Office. Joining me is jeff okeefe and sarah clip. I am pleased to have both of them here. Let me begin with you, tell me what happened . The trump administration, the president , and other key leaders were saying they had the votes, and in fact, they did. Was it difficult to pull this off . Absolutely. They have been trying for weeks, charlie, and they did it today by the skin of their teeth. The magic number was to get it over 215, 216 which they barely did. They called the vote shortly thereafter. No democrats voted for this. Article conservatives dont ardent conservatives dont think the bill went far enough. They decided they had to do it on thursday and they did it. It is a significant achievement, whether you are a fan of this president or republicans or not, there is no denying the house pulled off something many thought they could not do. This is the first major legislative achievement for House Speaker paul ryan, who has been on the job a little over 18 months. Certainly of course, the signature achievement so far for President Trump. Yet the senate remains, if you thought the house was difficult, let me introduce you to the upper chamber. [laughter] the senate is going to be a struggle. You already have two republican senators who have come out today and said they do not support this bill. Some of them are very concerned about medicaid. The American Health care act will cut a lot of money from medicaid. We do not know exactly how much. We are still waiting on the cbo score. It is probably in the neighborhood of 800 billion, which is a huge concern to the senators in the states that expanded medicaid. This is a big victory for republicans. Now, the senate has to go go through a lot of the fights that the house already did. There is discussion the house the senate might start its own bill from scratch. This is one victory in an ongoing fight. Now the focus turns to the senate and what they are going to do. Charlie there has been much discussion, including with my aboutgue john dickerson, the president as to what was in the bill and not in the bill. Give us a sense of the key aspects of that conversation. Part of the debate over the last three or four days. What is in the bill and what is not in the bill . The president suggested this is a bill that protects people with preexisting conditions. He said he wants to sign a bill that protects everybody with preexisting conditions. The problem with those statements are there are actual provisions that are not good for someone who has a preexisting condition. One of the ways that the conservative members of the house caucus were brought on board was by letting Insurance Companies in some states seek a waiver to charge sick people higher premiums. This is really a nonnegotiable for the Freedom Caucus. There wanted to get rid of this rule called community rating. If this bill that the house passed goes through, if it is signed into law by President Trump, we will once again have a market were sick people will have higher premiums. Charlie and sometimes high deductions, too. Yes. Charlie when you look at this bill and who gave up what, who made the toughest compromise . I think it is more mainstream, moderate republicans who had to go along to get the concessions sarah was just talking about. These ads write themselves. Democrats are in fantastic political position, because now they get to run campaign ads against Republican Senate are republicans across the country. To cut hundreds of billions of dollars from medicaid. If you got cancer, you will have to pay more for your health care. If your mother is sick, you have to pay more for her Health Care Plus your own. All sorts of different kinds of ways they can spin this. We had a Group Interview with nancy pelosi, and she conceded saying it is much easier for us to talk about things and they are going to be taken away from americans as to when you are trying to explain what you are going to do to change a big law that really is becoming a settled issue for many americans, even if they have general concerns with it. I would say it is people who faced difficult reelections next are in the suburbs, certainly in the northeast, surly some for congressional districts and a handful of congressman in california that will face an interesting and challenging time in the next few months explaining what they did, especially if that estimate from the congressional budget office, the nonpartisan counters comes back and demonstrate yet again that tens of millions of people could Lose Health Care coverage and that this bill could potentially cost billions of dollars to the federal government. That was a big risk they took in having this vote, not knowing exactly the potential cost of it come and in many cases, nubbers members conceding that they did not read the thing. Charlie why did the president feel like he had to do this now instead of going directly to tax reform . Because you need a lot of the savings that republicans helped to generate from health care in order to help pay for an figure out tax reform that is the basic policy answer. But he also knows that if you cannot get health care, it may be impossible to get tax reform, and maybe very difficult to do anything else, and they needed to get to a point where they got a win. House republicans said, we can government and come together on something as difficult as this was. It was a big step. Rightfully today, wanted to celebrate that with House Republicans and delayed his trip to new york to see the australian Prime Minister in order to do so. Thinge, to date, the only congress has given him is the nomination of Supreme Court justice neil gorsuch. They have a working they have a working relationship. We have a sense of how the white house and how the house can work together. Depending on how the final Health Care Bill will look like and sara is the expert on this on how exactly they would save money or to move money around, it would make doing tests are from a policy standpoint as well. Charlie sarah . Sarah it would be a step forward, but we are seen that seeing that health care is becoming this allconsuming task. Back in january, President Trump said he wanted to sign and sign an Obamacare Repeal bill in his first day of office. It is hard to see a timeline where republicans are both able to finish health care this year and go into tax reform given all of this work that has to be done. The senate is talking about writing its own bill, starting from scratch and sort of merging those together. When you look at the legislative calendar, it seems hard, but not impossible to achieve both health care and tax reform, two major policy overhauls in the same year. Charlie, there was a moment today at the white house rose president nt where the said, maybe we should get rid of paul ryan, no, he is going to stay. The president did not deny that he had thought about it, and did nothing to suggest that he wants ryan to stay put and is happy with the work he has done. Clearly, that relationship has been strained. It wouldve been far worse if this had not happened both for ryan and for trump, but more importantly, for their relationship. Of those two are not able to work together, the Republican Party and their ability to govern would be seriously jeopardized. Charlie paul ryan has consistently said ever since obamacare was passed, republicans had said, we got to do something about it. They try to change it in every possible way including a court challenge. Here it is, finally having a republican president , not to have acted on this according to paul ryan would have been to define of their own constituency. It wouldve been an existential crisis. He made the point on the house floor before the vote. He said, look, there are people in this chamber who are here because they vow to take this vote. If we do not take this vote, their entire political existence is called into question. They understand that much of their political success in recent years has been to rail against legislation like this. They needed to demonstrate that they tried very hard to get it done. One of the interesting dynamics we have seen developed is that no one wants to be blamed for stopping this. In the first round of negotiations, the Freedom Caucus was a roadblock to passing the health bill. It was then the moderates who were in the hot seat. It is like this Health Care Hot Potato that no one really wants to drop, even if they are not thrilled with the final product. I think we will see that dynamic play out in the senate. One of the things i learned from this Health Process is that nobody at the end of the day wants to be the one with the finger pointed at them, saying you are the one standing in the way of this Campaign Promise we have made for seven years. I think that will be a motivating factor in the senate to try to pass something. It does not look like the house was able to do this, but we were the place where it all fell apart. Charlie when you look at this bill, which many people have not [laughter] the point has been made how rare is that that people are asked to vote about something that they do not know what is in there . Sarah it is incredibly rare. This is what happened with the Affordable Care act. Republicans demanded they needed to be a score before you vote. It also seems quite risky for the republican members. It has been mostly democrats chastising republicans for doing this. We could see a cbo score in the next week or two that shows millions of people losing coverage. That vote has since been taken. You cannot take back the fact he you voted for it. It seems quite the risk republicans are taking decide to vote for a Health Care Bill not knowing who was covered in how much it will cost. Charlie they can go to their constituents and said, they did it. We said we about to repeal and replace obamacare and we did it. We dont know for certain, charlie, that they have. The way that it is written, it is not a wholesale replacement of the Affordable Care act. It is a sweeping, conservative rewrite, what elements but elements of the law will still be there. If you are one of those ardent conservatives who wanted to see completely wiped clean and your clean, then you are not going to be happy. If they go on a week long recess, that is underway, if they get asked by someone at the Grocery Store at a town hall meeting next week, what is really in this thing . If they then struggle to answer that, even their republican supporters would wonder, was that the best thing to do . It shows you they were willing to put all of that at risk and still hold a vote because they understood that the consequence of dragging it out even longer and possibly fumbling the ball yet again was worse than taking the vote now starting this process and taking it over to the senate. Charlie so, is it greater than 50 50 that the republicans will be able to vote in the house and senate. Sign have something signed by the president that will be a republican act of health care . Sarah i think it is an uphill battle, but the desire to have something is very strong. Given republicans control the senate, the house, and the white house, it would be hard to say that we were not able to get this done. And they hold 52 seats. The question will be whether they get at least 51, because there is no democrat who plans to vote with them. As it was described to me by democratic aides yesterday, we are sitting on our hands watching republicans deal with this. Charlie ed and sarah, thank you. We will be right back. Stay with us. Charlie 23 years ago, three selfdescribed hipsters created a free montrealbased magazine, which quickly developed a reputation for bold, provocative reporting. It was called vice. It has since become a Multimedia Organization valued at nearly 5 billion. Along the way, the company has eschewed many of the trappings of traditional news media and instead created what it calls immersive journalism. As harden described news with an edge. Vice news tonight was launched. George smith is the founder and a host of their with the documentary series on hbo. Eekly documentary series on hbo. And josh is the executive Vice President of news executive producer of vice news tonight. I am pleased to have them both back on this program. Tell me vice media is, as if i did not know. We started the magazine and in montreal, and then we came down here as the first dot com revolution kind of went bust. We then moved to brooklyn and started being a digital company. We were the first to do online video and native advertising and all that good stuff. We then got bigger and bigger and grew internationally. Now we are in 80 countries and a tv networks. We are online. We have mobile. We have agencies, we have record leabe record labels. Charlie it is a Media Company . That at about 5 billion . Last year. [laughter] charlie your show is about hellbent libertarianism . Yeah. I was lucky that i got to spend time with david. Charlie we loved him on that show. I loved him. We met when he was shooting page one, and we butted heads in the n we becamed the really good friends. I remember when they called me, they said if we get chain, will you come to dublin for round two . We said sure. It was kind of a lovefest. They sent up all these irish musicians, and we danced around this crazy castle together. We had a lot of fun together. But he was one of the best. He called it right. Of no rules, nonparadigm, nonpolitical. Olemic. Paradigm, nonp charlie is it news or entertainment . It is news, but it is entertaining news. I think that, you know, one of the things, to speak of reviews or critiques, the first review of vice news is that New York Times said and i am paraphrasing, but it is hipsters with skinny jeans and tattoos highfiving in war zones. Everybody was bummed, but i said look, they are not saying this stuff is not great or good news. They are not getting us on the facts. They are just saying we look different from them. If we look different from them, guess what . That is our audience. That is the millennials. So you can have the older generation, but we will take the younger generation. If youre making fun of the way we dress, it is a win. Charlie you have the hbo series, then you decided you wanted to come up with a nightly presentation. It was a combination. Charlie he said it was his idea and that it was not a combination. [laughter] richard loves the news that we create for hbo. And so, he loves what we do for hbo, and we love being on hbo. It is a great platform for us. When he came to us and said, we want to do this all the time and we want to do it nightly. It was a big conundrum because we did not want the voice of god or hosts, or to look like other news. It would just be derivative of what they would be. So, we had to reinvent news which is hard to do. So, i got sick of actually being beaten by this guy at all the awards shows every year when he was at bloomberg. We would always be up for best magazine, and he would win it. [laughter] when we wanted someone with a Creative Vision to say, im going to reinvent news, which is hard to do because it has to be recognizable enough to call it news, but different enough so we are not derivative of anything else. Charlie you have been in Time Magazine and really made Bloomberg Businessweek a magazine. You had no trepidation about this, because when you were leaving, you had tons of people who wanted you to come. Why was this right for you . It was a combination of things. I like solving problems, and the naughtier the problem, the more interested i am. But what i learned over the years and i have been blessed with having good patrons, is that you need support because you are not going to get it right the first time out. When you are taking on a big media problem, like how you get people to watch something that has not changed in 60 years, on the one hand, there was shane who was the right kind of media kind of being media rogue and saying we are going to do it differently. We will figure it out. It was expressing the kind of commitment that you need and the insistence on quality. I felt safe, because jumping into the most competitive landscape, delivering news over the air, is not a safe thing, but i like for all the things i was interested in, you could be smart, get permission to experiment, and that is a dream. That is what you want to be able to do. Charlie what are the elements of the nightly show . Josh when shane and i first spoke about this and i think i have said this to him and i said, nobody needs this, right . The media has changed so much. If you are an engaged news consumer, you are getting it all day on your phone, over the radio, watching tv. Nobody needs it to just tell you nobody needs anyone to just tell you what happened. What happened is pretty obvious. If you are going to do this, you have to make people want it by seducing them. You have to give them something a little familiar. We are unconventional in many, many ways. The thing we are very conventional about is, you watch a show, youre going to hear a lot about what happened in the world today and you understand it better. That is the basic value proposition. From there, we looked at what conventional news delivered. We saw that it is the only news product where it is on at the same time. It has the same format which is one person behind a desk. Oftentimes, they are doing the same kinds of stories. So, lets start over. Lets make the thing we want to make. The visual inspiration in some ways was saturday night live on the one hand and sesame street on the other. Not because we want to be funny or childish, because they know who they are marketing to. You go to saturday nigh live becuase you want to laugh and you go to sesame street educate your kids. No matter what the problem there they are trying to solve, they have moves. Saturday night live does it with shorts, commercial spoofs, they have ways to package all of those ideas. Sesame street is sometimes an et