Get to see it just did you can look at it. And in detroit it was betrayal. When so many find themselves worlds apart we choose to look for common ground. Hello and welcome to cross talk where all things are considered im hearing about germanys foreign minister has signaled that he would like to see a fog in nato russian relations but added the ball is in russias court really also as tensions over taiwan increase who is pushing for a military showdown. To discuss these issues and more im joined by my guest Marcus Papadopoulos in london is a historian analyst and author of the new book a rise rosia the return of russia to World Politics and here in moscow we cross to dimitri bobbitt she is a political analyst and editor and knows me internet media project originally crossed out rules in effect that means you can jump in anytime you want and i was appreciated so its going to marcus 1st in london so the German Foreign minister once a thaw and nato russia relations by the ball is in russias court now can you explain to our audience why that seems so odd or actually upside down go ahead marcus well we should all be hoping for indeed frame for a full invalidations between night russia because the preservation of global peace 2 are very large extent depends on improvements in between the western military and of Washington Federation how if it is simply ludicrous for the German Foreign minister so thats the who is enough cautious coats when into. Proof of who is in nato schools firstly it is not russia who has violates it the nato russia found in acts of nazi 97. 00 indeed it is nato because nato now has a Permanent Military presence in Eastern Europe on buses western buddhists and that is a major file ation all the agreements of 997. 00 between nato and russia it is not russia which has a russian Led Military Alliance on for example americas vote or jodys or britains oda so in fact the who is in the coats of nato but then nato and the German Foreign minister a not sincere when they say that they want to fall in relations they understand the level the atrocious level of relations between 8 and russia and they know that if there is to be a folk then nato has to take the 1st step so we can dismissal the German Foreign minister said as many propaganda and russia will not tolerate any sort of suggestion a hole or suggestion that the boat is in russias quote russia stipulates nato troop acquirements for that to be a full in relations firstly nato we draw was its military forces on the west from the old west and pulls out all of russia and secondly moscow who stipulates in a tight nato as late as in particular of course america presence of rights in the western military bloc will not seek the admission into its ranks of ukraine georgia and moldova unless those 2 requirements are met last there will be no Foreign Relations between the big western military bloc and russia you know i mean how do you think the Russian Foreign ministry is receiving the. Because theres it there that its russia that has a lot of complaints with nato i dont know what russia possibly could do do irritate the Nato Alliance ok and its all they theyre about expansion and theyre of. It in their inability to come to some kind of security arrangement which the russians have been talking about since the year 2000 ok a number of overtures including a time when and then it was president here so i mean how is the russian port minutely going to accept this i mean it seems to me really quite hollow Everyone Wants a thaw and tensions but i mean what does that mean what does that practically mean and since this is a relationship of sorts that means both sides should be committed to something go ahead jim. Oh i think we are working through a very important crucial period in the in the russian diplomacy in the history of russian diplomacy because in the last 2 or 3 weeks our foreign minister made several statements which which do for almost the previous but if you call i know russia i mean russia is still made you know the last efforts to get western countries especially the e. U. Member countries on track you know who didnt talk this week to their chairman of european columcille shalini shade and would you suggest that whats it called no need to size nonconfrontational relationship between russia and the u. But i think putting himself knows that this is not the case right now thats why our foreign minister lavrov said this week that relations between russia and the e. U. s an organization are im cold and practically debt so there are some good relations on the buy later level between russia and several members of the e. U. Itself it is a very Aggressive Organization i would say i would call it legal almost dado you know in the in its dealings with russia and and the latest them message from russia is that indeed the ball is in your court because you a breach in the spirit of that fallen act on the russian need to relations signed in 1907 in paris by president yeltsin and the president s over 7 west and you know be biggest countries in that in that statement basically in nato obliged itself not to expand you know its military infrastructure to the east thats why russia late. At least basically to the inclusion trust of hungry in poland and Czech Republic in 1901 and later the. Oh 2. 00 countries in 2004 into the Nato Alliance the idea was that these countries would be calm or peaceful when they feel themselves saga nato was umbrella but the always it was the case i mean look at the statements that we hear from poland from the bolduc states colin says it wants an american uclear weapons on its territory and why do they want it they say we didnt sign nato russia following an act in 1970 saw where free he gave not to fly off American Nuclear weapons so now i want to actually would also think it is right there part of nato but theyre not obliged to follow the directives of the alliance itself i mean thats morning to have your case just great you know that the law has every tractor force for them you know since they were not members of nato in 1907 when they were the mental side they say theyre free to do you know to do poison American Nuclear weapons on their territory. Or you know according to the Stockholm Institute for Peace Research russias military expenditure is just plain just 7 percent or what nato european allies spend on their defense in europe so who is who is a threat to whom here however this week we again heard the statement from nato us Foreign Ministers on the 22nd of march a final mistaken that basically a russian is a threat to a Nato Alliance the general sector of nato said that russia has behaved in the last few years has been getting more and more aggressive and basically my impression is that we live below or unwillingly you know the weiss people in the United States and in the e. U. They feel like theyre being sucked into some kind or well maybe stroke you know i want to which they can all get out that thats such a good point let me go back to mark as your team is absolutely right here because theres this tension is it of course they dont want to get into nobody wants. It into an actual conflict but at the same time they keep the Alliance Together to have some kind of unity they have to have an enemy and that enemy conveniently is russia and so that they can china and china what we advocate will get to that later but there is that tension right there because if there is a thaw and the end tensions go down to nato well what is it for ok and this duma pointed out now theyre going to think about taking on china because you know this is an Alliance Since the end of the cold war in search of a mission and the mission is russia go ahead marcus allow me fast food pizza to clarify something one of the major reasons s. White. Acquiesced in the late 1990 s. And yet its a foul since nato expansion in cerise and europe and indeed into the old 6 states is because the russia of the 99 season yet its he found since you know anything about it was totally different so the russia offsite russia was not in a situation to resists the dangerous expansion eastward expansion of night politically economically and militarily if the russian off that they existed in the late 1990 s. We for instance whod seen at its head and the history textbooks could look very different but of course it is the case that nato exists today to council the newly resurrected superpower status of russia that is the reason for its existence and indeed recently the wells was witness to the 22nd anniversary all for nature is illegal and murderous only campaign against serbia now night didnt just find Light International law and on serbian 1905 late its also cool want all the night so tracy. Which states clearly and unambiguously that nature would never use military force service so disputes so nature has demonstrated not just across the entire well its its murderous and criminal credentials and of course because russia is again in 2021 a superpower is order to try and contain russia and europe and that i consigned russia in the wilds the Defense Budget of nature has 3 creased and includes its justified to the British Public the American Public the recent strain increased the has to pay an enemy and russia fits the bill perfectly off this to save the enemy. What could the russian side you know lets take it base value what there is theyre searching i mean what what concretely would russia could russia its a redo i mean you have the most expensive basque military alliance in modern history directed against it on the what is what is russias post they do i mean. The new front is the black sea and then we have in the in the baltic i think in norway now that you have beat institutions i mean and russia is the aggressor i mean i dont understand you know what could russia possibly do in show goodwill if in fact what were getting from the georgian german warman is there is goodwill as well go ahead. Well basically just on small correction like addition to what marcus has just said nato in 1010. 00 im not only serve also montenegro which was out for mideast u. S. Auto yugoslavia and even though the montenegran present up a good college and i feel as though i was basically prowest and he stays in power now for 32 years memel to those in the United States who say that wouldnt stay in all for too long. Look at your 2 columns you know you stand tall for 32 years to college was there i bought the steel ball in montenegro so basically its a good lesson to everyone if you want to tease nato if you hold on to please them in doesnt mean i dont want to bomb well i mean for the better is im glad you brought up that footnote force because it shows that theres at the end of the day nato doesnt feel it is obligated to anyone to explain us all explained its existence ok by jamming back im not going to just let it go to a short break and after that short break well continue our discussion on some real estate. Over the forward to talking to you on. That technology should work for people. I robot must obey the orders given by human beings except where such orders would conflict with the 1st law show your identification for should be very careful about Artificial Intelligence and the point 0 if you use the great trance. On various shots and with Artificial Intelligence will somebody in. The obama must protect its own existences. If. There is. Thinks. We dare to ask. Well some have to cross top where all things are considered im Peter Lavelle this is the home edition then were discussing real news. Ok lets go back to marcus here lets change gears gentlemen we had a week ago the disastrous summit meeting of china in the United States in the American City of anchorage i think it was widely agreed maybe from very many different perspectives it was a real train wreck but it had to be expected here and now we have. American and british warships in exercises or around taiwan in agreement between the United States and taiwan about coastguard exercises is heating up here but you know marcus one of the things that i find very troubling is that the lack of knowledge of the inability to actually look at the origins of u. S. Chinese relations since the revolution it was under the Carter Administration where diplomatic relations were established and when that was happening it was accepted and it was accepted when nixon went to china taiwan is part of china ok and as far as the chinese are concerned the 1949 revolution has not completely been completed and is not been able to regain control sovereign control of its own soil that is never told to western publics whatsoever so this would be akin to. Me that of the chinese coming. Interest to have to hawaii broadened under its its wane i mean theres theres this pattern lack of respect of sovereignty here go ahead. Yes i think its extremely important. For cross to. Very clearly that. Is chinese sulfur and territory that is no dispute. There is no legal standing for anyone not america britain. To counter that and as a result of taiwan being chinese so foreign territory china is well within its rights to use military force to reclaim taiwan im not saying i would agree with that i do not believe the Chinese Government wishes to shoot that. Coos of action it is no different to have the Syrian Government is well within its rights to use of military troops to liberate the new face of syria where the americans and the northwest of syria whether its an al qaida is and in recent days weve had senior military officials in america arguing that china no longer respects the status quo over taiwan and has instead opted to use military force to settle the issue the problem with that is other same American Military officials have not corroborates it that claims with any substantial evidence whatsoever yes it is true that on chinas sudden this the Chinese Government has increased its military forces but the question peter is why and i cite the simple. Arguments action reaction because of the expansion of the American Military in the South China Sea combined of course weve britain increasing its military presence that very aggressive posture infomercials and a lot of money plays written sending warships administrates im sorry i dont understand what do you guys do in there. I believe that britain still considers itself so very influential player in that process the wells why because of the opium wars. And because of britain is something to be proud its not going to be fragile nothing to be proud of but lets not forget that britain has never apologized for the opium wars and has never shown any regret for its fruits devilishly the fia in the ok it was great since it is so look into creates foments political instability in congo which along with america they have succeeded in doing yes you know demon the big thing is if you look at the other main broadsheets in the u. K. The United States and cable t. V. They talk about democracy and hong kong which and i can actually can see during the disturbances about a year ago with the the union jack to be waved around here. Oh im sorry but the british imperialism brought no democracy done congo ok there was never ever there so i dont know what theyre talking about when it comes to democracy it was an empire and there was no legacy of british democracy for hong kong whatsoever again they think this meddling it as if hong kong is somehow separate from china it is not its an integral part of china which when diplomatic relations i go back to when the diplomatic relations were established with with communist china it was a recognition of its sovereignty that included hong kong that included taiwan but nobody seems to know that in media these days ok go ahead well you are right not only in diplomatic terms in kind of International Law but also when take the purely human side over the problem there are still and i cheneys and our russian prowest and us papers published in hong kong there are freed actions in hong kong where people supporting the protests i get they are part of the whole right so nothing terrible head on to hong kong from any point of view except the western sanctions. Which had destroyed these former paradise on earth you know and you know hong kong may not be as rich as it used to be known because of china but because of the west the same story with iran basically china has been investing tensile billions if not hundreds of billions on bolus into taiwanese economy China Economic and he is not interested in a war it has not been preparing for a war so the american of the British Military presence in spewing it and i cheneys its not in any way protect and any what but what was interesting during this meeting in alaska i think the most interesting look at it was taken by a colon is told the wall st john the general baker who wrote an opinion piece titled western culture elites i given away lenin stroke well basically you know just that during this meeting young. Women just arent yes for nefarious you know top man in china basically election Anthony Blinken on americas human rights record on estrangement of minorities its systems in need. You know racism everything he said would have been lifted straight from the pages of the Democratic Partys president ial election plentiful soldier blinken has nothing to respond to which shows you how how actually radical. How big the limitations the ideological he mediations awful mean cant you know so lincoln could only say that she was brick in breach of the protocol he was talking too long she did not a single argument against it because the moment when he often if you would be breaching the Democratic Party i dont mean to me. Its a its very interesting you know that as i said in the beginning of our conversation there are some people in the United States and even in europe on the stand how dangerous it is. And then making the last ditch effort to stall the night the space from getting into confrontation with 2 policy with russia and china you know our foreign minister had a heros welcome last week in china well when he came a right after the meeting in and korea showing these meeting was very well timed and after that we have an optical in the Foreign Policy authored by Richard Haass and Charles Compston to foreign ports you beat me so im going to the states im going to give you their titles on pay serious people that i didnt know is prevalent and you also follow us and what do they suggest they suggest that basically you know we return to more on ideological you know known confrontational rule of the hold with 6 policy you know that thats a good point demon but you know youre almost arguing against yourself in a way you dont mark is here isnt it people are so ideological that they theyre so ideological today came even concert in a debate thats why they mean they theres always this need jerk response from militant military reaction because theyre not interested in conversation or not interested in debates theyre not interested in having someone point out their gross rank hypocrisy ok not that im going to agree with everything that the chinese delegation had to say but you know if you know what if you if you live in a glass house he shouldnt throw stones and thats what mr blinken should have learned and i hope he did go ahead mark yes the americans and the british are not genuine when they pull to claim to be be consult them ocracy him beacons of human rights and as the gods eons of International Oh in truth it is all about preserving western global hedge money and the reason why the americans in the grocery increase in a military presence in the South China Sea is to contain china no different to how nature is its and sincere contain russia in europe but then there is none for. From busha there is no fret phone china out to another similarity between china and russia russias achilles heel manes the north caucasus even though the region is being so early large extent pacified it wouldnt take much for a serious conflicts and that is why in the 99. 00 states and even today western special services a still looking to foment or in the north caucuses and at the same time the americans and the british understand that chinas achilles heel is changed and that is why they are alleging that the Chinese Government sees persecutes in the muslim region of the Muslim Population of this region and has established concentration camps that the americans and the british have not provided any substantial reference of any kind whatsoever to corroborates that height indeed the chinese off fighting terrorists in changing notably islamist terrorists comprised of isis cells and al qaida cells there and if they are successful in jean jacques in the fates in the Chinese Security forces that. A grave threat to chinese in that sense or here is our president emeritus of the british its no coincidence that we agree is where biting in syria ok theres no coincidence about that again no one likes to point out that Inconvenient Truth ok ari the moment if you know what youve been is up 30 seconds on it yep well i agree marcus is quite right there is evidence that that there is from a scene john or we go or engine to get caught in this civil war in syria and again unfortunately in the quantity of dollars which mr haas and just because china suggest an is not possible now ideology can it because they created you know that assist as states a system we should prepare s. S. You will the thought about it even the thought of all of what they call nonconfrontational. Realistic manageable job political order which can sustain ideological differences are unfortunately well warsaw for then in the 19th century when the concept of all was established by russia reserved peace in europe and hundreds you have to jump in here gentlemen and make markets and be member join us here and thank our viewers watching us here you see you next remember. Is your media a reflection of reality. In a world transformed. What will make you feel safe from. The isolation community. Are you going the right way or are you being. Direct. What is true what is faith. In the world corrupted you need to descend. To join us in the depths. For a mate in the shallowness. The migraine crisis on the southern u. S. Border piles further pressure on the Biden Administration list of mounting access to. Tension facilities also in the headlines a disturbing video comes to light. The body count Footage Shows Police in the u. S. 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