Transcripts For BBCNEWS HARDtalk 20170131

The express is worried about a killer arctic blast it says is on the way. The mirror says mr Trumps Hotels contain all kinds of products imported into the us, despite his America First policy. The independent focuses on the question of when theresa may knew about mr tumps Immigration Policy order. The guardian says there is domestic uproar in britain over mr trumps policy. And the times reports that a former senior official at the Foreign Office believes theresa may has put the queen in a Very Difficult Position over the offer of a state visit foertrump. Now its time for hardtalk. This is hardtalk. Im stephen sackur. The Uk Parliament is about to vote on the governments plan to trigger article 50, the formal process which will end in britain leaving the eu. Theres little doubt mps will give Prime Minister theresa may a green light, but much has changed since lastjunes brexit referendum. The government has clarified its vision of what brexit means, while President Donald Trump is shaking up Global Politics. What place will post Brexit Britain occupy on the world stage . My my guess is that today is conservative mp domin raab. Domin raab, welcome to hardtalk. You area domin raab, welcome to hardtalk. You are a westminster mp who took the somewhat difficult to understand position of having the right to give a green light to article 50 taking the view that that was wrong and it should not be allowed. the view that that was wrong and it should not be allowed. I took the view it as did all the mps who passed the Referendum Legislation by 61. We gave this decision to the english people and by the way all parties agreed to this and having done that we need to respect it. The committee is scrutinising every negotiation at their son have any guises for holding up and frustrating at the verdict by the british people. There will be a verdict in the coming days in westminster. There will be a debate. Westminster. There will be a debate. We know various opposition lps, labour s all Scottish Nationalists, have various amendments to put forward. It will be a lively debate. Terrific. The 17th and debates we have had on the mac. Every democrat in the House Of Commons and in the House Of Lords will have their cards called. Are we talking about scrutiny all our people frustrating the wheel of the british people trying to scrap brexit altogether . Everybody will be accountable including yourself. One of the reasons the row so many remainers deeply bitter is they feel you in the leave camp never came clean during the Referendum Campaign about the kind of brexit you wanted. Some of the most prominent leaders wanted an exit which allowed britain to remain inside the Single Market and now that seems to be taken off the table. I think that is almost wholly wrong. Every time i was asked that question, all of us said. Let me finish the answer before you can scorn it. We all said and we will be leaving the eu, wanting to take back control of our borders and when asked the critical question about the Single Market we said we would be looking at the best access but no one said we would remain in the formal Single Market. Your version isa formal Single Market. Your version is a very different. Daniel and an, a senior mep. Is a very different. Daniel and an, a senior mep. Absolutely is a very different. Daniel and an, a senior mep. Absolutely nobody is talking about threatening our place in the Single Market. Paterson mp, only a madman would actually leave the Single Market. One more for luck, aaron banks, the biggest financier of the Leave Campaign Quote increasingly the norway option looks the best for the uk, having access to the Single Market. Looks the best for the uk, having access to the Single Marketm precisely demonstrates my point. have given you free quote that run counter to what you told me. No one is the Single Member of the Single Market. Only a is the Single Member of the Single Market. Onlya madman. Is the Single Member of the Single Market. Only a madman. Were not going to leave the Single Market in terms of a trading relationship at in terms of being a full member. If you look at the detailed comments made, not picking a few quote out of context, time and time again i remember discussing on the campaign, we all said it is clear you could not leave the eu and by The Back Door coming give up control of your Immigration Policy, and not have Trade Negotiations outside of the eu. We said we wanted the strongest possible access to the Single Market but we would not anticipate being formal members. What we now have is that the cliff edge scenario, something people said britain should try very desperately not to do. Explain to me why there is not the grave danger that after the triggering of article 50 britain will be staring over a cliff edge because there will be no negotiated trade deals and we will go to default, and to everybody concerned that represent a dangerous cliff edge. The pessimistic gloomy bbc portrayal saying that we would have an immediate shock after a brexit vote, they did not happen. We are the Fastest Growing economy for 2016. From google, the apple, to dyson. Just this week weetabix extra investment. All valid points but nothing to do with my question. I waited to address this. But you shifted the goal posts of chairman. Ijust conducting shifted the goal posts of chairman. I just conducting an shifted the goal posts of chairman. Ijust conducting an interview. You cannot include every discussion you have heard over the last year. I am asking a straightforward question. The forecasts have been demonstrably proven to be false. There will be a slowdown at the high level of growth we have at the moment, the Fastest Growing industrialised economy in the world but it will not be nearly as bad as forecasters predict that. Lets take this seriously, someone like Christian Forbes at the Bank Of England says all the uncertainty that had resulted in the negative forecasts the indicators are flawed and from the indicators are flawed and from the Bank Of England to the imf inaudible. I have decided you did not answer my question. The maltese Prime Minister got to the heart of this when he said the uks Deal Post Brexit must be worth than the terms of its membership. We can see no situation where whatever is negotiated end up being better than the Current Situation be uk has. You quoted the maltese Prime Minister andi quoted the maltese Prime Minister and i will quote. I can quote you Francois Hollande who has said we will pay. Francois hollande will not be Prime Minister when we do the negotiations. There is a range of different views. From the Spanish Foreign minister to the chief negotiator who said on the vexed issue of Uk Financial Services he has pointed out that given that britain puts £1 trillion worth of finance into european companies, if we turn around and have a rational being the differential approach to these negotiations. inaudible . We need to stop talking about detection is an start looking for the win win. Angela merkel, and others, there is a shifting mood in brussels and there is scope for a win win scope. Brussels and there is scope for a winwin scope. Neither You Nori Know where the negotiations will go. Your vision of what a post Brexit Economy should look like whether or not you get this complicated trade deal. Wasnt it very interesting when the british chancellor said you know what we may well do over the next few years as a result of brexit . We make completely transform our economy. Low tax, low public expenditure, a completely different economy. Is that what you want . not sure those were the words of philip hammond. I am paraphrasing but not unfairly. Between the referendum and the negotiations is to stabilise the economy. That is done. Set out the details of our plan. The Prime Minister did that with a positive vision of a post brexit self governing democracy, a strong neighbour including on trade and security, a Global Leader in free trade and the third thing that needed to happen was developed unity of purpose amongst the country at large. Following the lancaster house speech, the british pub lick 3 1, backed theresa mays vision. You talk about public opinion, ijust wonder whether you believe those brexit voters, lets talk about a particular place in the north midlands of the uk, where there will bea midlands of the uk, where there will be a by election. 70 voted brexit but do you think most of those 70 wa nted but do you think most of those 70 wanted to see a deregulated inaudible. I think the point is that win win is the speech. Of course, if we do not get a deal, even if the eu. You think that is what the british people voted for . Let me finish. Even if we apply external tariffs, we would have to take some measures to make sure that brexit the economy can continue to thrive in one is a question of tax and to retain our competitiveness. You would have to slash public spending much more than we have seen thus far. We want britain to be competitive, that is what attracts investment and create jobs but these silly caricatures of britain becoming the singapore of the north sea, ido becoming the singapore of the north sea, i do not recognise that at all. We need to be brave and go into the negotiations hoping for the best and bracing for the worst. If you look at that yougov poll, to the extent the eu can trust polls, it strong as public support that if the government did not get a good deal it should not sign up to any terms that we are offered from rustles and in that sense the british public, despite the frenzied polarised media debate, is getting the high end the Prime Minister. You are taking us dangerously back to the cliff edge. Lets. Dangerously back to the cliff edge. Lets. I dangerously back to the cliff edge. Lets. I want dangerously back to the cliff edge. Lets. I want to specific answers and then to look at the international picture. What happens to the 3 million also eu nationals living and working in the uk today . Am very confused by the mixed signals . I meekly in the Referendum Campaign anyone legally in the uk should have their rights protected. They can stay indefinitely . Those people already here will be able to stay indefinitely . I think as a moral position but also showing good faith in these negotiations. It is absolutely the right thing to do. What do you think of theresa mays position in moral terms when she refuses to give that guarantee and says, well, our stance will depend on how our nationals are treated in mainland europe. I think we should fight very hard for our expats and i understand why theresa may said i would like those issues dealt with. Orshe would like those issues dealt with. Or she tried to do, what the government did, is go to brussels and say, why not have an early agreement and push out of their anguish and anxiety European National space in the uk and the eu and remember it was the eu who said we cannot get agreement amongst the other 27 for this. It was them who said it will have to wait until march. We tried to do the right thing. Do you think some brexit backers, voters in towns like boston and lincolnshire, who have consistently according to the polls and anecdotal evidence that their town feels as though they have lost their culture and identity because so many East European farm workers are living in that town, do you think they will feel disappointed, let down, if you are saying to them, actually the status quo as it exists in boston and lincolnshire will have to remain . Certainly not with me or any of the people in the Vote Leave Campaign because we all said that we didnt think it was right as a basic point of moral ethics to start Deporting En Masse people who have been here for a long period of time, have played by the rules and worked hard. Ithink have played by the rules and worked hard. I think it was clear in terms of what we said during the referendum. It is quite right to try to secure those rights for expats abroad too. Another specific point about hard borders. It seems, the Scottish Nationalists are disappointed with the government stands, that the government isnt interested in discussing with them the idea that scotland could remain somehow in the Single Market and in the european Customs Union. But there is a question of whether in ireland and possibly scotland too if they get their way, there would be a ha rd they get their way, there would be a hard border between those nations of the United Kingdom and england. Will there be a hard border . Look, in terms of scotland, it will be icing wrong as a matter of principle and impossible to enforce. In terms of ireland there is the common travel area and those arrangements existed before we were members of the eec as it then was and of course there will be strong bilateral relations to make sure we dont undermine taking back control of our Immigration Policy but without putting up a hard border between the two. Forgive me but i am not clear, if ireland is in the Single Market and Customs Union and the uk is not, how can there not bea and the uk is not, how can there not be a hard border . We will have sensible mutual arrangements which respect both sides of the debate. We had that before we entered the eu so i dont think it is beyond the wit or man i dont think it is beyond the wit or man of man or woman but we wont have a hard border and we said that in the Referendum Campaign and the government says it now. Equally some of the stuff coming from the snp is not credible and it is not just the uk government saying that. The eu has said some of the ideas about staying in the Single Market. We have the referendum as one country and when you do that then you negotiate your International Relations as one country. Lets now look at the International Context in which it is all taken place. June 23 the british people voted. At the time barack obama was president of the ita states. Of course today donald trump is in the white house and noises from the white house are very different. You think it makes sense for britain to be cutting its bonds and ties with the European Union at and ties with the European Union at a time when the United States is being led by a man who is avowedly and proudly nationalist in his economics and his politics . Well, look, first of all we are not leaving europe, we are leaving the eu and we want to remain a good European Neymar and from theresa mays visit To Washington you can see even now have that influence can play out and the opportunity for our european friends, britain exercising leverage, and you heard her say not being naive about putin, and standing with britain behind our nato commitments, that is a good example, but britain wants an independent Foreign Policy and that means. Independent Foreign Policy and that means. And to be an independent, self governing democracy, that means independent from the eu but we will have a strong relationship with america, but. Will be . We had a really, really Special Relationship with Donald Trumps america . She said to trump, you renew your nation just as we renew ours, the opportunity to renew the Special Relationship for this age is here, a chance, she said for Post Eu Britain and trumps election to make america to this, this is a quote, lead america again. Do you think that with britain at this moment in Global Politics and especially us politics, is in a position and wants to have that special bond with Donald Trumps america . The Special Relationship endures is bigger than with the white house and with number ten, we have trade on values, security, the intelligence relationship and nato so it is absolutely right we dont throw toys at the pan because of a controversial president. We will double up on engaging. Do you think the public like the fact that when donald trump issued this Executive Order Banning Incomers from seven mostly muslim countries, Angela Merkel was on the phone within hours suggesting to the president that this was a big problem and he should remember what International Law says. Theresa may, she was asked about it, she obfuscated, she didnt address it directly, she didnt want to condemn the americans. Do you think the public like where she stands today . If you look at the two days of theresa may in washington, yes, we want to grasp the opportunities around free trade and it is great to have a president who wa nt it is great to have a president who want a free trade deal. This is a president who is avowedly protectionist and says everything he does will be about America First. What makes you think britain can cut a deal when donald trump is fanatically in favour of pursuing only americas interest . All the more the coup it was to be in first and get the commitment from him. Sorry, what commitment . The commitment to expedite and have proper working arrangements. On whose terms . Well, it will be. On his terms stephen, come on. Have you read the art of the deal . His terms stephen, come on. Have you read the art of the deanm his terms stephen, come on. Have you read the art of the deal . It is all about. I you read the art of the deal . It is allabout. Iam you read the art of the deal . It is all about. I am happy to answer the questions but you have to wait for the answers. It is a good thing. When it comes to delivering difficult measures, theresa may did it in public on nato and russia and when she got home yes there was this furore around the executive order. I think it was divisive and wrong but because she had been for two days in washington, because we are engaging, borisjohnson got on the phone and it was clear Notjust Borisjohnson got on the phone and it was clear not just for borisjohnson got on the phone and it was clear notjust for britain at 40 it was clear notjust for britain at a0 other countries that dual nationals coming from britain would be barred from coming to the us and thatis be barred from coming to the us and that is serious statesmanship, not throwing up their hands in despair, not flouncing off, the labour Party Positionjeremy not flouncing off, the labour Party Position Jeremy Corbyn not flouncing off, the labour Party PositionJeremy Corbyn that not flouncing off, the labour Party Position Jeremy Corbyn that we should work or snub donald trump but to engage, take advantage of the opportunities and deliver the candid advice of a friend and that is what theresa may did. In the art of the deal donald trump says whether you win or lose in any deal is all about the leverage you have. When you talk about britain in a post brexit future dealing with Donald Trumps america all with xi jinpings china or with Narendra Modis india, all nationalist leaders out to protect their nations interest, where do you think you leverage is and how much has britain got . Stephen, he goes again, classic bbc, doing down britain. Laughter. Iam simply laughter. I am simply asking the question. Sixth biggest military in the world, the common language of business, the birthplace of shakespeare, newton, weve got huge things going for us. The network of commonwealth links weve got. And you are right that we have to go into these negotiations whether with china, brazil, america, doing what normal countries do, to look after the British National interest but often it will be looking for a win win. Interest but often it will be looking for a winwin. Sorry but i asked how much leverage britain has and your answer included shakespeare. I mean, is it. You are asking about britain as a nation andi are asking about britain as a nation and i wanted to show why we are not down on our luck as you imply and we have huge economic power, military high power and soft power and that is why shakespeare and language and culture and values comes into it. At the end of the day you are right, we are the fifth biggest economy, not the biggest but free trade is win win, good for britain, jobs, cheaper prices and also good for america for the same reasons. And by the way it isntjust about the big countries. What about the global economy, the poorest countries in sub Saharan Africa . Economy, the poorest countries in sub sa ha ran africa . Free economy, the poorest countries in sub Saharan Africa . Free trade would give them a Lifeline Opportunity to gather and gain real genuine independence. It is a Great Mission for post Brexit Britain in the 21st century. For all those saying they have to review their plans for the present in the uk. Since brexit, since the brexit vote from dyson to jcb to apple, facebook, weve had a whole string of Major International companies who have pledged fresh investment into the uk. We had weet bix only this week, i am a big fan of weet bix. Weet bix only this week, i am a big fan of weet bix. It is a really interesting company. They say their prices have come up because of the post brexit Economic Situation and the consumer will have to pay and thatis the consumer will have to pay and that is something you are going to have to explain. I will be accountable to my voters in the normal way. Huge opportunities as mervyn king said to export more for britain. You are right to say there will be Inflationary Pressure and we need to look at that and the Bank Of England has the tools to keep it under control. Lets be realistic. Inflation is 1. 6 . It is well below the Bank Of England target rate. I dont think it gives you objective brownies for the pessimism you are expressing. We have to end it there, but dominic saab, thank you very much for coming on hardtalk. Hello. In a week when our weathers Turning Wetter and windier, lets celebrate a bit of sunshine and the best of that again on monday was in scotland. Contrast scenes like this with the view on the south coast of england and for tuesday were going to narrow these differences. Its this sort of weather thats going to win out as this Weather System works very slowly from west to east across the uk. Not a huge amount of sunshine on offer but plenty of cloud and most of us will see rain at some stage. Quite a wet start to the day in Northern Ireland although here something a bit drier and brighter for the afternoon. Down the eastern side of england where you start dry eventually well get to see some outbreaks of rain moving in here. A lot of the rain will be light but some heavy bursts in scotland, especially in the Southern Iplands and grampians. Maybe some highest routes could be a little bit slippy as we see some sleet and snow and rain falling onto frozen ground but conditions will gradually improve. A lot of the cloud is low cloud so theres hill fog around too. Eastern england starting dry, many of us here, but cloudy and feeling quite cool in that breeze. Where weve got milder air already into south west england, starting to move through more of wales as well, eventually into Northern Ireland. But it is a messy picture for tuesday as we take outbreaks of rain gradually further east. Again the heavy bursts into scotland and drier and brighter weather for Northern Ireland into the afternoon. Again all the while taking something a little bit milder into the uk from the south west. 11 in belfast. But it is going to feel qute cool in Eastern Scotland and Eastern England with the cloud, outbreaks of rain and the breeze. More rain to come in parts of england and wales especially on tuesday night and into wednesday morning. Clearer spells into scotland and Northern Ireland. So some spots getting cold enough for A Touch Of Frost and a few fog patches. England and wales, though, with all this cloud around, temperatures holding up. On wednesday the Weather System still dragging its heels, especially into england and eventually the rain pulling away from the east quite late in the day. A bit of a brighter interlude between the two Weather Systems before another one comes into Northern Ireland to parts of wales and the south west of england later on wednesday. And again, some of us getting into double figure temperatures. On thursday, it looks like a windy affair, some bright and sunny spells around but bands of showers, some may be heavy with the risk of hail and thunder spreading north east across the country. And the winds look like picking up further towards the end of the week and into the weekend. Still a lot of uncertainty about the detail but look at this, theres the growing sense some of us will be facing some quite Stormy Weather by the end of the week and into the weekend. We will, of course, keep you updated. Hello, you are watching bbc world news. Im adnan nawaz. Our top story this hour donald trump fires americas top legal adviser, the acting attorney general, sally yates. The shock move comes after she questioned the legality of his immigration ban. A white house statement accuses her of betrayal. Welcome to the programme. Our other main stories this hour taken from the wild. A yearlong bbc investigation into the traffickers selling Baby Chimpanzees from west africa. Russias secret shame. The new law that could put victims of Domestic Abuse at even greater risk. Im sally bundock. In business microsoft, amazon and expedia team up with Washington State in a bid to defeat president trumps travel ban, saying it is unconstitutional and damages the economy