we will analyze what the president said with our expert panel, all of those stories in "the kudlow report", beginning right now. ♪ until tonight's 5:30 p.m. leadership meeting, president obama had been notice bled absent from these negotiations, but our own cnbc's john harwood scored an exclusive interview with the president today. he asked the president where he would negotiate. >> well, i'm prepared to negotiate on anything. i think it's important for you to talk about how we create a budget that is creating jobs, encouraging growth, dealing with our long-term debt issues. the deficits are coming down at the fastest pace since world war ii, but we still have some challenges in terms of our long-term health care spending, so whatever the leadership wants to talk about, we've gottal budget, and we think we have some good answers, but we don't expect 100%. but what i have also said is that it is not acceptable for one faction of one party in one chamber to say either we get what we want or we'll shut down the government, or even worse, we will not allow the u.s. treasury to pay its bills and put the united states in default for the first time in history. so the message i have for the leaders is have simple. as soon as we get a clean piece of legislation that reopens the government, and there is a majority for that right now in the house of representatives -- >> but no negotiation until after that? >> until we get that done, until we make sure that congress allows treasury to pay for things that congress itself already authorized, we are not going to engage in a series of negotiations. the reason, john, is very simple. if we get in a happened where a few folks, an extremi wing of one party, whether it's democrat or republican, are allowed to extort concessions, based on a threat of undermining the full faith and credit of the united states, then any president who comes after me, not just me, will find themselves unable to govern effectively, and that is not something that i'm going to allow to happen. >> in to the speaker yesterday, when he said, you know, budget negotiation, maybe involving replacement of sequester cuts with entitlement cuts. if you get to that discussion, is it conceivable, or are there any circumstances under which you could make a budget deal with republicans that does not involve new taxes? >> you know, i think it is possible for us to make sure that we are not increasing the income tax rate? that is something that was debated during the campaign. that's now behind us. i think it is very important for us to continue to cut out programs that are unnecessary, not working, some of them need to be reformed. it is important for us to deal with our long-term entitlement spending, but i also think it's important for you to make sure we're investing in the things that are going to help the economy grow. i'll give you one specific example. every business that's watching this program relies on good roads, airports that function, ports that are working, and we are vastly under-investing in what is critical for our long-term growth. we have to find a way to pay for that. >> is there any deal you could accept, even a small deal, that does not involve revenue, which is the problem on the republicans' side? >> i think we have to distinguish between income tax hikes -- >> you mean loophopes too? >> we'll have to close in loopholes in order to pay for those things that will help us grow. the important thing, john, is in the normal give-and-take between parties, that's something we should be able to solve. keep in mind in terms of reopening the government, what democrats have already said they're willing to do, is to vote for reopening the government at funding levels that the republicans have established, and that the democrats don't like. so if john boehner puts the senate bill on the floor right now, that maintains the status quo. it doesn't increase government spending beyond where it already is. it's far short of what democrats think are necessary for us to invest in things like education, research and development, and all the things that are important, but what we're saying is we'll put everything on hold, we can enter into robust negotiations, democrats won't get 100% of what they want, republicans won't either, but that's the kind of democratic process the american people expect. >> before the election last year, you said you thought there was a possibility a reelection would break the fever within the republican party. it doesn't happen. >> yeah. >> do you see this moment as a chance through this confrontation to break the fever now? >> you know, the interesting thing, john, is that the majority of republicans around the country, people who voted republican, they may disagree with me on a whole range of issues, but they also recognize that a democracy only works if everybody is following the rules, that there's going to be some give-and-take, and i think that's actually true for a whole lot of republicans on capitol hill. there are a lot of republican senators and congressmen, some of them who have publicly said, we disagree with the president on a whole host of issues, but what we shouldn't be doing is shutting down the government, hurting our economy, having 800,000 federal workers who have no idea whether they're going to be able to pay the bills at the end of the month, and certainly what we shouldn't be doing is creating a potential financial catastrophe if the united states defaults. the last time there was even a threat of default back in 2011, we know that the economy did not grow, it went backwards during that quarter. where he know that as a consequence we got downgraded, and that's not something that any of us should want to repeat. we've got to take that off the table. first of all, that 5:30 p.m. white house meeting has just wrapped up. we'll have senator mitch mcconnell come in and tell us what he got. but let's get some analysis from our great panel of experts we have chris cofinas, kelly ann conway is here, and cnbc contributor from the american enterprise institution. gene, i want to begin with you. i didn't hear anything new on how we're going to end the shutdown, which is what americans are worried about. the c.r., yeah, but how to end the shutdown, which may go on for weeks. >> no, i think he's overplayed his hand with the shutdown. i think republicans are less scared today than they were yesterday about the shutdown. there was stuff, i think they field -- he's not going to win the shutdown battle. now it's moving toward the debt ceiling. if you're hearing what i'm hearing, we may have the mother of all battles here, because we'll have the debt ceiling battle, the shutdown battle, and what did the president mention there? we'll put the sequester in there, too, and we'll get a grand bargain. i december sound as confident as he democrat a couple -- >> i know you're democrat and he's democrat, but he wasn't focused, okay? let me try that. he wasn't focused, didn't have a sense of urgency. he wasn't very intense. as jimmy said, he sort of hints as a menu of options, but not the option that's laying off people today. we just had a connecticut company lay off a bunch of people. there will be much more where that comes from. what's his message? he's going to negotiate, but he won't negotiate? what's his message? >> i don't think this is a question of negotiating. how do you negotiate with the republicans on something that is completely untenable on its face? i mean, you've never seen this before where basically one faction of one party is basically saying unless you roll back a law that has been constitutionally affirmed, we're going to shut the thing down. >> isn't that sort of like the democratic party that spent eight years, ten year, 12 years trying to roll back the bush tax cuts? >> sure. >> which were actually put into place dwight voted in by congress -- it reminds me. so what's the difference? >> there's a difference. can you imagine if the democrats were out there saying to a republican president and a president senate, that unless you have -- unless you pass background checks we're shutting the government down? it's illogical. it's bad for the country. in terms of the politics, on the politics, the republicans are in a lose/lose. >> do you agree with that? >> they put themselves in a box. >> do you agree with that? >> i think five days ago, it could lookic that way, but what's change? they're saying we're the ones keeping the parks open, funding the veterans, getting the security guards to stand down and allow these while while chairs to go through. >> there were many opportunities for -- the president seemed rudderless and that he expected the republicans to blink. i think he's blinking by not being serious. we have the transcript right here. you cannot within 1 1/2 paragraphs say i'm willing to negotiate anything. i'm not going to negotiate the debt limit, i'm not going to negotiate obama care, and he said after we get this right, we'll negotiate. here's how easy it is. we want obama care rolled back. the president -- no. next? >> it's never going to happen. >> the president has slowly begun to lose the reasonableness of that. >> correct. >> he's saying no, no, no, you cannot change the law. >> can i ask you -- >> i agree in the beginning the republican story looked pretty bad. obama keeping telling people -- that come through -- i don't -- governor chris christie made an interesting point, i think it was yesterday. christie said, if it were me, i would bring all the leaders in the room, lock the door and not heads until we got a plan. that is not what obama is doing. >> i completely disagree. i'm sorry. >> where did he say i'm going to break down the barriers? where did he say i'm going to knock heads until we have a conference that gets rid of that resolves the c.r.? >> how do you negotiate with a faction of one party? the republican senators, a good chunk, have already said let's move on. if you put this on the floor, it would win overwhelmingly. there's a small faction of the republican party that says no. what does the president say to appease john boehner? there's nothing he can do. >> 77 democrats, 77 democratss in the u.s. senate said they would vote against the medical define tax. >> this is part of obama care. 77 voted for that, of which half were democrats. all you do is give up one concession, and that allows boehner to come in and say here's what we've got -- >> we are back at this in three months. >> your point, blaming everything on the tea party crowd, is completely wrong. there are concessions on both sides of the aisle. there's just nobody putting any pressure on them. i've got to get out of here iismts next you're going to say this happened every three months. the president debit do anything to put us on solid footing. >> i got to get out. you are going to lick your wounds on the things about the medical device tax. i want to tell you. if that came out and went into one of the c.r. deals, it works. by the way, it's a tax cut and a health care thing. all right. as we told you at the top of the show, the president has just wrapped up a meeting at the white house, but it doesn't look like there was any negotiating. please stay with us. i'm kudlow, and we'll be right back. . you really love, what would you do?" ♪ [ woman ] i'd be a writer. 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[ woman ] i'd be an architect. what if i told you someone could pay you and what if that person were you? ♪ when you think about it, isn't that what retirement should be, paying ourselves to do what we love? ♪ we've got a we've got a divided government. democrats control the white house and the senate. republicans control the house. we sent four different proposals over to our democratic colleagues in the senate. they rejected all of them. we've asked them to conference, to sit down and try to resolve our differences. they will not negotiate. >> they were concerned about the long-term fiscal affairs of this country, and we want we are too. let's talk about it. my friend john boehner, i repeat, cannot take yes for an answer. all right. that of course was speak john boehner and senate majority leader harry reid, both speaking after the meeting this evening at the white house. joining us is john harwood, our panel is still with me. chris kofina, kelly ann, and gene. that was a great interview, actually you had a lot of restrained on your side of the aisle, which is fascinating. i enjoy that very much. >> let me go to your interview, which we've been discussing. did you learn anything regarding the possibility of a fiscal grand design, or other solutions to the c.r.? or other compromise on health care? was there anything new that jumped out at all? >> reporter: a couple things, la irry. first of all, he drew that hard line between when he would negotiate and when he wouldn't. when he would is after they reopened the government and raised the debt ceiling. it's a tough line for republicans to cross, but the president said he's determined to break the fever of crisis governance, and also determined to resist what house republicans are doing or attempting to do on his health care plan, which they're not going to succeed at. that's one thing. when you get to the potential budget negotiations, which are where i think the zone of agreement ultimately lies, where they will make a deal, i thought it was interesting that he took off the table the idea of raising tax rates. yes, he has said that before, but to say it out loud at this moment means something. when i pressed him on could you accept a deal with republicans without new revenue? not just tax rates, but loopholes net new revenue, he said i think we need loop holes to be closed, but he did not draw a red line on that, so i think there's an area they can talk if this speaker with get over this problem he has to put the bill on the floor to reopen the government as well as raise the debt limit. >> john, there's been a lot of rumors over the last hour or so there might be maybe a mini-grand bargain, tossing the sequester in the mix. have been heard anything about that? >> reporter: i have over a period of time, but been consistently disappointed that the things i heard about don't materialize. i heard -- >> i mean more recently, like within the last hour or so? >> reporter: no, i haven't heard anything within the last hour, but what i heard from a house leadership aide yesterday is that the area where this could be resolved would be a deal that would involve alleviating some of the sequester cuts, which some -- and substituting entitlement cuts, which everybody agrees needs to be done, but is difficult to do politically for both parties. that's where the tax issue comes in, because democrats have been saying, you know, we can't make a big bucket deal with these guys unless we have some revenue. in the white house is willing to accept something less than that, i think republicans would find that a position they could work with. >> john, great interview with the president. and mentioning the pope -- i think the president's per -- it would be great for the president to find in the negotiations. i heard a president who sounds like jack kemp, but governs like barack obama, taking tax increases off the table. he's talking about -- i think it's signaling to the left. he talked about the extremist wing of either party, and i felt like he was really modulating his tone to the left. do you feel that way sitting across from him? >> reporter: not dramatically. i put that one question to him about sometimes the capacity operation you reflect in public and the edge to your tone gives the impression that you think republicans are either craven or stupid or crazy. he sort of flinched at that, and then he said, look, there are a lot of reasonaeepublicans out the ith. so ipartof what was motivati him was reach out to those people. but he is very focused on this emta ing about. i do think it is important to pout out what this group of people is trying to do is extraordinary, it is not par for the cord to use the process with this way in this intensity not to effect an ongoing negotiation, but to in effect nullify something that happened a couple years ago. i want to ask you licky split, how long do you believe this shutdown will go? >> i think october 17th, the date that jack lew said we will hit the debt ceiling. that looks like the target landing zone. >> i think you're dead right. i think paul ryan is saying the same thing and all of sudden they'll merge. thank you. john, hang on. a breaking news situation here. we're about to talk to one of the congressional leaders who just finished meeting with president obama, that being senator mitch mcconnell. he will join us live, next up on the "the kudlow report." in a world that's changing faster than ever, we believe outshining the competition tomorrow requires challenging your business inside and out today. at cognizant, we help forward-looking companies run better and run different - to give your customers every reason to keep looking for you. so if you're ready to see opportunities and see them through, we say: let's get to work. because the future belongs to those who challenge the present. at a ford dealer with a little q and a for fiona. tell me fiona, who's having a big tire event? 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[ powers down ] uh-oh, flobot is broken. welcome back live, this is "the kudlow report." all right. here's what's happening right now. congressional leaders just left the white house to discuss the current government shutdown and the upcoming debt ceiling budget fight. fresh from inside that oval office meeting, we welcome back mitch mcconnell. as always, sir, thanks for coming back to "the kudlow report." you were in this key meeting, what did you take away from this meeting? do you think the president wants to play an important negotiating role in ending the shutdown? >> i would say this about the meeting. it was cordial, but unprotective. the president maintaining privately the position he's had privately, which is he doesn't want to -- or over raising the debt ceiling. they's focus on the debt ceiling for a minute. going back to the 1950s, any president's request haz brought along with it. and as you pointed out to your viewer, with you now position for senate and house republica republicans. >> i don't see how this gets fixed up, sir, because senator harry reid will on negotiate with conferrees, and on the other hand, speaker boehner will not september a c.r. i don't know how they get together or where the shutdown ends, sir. we obviously want to continue the operation of the government, but we want to keep it within the constraints of the budget control act passed twoiers, which have reduced government -- this is a story largely untold that the bipartisan agreement called the budget control act, of which the sequester is a part for two years in a row. we don't want to walk away from the -- in addition to that, 99% of the bush tax cuts are now permane permanent. we don't want to walk away from the permanent -- look, none of those would be good for the country, to tax more or spent more would not be good for the economy. so what happens here, in the meeting with president obama he doesn't sound like he wants to negotiate on the continuing resolution or on the death bit. a lot of people believe, senator, that the two issues will emerge, when the ceiling expires, so did the president give any sense of how he would handle that? was there any sense that he might in some extra or unconstitutional way raise the debt ceiling on his own? >> no, i don't think he's going to take that position. he surely must note that the american people expect us to negotiate. we divided government. when you have divided government, you obviously have to talk to each other. i think the position at the moment that there's nothing to talk about is unacceptable. another train wreck head america yesterday called obama care. we have said we should be talking about some relief for the american people from the worst law that's been passed in the last 50 years. so we have said that was an important issue that needs to be addressed as well. so far he's very resistant unless he does it himself. reluctant to allow us to get all the american people, at least a one-year delay from the implementation of this new law, which of course is crating havoc. so i don't really understand where the compromises are going to come from. because the president is saying in effect he wants a clean continuing resolution. unless those two other conditions are met. i don't see the compromise. that's where i don't see where the end game is. can you help me on that? >> there will have to be a compromise. his party doesn't control the entire government. they don't expect you to not talk to each other. what we are saying is let's talk about this. in fact 9 house has sent a number of proposals, including one to go to conference and discuss this. who is being unreasonable. you have to talk to each other. it's talk to talk, to eliminate the government shutdown, find out what conditions need to be attach, but we also do something about this enormous debt that's accumulated. >> senator, i'm running out of time. from this meeting today with the position, this 5:30 meeting, did you sen any change at all in any part of his posture? not yet, but he can't get his way the way he wants it, because he doesn't control the entire government. the american people expect us to come together to figure out how to solve this problem. sooner or later we're going to do that. >> many, many thanks, mitch mcconnell, we appreciate your time and all of your great information. up next we'll go back to washington and talk live with two congressmen. i'm going to ask them to settle this deal right here and now to make a new deal. let me go -- i'm going to depart from the script for a second. give me a quick take, one quick take on what you heard from senator mcconnell in the obama meeting? the president wants everybody to like him, regardless of what happens here, and i think the president is losing his mojo. the republicans now are able to say you're voting against the nih, against kids with cancer, world war ii memorial veterans? >> jimmy? >> mr. mcconned sounded like a guy who sxekds a compromise, and i think he's right. absolutely. regardless of the president's position. i think the president's position is untenable. >> do you agree? >> no, i think senator mcconnell and the republicans are lives in la-la land. the la-la land is even if there's a technical default, it won't be on the president's report. he cannot afford that, either. >> if you look at every poll, every poll, i will be stunned if this changes, the american people clearly put the blame on the republicans. >> that's because -- >> that the smear his legacy. >> the caucus was split and voted for a clean c.r. >> i think events are overtaking that theory. >> and i think events are overtaking those polls, by the way. >> he's not going to allow it to shut down -- >> listen, john boehner is elling it his caucus that him, paul ryan, dave kemp, are cooking up a grand deal. that is cooking right now, and that's how you avoid it. that's the end game. >> the last word. i agree with you, by the way, i think the grand design is the end game, if they can get there. we'll be right back. but first off, check out this video from today, a spot that's become the emotional epicenter of the whole shutdown -- this memorial was paid for and kept up mostly by private donations, but the obama administration still put sup barricades to block veterans from missing. so are fa the vets have been winning, but isn't this a sight to behold? we'll be right back. what you wear to bed is your business. so, if you're sleeping in your contact lenses, ask about the air optix® contacts so breathable they're approved for up to 30 nights of continuous wear. serious eye problems may occur. ask your doctor and visit airoptix.com for safety information and a free one-month trial. president obama and president obama and the congressional leaders just failed to make a deal to end this shutdown. let's try two other members of congress. joinings you are house members peter welch and financial services committee chair jeb hensley, republican from texas. gentlemen, let's try this. i want to make a deal. right here and now. i want to maybe a deal to solve the shutdown and continuing resolution. >> i think with a little time we could be the ones to do it. here's what house republicans are fighting for. my mother-in-law has said the least you can do is show up, so at least we want the president, senate democrats to show up. and they continue to say we refuse to negotiate. listen, we don't line obama care. we understand the president does. the roll-out has been anything less than stellar. i get that, but can't we at least -- and so the last offer we put on the table, larry, was simply this. you know what? if your boss gets a one-year break, you ought to get a one-year break, and members of congress should not be treated better than working americans who pay their salaries. it's that simple. what this is about we're in the slowest, myotepid, weakest recovery in the modern eras. and so what we want to do is sit down with democrats and say where can we find common ground to improve the economy? and by the way, the nation is going bankrupt. everybody says do it tomorrow, we want to work on it today. >> peter welch, what is on the table here, i'm just going to try to summarize this is the vitter amendment that says congress and their staffs, and the executive branch, for that matter, should not be except from obama care. that's one thing on the table. peter welch what would you put on the table? >> that's the reason wee shutting the whole government down? that's the point. trying to make a political talking point. this is a question, first and foremost, about the constitutional process. are we going to vote on the budget? in the budget that we are proposing to vote on, was the one designed by the republicans. it's their number, 98 , passed by the senate. we're just asking it be put on the floor. we would turn the lights on. some of these issues that have to be resolved, we can't negotiate that in the regular order. the irony is when john boehner became speaker, he made a commitment to return to regular order. a love of us said, that's great, but it's broken down. the breakdown now means that sides that want to get their point used as leverage shutting government down or stiffing creditors on our bills. >> so you're saying you would keep the spending caps. jeb, we have spending caps on the table. i think mr. welch makes a good point. we also have the vitter amendment on the table where the congress and the executive branch should not be exempt. give me one more, mr. hensley, that would solve this problem, because we make a deal tonight to fix it. >> well, i wish we could, larry, but, you know, peter was talking about the constitutional process, and i think that's very important. listen, the constitution gives congress the power of the purse. i know the president has read the constitution and believes it says the power of the rubber stamp. listen, i understand the democrats have the white house. i understand they have the senate, about you republicans have the house, and we are not going to rubber stamp what the president wants to do. all we've heard again is my way or the highway. there are lots of things we would be willing and want to have on the table. listen, i'm a veteran of simpson bowles, where the president has paid lip service to doing something, but hasn't done something. again, i don't understand, if obama care is good enough for the american people, why isn't it good enough for washington elite? >> peter welch, would you answer that? >> members of congress, it's a basic question of fairness t chairman hensley asks a pointed question. peter, what's your responsible to that? i want we are subject to the same rules as everything else. those of us in congress are required by law to be in the exchanges. we are not on the same health cause as before. and there's an employer-based cry bugs that federal employees get. you can argue about obama care even senator grassley said his goal was to have -- not to deny employer-based contributions -- >> before that was changed by the stroke of a pen coming out of the white house, peter. >> that's right. >> and you're still eligible. for huge subsidies. that i think is troublesome. it's not huge subsidies. it's employer-sponsored subsidies. this is not about the members of congress, but about health care for all americans. >> all right. >> hold it. it's also about how do you change or pass a law? you have to get the votes. in the house, you've got to get them in the senate. keep in mind we had a presidential election, where there was contested, a billion dollars on each side, validated by the american people. >> the debate goes on. many thanks. peter welch and chairman jeb hence ling. we'll be back with much more from our panel. i think they have a few ideas themselves. i'm kudlow. please stay with us. americans take care of business. they always have. they always will. that's why you take charge of your future. your retirement. ♪ ameriprise advisors can help you like they've helped millions of others. listening, planning, working one on one. to help you retire your way... with confidence. that's what ameriprise financial does. that's what they can do with you. ameriprise financial. more within reach. ♪ [ male announcer ] the parking lot helps by letting us know who's coming. the carts keep everyone on the right track. the power tools introduce themselves. all the bits and bulbs keep themselves stocked. and the doors even handle the checkout so we can work on that thing that's stuck in the thing. [ female announcer ] today, cisco is connecting the internet of everything. so everyone goes home happy. did nana ever give you cheerios when you were a little kid? yeah, she did. were cheerios the same back then? cheerios has pretty much been the same forever. so...when we have cheerios, it's kind of like we are having breakfast with nana... yeah... ♪ yeah. you're so smart. yeah. have hail damage to both their cars. ted ted is trying to get a hold of his insurance agent. maxwell is not. he's on geico.com setting up an appointment with an adjuster. ted is now on hold with his insurance company. maxwell is not and just confirmed a 5:30 time for tuesday. ted, is still waiting. yes! maxwell is out and about... with ted's now ex-girlfriend. wheeeee! whoo! later ted! online claims appointments. just a click away on geico.com. welcome back to court court. our ace political panel is with me. kelly ann, you know, john harwood had an excellent interview and from what mitch mcconnell said about the meeting, you get the feeling that nothing has changed, that the president is not rolling up his sleeves, but the same rhetoric, nothing has changed. >> i believe the president and the left thinks it will hurt republicans. if nothing changes, you could go back to the war on women, tea party holding the country hostage. i'm not surthat is saleable when you're the president. here's what i see -- disengaged, but he looks a little indifferent, if not impertinent, i think he runs the risk of being seen as another politician. that's the worst thing that could happen. >> chris, i know you're going to disagree, but in all seriousness, certainly obama is not a guy that says, hey, here's how we're going to do this. he never does that. i want to contrast that. ronald reagan was a guy who was engaged. you may not have liked it. bill clinton was a guy who was engaged, in some sense clinton was the quint essentially guys, but they made deals, accepted compromises and were deeply involved. i do not believe obama fits that bill. >> how do you dance with someone who doesn't want to dance? it's that simple. how does president obama negotiate with speak boehner, when speaker boehner can't even negotiate within his own caucus? >> can i just correct you? tip o'neil, a left-win democrat had exactly the same problems, but hi managed to get stuff down with reagan, and nude gingrich and bill clinton were on op set sides of almost are. they managed to get stuff done. >> do you believe -- >> i think i've figured it out. the problem is tip o'neil knew had el was a politics. barack obama believe he's a transendant historical figure. why does he have to get down in the mud with the -- >> i live the psychoanalysis, it's very profound you're asking the president to negotiate -- >> hold that thought. >> he said he didn't want to negotiate. hold that thought. it's a brilliant thought. i don't want you to forget any of it. the panel will stay with us. we have a little more work to do. first up, what does our buddy jay leno think of all this take a look. >> how many are worried about the government shutdown? how many more are worried about it starting back up? yeah, that's the problem. let's see. let's fay it. we do have a lot of nonessential employees, like the treasury secretary. why is he there? we don't have any money in the treasury. it's not like he's counting. the room is empty. all right. let's get right back to our panel, one final time. let me get this right, because i know you had a brilliant thought. you're telling me that ronald reagan could get along political and professionally and make deals with tip o'neil while bill clinton could do likewise with newt gingrich. you're telling me that barack obama can't with john boehner? one of the most polite, humble down to earth speaker? >> you know the difference? sfimplts they actually had power and influence over their caucus. they did. the difference is speaker boehner clearly does not. if speaker boehner was sitting here talking with us, and in private. he would say let's put it on the floor, get it to december and we have three months to fight out ought these differences. >> tip o'neil had a revolt of all the southern democrats. the reason we got our legislation there shall there were 60, 70, 80 democratic boll weevils really democrats in sgin. i want -- i just don't understand these comparisons. >> what is the deal that john bomber is spokesed to be telling to his troops? i will not negotiate? i will not is that the dealing? >> i know it's hard to unthat, it's the law. >> that they've been asking to delay. >> it's a presidential election. >> one at a time. >> this las is a propertyian creature. it's not a finished product. no, and especially if congress holds the purse strings, and many americans didn't realize there was a third bite at the apple, but look, forget about what happened aier. what happened yesterday is what we should fog can cuss on. people tried to get health care. we know the stories. it's become a joke, because so many -- >> because so many people went to the exchanges. >> mostly out of curiosity. >> after day one, it's a failure. >> they're looking for waivers. the reason that none of your analogies hold up is because you can't compare the manies we're talking about. this guy is a selfish politician who will destroy the party in 2014. he acts like he has nothing to lose. >> republicans i think think that the president can somehow wave a wand and make republicans forget their own provisions. then the president can be blamed. >> you're very hung up on this divisions thing. >> it's true, larry. >> democrats have their divisions, republicans have their divisions. the country speaks, the country votes and the country speaks. right now, jimmy, the tea party has reascended. i think that's very interesting. i think that would be the wild cart in american politics today. i do in the think barack obama appreciates that. i've got to go. a great panel. chris, thank you, jim, and kelly ann, you're all great. that's it for this evening's show. thank you for much whatting. i am larry kudlow. we will be back with more action tomorrow night. please come visit us then. a, who's having a big tire event? 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