so are we out of the woods yet? >> the senate has just passed a temporary budget deal that would avoid a debt ceiling crisis. >> last night, i signed legislation to reopen our government and pay america's bills because democrats and responsible republicans came together. the first government shutdown in 17 years is now over. >> new high. by the way, closing high, too, 1 17,252. >> now we can begin mending fences. there's a hilarious poll out there. >> the bottom line is real people in america are hurting because of this congress. they need to get their act together. good evening, everyone. from washington to wall street, this has been a tumultuous week. with the s&p 500 closing at yet another record high today, the coming days could and should be just as dramatic. the question we have to ask tonight is, does this rally make sense and can it last? meantime, back in washington, both parties are back in their own camps getting ready for the next round of what seems to be that never-ending budget battle, hardline groups on both sides already applying the pressure to get what they want in the next round of negotiations. right now, nobody seems to want any part of the obama care rollout. you've heard about the website glitches, about the sky-high deductibles, the cost of the coverage. now the insurance companies say the information they're getting from the enrollees may be totally corrupted. all that coming up on this cnbc special report. good evening, everybody. i'm tyler mathisen. larry kudlow is out tonight and will be back on monday. this is a cnbc special report. we're here live at 7:00 eastern time and 4:00 p.m. pacific. joining me for the entire hour are cnbc's amanda drury. can i call you mandy? and kayla tausche is here. >> kayla is fine for me. >> we have to start the discussion tonight about these markets despite a crazy week. it was an up-and-down week but mostly an up week. the rally seems to be stronger than ever. here to discuss that and more, michael farr and jeff killberg. he's really thinking about notre dame and usc tomorrow. but we'll derail him for just a few minutes. michael, let me start with you. with earnings as tepid as they have been, notwithstanding google, which we'll get to in a minute, earnings have been relatively tepid. my question is has the market gotten a little ahead of itself? >> yeah, probably not. and i think the answer goes to monetary policy, tyler, and not to the fundamentals. when you're shoving this much money into a market at the pace of $85 billion a month out of the federal reserve and we now have with janet yellen, our new monetary mamma in place, it's the most dovish fed i've seen in my career. money is going to keep coming in. there's a backstop, there's support and i think you're going to continue to see multiples to expand. are prices high? yeah, up 60% off the 2009 lows. that's high. so stocks aren't cheap. investors should be careful. but i think in this environment, they can go higher. >> and yet, michael, i'm sure that monetary mamma is going to be generous. 9 but aren't you expecting a meaningful correction in the next few months? >> i've been so dead wrong about this, mandy, i said last year that -- i did. we haven't had one in 12 months and in january, i was giving a speech at the university of delaware and i said, i think we have a 10% correction coming up. we haven't had one in two years. john said, no, i think you're wrong as long as the fed keeps its foot on the pedal, we don't have that correction coming up. he's been right. i've been wrong. i expect stocks to pull back but we've never had this level of quantitative easing and never this forceful a fed in terms of accommodation in monetary policy. we really don't know. seems like they ought to come back a little. but it's not happening. >> let me turn to you, jeff, and ask a question about the market more broadly, more generally. there is an argument -- michael, you seem in part to be making it -- that there's almost a perfect trifecta of conditions, low but sustainable economic growth, very low, almost nonexistent inflation and interest rates that we know are going to stay low for the next year or so at the very least, that lowers the cost of capital. it means that bonds are no real stiff competition for stocks. so do we have a perfect environment setting aside monetary and fiscal policy for a moment? >> tyler, i'm going to say no to that. but you are right, this q.e. undercurrent has been amazing. it's actually reverted back to bad news being good news. what we're trying to figure out here in chicago, back at the nasdaq, tyler, the last week, since wednesday, the nasdaq is up 250 handles. in laymen's terms, that's up nearly 8%. that's not sustainable. we're seeing this q.e. undercurrent come in and be the trump card of all trump cards. but you have to look at tuesday's earnings. ibm, ebay, they get stiff-armed a little bit. i think the biggest things folks aren't really considering is -- maybe we've overshot it a little bit, was the body count. what was the damage done by washington? s&p put it at $24 billion. is that equal, another three to six months of q.e. of $85 billion? >> some earnings that were good, google. what a day for the shares of google. those shares topping $1,000 for the first time ever. and the stock is up more than 1,000% since its ipo. if you're one of the lucky folks to get in at those levels, you've made a lot of money. is there anything to knock the stock off its record run? this is what art cashin had to say. >> i'm beginning to worry about it. we're hearing things reminiscent to the 1999-2000 period, the number of hits, the number of eyeballs, i think, if we hold to the old tried and true, how many dollars are coming in, that might be better served. but people are extrapolating in some ways in a manner similar to the way they did in '99-2000 and that gets warning flags flying. >> where do shares of google go from here and does tech feel more bubblicious to you? >> it does feel bubblicious. what a move, nearly 15%. i think tech has been the safe haven for assets with the q.e. when people got nervous for the debt ceiling, what got hit? the tech sector. the nasdaq was down 2% and the s&p and dow jones were barely down 1%. i'm a little cautious. if you do own this, put some protection on. buy the downside puts or trim your position. what a sensational print that was to see today. >> what sort of red flags are looking for in the tech space? a lot of people say the correction will come and it feels bubblicious and put the protection on just in case it happens. but what are you watching for as an indicator? >> we're seeing complacency. you're seeing the nasdaq in particular outperform these last couple of months. in comparison to the other averages. it's more hot money. if you look at the inflows and the etfs specifically at the russell 2000, you're seeing a lot of inflows into the space because folks are chasing alpha here at the end of the moontd the end of the year. we want to see some movement. you see google give back some of these gains, you'll get other folks nervous in that sector. >> another company out today with better-than-expected earnings, not great earnings. that's general electric. they reported a backlog of so many things. a lot of the weakness came from ge capital. that had been a big cash cow for the company. do you think it's on a good path as more of a pure play industrial conglomerate at this point? >> i think it's one of the strengths of ge that you have those counterbalancing businesses so that when certain environments -- and they have to take -- can't add to earnings at the same rate through writeoffs or moving from the reserve portfolio. they have other businesses that are operating around the world. i think it was very strong. and i think that they were coming from fundamental demand, was really very encouraging. that gave me some encouragement about other stocks. i've been listening to what jeff said and what i'm saying. i want to be clear. stocks are not cheap. they're expensive in many ways and they could go higher. but when i look at a google at like 19.5 times next years estimates, that doesn't seem outrageous. you really have to go stock by stock. >> that's a really good point. what i've heard time and again is wharegardless of what the earnings are, the things that can undo the market is q4 guidance. my question is, to what degree are a lot of companies going to use the shutdown as an excuse for lowering their guidance -- >> like bad weather. >> it's the new bad weather. in situations that may be outwarranted even? >> some companies have blamed it on the rain before. but you're right. we have to figure out what was the actual -- what is the body count here? if s&p puts it at $24 billion, let's be prudent here and say it's $50 billion. i really think companies have a hard time using it as a scapegoat and they're going to get called upon it. >> they've already used it as a scapegoat. goldman sachs said, our clients weren't really trading toward the end of the september because they were already worried about it. we've seen that card start to be played. >> we've seen the guidance lower. but that whole retail -- the retail sector is hinting the fact that it's going to be a weaker holiday season. it could be weak in that retail space. >> top-line growth has been coming down as a result of the weaker economic recovery. top-line growth sales, revenue growth has not been robust. we're seeing the results. >> we have to leave it there, guys. i think it's interesting that on a day where we talk a lot about google, we're also talking about ge because i think google is in a way -- i'm not going to strain the metaphor, the new ge. it is the central company in the economy. ge makes lightbulbs. google makes search. i can't imagine going without lightbulbs. i can't imagine going without search for a week. >> but google is building glasses and other things. >> i was talking to a guest on "street signs" earlier on who said it used to be like the new, cool place. now it's like at&t. >> it's a utility in a way. >> it's a utility. >> can you imagine going a week without google? and google's now really a media company. general electric was a media company. then they decided they would get rid of us. we have to talk about what we can expect from washington. ace reporter and cnbc contributor robert costa is about to join us. then we want to ask our investor experts what washington needs to do to win us back, win back the respect and faith of the people. we'll be right back on this special report. ♪ norfolk southern what's your function? ♪ hooking up the country helping business run ♪ ♪ build! we're investing big to keep our country in the lead. ♪ load! we keep moving to deliver what you need. and that means growth, lots of cargo going all around the globe. cars and parts, fuel and steel, peas and rice, hey that's nice! ♪ norfolk southern what's your function? ♪ ♪ helping this big country move ahead as one ♪ ♪ norfolk southern how's that function? ♪ jbut when it comes to investing, things i prefer to do on my own. i just think it's better to work with someone. someone you feel you can really partner with. unfortunately, i've found that some brokerage firms don't always encourage that kind of relationship. that's why i stopped working at the old brokerage, and started working for charles schwab. avo: what kind of financial consultant are you looking for? talk to us today. ♪ "first day of my life" by bright eyes ♪ you're not just looking for a house. you're looking for a place for your life to happen. ♪ you have to let me know [ female announcer ] when sweet and salty come together, the taste is irresistible. sweet and salty nut bars by nature valley. nature at its most delicious. welcome back to this special cnbc report. with the government back up and running and a short-term budget deal in the books, what is up next for congress? for that, we turn to ace political reporter and cnbc contributor robert costa of "the national review" who joins us live from washington. robert, what's going on down in washington now that these guys have had a little time to exhale? >> lawmakers headed home today. but there is another fiscal negotiation on the horizon. that's the budget conference. the next project in washington is reconciling the senate democrats' budget with the house republicans' budget. pm >> who do you think has won out of all this and who has last? >> i think the republican party is definitely stumbling. they're trying to refocus on obama care. they're trying to really see a path ahead, plot that path ahead. i think the president was probably right in his press conference. there are no winners here. we have another fiscal impasse coming up in january and february, another battle ahead. >> we do have a path ahead of us but it's a short one. january's not that far away. some people are saying republicans haven't quite gotten the message that this fight isn't worth having again. do you disagree with that? >> i think there are different perspectives within the republican party. i sat down with michelle mcconnell yesterday and he said the republican party doesn't want to have another government shutdown or a debt ceiling standoff in february. but today when i spoke with ted cruz, he said he still has an appetite for trying to get some con kegss out of the white house when those two events approach. >> we saw pictures of patty murray and paul ryan going to breakfast yesterday, i think it was yesterday, to get this budget conference going. does anybody in washington expect that we are going to have anything approaching a so-called grand bargain come out of all this? >> i'd be reluctant to use the word grand. but i think a small bargain is possible. it would be in this way. sequestration trades from republicans for entitlement reform. when i spoke to mcconnell, he said maybe trading some of those jest je sequester for something like budget cuts. >> thank you for joining us. here's the question, how does k street win back wall street? this is what morgan stanley ceo said on the network earlier on today. >> talk to anybody on the street. i've been watching these interviews on the street. everybody is frustrated. america is the leading country in the world. it's the leading economy in the world. it's been the leader on so many issues. it's time we started acting as leaders. if we get a comprehensive solution, if congress can work towards that, i think the economy is free to do what it's supposed to be doing, which is growing. the u.s. economy is in good fundamental shape. >> let's welcome back michael farr and jeff kilburg. michael, you actually joined us on the show yesterday and you were saying you got out of d.c., as far as you possibly could because you were just sick of it. everybody's sick of it. not just americans but as an outsider, i can say the world is sick of it because we look to america for our leadership. where do we go from here and how do we win that trust and credibility back? >> i think cnbc's campaign to win us back is absolutely spot-on because look at it. guys on washington, you guys down the street from my office, you're losing us. you're losing us in kansas. you're losing us in california and in texas and in maine. you're losing us. we're getting so sick of you and your lack of leadership, your lack of responsibility and your lack of action for our good as opposed to your reelection. this is really cut and clear and simple. and i wrote a book called "restoring our american dream, the best investment" about the erosion of trust and four steps necessary to bring back trust. these guys have to rebuild trust with the voters, with the citizens of this country and i think they do it by acting like leaders, acting like grown-ups and addressing some of these harder issues. absolutely entitlements have to be at the top of this list. but they need to some together to do the right thing as opposed to just get further ahead for their next election campaign. >> but do you think they care or are aware that every single business leader has come on cnbc and said, we will grow and we will operate our business despite what's happening in washington? we think the economy is growing despite the drag from washington which is hurting the economy? they have their districts that they're held accountable to. do you think they care what the business community has to say anymore? >> what we heard in washington was they really wanted the crisis. they were waiting for that one more moment where wall street would just fall out completely and then they could all come rushing to save us from the crisis that they created, right? they took us to the edge of the cliff and then they want credit from pulling us back. wall street this time saw through it. i don't think they're going to get a manufactured crisis again that's going to bail them out. yeah, i think they wanted more pressure. they didn't quite get it. we're trying to go about our business. but make no mistake. if these guys had screwed this up worse than they already screwed it up, we could have had a serious economic problem that led us quickly right back into recession. and it's like warren buffett said with trust and your cred creditworthine creditworthiness, it's a lot like virginity, much easier to preserve than restore. >> you made me perk up my ears there with that metaphor. jeff kilburg, jump in here. seems to me throughout all this that if the policymakers and the national leaders could get together and come to some sort of agreement, come up with anybody's plan, a plan, i don't care whose it is really, that that would unleash business and improve confidence and give us a level of certainty that could add measurably to growth and add measurably to job creation. >> absolutely. you hit the nail on the head. i think the way they do that, you got me fired up about the usc/notre dame football game. it was all w.i.n., what's important now. as a country, especially here in chicago, we want to see a sense of urgency out of congress. they have that certainty. for small businesses and big businesses alike to have that job security and start hiring again. they need to come up with a deal. doesn't have to be the grandest bargain but has to happen now. we can't wait till the night or the week before. how about a change? moreover, i think if you really want to win back all the folks here in chicago, 535 resignat n resignations would be a great start. >> amen. >> i saw yesterday that congressman tom carson announced he's going to be donating his salary from the shutdown to three different charities. if every single congressman and woman donated their shutdown salaries to a good cause, to what degree would that go towards, i don't know, just making the american public feel a little bit better towards them? >> right. at least we'd have some sense that they get it. at least we'd have some sense that they're not just in their protected bubble. >> it could make middle america more upset because they have so much money they don't need the income. that may get people more upset, to be honest with you, mandy. >> i can see two sides of the coin on that one. michael, jeff, great to have you with us. thank you very much. >> thank you. >> are they released? are they allowed to go and enjoy their weekend now? >> they can go and inject some liquidity. >> an adult beverage. what will the politicians actually do? by the way, the next big deadline is december 13th. the two parties are in retreat for now. but will their core supporters let them make a deal? that is coming up next. i was made to work. make my mark with pride. create moments of value. build character through quality. and earn the right to be called a classic. the lands' end no iron dress shirt. starting at 49 dollars. welcome back to tonight's special report. the latest crisis is over. but there's still work to be done. the 11th hour legislation that brought an end to the 16-day government shutdown and raised the debt ceiling for a few more months bought time for negotiations but it added three new dates to the congressional national calendar. in a city where compromise has become a dirty work, critics say washington lawmakers succeeded only in kicking the can down the road. can congress defy the odds and tackle the serious issues impacting the health of our nation? here now is jessica tarleff and kristin anderson. kristin, i want to start with you on this. some people say if democrats can avoid the tax debate and if republicans can avoid the topic of defunding obama care, maybe we'll get somewhere. what do you think? >> it's very tough. i'm not terribly optimistic. i don't think we'll ultimately wind up in a situation of complete disaster. i think people really underestimate the fundamental differences between how republicans and democrats not only think the government should be ordered but what causes economic growth. because those differences are so large, it's not just a matter of everyone coming into a room and holding hands with each other. there are huge differences between where these parties are at. >> are those differences insurmountable? >> i don't know that they are. take a look at revenue-neutral tax reform. republicans could get on board with that because you're in the technically asking a lot of people to get more money. and democrats may like it because you're getting certain things in the tax code that they don't like. there are ways forward. it's going to be very hard to achieve. >> the president's said revenue has to be part of any tax reform that he would sign onto. it seems to me, though, for the president here, the tax reform and the revenue thing is just as sacred to him as obama care is, in lots of ways and that what you really want to get to is something that is maybe lower rates, close some loopholes. it's revenue-neutral but what it does is produces more growth. that's where the revenue comes from. >> i think that's the wisest path forward. i think whichever side of this debate -- whether republicans or democrats, that make their message about growth rather than the things that they're holding sacred, whether it's cutting spending or raising taxes, they're the ones that are politically going to come out ahead in this conversation. >> jessica, where are you on this? >> i think anything is possible. we have some levelheaded people out there who are hopefully driving the conversation. but when you split it between democrats and republicans, it's really democrats, republicans and tea party republicans, three factions going on here. we saw it in the latest kris. we should be looking back to simpson/bowles where they talk about real entitlement reform. they talk about tax reform, lowering the corporate tax rate. as you said, i totally agree that we need pro-growth economic policies, get people back to work. we just lost a lot of money in the shutdown. people don't have jobs. we lost three weeks of hiring. that should be the number one concern. >> to what degree can we touch entitlements? talk about sacred cow, that's the sacred cow. >> you have to be hopeful. these are people we have in charge. this is what we're working with. >> i think we lost hope a long time ago. >> but i remain hopeful. it's just -- it's not fun to be living in america if you're not. we have the greatest democracy in the world. we're supposed to. i'm really hopeful the legislators will start setting an example. >> it's signaled some willingness to look at the -- the cpi, how that is calculated, lo cost of living adjustments are calculated. 9 the eligibility age for medicare, maybe more cost-sharing, some medicare recipients more for their coverage. those are meaningful changes -- >> they are meaningful changes. he suggested them and thrilled to hear that -- >> but the left side of his party doesn't want any part of that. >> and they are pulling the strings. we've seen president obama has gone back and forth throughout negotiations all through his tenure as president and said, i want to work on this and then it didn't end up happening. i think it's a wait and see with such a small window. >> it is a small window. my question to you, kristen, we always say this time it's for real. this is the time we're going to get it right. and they just kick the can down the road. what are the chances it's going to happen all over again? >> the big question is what happens with obama care. that was a big ingredient that set this last government shutdown, debt ceiling debate on fire. and so the question is as this law is implemented, if the implementation goes as badly as republicans think it is, if these exchanges don't get the 7 million people enrolled, if 40% of that pool is not young and healthy people, if it begins to fall apart, republicans are going to smell blood in the water. and the same people who wanted to link obama care to this debate the last time will sense the political environment is even more favorable. maybe if we do the same strategy, it will work out better this time. which makes me nervous as a republican pollster -- >> so they're hoping they'll get some data points in the next three months. >> next time around, obama care will be significantly less popular than it is now -- >> the one thing i would say that really benefited the republicans this time around is that the 2014 elections weren't next month but a year from because if they were next month, they would have gotten slaughtered. but if obama care goes as badly as this first rollout has gone, that's going to benefit them in 2014, right? >> you're exactly right. >> if people are ticked off, they're going to throw out people who supported obama care. >> remember, it was about roughly a month or a little bit more ago that we were talking about syria and that syria was going to play a huge role in the elections. >> it did on things like chemical weapons. >> the shutdown may well be a different level of crisis but ultimately a year is a long time to go. >> kristen, thank you very much. we appreciate your being with us. and jessica, thank you very much for being with us. if you think congress had a bad week, how would you like to be responsible for the obama care website? but there's more. turns out there's a serious new problem for the very few people who were lucky enough to complete their enrollment. i tried, i couldn't. we have that story and much more. but first, listen to what billionaire investor wilbur ross has to say about obama care so far. >> there's one problem if they don't get enough people. the other problem is if they don't get the right people. there's a big assumption in it, namely that healthy young people will sign up. i think that's a very doubtful assumption. i think the healthy young people are going to wait until they get sick. could save you fifteen percent or more on car insurance. everybody knows that. well, did you know that when a tree falls in the forest and no one's around, it does make a sound? 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[ male announcer ] at edward jones, at a ford dealer with a little q and a for fiona. tell me fiona, who's having a big tire event? your ford dealer. who has 11 major brands to choose from? your ford dealer. who's offering a rebate? your ford dealer. who has the low price tire guarantee, affording peace of mind to anyone who might be in the market for a new set of tires? your ford dealer. i'm beginning to sense a pattern. get up to $140 in mail-in rebates when you buy four select tires with the ford service credit card. where'd you get that sweater vest? your ford dealer. welcome back to this cnbc special report. day 18 of the obama care exchange rollout and state and federal exchanges are still plagued with glitches and today "the wall street journal" reports that insurers say they've been getting flawed data, even from the trickle of enrollees who have managed to get through and sign up. is this the tip of the iceberg? let's bring in hadley heath and bob goldberg. bob, let me start with you. do you think obama care has a chance to succeed? >> i can only go by my experience. i tried enrolling after -- >> so did i. >> i enrolled as mickey mouse. >> were you able to get coverage on those ears? >> i have a prescription for cheese that they weren't going to fill which is a whole other issue. but it kicked me back because i didn't give a social security number, which i thought was interesting, how do they know that i wasn't mickey mouse. but my concern is this, as bad as the rollout's been, i've been dealing with cancer treatment issues and it's horrible to figure out if you're going to have the doctor that you have, if you're going to be able to get the drugs that you can, you don't know what the co-pays are. so as bad as this rollout is, it's probably going to be worse when you're trying to get the care that you need under these health exchanges. >> hadley, in the beginning, the president compared the rollout of the exchanges to apple's ios 7 saying this wasn't perfect but that's not to say that they're going to ditch the product. but i think consumers gave it roughly a month to fix that stuff. what do you think is the time frame here before people say, enough with it already? >> well, that's an important question because people who are signing up now at least according to insurance companies may be some of the sickest people, maybe some of the patients who have the determination to sign up again and again because they're desperate for insurance coverage. meanwhile, the young healthy customers that insurance companies love may be likely to give up in the beginning. this is truly an embarrassment for the obama administration. more than that, it's an illustration of government's ineptitude to make millions of decisions that should be free and personal about individual health care. >> bob, you made a good point when you said there's a disconnect with what's going on here in terms of trying to get enrolled and really only the most determined of people at this stage are going to get on. and yet all the things that we say and even the president says about how america is like right at the cutting edge, right at the forefront in terms of medicine and treatments and procedures -- this credible gulf is there. >> let me give you an example. hadley is right h. the people that are going to sign up initially aren't the healthy invincibles. they're not going to speed 30 seconds and go, forget it. i can go to the emergency room or take care of myself at the gym. it's people who really need the care. there's a further disconnect. the drugs that are now available, the doctors that are now available, those networks have been compressed, almost like take a cotton shirt, throwing it in the dryer and coming out short. new medicines coming out on the market will not be available on these plans for 2015. the plans are not required to add new medicines until the h.h.s. board reviews it again in 2015. well, there's a new drug for early treatment of breast cancer that was just approved. that's not going to be on many of these health care's forms. >> i think we'll have very little success in restraining medical cost growth until individuals really come face to face with the cost of their care. so long as there is a third party interposed between them and the care they receive, it's very easy for them to say, okay, that's some outside force that's doing that. but here, as i go on these exchanges and i look at how much unsubsidized insurance is going to cost, i am beginning to get a very clear view of how much this costs me, for a family of four earning let's say $60,000 a year, this is a huge nut. >> exactly. what you're talking about with having some cost sharing of some co-pays is what you might refer to as catastrophic insurance coverage or what we might have referred to as years ago as real insurance, insurance that's there when you need it because of an unexpected emergency. but the obama care plans are the opposite of that because they force you to have first dollar coverage of many of the basic, normal, preventative care things we seek from our doctor. but then the deductibles are also very high. they may be high deductible plans in some cases but they aren't truly insurance plans but more of a way to redistribute costs within health care. that doesn't bring health care costs down. subsidies are simply the affordable care act's mechanism to try to reduce costs for some consumers. meanwhile, their actual bill is being paid by someone else, and that's taxpayers. >> we want to explore another angle of this now which is the health care industry going through a massive transformation under this new plan under the affordable care act. as reported on cnbc.com today, venture capitalists are wasting no time looking for ways to cash in. let's bring in technology reporter katie thompson. this is essentially a government-run health care program. essentially a giant data dump. what do private venture capital managers see as the growth play here? >> v.c.s see a lot of opportunity. it is a data dump and that's where they see the most opportunity. there's going to be trillions of dollars spent in getting the program going and a lot of money spent in reallocation. so they're investing in companies that can break down patient data to help them make better decisions about their patients so they can essentially offer more effective, cost-efficient care. >> what are some of these companies? can you name some for us? >> yeah. a good example of this and may not be one you necessarily think about. one was investing in a company called propeller. it's a start-up that uses a sensor to monitor the patient's vitals and when they're taking their medicine and how much they're taking. so then that data is collected and it's put into a database in a dashboard application so the doctor can monitor his patients, it lowers readmission rates. helps him make cost-effective decisions about who's likely going to return to the hospital and who's actually abiding by their program. >> there's always someone who makes a buck, right? >> always. >> bob, hadley, cadie, thank you. $17 trillion and $4 billion, they're both right in the middle of two late-breaking stories tonight. we have the pricey details for you if you stick around, next. my mantra? always go the extra mile. to treat my low testosterone, i did my research. my doctor and i went with axiron, the only underarm low t treatment. axiron can restore t levels to normal in about 2 weeks in most men. axiron is not for use in women or anyone younger than 18 or men with prostate or breast cancer. women, especially those who are or who may become pregnant and children should avoid contact where axiron is applied as unexpected signs of puberty in children or changes in body hair or increased acne in women may occur. report these symptoms to your doctor. tell your doctor about all medical conditions and medications. serious side effects could include increased risk of prostate cancer; worsening prostate symptoms; decreased sperm count; ankle, feet or body swelling; enlarged or painful breasts; problems breathing while sleeping; and blood clots in the legs. common side effects include skin redness or irritation where applied, increased red blood cell count, headache, diarrhea, vomiting, and increase in psa. ask your doctor about the only underarm low t treatment, axiron. happy friday evening, everybody. welcome back to this cnbc special report. the u.s. national debt jumped today, topping $17 trillion. that's trillion with a "t" for the first time. that's according to the treasury department. it's because treasury officials are back to work and unwound the extraordinary measures they put in place to delay hitting that debt ceiling. $17 trillion is a huge debt, enough to roll this fighting and the government shutdown, nothing was done to address it. the next stop, quadrillion? >> promises that we've made that were probably too generous by half, at least. intergenerationally. and who is going to pay for all that? who's going to be taxed to do this. instead we had a conversation that was sidetracked to a discussion on the future of obama care. so i've spoken to a lot of people in congress who over the past few days have said we missed a moment here. we missed a moment to address the real -- a real fundamental question that we need to confront in this country, what are we spending money on, what can we afford? who's going to pay for it and what are we going to do about promises that are too generous? >> we're pushing over to the beginning of 2014, this current debt ceiling only goes until february 7th of the lack of a debt ceiling, rather. and now analysts from goldman sachs and other big banks are coming out and saying, actually this time the treasury won't even make it this far. they'll run out of money by the middle of march. if something isn't done in the interim, this could get worse the next time around. they were able to put those extraordinary measures in place last month. that's five months. that's extraordinary when you consider the size of the economy and the bills they needed to pay. how scary is it to think about what lays just 90 days in the distance? >> absolutely. and the president said, we need to raise the debt ceiling so the treasury can pay for what congress has already spent. >> that's right. and talking earlier in this hour, we've got to get to a point where we come up with some long-term plan that -- nobody's going to get everything they want. the right, the left, but the truth of the matter is, if we do that, american business is going to be unleashed, consumers are going to feel like they can plan and spend with some knowledge. and i think that is a really -- ought to be a powerful motivator to our leaders. >> they have to put aside washington and assume this is the way it's going to be and barrel forward with their own plans. >> cutting staff, not hiring -- >> a whole lot more with a whole will the less. >> another story, another day, another big fine for jpmorgan. they're going to pay a $4 million -- >> $4 billion. >> what am i thinking? to the federal housing finance agency. it will settle claims that jpmorgan misled investors, including fannie and freddie, about the quality of mortgages it sold prior to the housing bust back in 2008. so this is just one of several fronts on which jpmorgan is being investigated, fennel pennellized by one government agency or another. are the feds folks unfairly picking on jpmorgan or is it time for jpmorgan to put on pitz big boy pants and own up to some not-so-savory behavior? >> i can see both sides of the coin here. unfair, yes, because the company laid out in its earnings last week that of all the losses that investors, including government agencies like fannie and freddie sustained from the crisis and from buying some of these bad mortgages, 80% of them came from bear stearns and washington mutual. >> companies that they were brokered into taking over. >> exactly. >> by the federal government. >> exactly. but they are the kcustodian of those companies and someone has to be on the hook for those losses. more safeguards should have been in place. unfortunately there are not and some losses were from jpmorgan. >> how do you think jamie dimon has come out of this? >> i think he's come out okay. for the reason i just said. i think they can point to a lot of companies that are not jpmorgan as where some of these problems originated. i also think they're doing everything the regulators are asking them to do. the regulators say jump, they say how high. >> and congress had a pretty bad week. obama care had a pretty bad week. but did you hear about jcpenney? if you want to talk about bad weeks, you might have missed the latest blow to them. we'll talk about whether the chain has a future, next. the amm is of a better future, a confident retirement. those dreams, there's just no way we're going to let them die. ♪ like they helped millions of others. by listening. planning. working one on one. that's what ameriprise financial does. that's what they can do with you. that's how ameriprise puts more within reach. ♪ that's how ameriprise puts more within reach. at a ford dealer with a little q and a for fiona. tell me fiona, who's having a big tire event? your ford dealer. who has 11 major brands to choose from? your ford dealer. who's offering a rebate? your ford dealer. who has the low price tire guarantee, affording peace of mind to anyone who might be in the market for a new set of tires? your ford dealer. i'm beginning to sense a pattern. get up to $140 in mail-in rebates when you buy four select tires with the ford service credit card. where'd you get that sweater vest? your ford dealer. extra curricular activities help provide a sense of identity and a path to success. joining the soccer team. getting help with math. going to prom. i want to learn to swim. it's hard to feel normal, when you can't do the normal things. to help, sleep train is collecting donations for the extra activities that, for most kids, are a normal part of growing up. not everyone can be a foster parent... but anyone can help a foster child. with all of investors' attention focused squarely on washingtonened the and the deal to end the government shutdown, some stories fell through the cracks. jcpenney's stock falling to a 30-year low on a bankruptcy rumor which the company has denied. is this company not just the stock, but the company, is it in serious trouble? are they operating on borrowed time here? >> it depends on who you ask. i think a lot of people do feel that its survival is in question here. but i think an interesting thing that we learned this week was that apple beat out jcpenney in getting burberry's ceo. that proves that jcpenney is serious about getting a new ceo and getting someone who is a turnaround expert. amazing what she did for burberry. >> punching above their weight class, aren't they? >> i don't know. they're a big company. but it's sad that this iconic retailer may go the way of a lot of other retailers. i grew up in washington. there are lots of them that go by the boards. i think the era of the great american department store, it needs to be rethought and reimagined. that's what stores like kohl's or target have done i think rather successfully. maybe jcpenney hasn't. >> but a lot of mall operators say malls wouldn't let jcpenney go bankrupt. they would rescue them because if jcpenney which is an anchor store in many of those malls, if jcpenney were to leave, all those stores would leave. >> would suffer. >> exactly. >> no one ever wants to see a company go under, especially one of this size. think about all the employees suddenly without a job. we certainly wish them the best. but at this stage when you see a company losing half their value since september 10th, it feels as if the market is voicing its opinion. >> i'm afraid jcpenney has lost sort of what it stood for or what it stands for. we know what nordstrom stands for. we know basically what bloomingdale's stands for. jcpenney, i'm not quite as sure of that. we have to leave it there. folks, thanks very much. good to be with you. that's it for us. thanks for watching. larry will be back on monday. i am today by luck. i put in the hours and built a strong reputation in the industry. i set goals and worked hard to meet them. i've made my success happen. so when it comes to my investments, i'm supposed to just hand it over to a broker and back away? that's not gonna happen. avo: when you work with a schwab financial consultant, you'll get the guidance you need with the control you want. talk to us today. 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