Not care as long as and she says the president comes attitude as i am all right im the best all right i have ever been an aide says that steadily its make you feel brand new but money coming in comes to present comes defense she says i know 3 people who tested positive for cold it and to an asymptomatic and out my part that the call for 2 days ive not had trouble fun but accusing him of faking it with evidence is very odd to me john says trump says all american should receive the same treatment he hunt thats going to take a phenomenal amount of movie producers production crew and helicopters thomas says if youre not going to give this drug cocktail free to the American People lisa says im curious become the president of america be used as a guinea pig for untested medical research if anyone knows please could you let me know and mikes a strong defender of the press. He says top became president brought records in the short time he created millions of jobs and unemployment a record low as he just taxes and wages increased trump as one of the greats yet the super rich feel them so they want to paint a bad picture why else would he be out for 3 piece awards norma says i was watching c. N. N. And a commentator said trump would come to scotland when he loses i was screaming at the television we dont want him either j. C. Says you dont speak for everyone some of us support him actually but bob says the world these to distance itself from america before they pull other countries dont the toilet with them this is why there are so many people in america whose heads are spinning just now and theyre back to this meeting in april we asked professor David Blanchflower for his assessment on the measures required to stave off a want to station this is what he had to save back in 2008 the world was unprepared for a financial crisis in 2020 they were unprepared for basically a Health Crisis and so now were playing catch up and all the responses that weve seen which i said were exemplary but im not going to be enough theyre probably going to do the same thing next month and the month afterwards and so with that being that with being around being people is that over this decade or throw the world and policymakers have been utterly unprepared today he joins alex to assess the impact to date on the United States and world economies and get his years on economic consequences of President Trump and challenger joe biden and professor David Blanchflower joins me from florida welcome back to the show danny. Good to see here again of course now what about the Economic Policy the sponson america when i last spoke to you in the show you were pretty complimentary about the the big guns being trained on the the impact of the pandemic i still satisfied that the immediate policy the sponsons been up to the task well it was really very good from around the law a law down huge response sent through by congress all together and then as often is the way with these things the initial enthusiasm died away and the Unemployment Benefits that the congress was paying out stopped at the end of july and basically the economy has now started to slow because the stimulus has been pulled back and the economy is slowing and i think its actually impacting the polls and its impact republicans and its impacting Donald Trumps position in the polls so the answer is bad there and in the u. K. Context we so Good Good Good response oh now we seem a chance to look at labeling around of the baby starting to see unemployment rates coming up and i suspect we going to see of the same thing in the u. K. So initially good and now theyve got cold feet and were seeing slowing as the kind of express it now you will one of the most trenchant critics of the economics of a stand at the end of the Great Recession of 2910. 00 but its a different perspective a bigger opportunity now because the cost of borrowing rates are so low nonexistent what exactly is the constraint the fiscal constraint that so many governments seem to be if 100. 00 cuffing themselves putting themselves in manacles as opposed to taking the opportunity of these a credibly low balling rates to to get the job. Don what weve seen in the United States is tax giveaway which raise the deficit and raise the debt by 2 trillion so i think its hard to argue that you care that much in these times about the debt so i agree with you that borrowing is a is completely sensible thing to do perhaps what we should focus on is not so much how much should you borrow the question is what should he spend it all and i remember telling you when you were 1st minister only when you thought a lot about well can we do about Shovel Ready Projects can we actually start thinking and investing things and it was about building off those build schools build roads build sensible things to get the economy going and quickly so the answer is you can borrow cheaply go to its an Economic Policy terms what difference would a President Biden make him to pay up to president toms absolutely not i think youre going to see a series of things i mean the 1st thing youre going to see on the International Things this that fighting on day one will rejoin the paris the paris climate of cool music youll see a bigger push in terms of helping people in clean energy or all about kind of stuff but i think what youre going to see is a steady way Forward Investment in jobs try specially to protect the Affordable Care act but i dont think youre going to see anything huge carly because biden has reassured the markets and has actually said that when the big economic call is that alex is that theyre going to reverse those tax increases and they basically got a promise they will do not think the vast majority of people who earn under 400000. 00 a year and i think the reason in a sense is that those tax cuts really have show its hard to see any Major Economic benefits you just change income inequality and wealth inequality you just move money to the rich so i think thats the big thing going to see but i think increasingly there is not going to be a giant change because they reassure the markets and. Basically they can and move to job creation especially in in Climate Change areas. The lesson of economic crisis is the end does provoke new economic thinking when keynesianism was at a large extent new economic thinking caused by the Great Depression by often takes a bit of a time for it to to become a translated into Economic Policy often doxie seems to have a strangle hold and we saw that again in 2910 what are your hopes this time grown with a serious economic crisis following the hand demick that new economic thinking will be translated into new Economic Policy where theres a really great question i mean if you have you have to look forward and think well what did we learn from the pandemic in america the crucial distinction is the republicans are going to the Supreme Court a week after the election with 20 attorneys generals to tear down the Affordable Care act and the question is 75 percent of the people support it or what are you going to do youre going to remove that place with nothing so i think Going Forward these kinds of battles about Care Health Insurance how you deal with the low end of the crucial thing and i think the other question is going to be what the heck are you going to do about it you know in the skull in this of be issuing this initiative and in america its a giant issue what would be uniphase to governments around the what old in order to get new economic thinking translated into policy action well i feel this 2 parts and im a student history is you i mean the 1st thing is that when the boat sinking in the people are in the war so priority is to save them save the economy and build it and then start a plan for the future and i michael and i thought a lot about this in fact in 1943 im in the midst of the 2nd world war with student should chill go got an economist will you what are we going to do about them when they come home and this great work he did talked about. Stablish in a welfare state thinking about how we run an economy so that peace or decent jokes of people so its that kind of thinking strategic long term thinking i mean its a bit like what are you going to do when the troops come and the answer is you can have to start to build a society for everybody youre going to have to start to deal with the left because its about science good jokes for people so im going to get you to take your crystal ball arent you have you have tanks because way for a 2nd that you had to push on whether you think the policy response internationally is going to be like the new economic order which followed the the cataclysm of the 2nd one war or is it going to be the the underachievement and the performance that followed the Great Recession of 2910. 00 im going to get a new way an economic summit going to be stuck in the ruts in the past oh my heart hoax my heart hopes that it will be kind and gentle and positive but my head tells me that it will be much like we saw in the Great Recession where George Osborne comes ian impose austerity and says were all in this together which is precisely that was not true that was precisely not true and so the question is once with through this kind of damage and we through this phase will it be back to the old will. And i dont know i mean i do think alex that perhaps whats different this time is that this pandemic will change peoples with behavior in the long run the Great Recession didnt it didnt it was back to normal pretty quickly but i think this thing what old people are doing i mean them in america the big thing with trump in 2016 was the old people with it today theyre not he says go out come to a rally go to the store and their doctors are telling them not to so the question is is this is there a long run change in behavior and if there is then the scope i think it will see fundamental change and that when youre holding you know youll soon tutorials are the. Present moment with the students of college what is the question that they are asking you about contemporary Economic Policy what was the thing theyre saying fess up blanchflower kenya can you tell us why this is happening or not happening well thats a great question i think i think the big question that theyre asking right now is what i think is going all i mean you know its about and you think of new ways of working out whats going on but they say surely whats coming i mean well i think its coming but i think thats what were trying to work on and thats haute but this is exciting times and hopefully hopefully this will actually prove to be positive but its called to see the hats in the darkness of the storm professor David Blanchflower thank you again for joining me on the alexander show. And join us after the break well be telling the economic focus from their medical election to the next election shadow of the new u. K. From the Scottish Parliament and the National Assembly of wales john the same. Have you ever played high and low poker thats where the low here and the high hand where so weve got a situation in the Global Economy right now where in the currency markets various countries are trying to win with the worst possible hand lets see how this works out. Welcome back the next election shadowed in the u. K. I dont scotland and wales next year the polls will be told me to buy coverage 1000. 00 and its consequences the economic circumstances i like the to be dire but it is new thinking coming forward to meet the scale of the challenge alex is in conversation with former cabinet minister alex neil m. S. P. I know 7 when mcalpine did a tour of the scottish think tank called me to feel welcome to the shore like a robot players like. A former cabinet minister be it on the back benches no in the scots pile but youve recently published an economic plan for the couple a there were clearly health of absence which is going to be accompanied by a huge economic about and say what should plan consist of and whats the chances of it being brought forward into action. Well the 1st subject of alec is the major real survive through the pine dairy where the center vigils are businesses so the number one priority is an emergency funding for businesses and for individuals to make sure people dont end up and die a day as a result of the pandemic secondly they ended up plan to deal with the tsunami of unemployment that is very clearly coming through in scotland and indeed the rest in a decaying to wales and Northern Ireland as well as england and i think needs a number of things to happen number one we need to keep the Social Security improvements to make sure the spending goes in the economy at a local level secondly we need an Investment Program in infrastructure and thirdly we need a massive Investment Program also and business Business Investment ali and the business infrastructure for the longer tim and i think if we do all of these things together. Then we have a good chance of minimizing the impact in terms of unemployment but also surviving the pandemic so weve got an economy to go back to once upon then extol over robert capa in committing the think tank common weale which press publishes oppressive range of policy is also subject to crises such as this actually provoke new thinking and tabs of economic and other policies well not street week one of the things i think were seeing at the moment as everybody fights the last war as we fight the last war were facing this is a normal crisis a normal economic problem and we try out for a while and then we discover its not working and that scrape we start to move into a new economics and really feel im hoping is that we can move that process along as fast as we can not just in scotland globally we have to understand tools that we used to china deal with the truth in the name and financial crisis didnt really work then certainly not the long temps and were basically trying to. She used them again just now and it wouldnt be i fear and told me to realize thats not watching until someone says go hold on a 2nd what we can actually try whats going to actually work we will come out of this being with a very different economics than the ones that we were using when we went into it but the question is whether we are forced into a change or whether we recognize that that change is coming out what we recognize it sooner rather than later so rub a copy when you say you fight the last wall in economic terms of you saying the long period of a status which followed the Great Recession of 2009 we had danger of another 10 years of a stab at the following the the great pandemic of 2020 this is not true 1009 this is much more like the brutally structuring their economies went through and in 1080. 00 certainly in britain so its more fundamental than just were going to have a steady its going to be either in private Industry Sectors which we have assumed will always be weapons in the form in which they are what and theyre not going to be like that in the future and again the question is do we realise this change is coming and she or do we pretend this change isnt coming i mean funny when i write. If i should put your finger on one aspect of the Recovery Program that you forward which can both be on the beach it at least palliative to the economic problems on bring about long term restructuring what would it be in your program theres a lot of mythology around the National Debt and the deficit thought to bill seemed of the 2 julian day and national day it is actually owned by the bank of england i. E. By the government so the government can actually border a lot more to jumpstart the economy is seriously huge is a viable mean day in the capacity and in the end of the d. S. Not being in the end just not money. Never a mystery be that money has to be at sale and theres no chance of it causing inflation so theres more of motoring capacity and tens of printing money by the bank of england through various techniques and rob mccallum a common weale. Fred much of the material is fascinating stuff but as a think tank what chances of a few gautam getting some of your ideas taken forward as policy i mean after all government understandably to some extent is totally a mess than the Health Crisis of the present moment very difficult to pick up some of the the blue sky thinking from common will support the chances of parts of your ideas coming forward as a program or i would really like to see happen as the concept of a getting new deal in keeping that could choose one radical thing to get going west its to see we dont really done a piece of work on how you read them you have to really need you for school and its actually the 1st and comprehensive cost of getting new deal anything in the world and one of the big problems is that it takes a while to get going so it gets 3040 years of lead time before you can actually really do mean a thing which the fool parliamentary cant we do this problem whereby the biggest barrier to it can you kill which people have got to understand is really just i think in cheating project and it was a lack of and people there was just wasnt enough p