and over again i'm simply here to tell you what i saw, what i heard and what i knew. these judgments are for you folks to make. i thought that made for very credible testimony. >> and neither one fueled speculation of either side. both sides tried to say wouldn't you say, wouldn't you have thought? they backed off both times. i thought it was cheap when jordan said i can't believe you two are are the best they have out of the box. he did make the point of saying neither of you spoke to the president, know anything firsthand. >> that's a valid point. they have very little ground to stand on to attack these gentlemen. al also, particularly in the case of taylor, he's backed up by a contemporaneous record, his handwritten notes and his texts at the time. at the time he sent a contemporaneous text. >> and a staff that forgot to