online shopping accounts and an internet bank account? we'll find out how criminals could be trying to steal your identity. hello, welcome to the programme. we're live until 11 this morning. we also want to hear from you if you've been verbally or sexually harassed on public transport. there's a suggestion this morning that one solution might be women—only carriages on trains. oppponents say that's just giving into the problem. let us know what you think. do get in touch on all the stories we're talking about this morning — use the hashtag victoria live and if you text, you will be charged at the standard network rate. princes william and harry have described their bewilderment when they encountered grieving crowds, on the day of their mother's funeral. speaking to a bbc documentary marking 20 years since the death of princess diana — they say walking behind her coffin had been a "family decision". here's our royal correspondent nicholas witchell. it was the week when a nation mourned, and the monarchy faced sharp criticism. at its heart were two boys, william and harry, then aged 15 and 12, grieving for the loss of their mother, but required by their royal position to appear in public and help assuage the public‘s sense of loss. in the bbc documentary, william and harry speak of the numbness and confusion they felt when they were told that their mother was dead. and, in harry's case, it is clear there is still anger at the french photographers who were pursuing diana's speeding car in the moments before the crash in the alma tunnel, in paris. i think one of the hardest things to come to terms with is the fact that the people who chased her into the tunnel were the same people who were taking photographs of her while she was dying in the back seat of the car. william and i know that. we have been told that from people that know that it was the case. she had quite a severe head injury, but she was still very much alive on the back seat. those people who caused the accident, instead of helping, were taking photographs of her dying on the back seat. and then those photographs made their way back to news desks. william and harry were in balmoral when they heard the news in paris. they speak up in support of their grandmother for her efforts to shield them and for their father. "he tried to do his best for us", says harry. when they moved from balmoral to london, they encountered grieving crowds. and it's clear that they found the experience bewildering, with so many people sobbing, and wanting to touch them. of the decision to walk behind their mother's coffin, both say it was a collective family decision and both say they felt a strong sense of duty, even then. when you have something so traumatic as the death of your mother when you are 15, as, very sadly, many people have experienced, and no one wants to experience, it leaves you, you know, it will either make or break you, and i wouldn't let it break me. i wanted it to make me. i wanted her to be proud of the person i would become. i didn't want her worried, or her legacy to be that william or harry were completely and utterly devastated by it. and all of her hard work, love and energy she put into us when we were younger would go to waste. they were children coping with their own grief and the attention of a grieving nation, and who kept going to honour their mother's memory. we can speak to royal correspondent sarah campbell. what was the main impression you get from the two princes? i know you have watched the whole documentary. yes, it is an hour and a half, and palace officials say it is the first and last time that princes harry and william will talk in such detail about those seven days. it is called diana seven days, it starts when she dies, finishes at the funeral. it gives an insight and other key players who were involved. so the point at which they were told that she died. they were on holiday in balmoral with their father, that she died. they were on holiday in balmoral with theirfather, with the queen. williams says that he was com pletely the queen. williams says that he was completely numb and asked themselves the question, why me? in all the run—up to the 20th anniversary of her death, we have heard very little about prince charles in all of this, but prince harry does pay tribute to his father in this documentary. he says it is one of the hardest things you have to do is to tell your children that the other parent has died. he was there for us, he was the one of two left, and he tried to do his best and to make sure we were protected and looked after. going back 20 years, you will remember there was a lot of bad feeling towards the queen and the royal family, because they kept the boys in balmoral. there was clamour in london folk them to be brought back to london, and on this volume is absolutely clear that that was the right decision for them at the time. he talked about how the queen, his grandmother, tried to protect them. she took the newspapers away every day. williams said there were no smartphones, thankfully we have the privacy to mourn. we had no idea that the reaction to her death would be so huge. there were other insights on the queen from others involved in this documentary, tony blair speaking. he was saying that she was resistant to anything that seemed to look false, there would look like a pr event. diana's elder sister said the queen absolutely did the right thing to let the boys get over the shock in the bosom of their family. william again talks about the fact that she felt torn, the queen felt torn between being their grandmother, the grandmother of william and harry, and her role as queen. clearly a very very difficult time for them all. sarah, thank you. annita mcveigh is in the bbc newsroom with a summary of the rest of the day's news. police have used tear gas to disperse protesters outside a rally by president in arizona. media reports said some anti—trump protesters had thrown bottles at police. footage shows demonstrators being driven backwards. during the rally, the president attacked media coverage of his response to violent disturbances in charlottesville calling it "dishonest". this programme has learned that a long running investigation into a charity worker who helped expose the child sexual abuse scandal in rotherham is to be examined by the local government ombudsman. jayne senior has been investigated by rotherham council for a year, after a number of complaints. ms senior denies any wrongdoing and says it's a distraction from helping vulnerable young people in the town. i do not receive money for doing interviews. the only interview that i received a small amount of money for has gone to swinton lock. i don't and have not done this for money. somebody told them that i was earning a significant amount of money — well, i'm not. the government will today vow to end what it calls the "direct jurisdiction" of the european court ofjustice in the uk after brexit. a paper being published will insist such an arrangement would be "neither necessary nor appropriate" once britain has left the european union — adding there are other ways to resolve disputes. but critics say european judges could retain some influence. adam fleming is in brussels. a lot of discussion around the use of the word direct, the government saying it will end the directjurisdiction of the ec]. yes, and i am actually in luxembourg, the home of the european court of justice. in luxembourg, the home of the european court of]ustice. this government paper will be all about how do you solve disputes that arise between the uk and the eu, either around the brexit deal signed, or any future free trade partnership deal signed between the two sides? and crucially the british government does not want any dispute mechanism to include the european court of justice. the prime minister when she has talked about this issue has said she wants to end the jurisdiction of the ec]. now ministers talk about ending directjurisdiction. people will be combing through this paper when published at lunchtime for any hint ofa when published at lunchtime for any hint of a climb—down, a change or a softening or reinterpretation of the government's position. 0ne justice minister talked about how the fact that the uk will be keeping half an eye on what the uk does in future. what does that mean in practical, legal and political terms? we also know that the eu still sees a role for this place after brexit, especially on the issue of scrutinising and guaranteeing the rights of eu citizens who are still living in the uk after the uk leaves in march 2019. thank you very much, adam fleming. two men suspected to be behind last week's terror attacks in and around barcelona have been detained on terror charges — including murder. another man has been released on bail, while a fourth remains in custody. earlier, the court in madrid heard the group had intended to blow up several landmarks in barcelona. danish police have identified a headless torso found south of copenhagen as the missing swedish journalist, kim wall. the authorities believe she died on board a homemade submarine. the craft‘s inventor, peter madsen, has been accused of negligent manslaughter. identity theft is reaching "epidemic levels", with almost 500 cases a day according to a leading fraud prevention organisation. cifas says there were nearly 90,000 cases in the first six months of this year — a 5% rise. id fraudsters steal personal information before using it to apply for loans or store cards. a 14—year—old boy has been arrested for dancing the macarena in a busy saudi arabian street. a video of the teenager's performance was posted on twitter and quickly went viral — but now he's been accused of "improper public behaviour". it is not clear if he will be formally charged by the public prosecutor. a labour frontbencher has said women only train carriages could combat the rise in sexual offences on public transport. shadow prime minister chris williamson said it would be worth consulting on the policy, after such crimes doubled in the past year. jeremy corbyn first suggested the policy during his leadership election campaign in 2015. that's a summary of the latest bbc news — more at 9.30. lots of people getting in touch with us lots of people getting in touch with us about identity theft. philip dunne twitter says people need to wa ke dunne twitter says people need to wake up to the fact that their identity can be stolen. keep your comments coming. do get in touch with us throughout the morning — use the hashtag victoria live and if you text, you will be charged at the standard network rate. let's get some sport... england's women's rugby team are backin england's women's rugby team are back in another world cup final. it really has been a great summer for women's sport — off the back of the success of the cricketers, england's women are now gearing up for another rugby world cup final. they beat france last night 20—3 in a tense semifinal. the two sides shared a penalty a piece in the first half before prop sarah bern drove over for the first try of the night. an opportunistic score at the death from meganjones putting england into their fifth world cup final in a row — and a repeat of the showpiece from 2002, 2006 and 2010. 0bviously obviously i enjoyed most get the win and we set out to get to a world cup final and we have certainly done that. we will enjoy the performance tonight. we have said all along the way that you have do enjoy the winds, those little winds, and tonight we have that. tomorrow it will be back to square one. recover, review and move on for that massive game on saturday. the final takes place at 7:45pm in belfast, which will be brilliant, i'm sure. and lots of hype ahead of the big fight in vegas, what else would we expect this weekend? it's hard to take your eyes off of what's been unfolding ahead of saturday's main event. connor mcgregor and floyd mayweather arrived in las vegas for their "grand arrival". in a purple suit, mcgregor was working the crowds with lots of high fives and tonnes of support for the irishman but the the fight is yet to be a sell out — about seven thousand left, the cheapest costing from around £1100. in their last press conference later today of course we'll expect more verbal sparring between the pair. mayweather is expected to win and he's ready to get back in the ring and give fans more excitement. it is all about giving the fans what they want to see. i have been around they want to see. i have been around the sports are so many years, and this is the last one. conor mcgregor can talk the talk, can he walk the walk? we will have to wait to see, thatis walk? we will have to wait to see, that is what makes this fight and this matchup so intriguing. i have been off two years, it feels like i have lost a few steps, so we would just see. and before i go, worth mentioning celtic they've booked their place in tomorrow's draw for the group stages of the champions league. even thought they lost the second leg 11—3 they won the play—off tie 8—1; overall — a great effort by scott sinclair. they'll be amongst the bottom seeds for the draw aiming to reach the knockouts for the first time since 2012 i will be back with more at 9:30am. it is now three years since the jay report revealed the horrific scale of sexual exploitation of children in the south yorkshire town of rotherham. over the course of 15 years, more than 1,400 children, some as young as 11, were subjected to trafficking, rape and torture by gangs of men who were predominantly of pakistani origin, while the police and authorities failed to act. the report was seen by many as a watershed moment in changing how authorities would deal with abuse. but was it? the bbc‘s social affairs correspondent, alison holt, has reported many times on the rotherham grooming scandal, and has now returned to the town for a special report for this programme. before we talk to alison, i should warn you that you may find the details of her film upsetting and it's not suitable if you have children at home for the holidays. alison, what did you find? well, three years ago this week, when the scandal first emerged, the stories we were hearing were about children ignored, professionals who tried to warn about what was going on being sidelined, and information not being shared. there has been progress. but worryingly, what i found was there were still cases which seemed to show how difficult it is to change some deep—rooted attitudes. they'd kidnapped her, they'd held her hostage, they'd made her drug—run, gun—run, anything. rotherham in south yorkshire is a town trying to emerge from the darkest of times. they had her like a puppet. they manipulated for their own benefit, and then mentally and physically and sexually abused her. it's three years since rotherham found itself at the heart of one of britain's biggest child—abuse scandals. more than 11100 children sexually exploited by gangs for over a decade. the authorities, who'd ignored the problem, promised change. but how much has really happened? there are people who have been perpetrated against, who think they have reported it, and it's not been dealt with, it'sjust been put away in a drawer and left. the people of south yorkshire need proper protection, and we need to know that mistakes from the past have been learned. and for the first time, the whistle—blower who helped expose the abuse tells of the treatment that has torn her life apart. here we are, nearly three years on, and ifeel, erm... more vilified than some of the perpetrators in rotherham. they were raped by multiple perpetrators, they were trafficked to other towns and cities in the north of england, they were abducted, beaten and intimidated. in 2014, a report by professor alexis jay exposed the failure by the council and police in rotherham to tackle the gangs of men of largely pakistani heritage who were exploiting children. this is when she were only a few month old... there are some families for whom the lifelong cost of a problem ignored is only now becoming clear. she's in the garden playing. this is gemma. as a tiny baby, her mother, unable to cope, gave her tojulie and malcolm roberts to bring up. everybody liked gemma, she mixed with anybody, we just thought she were a normal kid, laughing and joking, she were lovely, she were. this is the first time the couple have talked about their foster daughter and the difficulties that started at an early age. she was a very troubled and a child that you couldn't reason with, a child that no matter what you said to her, she tried to get attention, whether it was good or bad. she were doing really stupid things, putting herself in danger, to the point where she was going to throw herself off the railway line. at 11, gemma was moved to a children's home, taken into care by rotherham council. now closed, this is one of the places where she was preyed on by men who claimed to be her boyfriend. it sounds like they plied her with money, goods, then drugs. and once they got hold of you with drugs, then every bit of your money that you get isn't your money, so you're owing to them all the time, and that is how it was. the incidents that she told me of, they kidnapped her, they'd held her hostage, they'd made her drug—run, gun—run, anything. 0n the streets of rotherham, she was increasingly trapped in a world of violence and abuse. pregnant at 16, her baby was taken into care. she did try to get help from the authorities but got nowhere. i knew that she was on the game, she was prostituting in sheffield. and i know that, with her arms, that she was on drugs. and i did say to her, gemma, i will be on a phone call and i will be hearing either a punter‘s got hold of you or you're on the slab in the morgue. but when professorjay told the world about the abuse in rotherham, for the first time gemma began to tell her foster parents about what had happened to her. gemma said, "mum," she says... "i am one of them girls, i am one of them that have been abused by these people." i asked her why didn't she speak to me beforehand when things were going off. she says, "i'd informed the police, the social services knew about it, why should i come and upset you, mum?" "why should i have trouble at your door?" she began to talk to the national crime agency about what happened to her as a child, but now in her 30s, she was still preyed on by some of the same abusers. when her foster parents were also threatened, they called 999. the perpetrators that had got gemma hooked on drugs, lending her money, manipulating her, were coming to the door, threatening with guns. these were all logged down, took crime incident numbers. police didn't come on two occasions, they came on one. so all since the jay report? oh, yeah. all after the publicity of that exploitation? all after that. all after the promises that things would change. yeah, exactly. and like she felt, like i felt, that she wasn't listened to. south yorkshire police say they haven't been able to identify the specific incidents but will work with gemma's family. jayne senior first met gemma when she was a teenager. then, she was manager of risky business, a charity which helped exploited children. she couldn't protect herself, they had a full hold on her, you know, as they did lots of the children that we were working with. these days, she works for a small charity called swinton lock. a community activity centre, it also provides support for vulnerable adults. january this year, the phone rang at work, and when i answered it, a little voice says, "can you remember me?" like others, gemma needed support — the sort of calljayne senior gets regularly. it's still happening, you know, and i have had a couple of calls from people in the community who this is still happening to their children or their daughters, just reaching out and asking for help and support, because they're just feeling like parents did ten year ago, five year ago, two year ago — frightened, worried, upset, lonely, isolated. abuse survivors also give information like names, phone numbers and car details. the charity was sending this to the council, expecting it to be passed on to the police. mike fowler is on the swinton lock management committee. he is also a former detective. well, the intelligence builds up a picture, and although small pieces of it might not be the right kind of information that can be turned into evidence, there could be a string of those that would form, you know, the full jigsaw puzzle, and they would be able to catch a perpetrator. the charity claims some of the information they sent in was not passed to the national crime agency. there are people who have been perpetrated against, who think they have reported it and it's not been dealt with, it'sjust been put away in a drawer and left. and that information is a mixture of historical information from the victims and current information as well. the current information is quite appalling, actually. so information that could potentially stop crimes which are happening now? yeah. rotherham council denied this, saying its records show information was passed to the nca in a timely way and in line with agreed protocols. but this is not the only battle with the council. jayne senior, who received an mbe from the queen for her work, helped expose the abuse that was ignored for so long in rotherham. for 12 months now, she's been under investigation by rotherham council after a complaint by a number of abuse survivors. the first she heard of it was when a journalist called. i were quite shocked, actually, and i think if a complaint‘s received and then investigated, i don't have a problem with that, but i shouldn't have to find out off a journalist. have you ever been given clear details about what you're under investigation for? no, never. so it's never been clearly set out? no. you've never had point one, point two... no, no. no, not at all. she believes she is accused of making money from media appearances and inappropriately sharing confidential information. last november, council officials interviewed herforfive hours. i were asked lots of questions about how much money i'd earned. i was asked questions about who i was sharing information with, who i'd passed that information on, had i got people's permission to share it? one of the accusations is that you've made lots of money from doing interviews, from writing a book, from talking about what's happened in rotherham. what's your reaction to that? it devastates me. i do not receive money for doing interviews. the only interview that i received a small amount of money for has gone to swinton lock. i don't and have not done this for money. somebody told them that i was earning a significant amount of money — well, i'm not. the interview wasn't the end of it. council officials arrived at the swinton lock charity unannounced. what was the first you knew? when they came through the door and introduced themselves. about seven officials were met by the charity's administrator, sharon cooke. she was told it was a monitoring visit and was quickly asked for personnel files. they were looking for specific information, particularlyjayne's, relating to her salary, and to her pay. how do you know that? because i keep my files in a very tight order, everything is popped away, and when i came back in, there were particular documents left out. we have policies and procedures here to deal with allegations. they've deliberately bypassed those, even when we've asked them to stop. it just seems as though, you know, they want to attackjayne's character and discredit the work she's done. as a whistle—blower. as a whistle— blower. given rotherham's history, the council has to make sure it investigates all complaints thoroughly, but the question being raised here is about the length of time it's taken. i've seen murder inquiries wrapped up well before then. it'sjust appalling, the way we've been treated. we are a small charity, we are not major criminals. rotherham council says it has a duty to robustly and fairly consider complaints, it's appointed independent investigators, and can't comment further. but jayne senior says the year—long investigation has taken its toll. here we are, nearly three years on, and i feel more vilified than some of the perpetrators in rotherham. that is how you feel at the moment, you feel vilified? absolutely, yeah. these have been difficult years for rotherham, but there have also been significant successes, gaining somejustice for abuse survivors. they've shown incredible bravery. for many of these young women, it completely shattered their lives. at three major trials, 19 people involved in exploiting children in the town were given long jail terms. the names of the ring leaders were very familiar to dr angie heal. they were included in the report she wrote for south yorkshire police in the early 2000s which was sent to senior officers. i was detailing some of the cases that were taking place, i was making it very, very clear that these were organised criminals that were abusing children in rotherham and elsewhere in south yorkshire as well. there are 88 ongoing investigations into how police officers handled these cases, but dr heal wants to know why, still, none of the highest ranking officers have had to account for their decisions. we've had at least 1,400 children over a 13—year period, probably much more, sexually exploited. we've now had, in the past 18 months, at least 19 offenders convicted and sentenced to nearly 300 years between them. and yet we have not had the senior command team properly investigated for what went wrong on their watch, during that time. and that really concerns me. certainly, for at least one of those 1,400, sucked into a violent world as a child, too little seems to have changed. gemma roberts was still talking to the national crime agency, but her family says she struggled to cope with the memories. she went into drugs more severely, because she tried to blank things out of her mind. it was upsetting her, she was wetting the bed, she was in a very bad mental state. injanuary, she was living in supported housing here in rotherham. she was getting limited help. but the abuse didn't stop. she'd been involved with these guys, with drugs and running with drugs, and got her that deep into it that, for whatever reason, there's no reason, she got raped by six asian men. nearly a month later, the police still hadn't taken her statement. soon after, she was found dead from a morphine overdose. unable to escape her abusers, her death a tragic symbol of the importance of learning from the past. they were still there from the care system, still there until she died at 35, and they are still there now, out on the streets. these, i wouldn't call them men, these perpetrators are still out there. and terribly sad story, gemma's story, and i should say both south yorkshire police and rotherham council have apologised for past failings, and in gemma's case, they send their condolences and say they are saddened by the tragic death. south yorkshire police say there are many crimes, which are family mentioned, and that all reported incidents involving gemma had been thoroughly investigated and finalised and they take all incidences involving guns and firearms extremely seriously. in terms of the concerns raised by dr heal, south yorkshire police turn to a report written for the crime and police commissioner, saying that significant lessons had been learned and improvements made. that is also worth saying that the national crime agency, which deals with most of the historic cases of abuse, says that in all information it is satisfied that all information relevant to its investigations have been shared with it. moving on to jane senior‘s case, since we contacted the council, she has now received details, written details of the accusations that she faces. we have spoken to a survivor of abuse who did not want to take pa rt of abuse who did not want to take part in the programme at this time. i want to emphasise something on this, which i think is really important, and that is that after all that happened in rather and in other places, it is vital, it is essential that people who are facing exploitation and abuse feel able to complain and know that it will be investigated thoroughly. that is not whether concerns lie —— lie here. the investigators will have to weigh up the investigators will have to weigh up the allegations made and decide the right and wrong is of that. that is theirjob. but what we are looking at here is the process, and we now know that the local government, or we understand that the local government ombudsman will be looking at the handling of jane senior‘s case, the way in which rotherham council has dealt with it. now, rather is certainly not the only place where they have had problems with exploitation. we have had problems in rochdale. most recently in newcastle where 19 people were convicted about ten days ago. so i think that underlines the significance of a problem across the country but also the difficulties of tackling it. thank you ever so much for doing that film for us and we will be talking about this later on. and if you have any concerns about what we've just covered, there's more information on the bbc action line — the number 0800 888 809. calls are free and are open 24—hours a day, and there's a full list of support and organisations available at bbc. co. uk/actionline. still to come... identity fraud has reached almost epidemic proportions in the uk, with almost 500 cases reported every day. analysts say four in five cases occur in cyberspace. protesters and police clash outside a trump rally in arizona. we'll be speaking to one of the protesters and a young republican who attended the us president's speech. it is 9:35am. here's annita in the bbc newsroom with a summary of today's news. princes william and harry have described their bewilderment when they encountered grieving crowds, on the day of their mother's funeral. speaking to a bbc documentary marking 20 years since the death of princess diana — they say walking behind her coffin had been a "family decision". harry had previously said walking behind her coffin aged 12 was something no child "should be asked to do". the government will today vowed to end what it calls the direct jurisdiction of the european court ofjustice in the uk after brexit. a paper being published will insist such an arrangement would be "neither necessary nor appropriate" once britain has left the european union — adding there are other ways to resolve disputes. but critics say european judges could retain some influence. identity theft is reaching "epidemic levels", with almost 500 cases a day according to a leading fraud prevention organisation. cifas says there were nearly 90,000 cases in the first six months of this year — a 5% rise. id fraudsters steal personal information before using it to apply for loans or store cards. that's a summary of the latest bbc news — more at 10.00am. here's some sport now with leah boleto. england will be planning to yet another women's rugby world cup final, their fifth another women's rugby world cup final, theirfifth in a row. they only needed two tries in a tense semifinal with france. they won 20-3, semifinal with france. they won 20—3, and will defend their title against new zealand in belfast on saturday. the countdown and chaos has started ahead of this week and's fight between floyd mayweather and conor mcgregor. both men have alighted las vegas ahead of their showdown in the early hours of sunday morning. celtic are through to the group stages of the champions league. they got past astana 8—4/2 legs. liverpool could join them in tomorrow's draw, they play hoffenheim tonight, leading 2—1 from their first leg, hoffenheim tonight, leading 2—1 from theirfirst leg, and hoffenheim tonight, leading 2—1 from their first leg, and england's hoffenheim tonight, leading 2—1 from theirfirst leg, and england's key players are through to the semifinals of the euro hockey finals. the men could join them if they beat ireland this afternoon. president trump has again lashed out at what he calls "fake news", at a rally in arizona. he said the media had misrepresented his response to the violence at a far—right rally in virgina, which left one woman dead. anti—trump protesters who had gathered outside the rally clashed with police after the event had finished. release reportedly deployed tear gas, after some of the protesters threw some bottles and rocks. during his 80—minute speech, president trump went on to read out part of a speech he had given a few hours after the charlottesville violence, but he left out the controversial claim that "both sides" had to shoulder the blame. this is what he had to say about the media's coverage. but the point is that those were three different, there were two statement and one news conference. the words were perfect, they only ta ke the words were perfect, they only take out anything they can think of, and for the most part all they do is complain. but they don't put on those words, and they don't put on me saying those words. the media can attack me, but where i draw the line is when they attack you, which is what they do. when they attack the decency of our supporters. cheering these are truly dishonest people, and not all of them, not all of them, you have some very good reporters, you have some very fair journalists, but for the most part, honestly, these are really, really dishonest people, and they are bad people, and i really think they don't like our country, i really believe that. and i don't believe there are going to change, and that's why i do this. if they would change, i would that's why i do this. if they would change, iwould never say that's why i do this. if they would change, i would never say it. the only people giving a platform to these hate groups is the media is itself, and the fake news. cheering earlier, i spoke to ryan norton, who protested outside the rally. and austin smith, treasurer of arizona young republicans, who attended president trump's speech. donald trump was warm with his welcome here in the great state of arizona. it was very high energy. there was over, i think, 19,000 people came to this rally, as some people came to this rally, as some people may not know that donald trump started his presidential campaign in arizona, so it felt like a welcome home party for him. so it was a really, really good rally. ryan, you were on the outside, clearly a different perspective you. you were demonstrating against donald trump? yes. explain why. thanks for having me. i think as americans we have a right to speak up, a responsibility, even, when we see things we don't agree with in government, especially at the level of the president. and what we have seen over of the president. and what we have seen over the last seven months, to millions of oscar 0uma isjust unacceptable. what was the mood like on the streets, just explain the people who are watching?m on the streets, just explain the people who are watching? it was exuberant. it was exciting, it was energetic, it was electric. people we re energetic, it was electric. people were enthusiastic, people were energised. there was a lot of camaraderie. people were just excited to know that in a state like arizona, that is very conservative, they weren't alone. and in that setting it felt great to be able to stand up and say i don't agree with any of this. austin connelly do you object to the anti—trump protests that were taking place outside of the hall where you work? absolutely not. i may disagree with why they are protesting but i fully support their right to protest, as an american, and as a conservative, i wholeheartedly agree with the right to demonstration, the first amendment and free speech. that's what makes this a special place. even as when president 0bama was president, i know that a lot of people on my side would demonstrate against president 0bama, and that was right to do that, so the opposition, the more progressive side in politics, they have that same absolute god—given right here in arizona and the rest of the. many people who watched this address by donald trump said it was more like a campaign rally than a presidential speech. is that what it felt like inside the hall? i mean, he was criticising the media for a lot of his speech. it did feel like a campaign rally, but that's who donald trump is. he is not a very typical president, as we have seen in the last eight months, he is doing something a little bit different. i do think that those rallies do help him to push his agenda forward. he says he is with us, the people, and that is how he continues to move his messaging, and to stay in june continues to move his messaging, and to stay injune with the heartbeat of the american people, and that israeli what his rally was like on the inside, as you can see when he goes to west virginia, north carolina, ohio and as though similar type of rallies. that is what donald trump does and how he moves his agenda forward to get the american people behind it. similarly ronald reagan would do the same thing, when he was president, he would address the american people, to go to congress and to talk to their representatives to get a conservative agenda moving. austin, let me bring in ryan, he is smiling and raising his eyebrows, by all means speak to austin. well, no, i understand what he is saying and my only issue with it is what we have seen of donald trump is that he is much more of a candidate. he is not a president. austin talks about pushing his agenda forward, but what has that achieved? i mean, there has been no major legislation passed, and by all accounts any legislative agenda he has has failed, thus far. and that's when he is in control of both houses of congress. he comes to these rallies, i personally think, because he gets tired of people outside of the echo chamber questioning him. and i think he is a man that has got such a fragile ego that he needs that echo chamber in order to recharge as batteries, so that he can continue on. how would you respond to that, austin? i would say president 0bama did the exact same thing when he was president. he did it, too. ithink it isa president. he did it, too. ithink it is a good idea for any president to have rallies, to get back towards the people, to get behind what the american people want for an agenda, what donald trump ran on. he said he is not going to be a typical president. i would encourage more of it. it is like a politician appearing ina it. it is like a politician appearing in a town hall. it is the same sort of thing. go-ahead, ryan. the whole thing with the echo chambers and him needing to hear praise all the time, it's kind of bizarre that we are at a point where... he lied to you guys inside tonight. what did he lie about? if you were a protest in, how do you know what he lied about?” you were a protest in, how do you know what he lied about? i watched it when i came home. white what specifically did he lie about? he repeated his statement about cha rlottesville repeated his statement about charlottesville where he talked about people on both sides. he omitted that entire portion of his statement when he was saying it back to everybody. the main part of his speech that he got so much grief for, he'll —— completely omitted it. austen, was he right to do that? he repeated the speech he made after the event in charlottesville where one woman was killed when a car was driven into a crowd of anti—far—right protestors. he said at the time both sides were to blame for that. he admitted that. —— he omitted that from his speech last night. was that the right thing to do? no, i don't think it was the right thing to do. i am part of the conservative group that was very disappointed in donald trump that he had to repeat himself multiple times when he had the opportunity, or must they slam dunk scenario, to diminish both sides for their actions. i do think it is an opportunity for a donald trump to learn from this situation, that he has to move forward from something like this. u nfortu nately, forward from something like this. unfortunately, i hope we never see these types of acts again. it may happen. president has unique opportunity to make sure that a situation like this, if it happens again, he doesn't make the same type of mistake. identity theft is reaching "epidemic levels", according to a fraud prevention group, with personal details being stolen at a rate of almost 500 a day. people in their 30s are now most likely to be targeted by fraudsters, who often use the data to apply for loans and store cards. more than half of all fraud recorded by the data organisation cifas took place online. there are fears that police are struggling to cope with the scale of this crime, and there's a suggestion today they might need help from expert volunteers with expert it skills. let's speak now to david kirk, who is the chairman of the fraud advisory panel, who says the police response to cyber crime is inadequate. alexander hitchcock from the independent think tank reform, whose report out today says the police need to recruit 12,000 volunteers in order to tackle the issue. from worcester we have jacqui ryland, a fitness and glamour model who ended up being threatened after her identity was stolen online. and from durham we have detective constable tony murray from durham constabulary‘s fraud investigation department, which is one of the forces boosting its fraud and cyber crime teams. i want to start with you, jackie. you have had your identity stolen online. explain briefly what happened? basically, i have got a really high social media following. you name it, i have had fake profiles put on there. the really serious one was last year. someone used my pictures to sell to strangers to arrange what he called meetings. i would strangers to arrange what he called meetings. iwould never turn strangers to arrange what he called meetings. i would never turn up. they were based in america or canada. the people he had conned the money out of, came after me. they threaten my children. they threatened me. the police couldn't help me at all. were they are unwilling or unable? in their view they said because it was all happening on twitter and gmail, they find it extremely difficult to cooperate with the social media channels. so twitter they can't cooperate with. they said the e—mails were in broken english, so they were probably from abroad. they couldn't do anything about that. detective car or tony murray, that is an extreme example of identity theft being stolen. what are the more common examples? fraud hurts, thatis more common examples? fraud hurts, that is what comes across there. the more common examples are that people every day have their precious personal data stolen. that could be their addresses, their date of birth, their banking details. it is precious to us, but it is very valuable to fraudsters. when they get it, it enables other fraud. when people call, when people e—mail, when people text us, they can socially engineer because they already know us. you can buy someone's identity on the dark web for as little as 4p. it is important we protect ourselves. if on twitter or facebook, we need to protect our date of birth. is there any need to tell everyone on facebook what our date of birth is, so we can say happy birthday? if you have not got your privacy settings set correctly, that could advertise the date of birth to anyone. once they have got that information, what are they then using that information to do? they are using that information to take out loans, to take out cards. they are using that information so that when people ring us or e—mail people, they can know them. they can say, i'm your bank. i know your name, i know your account number. they can pretend to be the bank. they can pretend to be the bank. they can pretend to be the bank. they can use technology to coincide. they can use technology to coincide. they can use technology to coincide. they can spoof caller id to make it look like a genuine number on the telephone. they can pretend to be us and full other people and commit fraud, and therefore expose us do a risk of loss and others, and fund serious crime. 0r risk of loss and others, and fund serious crime. or they can pretend to be others and know us. it puts us all in dangerof to be others and know us. it puts us all in danger of risk and fraud and losing money. fraud really hurts. david, you have said the police response is inadequate. why do you think that? well, because there is such a huge epidemic of fraud in this area, that it needs more resource to deal with it. the problem the police have is that this is all entirely new. it has been new over the last ten or so years. it is a new type of fraud. it is a kind of activity which the police have got to get up to speed with and it needs a lot of resource. before i bring you in, alex, do you think, detective cost of a lorry, that police have the digital skills to deal with this kind of crime? —— detective cost of murray.|j deal with this kind of crime? —— detective cost of murray. i think we can do more. we can all improve. in durham there is a programme to increase the skills in relation to digital investigation so we can secure and preserve the evidence better. we should all look to improve. but to do that, it is fairly new. it is dynamic. but we need to all recognise and work together, all sectors, the public, the voluntary sector, the private sector. because together we are better. there are people with skill sets and if those people are available, the police service, you can volunteer for the police service, for the cybercrime —— cyber crime unit. they are very skilled. let's talk about that. alex, you are suggesting effectively 12,000 digital volunteers to help police? yes, fraud is part of a wider crime. 4796 yes, fraud is part of a wider crime. 47% of crime is done online today. the police need the skills to address this new threat. part of this is using volunteers who are experts. police use special co nsta bles experts. police use special constables currently. 0f experts. police use special constables currently. of 13,000, only 40 constables currently. 0f13,000, only 40 wrighty experts. we are calling for a radical increase in the number of these experts who can help forces, who can write programmes, and hopefully that is a better offer for the police forces trying to fight the crime and also people who are victims. david, is this the answer? aren't it experts could —— going to be busy going to work instead of volunteering?” think it is a nice idea. it is something that, as alex mentions, a special constable problem has been very effective. the problem with trying to line up 12,000 volunteers is you will have a security issue. you will want to know who these people are and whether they are using this as an opportunity to get behind the action. and cause more trouble. it is a nice idea and it should be pursued. but it will take some care to set it up. tony murray, does that sound sensible to you? what alex touches on is a brilliant idea. that means we need more volunteers, we need people to engage across all sectors, because together we can be better. what we need to do is know what the message is. if we had more people... durham police have trade volunteers —— train volunteers. they are giving the elderly tips about the five key enablers of fraud. they are advising them to keep them safe. that's what i wanted to get into, if i can. isn't this just about us all learning to be more internet savvy and not giving out those details, your birthday etc? that is a critical starting point. in 2013, the government watchdog said 80% of fraud online can be prevented through both ensuring that computers don't leave passwords and things like that, and people don't give them away. there is sophisticated fraud happening that does need police to be on top of it, to know what is going on. the dark web is an anonymous internet server. it is very difficult to track down where people are coming from and what they are doing. that is where we find these details dumped for people to pick up and use the devastating ends. yes, i quite agree with that. it is a difficult area to get into and to fight. it's a massive area that —— of fraud that is going on and we need to be educated. i need to be educated on how to change my password, for example. we all do. jackie, do you think you were a bit naive? it is really difficult. with myjob there are a lot of pictures online. i don't post might kids online. i don't post might kids online any more, purely because i don't want the pictures being used. i think the likes of twitter and instagram need to peak —— make it so that you only have one account. it would be easier to track these people down who are cat fishing. thank you all for speaking to us today. i'm gratefulfor your time. now the weather. it has been a pretty wet night across northern ireland and scotland. we have seen some flooding. still this morning we have a weather front draped across parts of scotland. northern parts of england as well. gradually that wiltshire north and east through the day. we have some sunshine to look forward to. much of the brighter conditions before the south and west you are. you can see the thicker cloud across northern part of the british isles. and some nice breaks for the south allowing some sunny spells to come through. that is where we are this morning. the rain band heavy at times, perhaps thundery. gradually tracking its way north. behind it, you can look forward to sunny spells. it will be breezy along coastal areas in the west, showers likely in northern ireland. for devon and cornwall, a lot of dry weather. sunshine coming through the cloud. still feeling humoured across east anglia and the south—east. temperatures around 22 celsius. cloudy for the midlands. writer spells in western scotland. we are likely to see showers in northern ireland. for a western scotland, a better end to the day. some brightness coming through before sunset. through tonight, the rain band will clear north and east. behind it, a fairly quiet night. clear skies. we will start to see more showers in northern ireland. parts of wales and the south—west. feeling less muggy than last night, with temperatures ranging between 12 and 14 celsius. tomorrow, a better day for all of us. some sunny spells but the risk of some showers the further north and west you are. further south, high—pressure bringing afine further south, high—pressure bringing a fine day. highs 17 to 22 celsius. as we head towards the end of the week, the weather still pretty decent. a lot of dry weather. the best of the brightness always across parts of the south and east. further north and west more cloud and sunny spells, rain in northern ireland and parts of scotland. as we head towards the weekend, a few showers on saturday. plenty of usable weather. sunny spells. much of the showers across parts of the north and west. sunday is looking drier and brighter. the foster family of a young woman who was abused by gangs as a child in rotherham tell us exclusively about the abuse she suffered and how the perpetrators are still at large. they were still there from the care system, until when she died at 35, and they are still there now. 0ut system, until when she died at 35, and they are still there now. out on the streets, i won't call them men, these perpetrators are still out there. we'll be looking at how much really has changed in rotherham in the next few minutes. should the government end of the european court of justice's should the government end of the european court ofjustice's direct jurisdiction over uk law? we would discuss how this could affect the eu as well as our lives. the first legal sale of rhino horn is due to be held in south africa today. the breeder holding the auction says it is the best way to save the endangered species act but conservationists say it will push them towards extinction. we will be speaking to both sides of the argument. good morning, it is one minute past 10am. let's get the news with a anita. valli princes william and harry have described their bewilderment when they encountered grieving crowds, on the day of their mother's funeral. speaking to a bbc documentary marking 20 years since the death of princess diana — they say walking behind her coffin had been a "family decision". police have used tear gas to disperse outside a rally in arizona. media said some anti—trump protesters had thrown bottles at police. footage shows some protest is being pushed backwards. president trump attack media reports of the disruption in charlottesville, calling it dishonest. this programme has learned that a long running investigation into a charity worker who helped expose the child sexual abuse scandal in rotherham is to be examined by the local government 0mbudsman. jayne senior has been investigated by rotherham council for a year, after a number of complaints. ms senior denies any wrongdoing and says it's a distraction from helping vulnerable young people in the town. i do not receive money for doing interviews. the only interview that i received a small amount of money for has gone to swinton lock. i don't and have not done this for money. somebody told them that i was earning a significant amount of money — well, i'm not. the government will today vow to end what it calls the "direct jurisdiction" of the european court ofjustice in the uk after brexit. a paper being published will insist such an arrangement would be "neither necessary nor appropriate" once britain has left the european union — adding there are other ways to resolve disputes. but critics say european judges could retain some influence. identity theft is reaching "epidemic levels", with almost 500 cases a day, according to a leading fraud prevention organisation. cifas says there were nearly 90,000 cases in the first six months of this year — a 5% rise. id fraudsters steal personal information before using it to apply for loans or store cards. danish police have identified a headless torso found south of copenhagen as the missing swedish journalist, kim wall. the authorities believe she died on board a homemade submarine. the craft‘s inventor, peter madsen, has been accused of negligent manslaughter. lot of you getting in touch about identity theft. jim on twitter said i had my bank account stolen and cleaned out. i tracked down the woman, they said ticket to my bank. why fraud volunteers? there was a suggestion may be 12,000 volunteers could help the police. she says there should be professionals employed and paid for by facebook, google, twitter and the banks. to continue to get in touch with us, using the hashtag victoria line tube is if you text, do remember you will be charged at the standard network rate. now some sport with leo. england will play new zealand in the final of the women's rugby world cup after a tense semifinal over france was that the final takes place in belfast where katherine downes is for us. a fifth world cup final offer england, this is incredible, isn't it? it is, a fifth world cup final but this is the final everyone in the women's game was hoping for, the two best teams in the world, england and new zealand going head—to—head for that title here in belfast on saturday. 20—3 the final score in that semifinal against france for england, which makes it sound one—sided but it certainly wasn't. england only one it really because of a watertight defence. they had to make 50 tackles in the first 15 minutes alone, just give you an idea of what a bruising encounter it was. in fact, it was the strength of the england defence that well france down. that gave england the opportunity just that well france down. that gave england the opportunityjust take their chances, though they were very few and far between. that's sarah bernd storck you can see at the moment only the real team effort. the whole pack pushing her over the line. meg jones's try at the final whistle was just a quick piece of opportunities, but 20—3, they are through to the final, and that means captain sarah hunter can finally start thinking perhaps about back—to—back world cup wins. obviously ourjob was to get here and get the win, and we set out to get to a world cup final and we have certainly done that. i think we will enjoy the performance tonight. we have said all along the way that you have said all along the way that you have two enjoy those little wins and the we have done that and tomorrow it will be back to square one. recover, review and move on for that matter game on saturday. so a tough, bruising encounterfor matter game on saturday. so a tough, bruising encounter for england. matter game on saturday. so a tough, bruising encounterfor england. in contrast, a delhi winter there —— fairly easy win for their opponents on saturday, new zealand, 45—12 against the usa, running in seven tries on the way. england now have the patch themselves up, recover and look ahead to saturday because it will be quite a final. also today, conor mcgregor and floyd mayweather have arrived in las vegas ahead of their fight mayweather have arrived in las vegas ahead of theirfight in mayweather have arrived in las vegas ahead of their fight in the early hours of sunday morning, uk time. mcgregor was working the crowd with tonnes of support for the irishman. the fight is yet to be a sell—out. a few thousand left, with the cheapest costing around £400. mayweather says he wants to give the fans more excitement. it is all about giving the fans what they want to see. i have been around the sport for so many years, and this is the last one. conor can talk the talk, can he walk the walk? we will have to wait to see, that is what makes this fight and matchup so intriguing. i have been off for two years, they feel like i have lost a few steps, so we would see. info book of celtic have booked their place in tomorrow's offer the group stages of the champions league, even though they lost the second leg 4—3, they won the play—off tie 8—4 overall. they will be amongst the bottom seeds of the draw aiming to reach the knockout stages for the first time since 2012. it is now three years since the jay report revealed the horrific scale of sexual exploitation of children in the south yorkshire town of rotherham. over the course of 15 years more than 1,400 children, some as young as 11, were subjected to trafficking, rape and torture by gangs of men who were predominantly of pakistani origin while the police and authorities failed to act. the report was seen by many as a watershed moment in changing how authorities would deal with abuse. but was it? the bbc‘s social affairs correspondent alison holt has reported many times on the rotherham grooming scandal and has now returned to the town for a special report for this programme. before we talk to alison, i should warn you that you may find the details of her film upsetting and it's not suitable if you have children at home for the holidays. allison, first of all, tell us what you fan when you return to rotherham? it is exactly three years ago this week that the scandal emerged. at that time we were being told that children were ignored, professionals tried to warn of what was going on being sidelined and information not being shared. there has been progress since then, no doubt. but, worryingly, i have also been hearing from a whistle—blower who has talked about the difficult last year she has had. and also i have been hearing about abuse cases, which seemed to underline just how difficult it is to change some deep rooted attitudes. rotherham in south yorkshire is a town trying to emerge from the darkest of times. it's exactly three years since a report concluded that, over a decade, more than 1,400 children were sexually exploited whilst the council and police looked the other way. jayne senior was a key whistle—blower who helped expose the scale of the abuse. last august, after complaints by a number of abuse survivors, rotherham council put her under investigation. speaking about it for the first time, she says it's taken a huge toll. here we are, nearly three years on, and i feel more vilified than some of the perpetrators in rotherham. that is how you feel at the moment, you feel vilified? absolutely, yeah. she's accused of making money from media appearances and sharing information inappropriately. but she only received details of the actual allegations last week after the bbc contacted the council. it devastates me. i do not receive money for doing interviews. i don't and have not done this for money. somebody told them that i was earning a significant amount of money — well, i'm not. former detective michael fowler is on the management committee of the charity where jayne senior works. we have policies and procedures to deal with allegations. they've deliberately bypassed those, even when we've asked them to stop. it just seems as though, you know, they want to attackjayne's character and discredit the work she's done. as a whistle—blower? as a whistle— blower. in response, rotherham council says it has a duty to robustly and fairly consider complaints and that it's appointed independent investigators. it also says it can't comment further. there have been some significant successes in the town, with major abusers being jailed, but there are also families who say it's still a struggle to get the help they need. this is when she were only a few months old. gemma roberts was first exploited whilst in a council—run children's home. her foster parents claim, as an adult, plagued by the same abusers, it was still difficult for her to get police help. the perpetrators that had got gemma on drugs, lent her money, manipulating her, were coming to the door, threatening with guns. police didn't come on two occasions, they came on one. she felt, like i felt, that she wasn't listened to. in february of this year, gemma died of a morphine overdose. she'd been waiting three weeks for the police to take her statement about being gang raped by her abusers. they were still there from the care system, still there until she died at 35, and they are still there now, out on the streets. south yorkshire police say they don't have details of the specific incidents and that they will work with her family. but gemma's death is a tragic reminder of the importance of learning from the past. both rotherham council and south yorkshire police have apologised in the past about the failings going back by the period covered by the] report. south yorkshire police say they are saddened by gemma's death and they will work with her family to try and understand what their particular concerns are. south yorkshire police also say there are many crimes that the family talk about, and all of the ones they have recorded they say have been investigated thoroughly and finalised. they also say that any incidents involving firearms are taken extremely seriously by the force. on jayne senior‘s taken extremely seriously by the force. onjayne senior‘s case, we have spoken to an abuse survivor who didn't want to take part in this piece, but i think one thing we do need to emphasise is that, after all that has happened in the past, with people, children, being ignored when they are talking about abuse, it is absolutely essential that any complaint that is made is to relieve investigated, whoever it is. and it will be for the investigators to look at the allegations and decide the rights and wrongs there. the question here is about the process, and we understand that the local government ombudsman is going to be investigating the way in which rotherham council has handled this complaint against jayne senior. rotherham council has handled this complaint againstjayne senior. we also know that, earlier this year, a police investigation into the complaints was dropped, it found no case to answer. there is also questions about whether enough lessons have been learned about the conduct of the police? those will be ongoing questions for anybody involved in a place like rotherham. someone who wrote reports for south yorkshire police, a series of reports that warned about what she was seeing, basically telling them about the exploitation. although there are independent police complaints commission investigations into officers 88 which are ongoing, the point she is making is that still she feels that no senior officer, nobody in the senior command team, has had to account for the decisions made at that point in time. she believes until that is done, we can't fully learn lessons. south yorkshire police say there have been significant improvements. all of this underlines the importance of actually understanding rather than learning from it. we all know too well that rather is not unique. we have had rochdale, oxford and most recently, newcastle, where ten days ago 19 people were convicted of sexual exploit asian charges. it shows how much we need to keep questioning this area. and if we are going to provide the protection that vulnerable children need, how much we need to learn in these situations. alison holt, thank you for bringing that report. as we've seen in our report, the authorities, who had ignored the problem, promised change. but three years on, how much has really happened? we're joined now by dr alan billings, the police and crime commissioner for south yorkshire. nazir afzal, the former chief crown prosecutor for the north west, whose work led to the rochdale grooming prosecutions. and aneeta prem, human rights activist for charity freedom, who work in educating children and teenagers on sex and sexual exploitation. thank you all forjoining us. anita, i want to start with you. anybody watching that film is going to see what a harrowing story gemma's story was. just one story. is this kind of abuse still going on now? u nfortu nately abuse still going on now? unfortunately it is. this is not unique and gemma's death can't be in vain. the fact you reported this and wasn't listened to i think it is really important that senior officers are made accountable for what happened at the time. i think it is very important when a young person anybody comes forward to put this kind of horrific case, people being trafficked, raped and tortured, that they are taken seriously and there is a complete chain of command where we know exactly what is going on, it can't be hidden away. too many of these cases are. nottingham. that case as well. there are many cases out there. we will talk about police failings and looking back. but let's look forward. do you think the police are changing the way they view these people? there was a time before the jay report they were almost seen as willing participants, these young girls. now being seen as victims? i think that is the big chains. one of the first things i did whenl chains. one of the first things i did when i became police and crime commissioner was to establish a panel of victims, survivors as they preferred to call themselves, and their families, so preferred to call themselves, and theirfamilies, soi preferred to call themselves, and their families, so i could learn about grooming, what it was, why it had happened and where the police federation work, and introduced them to the police. victims have been influencing the training the police have. we have brought agencies together. they are all located in one place. you have got the local authority, the nhs, barnardos and police all in the same building sharing information. and crucially, in south yorkshire there have been these prosecutions. 1400 girls, all fenders arrived there, they need to be brought to justice. fenders arrived there, they need to be brought tojustice. that is beginning to happen. five big trials with big sentences sends out an important message. snazzier, do you think enough is being done to protect fulham will people right now? let me pay tribute to doctor billings. he inherited the situation in south yorkshire and he has tried to put things in place to provide the victims with the voice they need. my senses there are is a substantial amount of complacency. surely we recognise there are massive resourcing issues. it does cost policing about £1 billion last year to investigate child sexual abuse. that will increase over the next four years. there are massive issues for those charities. there are many in the north that don't have the resources to provide the support from victims they need. i was talking to a survivor last night in rotherham. she said to me she is really concerned we are not dealing with the future. what about the future fenders? there is not enough going on in relation young boys or girls. —— all fenders. my sense is that we are making progress, absolutely. there are many cases going through the courts but the courts do not have the capacity to deal with the work coming their way. i feel like a stuck record, good progress but plenty more to do. my other concern is about what is happening within the communities themselves. they took a real shock, rightly so, three years ago when they learned of this report and what was happening. some sizeable work we nt was happening. some sizeable work went on for a while. then when the cameras went away and the broadcasters moved on, all of that died down. i'm sure tomorrow there will be sizeable amounts of work going on for a little while, but again the microscope and leaves town and they and up moving on to other priorities. i think it is relevant you talked about moving forward. people will be familiar that last week sarah champion, the rather mp, —— rathermp, week sarah champion, the rather mp, —— rather mp, she resigned. she said britain has a problem with british pakistani men raping and exploiting white girls. there, i said pakistani men raping and exploiting white girls. there, isaid it. does that make me racist or am ijust prepared to call out this horrifying problem for what it is? she then had to apologise. i apologise, some people will find that offensive, but it is important people know what he said. people say she is calling it right. why is she having to resign? do you think she was calling it out right now we stay scared to talk about race in this context? people are very nervous talking about race. we know in this case the men came from pakistani descent. but we can't say all pakistani men are perpetrators. we have to be really careful. but we need to look at education and go into schools, which we are doing, and talk to young men and women about how they can report sensibly and about women's rights. it is important we look at the next generation and how this is going to be dealt with. is a cultural problem? i have spoken out on this subject several times. what sarah said, i wouldn't have said it without the context. 80% of the child sex offenders in this country are white males. british pakistani men are disproportionately involved. sarah is only echoing what i have said for the best part of five years. she shouldn't have had to resign. we don't shoot the message “ messenger resign. we don't shoot the message —— messenger if we don't like the masses. we in the communities have to tackle this issue. it is notjust about policing education. we have the perpetrators. ultimately, we have got to challenge them on what they do. doctor billings, i want to ask you, because the whistle—blower who took part in that film has been told by people that children are still being abused. are you actively pursuing investigations into claims right now about children being abused in rotherham ? right now about children being abused in rotherham? yorkshire police are dealing with all of the current cases of abuse. there are a lot of them. more than 100 are currently being investigated. some of the things you are talking about are not recent cases. they are investigated as well. the national crime agency are doing that in south yorkshire. you have got 117 detectives from the national crime agency actively at work and rather ham —— rotherham. they have not been able to bring anything to trial yet. to get these things to trial, if they are not recent, you have no forensic evidence, you are dependent on what the victims say in court. and getting these vulnerable people and wrapping the care around them, bringing them to court, educating the prosecution, the cps. and educating judges as well as to how you conduct a case, where there may be one victim, their witnesses and perhaps nine barristers for the defendants, all having their aggressive questions. it is not easy. i want to ask you one more question before we leave this story. many people will want to know this. there has been criticism that none of the senior members of your force we re of the senior members of your force were cleared by the ipcc. why haven't more senior officers being held responsible for what some people say are quite clear failings? a lot of people ask that question in south yorkshire. it seems as if the senior leadership can get away with these things, but the more junior members of the force... these are difficult things to investigate. it takes resources. i don't know if too much time has now gone by. but there are people currently being investigated by the ipcc. i criticised the length of time that is taking. if people have done things that are wrong, the public should know about that, the victims should know about that, the victims should know. some of those will be exonerated. they need to be cleared because that is hanging over them as well. it is a complex and difficult situation in south yorkshire. thank you all forjoining smack. and if you have any concerns about what we've just covered, there's more information on the bbc action line. the number 0800 888 809 — calls are free and are open 24—hours a day, and there's a full list of support and organisations available at bbc. co. uk/actionline. still to come, social workers are warning of a worrying lack of foster homes. we talk to people in the industry who say this is the worst we have seen in years. the first legal sale of rhino horn is due to be held in south africa today. the seller claims it is the best way to co nse rve seller claims it is the best way to conserve the species. conservationists say it will push them towards extinction. we will talk to both sides of the argument. a labourmp is talk to both sides of the argument. a labour mp is calling for women only train carriages to avoid sexual harassment on public transport. we will talk to him and an agenda equality campaign. but first, the news. police in germany —— birmingham have obtained landmark court injunctions to break—up gangs. 17 people have been served with a legal order banning them from certain parts of the city and mixing with one another. princes william and harry have described their bewilderment when they encountered grieving crowds on they encountered grieving crowds on the day of their mother's funeral. speaking to a bbc documentary marking 20 years since the death of princess diana, they say walking behind her cough and had been a family decision. harry had previously said walking behind her coughing was something no child should be asked to do. this programme has learned a long—running investigation into a charity worker who helped expose the sexual abuse scandal in rotherham is to be examined by the local government ombudsman. jane senior has been investigated by rotherham council for a year after a number of complaints. she denies any wrongdoing and says it is a distraction from helping vulnerable young people. a powerful typhoon has made landfall in china, forcing thousands of people to evacuate their homes. hundreds of flights have been cancelled and businesses forced to close. winds near the centre of the storm were recorded at more than 120 miles per. that is a summary of the latest news. join me at 11am. the government is outlining how it wants to stop judges in european courts from being able to overrule the courts in the uk after brexit. at the moment, it's possible for some cases that have gone through the british courts system to be ruled on in the court ofjustice of the european union, which is based in luxembourg. adam fleming has been looking at the work the courts do. there are actually two courts here. the court ofjustice — that's where national courts can ask for eu laws to be clarified, and eu countries can get into trouble for breaking eu rules. and the general court, where decisions made by the european institutions can be challenged by countries, companies and individuals. it means all sorts of stuff comes up. for example, today's cases include sharing airline passengers' details with canada, which countries should process refugees, and something about a german cosmetics company. but remember, this is absolutely not the european court of human rights. that is totally different, totally separate. all these guys — and they are mainly guys who served here in the past — and nowadays every member state, gets at least one judge here. shall we go and see them in action? speaks french. this is every judgment from the 19505 until about 2010 in multiple languages. to supporters of this place, it's amazing — transnationaljustice in action. to critics, these are examples of foreign judges interfering in other countries. we have a stream of cases coming in, around about 700 cases every year. we have neither the time nor the inclination to sit around hatching some federalist plots. so where do we think this place will feature in the brexit negotiations? well, the eu wants a big future role for the ec], particularly when it comes to the rights of eu citizens living in the uk. the british government isn't quite so sure. anyway, case definitely not closed. let's talk to alfonso valero from nottingham trent university, who's an expert on european law. allie renison is from the institute of directors. and peter stockdale from the english bridge union, that's recently taken its case to the european court ofjustice over whether or not it's a sport. peter, let's talk about your experiences, first of all. why did you feel you need to go to the ec]? there is an eu directive that there should be no vat charged on the entry fee of sport, but there is no clear definition of sport. when the government most recently included their definition, they included bridge. but hmrc were not applying it, so it was referred to the european court for a clearer definition on what it meant by sport. so it ruled in your favour though, so you are presumably delighted? we are, there has been a recommendation, but it still needs to be approved in october. alfonzo, i want to bring you in because this isa i want to bring you in because this is a hugely corrugated issue, and people at home might be scratching their heads thinking, why is this releva nt to their heads thinking, why is this relevant to me and my everyday life? the role of the ec] as such is quite relevant, insofar as it rolls on the right situation for example to consumer legislation, data protection, and things as maybe it would seem originally as remote as the composition of chemical products. the ec] definitely has a significant impact. ballet, what are you concerned with the changes that the government is likely to propose in lighter brexit? i think the big question is what replaces it. currently under the ec] virtually anyone can challenge another entity under eu law and the concern is that if we look at some of the other models the government is potentially thinking about, they tend to deal with state to state dispute resolution, not necessarily affording the same ease of access and rights to pursue disputes. of course any european citizens who remain hereafter brexit will still bea remain hereafter brexit will still be a will to use the court? yes. they will still be to use the british court. there was some debate on the ec] jurisdiction on citizen rights currently here going forward, whether or not the ec] needs to have a rather that particular issue. within the legal and academic community some people think that the eu has lightly overshot what it is asking for in that respect, but the wider question is who interprets the withdrawal agreement once we leave the eu, that is a much bigger question. alphonso, do you see there could be any benefit to the government's proposals, the idea of getting rid of the ec] playing a role in these everyday decisions? one benefit would be the fact that british legal courts tend to be a bit faster in their resolution. if you need to refer a question to the ecj you need to refer a question to the ec] in luxembourg where sometimes it is true there could be a delay of years in obtaining a decision. the other consideration is whether there has on the other hand a disadvantage for the uk citizens of the interpretation by the uk courts which may differ substantially from the ec]. peter, if you had not been able to go to the european court of justice, resume the blue this would have meant he would have this had to start paying vat for bridge and it would cost your sport? we have been paying vat, so hopefully going forward there will be no vat charged on bridge activities, making it cheaper for everyone to take part, and hopefully we can make wider involvement in fridge through this reduction in costs. thank you for joining us. —— in bridge. still to come, the first legal sale of rhino horn is due to be held in south africa today, but is at the right way to stop poaching? there is a warning from the uk social workers about a worrying number of foster homes, which are currently, i don't know why we are still on pictures of rhino horn, but hopefully we can get back to this. current figures show there is a shortage of around 7,500 — and the british association of social workers says this does not account for the complexity of matching children with an appropriate carer who suits their needs. some staff within the industry have told this programme the availability of foster homes is the worst they've seen in years — particularly when working with teenagers, those with disabilities or siblings. in extreme cases they're even struggling to place babies. charities are keen to stress that a child will always have a foster home, but it may not be the right home for them which means they may be frequently moved around which can be extremely distressing. joining us now, we have two foster carers — margaret akpewrene. and blair mortimer — who is also a social worker and recruits foster carers. wayne reid — who is from british association of social workers and is their fostering specialist. and — chloe cockette — who is from become, a charity for children in care. thank you all for coming to talk to us today. margaret, i want to start by speaking to you about your experiences as a foster carer, because some people may think this is hugely challenging, you could form a bond with this child and then they can leave you, which is heartbreaking, presumably? yes, it can be heartbreaking. i started fostering eight years ago with an organisation called action for children. my experience of working with fostering, it has been quite rewarding. obviously there are lots of challenges and issues surrounding the work that i do but it is something i have always wanted to do, and i'd took it on, i embraced it, knowing that i can offer a home toa it, knowing that i can offer a home to a young person that needs kind of guidance and love. fanatics actually what you have done and it has been a huge success story for your foster daughter. yes, it has done. i have a foster child who came to me at 13. she is now 18. she is now going on to university. her case was very convex when she first came. but working with my supervisor, social workers and all the professionals involved with her care over the yea rs, involved with her care over the years, we've turned things around for her, and to be fair she has also really turn things around for herself. being the environment with herself. being the environment with her friends herself. being the environment with herfriends and herself. being the environment with her friends and family helping to support me with his children, i hope andi support me with his children, i hope and i think that i've provided a safe and fun environment for her, and she can go on to do better things for herself. blair, hello, i had to guess who you were, i will bring you in on a moment, but blair, you are also a foster carer. have your experiences been equally positive? there must be some challenging times as a foster carer. certainly there are challenges but i think overall, doing it over 90 years now, overwhelmingly it has been positive. even the challenges when you are able to look back at those, you can see how there is great learning in that, you can readjust and adjust the support that is around you and also work better with the services, social workers, the services for the young people. but overwhelmingly fostering for me has been very, very positive. wayne, what do you think puts people off? there are lots of barriers. in terms of work, the image of foster carers, that can be avoided in terms of what the general public know about fostering, so people kind of make their own fostering, so people kind of make theirown minds up. fostering, so people kind of make their own minds up. i think we need to promote more of a positive image about what the role entails. it can be very rewarding. definitely. the support is vital for foster carers, they do an amazing job, and if we can provide that support the foster carers, and foster carers all of them felt supported, that will really help. what support do you get isa really help. what support do you get is a foster carer? the organisation i work for, action for children, there is a loss of support there for there is a loss of support there for the foster carers. we have support group, professionaltraining the foster carers. we have support group, professional training is about issues surrounding what we do. there is also friends and family who initially were a bit sceptical about me doing thisjob, because of the challenges and issues that comes with it, but now everyone has embraced it and they are very supportive. that helps. if i want to ta ke supportive. that helps. if i want to take a respite for myself, go on holiday orjust take a respite for myself, go on holiday or just have take a respite for myself, go on holiday orjust have a night out, all of that, i have a good support network. i would agree with that but the key is to encourage people to bring around support for themselves as well. i work for camden as a social worker and our ethos is about caring for our care workers, encouraging them to build around it. providing support groups for them, and in camera during them to support each other as well. if they are without a placement for a period of time, looking at how they can support each other. and also i think one of the things that needs to happen as well is looking at birth children as well, and how agencies and local authorities can work with birth children and acknowledge the impact of fostering on them as well. i think that will help stabilising placement and encourage carers to continue caring for longer. can you explain what happened for example if a child comes to you, how quickly do they leave you? what many people think is if i'm welcoming a child into our home, i am reading here, one foster carer said we have had our hearts broken several times when children and babies move on but we don't have any plans to stop. how much notice before a child would go to another home? sorry to interrupt, fostering can be very weird, very predictable, short—term placements can become long—term and vice versa. a lot of that the pens around the children's circumstances themselves, they can change by quickly with very short notice. what i would say is that foster carers are prepared. they are given preparation training, support, as margaret and blair have alluded to. there are mechanisms already there to support them at that transition but ultimately it does tug at heartstrings when children move on. the way that you engage with young people come you make those connections. you have to. that is pretty much what we want from foster care, you have to be to support them with dealing with that also. explain to people watching, chloe, the difference that a foster home, a caring, supportive, wonderful foster home, a caring, supportive, wonderfulfoster home home, a caring, supportive, wonderful foster home can make to a child? specific wonderful foster home can make to a child ? specific examples. wonderful foster home can make to a child? specific examples. it gives children a childhood. a good foster home will prepare a child for adult life and give them the family support and help them to build relationships. these are children who have been brought into care because they have had a tough time and they deserve the very best, and the very burst —— very best foster ca re rs the very burst —— very best foster carers will provide them with love and care and with support they will enable them to stabilise, enable them to lend budgeting skills, enable them to make friends and play and do the things we would want for our own children. that is the really important thing, that actually foster ca re important thing, that actually foster care enables children to be kids, and to recoverfor the foster care enables children to be kids, and to recover for the trauma they have experienced before coming into care. some people watching this may see they have seen reports on the news that certain ethnicities have not been able to adopt, what is it like in fostering, are there restrictions on ethnicity, race, religion, having a full—time job for example? some of that is provide a specific. depending whether you foster for a private agency or a volu nta ry foster for a private agency or a voluntary agency, there may be different requirements they have. there are no legal requirements about that but there may be provider requirements. anybody can foster now. as long as you are determined to do it. single people. married couples. so there are no restrictions, you can be a single person who has never had a child? yes. wie the important thing is fostering is not something that comes to be both, it grows within people. my suggestion would be is if anyone sitting at home has ever wa nted anyone sitting at home has ever wanted to foster, you have to get on the phone to your local authority. wherever your local authority is, phone in, meet with the team, go to an information session, because actually there is very, very little restriction in who can foster. the challenge, really, is can you make yourself available, the time needed, and build the support around? start talking to people around you about what your intentions are, and you will actually find you will be really supported. many people say i would love to foster, i just am really supported. many people say i would love to foster, ijust am not ina would love to foster, ijust am not in a position to do that, but with a future weeks and maybe just ending a few months or maybe a yearjust looking at work and other things, you put yourself into a position where you then can foster. the it is a professional role. most people think it is a case of caring for a child. but it is more than that. you are seen as a professional. and you get paid, of course. that can be an issue for some people perhaps if they don't have placements. alluding to what blair has been saying, that can be an issue potentially if they have bills to pay etc and they don't have a child emplacement. there is a balance. the pay is an enabler. it enables us to provide for the children. that is sometimes an issue. what are we looking at, a couple of hundred quid a week? issue. what are we looking at, a couple of hundred quid a week7m varies. depends on the needs of the child. i could talk to promote -- so much longer but i'm being told i have to move on. thank you for coming in to speak to us. earlier this month, a 17—year—old girl was assaulted by two different men on a train journey between newquay and plymouth. it's part of a rising trend of violence against women on public transport. that has led the labour frontbencher, chris williamson, to call for women—only train carriages. he said these could offer a "safe space for women". but not everyone thinks this is the right solution. to discuss this, chris williamson joins me from derby. also we are joined by laura bates from everyday sexism. shejoins us joined by laura bates from everyday sexism. she joins us from joined by laura bates from everyday sexism. shejoins us from north london. thank you to both of you. chris, tell us more about these proposals? live called for is a consultation on the suggestion. —— all i have called for. it is something that is utilised in different countries around the world. we have seen a 150% increase in assaults on women on trains in five years. you mentioned a case in the introduction. it seems to me it is worth considering, consulting on it. but more importantly, we need is to have more guards on trains, better security. this is what the industrial dispute is about on southern trains. southern trains are looking to introduce driver only trains. that would be a retrograde step. we need better security, more guards. this might be an additional idea that is worth exploring. i'm not saying it should be done. it will be down to whether there is support for it. if there is support for it, providing an additional carriers to provide that safe space for people if they wanted it, is worth looking at. laura? i really understand the suggestion and i think it's very well—meaning. for immediate risks sending a damaging message, which is if we segregate women, if we curtail their movements, constrain their freedom, in response to sexual violence, we are sending the message that it is inevitable, that men will always harass and assault women. and the only answer is to constrain women's movements, instead of tackling the problem aggressively by making sure that the perpetrators are brought to justice. the rise we are seeing in the reported number of sexual offe nces the reported number of sexual offences corresponds with a period offences corresponds with a period of good work being done by the british transport police and transport for london, in which they are focused on tackling perpetrators, on increasing plainclothes officers on days of action and patrols. and on increasing victim confidence in reporting. while those figures show there is a massive problem, a huge issue that needs to be tackled, that rise doesn't necessarily mean the problem is increasing exponentially. it actually shows more people feel they are able to come forward because they are seeing this tackled and trained officers are taking the problem seriously. laura, couldn't you may do both, tackle the problem and also have these women only carriages? certainly toggling from personal experience, i'm sure women who have —— watching this have got ona train who have —— watching this have got on a train late at night, maybe a friday night, lots of people that had drinks and men have been inappropriate, got too close, made you feel uncomfortable. wouldn't it just be good even if it was just in the evenings to say, women can sit in here, they don't have to worry?” do understand that point of view. that is a sticking plaster rather thana that is a sticking plaster rather than a solution. it has to be about the sending a clear message that this issue, which is already so normalised, could be further normalised, could be further normalised by the idea that women should simply go somewhere else because it will always happen. it is so important that we tackle this issue in the same way we tackle other forms of abuse on transport. in the same way people are experiencing racist abuse, islamophobia racist abuse. segregation is not the answer. it risks sending in normalising message, i think. risks sending in normalising message, ithink. as risks sending in normalising message, i think. as someone who has been assaulted on public transport, the idea that if that happened when ididn't the idea that if that happened when i didn't have and be in a women only carriage but that carriage was available, could cause further complications. how do we treat someone assaulted in that situation? i want to get chris williamson's response. lots of people getting in touch. jonathan said, how could possibly be implemented in force as men and women walk to a coach to find a seat? it's a step backwards, says gary. joy said, we had these backin says gary. joy said, we had these back in the 1960s. i was a schoolgirl who travelled to school by train. i even remember the number of times i was assaulted or men exposed themselves. we dealt with it. it's not right or normal mob of stilettos and elbows did come in useful. as i've already said, we need to push for behaviour change, and that starting schools. we need to get into a position where everybody can travel on public transport in complete safety. that requires greater investment in more security, more guards on trains. this idea is one that is used in other parts of the world. and it does merit, i think, consultation. and it might be, judging by the calls that you have had, and indeed the discussion that is taking place on social media, they seem to be more people saying it is the wrong way to go. i'm fine with that. i'm not saying we should go down this road. i'm really suggesting we consult on it. we need to be mindful of the fact we have seen a huge increase in attacks on women on trains and we need to tackle that. and if this debate can result in a move away from taking security away from stations and the suggestion that we don't need guards on trains, thenit that we don't need guards on trains, then it will have served a useful purpose. thank you both. a controversial auction of rhino horns takes place in south africa today. the event is an attempt to reduce poaching because the horns have apparently been safely stripped by a vet to prevent gunmen harming the animals. unlike elephant tusks, the horns of a rhinoceros grow back if cut off properly. the auction has been given the go—ahead following a ruling by south africa's constitutional court which allowed for domestic trade of rhino horns, despite the global ban. john hume is the south african game keeper who's holding the auction. he says the only reason to hold the auction was because the cost of keeping rhinos — and protecting them from poachers — was exorbitant there is only one way that i will pay for this cost. that is to sell my rhino horn and to use that money to protect my rhino. so to me, the people who are stopping me from selling my rhino horn and protecting my rhino, may as well be joined with the poachers, because they will kill my rhino. let's speak to two people who are on opposite ends of the argument on this issue. markjones is vet and also an associate director of the born free foundation. he joins us via videophone. as does professor douglas mcmillan, who's a professor of conservation and applied resource economics at the university of kent. mark, do you think this is sending out the right message about rhino worn? good morning. no. we think this is a disastrous step for rhinos. rhinos are struggling. there are rhinos. rhinos are struggling. there a re less rhinos. rhinos are struggling. there are less than 30,000 remaining in parts —— across the world. they are being seriously threatened by poaching further horns. more than 6000 have been virtually slaughtered by poachers in south africa in less than a decade. rhino poaching is on the rise in other countries such as namibia and zimbabwe. we don't believe that legalising the trade in rhino horn is any kind of answer to this problem. let's here from professor mcmillan. he clearly does think this is the right way forward. speak to mark. ijust think this is the right way forward. speak to mark. i just feel you think this is the right way forward. speak to mark. ijust feelyou made a very good case for why the poaching ban is not working. it is leading the —— leading to the deaths of many rhinos and people. the price of many rhinos and people. the price of right —— rhino horn would fall. that means the incentives to ports would decline. furthermore, ithink demand for a rhino worn may well fall as well. in vietnam, the actual fa ct fall as well. in vietnam, the actual fact it is illegal is an attraction to consumers. this is from the research we have done. a legal trade will solve the problem long—term. mark, you are shaking your head. well, previous attempts to deal with wildlife poaching crises by opening up wildlife poaching crises by opening up legal trade have failed miserably. the most recent one is the sale of elephant ivory. that has been followed by some of the worst declines in elephant populations ever seen, with more than 150,000 african elephants killed by poachers since 2012. there is no reason to think that rhinos will fare any better if we legitimise trade. we have a really poor understanding of the nature of the man for a rhino horn in asia. legalising markets sends mixed messages to consumers, undermining the public education programmes aimed at preventing people are persuading people not to buy horn. professor mcmillan, is the difference for you the fact that with rhinos, if you cut of the horn correctly, it grows back, therefore you are not killing the animal, you are keeping the trade going the the animal is still alive? absolutely. the legal trade will save rhino lives and save them from horrible deaths. you can say we need to end demand but that is much more difficult to do than to say. our evidence suggests, and we have just done work in vietnam with rhino worn users, they would prefer to buy, to pay more for horn, removed humanely from live rhino, than they would illegal poached rhino horn. that is an important observation. they won the support to look after rhinos but to have the rhino horn. fascinating. thank you for speaking to us. bbc newsroom live is coming up next. thank you for your company today. if you want to get in touch, the hash tag is victoria life. have a good day. good morning. we currently have some thunderstorms running through central and northern parts of england. they should clear in the next couple of hours. we also have sunny spells, the best in parts of the south and east. further notice —— north across scotland, rain. that is where we are currently. this rain band tracking its way north and east, lingering across eastern scotland. further south and west, the best of the drier and brighter weather, with temperatures ranging from 14 to 23. tonight, the rain will clear into the north sea. a lot of dry weather to look forward to. overnight, showers in northern ireland and western parts of wales. as we head into tomorrow, we can look forward to sunshine but the risk of showers. much of the showers in the north and west. temperatures between 13 and 22. a lot of settled weather to look forward to as we head towards the end of the week but more clout. —— cloud. this is bbc news, and these are the top stories developing at 11: the european court ofjustice will not have directjurisdiction over the uk after brexit, a government policy paper will say. prince harry tells the bbc he's very glad he walked behind princess diana's coffin at her funeral 20 years ago. donald trump lashes out at the media as he defends his handling of the violence in charlottesville. an investigation into a charity worker who helped expose the child sexual abuse scandal in rotherham is to be examined by the local government ombudsman. also coming up — transport secretary chris grayling says the north of england should solve its own regional transport problems. the comments come ahead of a transport summit in the region

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