Same saying we have this white mans burden to take care of everybody else and it is its not really about white and black is it you dont have to be white to be racist you dont have to be black to be a victim of racism the europeans were being conducted programs against the jews before they ever saw a black person the british were conducting programs against the irish thats all they ever had a friend african caribbean and indians you know to be racist against therefore they had ill you citizens to be racist against which has been our most recent target and of course you know the arabs in between because were waging war over the middle east so for me this is somewhat of a diversion im happy to see the back of the statues but if it just is a question of looking at statues and taking them away whilst doing nothing about the roots this is limit is it why does it change exert georget exactly half of diversion is needed a bill thats now. Oh i see it all ok that i offered to address social inequities absolutely ok but you know george theres this whole movement its anchor in the present there is no any past is adulterated its dirty its toxic and it must be wiped away i mean how can we address in the quality inequities without knowing the structural process they created in the 1st place and thats all in history ok and as far as you know seeing the bad status thats a totally different question and i think that we should talk about that i think we should talk about what statutes mean but this is this is the taliban and its a ship of western culture if you dont like it you dont understand it you just roy go ahead joe. Yes absolutely and of course the taking down all statues is a process thats only just begun it goes it isnt going to stop with roberts unique because you know next up of this league of the Founding Fathers washington and jefferson they were slave owners Woodrow Wilson retrograde views on blacks f. D. R. Japanese americans and with martin in Winston Churchills pearl in a box ok can i do not go exactly so you know Winston Churchill who was a been an icon icon and that much you know europe and United States for us since his death more than 50 years ago is now a reviled figure because hes an impure so Everything Else that he has done you know his wartime leader of the get forgotten is just and he parrots but one we know that this is a fraud is that if you really want to oppose imperialism if you really want to oppose. Powerful rich powerful countries exciting their will on weak countries which are none european nonwhite than oppose what the United States the United Kingdom and france the imperial powers are doing to syria right now i mean there are there conflicting there was brutal horrific sanctions and causing the misery that oppose what they did in libya destroyed a perfectly well dublin state for god knows what reason and its and now they did this is a country in which they reintroduced slate so that theres a country where you actually after own going slave trade not the Transatlantic Slave Trade 400 years ago but not only going slave trade in libya again not silence about that or the pressure thats of the sanctions against them venezuela again latin American Country and you know the the you know nonwhite people say nothing about that so. Well then heres the purpose of refighting the battles from 150 its like i mean i think i know the answer to lets go back to bristol john d. I know the answer that it in use that you alluded to it is that no one in the elites here do not want to talk about class thats like kryptonite to these people they dont want to talk its all because of racism its not because of class and that way that is actually a very soothing and comforting thing because you know having this purity tests that you clyde of people get on your knee take the knee and all these other things you dont you know address the structural problems of why there is racism in why there is and why theres growing desperation i mean look the phrase was attributed to george floyd but i think it has applied to it least half the United States i can read and its because of the structural inequalities the been built in and we have all these woke people that makes them build privileged even dont they dont they dont know anything about history they dont understand exploitation theyre even know that theyre being exploited. I mean 100 percent or so many points there and what you said i could pick up on that symbol that resonated with people so much about George Floyds desk it wasnt just that it was another policeman the way that it was filmed so we could see the cold blooded nature of his killer he was so calm the need to the net and the words of the dying man i cant read your lap for that to resonate with you that mismated across the world because that is the experience of the oppressed and exploited masses everything that its all great they have that need in the neck from imperialism they hate alleys and then and their children and you cant raise and that really resonates and thats why it is as you say about close and the system and not about purely black and white and racism at least pilots and america all the. Of course those things. Are many of the inequalities but really why has expanded now in such a way its not only the power of this particular merger its also the fact that its come on top of as you say a situation where the economic crash which is the biggest accomplishment is in a pretty used combined with the Health Crises are being disproportionately as always built by the poorest and of course the poorest in the imperius countries are more likely to be black if youre black youre more likely to be poor so that desperation is coming from people losing their jobs having no health care suffering from the crisis the most suffering most from the Health Epidemic and being in the middle of all of this and of course its very safe for a law to say this uprising and they scams and what they dont want is us to get together and say this is this system is a problem and we must get rid of it so what they were very happy to do is jump on a narrative that encouraged sections of the working class to despise one another and spend their time in the end fighting one another and you know being made absolute pulls out of on both sides of this argument i mean we saw in london this week you know working class white guys doing literally fitness aleuts churchill steps you cant make it up you know in their attempt to defend what they see as their culture its not their culture on the other hand youve got you know theyre being pitted against you know angry working class black and asian people who are feeling like theyve had enough of the inequalities in the system both sides of bad also suffering from the inequalities inequities of the system and its inability to provide basic security in really simple things like jobs Housing HealthCare Education you know its the rulers who benefit from all of this dont. And this this this putting us down into silence of what color are you and christian hierarchy you know the better you want the more oppressed you are the more kind of just you are to my knowledge e right you know you know george one of the things i find really quite sickening is that you have the amazons and him Silicon Valley and you know put on their website black lives matter and you know what that is pure genuflection and its at no cost of them whatsoever it doesnt affect their bottom line its its an amazing cultural cover for them because if amazon actually tears about black lives then why does he treat its workers like certs ok no jeff bezos gets. A free card out free card out of jail because he can say you know he takes a knee but it doesnt affect his bottom line is better but hes become what youve been more obviously rich during this crisis. Exactly and so what has happened is that this one black clad Math Movement has been coopted by these are. All these other. Silicon valley to whom this is you know pure symbolism i mean if these those really cared about black lives it could well for one thing raise the wages of all the people who work for him it doesnt he got them in. Union organizing at his workplace it doesnt mean theres no same goes for jamie diamond same goes for all of the all of these. Silicon valley billionaires that you can organize so all of those things that will actually affect their bottom line they dont know and what do they do that they actually. Use this black lives true or show their sapir iorio to their work laws because its their workforce that his race is not that you know. With the c. E. O. s with billionaires we dont were not racist but you you miserable a blight says you know who barely make it you make your rent payment you are rates and i will show you how terribly retrograde you are as a listener as they go to the game late so theres really nothing radical about it because we know whats right and we know what a radical movement is a radical movement is well look what you had with the bolsheviks you had a masters of support they will direct appeal to the last directly a feeling youre not going to go to a break and after that short break well continue our discussion mochas them. One else seemed wrong all rolled just dont call. Me. Yet to see how disdain. And endangered. The trail. Went to find themselves worlds apart. Just to look for common ground. The simple things workshops and petersburg public spaces where adults with learning disabilities can engage on equal terms with creative activities like graphics sewing ceramics. Cookery and joinery. Just giving you shit whats in your records. Or if you know what just is what did you give one case to come up with. The underlying idea of the workshop is a calendar of happiness which they feel thrilled to find joy in the Little Things and. The take away then from this. Where its a 2000000000. 00 negative net Worth Company worth 400000000. 00 and theyre issuing an initial bankruptcy offering fresh deal of stock they take away the news the information the fact is that has nothing to do with the Current Company it what it says is that the dollar is collapsing the dollar has entered a high burn area collapse and this causes people to run into things like fictitious stock markets as weve seen in zimbabwe as we see in venezuela this is whats happening in the United States right now as of today. Ah no no. No shots. Actually go. Well. No its. Point she her thirst for action. Welcome back to cross talk were all things are considered im peter all about trying to discussing some. Of you let me go back to georgia right before the break you were making a point what i think is really interesting in all this is that among conservatives and people that are more interested in class like our guest in bristol you know i hear their refrain and really makes me worry say you know im not really interested in this but the problem is is that localism is interested in you and theyre commie for you go ahead george yes absolutely because what happens. Workplaces at workplaces of jamie diamond and the workplaces of these laws is that white workers and black workers. A gauge. How do. You know that youre white and always be held to be racist and to be you know or had all kinds of news on things so youre going to have this constant tussle between the point where it was a work supposedly racism rather than over the fact that both of. Almost no pay of work hours palling work conditions and all of the money being siphoned all through the people at the top i mean its no accident that these offices. Give us a wealth you know what her im getting really and why not what. They did they argue about these statues and ive seen a lot of historical artifacts out of people but a statue with abolition abolitionists ok and they dont even know who it is oh but its a statue of apparently about white guy who listens how insane it is just to let me go back to one of the things i find really terrifying in this is it 1st of all this whole locus of movement is detaches itself from the rule of what i did talk itself of merit i would say it detach itself from. Being reasonable you cant argue with these people its like you know argument the plot earth are ok and the problem is was i see is this the visions that are artificially created to set us against each other is it where is the limits if you take the knee or you lay on your stomach and you put your hands behind your back and then they want more and more and more and when what this does is it creates an enormous amount of intimidation a Chilling Effect and then again it gets away from the very core basic ideas that were trying to get across on this program. Absolutely i mean if we want to understand where this work culture as you describe it identity politics where its come from its really something which has jumped into a space that was left by a retreating class conscious working Class Movement you know we my lifetime has been a lifetime of seeing that movement the working class in retreat you know the socialist countries were destroyed to my mind its all temporary well you know history goes up and down in these last 40 years weve seen a retreat of working class forces and into the space these the working class demands equality for women. End of racism end of colonialism end of imperialism they were working class to much and they still are but whats happened is with the retreats other class cultures leadership for the working class you have the chasm is a vision of these struggles and theyve been transformed theyve been put into separate so you dont no longer recognise that womens liberation is a class question that anti racism is a class question that anti imperialism is about class its about the system of capitalism as well as imperialism you put them into separate silos and weve had this kind of bush was a fixation if you like of working class demands they become things that you study at University Womens studies and the enemy is men and black studies and the enemy is white people you know and its a wonderful safe narrative for imperatives and but this thing with the step she is as well what was was what is being pushed so hard by our media and that very much in support of the debate of a statue because we can all discuss history and imperious crimes become something as george said something from the parts imperialism is in existence now and its crimes are worse than ever you know look at those the playstation was in congo that been fought in the last 15 years how many millions. Died so we can play our playstation while were not on the streets saying congolese lives matzoh well at home without play stations ignoring it you know. Absolutely. Even does it say about how the rule is in this crisis to prove the white house cat everybody should have everyone in the street i mean if they could but then you know the debts it but thats theres such a vacuum of leadership i mean we our leaders are now part of the worst in my lifetime bar no i mean its absolutely i mean we can start i bought off the cape there they serve a purpose here you know george one of the things i think i find very. Just hard me is that if you really look at whats happened with the economy how it how it you know i could be exploded into the culture now into our politics here i mean this is a real boom for the studies people because every you know to fight racism black lives matter wolk ism you need an equity counselor you need a diversity counselor you need it your person the chief in this apartment and you know what all those worthless agrees that have been burned up dont last 30 years there is upward mobility there but it what they do is you taking this paradigm and theyre just reinforcing all the problems we have discussed here and it feels so great doesnt it if youre if youre the one thats there its pointing you know if youre if youre a priest or a priest as in this church youre elevated ok i mean this reminds me of you know kids that were pot you know sit down and get on your knees you know you know and its terrifying and you know what people are sit maybe going to this is extraordinary moment go ahead george yes yes exactly so what youre now creating and i dont obviously didnt create it to some time is a farce administrative clouts reality parasitical. That well be. Getting another boot on the neck over the world goes. Because they will be there at every workplace to point fingers at employees who create a barely able to make a living that you are a terrible retrograde person you have terrible views of women who have terrible views on terrible abuse of homosexuals dont you need to be reeducated we however you know we have you know the degrees you know were doing very nicely thank you very much so it will be good guest you know the burden on people who are already booked and of course that thats why the j. V. Diamond and the rest the room was so happy with this great rio you know i work as would be even more miserable because they will constantly be up in the Human Resources office told what terrible people they are and how they must be educated so to get out of. This period and then then it is to their it vanish this managerial professional class but have all these worthless degrees and high esteem about themselves racism will never end because thats their job ok to go to ever it was like in the soviet union to do ever perfect socialism you know i mean its already perfect were going to ever respect that a bit more they have no way knishes have to see this kind o. O. O. Cultural terrorism to come to an end and if they do theyll just find another one ill be sexism or something like. This though they make exactly what job. There is. Yes i think george has really put his finger on something extremely important about all of this discourse and the constant substitution of the policing of language and symbols that language in particular when you policing language to the extent that they identity politics against Police Language what youre doing is shutting people out of the conversation what youre doing is telling working class you better not look you know mouth as you much you know i come from a what if not to put my dad is india. Amazing lets write something that makes backgrounds and through my lifetime the way people described that has changed an