well, look, he's not really, you know, it's a very complex situation in the middle east and to -- to not -- i mean, i don't care necessarily about names of people, but to not kind of know the dine mix. he says there are no iraqis. there is no iraq. >> well, listen. it's absolutely true that it's esa roll of the dice for the country to elect somebody to the presidency who has never held public office in a day in his or her life and we have, you know, ben carson and donald trump now leading the republican field, and neither one of them has spent time in public life and they should be held up to scrutiny. we should expect certain standard but when you have a roll call as you've had of terrorist leaders in the middle east, i -- i doubt many foreign policy experts don't know all those names. i don't think -- i don't think that's the standard. >> right. >> i do think that's a gotcha. trying to reveal gaps in his knowledge, but what we want to