his nearly ten-yearlong residency at madison square garden playing the piano and belting out the lyrics that so many fans adore. he's sold more than 150 million records, but he hasn't recorded a new rock album in almost 30 years. i've wanted to understand all this. i've wanted to understand him and his talent. so here we are on our way to billy joel's house. i'm excited, a little nervous. we'll see how it goes. fingers crossed. i still remember hearing "glass houses," getting the album, the vinyl and that photograph of you with the rock, and you're about to throw it. ♪ ♪ friday night i crashed your party saturday i said i'm sorry ♪ >> it was electric. ♪ you may be wrong but you may be right, you may be wrong but you may be right ♪ >> so you write for whom? >> i write for me. i mean it may sound selfish. it may sound self-serving, but the only person i know who can judge what i'm doing correctly is me. i know when i've written something that's not that good, but i've also written some stuff which is really damn good. and when that happens i'm very, you know, ecstatic. i don't know how that happened, but thank you. almost if i stuck my head into this rarefied atmosphere and it came into me and went through my fingers. >> when you think about your songs, what's the one you are most proud of, that you feel like you're saying, you know, when you write sometimes you think this is damn good? >> i think a song like "and so it goes" is a song i'm very proud -- it's very short, very simple. there's not a lot of accompaniment. the chords are really evocative. you hear the dissonance? there's always a -- a little bit of a sour note in every chord. ♪ ♪ in every heart there is a room, a sanctuary safe and strong ♪ >> there's an unresolved -- >> like the tension a little -- >> yes, there's this tension through the whole thing. ♪ a ♪ and so it goes and so you will soon i suppose ♪ >> when i finished writing i said that's really good. >> a lot of times when you write you're moved by events. you know your music is kind of rich with history and culture, so you hear about new york going bankrupt. >> yes. >> and you hear about ford saying to new york city drop dead, that famous headline. and that motivates you to write "miami 2017," right? >> yes. i mean i'm part of the world also. aside from being a musician i'm affected by events. if you think about it right before the beatles hit which was on the ed sullivan show 1964 what happened right prior to that? the assassination of john f. kennedy. who was the young vigorous man who represented youth in the future and he was taken away from us. and the country had the blues and big time. everybody was depressed over the kennedy assassination, and it lasted for a long time. who took us out of that depression? the beatles. they represented youth, they represented the future, they represented vitality. >> you remember the first time you heard the beatles. was the first time the ed sullivan show? >> the first time i saw them was the ed sullivan show. i think it was i want to hold your hand was a big hit. and this was different. what is that? who is that? that's the beatles, and it changed my life. that's why i do what i do now because of what the beatles did. this was like a band from the neighborhood, kind of like me and my friends. they were working class guy, and they were hugely successful and made their own music. that's what i want to do. >> how old were you when you were -- >> in 1964 i was 14 years old. >> but at this point you have already had ten years of piano -- classical piano lessons because you started at 4. >> right. >> do you look at that as a body of work and training that allowed you to do the kind of music that you do now? >> now i would have to say, yes. at the time i didn't know to what end i was learning to play the piano. my father played the piano. he was a good pianist but he worked at a corporation doing another kind of work. my mother was musical, she sang, and i took piano lessons because my mom wanted me to take piano lessons. i lived on a house on a quarter acre and we had an upright lester piano, which is not a very good pipiano and i was taking lessons. to what end i didn't know. >> when you look at people have a genes and genes for musical talent. your daughter is now an accomplished performer. >> alexa, yes. >> or was it the hard work of all those -- those years of the piano and later with the bands? >> i think it's a combination of the two. i think there must be something genetic which is inherent to be musical. you don't just pick up a guitar and go banging and you're an instant star. there's a lot of work involved. but there's also the background. i grew up hearing all kinds of music. i was exposed to classical music at a young age, broadway shows, folk music. >> what was the first tune that you ever played? >> the first tune i ever played -- wait a minute, i'll show you this. my daughter has the same book. i'm plugging this shamelessly. the john thompson piano course, book 1. first grade book. john thompson, music for piano. the first piece i learned was called believe it or not "off we go to music land." >> do you remember it? >> yes. >> can you play it without looking at it? >> here it is. okay, and it goes like this. and it even has words. ♪ off we go to music land learn by eye and ear and hand ♪ >> so when you were taking piano lessons and your mom's in the next room and you're doing piano practice and you're meant to be doing a mozart sonota, what would you actually do? >> well, i would start to learn the piece so i got a feel for, you know, how it should go. say the mozart sonata in "c." ♪ and then the next part. ♪ but i wouldn't play that because that was a lot of notes there. so i went -- ♪ and i would just make it up as i'm going along. >> so that was -- you started with mozart but then you just went into billy joel? >> yeah, i just made up my own stuff. >> you were telling me you thought "uptown girl" has a mozart element to it. ♪ >> yeah, if you break it down to its basics it's -- ♪ then you add an alberti base. ♪ ♪ and when she's walking she's looking so fine and when she's talking she'll say that she's mine ♪ >> but it's from the classical period. and there's a couple of songs like that. "for the longest time." ♪ it's very classic. >> could you mimic beethoven? >> if i was going to mimic beethoven it would be -- ♪ >> there's always an edge of anxiety and unfulfillment and anger and passion. >> is that why you like him more than mozart? >> i think beethoven is one of the most human of composers because he wrote in fits and starts. mozart is like perfect. >> right. >> he's like an angel, like he came down from heaven and everything he writes is perfect, effortless. he just kind of glides along and plays exactly what should be played. beethoven, i had a copy of "the night symphony," the actual notation. and you see these huge pages scratched out, like he never wanted anybody to see the lousy stuff he wrote. and i'm looking at this and going, wow, he wrote in fits and starts just like human emotions. and there's a lot of that in his music, fits and starts and insecurity and confidence, anger and love and passion. it's all there. which is why i love beethoven more tn any other composer. pain hits fast. so get relief fast. only tylenol rapid release gels have laser drilled holes. they release medicine fast for fast pain relief. and now get relief without a pill with tylenol dissolve packs. relief without the water. so, you're 45. that's the perfect age to see some old friends, explore new worlds, and to start screening for colon cancer. yep. with colon cancer rising in adults under 50, the american cancer society recommends starting to screen earlier, at age 45. i'm cologuard, a noninvasive way to screen at home, on your schedule. and i find 92% of colon cancers. i'm for people 45+ at average risk for colon cancer, not high risk. false positive and negative results may occur. ask your provider if cologuard is right for you. businesses have to find new ways to compete in order to thrive in an ever-changing market. the right relationship with a bank who understands your industry, as well as the local markets where you do business, can help lay a solid foundation for the future. pnc provides the resources of one of the nation's largest banks and local leaders with a focus on customized insights to help your business achieve its goals. that's how we make a difference. ♪ ♪ does it get better than never getting lost? ♪ does it get better than not parallel parking yourself? ♪ alexa ask smartfeed to feed the dog. does it get better than feeding your dog from 50 miles away? yes... it does. at buick we see a future that's even better. because the life enhancing innovations you've never even dreamed of? buick is dreaming of them every day. 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[laughter] ♪ ♪ this is the tempur-pedic® breeze° and its mission is to make sleep feel cool. so, no more night sweats... no more nocturnal baking... ...or polar ice cap air-conditioner mode. because the tempur-pedic breeze° delivers superior cooling... from cover to core. helping you sleep cool, all night long. don't miss our best offer of the year, with savings up to $700 on select* adjustable mattress sets, and experience the deep, undisturbed rest of tempur-pedic. learn more at *tempurpedic.com. people often say you're a great mimic, you've heard people say that like you can riff off -- do you like that? picasso said good artists copy great artists. >> yeah, there's probably something to that. it has to do with the ear. a lot of singers in pop music especially love the voice of ray charles. they want to sing like ray charles. rod stewart wants to sing like ray charles. robert from led zeppelin wanted to sing like ray charles. >> i always thought new york state of mind was your homage to ray charles. >> except i wrote it in such a high key i don't know if ray would be able to sing it. ♪ some folks like to get away ♪ >> it should be more -- >> did you wear glasses when you play? >> absolutely. but i thought of ray charles singing it in yankee stadium when i was writing the song, yes. >> and were you trying to do some kind of fusion i mean not just ray charles, but in general you have some influence and then you try to meld it into something you were doing? >> well, a lot of times i'm thinking of somebody else other than me singing what i'm writing because i don't like my own voice. i never did. i like to sound like somebody else and i'm thinking of somebody else when i'm writing. i want to conjure up somebody else. that allows me to go in any direction i want as a writer. it gives me a broad pallet. >> do you have a thought as to why your songs have lasted so long? >> they can be sung. almost all of the great music which is still viable today is mostly melodic music that can be sung or hummed or whistled. a lot of atonal music is almost impossible for people to remember or whistle to. so i think it's because it was melodic in the first place. >> when you write you always say the music comes first. >> yes. >> does that mean -- take us through that process. you get up in the morning and you start humming something and that stays with you? >> a lot of times i would have dreamt music i don't instantly remember when i wake up. but i do know what was that thing i dreamt last night and it was really good, it was almost symphonic, and i'll spend a good amount of the day trying to recall on the piano by playing it went like this, and it kind of went like that, trying to recall a dream. that's what happened with "just the way you are." i had dreamt it, i forgot it, and a few weeks went by and all of a sudden it reoccurred to me. and i was in the middle of a meeting with an attorney and accountant and i was like i've got to leave right now, i've got to write his song. and they went go, go write. and i was writing it and thinking i must have heard this before. did i steal this from somebody else, is this somebody else's melied. and i realize, yes, you idiot, you wrote it in your dream. you dreamt it and the dream reoccurred. and it's hard to do. i've tried to put a tape recorder next to my bed and hum into it and sing the melied, and it always sounds like -- i couldn't figure out what i was doing. so it doesn't work like that. 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"captain jack" after having done it for 30, 40 years, i've demoted him to private jack. it's two chords. ♪ and then it's just ♪ saturday night ♪ >> thank goodness there's a chord change. ♪ >> when you wrote "only the good die young" you thought of it as a reggae song. >> yes, i did. i heard it as -- ♪ my drummer, again, threw his sticks at me. >> how about the chorus of that? ♪ only the good die young, oh, yeah, only the good die young ♪ >> my drummer said the closest you've ever been to jamaica is the long island railroad when you stop at jamaica and change trains to go to manhattan. i said let's come up with a different kind of rhythm like instead of -- we did a shuffle. ♪ so i -- i credit the band for a lot of the arrangements. ♪ things that you might have done, well only the good die young ♪ >> sometimes your lyrics seem to me to be counteracting the melody. so, for example, the lyrics are soft and lyrical but the words are kind of cutting. >> it's an effective technique for writing a song. when they're opposites. she can kill with a smile, she can wound with her eyes. you don't think that's going to be like the words are -- it's like a nice folk song. ♪ she can lead you to love take you or leave you, she can ask for the truth but she'll never ♪ ♪ believe and she'll take what you give her as long as it's free ♪ ♪ yes she steals like a thief but she's always a woman to me ♪ >> and then you hear she's just a complete bitch, and then it just -- wait a minute, it's jarring. >> suddenly it gets harsh. >> yeah, but there are other songs where the -- the music actually complements what the lyric is. "summer highland falls" is kind of about panic depression. and it goes up and goes down, goes up and goes down, and this manic thing. ♪ there's a bipolar musical thing going on. and like -- and "so it goes," which is a sad song about knowing that heart break is going to come and you have that -- ♪ you hear those dissonant notes? than anybody else, apartments-dot-com can help you trade this love nest for... (woman) ...an actual nest. 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>> i wasn't a big rock star. i was just starting out. i had finished my first album when i went to europe. so i found out all this stuff about my family i didn't know just by going to vienna. i found out i had a half property. wow. >> is the song "vienna" in some way a metaphor for that? ♪ slow down you crazy child you're so ambitious for a juvenile ♪ ♪ but then if you're so smart tell me why are you still so afraid ♪ >> well, let's see, slow down you crazy child, that could have been me. you're so ambitious for a juvenile -- yes. in some ways, yes. ♪ you realize vienna waits for you ♪ >> but also the age i was at, i was in my mid-20s, which is a difficult time for a lot of people because a lot of people think we've got to have it all together before we hit 30. if we're not a success before we're 30, it's over, forget it, you're not going to make it. and there's all that pressure. and i saw that happening with my friends. and after -- after having been in vienna and learning a lot about that culture and europe as well, slow down, take it easy. there's a reason for every time in your life there's a season for it. so i don't know what may be the world's greatest philosopher, but i decided that to be the lyric. >> you don't talk about politics on stage and really not at all as far as i can tell. why? >> once in a blue moon i do if something is really aggravating me. but i realize people pay a lot of money to go to concerts, and they didn't come to hear me talk about my political views. they came to hear the music. a lot of them came to escape from all of that. >> right. >> i'm not a politician. and i'm not a philosopher. i'm just a piano player. don't forget that. don't lose sight of that. you're a piano player. and people don't want to hear your politics. even though something can be really on my mind and i'm dying to say it, i try not to -- >> because you think about you're steeped in history, you're reading this stuff. the one time that i know is after charlottesville. >> jews will not replace us! >> you wore a star of david. >> i wore the yellow star of david. i didn't say anything. i just wore the star of david because i know that if it was nazi germany i would be defined as a jew. doesn't matter what you do. doesn't matter who you are, what you've accomplished, you're a jew and that's it for you. you're out. and it all happened again, and i had to say something. i had to do something because it happened to my father's family. they were all wiped out except for his parents. they had -- they had to leave germany in the middle of the night. then my old man gets to new york, what happens, he gets drafted immediately and then he has to go back to germany and shoot school friends. so he had a tough life. and that has impacted me. that's affected me a great deal. even though i didn't know my father all that well, i recognize that his life must have been very difficult. and for me to be as successful as i am is astonishing when i consider the background where i came from. and it's natural. treat it that way with aveeno® daily moisture. formulated with nourishing, prebiotic oat. it's clinically proven to moisturize dry skin for 24 hours. aveeno® ♪ ♪ this is the moment. for a treatment for moderate-to-severe eczema. cibinqo — fda approved. 100% steroid free. not an injection, cibinqo is a once-daily pill for adults who didn't respond to previous treatments. and cibinqo helps provide clearer skin and less itch. cibinqo can lower your ability to fight infections, including tb. before and during treatment, your doctor should check for infections and do blood tests. tell your doctor if you've had hepatitis b or c, have flu-like symptoms, or are prone to infections. do not take with medicines that prevent blood clots. serious, sometimes fatal infections, lymphoma, lung, skin and other cancers, serious heart-related events, and blood clots can happen. people 50 and older with heart disease risk factors have an increased risk of serious heart-related events or death with jak inhibitors. this is the moment. but we've only just begun. speak with your doctor about cibinqo today. an innovation from pfizer. republicans in congress call them "entitlements." a "ponzi scheme." the women and men i served with in combat, we earned our benefits. just like people earned their social security and medicare benefits. but republicans in congress have a plan to end so-called "entitlements" in just five years. social security, medicare, even veterans benefits. go online and read the republican plan for yourself. joe biden is fighting to protect social security, medicare and veterans benefits. call joe biden and tell him to keep fighting for our benefits. ♪ (queen - we will rock you) ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ the new gmc sierra. premium and capable. that's professional grade. 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(vo) with 5g ultra wideband in many more cities, you get up to 10 times the speed at no extra cost. get verizon business unlimited from the network businesses rely on. welcome to your world. your why. what drives you? what do you want to leave behind? what do you want to give back? what do you want to be remembered for? that's your why. it's your purpose, and we will work with you every step of the way to achieve it. at pnc private bank, we'll help you take care of the how. so tell us - what's your why? ♪ when did you try to commit suicide? >> i was 21. >> the year was 1970. >> when you have one foot still in childhood and another foot in adulthood, it's a difficult time for a lot of people. i felt like i was a musician, but i was not successful. i wasn't making any money. i had no place to live. i had no prospects, and i thought, well, the world doesn't need another failed musician. and i was in a depressed state. >> and then comes 1976, '77, '78. in that seven. year period you release seven albums, maybe. >> '71 would have been "cold spring harbor." '73 would have been "piano man." '74 was "street life." >> turp styles '76. glass houses is '80. >> 1980. >> "nylon curtain" is '82. when you look back on it this is seven years where you're producing crazily successful album after album, hit single after hit single. did it feel like it at the time? >> i didn't realize until afterwards, but i felt like by the time i got to "turnstiles" whereby i was writing much better material, i had matured as a writer. not that i was on a hot streak but learning how to do it, and i think i got it. didn't feel particularly gifted or like on a super streak. that was my job. i learned how to do my job. i felt confident, how about that. i've been asked what's the reason for your success, and i say i'm competent. and they say what do you mean? when you're competent in a world of incompetence, that makes you extraordinary. i know how to do what i'm supposed to do. i know how to write and i know how to play. i know how to sing in key. i know how to entertain an audience. and i've seen a lot of people who are supposed to be able to do that, and they don't do it very well. so i can do it competently, and that makes me appear, you know, above and extraordinary. >> when did you feel like i'm a big star? >> we had done a gig at a venue in washington, d.c. constitution hall, i think, 2,000 seats or something like that. and i got attacked by a mob of girls. i was outside and i got mobbed by these girls. they were pulling my clothes off and my hair out. and i said, wow, this is kind of like a hard day's night, i must be doing pretty well. and i came in and the band was poking fun at me like, whoa, look at you, mr. superstar. and i didn't feel like a big shot, i realized i'm bigger than i thought -- than i know i am. >> so when i watch now and i saw you in madison square garden, you have tens of thousands of people singing back your songs to you. this must be a crazy heavy experience. and then you go into the car when the concert is done. is that deflating? >> yes. it's extreme transition to go from 20,000 people singing your words back to you, applauding you, standing, cheering, making all this noise. and then you get into this quiet car and there's nothing. you go from being mussolini to being insignificant. and a lot of people have difficulty with that transition. some people feel like they need to have body guards with them and a whole entourage of people. i'm just by myself in the car, okay, what was that all about? it's jarring. >> this is unique. movie stars don't have 50,000 people -- is that what causes so much of the drugs and the alcohol? you're almost trying to re-create that high. >> that -- that's probably true. some people who can't deal with that transition of going from adulation to absolute nothing, they need a lift, sort of like cocaine. you're always chasing that first sniff, and you'll never get there. it's -- it's a pointless chase. i -- i don't have a problem with it. i'm fine. i go home. i take out the garbage. i cook food, i play with the kids. i'm fine with that transition. but i've been doing this all my life since i was 14 years old. a is for awareness, because knowing that your chronic kidney disease in type 2 diabetes could progress to dialysis is important. b is for belief that there may be more you can do. just remember that k is for kidneys and kerendia. for adults living with ckd in type 2 diabetes, kerendia is proven to reduce the risk of kidney failure, which can lead to dialysis. kerendia is a once-daily tablet that treats ckd differently than type 2 diabetes medications to help slow the progression of kidney damage and reduce the risk of cardiovascular events, such as heart attacks. do not take kerendia if you have problems with your adrenal glands or take certain medications called cyp3a4 inhibitors. kerendia can cause hyperkalemia, which is high potassium levels in your blood. ask your doctor before taking products containing potassium. kerendia can also cause low blood pressure and low sodium levels. so now that you know your abcs, remember, k is for kidneys, and if you need help slowing kidney damage, ask your doctor about kerendia. ♪ meta portal go. look professional. ♪ even if you don't feel it. meta portal. the smart video calling device... - right on time! - of course. that makes work from home work for you. so, shall we get started? 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(soft music) what we now look at as your last rock album, did you think it was going to be your last? >> i didn't realize until i got to the end, the last song, which was called "famous last words." ♪ these are the last words i have to say ♪ >> i was writing that song, and i recognizes this is a swan song. i'm basically bidding farewell to song writing, and it felt like it was time. the song i wrote before that was called "2,000 years" ♪ in the beginning there was the cold and the night ♪ >> it was just looking forward to the year 2000 when everything was going to be great and the world was going to change and there was going to be no more war. and i realized how naive i was to have written that. things didn't change. things got what seemed to be worse. and i recognized i'm not a -- a prophet. i'm not a philosopher. i'm just a dumb piano player, so it's time for me to shut up. >> and that's exactly what he did. "river of dreams" was the last original rock album billy released in 1993. eight years later he did release "fantasies and delusions," an album of classical music. so you're still writing a lot, right? >> i still compose music. >> and is there an element of maybe you're being too much of a perfectionist that you don't want to show it to us, let the public hear it? >> maybe. i didn't think of that. but i -- what's important to me is that i'm being productive to myself, that i am creating, that i'm still a musician. i don't feel the need to have to share it with the world or record it and sell records and make a business out of it because i've been doing that for the past 50 years. >> is part of it the kind of music you did you felt like you did it, it was of an age, and the music being played now whether it's hip hop, rap, whatever is just not what you want to participate in? >> well, i think my kind of song writing is acronistic at this point. i don't really hear the kind of music i was writing back in the '70s or '60s or even the '80s anymore. it's a different kind of pop music. >> what do you think of it? >> some of it is good, and some of it isn't good. just like i was doing it there's some good stuff, there's some bad stuff. it's always going to be like that. >> the big difference now between when you grew up and i grew up, we listened to music as an album, and we had a curated list of songs that you had given us. >> yes. >> and now it's all individual. every individual creates his own or her own play list. and that's going to be more and more true with artificial intelligence because you're going to be -- the computer will suggest songs to you based on -- >> that's what you'll hear. >> what does that do to music, you think? >> i think it tends to diminish the community aspect of music. i think my age group seemed to all be on the same page for a couple of years, especially after the kennedy assassination. and i think it continued somewhat into the '70s. and then the demographics changed. and when the internet began people could stream their own stuff, and we weren't a community anymore. but that's part of the joy of being a musician is creating that community. i hear it when we play a concert and people are singing, and i realize there's a community here. look what we're doing. and it's just a joy to it that we created this sense of community, which i don't know if it's still going to exist. >> i mean in a way it's a metaphor for what's happening to the country, right? i mean, everyone -- everyone is moving internally and the only way they connect is through social media or something. >> yeah, they're listening to their own echo chamber. a lot of people will only hear what they want to hear. and sometimes you should hear things that you didn't want to hear just to be exposed to it. >> as we came to the close of our conversation we talked about how billy sees his own work in comparison with that of his musical idol. what is it you said about beethoven and you said i haven't forgiven myself for not being beethoven? >> well, i read a quote where neal diamond was talking about he had forgiven himself for not being beethoven, and i had an epiphany at that moment. that's the issue, i haven't forgiven myself for not being beethoven. and i probably never will. >> the first interview i was able to track down of you was 1977. you said when i was young i wanted to be a rock star and now i want to be a great musician. what do you want to be now? >> now i just want to be a good dad. i have two very young kids now, 6 years old, 4 years old. and i have a chance to be a father again because i also have a 35-year-old, and i want to do it better this time. there's such a joy to it. that's right now the most important thing to me. >> and is that partly because you've just scaled every mountain, i mean kennedy center, presidential medals, rock and roll hall of fame? it's difficult to see there's nothing left in that world for you to conquer? >> it was really my own bar i set. the height of that bar probably i'll never reach. one of it reasons i stopped writing songs is because i recognized this is as good i'm going to get with song writing. and rather than being aggravated and frustrated i couldn't write it better i'm going to do it a different way. i'm going to just write music. so i recognize what is it clint eastwood would say? a man's got to know his limitations. i recognize mine. "the godfather" was made in a very classical almost shakespearean style. it was going to be about succession. like a king who had three sons and none of the sons had all his talents. michael coul r