or other asian muslim origin is well—established. today, ken macdonald, a former director of public prosecutions, said it is "a disease of racism and sexism that will not abate until it is confronted". labour mp sarah champion said that "people are more afraid to be called a racist than they are afraid to be wrong about calling out child abuse", which has inhibited exposure of wrong—doing. she asked, "why are we not commissioning research to see what is going on and how we need to change what is going on, so that it never happens again?". they're good questions, so we are going to ask them for the first part of the programme this evening. first, rabiya limbada reports from oxford. some of the 18 men and one woman convicted of abusing girls in newcastle. the men convicted were mainly british—born, and came from bangladeshi, pakistani, indian, iraqi, iranian and turkish communities. a report in 2011 by the child exploitation and online protection centre identified over 2000 potential localised grooming offenders, ethnicity data was only available for one third. of these, 49% were white, and 46% asian. these figures include both group and individual cases of grooming. but, they are stark when you consider the uk asian population is round 7%. i can hear a woman getting slapped about. a police call made by a guest who was is concerned about what he could hear in the room next door to him in exford. in 2013 seven men were jailed for abusing six girls in oxford over an eight year period. in that case, known as 0peration bullfinch, two of men were of east african origin and five pakistani. a serious case review in 2015 called for research into why a significant proportion of people convicted in these kinds of cases are of pakistani and or muslim heritage. so far, that research has a been forthcoming. the muslim community in oxford are still trying to answer those question, themselves. i think quite often their fathers are disconnected from what it is is like to grow up in england. they have come from back home, and so these boys are trying to navigate themselves through an awful lot of emotions and challenges, and their fathers can't give them the right guidance or the right advice. so they find it elsewhere, and often that leads to bad company. here, many of the victims of the grooming gang we re picked up. girls as young adds 11 plied with alcohol and drugs and subjected to the most appalling sexual abuse. there have been efforts by community groups and religious leaders to get people to talk openly about what happened. many say not enough has been done. we should stop pussyfooting about and says these are asian men, they japanese, korean, malaysian? they are muslim of pakistani extraction, bangladeshi descent, turkish connections, whatever, why are we afraid to say they are muslim? who why are we being politically correct? unless we really tackle this head on, we are not going to solve this. ok, but whose responsibility is this is this? we the muslim community have a great responsibility to condemn this in public. for example, there are 2000 mosques in this country. how many do you think tomorrow will be nameling and shaming all of those people tomorrow? as you heard, the statistics say that asians are about 50% more likely to be convicted of a sexual offence than the rest of the population. for street grooming offences more specifically, the disproportion is much higher. but before we move on, a quick statistical point. it's dodgy to make ethnic or religious generalisations comparing muslims and non—muslims, say, on the basis of a tiny populations of offenders. even if a muslim man was ten times more likely to be convicted of a sexual offence than a non—muslim — which he's not — the numbers are low in both groups. you are literally talking about comparing a population that is 99.996% non—offending, with a population that is 99.96% non—offending. so few people offend in both groups. you can double the number in one group, and it makes little difference to the group overall. so you have to be careful about sweeping judgments on the differences between these groups. however, that being said, a lot of people think that the numbers understate important cultural characteristics of different religions and that the muslim community more widely has problems to deal with. so with me now is a panel, exclusively muslim, to work through the issues. the anti—extremism campaigner, anira khokhar, the founder of british muslim youth muhbeen hussain, the film—maker and journalist mobeen azhar and saba zaman, a journalist based in bristol. good evening. i want to started where we are framing this 0k by saying we have a muslim panel discuss bhag is a muslim problem. muhbeen. is that, do you think that is a problem? no we are framing it incorrectly. we have had a guy come on in the earlier piece saying it is not japanese or these different culture, islam is a religion of all cultures, the largest muslim population in the world is indonesia, to say this is a muslim problem. these grooming gangs were individuals that were using alcohol, drugs and having sessions exploiting these young girl. i don't know what is islamic about drinking alcohol and exploiting young girls. you want to separate it from the religion? do the rest of you feel that? he has a fair point. i this particular case, there are cultural parallels that are being made, and religious parallels, across the media, generally, there are no religious parallel has been made so in your intro it is interesting. what i do find interesting is we have an all—muslim panel here, but this situation is notjust exclusively muslim communities. it is across all, but it doesn't mean it doesn't happen and it needs to be addressed. what do you feel? there is a thing here, there is a pattern, that reoccurring whenever this happen — i am sure you can relate to this. when you hear these stories breaking, you wince when you hear muslim names, and as a community, we are really uncomfortable and really used to reacting. we are used to reacting and saying this is nothing do with us our or community. i don't think anyone in their right mind would say this is a theological issue, they are doing this because they are good muslims. of course, no—one would say that. having said that, we have to acknowledge that sex and sexuality and gender and respect for the opposite gender, are issues within certain parts of the south asian community, the arab community and large sections of the muslim community. these are things that we have to discuss, in our communities. and we have seen this pattern, in newcastle and rotherham and we can't shy away from these issues. i go back to you on that. do you agree with that? it is a different way of framing it, but do you buy what is being said? partially we have to look at this, but recognise we are dealing with it. let me give you a clear image of what happened in rotherham. when the rotherham grooming scandal came about the british muslim youth organised the first demonstration against these criminals that were claiming to be from our community. we demonstrated. you will never see the far right come out againstjimmy savile. i have not see the edl outside the bbc studios. we have people coming out. in fact it was a pakistani man in rochdale who recognised these people and it came out. help us out. in between these different interpretations of how we frame the problem are are you? the labelling is incorrect. i don't think it is a muslim problem, as the rest of the panel have suggested — and we happen to be muslims. it would have been nice to have other religions because it is notjust the muslim community who have the issue, we have seen many cases where there has been white groups, that have been grooming and there has been young children being raped, but we don't label them as white christian grooming gangs. we label them by name or we label them as just a group. and i think it is unfair that that is not the same, these are criminals at the end of the day. they should be treated like that. but even if they weren't, as i have seen across the board, generally, the media hasn't called it out as a muslim—specific case in this particular case, today. i mentioned it earlier, i think when even if it is not, due the names and the cultural associations there are cultural assumptions that are made when there are people from certain communities with certain names backgrounds, this is from the south asian diaspora. it is hard to separate that. it does exist. can i ask you, start us off on this, about the cultural issues, attitudes to sex — you kind of raised this. because you clearly think there is a bit of an issue. of course there is. it made a programme a few i think about a year ago called the muslim sex doctor. and i spent time shadowing an imam working in this field. and he was very open, he would tell me within, and i know this, you guys must know this, from within the pakistani community there are issues in terms of the narrow definition of the kind of women who deserve respect. this is a cultural thing, it is not a religious thing but we, we will use this word that means "honour". and we will see a woman who is wearing the hijab, who cooks and cleans, who is the queen of the home — she deserves respect. now what happens then, when you have people who are raised in those environments, and they getjobs as taxi drivers and working in takeaways, and theyjoin the night—time economy. the night—time economy is an ongoing theme in all these case, and you have these men who have grown up in this climate, who all of a sudden are face to face with women who don't fit that model. so women who might like a drink. 0r women who wear short skirts, or are quite loud. and that doesn't fit with their definition of a person that deserves respect. that is a problem. you have to address that. and following on from that. i think there is an issue within not just the pakistani but the south asian community in terms of women having that level of respect. so for example, you know, in a family, let us say there is a son and daughter, the son will allowed to go outside, stay out to about 10pm, possibly have a girlfriend, whereas the girls have to stay at home. if you are bringing children up in that mind set, they only know they have to respect that individual in the house, mother, daughter. that could be a sweeping generalisation as well. you're conflating issues here. i do think, i do think that this is something that the pakistani community, the south asian community need to look into. because as you said, the word "honour" is a burden on girls mainly. and so they have to live with that, anything they do is reflective on the whole family and the community. i don't think it is fair. no there is. there is an issue. but let us not conflate one issue with another issue. there are these men, and we are talking about a criminal mind—set of individuals, who like people likejimmy savile live two lifestyle, they live a public lifestyle where they want to show themselves as good community member, the same time when people say they only see certain women as fair game, let us be honest, if you look at the report, there were findings on the jay report, they found 150 young girls out of the 11100 were pakistani girls. the problem is these people aren't differentiating — because they are sick men — but pakistani girls, are finding it very difficult to speak out, these are very sick men. difficult to speak out. i am glad you raised that, because is there an issue round the ability to converse, or to come forward and say i have been attacked or abused, or i have been raped within the muslim community, forget the white girl issue. i can talk about the south asian community diaspora generally. i am also from a community. from the first generational perspective it has been something we don't necessarily talk about because there is the concept of honour, but it is changing and this group... is it? it is changing. there are people, there are practitioners on ground, who are actually working with women, and i can say it is not an exclusive muslim issue, or a south asian issue, but there is sometimes generally from the first generation that it was slightly difficult. there is a sense of keeping the honour of the community or protecting women, not because we are protecting the men, but sometimes that is how it folds out. basically covering up crime or burying crime. in the rotherham case we know the community did go forward and speak to police. the police did not speak to the victims either but i agree the police need help from the community and we need to be active and address these issues ourselves. completely — i think it is changing but it is achingly slow. what i mean by that, and again, i'm sure you guys can relate, growing up, i grew up in huddersfield in yorkshire, i went to mosque regularly — i know that my experiences did not match up with the conversations at the mosque. if you are a young man and you want to talk about contraception or you want to talk about certain feelings, or you just want to talk about sex, you're not going to get that guidance from the mosque. that is the last place. because it is a religious place. notjust in terms of it being a religious place but in terms of, look at the state of our mosques, the majority of them still today are run by imams who don't even speak the local language. but they also don't go out and groom young girls. but what i'm saying and this is really important, if you were raised in an environment where you can't talk about things like sex, that is going to lead to problems. isn't that a cultural dichotomy? it's not going back to the point, it is not islamic. you've all agreed that if there's a problem, it's cultural, but the question is, let's pin down what the cultural problem is. what i mean is i'm trying... we have ruled out religion at least, but at least some argue it is cultural. from my own experiences, one issue that i personally have not only come across on a personal level but also have seen as i've been working nationally is the fact that sometimes the police worries about community tensions and so they are not willing to always go in and talk to the community and talk to the community leaders who i call self—appointed because most of them are self appointed leaders, and actually discuss things that are happening. that is the argument effectively, that political correctness gets in the way of policing or enforcing or sorting out some of the problems. i'm going to have to come in here, i think that is the biggest lie that is ever told, the biggest excuse — you ask any pakistani male going into an airport whether they don't stop and search them because of racism. you are more likely to be stopped and searched, and that is preconditioned thinking that this individual may be a criminal. so there's no racism in that pakistani drug dealers. why is there racism in this? i tell you why, we have been fighting this case for three years with south yorkshire police and only now have they admitted there was no political correctness in the rotherham issue and it was their own internal failings because what happened is these officers did not believe the young girls because they were from working—class backgrounds. that problem is widely recognised. but it's racism, why are you stopping and searching pakistani males like never before in airports? you are not racist then. can i ask whether — because a lot of people think part of the solution to all of this will be for a much more open conversation, more brutally honest, more openness within the community and between communities but that is going to mean sometimes things like this. we are going to gather muslims around and ask if there is a muslim issue. i think that is very facile to say that. does that ever scare you? i think the idea of gathering muslims around, you know, i think we are starting to see for example this imam that i shadowed, he was organising conferences to talk about sex which is not heard of in the muslim community and i think that's a great thing to do. but the muslim community has to lead on that and it has onlyjust started to happen. i think it is important but where we have various voices from various communities but we are not all representatives. no one is. we are a huge diaspora communities and we can speak as individuals. i would also like to make a parallel... very briefly. i know we ruled out faith earlier and we talk about the islamic context and islam as a sense of justice. this isn't even about an islamic context, it is about young girls getting justice for a crime committed against them, just as if the church, when it comes to bishops and grooming young boys, i mean, that is not necessarily... that is the same paradigm and the same sense... we need to leave it there. we started the conversation and i really appreciate you all coming in and having it. thank you forjoining us. there has been quite a lot of complaining about british airways this year. not perhaps as much as united airlines, obviously, but with it problems and a lack of free short—haul sandwiches, many say the once great flag carrier has gone off the rails, or the right flight path. hasit? sometimes when consumers grumble, it's a sign of a useless company. sometimes though, it's a sign of a company that is determined not to lose money by giving away things that consumers don't want to pay for. our business editor, helen thomas, has been looking at which it is, on the case of the airline formerly known as the world's favourite. music: "flower duet (lakme) " — delibes. worst ever business class experience. i honestly didn't think this actually happened, especially on british bloody airways. might as well have booked easyjet. everyone‘s a critic nowadays and that's a problem if you were once the world's favourite airline. british airways has been having a turbulent time. it started last year with sandwich—gate, the decision to drop free food and drink on short flights. then came may's massive it failure and with it, the accusation that snacks and beverages weren't the only place that cost—cutting had gone too far. now, cabin crew strikes over low pay. my concern is they are cruising towards a crisis right now by ignoring the customer and going too far in their cost—cutting. by focusing solely on cost and not on the benefits of investment in product and reliability and labour relations provide, ba risks alienating its passengers, including, especially, the higher value customers who fly for business and pay higher fares. ba has lost altitude in the airline rankings. this year's top ten is dominated by asian and middle eastern carriers. down the list, ba at number a0. it last topped the rankings in 2006. it's not exactly news that air travel‘s changed since the days when british airways and british engineering stood for cutting—edge glamour. still, there's a sense that the overall ba experience has fallen some way since it sold itself on a distinctly british quality of service. but that is partly by design. ba's management have charted a particular course for the airline. it faces fierce competition from the likes of ryanair and easyjet. the boss, alex cruise, has talked about economy travel as a commodity product, or one where price is really the only thing that matters. and actually, it is a strategy that has served the business pretty well so far. airlines are a notoriously tough place to make money. but british airways' profits have soared to record levels. theyjumped again in the first half of this year. and that has helped its owner, international consolidated airlines group, or iag. its shares are up 40% this year. over the last five years, a focus on the bottom line means it has soared above european rivals lufthansa and air france—klm. this analyst thinks the bosses at ba and parent iag are getting more right than wrong. investors as a whole, i think they see a management team that is seeking to break out of the airline industry's historic record of poor profitability. to deliver better returns over the long term and that ultimately benefits all stakeholders, staff and customers alike. for those bristling at paying for their sandwich, there's more to come. ba will be squeezing more seats into its economy cabin. it wants to charge for more extras like checked bags or wi—fi. and there's changes coming at the front of the plane, too. ba's business class is pretty tired compared to competitors‘, so it is investing there. it is all part of a strategy, trying to offer top—notch luxury at the front of the plane and a cut—price, no—frills service at the back. today's hypercompetitive travel market means tough choices. still, some think ba is headed in the wrong direction. ba right now presents its customers with a very schizophrenic, disjointed experience. in the us, l'0real cosmetics has advertised for years, "we cost more but you are worth it". ba needs to take pride in the fact it is a premium brand. it is ok for ba to charge a bit more, provided that the value it provides is better. ba told newsnight that being more efficient enables the company to offer more low fares and to invest in new aircraft, better facilities and new technology. the question is whether pr troubles at some point start to drag on financial success. all businesses have to balance keeping their customers happy with making enough profit to survive. i think with british airways, there's a problem that expectations are anchored in history and are not necessarily consistent with either a service level that can be delivered profitably in this day and age, or which even actually existed in reality. i think sometimes, people remember things as being better than they really were. ba told us: feedback? that is one thing the airline is unlikely to find itself short on. helen thomas. donald trump made more comments on north korea this evening — interesting ones, because he gave the impression that he was reiterating his "fire and fury" comments of the other day, but actually he could be thought of as toning it down significantly. i'm joined by the bbc‘s washington correspondent rajini vaidya nathan. first, i think we have a clip of donald trump. it's about time that somebody stuck up for the people of this country and for the people of other countries. so if anything, maybe that statement wasn't tough enough, and we're backed by 100% by our military, we're backed by everybody. ok, let's talk to rajini. he said quite a lot in answers to questions there. do you feel he was ramping it up or toning it down? i think it was a bit of both. this is quite similar to the pattern we have seen before in many ways with president trump. he makes a perhaps off—the—cuff remark and then his aides rail it back and then he comes back guns blazing, reaffirming it even more strongly. in that rhetoric, president trump said he wished he had gone tougher and been stronger than saying he was going to unleash fire and fury but when you peel the rhetoric away and look at exactly what it means, some journalists ask what is tougher than fire and fury? he said, we'll see, we'll see. president trump said he was open to negotiations but then said negotiations never work and have not for decades when it comes to north korea. he also refused to be drawn on whether or not he is planning a pre—emptive strike but crucially, he also called on china to do more. i was going to say because in some ways, interpreting what you think all of this could be the chinese and you have to think about what he is saying in relation to the chinese. absolutely right, in many ways, this was as much a message to beijing as it was to pyongyang. in many ways, they are the power brokers in all of this. in terms of reaching a diplomatic solution to this ongoing crisis. that is also because beijing is a key trading partner with north korea so in many ways in terms of putting economic pressure on pyongyang it is really down to china. crucially of course, those united nations sanctions we saw last week being voted in were signed up by china and by russia. that is a key thing, there. what this shows overall is that despite the rhetoric we are hearing from president trump, his promise of fire and fury, he knows that right now he can't deliver that fire and fury ina vacuum. he still needs cooperation and it is worth pointing out of course that president trump has a bit of a love hate relationship with china. we have seen him play golf with president xijinping in florida and showered him with praise and then months later, sent tweets that he is simply not doing enough. it is clearly that the relationship with china is a tricky one for president trump to manage but clearly crucial. thank you forjoining us. time for viewsnight now — our opinion strand. and tonight jason hickel, an anthropologist from the london school of economics, the writer of a book called the divide, and who thinks we should stop obsessing with economic growth. 0ur addictions to economic growth is killing us. right now, the entire global system is captive to a single idea. economic growth. if you didn't think there was enough tv out there already, you'll have a little more choice soon. facebook launches its watch service today — at least for some consumers in the us. it's videos, and they're specially made for facebook. it's one step on from facebook‘s goal to eat the whole internet, as one tech writer put it, because this takes on tv. the videos won't be quite the same, but it is competition for traditional tv, and the amazon, netflix and youtube platforms too. but here's a question — are we being deluged with new content in an unsustainable way? what's at stake here is that there are lots of competing platforms, and they each want to entice us with great content — but can that last? i'm joined by lindsey clay ceo of thinkbox — which is the marketing body for commercial tv in the uk and dr catherine johnson, an associate professor in film and television at the university of nottingham. what do you think of the facebook offer? well, mark zuckerberg said 2017 would be the year of video and there is a lot of competition in this space. but i think it is important to recognise that what facebook is offering is really competition with youtube an not with the likes of iplayer and netflix. the content they are offering is largely short form, it is interactive, it is live sport, it is factual, it is content we are supposed to engage and interact round. it is different from the content you see netflix moving into, high end, global appeal, drama and documentary. documentary? couldn't facebook put that other stuff on as well? maybe buying stuff from the bbc and putting that on the site and making themselves the place you go to for all sorts of television? they would need to want to invest a lot of money in doing that, and the question is whether they want do that. there is no indication from facebook they really want to put that amount of money into either licencing or creating content. 0k. lyndsey, there is a lot of tv round and a lot of it comes from this competition between platforms. they are trying to become the place to go. is it sustainable? there has never been a better time to be a viewer. there is fantastic choice round at the moment, so i think, and generally competition is good. the viewer is the person that benefits from that. it keeps, you know, the competition keeps... are they making money lyndsey? because, there are a lot of platforms an i wonder whether —— and i wonder whether they are all making money or hoping they are going to be the one that is standing at the end of the battle between them? it's a good point. there is less pressure on them to make money because they have so much finance from the city etc, but yes, they are making money, and there are different ways you do make money from tv. some of it is ad funding, some of it subscription and some comes from the bbc license fee. facebook is ad—funded platform, so this seems like it a clear commercial play. mark zuckerberg made it clear he sees the future to be about video, but if you put it in context, if you look at how much video, how much time people are spending watching video, on facebook, we spend about four—and—a—half hours a day, on average, watching video, three—and—a—half hours is tv. 0n traditional tv. it is about three—quarter, 2% is facebook. that is interesting. i thought it was higher than that. it is not higher. and already there is a lot of video on the facebook platform, because we are scrolling down through our news feed. i doesn't account for a lot of time. do you think catherine, people have called it a golden age of television and there are lots, more shows than you have time to watch, do you think it is sustainable? i think that we all like watching video and there is definitely a market for different kinds of video, i think the key thing is we have different platforms, serving different needs, so what facebook is doing is providing content we want to share, that we want to interact round, community building content. it is different. at the moment, and from their offer around watch, it isa different service to something like bbc iplayer. and they are also attracting, at the moment, different ad revenue. if you are a big brand, most of the big brands are advertise, most of the advertising on facebook is from small companies and from local companies so there is a different advertising offer as well. are there too many platforms? do consumers — will they have to choose between amazon or netflix or do they get both? or will it end up all the programmes are on all the platforms and it doesn't matter. there is a move for exclusivity. they are looking to buy content, in perpetuity, for long time, —— times, ten years, and lock it down to encourage people to subscribe. there are a small number that will subscribe to netflix and amazon and now. really people are going to choose. you haven't got time to watch the stuff! and how much money have we got to spend on different subscription services? what tends to happen is the biggest subscribers are existing subscribers to pay tv. what happens if you love tv you really love it and you simply can't get enough of it. so to your point about is it sustainable? it is. we spend three—and—a—half hours in the uk, in the us it is under four hour, in brazil is it nearly six hours you might argue we have head room for growth on tv watching. —— four hours. i think that is probably good news for the likes of us who work in it. thank you both very much. that's just about it for tonight, but we can't leave without a word or two about wales and the welsh language. if you saw last night's programme, we had a discussion on policies to promote welsh language, with a defender of government efforts to get it more widely spoken, and someone who thought it was not the government's job. now our defender of welsh did a perfectly good job, but was someone who did not actually speak more than a bit of welsh herself. that is representative of a very prevalent group in wales. most people don't speak it, and polls suggest most people do support government efforts to promote it. but understandably, we had more than few comments suggesting that we had not done justice to the language, by discussing it without a welsh speaker. i'm not going to pretend that we disagree. we think it would have been better to have a welsh speaker too. by luck, the national eisteddfod is taking place this week so we can play out with a highlight, the band yr eira — translated as the snow — with suddo. goodnight. . the to the for most of us. the week and is looking pretty decent as well. we just need to get through tomorrow as well. there is some rain on the way. things are turning cloudy from the west. some outbreaks of rain. rain is spreading into north—western areas courtesy of this area of low pressure. frontal systems bringing the wet weather. tightly squeezed isobars with the light lines close together. that showers that winds will be a feature of the weather. gales across north—west scotland possible. these outbreaks of rain will spread a radically westwards. hideous births across scotland. —— hideous —— heaviest bursts. some drizzle for northern ireland and scotland. northern ireland and scotland. northern england, wales, the south—west and into the midlands, quite a gloomy afternoon. some patchy rain on and off. 16 or 17 degrees. temperatures could get all the way to 22 or 23. kurt heatherley, cloud around, with misty murky conditions over hills in the west. not a cold light by any stretch. 1360 degrees. head into the weekend, a struggle to break up some of that early cloud. —— 13—16 degrees. but this day and here, high pressure, that is the main feature of the weekend. it will be largely dry and there will be some spells of sunshine. echo cloudy start on saturday across the southern half of the country, probably stay like that. some drizzle here and there. but north, the sky should brighten and some spells of sunshine will develop. the chao fought it and scotla nd develop. the chao fought it and scotland in north—east england. temperatures of 16—21. the sunday, should be a nice day. largely dry with bills of sunshine. unlikely to get a shower. 15—21 degrees. but the wet weather does not last until next week. —— manager. the full forecast for the next seven days is on our website. that is all from me. good night. this is newsday on the bbc. 0ur this is newsday on the bbc. our top stories: president trump ups the words with north korea after vowing fire and fury, and now he says maybe he wasn't tough enough. north korea better get their act together or they're gonna be in trouble like few nations ever have been in trouble. slavery in britain — there are victims in every town and city. iam victims in every town and city. i am kasia madera in london. seven yea rs i am kasia madera in london. seven years on from the partition of india and pakistan, one muslim mother's tale of a desperate journey to a new home. and china's biggest movie box office hit,