Transcripts For BLOOMBERG Charlie Rose 20160512

Strategy might be, who he will choose for a running mate, who hillary will choose for a running mate, what her strategy will be, does trump have a serious chance in terms of strategy might be. Have at it. Mark thank you all for coming. 5 im going to do this in no particular order how does donald trump make the Big Decisions in this Campaign Selection of running mates, debates, which will be among the most watched events of all time, hodas than r wedding. Big. Two, can he convince people he is qualified to be president . Raise your hand if you are going to vote for donald trump. [laughter] how many people think there are people in this room who are secretly going to vote for trump but will not raise their hand . Now, this may not be the perfect demographic for that test, but i do that question all over the place. Can donald trump become a place for people to go to vote because they want change . Three, can Hillary Clinton be as likable, as engaging as donald trump . Looking at the modern age in president ial elections, to do things are true of everyone who on taller. Im not big in predictions, but i think trump will still be tolerant in november. Two, more likable. I think trump will still be taller in november. Able. More lik she will have to show people the private side of her, which is more likable. Change the country want so badly they are willing to she a risk on him, or can convince people that stability is important . Finally, the economy and president obamas Approval Rating. If his Approval Rating comes down and growth is still at 2 , it will be tough for the democratic party. Rose what would you add to that . John first, i want to thank you for those gracious and extort and extraordinary introductions. We wrotethem just like them. Of thoseith all things. They are really important. Bigink that theres two questions that relate to trump, fix the are can he current problems he has with two enormous and enormously important parts of the american electorate, hispanic voters and women voters . Right now, he is disapproved of by roughly the same percentage in those groups, like in the mid70s. Theres not a map that accommodates being disapproved of five more than half of the electorate in the case of women, and the most crucial and fastestgrowing part of the electorate in hispanics. If you are at that level of disapproval in those groups, i have no idea how he goes about axing those problems, but they are very large and potentially disqualifying. Rose talk of bowl did not do it for you . Owl did not taco b do it for you . John i want to say i did enjoy taco bowl. The election will always be close, somewhat close in america. You have a very divided country. We have seen this over the past few cycles. 47 , 48 are republicans, 47 percent, 48 republican. Given the has done, level of elite division and the Publican Party there is not as Much Division among republican voters. They are coming home to donald trump as he has been named the presumptive nominee. When you become the presumptive nominee, you get a boost, a bump, and your party starts to coalesce around you. Even though a lot of leading republicans are still arguing about it, the voters in the rePublican Party will largely be satisfied with him. The last thing i will say is to me, one of the biggest questions is is this Campaign Going to be governed more by art or science . All campaigns are about both. There is slicing and dicing of demographics and targeting of states and how you win this voter group, and what neighborhood rose sounds like the Clinton Campaign. That was the Obama Campaign in 2008 and 2012, and the Bush Campaign in 2000 and 2004. But theres also the art narrative, catching lightning in the bottle, what some might call the art of the deal. [laughter] to me, that is a big question. You want to go to mario cuomo, poetry and prose. Prose isll she know all she knows. You would not say trump is a poet, but he is a much more dynamic, captivating figure who feels more the frustrations of this moment for americans than she does. Mark if trump is a poet, i would say his preferred form would be the body limerick the baudy limerick. First of all, i will give you the texas version of the thank you for the introduction, which leg,u are pissing on my but it was warm and it felt good. [laughter] we are from the frontier, from the country. I just want to backup a little bit because and talk about sort of the macro element that are going on here that are driving a lot of us. A few years ago, as i began to look at sort of the thing that, the fundamentals of what was happening in this country and see the erosion of trust among voters toward government, toward politicians, toward the parties, sense the country was headed in the wrong direction, concern about economic future, i went back and asked how it looks compared to 1992 when there was this character, a businessman outsider named ross perot who decided to run. What was remarkable was how much worse those numbers are today or a few years ago than they were back in 1982, and in 1992, they were bad enough that this character from dallas, texas, as you recall, was leading bill clinton and george h. W. Bush for two months of the election and, arguably, had he been a different candidate with the same message might have won that election. The opening for somebody to run as a businessman outsider not beholden to special interests, not with a political background was enormous. That it was donald trump is a surprise, but it should not be. We should not be surprised somebody has captured that space of fundamental change, that is so fundamental, that as mark said, they are willing to risk somebody that might be risky because they have tried everyone else and have been let down. Rose what is it about trumps record in business that suggests he would be a good president . He brings opposing sides together and becomes a problem solver, and thats what a lot of people want in american politics. The other thing is he is postideological. Hes not a very ideological candidate, and thats where a lot of the country is. They do not care if it is a democratic or republican solution, they just want a solution. Trump is at as a businessman we are going to go in and cut a deal. Rose Bernie Sanders is still winning primaries. Winning one as we speak. How do you explain his phenomenon . Politicalvery other industrialized democracy, we social democrats, liberal democrats, people who believe what he believes. People who believe in singlepayer universal health , a much broader view for government in regulating the anancial markets, and worldview about support overseas free stuff as republicans. Ould call it Bernie Sanders, through discipline and strong belief and really good use of social media and television now that shows like ours have put him on, is able to reach those tens of millions of people who share those views. That a little bit of luck he was the right guy in the right place at the right time, but the overlap, much commented on between donald trump and Bernie Sanders, against special interest in politics, against hington special influence special interest influence in general, believe that the system is rigged against workingclass people. These are strongly held beliefs, and they are things he has kind of written the way above, and he is exciting. An authentic. Those are things that ring true. To beone, there was going a progressive challenge to Hillary Clinton. Someone was going to do it. He talked about the luck, he was lucky Elizabeth Warren or cory booker did not ill that space, someone who was younger, more conventionally attractive, more conventionally acceptable, did not run. The second is huge and i talk about political narrative all the time. No one has told a story that is more coherent, if you agree with it or not, then van than Bernie Sanders story about what has gone wrong in america. His argument and that is really all he is done is make an argument. On the stump, he does not tell jokes or talk about his biography or family. He makes a critique of everything that is wrong with america. It is a real worldview. The third thing is and it is the most important thing that all of the things that we all thought i should say Mark Halperin and i put him on our show earlier than almost anyone and took them seriously earlier than almost anyone, but even we totally underestimated the extent to which the things you would normally think our problems 74 years old, stoop shouldered, jewish guy mark selfdescribed socialist. John cranky, dyspeptic, dandruff on his shoulders. Lawn. Get off my added upt all of this to a bunch of assets because he is real. That guy has been saying the same thing for years. Hes never changed. He has never primped. He has been consistent, and that prefabricated, paultested politician. Ed paultested polltest politician. Mark at the end of the day, the Clinton Campaign will drive a very strong message on policy and issues that will likely appeal to millenials. They will appeal to any number of issues. Passion drives turnout, and right now, sanders is driving the passion. There may be antipassion against trump. Could be negative passion. Secretary clinton and senator sanders hate each other . John hate is a strong word, charlie. Rose ok, do they intensely dislike each other . Nomination fights that go on this long tend to breed a fair amount of friction. Rose which is why jim bakker said to george bush, get the hell out. Mark ill think its anything close to what it was with her and barack obama eight years ago i dont think its anything close to what it was with her and barack obama. I think putting things back together will be substantially easier. Rose why has she not pick up the phone to call him to tell him not to get out of the race because thats his decision, but to try to appeal to him. John candidates locked in combat do not talk to each other that way and she was someone who was told to get out of the race will out of the race in 2008 over and over again and she thought it was her right to fight to the end. Ofis true that the level intensity and bitterness is less than a 2008, but heres the truth on the worst day in 2008, barack obama did not think Hillary Clinton was a corrupt crook, and Bernie Sanders basically thinks Hillary Clinton is a corrupt crook. He thinks she is everything about the oligarchy and ruling class and governing class that he finds corrupt and despicable. Ofhink there is an element she represents something that he thinks is maligned in a way that obama and clinton work basically both establishment. They were cut from the same. Loth Bernie Sanders is senator, but he looks at her and thinks big money, all the things that he critiques. Rose we are all part of the media. What is your judgment in terms of the performance of the media so far . [laughter] same as always abject failure. [applause] seriousness, in all , i think we perform our jobs as a group as poorly as any elites in society. It is harder than it has ever been for a variety of reasons. Rose like what . Mark economies of scale are harder to achieve because our market share is smaller than it has ever been. The New York Times have the same budget to file freedom of information act requests than they did with a had a bigger . Nopoly they just do not. No one does. To applaud the overall coverage. I will say if you are on the right side of the digital divide, you have more access to information than ever in human history. Mark ronson is here. The british dj made his name in the club scene of new york city and has gone on to work with some of the biggest names in pop music including adele, Amy Winehouse, and sir paul mccartney. His new album earned him two awards at this years grammys including record of the year. Time magazine right in detail about his range with real skill and intelligent. Hassingle uptown funk been viewed on youtube more than five alien times. Here is a look at uptown funk featuring bruno mars. If we show up, we going to out out show two hot call the police and the firemen im too hot make a dragon want to retire, man im too hot you say my name, you know who i am im too hot reak it down yaown funk gonna give it to saturday night and we in the spot dont believe me, just watch have markleast to ronson at this table for the first time. How do you think of yourself . Producer, musician . Rk i think they all kind of in form each other. Dj in, you get to see rhythm and how it moves people, which you take into the studio, and the other stuff, you sort of pick up along the way. You said about uptown funk that you worked on it to within an inch of its life. Mark right. It started off as a jammed in jam in studio as a brunos studio. Every now and then, its just a bunch of wasted time, and every so often, you hit a rhythm, and that one out great. The difference is when you are starting a song, the jam is like conceiving the baby. Anything is possible. A little improvisational. Mark yeah, and that is fun and the skys the limit, and then you get to the. 6 months down the line where you are like, oh, crap, how do we rewrite the bridge for the 15th time . When you have something in the room everyone in the room feels like has the potential to be great, it is tougher to get it to the. Finish get it to the line. Rose what has the video done for you . Mark i was talking with the photographer from the Associated Press today. Who he wasn was going to photograph, and he says the white guy from the bruno mars video. Bruno mars is one of the great performers and entertainers of this generation. Notding next to him im going to be pulling any crazy moves or anything, but it has just been amazing to be in something that ought people seem to really love, something that we worked on and we actually love. Sometimes you get this with hated theirthey biggest hit. This is something i am really proud of and its crazy to see the light it has taken. Rose how has it affected you . Has it changed your life totally . Mark no, in london where i the, i take it to i take twube. In new york, i take the subway. Im so lucky that i do not have fame on the level of the people i have worked with because i can still live my life. Its fine. Is there some common denominator that they share . Mark all those people have sort of you know, pop music sometimes can be quite like a homogenous field. Every now and then you have someone who comes along and just blows the doors off because their talent is so remarkably different. I think the greatest connection that we have in pop music is still the human voice, nothing great vocal hear performance. Nothing hits harder. I think those people all just have such singularly great voices. They sing with passion. You know the meaning you know they mean it the minute they sing it. I feel like coming up as a dj in new york, i was mainly in hiphop clubs, but obviously, r b, disco, rock n roll, this music it was kind of a magical time when i was playing, and everyone remembers this stuff into their early 20s and maybe it holds a special place, but that record i wrote a ,etter to my favorite author and i wondered why we could not make music that feels good and has a group to it, but it can well . Eat stories as usually, stories are the territory of bob dylan and people who hold guitars and stuff, but we can have a great dance beat and still for some interesting lyrics. I asked and he wrote back and was interested in it. We took a trip to the deep south , to new orleans, drove to chicago, went to 30 different churches looking to discover a great young singer, and we stopped in memphis and fell in love with a studio where al green used to work. We recorded an album. Every kind of little step along the way opened another door that never would have happened if we stayed in new york. You produced most of back to black for Amy Winehouse . Mark thats the record i am probably most known for. I met amy in new york and we hit it off right away. We just clicked, and i really liked her, and we started writing in the first two days. And in twoehab weeks, we made that album. Rose did you see the documentary . Mark i did, yeah. I saw it twice. Rose did it seem real for u. S. On who knew her . Mark it did. Endot very tabloidy at the. Its hard for me to watch some of this stuff, like anyone watching home footage of a rent you lost, but there is something really beautiful and the celebration of how funny she was. Rose you said you knew you had to work with her. Mark yeah, we just started talking, and sometimes when you meet a singer for the first time as a producer, you might play them some chords or tracks to see if they respond, but with her, i knew she was like nobody i have met, so i just said, go home tonight and calm back in the morning come back in the morning and i will play something for you. Because i really wanted to impress her. I played her the courts for back to black and she liked it, and the momentum went on from there. Rose what would you like to do that you have not done . I think a lot of things. Some of the things, especially uptown felt and milestones i never thought i and ridiculous dreams of playing the super bowl or childhood dreams of playing snl that did not even appear on my bucket list because i would say my bucket list is more grounded in reality, but my heroes, people like george martin, quincy jones has a legacy of great music. Maybe i have seven or eight years of having the music that could be considered important for that people like, but i just its all i want to do and just get better as a producer. Rose we have a clip from summer breaking with kevin entirelyd was shot using smartphones. Mark entirely. Rose wow. That is amazing to me. We talked while we were watching it. This notion of shooting on a smart phone. Its amazing. Ark the director shoots a lot for illing stone, and he said, want to do this on iphone, and i like the idea of doing something a little bit different. Gaga this is you and lady performing to a hit. Charlie tell me about that. Mark ronson so i have been working for the last few months with lady gaga on the upcoming record. I was blown away by the talent in her voice. I think the opportunity came with the met, she has never played guitar. Album, shet on the is learning for it. She is such a fast learner. , she is performer insane. So i know she could have carried it anyway. So it was like a very lastminute thing. We got to rehearsing in one day. One of those things where i could have gone every which way wrong, but it kind of came off without a hitch, and it was a lot of fun. I had an amazing time working with her. It is kind of what we are working on now. She is really like, she is kind of amusing. She used to have this sitting at a pno barking orders at it ano barkingat a pi orders at a drummer. All of the world is not seen that. They have seen the tours and events, so it is great to make this authentic analog record with her. Charlie you worked on a dell 19. Ll adeles mark ronson i hope i get the call for 31. Charlie explain it to me. Mark ronson another thing with a voice is so infinite. I feel like for somebody who like has such a sunny deposition and as warm as she does, all the pain in her voice, the things i dont even know, it is that passion and emotion that locks you in right away. She can sing a phone book and we would line up to buy it. And you know, she is a great storyteller. And the authenticity, that is what we are missing right now. Charlie paul mccartney. Mark ronson yeah. He is somebody that, when i was in the studio, i could push the first day, the most nervous you are going to be. , heonly he is he a legend is a better producer that you, better musician then you. And you are in the room with the ghosts of george martin, Elvis Costello that he is already worked with. So he gives you a day circle. He knows everyone is nervous. You get a little window of kind of, all right, we will let you a few let you flub things, and then get over it and get excited about arranging things. Mainly i learned so much from him in that time about arrangements. The stuff he was doing with the beatles was so groundbreaking for that time. He still talks about technology and how to make his stuff interesting. It is very inspiring working with him. Charlie why does he pop for you . Mark ronson it was the music i was drawn to. I moved here from england when i was eight years old in 1983. That was the era of run dmc and the sound of new york and growing up, that is what we would sing on the school bus on the way to long meets up in the parks. And that was the music i was drawn to probably because of the grooves in the rhythms and away the example james brown and a lot of things that i would discover as my favorite kind of music. Charlie have you always been fascinated with vinyl . Mark ronson always fascinated with vinyl. This started in the era when you had vinyl. I still love it. I actually dont play them that much, but i have 5000 records in my studio that i just need to see them every day to be reminded of where you come from. I can see the little spine and remember where i bought them. Charlie so was this the perfect Training Ground for you . Mark ronson i think it is almost like probably the closest you can get to having a modern musicology kind of course. You learn every thing about musicianship, arrangement, playing, especially from old records. It is a good thing. A lot of good djs like dr. Dre that become producers, talking about the way your mind works and putting together music. The result of amazing producers that never touch vinyl. I think it is anywhere you have your own entrance point. Charlie where do you think he will be 10 years from now . Or five . Mark ronson five or 10 years from now . We live and an age where there is this giant sense of entrepreneurial i made as a musician, now i want my own line of polo shirts. And i was kind of saying, those heroes like lindsay and george martin, they are currently studying to get better. That is what i want to do. I would be happy if 10 years from now i am still working and deciding artists. Charlie thank you for coming in. Back in a moment, stay with us. Charlie Michael Eric Dyson is here. He is a political analyst at msnbc. His new book is called the black presidency, president obama and the politics of race in america. His relationship with the black community and more. It will help you understand the complex puzzle of race. I am pleased to have Michael Eric Dyson back at this table. So you had mr. Isaacson endorsing your book. Michael eric dyson a couple of people. He said very kind words. Charlie and julius, i like cam. The account of barack obama and the race is riveting. Essential for trying to understand the promise and pitfalls of americas racial maze. Tell me what you hope to a, was with this. Michael eric dyson i want people to understand how people how race has been used for and against obama since he entered office and then to step back and see how he himself has regarded race, engaged the issue, and then finally, how race has structured our understanding of him. Has often pitted him in interesting ways against a narrative that suggests that we are in a post racial nirvana that he has rejected. At the same time, he has been quite hesitant to embrace the issue of race and engages as the president of the United States of america. It as theage president of the United States of america. Charlie are the majority of africanamerican opinions celebratory of the fact that we have the First American president who is black . Michael eric dyson absolutely. 97 of black people voted the worst time, and then any 3 . 93 . There is a saturday night live sketch it comes on where the black journalists are there to be objective and a examiner obama, and no matter what goes on, even he is opposed to their beliefs, they say, do you believe in god, yes . If you was atheist, would you still vote for him . Yes, we would. It is pretty ironclad. Charlie but there is something he should have done more . Michael eric dyson there is a growing feeling he should have and could have done more. Diehards will continue to ignore that, but he is protected by black people who believe no matter what he does, he will be unfairly opposed and unjustly criticized. They do not want to add on to that. They do not want to engage in legitimate critique unless they fear that their words join with those of structure nests obstructionists who criticize this president. Veryroblem is this those black people, many were black and do not they did not ask anything of him. Lesbian, transgender, we are, they are black. Environmentalists did and other constituency groups dead, but other black people were loads to say anything loathe to say anything less they were traitors to him. Charlie how many people [indiscernible] he could say, i did address that and is now 5 . Michael eric dyson that is the larger American Public is 5 . Four. 9 recently. Black unemployment is now 8 something right now. Charlie he should have acknowledged that . Michael eric dyson yes. Any president that does not acknowledge it cannot deal with it. , thening it as a problem you develop resources, you constitute panels as he has done. You put together an initiative on urban america. You begin to do with president s do, executive orders, panels, white papers to think about ways we can strategically alleviate the struggling of a group. But he was not interested in being specific about race, he believed for a long time in his presidency that the rising tide believel bolts, if we in universal dimensions, particular elements of africanamerican people will be enhanced. I think he is wrong. If you help africanamerican people, think about the 1963, 1964 civil rights bill where that bill has been the template or anybody that was to come along as a Minority Group or an interest to say we want our fair share of the american pie. They have used that civil rights bill as the template. When you help black people, you help a larger american society. Charlie when you look at his record in terms of speaking, speaking to him, does he. . Short . He fall Michael Eric Dyson [speaking simultaneously] he wrote a lot of that himself. He put forth his idea of what america would does. He said at the best, america must engage in the issue of race. The anything but occurred. And then Henry Louis Gates of Harvard University had the fiasco that led to at his house. The beer summit was the resolution of that. The president learned a lesson. As a novelist said back in the 18th century, we do not want to deal with that. We do not want to address race. This is what his advisers suggested to him. Charlie you think he has not done more on race because he feared the political repercussions of it . Michael eric dyson he feared the political repercussions to be sure. Which means you can be strategic. He is one of the smartest guys in american politics right now. Why not find a way to address the issue without making it commercial . We do not need the commercial, just the product. He does not need to raise a black power sign. He needs to address it with consistent intelligence as with other issues. To addressbe loathe the issues. Charlie essie not spoken to the issue of black americans in prison . Michael eric dyson had recently. Charlie that is what you would like to have seen earlier and more. Michael eric dyson let me tell you why it makes a difference. The president said, i am not the president of black america. Black americans were not informed anything of that statement. They did not think they were a rest voting for a president of the naacp. When he says, i have a job to do for everybody. You may not be the president of black america, but you are the president of black americans, and are we not americans . Todoes not feel it necessary say that i another president of white americans. That is not the problem. When africanamerican people who have been distinctly in beginalized and seeks to brought back into the larger circle of american privilege, how do we do so, and how does the president happens to be black not take up the responsibility every other president that has taken the office trying to do . A blackohnson was not man, but the civil rights bill, the Voting Rights act, and the death, thef kings housing rights act, he was motivated. He went to howard university. Charlie [indiscernible] Michael Eric Dyson including lincoln. Charlie lbj . And selma. Michael eric dyson selma was trying to write to the ship of interpretation of how black people were involved in their own salvation. That movie was great. There is no question that Lyndon Baines johnson with all of his peccadilloes and idiosyncrasies was one of the greatest president s to occupy that place for africanamericans. Charlie and for the great society. Michael eric dyson against poverty, the brutal forces that had reduced america to a vast wasteland of poverty that dr. King warned about. To thinkso you like that barack obama would have been like lyndon johnson. Wrote oneic dyson he of the greatest memoirs on race and identity in america. It would be again to Michael Jordan being the president but did not talk about basketball. You are good at that. So he does not have to beat lyndon johnson, just barack obama. A man who does not last out at black people by giving condescending lectures at morehouse. To warn them of a Global Economy they must get what they earn and only what they earn will they get. Charlie with the morehouse commencement speech, condescending to Michael Eric Dyson africanamericans and those graduates who were there that day. Charlie did they take offense . Michael eric dyson yes. And many people celebrated him and were quite resentful. A pattern here. Not only morehouse. I was there at the Congressional Black Congress when he said put on your marching boots. When he was kneehigh to a tadpole, he was they were getting their skulls cracked open. People were heraldic. There is something beautiful about this president. Not only his skin but the fact he has had a biracial experience , his mother was white, his dad from kenya. He brings together the unimaginable opposites in american society, and in one body unites them. On those in shoulders unites the future of american democracy. The lamentable fact is his not safe enough, motivated enough to address these issues until forced to. There is a proprietary consciousness about him and a protective impulse or him. A mothering of him, fathering, people have reached out. That kind of kinship has made people say, beyond all that, if he is not doing in the substance of political fashion for africanamerican people, symbolic representation of his ascent will be in one sense mitigated by the fact he did not do anything in a concrete way to address the things he knew so well. And you finally see police brutality, he was giving us a law and order. Charlie my son. Michael eric dyson he was forced to say that, encouraged to say that after he delivered. Charlie you dont think his instinct is to speak without fear Michael Eric Dyson of fear about white america, white reprisal, what might happen, misinterpretation, and his reluctance and reticence is sand that america is often a powder trade powder keg, and he does not want it to explode. I will say this. Race will be interpreted in america. If you leave a vacuum and avoid, the wrong people will rise up to interpret it. We could have used more early on. A intelligence, passion, insight of barack obama on the issues and crises of rice and america of race in america. Charlie [indiscernible] Michael Eric Dyson [indiscernible] and who has been quite vicious and better. Cornell west has been in gauging but a nastiness and a kind of unexplained animosity to the president that is personal and uncomfortable in terms of violent imagination. I have no trust with that. Im talking about principled criticism. Talking about loving criticism. Even legitimate criticism. He had been auch in such bitter, nasty terms. I have nothing to do with that. Thevista gold unprincipled criticism of the president is unhealthy for any country without which we get left . Arlie Foreign Policy he succeeded on economic policy. Michael eric dyson you are making my point for me. Why is it that criticism cannot be had on the issue of race because this is internal dynamics. You said bill clinton had a bad policy with respect to africanamericans. Barack obama has no policy. I remind you Toni Morrison said bill clinton was the first black president. And she meant the way he was treated. Michael eric dyson not the substance of his ideas or the content of his vision or perspective. What she meant was they treat him like they treat the average brother on the street. They are dismissive of him. Bill clinton had more permission to be black in public than barack obama does. Barack obama cannot play the saxophone on a latenight show. He could not engage in the rituals. Not without playing [indiscernible] are you stereotyping . Charlie he probably could and we have be applauded. You can sing al green as well. Michael eric dyson at the apollo certainly. Among the people who are there. That constituency. Or Amazing Grace at the church. But when i say permission to be black in public, the way obama part fromt inside a that remarkable sermon and is when heharleston goes to the white house Correspondents Dinner and he signifies his blackness in a way, radiates from the heart of his likeness that is relatively unable to do. Charlie which is comedy. Michael eric dyson that is the way he can do it. Through humor, he can signify through he is. His blackness can be mediated through a forum already set up to know that what we are doing is humor is a humorous and comedic. Charlie [indiscernible] Michael Eric Dyson no, not all. Not only intellectuals but some of the cultural critics who have been saying this and acting saying, we have been asking this president , engaging this president , and we dont get any purchase. No serious response. We get lectures, condescension. A kind ofer we force serious engagement, yes. The president will occasionally speak to these issues. He went to the u. K. And could not help but remonstrate against black lives matter. Yell atyou cannot people. I do not deny what he said is true. But he praised to gay and lesbian activists for what they did, and larry kramer acted up. There was a lot of stuff these people did to get the attention of america and american president s. I think obama feels boxed in. He was loathe to speak earlier because he did not want to be blackened. He wanted to breathe the air of the american presidency. But every president has to deal with the issue of race. You cannot be exempt from that. Charlie i am sure he would say to you i am not failed to speak out. I have not healed to speak out. I thought it was necessary in terms of all those cases in which we have had police violence. Michael eric dyson he would. Charlie and he would say that in terms of president s, unemployment. He would fail that. Michael eric dyson i dont have to let me tell you what he said. Charlie i hear you. [speaking simultaneously] Michael Eric Dyson this is what he said. I disagree. To his credit, he is not as [indiscernible] as his followers are. When you have a hangnail, you get aspirin. When you get diabetes, you get insulin. There is no such thing as medicine. It is medicine targeted to an ill. Public policies like medicine work best when they are targeted to the eels are meant to relieve. So you are suggesting that this universal conception of how we can help africanamerican people is lacking. He said, i appreciate you, thank you for sharing. I disagree. I speak with the belief that when we help everybody, those at the bottom and those was vulnerable kobe helped as well. Vulnerable will be helped as well. Reluctancem on the to speak, he had to build up a head of steam. He looks for places to pick and choose where he can speak about race. He did some wrong things. The attorney general not a month in office said there was a nation of cowards. Obama came along and said he was not playing starsky and koch. The attorneywas general, i would not have said it that way. Charlie the politics of race in america. Thank you very much. Thank you for joining us. See you next time. Paul ryan. Reince priebus. And the rest. And donald trump. Behind closed doors. The donald visits d. C. Mr. Trump goes to washington. Mr. Trump goes to washington. Mr. Trump goes to washington. Mr. Trump goes to washington. Why didnt we think of that . Mr. Trump goes to washington. Somebody listen to me. An event so big it requires not one box, not two, not three, not four, not five. Holy