this pleads -- pleads with the police not to shoot him. we are going to play some of it for you right now. >> don't shoot him. he has no weapon. he has no weapon. don't shoot him. >> on the ground! >> don't shoot him. he didn't do anything. >> drop the gun! drop the gun! >> he does not have a gun. he has a tbi. he is not going to do anything to you guys. he just took his medicine. >> drop the gun. >> keith, keith, don't you do it. don't you do it. keith, don't you do it? [gunshots] >> did you shoot him? did you shoot him? he'd better not be [bleep] dead! he'd better not be [bleep] dead! we are here at 9453 lexington court. these are the police officers that shot my husband, and he had better live. he had better live, because he did not do nothing to them. don: frightening. you watch that, you cannot react other than your stomach, gutwrenching. unfortunately, margaret, we have seen too many of these, whether it is weekly or monthly. how does this latest infuse the national dialogue, particularly as we head into monday night's debate? margaret: this is already having a major impact. let's set the presidential obligations aside for a second. it's impossible not to be moved by the sounds and the images you see in that video. if you go back to ferguson and go more recently to dallas. you see this continuum. every time there is a national dialogue, a debate about it, a call for reconciliation and healing and understanding, and we're redirected toward another incident like this. it even has the potential to unite or the potential to divide. -- either has the potential to unite or the potential to divide. it has the potential to turn people outer people off. -- turn people out or turn people off. i think that will take shape in the next few days. don: when you are a parent you tend to lens everything through that. i was watching an interview with bryant gumbel interviewed by charlie rose. he says it is not fair that my son has a higher chance of being stopped or being killed every time he leaves the house. that is the reality. every black man lives with it. on the flipside, they are the police officers -- and my grandfather is a police officer. in the heat of the moment, the tulsa situation, very different situation. this poor guy has his hands up. here, unfortunately, you see what is going on. what you do take away, listening to his wife, you get she says the man was ill. she talked about traumatic brain injury. at first seem that concerned and then it becomes more heightened. there is more to come. we are going to need to see the police video. our camera was not on the actual shooting police officer, who was african-american. it was on a different police officer -- we have not seen that yet. there is still more to come. just a situation that does not have a simple answer. margaret: we look toward monday. we have a debate. how do you think this place on that level? don: you hate to politicize this. -- i hate to say it dramatically helps hillary clinton, but it plays into who she is as a candidate. you see everything that is -- has happened. every time there is a terrorist attack, donald trump, the first, the horrible attack on orlando. donald trump was, i was right. congratulates himself, i was right. even the other day, his comments about stop and frisk. talk about throwing kerosene on a situation. forget that it does not even work. but to not have the understanding, to not have the gene in your brain, the empathy gene, to know that is not the moment to throw that in there. to me, he is an igniter and hillary clinton is much more a unifier. margaret: it has the potential to galvanize this debate. hillary clinton's concern has always been and states of north -- in states like north carolina and florida. can you turn out the african-american vote? because people feel that it matters who is elected. that's one thing, it makes people feel disaffected. if these problems happen under barack obama, what will happen under any other president? it could be counterintuitive. don: the big issue has been, who turning outtorate in the polling? and where is that african-american vote? they are not emotionally enthusiastic and turning out for clinton. we know that. this could be -- the thing that galvanizes that entire electorate. obligates. if i were somebody on the fence about voting, this gets me out to vote. this is personal. this is emotional. this is real. both in the debate form but more importantly in the get out the vote thing, the -- besides this election, to me, this could be a galvanizing moment for the entire democratic party. you hate to use the word galvanize in something like this, but it could. margaret: does it matter what the video shows? don: when you put this with ferguson and put this with tulsa last week, this is a problem that african-americans live with every day. us white folk, we can empathize but we cannot feel it. and i think it is such a core, primal, self survival issue that i do think this will drive people out. coming up, we'll talk about this and more, but first a word from our good sponsors. ♪ president obama: i have said this repeatedly. the police have a really tough job. they repeatedly interact with people who are not looking forward to interacting with police. on the other hand, if you have repeated instances in which the perception is at least that this might not have been handled the same way were not for the element of race, even if it is unconscious, i think it is important for all of us to say we want to get this right. it should be a concern for all americans. margaret: that was president obama in an interview this morning. with us now is the former president and ceo of the naacp. he joins us from baltimore. thank you for being with us. >> glad to be here. margaret: it is impossible not to begin our conversation with the video that is out today and making news. i want to talk to you -- i want to talk to you about the presidential race, but first i want to talk to you about the reaction to the video and how you think this will impact the days ahead. >> you see a very courageous woman trying to save her husband's life even as she is trying to video it, fearing the worst may happen. it's in the tradition of may me tell and so many other women who till and so many other women who have courageously shown what they have done to my husband, my son, my brother. we have to be clear that we are living through a moment of disruption. a moment when video is showing the world what the black community has known for centuries. men and women with badges can get away with killing us and have. small numbers of police officers a small percentage of the , overall force have gotten away with killing huge numbers of black men for a very long time. unarmed, innocent black men. sometimes they are armed and innocent. this is a country where we believe in the right to bear arms. having a gun does not mean the police get to kill you. ultimately, i think there is reason to hope that we will come to a better place as a nation, but it will be a very painful road getting there. for us in the black community, there is reason to hope that perhaps this road we've been on for centuries, this piece of the road may be coming to an end sooner than it might have without this technology, but that will still be in now,eptably long time from if history is a guide. margaret: there are two stops on the presidential debate monday, the election o in november. candidates will be reluctant to do anything that looks like directly politicizing the tragedy, but will nonetheless be addressing the issue with the political debates. what is your question to each of the candidates, and what you -- do you think, beyond the debates, that you want them to talk about? >> i would ask them for their most courageous and bold land. -- bold stand. donald trump has been selling fear across the country and passing off fear as current, and coleridge --s courage, and it is dangerous. i think many people are voting for him simply because they fear what his finger on the nuclear weapon would do. but cops have their boot on the necks of black and brown men across the country. he is shilling rudy giuliani's old snake oil. it has proven to be a failure and to inflame tensions and undermine the police. not only was racial profiling wildly ineffective in new york city, 99.9% people did not actually have infractions. during that period, the rate cases,s solved, homicide went down. racial profiling, if you will, is a weapons of mass destruction and a weapon of mass distraction for the officers. it actually keeps them from doing their job and important tasks like getting killers and rapists off the street and set -- because instead they are stopping to frisk innocent people. don: stop and frisk this not work. my stomach turned when i watched that. i am a progressive guy. let me play the role of a trump supporter. here is a guy that had been in jail for shooting someone, here is a guy that possibly is reaching for a weapon. this cop, who is african-american is trying to do his job. this is not about race, it is about the heat of the moment. obviously, the tulsa situation is completely different. i am lensing it through those eyes if i am a red state guy. respond to that. >> years ago, jesse jackson said it is a sad day when you look over your shoulder when you are walking down a dark street, and you look over your shoulder and you are glad it is not a black guy. what he was referring to is that in this country, even we as lack people, if you live among small thinking, your mind gets small. if you live among racism, your mind gets warped. don: my point is that i am trying to take color out of it from a guy who is not lensing it from an african-american perspective. >> i get it, but black officers can get their sense of danger racially coded in the same way as white officers. ultimately, what you think of people does not have to do with your skin color as much as it has to do with your mind. don: could i look at the video and go, race had nothing to do with it? this was a situation -- we continually watch -- i'm not an idiot, i am giving the counter argument. >> i don't think that you are an idiot, i'm sorry if it is coming across that way. what am saying is that just because it is a black officer and a black victim does not the -- mean race has nothing to do with it. don: even if it was a white officer, sometimes, unfortunately, in the heat of the moment, it has nothing to do with race, it has to do with -- roll the would say is tape on similar cases where a white man has been killed, find those cases. don: fair point. >> because we do not see them. that is just it. every time that we hear a five year old or six year old in school has been handcuffed for no apparent reason, it is always a black kid. any time hear about an unarmed american man has been shot by police, doing nothing you should be shot for, johnny crawford buying a bb gun. don: we have got to go, but we appreciate your time, my friend. margaret coming up, we will talk : about the presidential debate on monday and issues the candidates will likely discuss. we will be right back. ♪ don: donald trump today picked up the endorsement of his one-time rival, the man who was booed during the convention, and trump of valid to start a super pack to vanquish. that was, of course, ted cruz. on his facebook page today, ted cruz said -- he does not mention the name. a new poll out suggests donald trump still has a lot of work to do. hillary clinton is up six points among likely voters. it also says more than half of the country fears a trump presidency and only about a third of americans believe donald trump is somewhat qualified to be in the white house. trump and clinton could not be more polar opposites in the way they are prepared for the debates. hillary clinton is studying the issues and drafting a psychological profile of trump to find ways to get under his skin. donald trump prefers the campaign trail to debate class. the new york times put it today that he is essentially approaching the debates as a big man on campus who thinks is last-minute paper will be dazzling simply because he wrote it. now we know how he approached college. let's start with trump. let's do some wargames. what do they each have to do? start with trump. margaret: donald trump is still behind in most places, so he has to do two things. he has to assure people were put to rest the expectations that he is a wildcard or two unforgettable -- too unpredictable. he has to knock her off her game. will he do it aggressively or not? that could backfire on him. that is a balancing act. for her, she has to attempt to poke holes or refute everything he says that is an exaggeration, a lie, not true, provably not true, not answered, while not sounding all of the ways that have hurt her in the past. shrill, humorless. unapproachable, that sort of stuff. don: i think he has the easier path. you have an untrustworthy, unlikable candidate versus a dangerous, unbalanced, racist candidate. she cannot all of a sudden become likable. if you are waiting for him to spin his head around and spit out pea soup, he gets presidential points for just doing what anybody else would do. without sayingy anything hateful, people could be going, yeah, maybe he can win. she has a much higher bar. we are seeing a man and woman face to face, and we've not seen this before. howls at them in. now he is a 6'3" man -- howls at the moon. now he is a 6'3" man facing a woman. can jab him, get him to attack and be belligerent toward her, that will play for the suburban moms. margaret: there are always pressures on moderators, but lester holt will be under particular scrutiny. how he handles questions and answers that are loose with facts. what does he have to do? debate, dos always a you fact check or not fact check? matt lauer was an impossible situation. he was not a moderator. i actually think it is beholden to both candidates to be the moderators themselves. if you are hillary clinton, you cannot be waiting and depending on, you get another candy crowley situation where the moderator cannot be badgering two and three times. it will be up to them to say liar, liar, pants on fire. i saw an interesting thing this morning on morning joe. hillary at some point will say i am lying, he will say i am not, and she needs to say, ok, everyone at home, google it right now. it's going to be up to her, not lester holt. margaret: who is the pressure on? more on her or lester holt? dawn: -- don: she does not lie, we have seen instances where she is not forthcoming like the e-mail, but on a day-to-day basis, it is not part of her strategy. he actually will say it, leave it out there. i did not support invading iraq. she needs to be saying in a silly, donald,is that is a lie, be a mama bear. i think the wildcard for him is that he will throw an molotov cocktail. like, i know your husband was unfaithful, but one of his really good friends is a convicted pedophile. are you an enabler of that? the whole jeffrey epstein thing. he has been on his plane 80 times. i'm not saying that is the case, but throw an incredibly unfair, crazy non sequitur at her. margaret: don't you want to know how she is prepping for that? i do. , if you other thing is starts off the debate and says look, i just want to apologize -- margaret: that could be the wildcard. don: whoa. obviously it's transparent, but if you are hillary clinton, what do you do? nicole brought this up this morning. i think you should apologize -- he should have apologized months ago, but to do it opening the debate, it would be brilliant. margaret: she is not known for her impromptu gamesmanship, do you think there could be a reverse wildcard moment? where she sprang something on him? don: if either of them have a bomb, it will happen on that night or 6-7 days before the election. she has the facts, no, we cannot build the wall, that is a silly thing and will explain it in a cogent way. that will seem presidential. she wins if she rattles him at all. if he attacks her, he loses. margaret: there you have it. time: there you have it. -- don: there you have it. and i certainly know what i am talking about. margaret: coming up, a longtime debate prep or joins us. we will be right back. ♪ hey how's it going, hotcakes? 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[laughter] >> i was tied up at the time, but the fact is -- donny: that was a good one. thanks for being with us. i read something that you wrote where you said you cannot win an intellectual debate but he sure can lose one. explain that for us. >> the debates are part of the overall campaign narrative. i don't think winning a debate will equal winning the election, but certainly performing poorly in a debate can cost you the election. there are some examples in the past to show that. gerald ford comes to mind, proclaiming that there was no soviet domination of eastern europe. there have been some others. so you have to make sure you perform well and win, because you can change the overall narrative of the campaign and give yourself momentum, which can help you get to election day. these debates, i think, will be the most monumental and the most impactful on the campaign narrative because they will be the most watched and because there are so many unanswered questions about the se candidates that the audience is going to bring to viewing the debates. donny: anywhere between 3%-10% of voters, the rest are locked in. you could not have two more polarized candidates. in one thought, each candidate, if you were to woo those undecided, what do they need to say to them? >> donald trump needs to show that he can pass the commander in chief test. i think donald trump needs to come in with the kind of temperament that he had in the exchange over new york values with ted cruz. if that donald trump shows up and shows he can pass that commander in chief test and is competent on issues, i think he will have a good night and hillary will have a long night. hillary clinton needs to show she has a vision for how she will move the country forward. her campaign just cannot be not donald trump. it has to be for something. she has to up her game on the presentation side. hillary clinton has been erratic in debates, in my opinion. some good, some bad. i liken her to al gore in 2000, when al gore came in, skyhigh expectations, sitting vice president, had been a senator. she comes in as former secretary of state, former state senator, ran for president already, former senator from new york. so, she has got skyhigh expectations. she has to find her voice to make sure that she delivers a consistent performance across all three debates or it will hurt her. >> if you are writing in the woodstock line for hillary clinton, what has she got to work with? what is her wheelhouse? what is available to her? >> with donald trump, she is has been going after his temperament. she has got to prove the claim. she has been making the claim that he does not have the temperament to be president and he does not talk to women the way he should. she has got to bait him into showing that temperament that is not capable of being presidential. for donald trump, he has got to stay on offense without being offensive. he has got to make sure that he can go after her on substantive issues without crossing the line and making it intensely personal, because in debating a woman, he will be held to a higher standard. she will be held to a higher standard as well. she cannot cross the line, either. overly aggressive women, unfortunately according to gender communication studies are , judged poorly. but he has also got to walk the line as well. it will be interesting to see how they handle each other. trump, which hillary clinton shows up to these debates. margaret: you're right. psychology is interesting, how americans perceive women. does humor work with women? do people want to see jokes or funny stuff? i don't know if you have had a chance to see hillary clinton do "between two ferms," what place -- plays and doesn't play? >> i think for hillary, she has to improve her likability numbers. that has been a problem. even back in 2007-2008, barack obama infamously called her likable enough. that was off of a question about what was a perceived personality problem. that is the problem she has to cure. she has got to connect with voters in the heart. she is very good with connecting with their heads. she knows policy. but she has got to connect with their heart. donald trump at times has been good at connecting with the heart. he is got to make sure he can connect with the head. he's got to make sure he knows policy well enough that he can carry forward a 90 minute debate. i liken him to a band that has got a great song, a one-hit wonder but you go to the concert , wondering if the rest of the music is any good. he has got to show up to make sure he can say i am substantive , enough on the issues, that surrounded by the right people, i can handle the job. donny: he actually thinks he will stay with his own game, at least according to reports, there is been not a lot of prep. to his credit, he says he is showing up that way. hillary clinton is very good on brand and has her nose in the books. thank you so much for being here. when we come back, we'll break down the tv ad wars. if you are in washington, d.c., you can now listen to us on the radio. we will be right back after these words from our sponsors. ♪ ♪ last night, hillary clinton released a powerful new advertisement that will be running in seven key battleground states and on national cable. take a look. ♪ >> i would look her right in that fat ugly face of hers. she is a slob. she ate like a cake. a person who is flat-chested is very hard to be a 10. does she have a good body? no. >> do you treat women with respect? margaret: lucky us, we have our ad man. what you think about that? donny: first of all, as a father of three daughters i want a , punch in the face after that. i think the clinton campaign has ads.antastic they have to set him up as hateful and dangerous. they get a moral imperative to vote against him. if you are a woman, and mother, and to see the advertisement, you go, wow. those are his words. those are his words. there is something so visceral about that. if you are a man, it hits you in a different spot. they have done an ad with children watching tv, i think it is incredibly effective. it is no coincidence that they broke that advertisement three days before the debate. they believe that donald trump going at clinton, man attacking woman could be a silver bullet. do you think there is a subtle reference to request a help hillary clinton once upon a time was a different kind of candidate? donny: i was hoping to get that moment. the trick once again, when that ad hits, you have to disqualify him. there is an ad term called permission to believe. people would love to believe donald trump. everybody wants something new, this is not working, that is an easy one. you just have to make the yearning for change. i can't look at myself in the mirror. i cannot look at my kids. it is very effective. margaret: it affects white voters, don't you think? she has got a real weakness with many subgroups of white voters, some of than men, some of them lesser educated white voters. the you feel that it appeals on that level? donny: absolutely. every election, it comes down to suburban moms. they vote risk-averse. they see this advertisement. everything is aimed at hitting primal nerves at parents, saying, the world can end. your daughter could get -- what kind of behavior is going to happen in school yards as a result of that? that is the thing that concerns me the most about a donald trump presidency. we are setting up proper behavior for our country. if he gets elected, you're saying two young boys that it is ok to be a bully. you are saying is ok to point at a muslim and say they are problem. you are endorsing that behavior. that culturally, beyond politically, that morally to me is the most offensive. margaret: now let's take a look at donald trump's latest ad. >> it is a movement, not a campaign. its leader, donald trump, is builder, businessmen, success. donald trump's priority -- you. dreaming big. building bigger. united for families, jobs. defined by freedom. standing together, pushing ahead, leaving the past behind. changing our future. together, we will make america great again. so, that was like a really different ad. donny: trump has surprisingly gone positive. that is a reagan mourning in ng inca add -- morni america ad. you have every buzzword in there. that was very smart using that bill and hillary imagery. it brings you back to the 1990's. margaret: to monica. donny: to the 60 minutes interview. even if you like the clintons, you go, i don't want to go back there. what i find fascinating is the spin. basically hillary clinton has been outspending him 25-1. donald trump have money but he is not spending it. i think what they are waiting for, they're going to start with the debate, and then for 10-20 days as we get towards the election blitz based on one , thing. this is like a weave and bob. i think you will see the real trump campaign, what ever that verybe, very targeted, high rating point kind of thing, saturating the market, because he has the money. margaret: hillary clinton does not have the guttural impact. donny: roger ailes is crafty, and that is not their handiwork. margaret: you think that is in the back pocket? donny: you don't see what is coming. you can't get that in-depth analysis any playhouse -- place else. margaret: coming up. we will talk about ted cruz and more with our amazing reporter. ♪ ♪ our bloomberg politics donald trump reporter bought a new suit today, so we had to show it off. >> it is now a couple of days old. donny: very dapper. >> i appreciate that. donny: it was on the prompter. donald trump announced today, potential supreme court justice nominees. one of them being mike lee. if i am on the ted cruz part of this, and as a democrat, what do i think of this? >> these are conservative picks. senator mike lee, who is best political friend with ted cruz, who just endorsed donald trump earlier this afternoon. i think you cannot separate those two points. donald trump saying to the conservative base saying to ted cruz supporters, , you may not like me and be excited by my candidacy, but on policy issues, if you want a president who is going to appoint conservative justices, you have got to vote for me. donny: let's go back to the debate. he is running around and does not have his head in the books, would he able to. i don't think he can focus. is the campaign concerned they will get the question about a city in syria where he is like, what? hillary clinton is very smart. she will turn to him at some point and say what you think about city x? he is going tuesday or. would you think about that? >> they want to avoid that "what is aleppo?" moment. that is what donald trump is at risk for potentially on monday. the bottom line is this, the sources i am speaking with are telling me that he is been prepping for this for several weeks. the way he is doing it is in true trump form. he is having top aides helping him. these are people he has surrounded himself. he will have a solid day of debate prep. margaret: crash for the exams. to the tedck cruz thing? i was shocked. it took everybody by surprise. there is no question that there is tension, to say the least, between donald trump and ted cruz. but there are also some significant interlocking of the ted cruz world and donald trump world. case in point, kellyanne conway. this is donald trump's campaign manager, who previously before was running a ted cruz super pac. you have a melding of conservative minds. this helps to get him a couple of news cycles. but voters who do not like donald trump or hillary clinton, i've got to be honest, i'm not sure ted cruz is going to make a difference. margaret: it helps, right? donny: this is not an endorsement election. these candidates are so clearly defined and polarizing that there is no one figure up there, certainly not ted cruz, that one way or another. any establishment candidate he uses to his advantage. margaret: what does ted cruz want out of this. donny: he thinks he is going to win. margaret: based on his previous discussion on donald trump, this will mean that mike lee gets anything, or that ted cruz will get anything for that matter. it is highly unlikely that he is changed his mind about everything. is this an insurance policy so donald trump does not go after him? is this so ted cruz can hang onto his own reelection prospects? what is his goal here? >> if donald trump wins i think , this gives ted cruz some influence in the administration. if donald trump loses, i think what this does is that it attempts i'm not sure it will , work, i think it is an effort for ted cruz to win over and build a bridge with the millions of supporters who backed donald trump in the primary and who chose donald trump over ted cruz in that primary. everybody thought those voters were going to go to ted cruz. they didn't. they went to trial. donny: what is donald trump's worst nightmare for the debate? >> that he has a "what is aleppo?" moment. a viral moment that defines the rest of the days. the best case scenario is that he is able to reach out to those independent voters who are displeased with the choice between hillary clinton and donald trump, and that those voters take away from monday night that this is a candidate who has continued to grow into his candidacy while hillary clinton has been defined by the past. donny: i think his night mare moment i think he has out , in the geography game, he could say he could hire someone. i don't think he has an out on the temperament thing. if he does it my initial theory , is that he did not want the presidency. the point i can tell you right away is that yesterday we were in my hometown of philadelphia, and donald trump went to a restaurant, but the reporters, we were asking him questions, and he seemed poised answer some questions from us, and one of the reporters shouted out a question about bitherism, and he walked straight to the counter. margaret: how much to me know about clinton's standing on goading in the prep sessions? none of the sources i have been speaking with have said there is going to be a stand in. the "what isvoid aleppo" moment. that moment where he responded to ted cruz about new york values. won him bipartisan support. if you can confront clinton in a way that shows a more measured demeanor. donny: i have a theory. i actually think it will be a nonevent. i think they are both smart. margaret: i want my money's worth. donny: i think we might be underwhelmed. to both of their credit. nothing new is going to happen here. i don't know if much will move. >> i can't wait. donny: i'm not even watching football that night. that's how important it is. margaret: we should talk about that. what do you think? donny: 100 million. the last time there was 100 million, it was "match" in 1983. ♪ ♪ donny: if you have not heard the big announcement bloomberg , politics is partnering for special coverage of the presidential debate on monday. they will be pregame and goes game interviews and analysis starting at eight or p.m. at 8:30 follow our twitter. coming up on "bloomberg west," you will have to sit through us anymore. -- you will not have to sit through us anymore. mark and john are back on monday. we don't need those guys, do we? margaret: let's keep going. donny: we will see you next time. thank you for having us. ♪ ♪ announcer: "brilliant ideas," powered by hyundai motors. ♪ >> ♪ i-d-e-a, ideas ♪ ♪ a classical music composer by training, samson is a rising star in the art world with a fresh multimedia approach to contemporary art. >> he is an articulate person. when you are talking to him, it is easy to get an rapture by

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